Who will be the 1st overall pick in 2009?

[stevew]

With 3 picks in the top 33, dare I say the LOLions are in good shape to rebuild on the fly?

[GrantDawg]

Stafford would fit well in Detroit.....as the next Joey Harrington.

[Matthean]

Originally Posted by Honolulu_Blue

I would think they would look at defensive end. Apparently there's that guy out of Georgia Tech, Michael Johnson, who is supposed to be pretty good. I have no idea what, if anything, he's done this year.

The problem is that he's not exactly a guy you take at the 1.1 spot, and the 1.1 spot is hell to trade out of. They could easily take him at 1.5. The team going from 1.5 to 1.1 has to basically add in a 1.10 pick type amount of value to make the deal. You basically have to do multiple trade downs with likely earning less value on your trades just to position yourself to get the guy at the right value, but then he's not really at the right value since you traded some of that away. Worse case scenario for Detroit is getting the first pick since they can skip on the first couple of picks anyway.

IMO, Backus sucks, is 31 years old, has no backup in the works and Gosder Cherilus can't seem to perform well enough to start on a team that has nothing to lose by starting it's rookies. Granted this team's ability to play people who should be starting isn't exactly the best either, ie Culpepper vs. Stanton. If Gosder could show enough promise as a starter then there is that outside chance he could eventually get switched to LT, which would take off some of the line burden, but as of right now I'm not seeing it.

[Honolulu_Blue]

Originally Posted by stevew

With 3 picks in the top 33, dare I say the LOLions are in good shape to rebuild on the fly?

If you were talking about any other team other than the Lions, I would say "yes". But given it's the Lions, probably not. The absence of Millen restores some faith, but only very little at this point. It's been a dark, dark decade thus far.

[Matthean]

Originally Posted by stevew

With 3 picks in the top 33, dare I say the LOLions are in good shape to rebuild on the fly?

And their GM is?

[DeToxRox]

Originally Posted by Matthean

The problem is that he's not exactly a guy you take at the 1.1 spot, and the 1.1 spot is hell to trade out of. They could easily take him at 1.5. The team going from 1.5 to 1.1 has to basically add in a 1.10 pick type amount of value to make the deal. You basically have to do multiple trade downs with likely earning less value on your trades just to position yourself to get the guy at the right value, but then he's not really at the right value since you traded some of that away. Worse case scenario for Detroit is getting the first pick since they can skip on the first couple of picks anyway.

IMO, Backus sucks, is 31 years old, has no backup in the works and Gosder Cherilus can't seem to perform well enough to start on a team that has nothing to lose by starting it's rookies. Granted this team's ability to play people who should be starting isn't exactly the best either, ie Culpepper vs. Stanton. If Gosder could show enough promise as a starter then there is that outside chance he could eventually get switched to LT, which would take off some of the line burden, but as of right now I'm not seeing it.

Goz has looked solid as hell the last few weeks. Beyond the penalties, he has been really good. I've been lucky to see some streams of the last couple home games, and he hasn't been bad at all considering the flux he is in. I am not ready to annoint him a pro bowler, but I do think they got it right with that pick.

[allpro10050]

Originally Posted by Matthean

And their GM is?

martin mayhew

[Matthean]

Haven't been watching because in all honesty it's just difficult to watch a team perform that poorly on a weekly basis at this point. I know he was starting and then got moved to back up and ESPN still list him as such. I continue to shake my head at the total lack of ability to run a team that this coaching staff has. There is no excuse for people like Goz and Stanton to not be getting significant playing time at this point.

[Honolulu_Blue]

Originally Posted by Matthean

The problem is that he's not exactly a guy you take at the 1.1 spot, and the 1.1 spot is hell to trade out of. They could easily take him at 1.5. The team going from 1.5 to 1.1 has to basically add in a 1.10 pick type amount of value to make the deal. You basically have to do multiple trade downs with likely earning less value on your trades just to position yourself to get the guy at the right value, but then he's not really at the right value since you traded some of that away. Worse case scenario for Detroit is getting the first pick since they can skip on the first couple of picks anyway.

That does seem to be the problem. The top prospects appear to be OT. They have a need there, but they invested in that position with their first pick last year and still have Backus.

Unless someone blows everyone away at the combine or something, the Lions will be in a fix. Who would want to trade up with them and spend all of that money and give up extra picks? It's super early now, but at this time I just don't see there being a player out there that any one team would covet so much that they would be willing to make such a deal.

Originally Posted by Matthean

IMO, Backus sucks, is 31 years old, has no backup in the works and Gosder Cherilus can't seem to perform well enough to start on a team that has nothing to lose by starting it's rookies. Granted this team's ability to play people who should be starting isn't exactly the best either, ie Culpepper vs. Stanton. If Gosder could be show enough promise as a starter then there is that outside chance he could eventually get switched to LT, which would take off some of the line burden, but as of right now I'm not seeing it.

I don't think Backus is all that good either, but they are paying him a ton of money. I don't think the Lions can afford to sit the #1 or #2 pick overall and I don't know if the Lions can afford to cut one of the few semi-decent players (Backus) on the team. It's possible they will, but that's just creating yet another hole in a team full of holes.

I don't think Backus has much, if any, trade value either.

I don't there's much chance of Gosder switching to LT. He struggled in that position during his senior year at BC. It's either RT or guard for him. More likely the former than the latter. He's been a bit better these last few weeks, but that bar is very, very low.

The Lions definitely need to address the offensive line and pretty much the entire defense with this draft and in free agency.

They also may need to address the QB situation, unless they feel that the Culpepper/Stanton duo is good enough to carry them next year.

[stevew]

I didn't really think anyone thought Gosder would be a good pro LT. But a lot thought he had the skill set to be a brutal run blocker at RT, aka the type of road grater you can build a fearsome running attack behind. But maybe that was just me.

[Matthean]

Originally Posted by allpro10050

martin mayhew

Well good, now I can sleep better at night knowing they have a top flight GM. Yes, I know who it is, but he has a minimal track record so far and may not even be the guy GMing the Lions draft. Pulling off the trade with Dallas was awesome, but bringing in Culpepper brought pretty much nothing to the table.

[DeToxRox]

Originally Posted by stevew

I didn't really think anyone thought Gosder would be a good pro LT. But a lot thought he had the skill set to be a brutal run blocker at RT, aka the type of road grater you can build a fearsome running attack behind. But maybe that was just me.

Exactly.

[st.cronin]

What about Moreno for the Lions? I think he's a better prospect than either Peterson (who had injury concerns) or McFadden.

[DeToxRox]

Originally Posted by st.cronin

What about Moreno for the Lions? I think he's a better prospect than either Peterson (who had injury concerns) or McFadden.

Kevin Smith is the RB of the future .. at least for now. He looks good in spurts, but with how awful our OL is and how early/often we're behind, we never get to see what he can do.

Honestly, if we don't go OT with the first pick I'll be shocked. The only way we might not is if we hire a guy who hasn't been a GM before and wants to make a pick to stamp himself as GM, in which case it'd be a QB.

God help us.

[DeToxRox]

Originally Posted by st.cronin

What about Moreno for the Lions? I think he's a better prospect than either Peterson (who had injury concerns) or McFadden.

Dola .. imo McCoy is the best RB prospect in the draft if he comes out. He plays and looks like an NFL RB.

[Matthean]

Originally Posted by st.cronin

What about Moreno for the Lions? I think he's a better prospect than either Peterson (who had injury concerns) or McFadden.

He would have to be at best the pick they get from Dallas, and even at that point I'm not sure how much he helps them. Outside of how bad that D is, the line really does suck, so no RB is going to get much out of it. They already are starting a rookie at RB and went and got Rudi.

[Sun Tzu]

So I guess Colt McCoy and Graham Harrel are both waiting until next year to declare themselves eligible for the draft?

[DeToxRox]

Originally Posted by Sun Tzu

So I guess Colt McCoy and Graham Harrel are both waiting until next year to declare themselves eligible for the draft?

McCoy said he was going to stay. Not sure on Harrell.

[st.cronin]

Harrell is a senior, I think.

[Sun Tzu]

Just checked, Harrell is a Sr. I don't know that he'd be worth the top overall spot, but I'd pick him up in the mid-late rounds and see if he can develop into something special. Not every single "system quarterback" in college is going to turn into Alex Smith.

[GrantDawg]

Originally Posted by Sun Tzu

Just checked, Harrell is a Sr. I don't know that he'd be worth the top overall spot, but I'd pick him up in the mid-late rounds and see if he can develop into something special. Not every single "system quarterback" in college is going to turn into Alex Smith.

True. And every 6'6 QB with a rocket arm is not going to be the next John Elway. There is more to it than just size and arm strength (though both help).

[Samdari]

Originally Posted by Honolulu_Blue

The top prospects appear to be OT. They have a need there, but they invested in that position with their first pick last year and still have Backus.

Originally Posted by Honolulu_Blue

I don't think Backus is all that good either, but they are paying him a ton of money.

Originally Posted by Honolulu_Blue

I don't think Backus has much, if any, trade value either.

This does not make sense. Someone "who is not that good" or "has no trade value" is not someone who keeps you from drafting a player at his position. If the best player in this draft is an LT, they would be best served taking him. Backus' contract probably has a high salary at this point, so he'd be considered for a cap cut anyway.

I am baffled at them not playing Stanton right now though. They should find out if they have anything there before making that #1 pick.

[VPI97]

Originally Posted by DeToxRox

Dola .. imo McCoy is the best RB prospect in the draft if he comes out. He plays and looks like an NFL RB.

+1

[Honolulu_Blue]

Originally Posted by Samdari

This does not make sense. Someone "who is not that good" or "has no trade value" is not someone who keeps you from drafting a player at his position. If the best player in this draft is an LT, they would be best served taking him. Backus' contract probably has a high salary at this point, so he'd be considered for a cap cut anyway.

In isolation, no, it doesn't make sense. When you look at the rest of the Lions' roster it sort of does make sense for all the reasons I state above. To sum up: Given all the giant, gaping holes the Lions have all over the field, improving the LT position is really more of a luxury than a need.

Should they look at getting help there? Most definitely. Will it be in the form of the first or second pick overall? I dobut it.

Also, what we think of Jeff Backus isn't necessarily what the Lions think of Jeff Backus. He and Railoa are considered the cornerstones of the offensive line. A very, very bad offensive line.

Originally Posted by Samdari

I am baffled at them not playing Stanton right now though. They should find out if they have anything there before making that #1 pick.

[st.cronin]

Here's my first mock draft, based on the projected standings done at football frontier:


1. Detroit (0-16) - Andre Smith, OT, Alabama
2. Seattle (2-14) - Michael Crabtree, WR, Texas Tech
3. Kansas City (2-14) - Matt Stafford, QB, Georgia
4. Cincinnati (2-13-1) - Aaron Curry, OLB, Wake Forest
5. Oakland (3-13) - Michael Oher, OT, Mississippi
6. St. Louis (4-12) - Malcolm Jenkins, CB, Ohio State
7. Jacksonville (4-12) - James Laurinaitis, LB, Ohio State
8. San Francisco (5-11) - Brian Orakpo, DE/OLB, Texas
9. Cleveland (5-11) - Knowshon Moreno, RB, Georgia
10. San Diego (6-10) - Taylor Mays, FS, USC
11. Buffalo (7-9) - Michael Johnson, DE/OLB, Georgia Tech
12. Green Bay (7-9) - Eugene Monroe, OT, Virginia
13. Houston (7-9) - William Moore, FS, Missouri
14. New Orleans (8-8) - Vontae Davis, CB, Illinois
15. Detroit (from Dallas [8-8]) - Brian Cushing, OLB, USC
16. Arizona (9-7) - Chris Wells, RB, Ohio State
17. Philadelphia (9-6-1) - SenDerrick Marks, DT, Auburn
18. Miami (10-6) - Rey Maualuga, ILB, USC
19. New England (10-6) - Brandon Spikes, ILB, Florida
20. Atlanta (10-6) - Terrence Cody, DT, Alabama
21. Chicago (10-6) - Greg Hardy, DE, Mississippi
22. Denver (10-6) - Darrius Heyward-Bey, WR, Maryland
23. Washington (10-6) - George Selvie, DE, South Florida
24. Minnesota (10-6) - Alphonso Smith, CB, Wake Forest
25. New York Jets (11-5) - Myron Rolle, SS, Florida State
26. Tampa Bay (11-5) - Jeremy Maclin, WR, Missouri
27. Indianapolis (11-5) - Peria Jerry, DT, Mississippi
28. Pittsburgh (11-5) - Jason Smith, OT, Baylor
29. Baltimore (12-4) - Darius Butler, CB, Connecticut
30. Philadelphia (from Carolina [12-4]) - Javon Ringer, RB, Michigan State
31. New York Giants (14-2) - Sean Weatherspoon, OLB, Missouri
32. Tennessee (15-1) - Alex Mack, C, California

I expect to go 0 for 32 with these picks. There is no consensus yet as to who is the top OT. I have not watched Eugene Monroe at all this year, but I think of Smith and Oher I like Smith a little bit more. At this point I think he's the most likely to go #1.

I believe Detroit will go either OT, DE, or QB with the first pick. That means either Andre Smith, Michael Oher, Eugene Monroe, Brian Orakpo, or Matt Stafford.

If Sam Bradford comes out he will almost certainly be a 1st round pick. Colt McCoy has said he will not come out, and I don't think Sanchez or Tebow will, either - those guys probably wouldn't be 1st round picks, anyway, although Tebow might.

[JPhillips]

I'd be shocked if Mike Brown passed up Crabtree, Wells, Moreno, Oher, and Monre to pick a LB. Brown loves offense and with the struggles this year I can't imagine them picking defense if they have a top five pick.

[Neuqua]

Larry English eats people.

[Galaxy]

Isn't Crabtree staying at Tech for another year?

[st.cronin]

Originally Posted by Galaxy

Isn't Crabtree staying at Tech for another year?

Doubtful, no matter what he says. His draft position will only get worse, and he'll be breaking in a new QB next year.

[Apathetic Lurker]

Lions is what the Lions is: Mike Stafford with 1st..

[Thomkal]

love your mock drafts Cronin, even when I disagree with them. Wow that would be wild if Arizona picks #16 after winning the West. They really need to change that to all playoff teams picking after the non-playoff teams.

You'll remember I called for the Cardinals to draft a RB in the first round last year in your mock drafts, and the need is even more apparent and desperate now. Not sure I want Wells with his injury history though.

I think Detroit, like Atlanta last year has to go QB with their pick. They likely will have a new coach and unless that coach likes Stanton or the other guy whose name I can't spell (sorry Culpepper but you aren't the answer), I think the coach will want a QB he likes for his system. Will Kitna be back with them next season? I suppose that might influence who they pick.

KC is also in an interesting position. Many people are calling for my boy Thigpen to be the starter next season including Tony Gonzales. Current thinking amongst many Chiefs fans is that they don't need to draft a QB in the first round thanks to Thigpen's presence. I think that's crazy and I'm a Thigpen fan. I think the Chiefs have to go QB if there's an elite franchise QB there at their spot, cause Thigpen is unlikely to ever be that.

How about St. Louis going for a QB with their pick? Do they have any young guys on their roster? I don't think Bulger/Green are going to be around much longer.

[Honolulu_Blue]

Originally Posted by Thomkal

I think Detroit, like Atlanta last year has to go QB with their pick. They likely will have a new coach and unless that coach likes Stanton or the other guy whose name I can't spell (sorry Culpepper but you aren't the answer), I think the coach will want a QB he likes for his system.

Orlovsky.

Originally Posted by Thomkal

Will Kitna be back with them next season?

No.

[Thomkal]

thanks for the spelling HB, I would have slaughtered it

[miked]

Need to see Kenny Britt in the 1st round

[johnnyshaka]

I don't think the Eagles take a DT in the first seeing as they already have two recent first rounders (Patterson and Bunkley) starting and their first pick last season (Laws) rotates in.

O-Line has to be the focus with the first pick and then I think RB depth...therefore like the Ringer pick. But I think TE is another area they may look to upgrade and Gresham looks like he's the top TE with both great size and speed.

[JPhillips]

I imagine the Eagles will end up with Stacy Andrews at tackle next year as he won't sign with Cincy and has said many times he'd like to play with his brother.

[Travis]

If he's there when they pick, I really can't imagine Seattle passes on Crabtree. I'm hoping they're picking a bit further down after a couple of late season wins (ideally 5th or 6th) and while this may cost them Crabtree, at least it would get them out of the ridiculous rookie contract picks (well maybe not entirely, but I do hope they're not picking top 3).

[Logan]

Originally Posted by miked

Need to see Kenny Britt in the 1st round

I think there's a chance he could run a flat 4.4, and if he does that and Crabtree times as slow as he is expected...allow me to predict him as the first WR taken.

[miked]

That would be cool, but I didn't think he was THAT fast. Funny, during the UL game, the ESPN people kept talking about how Kenny Britt needs to come back for his senior year because he's not a burner and could use some extra weight. I was thinking, sure, he's leading the country in receiving, there might be teams throwing around money this offseason because of the cap situation, and he'll likely have a QB throwing to him that hasn't played a college game. Sure he'll come back to add 10 pounds and hone his route running.

[Logan]

He ran a laser-timed 4.5 coming out of HS, and he sure can pull away from DBs. I think his size makes him look slower than he really is. We'll see.

[Sun Tzu]

At best the Niners will pick 10th/11th. There's no way they're going to lose all three of their remaining games, especially considering one of them is against the Rams. 8-8 is possible, 7-9 is likely, 6-10 is unlikely, 5-11 is extremely unlikely.

[RendeR]

Originally Posted by Sun Tzu

There is absolutely no possible way that Tim Tebow will go #1 overall.

Honestly, knowing how awful the Lions O-line really is I could see them going with Tebow. he can take a pounding and still play well. he's huge and can run whenever necessary. He's not the most accurate guy but he's shown flashes of geting better there this season.

Originally Posted by Schmidty

By the way, I know that won't happen, but I think he'll end up being one of the best players in the draft, retrospectively.

I really love the way Ringer Runs.

Originally Posted by JPhillips

No way Mike Brown throws a ton of money at a third DE. I wouldn't be surprised to see Crabtree as the pick if he's available.

I don't see the bengals taking a WR number 1, first off he may well not be there when they pick as other teams ahead of them have bigger needs at wideout and secondly with that injury he's gonna drop in many pepole's draft lists. 3rd and probably most importantly, the Bengals have a couple of young guns at WR who look like they may well step up and be able to fill the shoes of housh and Chad. I hope to god they trade Chad and resign Housh. I want TJ to teach the young guys his work ethic and determination.

Originally Posted by JPhillips

I agree from the outside, but I don't know if Mike Brown throws huge money at a tackle when the team will likely have Jones, Whitworth and Collins already. Brown has always been one to make a run for skill positions.

This is where I'm perplexed. I like Collins attitude, we need that kind of firey play on the line. I'm just worried that Levi is a flop, having been given the chance to take over at LT he's really dropped the ball and also had injury issues. I'd really like to see them take a tackle with the first pick, but knowing Brown, I half expect him to take Beanie Wells or Ringer and subject yet another great RB prospect to the Bengals curse.

Originally Posted by JPhillips

I'd be shocked if Mike Brown passed up Crabtree, Wells, Moreno, Oher, and Monre to pick a LB. Brown loves offense and with the struggles this year I can't imagine them picking defense if they have a top five pick.

I agree here, I don't expect them to take another LB. Without the injuries we had this season our defense would be playing even stronger than they are. People seem to be ignoring the total lack of offense this team has. Our defense, given even a middle of the pack offensive play, would be in the top 12-16 in the league. They're just getting no support and they're beat to hell.

Originally Posted by JPhillips

I imagine the Eagles will end up with Stacy Andrews at tackle next year as he won't sign with Cincy and has said many times he'd like to play with his brother.

like Andrews, he's a beast of a man and he's got amazing athletic talent, unfortunately I just don't think he's as good as everyone says he is. he gets beat regularly and badly by middlen D-lineman. I won;t be that upset if we lose him.


I wish there was a real monster of a DT or DE out there, but I don't see that type of guy in the mock drafts I've looked at. We really do need a pass rush. Even a slitghly better one would create a lot more opportunities for the defense to make big plays.

I desperately wish Brown would hire a real GM and stay the hell out of things. He's not a footbal talent guru like his father was. And as a Bengals.com article described him "he's hardheaded and stuck in his ways...he's a lawyer..." He needs to write checks and shut the hell up about the rest of it.

[st.cronin]

Kenny Britt is good, and is definitely a plausible first rounder. Last year WR was a very tough position to predict who would get picked when. Remember Donnie Avery?

Wells vs. Moreno ... I think Moreno is better, but Wells is likely to show a very sexy size/speed combo at the combine. Moreno is, I think, a little on the small side, and may slip down the board a bit.

I believe if Crabtree is available Cincinnati would take him. Big picture, though, it seems they have more holes to fill on defense than on offense, and the top of this draft is thin on playmakers. There's Crabtree, maybe Moreno, and that's pretty much it.

I'm getting closer and closer to thinking Orakpo will be the #1 pick. There are just a ton of offensive tackles that look like good prospects in this draft, and if you're the Lions and you want an OT, you can get one with your second pick like Eben Britton or Ciron Black who are almost at the level of Smith/Oher. Orakpo has been insanely good this year, and the Lions, like the Bengals, seem to have a lot more holes on defense than offense.

Fwiw: I didn't think Ryan was much of a prospect, so clearly I'm an idiot, but I like Stafford LESS than I liked Ryan. He has made some progress since he was a freshman, but I still find it extremely difficult to imagine some team investing the first overall pick in him.

[miked]

Orapko was my vote, and I see somebody finally joined me, making it 2 people.

[Cuckoo]

Orakpo is a beast. I hate Texas with every fiber of my being, but I'd have him on my short list for 1 overall.

[DeToxRox]

No chance Detroit goes DE #1.

Assuming the current regime stays in place, which is 75% likely, it's almost certain Stafford goes #1.

The only way they take Orakpo #1 is if he is like Jake Long last year and agrees to take less money then others at #1, which is possible.

All things equal, as much as I hate it, Stafford will be a Lion.

[Samdari]

Originally Posted by st.cronin

K I didn't think Ryan was much of a prospect, so clearly I'm an idiot, but I like Stafford LESS than I liked Ryan.

Then they'd clearly be crazy NOT to take him, yes?

[st.cronin]

Update after the last week's games:

1. Detroit (0-16) - Matt Stafford, QB, Georgia ... I guess I've come around to this. Stafford really did have a tremendous statistical season, he's a great athlete, etc.
2. St. Louis (2-14) - Andre Smith, OT, Alabama ... Smith is really interesting to watch. He's very athletic and strong, but also incredibly aggressive. He's the rare offensive lineman that you can't take your eyes off of when watching the game.
3. Kansas City (2-14) - Michael Oher, OT, Mississippi ... Last year's lottery pick went to rebuild the defensive line, this year's will likely go to the offensive line. A QB is also possible, although I think Thigpen has been quite good.
4. Seattle (3-13) - Michael Crabtree, WR, Texas Tech ... Crabtree has said he'll stay at TT next year, but I'm doubtful.
5. Oakland (3-13) - Brian Orakpo, DE, Texas ... Orakpo would probably be a reach at #1. He's been terrific this year, but he's not quite ideal size for a DE, and he has some history of injuries.
6. Cincinnati (3-12-1) - Knowshon Moreno, RB, Georgia ... Bungles have lots of holes on defense, but they'll take an elite RB if one's available.
7. Jacksonville (5-11) - Aaron Curry, LB, Wake Forest ... Curry has tremendous talent and has been very productive in college, winning the Dick Butkus Award this year. Could play any LB spot in a 4-3 scheme.
8. Cleveland (5-11) - Malcolm Jenkins, CB, Ohio State ... Jenkins could go higher than this. He's a big, athletic, fast corner who may give scouts major wood at the combine.
9. San Francisco (6-10) - Eugene Monroe, OT, Virginia ... UVA continues to pump out elite O-line prospects. When Monroe was a junior and Branden Albert a senior, Monroe played LT and Albert played guard. Albert is now playing LT in the NFL, so Monroe is probably at least as good a prospect as Albert.
10. San Diego (6-10) - Taylor Mays, FS, USC ... The best player on the best college defense this season, and one of the best of all time. Mays is an impressive size/speed combo, and could probably play SS or even CB as well.
11. Green Bay (6-10) - James Laurinaitis, LB, Ohio State ... If the Pack pick Laurinaitis, presumably Hawk would move to weakside LB. Green Bay has a reputation of picking best available player regardless of need.
12. Buffalo (7-9) - Michael Johnson, DE, Georgia Tech ... Johnson is still a darkhorse for #1 pick overall. He's got prototypical size for a DE, and was very productive for a very good Georgia Tech team this last year. With a good bowl game and a good combine, he could convince Detroit to go the Mario Williams route.
13. New Orleans (8-8) - William Moore, SS/FS, Missouri ... the next Roy Williams? He's probably better than that.
14. Houston (8-8) - Vontae Davis, CB, Illinois ... Had a bit of a shaky senior season, but still big and fast, projecting as the perfect cover corner.
15. Washington (9-7) - SenDerrick Marks, DT, Auburn ... May project as a DE, but a talented lineman nonetheless.
16. Detroit (from Dallas [9-7]) - Brian Cushing, LB, USC
17. Arizona (9-7) - Chris Wells, RB, Ohio State ... Wells could well be the 1st RB taken.
18. Philadelphia (9-6-1) - Greg Hardy, DE, Mississippi
19. Miami (10-6) - Rey Maualuga, ILB, USC ... This draft is very deep in LBs.
20. New England (10-6) - Brandon Spikes, ILB, Florida
21. Chicago (10-6) - Darrius Heyward-Bey, WR, Maryland
22. Denver (10-6) - Terrence Cody, DT, Alabama ... Cody is an elephant.
23. Atlanta (10-6) - Alphonso Smith, CB, Wake Forest
24. NY Jets (11-5) - Sam Bradford, QB, Oklahoma ... Assuming Bradford leaves college, this is about as far as he's likely to slip.
25. Tampa Bay (11-5) - George Selvie, DE, South Florida
26. Indianapolis (11-5) - Peria Jerry, DT, Mississippi
27. Baltimore (11-5) - Myron Rolle, SS, Florida State ... Smart fella, from what I gather.
28. Minnesota (11-5) - Brandon Pettigrew, TE, Oklahoma State
29. Philadelphia (from Carolina [12-4]) - Darius Butler, CB, Connecticut
30. Pittsburgh (12-4) - Jason Smith, OT, Baylor
31. NY Giants (12-4) - Sean Weatherspoon, OLB, Missouri
32. Tennessee (14-2) - Alex Mack, C, California

[RendeR]

Originally Posted by st.cronin

I believe if Crabtree is available Cincinnati would take him. Big picture, though, it seems they have more holes to fill on defense than on offense, and the top of this draft is thin on playmakers. There's Crabtree, maybe Moreno, and that's pretty much it.

This will not happen. Seriously, you're not looking at what they have and what they need here.

The Bengals have 2 young guys that have the skills to be #1/2 recievers waiting in the wings to see what they do with Ocho-noshow and Housh-MAN-zadeh.

The Defense actually has one glaring need, pass rush, we don't have any.
The linebackers (when healthy) and the secondary (when healthy) are actually very strong units.

The Offense has 4 major needs.
O-line, we need a stud Tackle, wether he plays right side or Left, we just need one badly. If there is a super Tackle available, I'll wager my salary that they take him, if there isn't one, or there is a Guard comparable they'll take that player and move one of their other Gaurds to tackle/center. We also need a stud Center but there isn't one in this draft.

Running back. We have benson who is playing his heart out, but Perry is a bust (much to my disgust as I put faith in a Mishitgin product) and beyond those two we have exactly squat. IF one of the studs is available, they might go this way but their history with first round RB's is terrible and tney may avoid this pick.

Fullback. We have a guy thats smaller than our RB's tryin to block for them. He can't catch either. God I miss Lorenzo Neal.

Tight End. Utecht is a great TE, but he's aging and he gets hurt far too often. We have enough guys on IR this season, we need a gigantic bulldozer with good hands to give Carson a check down he can trust.

They will not take Crabtree, they don't need Crabtree.

[RendeR]

DOLA, guess I should read further before posting, been a long day.

I'm not sold on moreno, but I also haven't really seen much of him. Anyone got some video clips I can watch of him?