WW-Pokemon Day Three Deadline 4/15 10 PM

[Narcizo]

Now I really must go.

[timmae]

That's interesting! Hey jackal!

I find the raven/shoveler/jackal around posts 520-550 weird.

[path12]

Originally Posted by timmae

That's interesting! Hey jackal!

I find the raven/shoveler/jackal around posts 520-550 weird.

Can you clarify? I just went back and read them and didn't see a whole lot.

[timmae]

Originally Posted by path12

Can you clarify? I just went back and read them and didn't see a whole lot.

I read back through to verify any instances in which Jag or Jackal interacted with team evil (and assumed team evil member shoveler) during the game. That page of threads was the jist of it I think. The sequencing between jackal/raven/shoveler posts was an interesting give and take. Jackal pushes raven's thought about me being inactive. Meanwhile shoveler is asking about jackals vote towards him. Jackal pushes more action towards me. Jackal backs off when CR pipes in. Then has an iffy reason on the shoveler vote (not much going on). Then when I vote autumn he places his vote there. In the span of 2 hours there were numerous thoughts/reactions from jackal but not much conviction to any of them. Just pinged me is all.

[The Jackal]

Fair assessment - I was intentionally moving my vote around yesterday to see how other votes would follow, as I alluded to.

What do you mean though by, "Jackal pushes more action towards me"

All I said was that I wanted to hear more from you, then that your line about not voting for you should be irrelevant. If that was a joke CR obviously saw it but to me I was being honest.. saying something like that before leaving just strikes me as being off.

[The Jackal]

Honestly though I don't have a good read on whom the last wolf is, I'm happy to admit it. I haven't played my best game so if I need to be scanned/lynched that's fine, s'long as the village wins.

[The Jackal]

Certainly not saying I won't continue to attempt to analyze, though!

[The Jackal]

double negatives and all

[The Jackal]

I'll prolly end up putting together a trust list with stabs at reasoning tomorrow once we presumably have one more scan.

[The Jackal]

Though the way this week is going at work, not sure I'll have a ton of time during the day.. we'll see

[timmae]

Originally Posted by The Jackal

Fair assessment - I was intentionally moving my vote around yesterday to see how other votes would follow, as I alluded to.

What do you mean though by, "Jackal pushes more action towards me"

All I said was that I wanted to hear more from you, then that your line about not voting for you should be irrelevant. If that was a joke CR obviously saw it but to me I was being honest.. saying something like that before leaving just strikes me as being off.

By action I meant notice I guess. Your posts:

Originally Posted by The Jackal

I'll decide what's a waste of my time thank you very much

Originally Posted by The Jackal

hint: this meeting

Originally Posted by The Jackal

but yes timmae, that last line is and/or should be disregarded by everyone

I was reading into the fact that you were casting the net wider in some cases (thoughts without direct reasoning or content to back it up) rather than being specific to what was pinging you about certain people. Essentially I read wolfies as casting a little bit of blame amongst the most amount of people while village tends to pick apart specific instances/content.

I think to my detriment I often have a gut feel towards why I think someone is evil and I am not able to back it up with enough case study. I am hoping I am getting better at it though. These first few games have been more about posting my thoughts so I don't die with them more than anything.

[JAG]

So Narc and I called out Grover, no response. Timmae said something, Grover asked for clarification, then just said thanks afterwards.

So Grover, do you have any thoughts on the remaining wolf? Anything you van point to that would make me feel better about you?

[The Jackal]

Timmae - the meeting comment was about the actual meeting I was in at work, not us "meeting" - just in case you were interpreting it that way. I would rarely call WW banter useless.

[The Jackal]

And as someone who is having trouble deciding who the last person to target is, I appreciate the depth of your analysis on me. Now you don't necessarily have to believe me, but my vote jumping yesterday was intentional and trying to detect any shifts in the overall vote because of it, as well as gauging the reactions of the people I was voting for.

[Grover]

Originally Posted by JAG

So Narc and I called out Grover, no response. Timmae said something, Grover asked for clarification, then just said thanks afterwards.

So Grover, do you have any thoughts on the remaining wolf? Anything you van point to that would make me feel better about you?

Where was I called out? I must have missed this.

I think it's Font. I'm still rubbed the wrong way by her aggressiveness toward EF.

Other than that, I'm pretty certain we guessed right tonight. If we're wrong and Shoveler is innocent, I think we have to lynch path. If we're right, I want to focus on font tomorrow.

[The Jackal]

I am curious why other people are reading font strongly as villager - haven't been able to make up my mind there.

[The Jackal]

Let me put up the vote counts before I take a look see

[The Jackal]

(thanks EF, updating with Narc reveal)

Day One Final Tally

Cheekimonk 5-The Jackal(160), Raven(214), Chief Rum(226), Britrock(237), EagleFan(337)
EagleFan 5-Fontisian(61), Vaimes(71), Shoveler(264), Path(318), Cheekimonk(333)
Britrock 4- JAG(59), Narcizo(192), Autumn(260), Timmae(293)
The Jackal 1-Grover(104)


Day Two Final Tally

Raven 6- Autumn(622), Vaimes(626), Fontisian(636), Path(638), Timmae(641), JAG(675)
Autumn 4- The Jackal(546), Shoveler(579), Chief Rum(585), Raven(597)
Shoveler 2-EagleFan(360), Narcizo(510)
Timmae 1- Grover(530)

[EagleFan]

Originally Posted by The Jackal

I am curious why other people are reading font strongly as villager

Not everyone has...

[The Jackal]

In no particular order:

Font - Early vote on EF D1 that doesn't move, overtly aggressive towards him. The aggressiveness seems to strike others as unwolfy - in general I agree but I don't have a strong village read on Font. D2 Voted for Raven post-shoveler reveal as a drive-by at 9:32 (636) - didn't post again until 9:59 to say:

Originally Posted by fontisian

Look, if the reason we're not lynching EF is that he probably wouldn't have made that kill (which is my reasoning), that also applies to Autumn.

Again, I'm pretty neutral on font.


Vaimes: Have talked at length about how the false claim bothered me, but without playing with Vaimes much it's fairly hard to make any reads based on it, learning as I go about other boards cultures. Another early vote on EF that wasn't moved, and the first to follow Autumn on to Raven. He didn't need to make that move, he was only the 2nd vote and it was early enough to wait for other candidates to be suggested if he's a wolf. Could have done it to buy trust in case Raven got momentum, but that vote elevates him slightly for me.


Timmae: D1 doesn't say a lot to me, was more quiet than I've come to expect as mentioned by others, but everyone has a busy day now and then. D2 he is one of the latter people to move on to Raven - but that isn't indicative in itself as four people voted Raven within 15 posts. I tend to find it likeliest that a wolf teammate would bide their time and not jump on Raven right away, so this pushes timmae slightly down my trust list.

JAG: Hasn't really pinged me, but I'm not an expert in reading him. Early D1 vote with no movement and the last to jump on Raven are not the best looking votes, but I'm neutral leaning good here.

Grover: No real read. Two outlier votes which look bad but that we were told to expect if the votes went different ways. As I said before, without him having been forced to make a decision, it's tough to use his votes to look at. I know Grover pretty well but I have no idea what to expect from him in terms of how he plays this game. I didn't think he was the Angel in the Mars game. So, throwing knowing him aside - I don't think his posts have added much and he's been absent during critical periods where people were talking to each other. So I guess I'm pretty neutral here but thinking I can give him more time to make his mark.

[JAG]

Here Grover:

Originally Posted by JAG

Post 530 for Grover, switching from font to timmae when Raven had 3 and timmae had 2 doesn't look too good.

Originally Posted by JAG

Grover's my only guess for the last wolf at this point after reading back. path had some good dialogue calling him out Day 2 and his vote on timmae yesterday looks fishy in retrospect.

Originally Posted by Narcizo

I ought to try and do some sort of analysis but I haven't really had time today and its difficult seeing past Grover. My worry is that this, barring Path's scan tonight, is all the information we're going to get. But with the number of cleared villagers I think the wolf would have to be the last possible person imaginable for us not to win. But wackier things have happened.

Originally Posted by Narcizo

Anyone would think people don't read my posts.

Vaimes isn't the martyr - I am. Vaimes never seriously meant he was the martyr. Vaimes claiming martyr should not be interpreted in any way as him being bad. If anyone says that I'm going to come back from the dead and box their ears.

I would like to change my suspicion list a bit.

Most suspicious at the top this time:

Grover
Jag
Jackal
Timmae
Vaimes
Fonti

So not actually a radical change to be honest I've just realised.

Jag's vote on Raven was when it was fait accomplice. Jackal's votes have been pretty bogus but I've had a better vibe from Jackal than Jag. I feel very confident that font and Vaimes are village, particularly fonti. And that should be enough to see us win.

[The Jackal]

We'll know more about someone in a couple hours. Before I sink time into going back through more posts to see if I feel anything outside of vote analysis, I'll wait for the night results.

[JAG]

Originally Posted by The Jackal

I am curious why other people are reading font strongly as villager - haven't been able to make up my mind there.

Not as sold as Narc is, but she did have good votes on Shoveler and Raven yesterday.

[The Jackal]

I actually feel like part of my neutral to good read on JAG is you guys getting in my head about it being unlikely that EF/Autumn (before knowing their allegiance) would approve of the brit NK. If that's the reasoning, JAG fits in that group too.

[The Jackal]

Originally Posted by JAG

Not as sold as Narc is, but she did have good votes on Shoveler and Raven yesterday.

If Grover ends up being the wolf, good on the 4 of you for making that switch and excellent villager play.

[The Jackal]

(and obviously good target, autumn)

[EagleFan]

Where has font been?

[EagleFan]

Don't like Grover's two votes at all. A Raven/Shoveler/Grover WW team would be a relatively inexperienced FOFC WW team which could point to the day 1 NK.

Jackal is trying hard tonight, which could be helpful villager or a wolf trying to be a helpful villager.

font has vanished today; potentially a wolf in hiding move.

JAG has been hard to read, he doesn't seem to be the same JAG that I remember in games. His vote on Raven looks good though.

timmae has been a riddle to me but his vote on Raven looks decent.

Vaimes had a parked vote on day one. His day two vote could go either way.


Don't feel strongly enough about any of the above at the moment.

[fontisian]

Or, font's been busy toDay.

[Shoveler]

this entire game was a clusterfuck from the beginning. zinto should have seen that three noobs on the wolf team would get absolutely eaten alive. team rocketing into the side of a mountain has been a dream to be a part of for the past two or so days. after last night i gave up, and i am really surprised to see the last of my team trying desperately to keep the game alive when he doesn’t have a chance in hell. this game is fucking over, and has been due to the stupid ass mistakes made last night. raven was supposed to vote for me and then move his vote after my reveal. and path you are so damn lucky buddy. i had the night kill order on you right after you contested my claim and it stuck there until timmae decided to change it to chief in the last few minutes before the deadline. i have stewed about this all day and fuck it i cannot wait to be lynched and get the hell out of this thread. I suck at werewolf, screw this game

[timmae]

woh... what is that now? Shoveler... stooge #2. Now we need to find the 3rd stooge. This play sounds like a vet move to throw choas around. Bad shoveler!

[timmae]

Font, what are your thoughts on this claim by shoveler?

[Zinto]

As of Post 882

Shoveler 7-Path(763), Font(765), Vaimes(766), JAG(771), Narcizo(773), Grover(783), EagleFan(784), Autumn(793), The Jackal(800)
Autumn 1-Timmae(728)

Nightfall 1-Narcizo(834)

[The Jackal]

Originally Posted by Shoveler

until timmae decided to change it to chief

[timmae]

unvote autumn
vote shoveler

Bit of housekeeping after my shoveler vote didn't have an unvote of autumn.

[EagleFan]

Hmm, really hope that is gamesmanship. Not fond of that play if it is the truth though.

[Vaimes]

I laughed.

[timmae]

I sincerely hope that last sentence was added only for an exclamation to the last ditch effort to save this for the wolves. I hope shoveler is onboard for the next game and many more after that!

[Grover]

I think he's trying to save himself at the last moment, it's a complete desperation play.

But it is a bizarre play of gamesmanship. I don't know why something like that statement would be thrown out there.

[path12]

Originally Posted by Shoveler

and path you are so damn lucky buddy. i had the night kill order on you right after you contested my claim and it stuck there until timmae decided to change it to chief in the last few minutes before the deadline.

Luck my ass. If you would have night killed me you would have found out I was the seer and you'd be right where you are this very minute.

I will get night killed as a role every single time if it means a village win.

[path12]

Originally Posted by path12

Luck my ass. If you would have night killed me you would have found out I was the seer and you'd be right where you are this very minute.

I will get night killed as a role every single time if it means a village win.

Enjoyed playing with you though.

[EagleFan]

Though it does help having a couple extra cleared players.

[path12]

Originally Posted by EagleFan

Though it does help having a couple extra cleared players.

You would have went back and found those earlier posts to clear you. Wouldn't have known about Autumn, but you'd still have two wolves down at that point.

[path12]

So. Stupid to keep the scan choice under wraps with one wolf yet, so let me get some ideas from y'all.

Right now I'm between Grover and timmae.

Thoughts?

[path12]

Dola, I'm going for a wolf, not to clear anyone's name.

[path12]

"Yet" in #894 should be "left".

[EagleFan]

I wouldn't be adverse to a JAG scan to be honest (would clear up an potential "why is JAG still alive?" confusion).

Though your two choices are good as well, or throw font into that mix.

If we think that Shoveler's rant was just a planned rant for gamesmanship we would have to assume it was discussed between the two remaining wolves.

That would mean that we need to ask if timmae's response was a believable just got thrown under the bus response.

That is kind of a risky play as going after the wrong person that way could potentially blow things out of control.


(sorry, kind of spitting out random thoughts as they come to me there)

[JAG]

Originally Posted by path12

So. Stupid to keep the scan choice under wraps with one wolf yet, so let me get some ideas from y'all.

Right now I'm between Grover and timmae.

Thoughts?

Grover naturally. He still hasn't responded to me and had a vote that helped wolf Raven. Even if we were only to go on post tone, it's hard to believe wolf timmae would forget that Autumn had been scanned by the real seer.

[JAG]

Originally Posted by timmae

Ok, I don't like voting claimed village D1. So... Both Grover and raven have been around but not over the top active. Grover is off bowling so I will go with the guy who stuck up for Brit unasked.

unvote britrock
Vote raven

From Day 1

[Grover]

Originally Posted by JAG

Grover naturally. He still hasn't responded to me and had a vote that helped wolf Raven. Even if we were only to go on post tone, it's hard to believe wolf timmae would forget that Autumn had been scanned by the real seer.

And you haven't responded to my response where I asked when you called me out.