The Thread for Bitching About Soccer or Arguing Against Bitching About Soccer

[MJ4H]

I thought about seeing how many different facepalm gifs I could find for this occasion, but I got lazy.

[Ronnie Dobbs2]

Originally Posted by Sun Tzu

Just for the sake of entertainment...

Yes. That's exactly what my post was saying.

Fair enough. After a reread, what you are saying is that sports watched massively by Americans are reserved for truly gifted athletes. Other sports that aren't watched massively by Americans let non-truly gifted athletes in.

Sorry about the confusion.

ETA:

[MJ4H]

FUCKING LAY OFF THE BIG O

(and to be fair, he did specifically mention basketball as being the same type of thing as soccer)

[Sun Tzu]

Originally Posted by Ronnie Dobbs2

Fair enough...

You posting a pic of a basketball player is only re-affirming that you only read the words directly before and after "soccer" or "american" in the post. Please re-re-read. Do a Ctrl+F for the words "Basketball" or "practice" if it helps.

[illinifan999]

Originally Posted by cthomer5000

1. If you're willing to pay for the additional channel, you can almost always get 9 out of 10 soccer games that are played in the English Premier League each week. All but the worst of the EPL teams are on TV every week.

2. Maybe get a DVR? The one positive about being a follower of a MLS team is that it is very easy to watch the game hours later without having run into any spoilers.

Or if you want to follow a league other than the EPL, Serie A is shown every weekend on FSC. I would say about 90% of Inter, Juve, and Milan matches are shown.

[Ronnie Dobbs2]

Originally Posted by Sun Tzu

You posting a pic of a basketball player is only re-affirming that you only read the words directly before and after "soccer" or "american" in the post. Please re-re-read. Do a Ctrl+F for the words "Basketball" or "practice" if it helps.

Well fuck me for trying to make a joke. So then it's football and baseball that's reserved for truly gifted athletes?

Edit: I guess the confusion for me is what Americans massively watch. NBA Finals ratings and World Series ratings not that far off.

[JediKooter]

Beckham sucks. He's made out of glass. So what's with all the hype?

[tyketime]

Originally Posted by molson

I don't think the low scores are biggest problem with soccer. The games are much shorter - a 2-1 soccer game is roughly equivalent to a 28-14 football game.

In popular American sports though, things that effect the game's outcome happen throughout the game. That's what we like. A scoreless half-inning of baseball clearly advances the game, putting a zero up on the scoreboard. A touchdown may take a half hour or more of real time to develop, and it may be a direct consequence of a big defensive play/turnover/kickoff return that happened just prior to that. Everything feels connected.

In soccer, you can have huge periods of time that go by, where nothing happens that actually advances the game.

To a non-soccer fan, a game kind of looks like this:

nothing happening...nothing happening...nothing happening..SCORE OFF A DEFLECTION THAT HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH WHAT HAPPENED EARLIER....nothing happening....nothing happening....

We like more structure rather than free-flowing play (innings, downs, yards to to go, or failing that, a changing socreboard every few seconds, as in basketball)

While I never played soccer growing up, I've become a huge fan of the sport in the past 10 years. And when I first watched, I would agree that it looks like a lot of nothing was going on. And even now, I dread 0-0 (nil-nil) games. So to most casual fans, I would agree that's what it looks like on the surface. I suspect no different than the old adage that you can start watching a NBA game mid-way through the 4th quarter, and not miss much.

But having watched soccer as a fan, I see other things happening on the field. The first thing I pick up on are there are three locations to focus on. Team A's strikers vs Team B's defense, the midfield, and Team B's strikers vs Team A's defense. You can then start to notice the little battles that are taking place. And these little battles begin to build on each other. Let's look at Germany as an example. I thoroughly enjoyed watching their games against England & Argentina. Their defense was solid and allowed few scoring chances. They owned the middle game, and their counter-attack was both open and exciting to watch. But when they played Spain, it didn't work. Spain was much more disciplined than their previous two opponents. Spain was patient. They clogged up the middle and nullified Germany's ability to counter-attack. Spain maintained possession of the ball, minimizing Germany's chance for a quick strike (not unlike the NFL teams of yesterday that ran the ball on most downs and chewed up 8-9 minutes on the clock). As the game went on, you could sense that Germany was starting to push forward more, which then opened themselves up for a quick attack the other way. While there wasn't a single goal in the first 70 minutes, you could see the strategies of two different sides: Spain with it's control & patience. Germany with solid defense and looking to quickly go on the attack. The game is advancing (just not yet on the scoreboard).

You start to see the individuals and how they are interacting. Germany's Klose had very few touches/chances against Spain, but you didn't see him blow a gasket. Compare that to a Wayne Rooney, whose frustration grew more & more intense in England's game against Germany (I know, England got royally screwed, and it DID impact the game, but my point is still the same). The emotional South American teams react so differently than European teams (in general). The physicality of the English Premier League versus the beauty and artistry of Italian/Spanish soccer.

There is an appreciation I have gained of the strategies throughout a soccer match that aren't necessarily visible on the surface. Of course I am still biased and will typically "enjoy" a 3-2 game better than a 1-0 result. But please don't mistake a lack of scoring with nothing going on.

[Sun Tzu]

Originally Posted by Ronnie Dobbs2

Edit: I guess the confusion for me is what Americans massively watch. NBA Finals ratings and World Series ratings not that far off.

Meh...I think you'd be hard pressed to win an argument where your position is that basketball is followed as passionately as baseball, especially in the states.

Now I'm not trying to come off as a US elitist here. In fact I'm quite the opposite...I don't even believe in patriotism. I'm the guy who stays seated during the national anthem before games, and rolls his eyes when they show some military yuck-yuck on camera.

Still, I think as far as team sports go, professional baseball probably ranks at the top as far as the need for world-class talent/gifts, and soccer/basketball rank near the bottom. I guess a lineman in the NFL could be played by anyone, but even then you have to be 6'3+ to really even be considered. I don't know how many 5'10 - 6'0 pro NBA players there are though.

Getting back on topic...soccer is boring because it's entirely possible to sit there for 3+ hours and literally see nothing happen.

[ISiddiqui]

Originally Posted by tyketime

But please don't mistake a lack of scoring with nothing going on.

Hear Hear!

I do come back to what my dad used to say about cricket (my dad was born in India and grew up in Pakistan), "you just weren't raised with it, so you think its boring". Though with cricket the all day test matches is kinda silly, but with 20/20 or even watching a portion of it, and actually looking at the rules and strategy I realized that it definitely is interesting.

I think one of the problems is what we were used to growing up with and how that impacts really studying a new game. The comments about soccer's free flow and lack of deliniated structure is a very key observation.

[MJ4H]

Originally Posted by Sun Tzu

it's entirely possible to sit there for 3+ hours and literally see nothing happen.

It's entirely possible to sit anywhere and see nothing happen. It doesn't mean nothing happened.

[bhlloy]

To me Baseball is the ultimate "practice and you get good" sport. Yes at the highest level the hand eye co-ordination is ridiculous and there are a few positions that are true athletes, but at the highest level you can say that about any sport. 99% of the population will never have the natural fitness level or agility to play soccer at the top level either.

[MrBug708]

Originally Posted by Sun Tzu

Soccer is considered kind of a joke sport in the San Fran bay area. Like...it's not even a real sport. I look at it like basketball. It doesn't really require any special talent to play. Anybody can grab a ball and kick it around the field. Sure it's played at a higher level with the pro's, but it's one of those sports where if you practice a lot then you get really good. Whereas with Baseball, you could practice every day with the best trainers in the world...but if you don't have world class hand-eye-coordination, you're going to be stuck in the minors (if you're lucky) your whole life. I think that's a big reason that the two big sports, Football and Baseball, are so popular in the States. US citizens are a bunch of elitist assholes, and they wont settle for watching sports on a massive scale that aren't reserved for only truly gifted athletes.

At least that's my take.

To be fair, the Bay Area isn't exactly a sports Mecca. No one watches the A's, you have the Raiders, the Giants havent done anything, the 49er's havent been good in decades. The colleges teams are probably the best and no one supports them either

[molson]

Originally Posted by cthomer5000

By your logic: How do 3-and-out series in football advance the game?

The eventual touchdowns that are scored have nothing to do with that series.

A three-and-out sets up the defensive team with excellent field position. It advances the story of the game, in that way.

And I think the lower scoring in soccer does come into effect there. A three-and-out earns the defensive team what, a 40-50% chance of scoring? In soccer, an excellent defensive play earns a 3-4% chance of scoring (or less)? So its harder to care about the excellent defensive play in soccer, because odds are, it won't matter to the final result of the game.

I find soccer a very pleasing sport to watch. But I like watching it like I would like looking at a painting, or a track and field event. I can't really get into it as a competition.

[Kodos]

Originally Posted by tyketime

While I never played soccer growing up, I've become a huge fan of the sport in the past 10 years. And when I first watched, I would agree that it looks like a lot of nothing was going on. And even now, I dread 0-0 (nil-nil) games. So to most casual fans, I would agree that's what it looks like on the surface. I suspect no different than the old adage that you can start watching a NBA game mid-way through the 4th quarter, and not miss much.

But having watched soccer as a fan, I see other things happening on the field. The first thing I pick up on are there are three locations to focus on. Team A's strikers vs Team B's defense, the midfield, and Team B's strikers vs Team A's defense. You can then start to notice the little battles that are taking place. And these little battles begin to build on each other. Let's look at Germany as an example. I thoroughly enjoyed watching their games against England & Argentina. Their defense was solid and allowed few scoring chances. They owned the middle game, and their counter-attack was both open and exciting to watch. But when they played Spain, it didn't work. Spain was much more disciplined than their previous two opponents. Spain was patient. They clogged up the middle and nullified Germany's ability to counter-attack. Spain maintained possession of the ball, minimizing Germany's chance for a quick strike (not unlike the NFL teams of yesterday that ran the ball on most downs and chewed up 8-9 minutes on the clock). As the game went on, you could sense that Germany was starting to push forward more, which then opened themselves up for a quick attack the other way. While there wasn't a single goal in the first 70 minutes, you could see the strategies of two different sides: Spain with it's control & patience. Germany with solid defense and looking to quickly go on the attack. The game is advancing (just not yet on the scoreboard).

You start to see the individuals and how they are interacting. Germany's Klose had very few touches/chances against Spain, but you didn't see him blow a gasket. Compare that to a Wayne Rooney, whose frustration grew more & more intense in England's game against Germany (I know, England got royally screwed, and it DID impact the game, but my point is still the same). The emotional South American teams react so differently than European teams (in general). The physicality of the English Premier League versus the beauty and artistry of Italian/Spanish soccer.

There is an appreciation I have gained of the strategies throughout a soccer match that aren't necessarily visible on the surface. Of course I am still biased and will typically "enjoy" a 3-2 game better than a 1-0 result. But please don't mistake a lack of scoring with nothing going on.

Sorry, but my eyes kinda glazed over when I hit the underlined passage. I was too bored to carry on.

[JediKooter]

Another problem I have with soccer is, what looks to me, as just absolute horrible passing. I don't know if that's because there's just too many people out on the field or what, but, it seems to be really bad at all levels. Watching part of the Spain/Germany game yesterday, Spain was on Germany's side for almost the whole time it seemed like and when Germany would try and push down field and pass it, it would get intercepted almost every single time.

The players also seem to be really top heavy with how easy the fall down.

[Kodos]

For the record, I think soccer is fun to play. It was the only sport outside of track and cross country that I had any skill at in junior high/high school. I was cut from the 7th grade team (had never played organized soccer before then, and couldn't compete against guys who had been playing for years) and thus diverted into cross country. Basically, my only physical gift was endurance. I could run and run and run. In soccer, that meant that other kids in gym would get tired before me, so I could do fairly well once they got tired out.

I really pissed off my friend who was on the soccer team one day. We were playing one-on-one, and I ended up beating him. He complained that my constantly attacking the ball wasn't what real players would do. Sorry for employing a strategy that worked for me, buddy.

[Sun Tzu]

Originally Posted by MrBug708

To be fair, the Bay Area isn't exactly a sports Mecca. No one watches the A's, you have the Raiders, the Giants havent done anything, the 49er's havent been good in decades. The colleges teams are probably the best and no one supports them either

Oh I agree, I'm just saying that it's like that there, which means (and this is just a guess here) that it's probably like that several other places too. I doubt that baseball or football are considered a joke sport many places though. Then again, they may be considered a joke outside of the states, but that may have more to do with the lack of games being televised there.

[tyketime]

Originally Posted by Kodos

Sorry, but my eyes kinda glazed over when I hit the underlined passage. I was too bored to carry on.

While you do say that with jest, it is truly a problem with the younger generation. The shorter attention span, ESPN packaged quick clips. The viewer wants it, and wants it now.

[lungs]

One thing I like about soccer is the lack of commercial breaks.

And think about it, in football the action is not constant. They play for a few seconds, whoever makes the play dances around and then they go play grab ass in a huddle before a few more seconds of action resume.

That said, I'm not a huge soccer fan.

[Ronnie Dobbs2]

Originally Posted by Sun Tzu

Getting back on topic...soccer is boring because it's entirely possible to sit there for 3+ hours and literally see nothing happen.

I would just like to point out that this is actually not possible

You'd either be out after 2 hours or at least see penalties.

[Icy]

Originally Posted by Sun Tzu

Soccer is considered kind of a joke sport in the San Fran bay area. Like...it's not even a real sport. I look at it like basketball. It doesn't really require any special talent to play. Anybody can grab a ball and kick it around the field. Sure it's played at a higher level with the pro's, but it's one of those sports where if you practice a lot then you get really good. Whereas with Baseball, you could practice every day with the best trainers in the world...but if you don't have world class hand-eye-coordination, you're going to be stuck in the minors (if you're lucky) your whole life. I think that's a big reason that the two big sports, Football and Baseball, are so popular in the States. US citizens are a bunch of elitist assholes, and they wont settle for watching sports on a massive scale that aren't reserved for only truly gifted athletes.

At least that's my take.

Yeah even my grandma can do this, no skills required for soccer:

[cthomer5000]

Originally Posted by molson

A three-and-out sets up the defensive team with excellent field position. It advances the story of the game, in that way.

And I think the lower scoring in soccer does come into effect there. A three-and-out earns the defensive team what, a 40-50% chance of scoring? In soccer, an excellent defensive play earns a 3-4% chance of scoring (or less)? So its harder to care about the excellent defensive play in soccer, because odds are, it won't matter to the final result of the game.

I find soccer a very pleasing sport to watch. But I like watching it like I would like looking at a painting, or a track and field event. I can't really get into it as a competition.

Well, I just fundamentally disagree. I think like anything people haven't put any real time into, they just can't see it.

Every sport has its merits, and its issues. But the 'nothing happening' is just an invalid argument, IMHO. Or minute 3 of a game having nothing to do with minute 90.

[Sun Tzu]

Originally Posted by bhlloy

To me Baseball is the ultimate "practice and you get good" sport. Yes at the highest level the hand eye co-ordination is ridiculous and there are a few positions that are true athletes, but at the highest level you can say that about any sport. 99% of the population will never have the natural fitness level or agility to play soccer at the top level either.

I disagree whole-heartedely. Having grown up playing baseball and seen many athletes who I thought were gifted crash and burn, I can tell you for fact that if you don't literally have absolute world-class coordination, you will fail. If you pick up a bat, ball and glove, you may get good enough after a few years to play half-way decent on your local senior league team...that's about it.

I'm also not talking about 99% of the population, and if it came off that way earlier I apologize. I'm talking about athletic people who want to play sports and are already in shape enough to do so. With professional training starting at a very young age, someone who has half-way decent coordination that takes up basketball or soccer will probably turn in a great player, and may even go pro. That's just not the case with baseball or football...there are certain tools/physical traits that you have to have been born with in order to make it.

[molson]

Originally Posted by cthomer5000

Well, I just fundamentally disagree. I think like anything people haven't put any real time into, they just can't see it.

Every sport has its merits, and its issues. But the 'nothing happening' is just an invalid argument, IMHO. Or minute 3 of a game having nothing to do with minute 90.

I didn't say "nothing happened". Just that the things that do happen matter a lot less to the eventual outcome of a game than in other sports.

An intercepted pass in football is a much bigger deal than in intercepted pass in soccer, for example.

[Kodos]

Originally Posted by tyketime

While you do say that with jest, it is truly a problem with the younger generation. The shorter attention span, ESPN packaged quick clips. The viewer wants it, and wants it now.

I just turned 40, fwiw.

On the other hand, I'm tired, have been sick for a couple days, and am working on complicated crap today at work, so my attention span isn't great today.

[Sun Tzu]

Originally Posted by Icy

no skills required for soccer

It's terrible if that's what you extracted from my post...just terrible.

terrible

[Kodos]

TERRIBLE!

[Sun Tzu]

Originally Posted by Ronnie Dobbs2

I would just like to point out that this is actually not possible

You'd either be out after 2 hours or at least see penalties.

Haha...and what the hell is with the cards?

Not to mention the guys falling down acting as if they fractured their skull every time someone bumps into them?

Yeesh!

[bhlloy]

Originally Posted by Sun Tzu

With professional training, someone who has half-way decent coordination that takes up basketball or soccer will probably turn in a great player, and may even go pro. That's just not the case with baseball or football...there are certain tools/physical traits that you have to have been born with in order to make it.

We'll just have to flat out disagree, I think this is insane. You are telling me that somebody with average height and athleticism has any chance of becoming a pro basketball player?

Soccer, yes the obvious athletic constraints aren't there but still, in Europe or South America (or any country where soccer is a major sport) if you aren't an elite athlete you will not be a pro player. Somebody like Messi or Iniesta might look small and unathletic but I guarantee you their natural fitness, agility, co-ordination and balance are off the charts. Funnily enough, I'd be willing to bet they would be pretty good baseball players if born in the US

[Sun Tzu]

Originally Posted by Kodos

TERRIBLE!

[Sun Tzu]

Originally Posted by bhlloy

We'll just have to flat out disagree, I think this is insane. You are telling me that somebody with average height and athleticism has any chance of becoming a pro basketball player?

Soccer, yes the obvious athletic constraints aren't there but still, in Europe or South America (or any country where soccer is a major sport) if you aren't an elite athlete you will not be a pro player. Somebody like Messi or Iniesta might look small and unathletic but I guarantee you their natural fitness, agility, co-ordination and balance are off the charts. Funnily enough, I'd be willing to bet they would be pretty good baseball players if born in the US

Whoops...sorry I meant to include that they would need to start at a young age. I'll edit.

Are those elite players? I'd be willing to bet that the truly elite guys in soccer could have gone in multiple directions if they started at an early age, but that can probably be said for most truly elite handful of players in any sport.

[Ronnie Dobbs2]

Originally Posted by Sun Tzu

It's terrible if that's what you extracted from my post...just terrible.

terrible

It took me a while to get that you are discussing "gifts from God" and not "athletic gifts." Essentially your argument is that you have to be some sort of "freak" to be good as baseball/football, if I read you right.

[Sun Tzu]

Originally Posted by Ronnie Dobbs2

It took me a while to get that you are discussing "gifts from God" and not "athletic gifts." Essentially your argument is that you have to be some sort of "freak" to be good as baseball/football, if I read you right.

More or less, yeah. You have to be special, and not short school bus special either. I'm not religious so the whole "gifts from God thing" doesn't apply to what I'm saying, but I think it's in the same vein. The guys who go pro in baseball/football are almost literally freaks, even compared to other very athletic people.

[cthomer5000]

Are you guys seriously acting as if coordination isn't an issue in placing a soccer ball?

They aren't just randomly kicking it out there, and the average control that these players have is pretty mind-blowing when you actually slow it down.

[Ronnie Dobbs2]

Originally Posted by Sun Tzu

More or less, yeah. You have to be special, and not short school bus special either. I'm not religious so the whole "gifts from God thing" doesn't apply to what I'm saying, but I think it's in the same vein. The guys who go pro in baseball/football are almost literally freaks, even compared to other very athletic people.

God thing was just shorthand. I guess I'd say that the coordination required to excel in soccer is very similar to that of hitting a baseball, being a RB/WR/CB in football. I imagine we're not going to convince each other either way.

[cthomer5000]

I would have a hard time being convinced that any top-flight athlete in any sport doesn't have exceptional talents. I don't know why I constantly see this argument being made about soccer though. I guess to the untrained eye it's just running.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by molson

An intercepted pass in football is a much bigger deal than in intercepted pass in soccer, for example.

Aw c'mon, an intercepted pass in soccer means that someone just lost not only a chance to fail to score but also they lost a chance to fail at generating a scoring chance

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by cthomer5000

I guess to the untrained eye it's just running.

More like running while appearing rather inept at locating a ball within even 10 feet of the intended target (unless of course they meant to kick it to the other team repeatedly, maybe that's part of the deep ultra-secret strategy that eludes the non-diehard), followed by crashing to the ground whenever a mild breeze interferes with their delicate aerodynamics.

See? We really do pay a lot more attention than you think

[Sun Tzu]

Originally Posted by Ronnie Dobbs2

I imagine we're not going to convince each other either way.

Agreed...I'm happy with agreeing to disagree here. I'm not an extremist for much of anything...so I'm not saying that any Joe Schmoe couch potato can play soccer at a professional level. Hence me saying that it still requires good coordination and potentially even professional training starting at a very young age, but at the same time I'd be willing to bet there are a good number of "pick up game" soccer and basketball players all over the world who could play at a professional level with a bit of technique training...maybe not as a superstar but at the very least as a role-player. I sincerely doubt the same can be said for Baseball. There are probably some people that can play WR out there, but that's the only position that I'd be willing to concede. The DB position may look easy, but I assure you it's very difficult, especially considering the amount of play recognition involved.

[ISiddiqui]

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

More like running while appearing rather inept at locating a ball within even 10 feet of the intended target

Maybe you actually have to play soccer at a competitive level to understand, but its really difficult to hit pin point passes at a distance, especially when another player is barreling down on you.

And as for shots, unless you hit it into the corners, the goalkeepers are too good for you to score goals (unless they make some dumb error). And if you are aiming for a small area, any mishit will carry farther.

[Kodos]

I always feel a bit odd when JiMG and I are arguing on the same side in something.

[Lathum]

Originally Posted by Sun Tzu

Not to mention the guys falling down acting as if they fractured their skull every time someone bumps into them?

I think this is a part of the problem. Americans tend to appreciate grit, think Kirk Gibson or Curt Schilling. I think many see the antics of soccer players and think they are a bunch of pussies.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by ISiddiqui

Maybe you actually have to play soccer at a competitive level to understand, but its really difficult to hit pin point passes at a distance, especially when another player is barreling down on you.

And as for shots, unless you hit it into the corners, the goalkeepers are too good for you to score goals (unless they make some dumb error). And if you are aiming for a small area, any mishit will carry farther.

Bzzt. I didn't even mention anything about relative difficulty, I described what it looked like.

It ain't easy to, I dunno, hit a 13 rail shot playing billiards either, but I'm also not inclined to sit & watch people do that.

[Marmel]

I don't like or dislike soccer. I watch some WC games and enjoy them, mostly. What I do hate about soccer are the fans of the sport who will tell you how exciting and how intricate the game play is. It just isn't and that is not a bad thing. It also drives me a little crazy how soccer fans seem to NEED the sport to become successful in the USA. If you enjoy watching it, fine, but why does it matter if Americans accept it or not? You can still watch and enjoy it.

On the other hand, soccer haters are annoying too. I hate skiing, but I don't go around telling skiiers that their sport sucks and it is just going up and down a hill with no point to it.

When did I become so cranky?

[Kodos]

Birth?

[Sun Tzu]

Whenever I see Marmel on here, I automatically think of Nermal...from the Garfield comics.

[molson]

I do wish I was more into soccer because I love the structure and format of the whole soccer world. One set of rules, universally applied across hundreds of leagues at verious levels throughout the world, and all of those leagues kind of make up one, greater, global league. Teams, (I'm sorry, "clubs") from one league going to a tournament to play against clubs from other leagues - great stuff.

[cthomer5000]

Originally Posted by Marmel

I don't like or dislike soccer. I watch some WC games and enjoy them, mostly. What I do hate about soccer are the fans of the sport who will tell you how exciting and how intricate the game play is. It just isn't and that is not a bad thing. It also drives me a little crazy how soccer fans seem to NEED the sport to become successful in the USA. If you enjoy watching it, fine, but why does it matter if Americans accept it or not? You can still watch and enjoy it.

On the other hand, soccer haters are annoying too. I hate skiing, but I don't go around telling skiiers that their sport sucks and it is just going up and down a hill with no point to it.

When did I become so cranky?

This is bogus. Soccer is probably the only sport that professional sportswriters professionally deride constantly. I can probably dig up 50 articles since June 1 printed in newspapers that have the equivalent of 'The World Cup is here, Who Cares?' type headlines. Or 'Rule changes that would make soccer interesting'

The sport is constantly ripped by the old guard in sports writing, and there are clearly many average Americans who fall in line with this kind of thinking.

There is literally a real media bias against the sport in this country. We aren't delusional. The degree of bias, and the amount of these absurd articles, may be shrinking over time, but it's still pretty prevalent.

[Sun Tzu]

Actually, I have to admit there is one reason I would want to get into soccer.

FM

I hear that shit is dope.