Biggest Trade in NBA history - Page 2

TazFTW · 08-03-2005, 04:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KWhit

What the hell?!

And wasn't there a point guard that came out of Duke named Jason Williams too?

Just another reason the NBA sucks. Too many guys named Jason Williams.

Yep, Jay Williams (changed his name some he would not be associated with either of the other two). I believe he's attempting a comeback from that motocycle accident he had.

DaddyTorgo · 08-03-2005, 04:57 PM

i don't understand how in these huge multi-team NBA trades one team always seems to make out as the identifiable "winner." I mean, Miami gets Walker AND Jason Williams AND James Posey?

and who does everyone else get...journeymen and unproven rookies and crap to waive. It just...it makes no sense to me. How could the Celts for example, not sign-and-trade Walker for Posey (with assorted other pieces thrown in to make the salaries work). Instead Miami ends up with all the proven players and everyone else ends up with JUNK (eddie jones a possible exception).

edit: and i don't consider the two second round picks the C's got to be anything. I mean really...aside from Carlos Boozer, who's the last PRODUCTIVE player ever drafted out of the second round (and I mean productive in the sense of "helped his team contend" not just "ate up minutes and put up mediocre numbers)? Grrrrr...Danny Ainge....grrrr

MrBug708 · 08-03-2005, 04:58 PM

In the NBA it's all about salary cap moves

pennywisesb · 08-03-2005, 04:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GoldenEagle

A back court of Stoudmire and Jones is nothing to scoff at.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shorty3281

In 1998.

Seriously, since when is Stoudamire and Jones a "great" backcourt? Thats probably one of the worst starting backcourts in the game talent-wise IMO.

rkmsuf · 08-03-2005, 05:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DaddyTorgo

i don't understand how in these huge multi-team NBA trades one team always seems to make out as the identifiable "winner." I mean, Miami gets Walker AND Jason Williams AND James Posey?

and who does everyone else get...journeymen and unproven rookies and crap to waive. It just...it makes no sense to me. How could the Celts for example, not sign-and-trade Walker for Posey (with assorted other pieces thrown in to make the salaries work). Instead Miami ends up with all the proven players and everyone else ends up with JUNK (eddie jones a possible exception).

mostly they are all junk

anyone who thinks walker is worth anything above the exception is way off. he isn't very good.

posey? meh, we'll see.

the c's made the best deal. they got money and a 5 million exception for a guy who was a free agent that nobody really wanted. he could have been signed for 5 mil but the unique chance to dump eddie jones and get williams made the heat trade for him.

jbmagic · 08-03-2005, 05:06 PM

the key was eddie jones had a huge contract for next season.

stevew · 08-03-2005, 06:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wolfpack

No, there really was a John "Hot Plate" Williams. While you know "Hot Rod" who played for Cleveland, there was another John Williams who played in the black holes known as Washington and the LA Clippers. He was supposed to be pretty good but had an utterly crappy work ethic that allowed him to balloon to close to 300 pounds. He was dubbed "Hot Plate" as a knock against him compared to "Hot Rod".

Both Hot Rod, and Hot Plate were always amongst the most overpaid players at any given point in time.

korme · 08-03-2005, 06:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TazFTW

Yep, Jay Williams (changed his name some he would not be associated with either of the other two). I believe he's attempting a comeback from that motocycle accident he had.

He's attempting a comeback under his given name of Jason too..

korme · 08-03-2005, 06:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wolfpack

No, there really was a John "Hot Plate" Williams. While you know "Hot Rod" who played for Cleveland, there was another John Williams who played in the black holes known as Washington and the LA Clippers. He was supposed to be pretty good but had an utterly crappy work ethic that allowed him to balloon to close to 300 pounds. He was dubbed "Hot Plate" as a knock against him compared to "Hot Rod".

Heh. Cool story.

JeeberD · 08-03-2005, 07:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TazFTW

Yep, Jay Williams (changed his name some he would not be associated with either of the other two). I believe he's attempting a comeback from that motocycle accident he had.

And then there's this Jason Williams (on defense), though I really doubt he has a shot at the NBA...

Karlifornia · 08-03-2005, 08:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shorty3281

He plays in the NBA, and he's married to Britney Spears. Score!

Neon_Chaos · 08-04-2005, 01:47 AM

Jason Williams will fall in line.

Think of it as the Jordan-Rodman Corollary. A superior alpha-male will fix any major screw-up of a team-mate. That's what Shaq is... a superior alpha-male.

daedalus · 08-04-2005, 01:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wolfpack

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shorty3281

You know it's really "Hot Rod", don't you?

No, there really was a John "Hot Plate" Williams. While you know "Hot Rod" who played for Cleveland, there was another John Williams who played in the black holes known as Washington and the LA Clippers. He was supposed to be pretty good but had an utterly crappy work ethic that allowed him to balloon to close to 300 pounds. He was dubbed "Hot Plate" as a knock against him compared to "Hot Rod".

Hot Plate played his college ball at LSU was INSANELY talented. 6'8 dude who handles and could pass like nobody's business. Absolutely zero work ethics, however, and never really achieved anything with his talent. Hot Rod was a solid 4 on a talented Cleveland team that eventually, unfortunately, imploded.

Quote:

Originally Posted by stevew

Both Hot Rod, and Hot Plate were always amongst the most overpaid players at any given point in time.

That's quite possible, although I think they played a bit before current day's ridiculous salaries. I liked Hot Rod, though. I thought he was a good solid player who worked hard and you never heard ugly things about off-the-court.

larrymcg421 · 08-04-2005, 02:52 AM

As a C's fan, I'm glad Walker is gone. He does have some talent, but is way too streaky. When it's time for a big game, you never know if he's gonna be 10 for 10 or 3 for 15. He provided a spark last season when he joined, but his numbers soon began to fall afterwards.

Neon_Chaos · 08-04-2005, 03:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by larrymcg421

As a C's fan, I'm glad Walker is gone. He does have some talent, but is way too streaky. When it's time for a big game, you never know if he's gonna be 10 for 10 or 3 for 15. He provided a spark last season when he joined, but his numbers soon began to fall afterwards.

I know... he is a very streaky player. Good thing the Heat have Shaq and Wade.

Izulde · 08-04-2005, 04:13 AM

Jason Williams looks gay. Are you sure he's married to Britney Spears?

BreizhManu · 08-04-2005, 08:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DaddyTorgo

edit: and i don't consider the two second round picks the C's got to be anything. I mean really...aside from Carlos Boozer, who's the last PRODUCTIVE player ever drafted out of the second round (and I mean productive in the sense of "helped his team contend" not just "ate up minutes and put up mediocre numbers)? Grrrrr...Danny Ainge....grrrr

Ginobili

Arles · 08-04-2005, 10:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DaddyTorgo

I mean really...aside from Carlos Boozer, who's the last PRODUCTIVE player ever drafted out of the second round (and I mean productive in the sense of "helped his team contend" not just "ate up minutes and put up mediocre numbers)?

Gilbert Arenas, Kyle Korver, Mehmet Okur, Earl Watson, Bobby Simmons, Michael Redd and Brian Cardinal. And that's only counting 2000-2003.

Eaglesfan27 · 08-04-2005, 10:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Arles

Gilbert Arenas, Kyle Korver, Mehmet Okur, Earl Watson, Bobby Simmons, Michael Redd and Brian Cardinal. And that's only counting 2000-2003.

As a Sixer's fan I would dispute that Korver claim. Sure, he puts up some points, but his all around game is not that good and is more of a hinderance to the team many times.

Arles · 08-04-2005, 11:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Eaglesfan27

As a Sixer's fan I would dispute that Korver claim. Sure, he puts up some points, but his all around game is not that good and is more of a hinderance to the team many times.

Sixers just signed him to a $25 million deal. That normally indicates he's a somewhat productive player (which was what the poster asked).

Neon_Chaos · 08-05-2005, 12:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DaddyTorgo

I mean really...aside from Carlos Boozer, who's the last PRODUCTIVE player ever drafted out of the second round (and I mean productive in the sense of "helped his team contend" not just "ate up minutes and put up mediocre numbers)? Grrrrr...Danny Ainge....grrrr

Off the top of my head... Manu Ginobili, Gilbert Arenas, Bobby Simmons, Rashard Lewis.

Sublime 2 · 08-05-2005, 01:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DaddyTorgo

edit: and i don't consider the two second round picks the C's got to be anything. I mean really...aside from Carlos Boozer, who's the last PRODUCTIVE player ever drafted out of the second round (and I mean productive in the sense of "helped his team contend" not just "ate up minutes and put up mediocre numbers)? Grrrrr...Danny Ainge....grrrr

Danny Ainge is very high on Justin Reed, Ryan Gomes, and Orien Greene (though from what i hear he tried to get out of his commitment to Orien). Reed proved like he could be a quality backup to Pierce at the 3 spot during summer camp (take that for what it's worth). He's a solid defender (shut down McGrady a few times last year) though his offense needed some work, and it seems like he improved on that this summer. If I had any GM to draft mid-second rounders i would pick the Spurs GM followed by Ainge (admitting obvious bias). I think Ainge in the past 3 years has drafted exceptionally well! Banks could(!) be solid "blitz" pg, Perkins, a big bruiser; Jefferson, future all-star; Allen, strong defender; West, shoot first but solid pg; Gerald Green, Steal of 05 draft (nothing do w/ Ainge so much); Gomes, solid 3-4 tweener; and Oriene, who i know nothing about but Ainge loves. I really see no busts since Ainge came aboard. Even Brandon Hunter who proved to be a more than adequate rebounder (though nothing else). I know second rounders are nothing to bank on but I believe Ainge to be one of the best drafters around these days.

P.S. I am a complete homer! GREEN 17!!!!

JeeberD · 08-05-2005, 09:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Neon_Chaos

Off the top of my head... Manu Ginobili, Gilbert Arenas, Bobby Simmons, Rashard Lewis.

Cutino Mobley

Pacersfan46 · 08-05-2005, 09:31 AM

To add to the list of 2nd rounders:

Nick Van Exel, Stephen Jackson, Jeff McInnis, Malik Rose.

I missed that part of the post, or I would have jumped on that a long time ago. Besides that, trust in Danny Ainge. Thinking about the roster he was handed, and what he's made out of it .... I'd trust him.

Eaglesfan27 · 08-05-2005, 09:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Arles

Sixers just signed him to a $25 million deal. That normally indicates he's a somewhat productive player (which was what the poster asked).

Or it indicates the Sixer's management is stupid sometimes. I believe the poster asked if the guy helped his team compete and not just put up mediocre numbers. I'd contend that Korver doesn't help his team compete due to his poor defense. I hope he improves and proves me wrong and earns that contract, but I wouldn't count on it.

Eaglesfan27 · 08-05-2005, 09:58 AM

Actually, I'll take it back about Korver. I was just reviewing his defensive numbers on a game by game basis over on NBA.com and he did show defensive improvement last year. Hopefully, he'll continue to improve some defensively and become a more well rounded defender making him worthy of that contract.

Arles · 08-05-2005, 11:09 AM

I like Korver. He's certainly not a "star", but he's a very good shooter, decent defender and a strong NBA role player. Seems like a "Brent Barry"-type without the skills as a ball-handler, but a little better defense. At a minimum, he's very good value for a second round pick.

Gary Gorski · 08-05-2005, 12:53 PM

Korver would be much more valuable if a certain alleged power forward would actually play in the post instead of standing around on the perimiter. Korver would be a great fit on a team like Miami - two dominant scoring threats and with one being Shaq you know they have to double down - if he's open Korver can shoot all day. His problems come when someone is actually defending him and he has to work to get open or get his shot off.

jbmagic · 08-05-2005, 01:30 PM

Korver looks like the Kelso from the The 70's show.

rkmsuf · 08-05-2005, 01:30 PM

Word on the street is Garnett to Detroit for both Wallaces and two first round picks.

Eaglesfan27 · 08-05-2005, 01:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rkmsuf

Word on the street is Garnett to Detroit for both Wallaces and two first round picks.

Wow. That would be something to see. If that happened, who do you think comes out ahead? I'd have to say Minnesota, particularly since Garnett has seemed to have too much trouble getting along with teammates and the two Wallaces have proven they can win a championship together. Throw in 2 first round draft picks..

DaddyTorgo · 08-05-2005, 01:45 PM

fine fine. i got served. there are productive second rounders. just goes to show that i don't know my basketball drafting all that well. prolly cuz i am not THAT into following the game at the pro level

MikeVic · 08-05-2005, 02:14 PM

Pistons want to get rid of both Wallaces because Darko is ready to EXPLODE on the court!!!

stevew · 08-05-2005, 02:26 PM

To some extent, trading Ben Wallace now would be a blessing for Detroit. He's a free agent next year, and will surely want a ton of money. With KG, the pistons would be favored to win the title i would think.

korme · 08-05-2005, 02:26 PM

Wow, huge rumored deal but I don't know why Detroit would do it. I mean, why break up a team that has led you to 2 straight NBA Finals with one title? Don't get me wrong, Garnett is possibly the best, most versatile big man in the game.. but if it ain't broke, don't fix it..

Wolfpack · 08-05-2005, 02:42 PM

Anyone think Flip Saunders has a hand in this if it happens? Wonder what KG thinks about the possibility of being reunited with his old coach?

Pacersfan46 · 08-05-2005, 04:39 PM

I've heard a rumor in Indy about Artest, and Jermaine O'Neal for KG.

Who knows.

jbmagic · 08-05-2005, 04:40 PM

i heard a rumor in LA about Odom and Kwame Brown for KG

who knows

Arles · 08-05-2005, 04:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jbmagic

i heard a rumor in LA about Odom and Kwame Brown for KG

who knows

That would be the dumbest move in the history of the NBA for Minnesota. No chance that happens.

MikeVic · 08-05-2005, 04:59 PM

I've heard a rumour in Toronto about Rose and Araujo for KG.

Who knows.

jbmagic · 08-05-2005, 05:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MikeVic

I've heard a rumour in Toronto about Rose and Araujo for KG.

Who knows.

thanks for playing along

Arles · 08-05-2005, 05:14 PM

Come on, JBM, I need some smileys on a Friday afternoon.

08-03-2005, 04:57 PM	#52
DaddyTorgo Hall Of Famer Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Massachusetts	i don't understand how in these huge multi-team NBA trades one team always seems to make out as the identifiable "winner." I mean, Miami gets Walker AND Jason Williams AND James Posey? and who does everyone else get...journeymen and unproven rookies and crap to waive. It just...it makes no sense to me. How could the Celts for example, not sign-and-trade Walker for Posey (with assorted other pieces thrown in to make the salaries work). Instead Miami ends up with all the proven players and everyone else ends up with JUNK (eddie jones a possible exception). edit: and i don't consider the two second round picks the C's got to be anything. I mean really...aside from Carlos Boozer, who's the last PRODUCTIVE player ever drafted out of the second round (and I mean productive in the sense of "helped his team contend" not just "ate up minutes and put up mediocre numbers)? Grrrrr...Danny Ainge....grrrr Last edited by DaddyTorgo : 08-03-2005 at 05:03 PM.

08-04-2005, 01:47 AM	#62
Neon_Chaos Pro Starter Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Parañaque, Philippines	Jason Williams will fall in line. Think of it as the Jordan-Rodman Corollary. A superior alpha-male will fix any major screw-up of a team-mate. That's what Shaq is... a superior alpha-male. __________________ Come and see.

08-04-2005, 02:52 AM	#64
larrymcg421 Head Coach Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Georgia	As a C's fan, I'm glad Walker is gone. He does have some talent, but is way too streaky. When it's time for a big game, you never know if he's gonna be 10 for 10 or 3 for 15. He provided a spark last season when he joined, but his numbers soon began to fall afterwards. __________________ Top 10 Songs of the Year 1955-Present (1976 Added) Franchise Portfolio Draft Winner Fictional Character Draft Winner Television Family Draft Winner Build Your Own Hollywood Studio Draft Winner

08-04-2005, 04:13 AM	#66
Izulde Head Coach Join Date: Sep 2004	Jason Williams looks gay. Are you sure he's married to Britney Spears? __________________ 2006 Golden Scribe Nominee 2006 Golden Scribe Winner Best Non-Sport Dynasty: May Our Reign Be Green and Golden (CK Dynasty) Rookie Writer of the Year Dynasty of the Year: May Our Reign Be Green and Golden (CK Dynasty)

08-05-2005, 09:58 AM	#76
Eaglesfan27 Hall Of Famer Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: New Jersey	Actually, I'll take it back about Korver. I was just reviewing his defensive numbers on a game by game basis over on NBA.com and he did show defensive improvement last year. Hopefully, he'll continue to improve some defensively and become a more well rounded defender making him worthy of that contract. __________________ Retired GM of the eNFL 2007 Super Bowl Champion Philadelphia Eagles (19-0 record.) GM of the WOOF 2006 Doggie Bowl Champion Atlantic City Gamblers. GM of the IHOF 2019 and 2022 IHOF Bowl Champion Asheville Axemen.

08-03-2005, 04:58 PM	#53
MrBug708 Head Coach Join Date: Apr 2001 Location: Whittier	In the NBA it's all about salary cap moves

08-03-2005, 05:06 PM	#56
jbmagic Pro Starter Join Date: Apr 2004	the key was eddie jones had a huge contract for next season.

08-05-2005, 09:31 AM	#74
Pacersfan46 H.S. Freshman Team Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Indianapolis	To add to the list of 2nd rounders: Nick Van Exel, Stephen Jackson, Jeff McInnis, Malik Rose. I missed that part of the post, or I would have jumped on that a long time ago. Besides that, trust in Danny Ainge. Thinking about the roster he was handed, and what he's made out of it .... I'd trust him.

08-05-2005, 11:09 AM	#77
Arles Grey Dog Software Join Date: Nov 2000 Location: Phoenix, AZ by way of Belleville, IL	I like Korver. He's certainly not a "star", but he's a very good shooter, decent defender and a strong NBA role player. Seems like a "Brent Barry"-type without the skills as a ball-handler, but a little better defense. At a minimum, he's very good value for a second round pick.

08-05-2005, 12:53 PM	#78
Gary Gorski Wolverine Studios Join Date: Oct 2003	Korver would be much more valuable if a certain alleged power forward would actually play in the post instead of standing around on the perimiter. Korver would be a great fit on a team like Miami - two dominant scoring threats and with one being Shaq you know they have to double down - if he's open Korver can shoot all day. His problems come when someone is actually defending him and he has to work to get open or get his shot off. __________________ Wolverine Studios http://www.wolverinestudios.com

08-05-2005, 01:30 PM	#79
jbmagic Pro Starter Join Date: Apr 2004	Korver looks like the Kelso from the The 70's show.

08-05-2005, 01:30 PM	#80
rkmsuf Head Coach Join Date: Dec 2001	Word on the street is Garnett to Detroit for both Wallaces and two first round picks. __________________ "Don't you have homes?" -- Judge Smales

08-05-2005, 01:45 PM	#82
DaddyTorgo Hall Of Famer Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Massachusetts	fine fine. i got served. there are productive second rounders. just goes to show that i don't know my basketball drafting all that well. prolly cuz i am not THAT into following the game at the pro level

08-05-2005, 02:14 PM	#83
MikeVic Head Coach Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Hometown of Canada	Pistons want to get rid of both Wallaces because Darko is ready to EXPLODE on the court!!!

08-05-2005, 02:26 PM	#84
stevew Hall Of Famer Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: the yo'	To some extent, trading Ben Wallace now would be a blessing for Detroit. He's a free agent next year, and will surely want a ton of money. With KG, the pistons would be favored to win the title i would think.

08-05-2005, 02:26 PM	#85
korme Go Reds Join Date: May 2001 Location: Bloodbuzz Ohio	Wow, huge rumored deal but I don't know why Detroit would do it. I mean, why break up a team that has led you to 2 straight NBA Finals with one title? Don't get me wrong, Garnett is possibly the best, most versatile big man in the game.. but if it ain't broke, don't fix it..

08-05-2005, 02:42 PM	#86
Wolfpack Pro Rookie Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Raleigh, NC	Anyone think Flip Saunders has a hand in this if it happens? Wonder what KG thinks about the possibility of being reunited with his old coach?

08-05-2005, 04:39 PM	#87
Pacersfan46 H.S. Freshman Team Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Indianapolis	I've heard a rumor in Indy about Artest, and Jermaine O'Neal for KG. Who knows.

08-05-2005, 04:40 PM	#88
jbmagic Pro Starter Join Date: Apr 2004	i heard a rumor in LA about Odom and Kwame Brown for KG who knows

08-05-2005, 04:59 PM	#90
MikeVic Head Coach Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Hometown of Canada	I've heard a rumour in Toronto about Rose and Araujo for KG. Who knows.

08-05-2005, 05:14 PM	#92
Arles Grey Dog Software Join Date: Nov 2000 Location: Phoenix, AZ by way of Belleville, IL	Come on, JBM, I need some smileys on a Friday afternoon.

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