07-14-2005, 01:30 PM | #51 | |||
College Benchwarmer
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Springfield, USA
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For instance, where is the crowd shouting that Freddy Adu should be playing high-school ball? Isn't that where he belongs? |
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07-14-2005, 01:56 PM | #52 | |
Roster Filler
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Cicero
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As I said, calling her a choker for her performances at the US Open and the John Deere ignores the fact that she's 15 and solely looks at the golf results. From that perspective, its fair - and accurate. She also cannot have it both ways. If she wants to play against the top women and men because it is the best competition, she cannot then hide behind being so young as an excuse when she does not play well. You want to play at the top level, you should be willing to be judged on that level too. If she had performed that way at a junior event, I'd agree with everything you are saying - its ridiculous to call those performances chokes. Since they were at the top levels of golf, they were chokes.
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07-14-2005, 02:05 PM | #53 | |
Quarterback
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: London, England
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Ray Romano would never ever get a sponsors exemption to a PGA tournament. He has played in Pro Am tourneys on the tour, but those are completely different. In those cases, the pro am runs alongside the pro tournament. |
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07-14-2005, 02:37 PM | #54 |
Pro Rookie
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Raleigh, NC
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Wie's doing well again. Last report from USGA website has her 2-up through 8.
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07-14-2005, 02:39 PM | #55 | |
College Starter
Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: A negative place
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Quote:
If my math is right, that would get her into the final 8 right? |
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07-14-2005, 02:44 PM | #56 | |
High School Varsity
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: Cincinnati, OH
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Quote:
If she wins.... still 10 more holes... -Chas
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07-14-2005, 02:46 PM | #57 | |
College Starter
Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: A negative place
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Quote:
True. She'll probably choke. |
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07-14-2005, 03:01 PM | #58 |
College Starter
Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: A negative place
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Dola - uh-oh, she just gave one back on 12. 1 up with 6 to go.
BTW - that Anthony Kim guy is just destroying people. My money's on him to win. |
07-14-2005, 03:17 PM | #59 |
Pro Starter
Join Date: Apr 2003
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2 up with 4 to play, lookin good for her to get to quarter finals
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07-14-2005, 03:29 PM | #60 |
Head Coach
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: Green Bay, WI
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Isn't this the event that grants a Master's exemption to the champion?
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07-14-2005, 03:31 PM | #61 | |
College Starter
Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: A negative place
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Quote:
Both the Amateur public links (this one) and the US Amateur (August) grant a Master's exemption I believe. |
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07-14-2005, 03:37 PM | #62 |
Pro Starter
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2 up with 2 to play, with just a tie on either of the last 2 holes she advances
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07-14-2005, 03:49 PM | #63 |
Pro Starter
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Location: Las Vegas
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3 and 1 victory..
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07-14-2005, 03:50 PM | #64 |
College Starter
Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: A negative place
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Wie wins and advances (rats beat again).
BTW - when she went from 3 up to 1 up on the back in just 4 holes, it would have been a good time to choke ... but she didn't. Likewise in the opening round when she was in 84th place (and needed to get to 64th by round 2) she could have choked but came through. Last edited by moriarty : 07-14-2005 at 03:51 PM. |
07-14-2005, 03:52 PM | #65 | |
College Benchwarmer
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: Seattle WA
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Quote:
As someone who doesn't really follow golf at all, what does this mean?
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07-14-2005, 03:53 PM | #66 | |
Torchbearer
Join Date: Sep 2001
Location: On Lake Harriet
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Quote:
3 holes up with one to play, i.e., there was no way her opponent could win or force a tie, so the match ended after the 17th hole. |
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07-14-2005, 03:54 PM | #67 |
College Benchwarmer
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OK, I get it. Thanks
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07-14-2005, 04:21 PM | #68 | |
Roster Filler
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Quote:
Sigh, no one listens.
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07-14-2005, 04:32 PM | #69 | |
Torchbearer
Join Date: Sep 2001
Location: On Lake Harriet
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Quote:
As applied for the 2005 tournament, the winner of the Public links as well as the winner and the runner-up at the US Amateur would receive an invitation to the Master's. |
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07-14-2005, 08:16 PM | #70 | |
College Starter
Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: A negative place
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Quote:
Why? Because you claim the Master's can revoke the offer to the winner? Big deal - they won't do it, and they already said if Michelle wins she'll play in the Masters. So the public links winner and the amateur winner (and runner up, thanks Diagmma) WILL get an invite to the Masters. Maybe it's you who should learn to listen. Last edited by moriarty : 07-14-2005 at 08:16 PM. |
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07-14-2005, 08:44 PM | #71 | |
College Prospect
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: Monroe, LA, USA
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Quote:
I always enjoy seeing this logic. Of course by that logic, if you are not better than Kobe, you can't be a Kobe detractor. Just stfu. If you can't beat Lance in the Tour de France, you have no right to say anything negative about him. stfu. Etc. Interesting viewpoint. Having said that, I will just repeat my opinion that the Michelle Wie story is overrated, though she is a very good golfer. But then it is golf, after all. However, I think it would be neat for her to win and qualify for the Masters. |
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07-15-2005, 06:39 AM | #72 | ||
lolzcat
Join Date: May 2001
Location: williamsburg, va
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Quote:
My understanding of it (granted this is just from talking heads on the radio), there is no guarantee of an invite.. it has just traditionally happened, but there is no agreement or statement in writing that the winner is granted an invite to the Master's.
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07-15-2005, 06:52 AM | #73 |
Head Coach
Join Date: Jul 2001
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I have and will continue to root for Wie in every men's tournament she enters.
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07-15-2005, 07:12 AM | #74 | |
College Starter
Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: A negative place
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Quote:
I don't disagree with your statement (or Samdari's). However, the dude asked a simple question and he deserved a simple answer. The Master's has traditionally invited the winner of the tournament (and the amateur). Can anyone recall the last time they didn't? And if they were going to change the tradition, they would say so before the tournament. Hootie and the boys aren't stupid enough to crush some kid's dream after he thinks he's (or she's) qualified. So I'm 99.99% sure they will be invited. And I'm willing to take any bets to the contrary. The only reason this comes up with the talking heads recently is because there was a question on whether they would allow Wie to play if she qualifies. This is a mute point for two reasons. 1) Hootie is already on record saying if she wins, she'll ge the invite. 2) The Masters or Augusta National has no policy against women playing there. Women have played, and do play at Augusta, so there's no reason to think they wouldn't let her play. The controversy at Augusta comes from them not allowing a woman member (not a woman play their course). |
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07-15-2005, 07:18 AM | #75 | |
Roster Filler
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Cicero
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You have absolutely no basis to say that the Master's would announce before the tournament that they were not inviting the champion. In the past they have announced during the final 18 holes of a tournament that traditionally sent its champion that this year's champ would not be invited. They have always invited the champion of the publinx, true (and I think they would even if it were Wie) but they have also never announced beforehand that they were inviting the champion. The correct answer to the question would be: they invite who they want.
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07-15-2005, 07:20 AM | #76 | |
Roster Filler
Join Date: Jan 2002
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Quote:
I think you imagined this - please provide a source.
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07-15-2005, 07:23 AM | #77 |
Hall Of Famer
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Location: The State of Insanity
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I don't think he did, I saw it on ESPN, Samdari, but I will hunt for a link for you.
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07-15-2005, 07:28 AM | #78 | |
College Starter
Join Date: Nov 2000
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Quote:
I already did if you'd listen or read. Try rereading this thread and follow the links I provided. Edit: Let me help. POST 20 Last edited by moriarty : 07-15-2005 at 07:30 AM. |
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07-15-2005, 07:35 AM | #79 | |
College Starter
Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: A negative place
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Quote:
Really, when did this happen? |
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07-15-2005, 07:36 AM | #80 | |
Roster Filler
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Cicero
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Quote:
I already read that. I was looking for a trusted source, with a quote. If he had truly announced this, it would have been huge news that everyone reported, yet everyone in the golf press except one unkown writer at a minor site thinks that the Master's has said nothing regarding Wie.
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07-15-2005, 07:38 AM | #81 | |
College Starter
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Location: A negative place
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Quote:
Uh, ESPN is not a trusted source? What do I have to do to convinve you? |
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07-15-2005, 07:41 AM | #82 | |
Roster Filler
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Cicero
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Quote:
That's NOT espn.com. I did find it there however. I am stunned that was not bigger news. She lost the first two holes today, however.
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07-15-2005, 07:42 AM | #83 |
Hall Of Famer
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http://www.indystar.com/apps/pbcs.dl...75/1004/SPORTS
Wie is the first female to qualify for a U.S. Golf Association men's championship, but her eye is fixed on something bigger. The Masters, where no woman has played, has been her lifelong dream. Since 1989, all-male Augusta National Golf Club has annually invited the Public Links champion to play in the Masters, and club chairman Hootie Johnson has said Augusta would welcome Wie or any other woman who qualifies.
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07-15-2005, 07:44 AM | #84 | |
College Starter
Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: A negative place
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Quote:
Yeah, I don't think she'll win - that Kim guy looks good. Anyways, sounds like you're coming around but here's a link to the official Master's Website. Link Here The page shows the 2006 MASTERS TOURNAMENT INVITEES Current Field to Date: Note at the bottom: 6. Current US Amateur Champion (6-A) (Honorary, non- competing after 1 year) and the runner-up (6-B) to the current US Amateur Champion 8. Current US Amateur Public Links Champion 9. Current US Mid-Amateur Champion for 2005 (threw that one in for kicks) So I suppose they could change their mind (or have a rogue website), but this looks to me like they've already invited the winners into the field. Last edited by moriarty : 07-15-2005 at 07:44 AM. |
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07-15-2005, 08:40 AM | #85 |
Roster Filler
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Cicero
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Getting worse, lost 4 of the first 5. Not that she is playing bad, all of the holes she lost were on birdies by Clay Ogden.
The thing with the Master's list of invitees is that, unlike the other majors, there is no large governing body saying, these people qualify, and then they have to stick to it. That list is guidelines (followed 99% of the time, I know) not hard and fast rules, and they have at times in the past not invited people who met their existing criteria for invitations (something I am having trouble making you understand). That's why I have been doubting all along (and still think there's about a 10% chance she would not) she would get invited. For example, if the winner of one of those were to come out and make a big public stink about Augusta's membership policies, I am fairly certain they would not be getting their invitation letter, despite having met published criteria.
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07-15-2005, 08:44 AM | #86 | |
College Starter
Join Date: Nov 2000
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Quote:
I understand very well how controlling the folks are in Augusta. I still remember them kicking out the television commentator (whose name escapes me) for making the bikini wax comment. I still don't know when in the past though they've declined to invite the winner of either tournament - could you enlighten me on this? I know the public links amateur has been invited since 1989 (when I believe they first started inviting them). |
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07-15-2005, 08:44 AM | #87 |
Quarterback
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: London, England
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Hootie Johnson said over a year ago that he would be delighted to welcome her to Augusta if she qualified. I am not sure why anyone would think he was lying when he said that.
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07-15-2005, 08:46 AM | #88 | |
Roster Filler
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Quote:
I don't think he was lying - I do know its not entirely up to him.
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07-15-2005, 08:46 AM | #89 | |
Coordinator
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Quote:
Gary McCord |
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07-15-2005, 08:48 AM | #90 | |
Roster Filler
Join Date: Jan 2002
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Quote:
They did not want blacks, so they neglected to invite them when they first met existing criteria. They did not want foreign players, so they did not invite them when they met existing criteria. I suspected that the same would hold true for women. All occurred prior to 1989.
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07-15-2005, 09:01 AM | #91 | |
College Starter
Join Date: Nov 2000
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Quote:
Lee Elder was invited to the tournment in 1975 (for winning a PGA tournament, not the amateur). And foreign players have been invited for as long as I can remember (Gary Player won it way back in 1961). So I would say it's probably safe to say that the Master's committe hasn't turned down any winner of the US Amateur in the past 30 years, and the public links champion since 1989 (or since they first started inviting them)? |
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07-15-2005, 09:08 AM | #92 | |
Roster Filler
Join Date: Jan 2002
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Its absolutely safe to say that - its provably true. That does not change the fact that they did not invite a foreign player the first time one should have been eligible, and they did not invite a black player the first time one traditionally would have been eligible. You really think I am making up them excluding people? They have done it, trust me. EDIT: Yeah, she finally gets one back, winning the 10th to get within 4.
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07-15-2005, 09:13 AM | #93 | |
College Starter
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Quote:
I believe you - I haven't even asked for the link. Like I said, I'm fully aware of how controlling (edit - controlling may not be the right word here - as, they've said many times, it's their tournament, they can conduct it the way they want) the Master's committee can be. I'm just curious how long ago it was that they actually invoked this policy. Last edited by moriarty : 07-15-2005 at 09:14 AM. |
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07-15-2005, 09:20 AM | #94 | |
Roster Filler
Join Date: Jan 2002
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Quote:
LOL, well I have been looking for a link. Unfortunately news that occurred 20 years before the internet became a repository for information is harder to come by than I have suspected. The famous story I am thinking of was actually told during a golf tournament I was watching one day. It was during the 80's (the tournament I was watching, not the time it happened) probably, and I don't even remember the announcer. The announcer said that they revoked a tournament's (the Canadian Open I believe) automatic entry into the Master's on the back 9 because a black was in contention. Presumably this would have had to have happened prior to Elder in 1974. So, there is my source, my memory of an oral retelling that occurred at least 15 years ago, of an incident that occurred at least 30 years ago. Perhaps that is not as rock solid as I am thinking. EDIT: gave her hole back on the 11th, now down 5. If this is 18 (not sure when they go to 36, but its probably the semis or finals) she is in a world of hurt.
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07-15-2005, 10:27 AM | #95 |
Grizzled Veteran
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: Wisconsin
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She's done..
I don't think I can live for the next few days without constant Wie updates. Hopefully, someone latches onto the opportunity tonight and presents Wie reading Harry Potter...
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You, you will regret what you have done this day. I will make you regret ever being born. Your going to wish you never left your mothers womb, where it was warm and safe... and wet. i am going to show you pain you never knew existed, you are going to see a whole new spectrum of pain, like a Rainboooow. But! This rainbow is not just like any other rainbow, its... Last edited by Mustang : 07-15-2005 at 10:28 AM. |
07-15-2005, 10:49 AM | #96 |
Head Coach
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I'd hit it right after Dark Cloud.
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07-15-2005, 10:10 PM | #97 |
Pro Rookie
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I do not doubt the Masters may have done something like that in the past. It's in Augusta, GA, after all, and quite obviously people are still around who endured segregation. However, at this point, I doubt they'd do anything of the sort. They could ride out Martha Burke and her one-woman-acting-as-a-voice-of-millions routine, but it's another kettle of fish to actually change the rules to block a player in such a discriminatory fashion. No way in hell CBS stands with them to carry the tournament if they did that nowadays. The firestorm would be nuclear in comparison to the struck matchstick of the women's membership question.
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