The 2010 Video Games Thread

[Mizzou B-ball fan]

Originally Posted by gstelmack

That makes perfect sense. Maybe it's just been too long since I've actually walked into a Gamestop, I just never remember being able to save that much on the used titles.

You'd easily get those bigger discounts when they run their Buy 2 Get 1 used sales. Let's say you want three Classics on the PS3 (normally $30 new). That means the used copies are $25. If you bought those three as used, you could get them for $45 ($50-10% off with Edge card). So it would have been $90 new versus $45 used. The B1G1 usually comes around every 2-3 months, so as long as you're not picky, you can wait and see substantial savings.

[SportsDino]

I usually am picking up the bulk of games when the new price is falling too, its just the used price falls faster, and I've personally had a good record on the quality of used games I get. Between the $5-15 deduction for being used, saving another 10% on the Edge card, it knocks a lot of games into that sub-20 sweet spot for me. Note, I don't really care about the savings, I'd buy at full price and not give a crap, I just naturally pay the lower price as long as I'm reasonably confident I'm getting the same product.

When it comes to these online games from EA, I'd just bump another $10 onto it mentally... but worst than the money, I'd assume I need to jump through a dozen hoops to get it to work, so I'd say screw it and go elsewhere, I hate frustration and waiting to use stuff I already bought.

As for EA targeting the used market, somewhere in their line of thought they must be assuming they are targeting the crowd of gamers that rotates through games quickly. They buy something brand spanking new, they play a few weeks, and because every shooter is like another, they decide to move on.

If that is a target crowd, then it does make sense that there is a large cost of servers that is not serving EA's ultimate purpose. To get the quick rotating crowd they need to keep making new games and new servers, but they also need to maintain old servers and games which they've probably done some study on and determined a huge chunk of that group is used gamers who don't contribute to their initial rush.

This new rule makes it less likely they are going to get used gamers to buy an online game used. If they are fine with writing off that crowd, that is their choice to make (like I said, I'd avoid it like the plague, but then I was buying used to begin with so why would they even care?).

I personally doubt EA values long running gaming communities. The money for them is in selling a big pile of software up front, and there is a sizable enough crowd that only sticks around for the short term that I can understand if they write off other segments.

I guess all of this is a moot point without digging into statistics, its just my wild guess at what and why they are doing it. EA has a history of knocking the gamers for a loop so this isn't really out of character for them... and historically, the gamers take the lumps and whine a bit, but still fork over the money, so I don't see them changing that business model.

[SackAttack]

Originally Posted by spleen1015

How many folks here buy used games? I don't think I have ever bought a used game.

I generally do not buy used, unless it's a situation where I can no longer find the game new.

If I'm going to take the step of purchasing the game, I would prefer for the developer to get its cut of the sale rather than handing the entire purchase price to GameStop.

[Tasan]

I buy used as much as a I can, especially for the kids stuff. Usually I wait a year for the price to come down good.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by SackAttack

If I'm going to take the step of purchasing the game, I would prefer for the developer to get its cut of the sale rather than handing the entire purchase price to GameStop.

So do you only buy new cars too?

[SackAttack]

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

So do you only buy new cars too?

Technically? Yeah.

I'm still driving my first car.

[SackAttack]

Although it's also worth pointing out that a video game doesn't represent 5-7 years worth of debt, either, so that's probably not the best comparison there, Jon.

[stevew]

Has anyone seen any info on Tecmo Bowl Throwback for the PS3? Was there a release delay? I can't find any info.

[Ajaxab]

I only partially understand the adversarial nature between EA and Gamestop. I know I have purchased titles I've been on the fence about used rather than new in the past. If the game was good, that used purchase has then got me to consider buying the next game in the series new. As an example, I bought Elder Scrolls: Oblivion used and will likely buy Dragon Age: Origins new because I got so much entertainment out of Elder Scrolls. Without that used purchase, I might never have given Dragon Age a passing thought because that game genre wasn't initially appealing to me. For EA to get draconian about forcing gamers to purchase only new games for online play is to cut off some potential new customers who might give borderline interesting games a chance.

Another thing that has to be mentioned is EA's monopolization of sports game licenses. If a developer is going to complain about excessive development costs, then they need to think about how much cash they have used to buy out other developers. EA's exclusive licenses have prevented other developers from either making a game based on the professional version of the sport (e.g. NFL) or limiting what teams can appear in another company's version of the sport (e.g. Pro Evo). EA has made its bed in this respect. I just can't buy the 'cost of development has forced us to do this' argument.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by SackAttack

Although it's also worth pointing out that a video game doesn't represent 5-7 years worth of debt, either, so that's probably not the best comparison there, Jon.

My money is my money, and what I own I own. The price doesn't matter one iota to me, 5 minutes worth of debt or 5 years worth. So the comparison is at least every bit as valid as the bewildering sympathy I've seen in this thread for the developers who apparently don't want to acknowledge that once they sell a product it is no longer under their control. The same logic (or illogic) I've seen in this thread would mean that you shouldn't be able to buy a used car that doesn't have a core function disabled when it changes ownership.

You know me, I'm not exactly known as a corporate basher, but this borders on the absurd.

[SackAttack]

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

My money is my money, and what I own I own. The price doesn't matter one iota to me, 5 minutes worth of debt or 5 years worth. So the comparison is at least every bit as valid as the bewildering sympathy I've seen in this thread for the developers who apparently don't want to acknowledge that once they sell a product it is no longer under their control. The same logic (or illogic) I've seen in this thread would mean that you shouldn't be able to buy a used car that doesn't have a core function disabled when it changes ownership.

You know me, I'm not exactly known as a corporate basher, but this borders on the absurd.

I haven't chimed in on the discussion in this thread, although I have in other places. I'll sum up for you my feelings:

It's their product, and they can do what they think best with regards to protecting and growing their market. I thought how they handled it with Mass Effect 2 was inspired. I just don't think they thought their cunning plan all the way through with respect to their sports franchises.

But thinking they might be making a mistake (which is not the same as "you shouldn't be allowed to do that!") has no bearing on whether or not I choose to support the developers of franchises I enjoy by making sure that they're receiving payment for that enjoyment. That's a personal decision, and while there is a principle behind it, you don't see me saying "the used games market should be eliminated," either.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by SackAttack

by making sure that they're receiving payment for that enjoyment.

I guess that's what I don't get ... there's no piracy involved here, they already got paid by the original purchaser. This is no different than, say, designer clothing that ends up in a consignment shop.

(And ftr, I know you didn't say or even imply any piracy, I just don't know a better word to help illustrate what I mean)

[k0ruptr]

I guess I just like saving a little money, but a good example for me is I just picked up Splinter Cell: Conviction and Assassins Creed 2 used at Gamestop for $78 or so after discounts and tax. Now I wouldn't have bought these games new for $120 thats a 40 or so dollar difference and now I get to enjoy 2 awesome games that otherwise I would of had to wait for the new price to drop or not buy at all.

(This is also assuming I can't find it on sale anywhere new, which is not the case there have been sales on both of these games, but I just missed them, so I picked them up used and I think I got a fairly decent deal . )

[SackAttack]

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

I guess that's what I don't get ... there's no piracy involved here, they already got paid by the original purchaser. This is no different than, say, designer clothing that ends up in a consignment shop.

(And ftr, I know you didn't say or even imply any piracy, I just don't know a better word to help illustrate what I mean)

Honestly, Jon, the problem I'm having here is not with your point, but with the examples you're drawing to support it.

You're comparing second sale on a video game to second sale on a $3000 Donna Karan dress, or what have you.

If I write a short story compilation, and I determine that, based on the time and costs involved, I need to sell 5,000 copies of that compilation in order to justify doing another one, but I instead sell 2,000 copies, I'm in the hole. It might even be a fantastic thing if those 2,000 copies then proliferate to another 8,000 end users via second sale. But I'm now in a position where...can I count on that total 10,000 end user market to support my next effort? I already lost money on this venture.

Now consider that my publisher probably had expectations of their own. Even if I decide that it's worth attempting a second compilation because the market has grown, do they share my analysis? Will they give me that second opportunity?

Cars, dresses, these aren't the same thing. Yes, the core principle of "they got their money from the original purchaser" is the same, but video games are different in that they are entertainment. It's fundamentally a storytelling venue. the Shenmue franchise is an example of one whose story remains unfinished because sales didn't justify continuing with the obscene budget that was originally given its developers.

Was that because people just didn't buy the game? Certainly possible. Was that because people did buy the game, but the secondary market was far greater than the originating market, leading to that 2,000-first-sales-and-8,000-second-sales phenomenon I described? Also possible. Because of the various mistakes Sega made with their business over a 4-6 year period, it's hard to know with any fundamental certainty.

But that's the difference between buying a car used and buying a game used. Or even buying a used designer dress. The second sale of the car and dress don't prevent you from future enjoyment of those things. The second sale of a game is more clouded. Some franchises can deal with second sales going to GameStop for $54.99 instead of buying a new copy at $59.99. Some franchises are too niche to survive that.

It is, of course, up to any given individual to make that decision. As you rightly point out, it's their money, and first sale doctrine allows original end users to do pretty much whatever with a product they've paid for.

We're not in disagreement there.

Where I think we're in disagreement is that you see purchasing used games as perfectly natural, where I see it as potentially eating your seed corn.

I know there are developers on this board (Marc Vaughan, I believe is one) who've indicated that they see second sales as useful because the money derived from them goes back into new purchases of other software. Fantastic.

Again, I'm not trying to get rid of that market. I simply think that EA, in chasing an increase in first sales, struck exactly the right note with Mass Effect 2 and might be off-key a bit with their sports franchises.

And, again, my stance on buying new versus used is my own, and for the reasons I've laid out. I'm certainly not saying everybody is obligated to see the issue the way I do, but there are some very specific reasons why I see it that way, and I think that comparing the video game industry to automotive and designer clothing misses the point.

[dubb93]

In all seriousness my lack of interest in sports games has grown year by year. I know EA makes games other than sports games, but I see this as a huge reason to not buy sports games going forward. I am normally the guy that buys the game brand new(well, Madden and NCAA atleast) and then trades the two on down the line for a single game. If EA is going to null the value of my trade-in down the line Madden and NCAA just got a hell of a lot more expensive from me on the front end so I will opt to voice my displeasure with my pocket book this year.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by SackAttack

And, again, my stance on buying new versus used is my own, and for the reasons I've laid out. I'm certainly not saying everybody is obligated to see the issue the way I do, but there are some very specific reasons why I see it that way, and I think that comparing the video game industry to automotive and designer clothing misses the point.

And that's fair enough, hopefully most our at least our direct back-and-forth in this thread has come across (from me) as mostly "I honestly & sincerely don't understand where you're coming from" instead of "you filthy rotten pig". Heck, even now that I have a better understanding of it and still disagree with you pretty much completely I'm not in "filthy rotten pig" territory about it

In the more general discussion sense, what I see that dubb just mentioned is how I believe this will actually play out. I believe the end result will be that GameStop et al will have to deal with this decision by EA cut the price of those used games accordingly (in order for them to remain viable for the consumer). Meanwhile, in the process, in order to cut their price they're going to have to cut the trade-in allowance for these games as well, which in turn puts a real dent in the willingness of customers to bother trading them in anyway. Eventually, I believe it plays into EA's real goal, which is to kill the resale market altogether. I just hope that consumers catch on enough to bite them in the pocketbook with reduced sales on the new titles in the first place.

Truly, at this point, I believe the best long run for customers (and certainly the most karmic outcome) would be for EA to find themselves belly-up and the sooner the better afaic.

[RainMaker]

I think some of you guys fail to look at what this does to new sales too. Similar to dubb, I base a lot of my new game purchases on the fact I can flip it for $30 in store credit or a new game. So in my mind, I'm buying a game for $30 instead of $60. It allows me to buy more games. Now if that price for used goes down to $10-$20 for a game that is a couple months old, I might skip on some titles that are borderline purchases.

For instance, I probably wouldn't have bought Infamous, or Assassin's Creed 2 if it wasn't for the fact that I knew I could re-sell them later at a decent price.

[RainMaker]

Also to add. While I understand the move and sort of agree with it from a business perspective, I think the company would be better off making better games and offering good DLC for it down the road.

MW2 seems to be the model that they should be shooting for. A great game with replay value with the lure of DLC down the road. I read that they sold over 2.5 million "Stimulus Packages" in the first week. Even after Microsoft's cut, that's a lot of money for some maps.

To circumvent the used game market, they should give people reason not to sell the game. Hell, I hung on to GTA IV only because of the DLC they had promised.

[mckerney]

Originally Posted by gstelmack

What is the attraction of used over say:

- A Steam sale (obviously PC only)
- $20 "Platinum" titles (which 360 and PS3 both have their own versions of)
- Clearance bins at the store

?

But I do get buying games at less than the $50-$60 full price, don't get me wrong. Or trading with a buddy. I've just never seen the attraction of used at places like GameStop where you typically are not saving much over the new titles sitting right there.

I don't really get buy used from Gamestop, I'm usually able to get games cheaper new on sale than the used price at Gamestop. If you're patient and willing to check Cheap Ass Gamer you can find some great deals. I picked up Final Fantasy XIII from Kmart for $30 last week and bought Dante's Inferno for $25 from the EA store a while back. Even if you're buying new releases you can usually find some great prices, a preorder of Red Dead Redemption is $46.99 on Buy.com which is likely much lower than you'll see a used copy for at Gamestop anytime soon.

Not saying I don't buy used at all, I've used Goozex to get rid of my old XBox games and pick up a few Wii titles, but most games I get I either buy at release or wait until I get find a sale on CAG for PS3 or Wii, or Steam has a sale for PC.

As far as the EA Sports online decision, I'm not surprised by it at all. It fits right in with EAs Project $10 that has had launch day DLC that costs $10 without a code from a new copy for games like Mass Effect 2, Dragon Age, and Dante's Inferno.

[MizzouRah]

Originally Posted by Eaglesfan27

I'm in.

Oh yeah!

[SackAttack]

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

And that's fair enough, hopefully most our at least our direct back-and-forth in this thread has come across (from me) as mostly "I honestly & sincerely don't understand where you're coming from" instead of "you filthy rotten pig". Heck, even now that I have a better understanding of it and still disagree with you pretty much completely I'm not in "filthy rotten pig" territory about it

Well, sure.

I suspect the diametrical opposition here is probably also at least partly a factor of the degree to which each of us consider ourselves a "gamer." I don't get the sense that console gaming has been your primary hobby for the last 25 years, so your approach to the subject matter is likely going to differ from mine, in that I *am* approaching it from that tangent.

In the more general discussion sense, what I see that dubb just mentioned is how I believe this will actually play out. I believe the end result will be that GameStop et al will have to deal with this decision by EA cut the price of those used games accordingly (in order for them to remain viable for the consumer). Meanwhile, in the process, in order to cut their price they're going to have to cut the trade-in allowance for these games as well, which in turn puts a real dent in the willingness of customers to bother trading them in anyway. Eventually, I believe it plays into EA's real goal, which is to kill the resale market altogether. I just hope that consumers catch on enough to bite them in the pocketbook with reduced sales on the new titles in the first place.

I can see part of that - reducing used prices on those games as well as cutting the trade-in values.

I don't think, with respect to the sports games, that it will cause people to stop trading them in. People devoted enough to a franchise to buy it yearly, either new or used, really will tend to see the previous year's game as a sunk cost. You might hold onto an RPG or a shooter rather than trade it in for craptastic value, but if you're buying Madden 2011, are you really looking at Madden 10 and saying "Well, no, I don't want to trade that in for a buck and a half because I might play it again"?

It's like I say - sports games are measured by a fundamentally different metric in the secondary market than almost any other title is.

Truly, at this point, I believe the best long run for customers (and certainly the most karmic outcome) would be for EA to find themselves belly-up and the sooner the better afaic.

Eh. If you take that point of view, you're likely going to have to take that hardline stance against all of the major publishers for one reason or another. What does that leave you? Salted earth in the industry, because your little publishers probably can't sustain the industry on their own if the big guys that attract purchasers to the stores in the first place go kaput.

[DeToxRox]

One step closer to paying monthly subscription fees for games from the bigger publishers. I believe Activision has even mentioned something like this. I guess for WOW or whatever it works, so the model is there though it's a far smaller scope of people.

[SportsDino]

As a wannabe future game developer, I don't care about the second sale market, I care more about my copyright being protected. Lot of common sense in allowing people to do second sales, and its not worth the effort to try and safeguard against it.

In EA's situation, they have a service they are providing that is separate from physical posession of the game (although there is some implied association). I don't mind them charging for such a service (in principle), however, if they go the evil route (this is EA after all) and try to turn this into a system for activating used games for single player functionality... then I go from mildly perturbed to uber-pissed and I'll boycott them.

Maybe if I was more of a multiplayer type I would be as agitated as Jon, who has every right to be, and in my opinion if that sort of EA behavior annoys you turn it into negative interest in buying their product and hopefully they go bust. Sadly, too many gamers don't get ticked to that degree and keep forking over the money, and that is who EA is really going after.

[mckerney]

Originally Posted by SportsDino

I don't mind them charging for such a service (in principle), however, if they go the evil route (this is EA after all) and try to turn this into a system for activating used games for single player functionality... then I go from mildly perturbed to uber-pissed and I'll boycott them.

They already to this to a degree. You can still play through the game without the content, but Dragon Age and Mass Effect 2 have characters, missions and weapons that you get for free if you have the code that comes with a game purchased new but you need to pay for without the code.

[Mizzou B-ball fan]

Notice a rumor that a new PSP may be introduced at E3. We'll know whether Sony was caught off-guard by Nintendo if that's the case. If it's 3D-capable, we'll know that Nintendo announced early to try to get a jump on Sony's announcement. If it's not 3D, we'll know Sony got caught with their pants down.

PSP 2 – the big E3 surprise? | Games Industry | MCV

[SackAttack]

Originally Posted by DeToxRox

One step closer to paying monthly subscription fees for games from the bigger publishers. I believe Activision has even mentioned something like this. I guess for WOW or whatever it works, so the model is there though it's a far smaller scope of people.

I suspect the next Call of Duty is going to go this route. MMOFPS, here we come.

Originally Posted by mckerney

They already to this to a degree. You can still play through the game without the content, but Dragon Age and Mass Effect 2 have characters, missions and weapons that you get for free if you have the code that comes with a game purchased new but you need to pay for without the code.

Well, right. And that's what I was talking about with Mass Effect 2, where I thought they hit the right note. There was included content with new purchases, while used purchases had to pay for the ability to even *access* the DLC. I thought that hit basically the right note. The free stuff wasn't anything core to the game. A used purchaser could, if they wanted to, play totally through and never miss any of the launch freebies. Where they'd be up the creek would be once the paid DLC started coming out, if they wanted access to that? They'd have to pony up.

Dragon Age did the same thing, yes, but they also put paid DLC hooks into the game right from the word go, and THAT I didn't care a whit for. If I buy your game new and from day one it's already nagging me to spend more on DLC, I probably won't be finishing your game.

[SackAttack]

Originally Posted by Mizzou B-ball fan

Notice a rumor that a new PSP may be introduced at E3. We'll know whether Sony was caught off-guard by Nintendo if that's the case. If it's 3D-capable, we'll know that Nintendo announced early to try to get a jump on Sony's announcement. If it's not 3D, we'll know Sony got caught with their pants down.

PSP 2 – the big E3 surprise? | Games Industry | MCV

I don't think Sony's announce really has anything to do with Nintendo's, although it may appear that way.

I suspect they got caught with their pants down in the sense of "Nintendo just released the DSi/XL, so we're probably safe to blow them out of the water with something really righteous," and then...oh look. New hardware from the big N.

But I think they probably had this hardware announce planned all along, particularly in the rapid float to the top of the bowl the PSPgo made. "Well...shit. That didn't work. Moving on!"

My off the cuff guess is that the PSP2 will resemble the PSPgo, but be a little bit larger. It'll probably still keep the slider screen, incorporate a second analog stick (which is where the larger size comes into play), and will probably retain the lack of a UMD drive. They will probably bundle it with at least one major game release, either pre-installed or with a download code in the box, to get people to jump in with both feet.

[Mizzou B-ball fan]

Originally Posted by SackAttack

My off the cuff guess is that the PSP2 will resemble the PSPgo, but be a little bit larger. It'll probably still keep the slider screen, incorporate a second analog stick (which is where the larger size comes into play), and will probably retain the lack of a UMD drive. They will probably bundle it with at least one major game release, either pre-installed or with a download code in the box, to get people to jump in with both feet.

And if that's what they bring to the table, it will fail just like the PSPGo.

[EagleFan]

Originally Posted by SackAttack

Well, right. And that's what I was talking about with Mass Effect 2, where I thought they hit the right note. There was included content with new purchases, while used purchases had to pay for the ability to even *access* the DLC. I thought that hit basically the right note. The free stuff wasn't anything core to the game. A used purchaser could, if they wanted to, play totally through and never miss any of the launch freebies. Where they'd be up the creek would be once the paid DLC started coming out, if they wanted access to that? They'd have to pony up.

Dragon Age did the same thing, yes, but they also put paid DLC hooks into the game right from the word go, and THAT I didn't care a whit for. If I buy your game new and from day one it's already nagging me to spend more on DLC, I probably won't be finishing your game.

This is a fine solution IF is stays at that level. The problem is, and anyone can see this coming based on it being EA, is that with each release that bar of what is and isn't "core" gameplay starts to move and before you know it buying a game second hand will only get you a disk that will only bring you to the main menu.

[dubb93]

The more I think about the EA choices the more pissed I get. Instead of crippling the 2nd hand market why not give us a reason to not trade our game in? Games like Fallout 3 and Borderlands have a thriving DLC market with campaigns you actually want to play. No reason to trade those games in until WELL after the game has had its use and basically everyone willing to buy the game new has already purchased it.

I just realized that I have never purchased an EA dlc and that most of their games get sold when I beat them. Why is this? To me atleast it seems that EA just doesn't "get" DLC. Their games feature full priced dlc for armor and quests that take roughly 20-30 minutes to beat. Dragon Age and ME 2 highlight this. It seems to me that if EA wanted to cripple the 2nd hand market they should create reasons for people not to trade the game in in the first place rather than punish those who do buy their games(2nd hand).

[Kodos]

Ah, but which option is easier to achieve? Creating compelling, lasting content that people want to buy, or just going ahead and tacking on charges for things that should just be a part of the game?

[stevew]

I can't see spending 60 dollars on MW2, the game. It was actually not very fun at all. Plus it was incredibly short.

Now MW2 multiplayer is a whole different animal. I've spent a crazy amount of time on that(something like 6 days +). So I guess I'd probably pay to play online. But they'd have to do shit like ban cheating/boosting. And have a much better matchup engine. No more significant lag either.

[SackAttack]

Originally Posted by Mizzou B-ball fan

And if that's what they bring to the table, it will fail just like the PSPGo.

The handheld space isn't an easy one in which to compete.

The thing right now with the PSP, I think part of why the download-only option hasn't succeeded real well, is because most of the games you can buy online are available for less in UMD format. People who have a PSP already aren't willing to upgrade, and people who are buying one new are seeing a $249 price compared with this other one for almost a hundred bucks less that can play games right off the shelf. That's a no-win proposition.

If, on the other hand, that's how the new system is marketed and sold from the beginning, maybe it changes the game for them a little bit. They cannot dethrone Nintendo in terms of overall numbers, but with Nintendo carving out a new market, there may be room for Sony to bring some of the more traditional players home, if they do it right.

Originally Posted by EagleFan

This is a fine solution IF is stays at that level. The problem is, and anyone can see this coming based on it being EA, is that with each release that bar of what is and isn't "core" gameplay starts to move and before you know it buying a game second hand will only get you a disk that will only bring you to the main menu.

Well, the problem is that when you start trying to do that across your entire library, you run into the little issue of not every game being able to do it the same way. An RPG can have non-core DLC that's still compelling. You get into sports games, which is where we're at, what can you realistically cordon off that isn't core? Sports games aren't the only games that'll run into that issue, either. So, yeah, they end up taking the lazy road out instead of working to create something compelling to offer new buyers.

Sports games are pretty vanilla offerings, when you come right down to it. I'm not sure they're a good fit for "Project Ten Dollars" or whatever else you want to call it.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Happened to see this earlier, not sure if it's been mentioned already or not, if so pls forgive the duplication.

Basically Portal can be d'loaded free for the PC or the Mac between now & May 24th, in case you're curious but never got around to trying it.
Haven't Played Portal Yet? Don't Worry, It's Finally Time To Try The Cake: It's Free - G4tv.com

Definitely not everybody's cup of tea (sure wasn't mine) but I figured it was worth a mention here regardless.

[MJ4H]

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

Happened to see this earlier, not sure if it's been mentioned already or not, if so pls forgive the duplication.

Basically Portal can be d'loaded free for the PC or the Mac between now & May 24th, in case you're curious but never got around to trying it.
Haven't Played Portal Yet? Don't Worry, It's Finally Time To Try The Cake: It's Free - G4tv.com

Definitely not everybody's cup of tea (sure wasn't mine) but I figured it was worth a mention here regardless.

Oh hell yes. Tried the demo and loved it, but it runs poorly on my computer, so I never bought it. Will definitely grab it for free, though. Fantastic game.

[RainMaker]

Originally Posted by Kodos

Ah, but which option is easier to achieve? Creating compelling, lasting content that people want to buy, or just going ahead and tacking on charges for things that should just be a part of the game?

One of those options leads to losing $700 million in a year.

[mckerney]

I've got Red Dead Redemption preordered for PS3, can't wait until it arrives.

[spleen1015]

I convinced my MW2 playing friends to get Red Dead, so I'll be getting the 3-sixty version.

[RainMaker]

I can't wait for it. For anyone interested, Amazon is still giving away $20 in credit if you pre-order the game.

[mckerney]

Originally Posted by RainMaker

I can't wait for it. For anyone interested, Amazon is still giving away $20 in credit if you pre-order the game.

Looks like the best deal available now with the Buy.com sale being over. And it is a $20 gift card that can be used for anything on Amazon rather than the video game credit they usually offer with games.

[MizzouRah]

Originally Posted by RainMaker

I can't wait for it. For anyone interested, Amazon is still giving away $20 in credit if you pre-order the game.

and... release day shipping is only $5.98...

[Eaglesfan27]

Originally Posted by spleen1015

I convinced my MW2 playing friends to get Red Dead, so I'll be getting the 3-sixty version.

Most of my online friends are also getting this for the 360, so I've preordered it for the 360.

[SackAttack]

Finally just broke down and went for my pre-order of Super Mario Galaxy 2 so I could lock in the $20 video game credit with it before they stop doing that.

apparently I won't receive it until the 26th, but I expect to be working late on the 25th anyway, so...

[stevew]

Originally Posted by mckerney

I've got Red Dead Redemption preordered for PS3, can't wait until it arrives.

waldorfsalad-
Getting it, down for an FOFC posse

[mckerney]

Originally Posted by stevew

waldorfsalad-
Getting it, down for an FOFC posse

Also down for a posse, PSN name is RocknRanger.

[samifan24]

Originally Posted by mckerney

Also down for a posse, PSN name is RocknRanger.

I'm in, too. Let me know when you guys start one.

[RainMaker]

How does online play and posses work?

[stevew]

No idea, but it's going to be fucking cool.

[mckerney]

Originally Posted by RainMaker

How does online play and posses work?

Short video on some of MP features:

Red Dead Redemption Multiplayer Has A Posse - Red dead redemption - Kotaku

[Groundhog]

Why can't you bitches go out and buy PS3s???