2012 NFL Regular Season - Week 4: The Focus Turns to Football Now - Page 2

Arles · 09-26-2012, 02:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dutch

IRT MNF -- Wow. Here's an angle I hadn't seen.

NDN PlaylistWidget

So...help me out...FOFC, what am I seeing here? Is Jennings the guy with only one hand on the ball???

It doesn't matter; the rule states that once one person has established possession, another can't piggyback on. Watching it live, in the 30 other angles or even that angle show that at the highest point of the catch, Jennings is the only one with it. You can't make a catch, have someone dive on top of you as you're falling down and grab at the ball, and then have it ruled the other guy's catch. That's basically what people are saying who say Seattle had the catch.

Once the image on the left happened, Jennings had possession and it's immaterial what Tate did:

stevew · 09-26-2012, 02:31 PM

I feel like they should have been handing out a lot more fines. It's ridiculous how jerky some of these receivers act when they try to get the bullshit PI called. Hell, I saw someone tugging on his facemask while he was being tackled to try to get a call made(I think this was maybe Matt Cassell). Santonio Holmes should perpetually be paying 5-10k a game for the way he acts.

sterlingice · 09-26-2012, 02:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kodos

I'm really enjoying the winlessness in New Orleans.

New Orleans? I just never saw them as some big, nasty power that I wanted to lose games. I didn't realize there was some bottled up Saints hate out there.

SI

RendeR · 09-26-2012, 02:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Arles

It doesn't matter; the rule states that once one person has established possession, another can't piggyback on. Watching it live, in the 30 other angles or even that angle show that at the highest point of the catch, Jennings is the only one with it. You can't make a catch, have someone dive on top of you as you're falling down and grab at the ball, and then have it ruled the other guy's catch. That's basically what people are saying who say Seattle had the catch.

Once the image on the left happened, Jennings had possession and it's immaterial what Tate did:

Actually thats wrong. In the image at the left what you can't see is that Tate's left arm i up under the ball, thats his glove you can barely see between Jennings arms. At this time Jennings does not yet have possession. Neither does Tate yet either. As they both fal to the ground it becomes a lot more muddled.

Again on the right you can't see tate's left arm, which if you watch the video went between the ball and Jennings body. This was why I was saying simo-possession the entire time.

Now personally with all the other shit that happened in this game I felt the Pack should have lost it without all the drama anyway, but in the end it got handled and I agreed with the final decision not to change the on field call.

Arles · 09-26-2012, 02:42 PM

I guess if people look at enough angles, they can eventually talk themselves into Tate have some sort of possession. But, in real time and when looking at the 3 main angles, here's what is clear:

1. Jennings is the first to secure both hands on the ball.
2. Jennings always has both hands on the ball.
3. Jennings is the only one to have the ball secured in his chest by the time they hit the ground.
4. Tate was always trying to grab at the ball through Jennings the entire play.

I just don't see how anyone who saw this real time or even after a look at the replay had the first instinct to say "Yeah, Tate's the one who caught it".

I think the side judge was late getting over and by the time he got there both guys were fighting for the ball. So, in his mind, it was simultaneous possession and he said TD. However, he never had a clear view at the catch in the air or when they hit the ground. The head ref then made that call because the side judge looked more definitive and when he reviewed it - I don't think he knew a) what was reviewable or b) the definition from the rule book of what a simultaneous catch was. So, in order not to cause waves, he rubber stamped the call on the field.

The process is what bothers me and that's exactly what we get with replacement refs. They don't know the rules very well, they haven't developed instincts for the NFL game and they are unsure on how to act. You balance all this with them not wanting to look "stupid" or "weak" and there's a chance they will make calls that require more information/study with false bravado.

If this exact catch happened with real refs, I guarantee the initial decision would have taken atleast 5-6 minutes to sort out. Then, the ref would have known the rules for simultaneous possession and what was reviewable when he looked at the replay. If after 4-5 minutes of discussion between the ref and the officials that saw the play and a full review (by someone who knew rules), the decision was made that it was a catch by Seattle - I feel like it would have atleast been more palatable.

Honestly, I seriously doubt that would have happened as the back judge had a clear view and if he knew the NFL rules he would probably have been more adamant about it being an INT. Also, a real side judge would have known he was in a poor position to make the call and probably deferred or atleast conferenced with the back judge before making the TD signal. And, I guarantee a real ref wouldn't have made a quick TD call without talking to both the officials at the scene. Still, there's nothing that can be done at this point - but the fact that both the wrong judgement was made (slightly debatable, but it's a weak debate against it) combined with a terrible process being followed by refs who did not know the rules (for both replay and the catch itself) make it much harder to take as a fan.

RendeR · 09-26-2012, 02:47 PM

If one convinces one's self of anything one can believe it.

Again, you don't know for certain from any of the videos that I saw anyway, that Tates hand isn't between ball and body, which negates entirely the "secured to chest" issue. Its possibe that hand is in there. Maybe I missed a point where it wasn't but I haven't seen that yet.

I didn't watch it and think Tate had it, I thought initially it was a pick, however once th replays started going (and the fact that one ref did call it a TD and he was at the best angle to see tates arms and hands) I could see that Tate MAY have indeed had it as well.

Its not nearly black and while like anyone is trying to say, but in the lack of a black and white result you have what appears to be both people with the grab.

Gotta love MNF giving us something to dissect for a few days eh?

RendeR · 09-26-2012, 02:49 PM

The bigger point of the review is that none of the replays truly give concrete evidence that Tate Didn't have possession with Jennings, and without that he had to let the cal on the field stand.

Blackadar · 09-26-2012, 02:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RendeR

The bigger point of the review is that none of the replays truly give concrete evidence that Tate Didn't have possession with Jennings, and without that he had to let the cal on the field stand.

Horseshit. When Tate's hands don't get there at the same time, when his hand flies off the ball, etc. - there's more than enough evidence to show that Tate did not have and did not keep possession of the ball.

And I don't like the Packers.

Arles · 09-26-2012, 02:53 PM

The first problem was the process for making the TD call was so sloppy it skewed the review in the wrong direction. There is no way the old guy sprinting down the sideline to get into position saw Tate make the catch. What he saw was Tate and Jennings both fighting for the ball on the ground when his slow ass got there and that's why he made the call. He should not have been the one making the call. He started out about 30-40 yards from the play, the back judge had to go about 10 and he was the one who saw the action in the air (when Jennings had it) and that's why he called touchback.

But once the TD call was made on the field, I can see an argument that it should stand IF you didn't know that simultaneous possession can't occur once one player gains full control. And, IMO, I don't think the ref knew that rule when he reviewed it. If he did, there's no way you can look at from when Jennings has both hands on the ball at the top before Tate to where Tate's one arm falls off of it on the way down and not see that Jennings had clear possession before Tate.

Arles · 09-26-2012, 03:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RendeR

Actually thats wrong. In the image at the left what you can't see is that Tate's left arm i up under the ball, thats his glove you can barely see between Jennings arms. At this time Jennings does not yet have possession. Neither does Tate yet either. As they both fal to the ground it becomes a lot more muddled.

This is the angle that shows Jennings had both hands on the ball close to his chest before Tate is close to having any sort of possession:

Ironically enough, it's the same angle the back judge would have seen during live action. The real "fail" in this is that the back judge was completely ignored in this decision even though he had the cleanest angle to see it live.

Finally, this is the best image I've seen. Basically, Tate is reaching up towards Jennings while Jennings securely has the ball between both hands and elbows against his chest. I don't see how anyone could say that at this point, Tate has clear possession of the ball and it's obvious that Jennings does.

wade moore · 09-26-2012, 03:07 PM

meh, we couldn't keep this to the week 3 thread?

RendeR · 09-26-2012, 03:09 PM

I an see what your're saying, but just ike the left hand image you poste above, Jennig' hands weren't closed on the bll there, in this one you can't tel if they are closed on the ball or not.

THen you look at the fact that this was at full speed and not stop motion like we get to see it and I can definitely see the issue with the calls.

I do agree that all three official involved NEEDED to huddle up and discuss what each one saw and THEN make an on field call. AS you say each one had differing angles and views of it all.

The speed of the NFL game really kicked their ass on this one.

RendeR · 09-26-2012, 03:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wade moore

meh, we couldn't keep this to the week 3 thread?

No, now go lick a window or something

stevew · 09-26-2012, 03:10 PM

Agreed with Wade
Beyond giving a fuck about a week 3 game

RendeR · 09-26-2012, 03:11 PM

That last image: There is white between the ball and jennings hand. it is NOT a secure possession there either. Its not the laces, the laces are further to the right in the image.

So at this point neither guy has control yet and they're on their way down to the ground where it becomes a muddled mess.

RendeR · 09-26-2012, 03:12 PM

Ok OK OK gah, this IS the week 4 thread anyway.

Arles · 09-26-2012, 03:16 PM

Fair enough, so everyone can get back to discussing that Thursday night barn-burner of Baltimore-Cleveland now

stevew · 09-26-2012, 03:16 PM

What's the packers record since Raji started to discount double check? 1-3, right?

Dutch · 09-26-2012, 03:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by stevew

What's the packers record since Raji started to discount double check? 1-3, right?

It's actually just 1-2...UNLESS WE ARE ALSO TALKING ABOUT MNF's DEBACLE IN WEEK #3.

spleen1015 · 09-26-2012, 03:43 PM

I don't care if you talk about it here or the other thread. My only question is, why are we still talking about it like we're still arguing over what happened? Shit isn't going to change and everyone had said the same things 15 different ways with pics and video from 68 different angles.

Dutch · 09-26-2012, 03:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Arles

Fair enough, so everyone can get back to discussing that Thursday night barn-burner of Baltimore-Cleveland now

Agreed, back to the week #4 discussion. Personally, I like the Ravens logo better, the Browns are just too plain and orange.

OR

Solecismic · 09-26-2012, 03:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dutch

Agreed, back to the week #4 discussion. Personally, I like the Ravens logo better, the Browns are just too plain and orange.

This is a replacement orange. If you had the original, on review, you'd find that no sentient person could possibly call it plain.

Damned replacement graphic designers.

CrimsonFox · 09-26-2012, 03:59 PM

I think I want to start watching football just to see all the bad calls!

Dutch · 09-26-2012, 04:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Solecismic

This is a replacement orange. If you had the original, on review, you'd find that no sentient person could possibly call it plain.

Damned replacement graphic designers.

I was looking for an original but Google has new engineers and when I typed in "browns logo" all I got was "interesting facts about John Kruk".

http://www.replacementgoogle.com/

They need to bring the other engineers back...stat.

sterlingice · 09-26-2012, 04:13 PM

I love that my replacement result was "Movies that had Shaq in them" or something like that

SI

Dutch · 09-26-2012, 04:22 PM

I typed in "Fun Facts about Cleveland" and got "Reviews of Anything starring Ben Affleck"

This is really starting to piss me off.

Glengoyne · 09-26-2012, 04:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Arles

I guess if people look at enough angles, they can eventually talk themselves into Tate have some sort of possession. But, in real time and when looking at the 3 main angles, here's what is clear:

1. Jennings is the first to secure both hands on the ball. IMMATERIAL
2. Jennings always has both hands on the ball. IMMATERIAL
3. Jennings is the only one to have the ball secured in his chest by the time they hit the ground. IMMATERIAL
4. Tate was always trying to grab at the ball through Jennings the entire play. I don't believe that is true

...

My Comments in BOLD
The two hands on the ball and always had it and pulled it into his chest don't matter because I don't believe those are at all in dispute.

The official on the field ruled simultaneous possession. That means he believed that Tate's hand...that you can see clearly on the ball along with Jennings constituted control by Tate at the same time that Jennings controlled the ball.
For the on the field call in real time. I'll call that call decision by the ref plausible.

Anyone can correct me if I'm wrong, but for the call to be over ruled on replay don't you need to see incontrovertible evidence that Tate doesn't have possession at the same time as Jennings? That I still haven't seen. You can clearly see that Jennings has the ball and control, but you can't see that Tate doesn't. That is the problem.

Bottom line to me, is that this is a reasonable call. Do I really think Tate had control...No. I think Tate got a hand on it at the same time Jennings caught it.

So I can understand the referee making the call in real time, and I can understand not overturning it. Far from the worst calls I've seen made by regular officials, and far from the worst calls in the Monday Night game, not even close to the worst calls in the fourth quarter.

Glengoyne · 09-26-2012, 04:53 PM

Ooops NM Back to boring week four discussion.

Nothing to see here.

Arles · 09-26-2012, 05:32 PM

Chris Mortenson just reported that the deal is in its final stages and the real refs will be back for week 4. Just one more week of this circus...

Suicane75 · 09-26-2012, 05:40 PM

What if the replacement refs decide on Sunday morning not to work? There careers are already screwed anyway.

Dutch · 09-26-2012, 05:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Arles

Chris Mortenson just reported that the deal is in its final stages and the real refs will be back for week 4. Just one more week of this circus...

w00t!

Thank God.

Desnudo · 09-26-2012, 06:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Glengoyne

My Comments in BOLD
The two hands on the ball and always had it and pulled it into his chest don't matter because I don't believe those are at all in dispute.

The official on the field ruled simultaneous possession. That means he believed that Tate's hand...that you can see clearly on the ball along with Jennings constituted control by Tate at the same time that Jennings controlled the ball.
For the on the field call in real time. I'll call that call decision by the ref plausible.

Anyone can correct me if I'm wrong, but for the call to be over ruled on replay don't you need to see incontrovertible evidence that Tate doesn't have possession at the same time as Jennings? That I still haven't seen. You can clearly see that Jennings has the ball and control, but you can't see that Tate doesn't. That is the problem.

Bottom line to me, is that this is a reasonable call. Do I really think Tate had control...No. I think Tate got a hand on it at the same time Jennings caught it.

So I can understand the referee making the call in real time, and I can understand not overturning it. Far from the worst calls I've seen made by regular officials, and far from the worst calls in the Monday Night game, not even close to the worst calls in the fourth quarter.

Matthean · 09-26-2012, 06:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wade moore

meh, we couldn't keep this to the week 3 thread?

Don't worry, this thread will be 4 pages of week 3 talk before a game is played.

stevew · 09-26-2012, 07:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Arles

Chris Mortenson just reported that the deal is in its final stages and the real refs will be back for week 4. Just one more week of this circus...

Week 4 starts tomorrow.

Dutch · 09-26-2012, 07:10 PM

I'll bet a crew is already there just waiting for the word.

kingfc22 · 09-26-2012, 07:17 PM

The NFL can say all they want about how the "right" call was made on MNF, but this sudden rush to get the regular refs out there this week is a clear admission of guilt IMO.

MizzouCowboy · 09-26-2012, 07:24 PM

Bills released long-time punter Brian Moorman, who was then signed by Dallas. I've always been a fan of Moorman, since he played at nearby Pitt State, and it'll be cool to see him punt for Dallas if Chris Jones (foot injury) can't play.

Lathum · 09-26-2012, 07:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kingfc22

The NFL can say all they want about how the "right" call was made on MNF, but this sudden rush to get the regular refs out there this week is a clear admission of guilt IMO.

Said the same thing to all the seahawks fans at work today. They disagreed

CrimsonFox · 09-27-2012, 01:53 AM

woowoo

NFL reaches tentative agreement with referees to end lockout | Fox News

Apathetic Lurker · 09-27-2012, 01:59 AM

Cowboys.com is now a gay dating site....lol

Article safe for public consumption

Cowboys.com is now a gay dating site | Shutdown Corner - Yahoo! Sports

gstelmack · 09-27-2012, 07:13 AM

Looking forward to the discussion of how awesome the officiating is this week once the games are over: no one complaining about blown calls, how much faster paced the games are. Everyone is going to be all happy and rosy now, right? Right?

Logan · 09-27-2012, 07:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gstelmack

Looking forward to the discussion of how awesome the officiating is this week once the games are over: no one complaining about blown calls, how much faster paced the games are. Everyone is going to be all happy and rosy now, right? Right?

The first time the real refs enforce a 27 yard personal foul or allow a coach two free timeouts to challenge plays, I promise to acknowledge them.

Blackadar · 09-27-2012, 07:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gstelmack

Looking forward to the discussion of how awesome the officiating is this week once the games are over: no one complaining about blown calls, how much faster paced the games are. Everyone is going to be all happy and rosy now, right? Right?

Just because one group was horrible doesn't mean that a mediocre group is beyond reproach.

molson · 09-27-2012, 08:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Blackadar

Just because one group was horrible doesn't mean that a mediocre group is beyond reproach.

But it does make you wonder where the "good" refs are, I'm still trying to figure that out. Where exactly are the refs that would satisfy people, why can't we find them? If the best ones people are desperate to get back are "mediocre", I think there's an issue with the the scale, it's unbalanced or something.

Blackadar · 09-27-2012, 08:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by molson

But it does make you wonder where the "good" refs are, I'm still trying to figure that out. Where exactly are the refs that would satisfy people, why can't we find them? If the best ones people are desperate to get back are "mediocre", I think there's an issue with the the scale, it's unbalanced or something.

I was semi-joking. Yeah, they're human and they'll screw up, but in general they do a good job. Still, that doesn't mean that people aren't allowed to (or won't) criticize their mistakes.

Desnudo · 09-27-2012, 08:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by molson

But it does make you wonder where the "good" refs are, I'm still trying to figure that out. Where exactly are the refs that would satisfy people, why can't we find them? If the best ones people are desperate to get back are "mediocre", I think there's an issue with the the scale, it's unbalanced or something.

robots

SnowMan · 09-27-2012, 08:17 AM

News Distribution Network - Shared Video

Dutch · 09-27-2012, 08:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Blackadar

I was semi-joking. Yeah, they're human and they'll screw up, but in general they do a good job. Still, that doesn't mean that people aren't allowed to (or won't) criticize their mistakes.

Right, it's not like we begged for instant replay because these guys are perfect. Hell, the rulebook isn't even perfect. The bottom line is that I'm glad the vets are back but I will blast them like crazy when they screw over my team.

Dr. Sak · 09-27-2012, 08:38 AM

For those interested...Gene Steratore will be the referee in tonight's game.

Blackadar · 09-27-2012, 08:49 AM

Oh, and on the Golden Tate thing...you can't give him possession when his hand isn't even on the ball but the defender has two hands on it and it's cradled in his chest.

09-26-2012, 02:42 PM	#55
Arles Grey Dog Software Join Date: Nov 2000 Location: Phoenix, AZ by way of Belleville, IL	I guess if people look at enough angles, they can eventually talk themselves into Tate have some sort of possession. But, in real time and when looking at the 3 main angles, here's what is clear: 1. Jennings is the first to secure both hands on the ball. 2. Jennings always has both hands on the ball. 3. Jennings is the only one to have the ball secured in his chest by the time they hit the ground. 4. Tate was always trying to grab at the ball through Jennings the entire play. I just don't see how anyone who saw this real time or even after a look at the replay had the first instinct to say "Yeah, Tate's the one who caught it". I think the side judge was late getting over and by the time he got there both guys were fighting for the ball. So, in his mind, it was simultaneous possession and he said TD. However, he never had a clear view at the catch in the air or when they hit the ground. The head ref then made that call because the side judge looked more definitive and when he reviewed it - I don't think he knew a) what was reviewable or b) the definition from the rule book of what a simultaneous catch was. So, in order not to cause waves, he rubber stamped the call on the field. The process is what bothers me and that's exactly what we get with replacement refs. They don't know the rules very well, they haven't developed instincts for the NFL game and they are unsure on how to act. You balance all this with them not wanting to look "stupid" or "weak" and there's a chance they will make calls that require more information/study with false bravado. If this exact catch happened with real refs, I guarantee the initial decision would have taken atleast 5-6 minutes to sort out. Then, the ref would have known the rules for simultaneous possession and what was reviewable when he looked at the replay. If after 4-5 minutes of discussion between the ref and the officials that saw the play and a full review (by someone who knew rules), the decision was made that it was a catch by Seattle - I feel like it would have atleast been more palatable. Honestly, I seriously doubt that would have happened as the back judge had a clear view and if he knew the NFL rules he would probably have been more adamant about it being an INT. Also, a real side judge would have known he was in a poor position to make the call and probably deferred or atleast conferenced with the back judge before making the TD signal. And, I guarantee a real ref wouldn't have made a quick TD call without talking to both the officials at the scene. Still, there's nothing that can be done at this point - but the fact that both the wrong judgement was made (slightly debatable, but it's a weak debate against it) combined with a terrible process being followed by refs who did not know the rules (for both replay and the catch itself) make it much harder to take as a fan. __________________ Developer of Bowl Bound College Football http://www.greydogsoftware.com Last edited by Arles : 09-26-2012 at 02:49 PM.

09-26-2012, 02:47 PM	#56
RendeR Coordinator Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: Buffalo, NY	If one convinces one's self of anything one can believe it. Again, you don't know for certain from any of the videos that I saw anyway, that Tates hand isn't between ball and body, which negates entirely the "secured to chest" issue. Its possibe that hand is in there. Maybe I missed a point where it wasn't but I haven't seen that yet. I didn't watch it and think Tate had it, I thought initially it was a pick, however once th replays started going (and the fact that one ref did call it a TD and he was at the best angle to see tates arms and hands) I could see that Tate MAY have indeed had it as well. Its not nearly black and while like anyone is trying to say, but in the lack of a black and white result you have what appears to be both people with the grab. Gotta love MNF giving us something to dissect for a few days eh? __________________ http://wotlabs.net/s...8/signature.png http://wotlabs.net/sig_dark/na/banichi18/signature.png

09-26-2012, 02:49 PM	#57
RendeR Coordinator Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: Buffalo, NY	The bigger point of the review is that none of the replays truly give concrete evidence that Tate Didn't have possession with Jennings, and without that he had to let the cal on the field stand. __________________ http://wotlabs.net/s...8/signature.png http://wotlabs.net/sig_dark/na/banichi18/signature.png

09-26-2012, 02:53 PM	#59
Arles Grey Dog Software Join Date: Nov 2000 Location: Phoenix, AZ by way of Belleville, IL	The first problem was the process for making the TD call was so sloppy it skewed the review in the wrong direction. There is no way the old guy sprinting down the sideline to get into position saw Tate make the catch. What he saw was Tate and Jennings both fighting for the ball on the ground when his slow ass got there and that's why he made the call. He should not have been the one making the call. He started out about 30-40 yards from the play, the back judge had to go about 10 and he was the one who saw the action in the air (when Jennings had it) and that's why he called touchback. But once the TD call was made on the field, I can see an argument that it should stand IF you didn't know that simultaneous possession can't occur once one player gains full control. And, IMO, I don't think the ref knew that rule when he reviewed it. If he did, there's no way you can look at from when Jennings has both hands on the ball at the top before Tate to where Tate's one arm falls off of it on the way down and not see that Jennings had clear possession before Tate. __________________ Developer of Bowl Bound College Football http://www.greydogsoftware.com Last edited by Arles : 09-26-2012 at 02:57 PM.

09-26-2012, 03:09 PM	#62
RendeR Coordinator Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: Buffalo, NY	I an see what your're saying, but just ike the left hand image you poste above, Jennig' hands weren't closed on the bll there, in this one you can't tel if they are closed on the ball or not. THen you look at the fact that this was at full speed and not stop motion like we get to see it and I can definitely see the issue with the calls. I do agree that all three official involved NEEDED to huddle up and discuss what each one saw and THEN make an on field call. AS you say each one had differing angles and views of it all. The speed of the NFL game really kicked their ass on this one. __________________ http://wotlabs.net/s...8/signature.png http://wotlabs.net/sig_dark/na/banichi18/signature.png

09-26-2012, 02:31 PM	#52
stevew Hall Of Famer Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: the yo'	I feel like they should have been handing out a lot more fines. It's ridiculous how jerky some of these receivers act when they try to get the bullshit PI called. Hell, I saw someone tugging on his facemask while he was being tackled to try to get a call made(I think this was maybe Matt Cassell). Santonio Holmes should perpetually be paying 5-10k a game for the way he acts.

09-26-2012, 03:10 PM	#64
stevew Hall Of Famer Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: the yo'	Agreed with Wade Beyond giving a fuck about a week 3 game

09-26-2012, 03:11 PM	#65
RendeR Coordinator Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: Buffalo, NY	That last image: There is white between the ball and jennings hand. it is NOT a secure possession there either. Its not the laces, the laces are further to the right in the image. So at this point neither guy has control yet and they're on their way down to the ground where it becomes a muddled mess. __________________ http://wotlabs.net/s...8/signature.png http://wotlabs.net/sig_dark/na/banichi18/signature.png

09-26-2012, 03:12 PM	#66
RendeR Coordinator Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: Buffalo, NY	Ok OK OK gah, this IS the week 4 thread anyway. __________________ http://wotlabs.net/s...8/signature.png http://wotlabs.net/sig_dark/na/banichi18/signature.png

09-26-2012, 03:16 PM	#67
Arles Grey Dog Software Join Date: Nov 2000 Location: Phoenix, AZ by way of Belleville, IL	Fair enough, so everyone can get back to discussing that Thursday night barn-burner of Baltimore-Cleveland now __________________ Developer of Bowl Bound College Football http://www.greydogsoftware.com

09-26-2012, 03:43 PM	#70
spleen1015 Coordinator Join Date: Sep 2003	I don't care if you talk about it here or the other thread. My only question is, why are we still talking about it like we're still arguing over what happened? Shit isn't going to change and everyone had said the same things 15 different ways with pics and video from 68 different angles. __________________ Why choose failure when success is an option?

09-26-2012, 03:59 PM	#73
CrimsonFox Head Coach Join Date: Dec 2009	I think I want to start watching football just to see all the bad calls!

09-26-2012, 04:13 PM	#75
sterlingice Hall Of Famer Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Back in Houston!	I love that my replacement result was "Movies that had Shaq in them" or something like that SI __________________ Houston Hippopotami, III.3: 20th Anniversary Thread - All former HT players are encouraged to check it out! Janos: "Only America could produce an imbecile of your caliber!" Freakazoid: "That's because we make lots of things better than other people!"

09-26-2012, 04:22 PM	#76
Dutch "Dutch" Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Tampa, FL	I typed in "Fun Facts about Cleveland" and got "Reviews of Anything starring Ben Affleck" This is really starting to piss me off. Last edited by Dutch : 09-26-2012 at 04:23 PM.

09-26-2012, 04:53 PM	#78
Glengoyne Grizzled Veteran Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Fresno, CA	Ooops NM Back to boring week four discussion. Nothing to see here.

09-26-2012, 05:32 PM	#79
Arles Grey Dog Software Join Date: Nov 2000 Location: Phoenix, AZ by way of Belleville, IL	Chris Mortenson just reported that the deal is in its final stages and the real refs will be back for week 4. Just one more week of this circus... __________________ Developer of Bowl Bound College Football http://www.greydogsoftware.com

09-26-2012, 05:40 PM	#80
Suicane75 Coordinator Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: NJ	What if the replacement refs decide on Sunday morning not to work? There careers are already screwed anyway.

09-26-2012, 07:10 PM	#85
Dutch "Dutch" Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Tampa, FL	I'll bet a crew is already there just waiting for the word.

09-26-2012, 07:17 PM	#86
kingfc22 Head Coach Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Morgan Hill, CA	The NFL can say all they want about how the "right" call was made on MNF, but this sudden rush to get the regular refs out there this week is a clear admission of guilt IMO. __________________ Fan of SF Giants, 49ers, Sharks, Arsenal

09-26-2012, 07:24 PM	#87
MizzouCowboy H.S. Freshman Team Join Date: Feb 2009	Bills released long-time punter Brian Moorman, who was then signed by Dallas. I've always been a fan of Moorman, since he played at nearby Pitt State, and it'll be cool to see him punt for Dallas if Chris Jones (foot injury) can't play.

09-27-2012, 01:53 AM	#89
CrimsonFox Head Coach Join Date: Dec 2009	woowoo NFL reaches tentative agreement with referees to end lockout \| Fox News

09-27-2012, 01:59 AM	#90
Apathetic Lurker College Prospect Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Buffalo,NY	Cowboys.com is now a gay dating site....lol Article safe for public consumption Cowboys.com is now a gay dating site \| Shutdown Corner - Yahoo! Sports

09-27-2012, 07:13 AM	#91
gstelmack Pro Starter Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Cary, NC	Looking forward to the discussion of how awesome the officiating is this week once the games are over: no one complaining about blown calls, how much faster paced the games are. Everyone is going to be all happy and rosy now, right? Right? __________________ -- Greg -- Author of various FOF utilities

09-27-2012, 08:17 AM	#97
SnowMan High School Varsity Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Georgia via Alaska via Washington	News Distribution Network - Shared Video

09-27-2012, 08:38 AM	#99
Dr. Sak Grizzled Veteran Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Stuck in Yinzerville, PA	For those interested...Gene Steratore will be the referee in tonight's game.

09-27-2012, 08:49 AM	#100
Blackadar Retired Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Fantasyland	Oh, and on the Golden Tate thing...you can't give him possession when his hand isn't even on the ball but the defender has two hands on it and it's cradled in his chest. Last edited by Blackadar : 09-27-2012 at 08:49 AM.

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