WW Dukes Versus Hunters (GAME OVER!!--See Post #1387)

[The Jackal]

Originally Posted by timmae

Tuesday night is the beginning of D2, right? I know that the afternoon lynch throws people off.

Yeah I suppose so

[cheekimonk]

Originally Posted by Chief Rum

A Duke Cultist would have all the appearances and effects of Stuttering Sam.

That actually clears it up a LOT to me. Thanks, Chief!

[Chief Rum]

Originally Posted by Narcizo

Chief - if a hunter kill on another hunter was blocked by the medic would the shooting hunter die?

A Hunter will die if he shoots and kills another Hunter.

[Chief Rum]

Originally Posted by Autumn

Okay, turns out this is the only response to that idea, and I don't think it's convincing.

Chief: Are night kill targets told that they were targeted, even if they survive?

I'll put it this way. If someone comes to murder you, you will know it.

[Autumn]

Originally Posted by Chief Rum

I'll put it this way. If someone comes to murder you, you will know it.

Is that a threat?! :-)

[Autumn]

Well, that sounds convincing. In which case I believe Martin, and will clear him in my book. And I have to think this paints Font poorly, and not in a "I've been set up by wolves to look bad" sort of way.

vote fontisian

[Shoveler]

Vote Font

I'm still up for shooting her, but there is the chance that I am the blank. I have to agree that it's more than likely font is a duke, so I'm willing to bet I dont take us both out.

[Chief Rum]

Everyone is going about their business in the village, but the tension is palpable.

Sideways glances, gun barrel stroking, crackling of knuckles, unconscious displays of stunted aggression are evident everywhere.

MartinD gets many looks. So does fontisian. And Autumn. But someone no one was looking at was the one who broke the silence.

"You greedy, oil grubbing BASTAAARRRRRDDDD!!" EagleFan screams. He pulls out his rifle from under a haystack and aims and fires. freezing everyone in place.

MartinD was very close to EagleFan, not more than 20 feet away. EagleFan couldn't miss. MartinD took the shot right through the heart. He was dead before he hit the ground.

The rifle shot fades into the swampy surroundings.

MARTIND was a DUKE and was formerly the MEDIC. He was a regular villager with no villager role.

EAGLEFAN is a Hunter and has used his shot.

[Chief Rum]

Day Three Vote Tally (as of Post #808)

fontisian (3)-- cheekimonk (799), Autumn (806), Shoveler (807)

Yet to Vote: The huddled masses

[Shoveler]

WTF?

[timmae]

That's one way to play it. Wtf? Care to explain ef? I don't like this play on the basis it is another vaimes scenario. Shoot first and ask questions later. Is this typical for hunter roles?

[fontisian]

EF is scum with Autumn. No townie ever steals the shot from me and then uses it on Martin of all people.

[MartinD]

Well, I guess that was pretty much inevitable... (I was fully expecting to not be alive when I woke up this morning )

[fontisian]

Oh, and I don't understand how anyone could possibly think either of us was a wolf. Martin was the uncounterclaimed protect and I would never shoot Martin as a wolf.

[The Jackal]

Vote EF

[Grover]

Originally Posted by fontisian

EF is scum with Autumn. No townie ever steals the shot from me and then uses it on Martin of all people.

Not discounting your first sentence.

But on the second sentence reads a little arrogant? Why does someone have to wait for you to take a shot first? Regardless of who they shot, they are not 'stealing' it from you if you didn't get the command in first.

That being said... I agree with you and feel that he and EF are working in concert. But I want an explanation from EF to explain why he chose to shoot Martin before I lay a vote down on anybody.

[cheekimonk]

Well, that doesn't make EF look good, but he's a vet so he had to know that...so not sure what to make of it.

[cheekimonk]

Originally Posted by fontisian

EF is scum with Autumn. No townie ever steals the shot from me and then uses it on Martin of all people.

EF would know that, too, just as you do. It would make EF's shot a misdirection play when votes are piling up on you which, at this point, is as plausible an explanation as any.

[The Jackal]

Originally Posted by fontisian

Oh, and I don't understand how anyone could possibly think either of us was a wolf. Martin was the uncounterclaimed protect and I would never shoot Martin as a wolf.

I'm not sure how any of what has happened clears you as a wolf. You were a legitimate medic target based on what Vaimes was saying D1. Now that we know for sure that Martin was a villager, we can truly believe what he said when he said it was mostly random.

[Autumn]

I absolutely would not have wasted my morning on figuring out the Martin issue if I knew EF was going to kill him. I wonder if EF is a wolf, and the wolves were figuring Martin was the bodyguard, and this was a quick way to get rid of him without using another night kill. EF would have to be pretty confident he can talk himself out of a lynch though.

[fontisian]

Originally Posted by Grover

Not discounting your first sentence.

But on the second sentence reads a little arrogant? Why does someone have to wait for you to take a shot first? Regardless of who they shot, they are not 'stealing' it from you if you didn't get the command in first.

That being said... I agree with you and feel that he and EF are working in concert. But I want an explanation from EF to explain why he chose to shoot Martin before I lay a vote down on anybody.

If EF thinks I'm scum, then he respects my request to shoot and hopes I end up killing myself. Stepping in to shoot someone who is 1.going to be cleared by my death and 2.guaranteed not to kill him is scummy as fuck.

I said I was going to shoot Autumn. EF shot first to prevent that from happening. They both need to die.

Vote: EF

[The Jackal]

Chief, will it be announced if an item was used?

[fontisian]

Originally Posted by cheekimonk

EF would know that, too, just as you do. It would make EF's shot a misdirection play when votes are piling up on you which, at this point, is as plausible an explanation as any.

So, you think he's scum, and you don't want to lynch him? What?

[The Jackal]

I'm asking because I'm thinking about putting together a list to see how many potential kills and dukes there are left out there.

[fontisian]

Originally Posted by The Jackal

I'm not sure how any of what has happened clears you as a wolf. You were a legitimate medic target based on what Vaimes was saying D1. Now that we know for sure that Martin was a villager, we can truly believe what he said when he said it was mostly random.

Why would I ever try to kill Martin? If I'm scum, and I get lynched, then I can count on the town to proceed to waste a lynch or shot on him, as long as I don't waste a shot on him first.

[The Jackal]

Originally Posted by fontisian

Why would I ever try to kill Martin? If I'm scum, and I get lynched, then I can count on the town to proceed to waste a lynch or shot on him, as long as I don't waste a shot on him first.

Well first off, it would presumably be a wolf team decision, not a lone wolf decision.. unless you are the cultist. So you're basically saying that the kill attempt on Martin suggests you are unlikely to be a wolf because of the connection it'd draw to you?

[fontisian]

Originally Posted by The Jackal

Well first off, it would presumably be a wolf team decision, not a lone wolf decision.. unless you are the cultist. So you're basically saying that the kill attempt on Martin suggests you are unlikely to be a wolf because of the connection it'd draw to you?

No.

I am saying that if I am a wolf, Martin becomes an easy mislynch down the line and there's no reason to shoot him.

[The Jackal]

And the scenario you are proposing is that as a wolf/wolf team you would have left Martin alone because if you got lynched then we'd go after him next? I'm not following

[The Jackal]

The amount of misdirection it has caused is plenty of reason to shoot him. The wolves knew he was a villager and may have assumed he'd be essentially cleared. That said, he was still a weird target when there's a seer out there.

[cheekimonk]

Originally Posted by cheekimonk

EF would know that, too, just as you do. It would make EF's shot a misdirection play when votes are piling up on you which, at this point, is as plausible an explanation as any.

Originally Posted by fontisian

So, you think he's scum, and you don't want to lynch him? What?

Where did I say I don't want to lynch him? I have to be argued off you first and that will involve watching the analysis from people much more adept at this than me.

[Autumn]

Originally Posted by fontisian

Why would I ever try to kill Martin? If I'm scum, and I get lynched, then I can count on the town to proceed to waste a lynch or shot on him, as long as I don't waste a shot on him first.

And if you're wolf and he gets lynched/killed, that makes you look less suspect. I am more suspicious about the fact that you act oblivious to that than the idea itself. A wolf doesn't count on getting lynched, a wolf tries to stay alive. Plan A would be to get Martin dead before you.

[EagleFan]

I let font get under my skin and I wasn't sold on the idea that he knew that he was attacked. He was a safe target and I fully expected to see a wolf result which would have meant font was wolf two. Took a hero shot and failed miserably. I am fine with facing my punishment. I have been useless anyway.

[The Jackal]

Eh, I don't think I'm going to be moving my vote. If you are a villager, that was not the best idea

[The Jackal]

Please feel free to expand on who I should vote instead of you

[fontisian]

Originally Posted by Autumn

And if you're wolf and he gets lynched/killed, that makes you look less suspect. I am more suspicious about the fact that you act oblivious to that than the idea itself. A wolf doesn't count on getting lynched, a wolf tries to stay alive. Plan A would be to get Martin dead before you.

...

Uh, no? Martin being town really doesn't make me look better, but then there's no actual case against me beyond the odds anyway.

[The Jackal]

I think the main thing that might be raising eyebrows is the certainty with which you're saying that there's no way you could be a wolf based on what happened with Martin. I think it's pretty clear that that's not certain at all.

[cheekimonk]

Originally Posted by EagleFan

I let font get under my skin and I wasn't sold on the idea that he knew that he was attacked. He was a safe target and I fully expected to see a wolf result which would have meant font was wolf two. Took a hero shot and failed miserably. I am fine with facing my punishment. I have been useless anyway.

EF, no offense but it just doesn't make sense that a player like you would do such a thing.

[cheekimonk]

Originally Posted by The Jackal

I think the main thing that might be raising eyebrows is the certainty with which you're saying that there's no way you could be a wolf based on what happened with Martin. I think it's pretty clear that that's not certain at all.

This.

[fontisian]

No, that's clearly not what's making people suspicious, as I'm just bringing it up now and people have wanted to lynch me all Day.

[Autumn]

EagleFan has been pretty busy and distracted all game, and having been a wolf with him before, I could see him deciding to take one for the team, take a possible bodyguard out, and distract the village, if he doesn't feel he can put enough effort in. So I think that's a possibility.

[cheekimonk]

Originally Posted by EagleFan

I let font get under my skin and I wasn't sold on the idea that he knew that he was attacked. He was a safe target and I fully expected to see a wolf result which would have meant font was wolf two. Took a hero shot and failed miserably. I am fine with facing my punishment. I have been useless anyway.

Originally Posted by cheekimonk

EF, no offense but it just doesn't make sense that a player like you would do such a thing.

Clarification: ...a player like you would do such a thing without it being part of a strategy.

[cheekimonk]

Originally Posted by fontisian

No, that's clearly not what's making people suspicious, as I'm just bringing it up now and people have wanted to lynch me all Day.

People could have been suspicious of you before, and now more suspicious for an additional reason. That's where I fall.

[The Jackal]

8 hunters
-1 for the blank
-1 for vaimes
-1 for EF
5 living hunters, including the blank and EF .. suggests up to 3 kills left

--

8 dukes
-1 for sam
-1 for martin
7 living dukes .. suggests up to 6 dukes left

--

So we're looking at up to 3 kills and up to 6 dukes. Take one out of those 9 because of the cultist, who can't do either - 8 actions (2 or 3 kills, 5 or 6 dukes). Then there's the items:

Vest: Could block one kill
Clip: Adds one kill into the mix (9 actions, 3 or 4 kills, 5 or 6 dukes)
Laser: Won't affect # of actions
Mirror: Could block one kill
Camo: Could stop a kill or duke
Bullhorn: Could stop a duke or just switch it

So, I'm seeing up to 9 actions - 3 or 4 kills and 5 or 6 dukes remaining, assuming that the wolves and seer/BG all get a hunter/duke ability as well. Rest depends on who has the items and a bit of luck.

[Grover]

vote EF

Story doesn't hold up. I really dislike font's story too, but EF seems infinitely more wolfish at the moment. I was pretty damn certain MartinD was village, potentially the Bodyguard. I'm thinking EF thought that he could have been the BG as well. Protected last night and knew it, which is apparently rare? I'm guessing EF, as a wolf, was taking a flier on MartinD being the BG and wanted to kill him off before he could protect a potential NK target tonight.

[Autumn]

Originally Posted by The Jackal

8 hunters
-1 for the blank
-1 for vaimes
-1 for EF
5 living hunters, including the blank and EF .. suggests up to 3 kills left

--

8 dukes
-1 for sam
-1 for martin
7 living dukes .. suggests up to 6 dukes left

--

So we're looking at up to 3 kills and up to 6 dukes. Take one out of those 9 because of the cultist, who can't do either - 8 actions (2 or 3 kills, 5 or 6 dukes). Then there's the items:

Vest: Could block one kill
Clip: Adds one kill into the mix (9 actions, 3 or 4 kills, 5 or 6 dukes)
Laser: Won't affect # of actions
Mirror: Could block one kill
Camo: Could stop a kill or duke
Bullhorn: Could stop a duke or just switch it

So, I'm seeing up to 9 actions - 3 or 4 kills and 5 or 6 dukes remaining, assuming that the wolves and seer/BG all get a hunter/duke ability as well. Rest depends on who has the items and a bit of luck.

Thanks for doing this. I think you missed JAG as a (dead) hunter?

[Chief Rum]

Originally Posted by The Jackal

Chief, will it be announced if an item was used?

Yes.

[The Jackal]

Originally Posted by Autumn

Thanks for doing this. I think you missed JAG as a (dead) hunter?

Is my math off? I didn't deduct 1 for JAG/Zinto because they didn't use their kill, but out of the 5 living hunters there should be up to 3 kills left because EF used his and the blank is still out there.

[The Jackal]

So in that sense me having vaimes up there as -1 doesn't really apply - but bottom line is the 3 kills left as a starting point there. let me know if that doesn't make sense

[cheekimonk]

Originally Posted by Grover

I'm guessing EF, as a wolf, was taking a flier on MartinD being the BG and wanted to kill him off before he could protect a potential NK target tonight.

That makes a lot of sense and is hard to dismiss.

[The Jackal]

Originally Posted by cheekimonk

That makes a lot of sense and is hard to dismiss.

And it also prevents any other hunters from taking a shot today.