Vick Sentenced to 23 Months For Dog Fighting

[stevew]

If this is indeed true, I'd say there's at least 600 more posts left in this thread, if not more.

[larrymcg421]

Originally Posted by stevew

If this is indeed true, I'd say there's at least 600 more posts left in this thread, if not more.

If this goes to trial, this thread will destroy the board.

[st.cronin]

There's no way Vick can go to trial now, can he? As public as this negotiation has been, don't the Feds have him by the balls?

[larrymcg421]

Originally Posted by st.cronin

There's no way Vick can go to trial now, can he? As public as this negotiation has been, don't the Feds have him by the balls?

None of that is admissable, but yeah anyone on the jury will know about that, so he's screwed. That doesn't mean he won't be stupid, though.

Be stupid, Mike! Come on! Do it for the TV fans!

[Axxon]

Originally Posted by SkyDog

Yes yes. When I think of the Patriots and Bucs in particular, I think, "Man, they ALWAYS used to suck." The Bucs and Seahawks are still expansion teams in my mind.

Don't feel bad. I've been a Bucs fan since the day the franchise was awarded and I still think of us as an expansion team.

What's funny is that this is really a huge part of my love for the team. Existing longer than them but not by a whole lot; I had just discovering football a year before they got a team and my interest in football was directly related to all news Buccaneers and vice versa actually.

I feel more tied to the team than I would have had the team always been around ( and always sucked ) and I became a fan of them. The Bucs are kinda like a little brother. I watched them be born, I watched them fall like babies. I watched them grow up, I watched them ascend to the pinnacle and now, well, this year we'll see but I'll tell you one thing

The adventure has been great and I wouldn't have it any other way.

Except for Bo Jackson, but every great adventure needs it's villian.

[Vinatieri for Prez]

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

Y'know, it is at least possible that some of us remember football prior to 1983.

Prior to the SB season in '85, the Patriots had not won a playoff game in 22 years, dating back to the AFL in 1963 and only made the post-season 3 times in that span. And after '85, it was another decade before they won another playoff game in 1996. To put that in a little perspective, from 1970 to 1995, the Patsies made the playoffs 6 times ... only once more than the woeful Falcons and once time less than the Colts.

I can't say if that's what the original post had in mind, but it does seem at least possible.

Synovia said collossally bad prior to 2000. How far do you want me to go back - the Boston Patriots?? I went back all way until the strike season. I think I was more than generous in even doing that. And he compared them to the current day Lions. He should have said pre-1984 then under your theory, but of course that wasn't his argument. And while you say they didn't win a playoff game for awhile prior to 1985, you can't honestly say that the Pats did not have a pretty good team in the late 1970s. Anyway you slice it, even going back that far, you cannot describe them as collossally bad or comparable to the recent Detroit Lions.

[Ben E Lou]

Not exactly what you'd call a reliable source here, but at least an interesting read if you like watching train wrecks.

Originally Posted by AJC

Vick deeply into dogfighting, father says

Originally Posted by AJC

QB's dad says he didn't abandon family

The Atlanta Journal-Constitution
Published on: 08/24/07

Michael Vick's father said he pushed his son to quit dogfighting years ago or, at least, put property used for the fights in the name of friends to avoid being implicated some day.


Michael Boddie, in two sometimes tearful interviews with The Atlanta Journal-Constitution this week, said some time around 2001 his son staged dogfights in the garage of the family's home in Newport News, Va. Boddie also said Vick kept fighting dogs in the family's backyard, including injured ones — "bit up, chewed up, exhausted" — that the father nursed back to health.


Boddie, who is estranged from his son, dismissed the idea that Vick's longtime friends were the main instigators of the dogfighting operation.
"I wish people would stop sugarcoating it," Boddie said. "This is Mike's thing. And he knows it."


He "likes it, and he has the capital to have a set up like that."
Daniel Meachum, an attorney for Vick, said his client never mentioned situations described by Boddie, nor discussed Boddie in relation to dog activities. "It's a disgrace Mr. Boddie, who chose for nearly 22 years not to be part of Mike's life, would at this time seek to capitalize on his son's current situation."


Vick's mother, Brenda Vick Boddie, who hasn't lived with her husband for the past five years, did not return calls seeking comment.


Boddie said he and the Atlanta Falcons quarterback have had a volatile relationship for years and that his son has refused to speak with him directly for the last 2 1/2 half months. Boddie said he is speaking out because he's been hurt by his son and wife's failure over the years to correct what he considers inaccurate media reports that Vick grew up without his father present.


"I've been drug through the mud," Boddie said.


He said he intends to write a damaging book about more of what he knows.


Boddie, 45, lives in a Duluth apartment that his son has paid the rent on for the last three years. Vick, who has a $130 million contract with the Falcons, also gives him a couple of hundred dollars every week or two, the father said.


Boddie wanted more. Two years ago, he said, he asked Vick for $1 million, spread out over 12 years, enough to keep him comfortable for the rest of his life. Vick declined, the father said. In recent weeks, Boddie asked Vick, through an assistant, for $700,000 to live on.


Boddie said he hasn't been contacted by federal investigators pursuing dogfighting accusations against Vick. A federal grand jury indicted Vick with one count of conspiracy to cross state lines to engage in illegal gambling; to sponsor a dog in an animal fighting venture; and to buy, transport and receive dogs for animal fighting.


The indictment does not mention the parents' former home in Newport News, where Boddie said he cared for Vick's pit bulls and where he said three dogfighting session were held, roughly around the time that Vick was transitioning from college football to the pros.


Earlier this week, Vick agreed to plead guilty Monday in the federal dogfighting case in Richmond. He faces prison and the possible end of his football career. Three co-defendants already pleaded guilty and were expected to testify against Vick if the case went to trial. In addition, a Virginia prosecutor is considering bringing state charges against Vick.


Anger and anguish
Boddie lives in an apartment, just a few miles from where his son lives in the upscale, gated Sugarloaf neighborhood. Posters of the football star are thumb-tacked to the walls of a guest bedroom. A picture of Vick's two young children is framed on a wall near the kitchen. Hung on a wall beside the kitchen sink is a long list entitled "Quick Drink Recipes."


In language blanketed with profanity, a sometimes sitting, sometimes pacing Boddie recounted what he said was some, but not all, of what he knows about his son. At times while discussing his wife and children, Boddie appeared to alternate between anger and anguish. His cellphone rang several times. At one point he answered, paused, unleashed an expletive-laced torrent of words and marched out of the apartment with the phone to his ear. He later said the caller was an assistant of Michael Vick's who asked what he planned to disclose to a reporter and urged him to keep quiet.


"I know some things," Boddie said. "That's why they're going crazy."
He said he's not perfect. He said he hasn't worked since 2003, went through drug rehab in 2004 paid for by his son, was sometimes high or drunk around his children when they were young, has gotten in trouble for drinking and driving and had his driver's license revoked.


"There are some things I wish I could go back and change," he said.
But Boddie said he gave Vick something that most kids didn't have in the Newport News housing projects where both grew up: "I never left his side. Never left his mother's side. And where we come from, this day and time, that's a hell of a thing."


He and Vick's mother weren't married when Michael Vick was born. But they married later and Boddie said he lived with the family from the time Vick was 3 years old until after his eldest son went to Virginia Tech to play football. He said he was usually working during Vick's youth, often on jobs sandblasting and repainting ships.


He said he is frustrated about continued suggestions that Vick was raised without a father. He said his son and wife should have set the record straight.


But in a 2001 AJC article about their son, his wife was quoted as saying that Boddie's presence in Vick's childhood "means a lot to me."


"He was always there, providing, taking care of what needed to be taken care of. Through everything, we stayed together as a family. I have a lot of respect for him for that."


But in other press reports, both Michael Vick and his mother suggested that Boddie was an emotionally distant father. He "never paid that much attention to me," Vick said, according to a Sports Illustrated story in 2000.
Boddie said that, over the last year, his son has been disrespecting him, "talking to me like I'm one of his . . . dogs."


Boddie said he's tried to look out for his son. Around 2002, while at Vick's rural property near Smithfield, Va., he warned his son.


"I told him basically, 'You don't need to be doing this. You got bigger fish to fry. You got more important things that you can do.' "


Boddie recalled telling his son to transfer the property to the name of one of his friends: " 'Take this place right now, put it in one of their names because if anything goes wrong . . . it's you they coming after.' "
Boddie said he doesn't recall his son's reply.


Boddie also said dogfighting occurred at the family's Newport News home on Terrace Drive. The family was in the house for about a year or more as Vick moved from playing college football at Virginia Tech to the pros. Boddie said he cleaned out the home's garage three times in 2001 to make room for dogfighting sessions held by Vick and his friends.


"I hung around long enough to actually walk in there when an actual dogfight was going on," Boddie said, but he added that he didn't stay long.
"It wasn't my thing," he said.


He said he had already witnessed test fights of dogs — in which dogs battle to see how well a prospective fighter will perform.


"It's really something to stand there and watch. You have to have the stomach for it," he said.


Boddie said Michael Vick kept pit bulls in eight cages in the backyard of the Terrace Drive home. However, a neighbor, Willie-Mae Hansell, said she only saw one dog at the house, and never heard anything unusual there.


"I fed the dogs," Boddie said. "I've nursed them back to health, dogs that have been in fights. Raised litters of puppies."


The injured dogs could barely muster up enough strength to eat at first, he said. Boddie contends that Vick's mother was aware of the dogfighting and said he heard her tell her son to stop it. Boddie said of his son: "I think he basically told her, 'OK, Mama. OK, I'll stop.' "


Boddie said he wasn't aware of any dogfighting in the Newport News projects when Vick grew up there. The closest he recalled was kids being fascinated as dogs chased stray cats in a nearby lumber yard. He said that, despite his earlier warnings to his son, he never expected Vick would someday face the dogfighting troubles he is in now.


"I thought he would have gotten out of it by then, gotten it out of his system."

[miami_fan]

Originally Posted by larrymcg421

There's still hope for a circus trial.

Ohhhh yeah....

See I knew I wasn't the only one

[Easy Mac]

Everytime I turn on the TV, there's someone saying Vick made a mistake and should be forgiven.

What mistake did he make?

Its a mistake if I accidently run over someone's dog. It's a mistake if I fill in the wrong circle on a voting ballot.

Its not a mistake if I habitually fight and kill dogs. The only mistake he made was associating with people who weren't as good as he was at not getting caught.

[RPI-Fan]

I get the sense that the feds REALLY don't have as much as here as everone seems to believe they do. They let Vick toy with them on the timeline of the plea deal (was supposed to be on a Friday, but he just decided to wait until Monday...), and now this comes up. I mean, in the Duke case, wasn't there a good month or two before anyone started to question the prosecution's case?

I suspect that the testimony the feds will get can be pretty much wiped out by lack of credibility of the "witnesses", and that while there might be a paper trail, it doesn't relate to gambling the way that everyone assumes it does.

[RPI-Fan]

Originally Posted by Easy Mac

Everytime I turn on the TV, there's someone saying Vick made a mistake and should be forgiven.

What mistake did he make?

Its a mistake if I accidently run over someone's dog. It's a mistake if I fill in the wrong circle on a voting ballot.

Its not a mistake if I habitually fight and kill dogs. The only mistake he made was associating with people who weren't as good as he was at not getting caught.

His only mistake was getting caught. However, sometimes getting caught is the only thing that makes you realize how wrong you've been and allows you to truly develop and show remorse for your actions. On the other hand, sometimes it just makes you sorry you got caught.

I'm hoping Vick has the "first" option happen to him, and while I am as anti-cruelty-to-animals as anyone, I could think about forgiving him if he truly does seem remorseful for what he's done (even if it took federal charges to make him see things that way).

[Kodos]

Yes, Mikey. Take this to trial. Good idea!

[flere-imsaho]

Originally Posted by larrymcg421

If this goes to trial, this thread will destroy the board.

Nah, if the Katrina thread didn't destroy the board, nothing will.

[rkmsuf]

Originally Posted by Kodos

Yes, Mikey. Take this to trial. Good idea!

Mr. Vick, how would you describe yourself?

Vick: i'm da shit

[flounder]

Am I the only one who thinks he has a great shot of getting at least a hung jury at trial? Everyone thought going into the OJ trial that it was an open and shut case. If I was him, I'd take my chances, too.

[RPI-Fan]

Originally Posted by flounder

Am I the only one who thinks he has a great shot of getting at least a hung jury at trial? Everyone thought going into the OJ trial that it was an open and shut case. If I was him, I'd take my chances, too.

Granted he'll be going up against federal prosecutors rather than the L.A.P.D. and D.A.'s office, but I am still very skeptical of the amount and quality of evidence that they may have. (not to say I don't think Vick was a de facto ringleader)

[Logan]

Doesn't the racketeering charge become easier to prove with the corroboration of all these other guys?

[albionmoonlight]

Originally Posted by larrymcg421

If this goes to trial, this thread will destroy the board.

Only if it somehow also manages to incorporate a discussion of Monthly Console Sales Numbers.

[John Galt]

Originally Posted by albionmoonlight

Only if it somehow also manages to incorporate a discussion of Monthly Console Sales Numbers.

Those threads have to be the most overachieving threads I have ever seen on this board. When I saw the first one, I would have never predicted they would last a week, much less what they have become.

[st.cronin]

Originally Posted by RPI-Fan

Granted he'll be going up against federal prosecutors rather than the L.A.P.D. and D.A.'s office, but I am still very skeptical of the amount and quality of evidence that they may have. (not to say I don't think Vick was a de facto ringleader)

I don't know how any outsider can have an informed opinion about the quality of evidence.

[st.cronin]

Originally Posted by John Galt

Those threads have to be the most overachieving threads I have ever seen on this board. When I saw the first one, I would have never predicted they would last a week, much less what they have become.

+1, the whole thing just baffles me. Every now and then I go look to see if there isn't actually something else going on in there.

[DaddyTorgo]

Originally Posted by flounder

Am I the only one who thinks he has a great shot of getting at least a hung jury at trial? Everyone thought going into the OJ trial that it was an open and shut case. If I was him, I'd take my chances, too.

it's not a jury trail though, is it?

[Logan]

Originally Posted by John Galt

Those threads have to be the most overachieving threads I have ever seen on this board. When I saw the first one, I would have never predicted they would last a week, much less what they have become.

I've never stepped into those threads. Am I missing gold?

[RPI-Fan]

Originally Posted by DaddyTorgo

it's not a jury trail though, is it?

Except under limited circumstances, you have the right to trial-by-jury (whether at the local, state, or federal level).

[RPI-Fan]

Originally Posted by st.cronin

I don't know how any outsider can have an informed opinion about the quality of evidence.

I'm not trying to purport to having a particularly "informed" opinion of this specific case. My skepticism is based on proceedings of previous high-profile cases and the actions of the various parties. The actions of the parties in this case, based on what I have seen in the psat, leads me to believe there may not be as much as evidence as general concensus seems to assume.

???

[DaddyTorgo]

Originally Posted by RPI-Fan

Except under limited circumstances, you have the right to trial-by-jury (whether at the local, state, or federal level).

mmm. but i wonder if they charge him under RICO is it still a jury trial? would seem to make sense that RICO trials would be in those circumstances or something (not wanting mafia to retaliate against jury members). but i dunno if that's true...just saying

and i don't think he really has a shot at a hung jury. too many people just really love their dogs, or have friends who love their dogs. and no dog-lover is going to acquit if there is sufficient evidence for the feds to bring it to trial

[John Galt]

Originally Posted by Logan

I've never stepped into those threads. Am I missing gold?

If by "gold," you mean pointless, endless, joyless bickering, then yes, you are missing tons and tons of gold.

[albionmoonlight]

Originally Posted by DaddyTorgo

mmm. but i wonder if they charge him under RICO is it still a jury trial?

If Vick were to go to trial, he would have the right to a jury.

[RPI-Fan]

Originally Posted by DaddyTorgo

mmm. but i wonder if they charge him under RICO is it still a jury trial? would seem to make sense that RICO trials would be in those circumstances or something (not wanting mafia to retaliate against jury members). but i dunno if that's true...just saying

and i don't think he really has a shot at a hung jury. too many people just really love their dogs, or have friends who love their dogs. and no dog-lover is going to acquit if there is sufficient evidence for the feds to bring it to trial

Right, that's the thing with hung juries. You could have the 11 biggest dog-lovers in the world on the jury, but if the 12th guy is Gary Sheffield, you could get your hung jury.

[rowech]

Originally Posted by RPI-Fan

Right, that's the thing with hung juries. You could have the 11 biggest dog-lovers in the world on the jury, but if the 12th guy is Gary Sheffield, you could get your hung jury.

Or with Ron Jeremy.

[Warhammer]

Originally Posted by RPI-Fan

I get the sense that the feds REALLY don't have as much as here as everone seems to believe they do. They let Vick toy with them on the timeline of the plea deal (was supposed to be on a Friday, but he just decided to wait until Monday...), and now this comes up. I mean, in the Duke case, wasn't there a good month or two before anyone started to question the prosecution's case?

There were quite a few asking questions about the case as it was coming out.

I really feel what is happening here is that the Feds want to get this over and done with and not take the chance of someone hanging a jury and Vick getting off.

[rowech]

Originally Posted by Warhammer

There were quite a few asking questions about the case as it was coming out.

I really feel what is happening here is that the Feds want to get this over and done with and not take the chance of someone hanging a jury and Vick getting off.

My opinion as well...and the fact that Vick feels he can get a hung jury now after seeing reaction in the media.

[rkmsuf]

Originally Posted by st.cronin

+1, the whole thing just baffles me. Every now and then I go look to see if there isn't actually something else going on in there.

+2

[Warhammer]

Originally Posted by Buccaneer

Before the Bucs and Hawks came, the joke teams were (in the 1970s) were the Oilers, Saints, Eagles, Giants, Bears and I think Falcons. The Bucs and Hawks did suck early on but one cannot forget the Bucs run in 1979 and by the early 1980s, the Hawks were a good team.

The Oilers, Eagles, Bucs and Hawks all got respectable by the late 70s or early 80s. The Oilers had a couple of 10 win seasons with Campbell in the late 70s, the Eagles made it to Super Bowl 15 and had another playoff run in there, the Bucs made the NFC Championship game in 79, and the Hawks had their runs in the early 80s behind Warner and Kreig.

[KWhit]

Originally Posted by duckman

ESPN's Lester Munson is saying the plea agreement is serious jeopardy. His opinion is that the feds will rather take the case to court than agreeing to Vick's version of the statement of facts. That will mean more charges will be filed against him since he didn't take the plea agreement.

Good.

[Eaglesfan27]

Vick's attorneys filed the plea agreement today. From ESPN's website:

Michael Vick filed a plea agreement in federal court Friday admitting to a dogfighting charge and agreed the enterprise included killing fighting dogs and gambling.


However, according to the statement of facts that accompanies the plea, Vick did not place side bets and did not receive proceeds from purses from the fights.


The Atlanta Falcons quarterback is scheduled to formally enter his plea Monday in U.S. District Court.


In the agreement, Vick agreed to plead guilty to the first count of the indictment against him -- that he was part of a conspiracy to operate a dogfighting ring across state lines. The charge carries a potential sentence of up 5 years in prison, a fine of up to $250,000 and up to three years' probation.
In the plea agreement, Vick agreed to enter the plea "because the defendant is in fact guilty of the charged offense."

[bob]

And here is the plea agreement:

http://sports.espn.go.com/photo/2007...icksummary.pdf

[Eaglesfan27]

Reading the plea agreement, it sounds like he admitted to killing dogs after all.

[bob]

Yeah, I think ESPN heard a bad report or rumor and just reported it as fact.

[rowech]

If you read the whole thing though, it clearly states later on Vick did not admit to killing dogs.

[Eaglesfan27]

Originally Posted by rowech

If you read the whole thing though, it clearly states later on Vick did not admit to killing dogs.

He didn't admit to it in the paragraph about 2001 or maybe it was 2002. In later paragraphs, he admits to killing 6 to 8 dogs due to the collective efforts of himself and 2 of his friends.

Edit: It's on page 9 where he admits to killing 6-8 dogs with his friends via methods which included hanging and drowning and that it was due to the collective efforts of his 2 friends and him.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Okay, so the behind-the-scenes stuff on the plea seems to have probably been about him not stipulating that he actually gambled himself, only that he bankrolled the operation & gambling of others. Seems that might have been what could have gotten him banned for life (or quite a few years at least) from the NFL.

If anything though, I find the fact he didn't gamble on the fights even more disturbing. This really does seem to have been simply about fun for him.

edit to add:
Meanwhile the AJC article tries to explain the difference in whether Vick admitting to killing the dogs. Looks like he's trying to leave himself a loophole that will let him claim he didn't, even though the statement is worded to imply that he did.
Steve Sadow, a prominent Atlanta defense attorney who has followed the case, said he believes Vick's attorneys agreed to the careful phrasing in the summary of facts to help them with their negotiations with the NFL and for public relations.

"It's important because of the NFL's gambling policy," Sadow said. "The fact that Michael Vick did not admit to personally killing any dogs in the plea agreement will also have, in my opinion, virtually no significance in the criminal case regarding his ultimate sentence. It's more of a public relations move."

The agreement says Vick was involved in the execution of dogs because his co-defendants have told the government that Vick participated in it, Sadow noted.

"Vick's position clearly is that he didn't kill any dogs," Sadow said. "But the government wasn't going to agree with that. So, rather than letting that be the hang up, they figured out language both sides could live with. Now, Vick can stand before his public and claim he never killed any dogs."

Vick and his co-defendants — Tony Taylor, Quanis Phillips and Purnell Peace — were involved in dog fights in Virginia and in other states, says the summary of facts accompanying the plea agreement. This began in 2001 and carried on through this past April.

In the summer of 2002, according to the agreement, Vick and his co-defendants "rolled" or "tested" Bad Newz Kennels dogs by putting them through fighting sessions to determine which ones were good fighters. "Vick was aware that Phillips, Peace and Taylor killed a number of dogs that did not perform well in testing sessions around this time," the summary says. "Vick did not kill any dogs at this time."

This past April, Vick, Peace and Phillips tested additional Bad Newz Kennel dogs during fighting sessions. "Peace, Phillips and Vick agreed to the killing of approximately six to eight dogs that did not perform well in 'testing' sessions," the summary says. "Vick agrees and stipulates that these dogs all died as a result of the collective efforts of Peace, Phillips and Vick."

This language is different than that used in summaries accompanying the plea agreements previously reached by Phillips and Peace. Both of their summaries say that Vick participated with Phillips and Peace this past April in executing about eight dogs "by various methods, including hanging and drowning."
http://www.ajc.com/sports/content/sp...ge_tab_newstab

[Honolulu_Blue]

Here is a paragraph-by-paragraph analysis of Vick's plea agreement by by the profootballtalk.com guys, who've really been the bee's knees when it comes to reporting on this story. (In words of that black dude in Die Hard "... And the quarterback is toast.")

In paragraph 1, Vick pleads guilty to conspiracy to establish, maintain, etc. an interstate gambling enterprise and conspiracy to engage in interstate dog fighting.

In paragraph 2, Vick admits that the Surry County property to which he initially said he never goes was the main staging area for housing and training pit bulls for fighting.
In paragraph 3, Vick admits to being involved in dog fights at the Surry County property, and to participating in dog fights in other states.

In paragraph 4, Vick admits that the enterprise involved gambling activities in violation of Virginia law. Vick denies that he placed side bets on any fights, or that he received process from the purses. (However, he admits that he was the primary source of funds for the operation. If the winnings went only to his co-defendants, then that's less money Vick had to give them to get them to continue to tend to the operation while he was "at work" for the Atlanta Falcons.)

In paragraph 9, Vick admits that he began acquiring dogs for the operation in "2001-2002," and that the "Bad Newz Kennels" were established in 2002.

In paragraph 12, Vick admits that he knew the other defendants "killed a number of dogs" that did not perform well in testing sessions in 2002. Vick denies killing any dogs at that time.

In paragraph 32, Vick admits that in April 2007 -- the same month in which he say face-to-face with NFL Commissioner Roger Goodell and denied that dog fighting was occurring on his land -- he agreed with Purnell Peace and Quanis Phillips to kill six-to-eight dogs that did not perform well in testing sessions. Here's the key passage:

"[A]ll of those dogs were killed by various methods, including hanging and drowning. VICK agrees and stipulates that these dogs all died as a result of the collective efforts of PEACE, PHILLIPS, and VICK."

Case closed. He admits to gambling, and he admits to killing dogs.

[flere-imsaho]

No surprise, then. Vick wants to come out of this with the following:

1. Being able to say he didn't kill dogs personally.

2. Being able to say he wasn't involved with the gambling.

I'm sure he thinks the first will spare him/his team from the worst of the bad PR, and the second is obviously to avoid even worse sanctions from the NFL. This would appear to be a tacit admission that he was going to jail anyway, and wanted to try as much as possible to preserve a post-jail NFL career if possible.

[st.cronin]

Yeah, that's a bad deal for Vick, it seems like. I don't believe he got very good advice. He should have gone to trial, hired some real pit bull for a lawyer, and fought like hell. As it is, he's going to jail, he's almost definitely never playing football again, and he's going to run out of money very soon.

[Atocep]

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

Okay, so the behind-the-scenes stuff on the plea seems to have probably been about him not stipulating that he actually gambled himself, only that he bankrolled the operation & gambling of others. Seems that might have been what could have gotten him banned for life (or quite a few years at least) from the NFL.

If anything though, I find the fact he didn't gamble on the fights even more disturbing. This really does seem to have been simply about fun for him.

According to the collective bargaining agreement, the gambling charge would give Goodell leeway to suspend him anyway he sees fit. So I think its pretty obvious since he has 7 witnesses willing to testify otherwise that this is just an attempt to save his NFL career. He's probably hoping the feds are happy enough with his statement that they don't push the gambling thing.

From what I understand if they don't like what he says Monday when the plea is officially entered they can still pull it. Also, if the judge feels he's lying he can come down pretty harsh at sentencing, regardless of what the prosecution recommends.

[stevew]

I didn't realize they let you write your own plea agreement. That's hardly allocution.

[Honolulu_Blue]

Originally Posted by stevew

I didn't realize they let you write your own plea agreement. That's hardly allocution.

Typically, as I understand it, the government drafts the statement and then the defendant can revise. They exchange drafts back and forth until both sides are "happy".

[JonInMiddleGA]

I'm just hoping that the state charges & subsequent trial will blow up this obvious attempt at creating some loopholes for the gullible (or worse) to jump through.

[Honolulu_Blue]

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

I'm just hoping that the state charges & subsequent trial will blow up this obvious attempt at creating some loopholes for the gullible (or worse) to jump through.

+1