Another attack - This time in Brussels

[RainMaker]

Also in regards to Malala. She can't live in her native country because she would be killed. Despite from what I'm told that it's just an incredibly small number of extremists. Heck, she has to have armed guards 24/7 with her in Britain.

Doesn't it seem odd that there is such a huge correlation between a religion and that kind of violence? Maybe it's all a giant coincidence that has played out over a long time. Or maybe there is something really fucked up about that culture that we should be talking about.

[Groundhog]

Originally Posted by RainMaker

A group of backwards ass losers living in the stone age butcher a group of innocent people and the overwhelming response is to rush out to whiteknight that backwards ass culture.

Stop patting that culture on their head like a dog who wet the floor and start treating them like actual adults.

^ good example of what I'm talking about.

[larrymcg421]

Originally Posted by RainMaker

People on the left care more about a bakery refusing to bake a cake for a gay couple than they do an entire region of the world treating homosexuals as dogs. Treating women as property. Butchering innocent lives in the name of a God.

Nope.

A group of backwards ass losers living in the stone age butcher a group of innocent people and the overwhelming response is to rush out to whiteknight that backwards ass culture.

Nope.

Stop patting that culture on their head like a dog who wet the floor and start treating them like actual adults.

Nope.

Let me know when you want to actually discuss the issue instead of resorting to stupid strawman arguments.

[AENeuman]

Originally Posted by RainMaker

People on the left care more about a bakery refusing to bake a cake for a gay couple than they do an entire region of the world treating homosexuals as dogs. Treating women as property. Butchering innocent lives in the name of a God.

So yeah, sorry about the bakery thing. If I had known I could have saved lives instead....

[RainMaker]

Originally Posted by larrymcg421

Let me know when you want to actually discuss the issue instead of resorting to stupid strawman arguments.

The first thing you did was pop-in with an excuse for their culture.

[ISiddiqui]

I find it interesting that people think Arabic culture and South Asian culture are the same thing. I mean do these folks have any clue what they are talking about? Or know anyone from either of these two very disparate cultures?

Makes as much sense as equating the culture of the Lord's Resistance Army in Uganda with Southern Baptists in the US and claiming its the same culture.

[Groundhog]

Originally Posted by ISiddiqui

I find it interesting that people think Arabic culture and South Asian culture are the same thing. I mean do these folks have any clue what they are talking about? Or know anyone from either of these two very disparate cultures?

Well in short, no & no. A little surprising maybe, but then, people are close-minded, xenophobic, and quite often stupid, too.

[RainMaker]

Originally Posted by ISiddiqui

I find it interesting that people think Arabic culture and South Asian culture are the same thing. I mean do these folks have any clue what they are talking about? Or know anyone from either of these two very disparate cultures?

Makes as much sense as equating the culture of the Lord's Resistance Army in Uganda with Southern Baptists in the US and claiming its the same culture.

There is one constant in those cultures. And that constant has a strong correlation to terrorism.

Unless you just think that's a giant coincidence?

[ISiddiqui]

It is amazing what an arrogant asshole you are. Especially when you wish to presume to tell me what my culture actually is or is not.

Do I presume to link the KKK and the Lord's Resistance Army and claim they are from the same culture?

[wustin]

If one mass murder can't be used to vilify an entire group. Can I use the same argument for mass shooting

[ISiddiqui]

I mean for fuck's sake, South Asia has the Tamil Tigers, a Hindu terrorist group which btw invented suicide bombing, the National Liberation Front of Tripura and the Nationalist Socialist Council of Nagaland, which are both Christian terrorist groups, as well as the ISI and Al-Queda Muslim terrorist groups.

But obviously, this violence is merely because of the same exact culture as the Middle East. Get a clue.

[RainMaker]

Not sure that's the best comparison. Probably would compare LRA more to the Branch Davidians. Either way, those groups are dealt with in most of the Western world. And even in the LRA's case, the US provided support that has essentially destroyed that group.

[Groundhog]

Originally Posted by RainMaker

There is one constant in those cultures. And that constant has a strong correlation to terrorism.

Congratulations on your 5-star post. You managed to both have the message buzz right over your head while still sounding like an uneducated, xenophobic stereotype.

[ISiddiqui]

Originally Posted by RainMaker

Probably would compare LRA more to the Branch Davidians.

Because you are a fucking bigot. The LRA in Christmas of 2008 massacred over 400 people in 5 coordinated attacks - 2008 Christmas massacres - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia. That's not the Branch Davidians.

Either way, those groups are dealt with in most of the Western world. And even in the LRA's case, the US provided support that has essentially destroyed that group.

As stated upthread, who do you think is dealing with ISIS right now?

[RainMaker]

Originally Posted by ISiddiqui

Because you are a fucking bigot. The LRA in Christmas of 2008 massacred over 400 people in 5 coordinated attacks - 2008 Christmas massacres - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia. That's not the Branch Davidians.

No shit. We don't let our nutjobs get that powerful. Koresh would have massacred more if he was able to obtain more power.

Kony was actually called "Africa's Koresh".

[AENeuman]

Originally Posted by RainMaker

Not sure that's the best comparison. Probably would compare LRA more to the Branch Davidians. Either way, those groups are dealt with in most of the Western world. And even in the LRA's case, the US provided support that has essentially destroyed that group.

I think it is more in line with the Lost Cause of the Confederacy.

I guess Sherman should have delt with the radical, deeply religious, clannish, traditionalist more harshly. If so, we would be one big happy America today.

[RainMaker]

Originally Posted by Groundhog

Congratulations on your 5-star post. You managed to both have the message buzz right over your head while still sounding like an uneducated, xenophobic stereotype.

Nothing I said is untrue. The overwhelming majority of terrorist attacks today are done in the name of Islam. Now if you can find some other constants among these groups that separates them from the rest of the world, I'm more than happy to hear it. But the numbers are in the link below.

https://www.start.umd.edu/pubs/START...14_Aug2015.pdf

Shall we talk women's rights next? Women are often treated as property. Need to be escorted in public. Must wear veils or at the least dress modestly. And these are from some of the more moderate regimes. I'm sure you can find more about what life is like within the more fundamentalist societies.

Homosexuality is forbidden in many of these countries. Punishment ranges from jail to death. Child marriage is more prevalent. And education is limited if you happen to be a female.

Don't take my word for it though, plenty of data available.

| Freedom House

Only one predominately Muslim country is above 53% on the International Human Rights Rank Indicator. Most fall near the bottom.

Now I'm someone who is socially progressive. So seeing this stuff angers me. I don't want gay people to be stoned to death. I don't want women paraded around in veils by men like pets. I feel that people who do that kind of stuff are living in the stone age. And I'd say similar to people in this country who push for sodomy laws or the right to physically abuse women.

Now xenophobia is the dislike of people from other countries. I don't have that. I dislike people who trample on people's human rights whether they live in this country or another. That used to be a progressive ideal but these days some folks get a pass.

[Groundhog]

Thanks for your paragraphs of text, but again what ISiddiqui has completely flown over your head still. I don't need to google or follow links, I know what life is like in the Middle East right now. It has nothing to do with the point either myself or ISiddiqui were trying to make.

As for your last statement, you are xenophobic because your statement that you 'dislike people who trample on people's rights' only applies to people you deem worthy of having those rights, which excludes the Islamic people as a whole, based on what you've said in this thread as well as other threads every time something about race or religion comes up.

[RainMaker]

No, I'm for everyone having those rights which is why I don't rush to make excuses for those who wish to deny them.

[Edward64]

its radical Islam vs the West(+Russia).

There are many inputs that caused where we are. Sure the West have done bad things, supported the wrong people; the nations that these terrorists come from have also failed to prevent the radicalism etc. etc. There's plenty of blame and I don't think there is one root cause.

Regardless of who is right or wrong, the problem is real and we have to deal with it.

In the short run, its beyond talking, its ultimately finding the will and the ways to squash them.

However, because once we ultimately degrade ISIL (like we did AQ), another hydra head will popup somewhere. So the long-term solution is some sustained program to increase the positive view of the west. If this means supporting and compromising on some principles to put strongmen in place, I'm all for it. Western democracy will not work everywhere.

[rowech]

Originally Posted by RainMaker

No shit. We don't let our nutjobs get that powerful. Koresh would have massacred more if he was able to obtain more power.

Kony was actually called "Africa's Koresh".

Instead we have a bunch of them that kill 5 people here, 7 people there, 10 over there, etc. That adds up.

[corbes]

Just for my own edification, how many people here don't recoil in horror at the suggestion that we should empower law enforcement to patrol and secure our Muslim neighborhoods before they become radicalized?

[Groundhog]

No better way to help prevent radicalization than to start treating innocent people as future radicals.

[Ben E Lou]

If "preventing radicalization" were the goal there, you might have a point, Groundhog. But the more we see these types of attacks, the less that's even on the radar.

[BillJasper]

Originally Posted by Edward64

However, because once we ultimately degrade ISIL (like we did AQ), another hydra head will popup somewhere. So the long-term solution is some sustained program to increase the positive view of the west. If this means supporting and compromising on some principles to put strongmen in place, I'm all for it. Western democracy will not work everywhere.

First step would probably be to quit kicking the shit out of the civilian populations over there. We play right into the hands of groups like ISIS when we do that.

Every time we kill a civilian, it is like putting up a recruitment poster.

[SirFozzie]

Name the politician:

“Hoarding tens of billions of records of ordinary citizens did not stop Fort Hood, it didn’t stop Boston, it didn’t stop Chattanooga, it didn’t stop Garland, and it failed to detect the San Bernardino plotters,”

"The First Amendment protects religious liberty. The federal government can go and apprehend us in the church and they can monitor us if we are carrying out criminal conduct,” And the way the Fourth Amendment works, the Bill of Rights work, is you have particularized evidence of criminal conduct and you target the terrorist and not the law-abiding citizens.”

Yup, Ted Cruz. So this is just him throwing red meat to the base in an attempt to pull folks from Trump. (in other news, other poltiicians Flip Flop, Bears shit in the woods, water still wet, and Pope still catholic)

[BillJasper]

Originally Posted by SirFozzie

Name the politician:

“Hoarding tens of billions of records of ordinary citizens did not stop Fort Hood, it didn’t stop Boston, it didn’t stop Chattanooga, it didn’t stop Garland, and it failed to detect the San Bernardino plotters,”

"The First Amendment protects religious liberty. The federal government can go and apprehend us in the church and they can monitor us if we are carrying out criminal conduct,” And the way the Fourth Amendment works, the Bill of Rights work, is you have particularized evidence of criminal conduct and you target the terrorist and not the law-abiding citizens.”

Yup, Ted Cruz. So this is just him throwing red meat to the base in an attempt to pull folks from Trump. (in other news, other poltiicians Flip Flop, Bears shit in the woods, water still wet, and Pope still catholic)

Cruz is a scary mother fucker. I'd rather have Trump if it came down to those two.

[ISiddiqui]

Originally Posted by Edward64

However, because once we ultimately degrade ISIL (like we did AQ), another hydra head will popup somewhere. So the long-term solution is some sustained program to increase the positive view of the west. If this means supporting and compromising on some principles to put strongmen in place, I'm all for it. Western democracy will not work everywhere.

In some respects this is true, but we have to be careful as to how much we put the strongmen in place. In some of these countries the strongmen aren't all that popular and when they finally get knocked off their perch, if our hands are all over propping up those strongmen we'll get in trouble.

[flere-imsaho]

Originally Posted by RainMaker

People on the left care more about a bakery refusing to bake a cake for a gay couple than they do an entire region of the world treating homosexuals as dogs. Treating women as property. Butchering innocent lives in the name of a God.

A group of backwards ass losers living in the stone age butcher a group of innocent people and the overwhelming response is to rush out to whiteknight that backwards ass culture.

Stop patting that culture on their head like a dog who wet the floor and start treating them like actual adults.

As someone who identifies as "on the left", this is pretty offensive.

[BYU 14]

Originally Posted by flere-imsaho

As someone who identifies as "on the left", this is pretty offensive.

No shit.

Rainmaker, it's really undermines any semblance of a point you may have when you make asinine statements like that. Good, decent people care about others in a wide variety of ways, including educational opportunities, racism, religious freedom, quality of life and most of all the freedom to live their lives without fear of getting killed by a bunch of extremist cowards in the name of religion.

You really think the majority place more value on where a gay couple can get a fucking cake over the murder of almost three dozen innocents? Go back to home depot and ask them for a smaller brush. So if your 'paintings' aren't pretty, they can at least be more realistic.

[Castlerock]

Originally Posted by RainMaker

People on the left care more about a bakery refusing to bake a cake for a gay couple than they do an entire region of the world treating homosexuals as dogs. Treating women as property. Butchering innocent lives in the name of a God.

A group of backwards ass losers living in the stone age butcher a group of innocent people and the overwhelming response is to rush out to whiteknight that backwards ass culture.

Stop patting that culture on their head like a dog who wet the floor and start treating them like actual adults.

Originally Posted by flere-imsaho

As someone who identifies as "on the left", this is pretty offensive.

Originally Posted by BYU 14

No shit.

Rainmaker, it's really undermines any semblance of a point you may have when you make asinine statements like that. Good, decent people care about others in a wide variety of ways, including educational opportunities, racism, religious freedom, quality of life and most of all the freedom to live their lives without fear of getting killed by a bunch of extremist cowards in the name of religion.

You really think the majority place more value on where a gay couple can get a fucking cake over the murder of almost three dozen innocents? Go back to home depot and ask them for a smaller brush. So if your 'paintings' aren't pretty, they can at least be more realistic.

RainMaker's post exemplifies political dialog today. This is true at the personal level (RainMaker's post) and at the national level (FoxNews, etc). I seriously doubt that RainMaker believes what he wrote but he wrote it anyway. The same thinking applies to partisan news broadcasts and it does not change anyone's opinion. It only serves to further divide. Those that find it offensive and false tend to disengage. Those that 'agree' (I am hesitant to use the word 'agree' because I don't even believe that RainMaker believes that) find their world-view reinforced. It drives people to the extremes and leaves no room for common ground. On anything.

[Solecismic]

Originally Posted by BillJasper

First step would probably be to quit kicking the shit out of the civilian populations over there. We play right into the hands of groups like ISIS when we do that.

Every time we kill a civilian, it is like putting up a recruitment poster.

I'm not in favor of killing civilians, but I disagree. They know we have overwhelming firepower. Their strategy is to hide among civilians where they can. Because they know it bothers us to kill them more than it bothers them - even though it's their people, so to speak.

Because this is a religious movement, they believe death is their path to a positive afterlife. Nothing that happens to anyone on this earth bothers them. They'll fight as long as they can, using their people as shields. They'll target our civilians intentionally.

We can't romanticize this. But, hopefully, we can do everything possible to limit civilian deaths on all sides.

The Israelis have been dealing with this for decades. Unfortunately, it doesn't stop when they ignore it. They just get better and better at developing strategies and weapons that limit civilian deaths.

[TroyF]

Castlerock,

Political dialog? It doesn't exist anymore. Not from either side. I don't care what the debate is. When I stick my head into political threads, i don't insult anyone. I try to give a reasoned opinion (and I understand fully there will be people that will disagree with me) and i get called out for being a right wing lunatic or a bleeding heart liberal.

You cannot have an opinion that goes against the party you are speaking with and have any form of communication at this point. I wouldn't vote for Trump if you held a gun to my head. I despise Hillary on just about every level. Try to bring up WHY I don't like each candidate to the right or left and I'm a bad person.

Sorry for the rant, but these things are really starting to get to me. The one part that RainMaker gets right is the overwhelmingly horrible record of women/homosexuals in Islamic countries. It's horrible on just about every level. That doesn't mean there aren't other countries that have their issues. (Russia is also a horrific place to be if you are gay for example)

But the polls that show peoples beliefs in honor killings, death if you change your religion, women's rights, gay rights, female education, female mutilation, child marriage, etc. . . Holy hell it is bad there and I wish people would stop making excuses for the culture. This counts our "allies" and our "enemies" (which in most cases is the same thing)

There are no easy solutions to changing a culture, but I don't think ignoring it and allowing our allies to have horrific human rights records against women and homosexuals is the way to go either.

[bob]

My thoughts, which are worth about as much as you've paid for them...

It may be interesting to discuss how we as a world have gotten here, assign percentage of blame to the western world vs. the extremists, and talk about what we could have done differently from a historical perspective, but none of that really matters to where we are today. You have to live in the world that is, not the world as you want it to be.

There are basically three ways to win a war:

1. Destroy their will to continue. Outside of completely giving into their demands and allowing a global caliphate, nothing can be done here to appease all extremists. Pull out of the middle east completely, immediately stop all support of Israel, go isolationist, and while that might placate some people, it will be seen as a sign of weakness by others that continue to push. Remember, they want a war.

2. Destroy their capacity to continue. Seems like more could be done here to prevent black market oils sales from funding Isis itself, but that won't stop homegrown extremists or some other group from popping up elsewhere.

3. Destroy them all. I can't remember who said it, and this isn't the exact quote, but when told that the US army was not equipped to fight against guerrilla warfare in Vietnam, he said "The US army is actually extremely well equipped to fight against guerrilla warfare provided you have the political will to kill every man, woman, and child."

I'm not advocating #3, but don't see how #1 or 2 can occur. Maybe someone smarter than me can toss out suggestions.

[RainMaker]

What is false about the statements? Take Saudi Arabia, an ally of ours, a country we consider rather moderate in the Middle East, a country I spent 3 months in.

Women can't drive in that country. They need to be escorted in public by a male. They don't have a say in who they marry (nor is there a law in how young they can be). Only a couple years ago did a law get put in place saying you couldn't beat the shit out of your wife. You can't leave the house without covering yourself properly and if you are unfortunately raped, you're punished for that!

This is actually better than being gay which is outlawed. Not only can you be imprisoned for it, you also can be lashed or put to death. And the religious police don't fuck around with the locals.

There are scores of human rights violations taking place in the country. There are countless polls done that show just what the people in these countries think about topics such as women's rights, homosexuality, and so on.

Again, this isn't ISIS or Al-Qaeda. These are the good guys in the Middle East. Feel free to pull up photos of President Obama laughing it up with King Abdullah a couple years ago or George Bush holding hands with him.

I find all that stuff fucked up and I think it's fucked up that there are so many people here that rush to make excuses for that behavior.

[Solecismic]

Originally Posted by TroyF

Castlerock,

Political dialog? It doesn't exist anymore. Not from either side. I don't care what the debate is. When I stick my head into political threads, i don't insult anyone. I try to give a reasoned opinion (and I understand fully there will be people that will disagree with me) and i get called out for being a right wing lunatic or a bleeding heart liberal.

You cannot have an opinion that goes against the party you are speaking with and have any form of communication at this point. I wouldn't vote for Trump if you held a gun to my head. I despise Hillary on just about every level. Try to bring up WHY I don't like each candidate to the right or left and I'm a bad person.

Sorry for the rant, but these things are really starting to get to me. The one part that RainMaker gets right is the overwhelmingly horrible record of women/homosexuals in Islamic countries. It's horrible on just about every level. That doesn't mean there aren't other countries that have their issues. (Russia is also a horrific place to be if you are gay for example)

But the polls that show peoples beliefs in honor killings, death if you change your religion, women's rights, gay rights, female education, female mutilation, child marriage, etc. . . Holy hell it is bad there and I wish people would stop making excuses for the culture. This counts our "allies" and our "enemies" (which in most cases is the same thing)

There are no easy solutions to changing a culture, but I don't think ignoring it and allowing our allies to have horrific human rights records against women and homosexuals is the way to go either.

Thankfully, it's still a minority of forum members who do this. I think FOFC is remarkable in that we can have fairly good discussions. I decided to put a handful of people on ignore - the ones who persistently start the personal nastiness when they disagree with you - and it has worked wonders. Really, just a handful. The people I've actually met from FOFC are some of the most intelligent and interesting people I know.

I think one point those who are inclined to defend the culture often miss is that one of our core values is supposedly that we respect differences. That the overriding defiance of our Founding Fathers was to install the right to have religious and political differences. That simply doesn't exist in many countries and cultures. To even have this discussion in Saudi Arabia, for example, would be to risk severe punishment.

[nol]

Originally Posted by RainMaker

What is false about the statements? Take Saudi Arabia, an ally of ours, a country we consider rather moderate in the Middle East, a country I spent 3 months in.

Women can't drive in that country. They need to be escorted in public by a male. They don't have a say in who they marry (nor is there a law in how young they can be). Only a couple years ago did a law get put in place saying you couldn't beat the shit out of your wife. You can't leave the house without covering yourself properly and if you are unfortunately raped, you're punished for that!

This is actually better than being gay which is outlawed. Not only can you be imprisoned for it, you also can be lashed or put to death. And the religious police don't fuck around with the locals.

There are scores of human rights violations taking place in the country. There are countless polls done that show just what the people in these countries think about topics such as women's rights, homosexuality, and so on.

Again, this isn't ISIS or Al-Qaeda. These are the good guys in the Middle East. Feel free to pull up photos of President Obama laughing it up with King Abdullah a couple years ago or George Bush holding hands with him.

I find all that stuff fucked up and I think it's fucked up that there are so many people here that rush to make excuses for that behavior.

Are you being ironic or just choosing to ignore the fact that America is maybe 2-3 generations removed from most of this 'stone age' behavior you described?

[RainMaker]

Originally Posted by nol

Are you being ironic or just choosing to ignore the fact that America is maybe 2-3 generations removed from most of this 'stone age' behavior you described?

So if America did something generations ago I can't criticize people for doing it now? I mean I think slavery is abhorrent even though America allowed it for many years.

Again, I don't understand why you want to keep making excuses for that behavior.

[nol]

Originally Posted by RainMaker

So if America did something generations ago I can't criticize people for doing it now? I mean I think slavery is abhorrent even though America allowed it for many years.

Again, I don't understand why you want to keep making excuses for that behavior.

Nobody is making excuses. They are asking what you actually want to do about it outside of repeating Bill Maher's schtick (so edgy!) because many of the solutions proposed would also constitute a gross violation of human rights.

[AlexB]

Originally Posted by bob

My thoughts, which are worth about as much as you've paid for them...

Due to an old English idiom, your thoughts are unfortunately only worth half of everyone elses. Sorry

[ISiddiqui]

Originally Posted by TroyF

There are no easy solutions to changing a culture, but I don't think ignoring it and allowing our allies to have horrific human rights records against women and homosexuals is the way to go either.

Well, we do tend to ignore it quite a bit in other contexts. I mean Central America in the 1980s was a human rights horror fest (some countries aren't much better), but most people couldn't be bothered to care. Sub-Saharan Africa has countries which are as backwards on human rights as you could imagine. East Asian countries (like China) tend to be horrible on a whole bevy of human rights concerns. So when one seems to only cry wolf on the Middle East (and then try to lump in South Asia into it), it doesn't particularly land all that hard.

There are plenty of organizations who work on world wide human rights issues that do call out the vast issues that exist in the Middle East, but they also do so in all parts of the world. Those are groups I care to listen to.

In addition, I just don't see it ignored all that much by the left - look at the anger at what is going on in Qatar for the World Cup 2022, and the left was on the front lines of being against human rights abuses in China when they had the Olympics. What left leaning groups are asking for is to not tar the entire 1 billion+ religion with these human rights abusers. I mean even when we do care about Chinese human rights abuses, we don't go after Chinese descendants in the US about it.

[RainMaker]

Originally Posted by nol

Nobody is making excuses. They are asking what you actually want to do about it outside of repeating Bill Maher's schtick (so edgy!) because many of the solutions proposed would also constitute a gross violation of human rights.

Yes you are. Your reaction to their human rights abuse isn't condemnation, it's "well America did it to back in the day!". It's justifying their actions.

Solutions are complex. Perhaps it involves sanctions, perhaps public condemnations from our top officials, perhaps withholding aid. We don't have to change their culture by brute force. But we don't have to hold hands and laugh it up in the Rose Garden either while a woman is beheaded in Chop Chop Square for being raped.

[ISiddiqui]

Originally Posted by RainMaker

Solutions are complex. Perhaps it involves sanctions, perhaps public condemnations from our top officials, perhaps withholding aid. We don't have to change their culture by brute force. But we don't have to hold hands and laugh it up in the Rose Garden either while a woman is beheaded in Chop Chop Square for being raped.

You realize that your entire idea for international diplomacy means we should not meet with like half of the world's countries?

[Neuqua]

Originally Posted by RainMaker

But we don't have to hold hands and laugh it up in the Rose Garden either while a woman is beheaded in Chop Chop Square for being raped.

Stop doing that.

[RainMaker]

Originally Posted by ISiddiqui

You realize that your entire idea for international diplomacy means we should not meet with like half of the world's countries?

No problem with meeting leaders. When King Abdullah died Obama called him a friend. Clinton praised his humanitarian efforts. Kerry called it "a sad day". Even McCain praised him. The UK flew flags at half mast.

Seems like a lot of whitewashing of such an oppressive regime.

[RainMaker]

Originally Posted by Neuqua

Stop doing that.

It actually happened.

[ISiddiqui]

Originally Posted by RainMaker

No problem with meeting leaders. When King Abdullah died Obama called him a friend. Clinton praised his humanitarian efforts. Kerry called it "a sad day". Even McCain praised him. The UK flew flags at half mast.

Seems like a lot of whitewashing of such an oppressive regime.

Yeah, welcome to international diplomacy.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by bob

3. Destroy them all. I can't remember who said it, and this isn't the exact quote, but when told that the US army was not equipped to fight against guerrilla warfare in Vietnam, he said "The US army is actually extremely well equipped to fight against guerrilla warfare provided you have the political will to kill every man, woman, and child."

I'm not advocating #3, but don't see how #1 or 2 can occur. Maybe someone smarter than me can toss out suggestions.

The absence of realism for 1 and/or 2 is why I've advocated #3.

Problem is, as it was in Vietnam, is that pesky political will you mentioned.
A combination of cowardice & foolishness cost us that war but we seem downright gleeful in ignoring that reality in order to repeat the same mistake again.

[AENeuman]

Originally Posted by RainMaker

So if America did something generations ago I can't criticize people for doing it now? I mean I think slavery is abhorrent even though America allowed it for many years.

Again, I don't understand why you want to keep making excuses for that behavior.

You sound like the worst dinner guest ever: "These peas are delicious, but the suffering in Yemen is preventing me from enjoying them."

[JonInMiddleGA]

I'll ask here, since someone referenced it here earlier IIRC:

Did we order the flag to half staff for the attacks in Ankarra back on 3/13?