Baseball Mogul 2006 Preview Thread (Yes, Virginia, there ARE lefties and righties!)

[jbmagic]

Skydog

has the double injury been fix for patch 8.11?

[Ben E Lou]

Originally Posted by MizzouRah

The feeling I get, "I'm getting close to my last patch for 2006."

Ah, I see where you're coming from, but it doesn't particularly bother me since I've developed confidence that he's going to see this version through to the end.

[Buccaneer]

Originally Posted by SkyDog

Ah! I thought that, since it was right after the link to the poll (and those things weren't in the poll) that you were complaining (yes, you complain a lot) that they weren't in there.

And you, sir, harrass a lot.

[amdaily]

Originally Posted by jbmagic

Skydog

has the double injury been fix for patch 8.11?

I believe that will be in 8.12, but it's not a show stopper. I've started a fresh career with 8.11.

[jbmagic]

Originally Posted by amdaily

I believe that will be in 8.12, but it's not a show stopper. I've started a fresh career with 8.11.

thanks

sounds like the game is getting better.

[21C]

Originally Posted by MizzouRah

I just don't think a product that was not released in good shape should have a - next version, what do you want? thread. The feeling I get, "I'm getting close to my last patch for 2006."

I'm with Todd on this. I saw that thread before I came here and I just couldn't believe it. Monocle-dropping shocking!

I also agree with Galaril that it is like you are paying to beta test. I was one of those guys for the last few versions of Mogul. I bought them and spent most of the early going posting bugs I'd found or suggestions for improvements. I spent less time playing and more time posting about the game.

I beta tested this time but I didn't think the game was in great shape when it was due for release. I watched the Sports Mogul board closely to see how the game has progressed to see if it was good enough for purchase but I keep seeing some residual problem or, worse, some new problem introduced that breaks the game.

I still haven't committed to buying this year's version and now I find that they are canvasing opinions about next year's game. I think that this would be good if they begin beta testing a lot earlier so that the game gets released in good shape.

But I'm not convinced of this since Clay is talking about possibly releasing Basketball Mogul later this year when Football Mogul is only half-assed after two ( or is it three ) iterations.

[mgadfly]

I should be studying, but I played some BB mogul the past couple hours instead. With the latest Beta patch I have to say I'm having some fun. I turned down injuries and am having a lot of fun building the Mariners (fictional players) into a playoff contender.

[jbmagic]

There still more problems reported at Baseball Mogul Forum

" Scouting report stats & actual stats different
just installed v.8.11 but I dont know if this is exclusive to 8.11
The scouting report descriptions do not match the stats listed on the player page:
For example:
One of my pitchers is Oliver Perez. The scouting report indicates that he has started 8 games and has a 4.83 ERA. The stats on the same player page say that he has started 4 games and has a 6.41 ERA.
They don't match up."


Another Bug on version 8.11

"Pitchers are having incredible rookie seasons, followed by decent ones after it. In their rookie seasons, they always have 0 BB and 0 K.
Examples:

Bronson Arroyo-
Rookie Season: 22-7, 1.47 ERA 0 BB 0 K .072 OBA 11 CG
Next Season: 22-8, 3. 22 ERA 67 BB 1 K .275 OBA 15 CG

39 GS both years.

Gary Knotts-
Rookie Season: 21-7, 1.10 ERA 0 BB 0 K .091 OBA 13 CG
Next season: 19-12, 4.39 ERA 42 BB 0 K .317 OBA 7 CG

[jbmagic]

Unoffcial Patch 8.12 just release by Clay

"Unofficial Patch: v8.120

Fixed problem with transactions not being recorded in Simulator Mode in 8.100 and 8.110.

Also improves simulation pre-WWII (please post your feedback on this issue).

Still working on the "injuries while injured" bug.

Clay

P.S. I'm going to be away from the computer this weekend, so I won't be able to responde to issues until Monday"

[Galaril]

Is it me or our patches just solving problems that were caused by previouse patch or two earlier. Well ......(sigh)I guess I won't be playing any BM this weekend.

[Ben E Lou]

Originally Posted by Galaril

Is it me or our patches just solving problems that were caused by previouse patch or two earlier.

It's just you. Clay's developing the Markus bad habit of not listing all his enhancements in his patch feature lists, it would appear. Looking around the board this morning, I noticed several fixes and tweaks that he mentions to users that are not in the fix list. One of the undocumented fixes that looks GREAT so far is this one:

Clay Dreslough Mr. Blog Registered: Jun 2001 Location: Ashford, Connecticut Posts: 2030

quote: Originally posted by dolfanar It's just as bad or worse the further you go back in the game. You have *tons* of historical rookies, people who IRL saw Major League action being displaced far too early by 18 year old Major League stars. The player development curve is incredibly flawed, and the game is all over the place with player assignments within an organization. I have spent a lot of time working on this issue recently. Start a new game with 8.12 and let me know. Clay __________________ Clay Dreslough Sports Mogul Inc. Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged

04-16-2005 02:37 AM

In my first 8.12 test, I'm so far seeing a trifecta that I've never seen before in any baseball sim:

1. accurate average ages of everyday players
2. 23-25 being the norm of guys becoming everyday players
3. still having a few players perform well into their late 30's and early 40's.

This is definitely a new thing. The most recent season in my league saw a 21-year-old have a .247-36-101 season, a 37-year-old with .290-19-85 numbers, and a 42-year-old hit 10 homers in 257 at bats, all while the league's average age was less than a quarter of a year from real-life.

Also, Clay didn't mention it, but FINALLLYYYYYY RBI is next to HR on player cards.

[Ben E Lou]

Actually, there's at least one more undocumented fix as well. Why do some developers do this? I can understand it a "fixed small bugs and glitches" mention if the fixes are truly tiny, such as fixing a spelling error on a report or a tiny interface fix, but when you fix something like this...

Author Thread

BigBubba Grand Marshall Registered: Sep 2003 Location: Minnesota Posts: 24 Fake It Has anyone else noticed that Historic players gain MLB experiance while in the Minors. Kind of a pain if you want to try to get ROY when by the time they are ready to play they have 2-3 years of MLB experiance from AAA play. Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged 04-16-2005 01:53 AM

Clay Dreslough Mr. Blog http://www.mogulsports.com/vbulletin...ine=1105133231 Registered: Jun 2001 Location: Ashford, Connecticut Posts: 2030 Should be fixed in most recent patch. __________________ Clay Dreslough Sports Mogul Inc. Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged 04-16-2005 02:29 AM

...I'd think it would be a pretty big deal to historical players to know that a significant bug like that was fixed, wouldn't it? I'm glad he mentioned it in the thread, but why not put it in the fix list???

[MizzouRah]

Originally Posted by rjolley

Wait, they scheduled a soccer game for 9 year olds at 6:30am? That's crazy...

Yeah, fun.... she's looking at me now, one eye open.


Todd

[Ben E Lou]

Originally Posted by MizzouRah

Yeah, fun.... she's looking at me now, one eye open.


Todd

[Buccaneer]

Are these two related?

Also improves simulation pre-WWII (please post your feedback on this issue).

It's just as bad or worse the further you go back in the game. You have *tons* of historical rookies, people who IRL saw Major League action being displaced far too early by 18 year old Major League stars. The player development curve is incredibly flawed, and the game is all over the place with player assignments within an organization.

---

I have spent a lot of time working on this issue recently.

Start a new game with 8.12 and let me know.

[Buccaneer]

...I'd think it would be a pretty big deal to historical players to know that a significant bug like that was fixed, wouldn't it?

I'm not sure. Only if it screws up the algorithm for the player development curve (i.e., everything shifts up 3 years) as well as arbitration and extensions negotiations (e.g., player thinks he's a 3-yr vet). ROY is trivial.

[Ben E Lou]

Originally Posted by Buccaneer

arbitration and extensions negotiations

Bingo. I would assume that it did. Both of those are based on years of service.

The two things you mentioned MIGHT be related, but I don't think that's what he meant in that specific post. There have been some sort of problems with stats in historical leagues, but I don't know details.

[Buccaneer]

Thanks.

[markprior22]

I'm not going to have time to try 8.12 until later. Any of you guys figured out what injury and salary demands settings are best to use with 8.12 (assuming a 2005 starting season)?

[jbmagic]

For 8.12 has this been fix

http://dynamic2.gamespy.com/%7Efof/f...&postcount=908

this is a big bug. Dont you guys think so?

[amdaily]

Originally Posted by markprior22

I'm not going to have time to try 8.12 until later. Any of you guys figured out what injury and salary demands settings are best to use with 8.12 (assuming a 2005 starting season)?

I've been playing with injuries and salaries at -10% and league revenue at +10%. Only got in 4 seasons last night, but will quick sim bucnh this afternoon to see how it pans out.

[Ben E Lou]

Those of you who want lefty/righty lineups in the next version need to make your voices known. There are currently more than a dozen other features ahead of left/right splits.

[Buccaneer]

Editable League Structure, Interleague Play, and Playoffs		11	3.55%
Manager Signings/Firings		8	2.58%
Platoon splits (lefty/righty stats and lefty/righty lineups)		8	2.58%
Editable Number of Pitchers Per Team and Roster Sizes		9	2.90%
Enhanced Play-By-Play: Triple Plays, Double Switches, Taking a Base on Defensive Indifference, Ejections, etc.		6	1.94%
Salary Caps and Revenue Sharing		12	3.87%
Enhanced Injury Engine (the ability to play hurt, e.g. "he's at 85%" etc.)		14	4.52%
Interactive Play-By-Play (e.g. choose when to pinch hit, sacrifice, steal, bring in relievers etc.)		10	3.23%
Stadium improvements (e.g. luxury suites, additional seats)		14	4.52%
Player Hot Streaks. More Morale Depth.		12	3.87%
Expanded revenue options (merchandise, concessions, media contracts etc.)		12	3.87%
Ability to Move Pitcher's Slot to any Position in the Batting Order		5	1.61%
Use a Pitcher as a Position Player or Vice Versa		9	2.90%
Computer-controlled commissioner (vetoes cash-only trades, disallows team movement, etc.)		5	1.61%
Other [non-lefty/right] split stats (home/away, day/night, runners-in-scoring-position, month-by-month)		6	1.94%
'Team Options' Slider for Percentage of Games to start Alternate Starters		11	3.55%
Computer-controlled owner (that sets your budget and/or fires you for poor performance)		8	2.58%
Three-way trades		12	3.87%
Pitch-by-pitch interaction (e.g. choose which pitch to throw to what location in what count; as batter, guess pitches)		4	1.29%
Minor-league TOTALS in Scouting Report		9	2.90%
Schedule Editor		7	2.26%
Playoff TOTALS in Scouting Report		8	2.58%
New Screen and Dialog background artwork		3	0.97%
Rule 5 Draft		8	2.58%
Improved Sim Engine for Deadball Era (pre-1920)		8	2.58%
Incentive Clauses		11	3.55%
Auto-Sort Button for Strategies		7	2.26%
Backloaded Contracts (e.g. $3M in 2005, $4M in 2006, etc.)		11	3.55%
Player-of-the-month (week, game) awards		10	3.23%
More severe personality effects (e.g. "clubhouse poison")		10	3.23%
Improved HTML output for running leagues		3	0.97%
Team Stats Output - the ability to display, sort and print a range of team stats (not just in Standings)		2	0.65%
"Almanac" (automated yearly HTML output of all of stats, standings and leaders)		5	1.61%
Bidding for free agents against the AI (no immediate signings)		16	5.16%
Separate majors/minors Auto-Sort buttons		12	3.87%
Other (please describe below)		4	1.29%

I voted for about 6-7 items but does this list strike any of you as being...surprising (as in none of these are in BM6)?

[21C]

Originally Posted by Buccaneer

I voted for about 6-7 items but does this list strike any of you as being...surprising (as in none of these are in BM6)?

No surprise at all. Mogul uses something called 'feature crawl'. They will drag out the introduction of new features so there will be a selling point for the new version. Why introduce new features all at once when you can keep things for future versions? It's like asking for ideas for the next version while the current version is still warm.

I will say that this latest version seems to have had the greatest upgrade over previous versions.

[Bee]

You could make a similar list for FOF.

I'm not sure why there's so much hatred for this series, but it's really fascinating. While this game isn't in the same category as FM/CM or even FOF, I find it as entertaining as OOTP or Puresim baseball. There are issues and improvements that could and should be made, but that's the case with every game out there. I don't know, it just seems amusing to me to see people who want to continue to pile on to this game. It's almost like it's a Derek Smart game...LOL

[bryce]

Originally Posted by Bee

You could make a similar list for FOF.

I'm not sure why there's so much hatred for this series, but it's really fascinating. While this game isn't in the same category as FM/CM or even FOF, I find it as entertaining as OOTP or Puresim baseball. There are issues and improvements that could and should be made, but that's the case with every game out there. I don't know, it just seems amusing to me to see people who want to continue to pile on to this game. It's almost like it's a Derek Smart game...LOL

I think a lot of people have sworn off this game because of Mogul's complete lack of support the past 3 years or so and its complete disregard for the consumer, and it will take a minor miracle to win them back over. I am included in this group...

[mgadfly]

I played the original mogul, and loved it. Got bored after awhile and never went back to it because I liked OOTP better. This is the first version I've purchased since the original, and I have to admit that it really hasn't changed that much (how long has it been? six or seven years?).

That said, I like this game a lot. It is simple and sims fast. With the adjustable injuries slider working and the FAs being signed, I'm starting to have a lot of fun. The area that I'd like to see fixed is when someone tries to switch teams in the middle of a career. For example, I was Seattle and my franchise was worth something like $300 M. I thought it'd be fun to sell the Mariners and buy Tampa Bay (which was worth somewhere around $125M). With the extra cash I was going to try to rebuild the team, get a new ballpark/relocate, and see if I could become competitive.

Unfortunately, even with the editors, the game won't let you do this. I used the league editor to switch human control from the Mariners to the Rays. I edited the available cash for the Rays to the appropriate amount. I then turned off commish mode and tried to play. Every time I signed a free agent it put that player on Seattle's roster (even though it brought up the appropriate team name when I was actually negotiating the deal).

I then tried to move the Rays to Portland Oregon and put them in the AL west. That didn't work. I set it up through the league editor, but the schedule was messed up (Portland never played a game).

I can live without it, but it would be nice if it worked.

[MizzouRah]

It's been much more fun since 8.12. At least I'm enjoying myself so far playing with the Cardinals - testing the game and getting used to what's where.


Todd

[Galaril]

With 8.12 is it still necessary to adjust injuries - something% , lower the salry demands to 20% and increase league revenues 10%?

[Galaril]

The Unofficial Patch: v8.130 has been released it fixes two Huge issues for many.
1. Fixes issues with ratings for Historical Players and Historical Rookies

2. Fixed bug where injured players could get injured again (in minors or Spring Training)

Clay


I believe that Clay mentioned the historical tweaks here were related to post WW2 to 1995 since preWW2 and after 1995 were all set more or less.

Thanks Clay!

[MizzouRah]

Originally Posted by Galaril

The Unofficial Patch: v8.130 has been released it fixes two Huge issues for many.
1. Fixes issues with ratings for Historical Players and Historical Rookies

2. Fixed bug where injured players could get injured again (in minors or Spring Training)

Clay


I beleive that Clay mentioned the historical tweaks here were related to post WW2 to 1995 since preWW2 and after 1995 were all set more or less.

Thanks Clay!

Brilliant!


Todd

[Buccaneer]

Thanks, that's about close enough to try. One last thing, trade AI still ok (in finding and making deals with the AI)? Oh, one corollary. Do you see the AI making stupid trades among themselves and releasing/signing in-season FA stupidly?

[Ben E Lou]

Originally Posted by Buccaneer

Thanks, that's about close enough to try. One last thing, trade AI still ok (in finding and making deals with the AI)?

It was in 8.12. Haven't tried it out in 8.13. I actually got an AI-offered deal in 8.12 that wasn't a complete fleece job.

Do you see the AI making stupid trades among themselves and releasing/signing in-season FA stupidly?

Not terribly stupid. Better than OOTP, I think, but not outstanding, either. What I haven't seen (that I saw in OOTP far too often) was the sign-him-then-release-him-two-weeks-later stuff.

[MizzouRah]

Originally Posted by Buccaneer

Thanks, that's about close enough to try. One last thing, trade AI still ok (in finding and making deals with the AI)? Oh, one corollary. Do you see the AI making stupid trades among themselves and releasing/signing in-season FA stupidly?

I'm about to turn off trades offered to me by the CPU, if I can. They are some of the most lopsided trades in MLB history. Jason Kenall for Rolen, Edmonds, and Marquis? Ok... Also when you put someone on the trade block, you can click many times in a row and get offered different players.. weird.

Todd

[Ben E Lou]

Originally Posted by MizzouRah

I'm about to turn off trades offered to me by the CPU, if I can.

Note that my answer above was based on AI-offered trades being turned off. I've never bothered with it, nor have I ever found a need for it.

[MizzouRah]

Originally Posted by SkyDog

Note that my answer above was based on AI-offered trades being turned off. I've never bothered with it, nor have I ever found a need for it.

It would be nice if it worked.. oh well. It doesn't even seem a little messed up, it's friggin wayyyyyy out of whack.


Todd

[jbmagic]

Originally Posted by SkyDog

It was in 8.12. Haven't tried it out in 8.13. I actually got an AI-offered deal in 8.12 that wasn't a complete fleece job. Not terribly stupid. Better than OOTP, I think, but not outstanding, either. What I haven't seen (that I saw in OOTP far too often) was the sign-him-then-release-him-two-weeks-later stuff.

ootp is worse for sign and release by cpu because of the waivers and player option. OOtp can't handle it well.

IF Baseball Mogul ever adds waiver and player options, lets hope it dont have the same problem with signing players and then releasing them.

[Buccaneer]

Originally Posted by SkyDog

It was in 8.12. Haven't tried it out in 8.13. I actually got an AI-offered deal in 8.12 that wasn't a complete fleece job. Not terribly stupid. Better than OOTP, I think, but not outstanding, either. What I haven't seen (that I saw in OOTP far too often) was the sign-him-then-release-him-two-weeks-later stuff.

That's exactly what I was referring to. I'm glad to see it better in BM. As far as trades, I don't think I had ever seen an AI-offered trade (in OOTP) so that's irrelevant. But it does sound like human-instigated trades are cool.

[Ben E Lou]

Twenty-one potential features running ahead of lefty/righty lineups in the voting thus far. Fascinating.

[st.cronin]

Originally Posted by SkyDog

Twenty-one potential features running ahead of lefty/righty lineups in the voting thus far. Fascinating.

And if Clay listens to those folks he'll never expand his audience.

[Galaril]

Originally Posted by st.cronin

And if Clay listens to those folks he'll never expand his audience.

After playing with 8.13 I am more concerned with version 2006. I don't care what anyone says injuries are not realistic to many long injuries regardless of the injury slider. They almost seem to be coded in a way that is not random or based on players proneness to injury. I can't prove this just the way it plays at leats for me after 7 seperate seasons.

[Ben E Lou]

Originally Posted by st.cronin

And if Clay listens to those folks he'll never expand his audience.

Well, I think you're dealing with a self-selecting audience, at least up until this version, and maybe this one, too. Who would have stuck with Mogul over this many years as it didn't get better, and OOTP and PureSim did? Answer: people who preferred a much "lighter" game without setting multiple lineups. As I've said, I'm hoping to encourage FOFCers--who tend to prefer a deeper game than Mogul has been--to sign up over there and make their voices known. Clay has proven over and over again that he's going to listen to the voices of those who speak up--even above his own baseball knowledge.

[MizzouRah]

Personally, I don't want a deeper game from BBMogul. If I want an OOTP type game, I'll continue to purchase OOTP. I just hope Clay tightens the current version up for the time being. The sim speed will only get slower once you start getting into OOTP/Puresim type depth and I think you'll being getting away from Mogul's appeal.

Although I could be totally wrong about the targeted audience.


Todd

[st.cronin]

I just want a good baseball game. The only one I enjoy is DMB, and that has no career play. I'm looking forward to SIs entry in the field.

[Ben E Lou]

Injuries, schminjuries.

Originally Posted by SkyDog

I just started a test season, 8.13. I set my medical spending to highest, with injuries at zero. Injury contingency: 1 day.

Here's a log of injuries:

April 17th--Alt starter--1 day
April 18th--AAA pitcher--6 days
April 24th--starting catcher--3 days
April 26th--rookie league catcher--16 days
May 1st--single-A 2B--3 days
May 6th--starting 2B--2 days
May 13th--AAA pitcher--17 days
May 13th--AAA pitcher-4 days
May 25th--SP2--3 days
May 31st--starting 3B--6 days
June 1st--AAA picther--6 days
June 2nd--single A pitcher--3 days
June 10th--single A 2B--9 days
June 12th--SP5--4 days
June 14th--starting SS--2 days
June 20th--SP3--4 days
June 22nd--AAA pitcher--4 days
June 25th--AAA CF--3 days
June 27th--single A pitcher--4 days
July 2nd--starting catcher--22 days
July 6th--SP2--11 days
July 7th--SP1--51 days
July 12th--rookie league pitcher--2 days
July 17th--MLB MR--1 day
July 22nd--single-A pitcher--3 days
July 23rd--starting 1B--9 days
July 24th--starting CF--149 days
July 29th--SP5--3 days
August 1st--AA pitcher--7 days
August 8th--starting LF--1 day
August 19th--AA first baseman--4 days
August 21st--AA pitcher--3 days
August 31st--single A pitcher--7 days
September 8th--SP4--8 days
September 21st--starting RF--1 day
September 25th--SP4--193 days
September 29th--starting SS--4 days


That's it. 73 players. Only 37 injuries all year. Yes, at default injury setting, over half of the players in my organization just went through an entire season with NO injuries. Zip. None. Furthermore, only three injuries at MLB level that lasted 10 days or more. You people need to stop whining about injuries.

[jbmagic]

Skydog

I would love to see a comparison when injuries is to the lowest and highest setting too.

and is injuries based on your players that is prone mainly. so some teams will have more injuries then others?


a true test will be total amount of injuries for the whole league in a season

[mgadfly]

Originally Posted by SkyDog

Injuries, schminjuries.
That's it. 73 players. Only 37 injuries all year. Yes, at default injury setting, over half of the players in my organization just went through an entire season with NO injuries. Zip. None. Furthermore, only three injuries at MLB level that lasted 10 days or more. You people need to stop whining about injuries.
[/size][/font]

Yeah but you were saying that even prior to the patch that fixed the injury problem.

I'm fine with how injuries are NOW, but I still think you were wrong earlier in this discussion.

[Ben E Lou]

Originally Posted by mgadfly

Yeah but you were saying that even prior to the patch that fixed the injury problem.

I'm fine with how injuries are NOW, but I still think you were wrong earlier in this discussion.

8.12 and 8.13 didn't do anything to change in-season injuries, now did they? If they have, then that would explain why they are now too low.

[jbmagic]

skydog test doesnt show nothing to me.

he only showing us one team injuries. every team has different ratings for player injury ratings. some teams has more players that are prone to injury, etc. so some teams will have more injuries than others.

for a true test,
he needs to do a test for the whole league to see how many injuries there is and compare it when you set the injury slider to low, default and high and compare it to the real MLB for that year.

[MizzouRah]

Originally Posted by jbmagic

skydog test doesnt show nothing to me.

he only showing us one team injuries. every team has different ratings for player injury ratings. some teams has more players that are prone to injury, etc. so some teams will have more injuries than others.

for a true test,
he needs to do a test for the whole league to see how many injuries there is and compare it when you set the injury slider to low, default and high and compare it to the real MLB for that year.

These are games, does EVERYTHING have to be +/- 0.005 of today's game? I'm happy with the results so far.

Todd