Why is it the phone/tech companies fault? Shouldn't it be the parents?

[DanGarion]

Originally Posted by mauboy1

"Your way of parenting is wrong"
"No yours is"
"No this the way"
"This is the way it was for me when I was a kid."
"WRONG"

Everyone needs to understand everyone is different.

You are wrong sir...

[Dallasin2k3]

Originally Posted by Lathum

So every long car ride, plane ride, wait at a restaurant, wait at a doctors office, trip to grandmas, wait for a movie to start, etc...you just sat on your hands and were a quiet little angel?

No. I was obnoxious and impatient. And then I got a whipping every time I acted out, until I learned that I shouldn't be obnoxious and impatient, and that it was worth it to just STFU and not cause trouble.

But that required a lot of patience on the part of my parents. Nowadays, parents seem to have less patience for these types of lessons, and are more likely to purchase a car that has a TV/DVD in the back, or give their kids their phones to play games on, etc., every time they are in a car ride or other situation that requires the kid to be patient and not cause trouble. Frankly this makes the car ride easier for the parents and children alike but I think it fails to teach important lessons and is the equivalent of avoiding an opportunity to teach/learn something.

My .02, realizing that most will disagree with this. Not saying that I am not impatient either. We all live in an instant, want-it-now, fix-it-now society.

[mauchow]

Originally Posted by DanGarion

You are wrong sir...

Heh. I know everyone knows that every parenting style is different but we've got a bit off topic to trying to prove what's right in the situation.

I would liken this to my Amazon account. Anybody can walk onto my laptop and order something from Amazon. I would be upset that it happened but at least I would know whats going on for the most part. An notification gets sent to my phone, it would require the CC # if a different delivery address was used.

The APP should definitely have better safeguards and it looks like they're taking some action regarding this. I don't really care.

[Lathum]

Originally Posted by Dallasin2k3

No. I was obnoxious and impatient. And then I got a whipping every time I acted out, until I learned that I shouldn't be obnoxious and impatient, and that it was worth it to just STFU and not cause trouble.

But that required a lot of patience on the part of my parents. Nowadays, parents seem to have less patience for these types of lessons, and are more likely to purchase a car that has a TV/DVD in the back, or give their kids their phones to play games on, etc., every time they are in a car ride or other situation that requires the kid to be patient and not cause trouble. Frankly this makes the car ride easier for the parents and children alike but I think it fails to teach important lessons and is the equivalent of avoiding an opportunity to teach/learn something.

My .02, realizing that most will disagree with this. Not saying that I am not impatient either. We all live in an instant, want-it-now, fix-it-now society.

The whole concept of "making things easier" is absurd to me. Why should I make my kids sit in silence or not be entertained for a car ride when it isn't necessary? What lesson exactly is learned by making your kids sit in the back seat and stare out the window?

Its not like I am giving my kid my phone to play with while we are at dinner or church. While there are obvious limitations I think it is idiotic to force your kid to be bored just because that is how it was when we were kids.

When I was a kid my parents gave me stuff to play with on long trips. Coloring books, gameboy, etc...What we need to realize is Ipads, smartphones, etc...are the coloring books of today.

[DanGarion]

Originally Posted by mauboy1

Heh. I know everyone knows that every parenting style is different but we've got a bit off topic to trying to prove what's right in the situation.

I would liken this to my Amazon account. Anybody can walk onto my laptop and order something from Amazon. I would be upset that it happened but at least I would know whats going on for the most part. An notification gets sent to my phone, it would require the CC # if a different delivery address was used.

The APP should definitely have better safeguards and it looks like they're taking some action regarding this. I don't really care.

I hope you realized my response to you was just some kidding arond.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by Lathum

Why should I make my kids sit in silence or not be entertained for a car ride when it isn't necessary?

Because some of them fuck up & buy shit that they shouldn't? Isn't that how this whole topic came up?

When I was a kid my parents gave me stuff to play with on long trips. Coloring books, gameboy, etc... .

I think I'm starting to see the root of at least some of the disconnect here. When the Gameboy was released I was 22. By then I was routinely reading to distract myself while driving.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by mauboy1

Anybody can walk onto my laptop and order something from Amazon.

You leave your laptop lying around? Logged into Amazon? With your CC# stored (which I do, but only because I don't do the first two things).

If so, any charges are your responsibility afaic, you brought that shit on yourself.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by Dallasin2k3

My .02, realizing that most will disagree with this.

Most of the decent parents won't, they will have already learned the same lessons you talked about AND have/are trying to teach them.

[DaddyTorgo]

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

You leave your laptop lying around? Logged into Amazon? With your CC# stored (which I do, but only because I don't do the first two things).

If so, any charges are your responsibility afaic, you brought that shit on yourself.

You're so silly. He went on to say that he accepted that any charges would be his responsibility.

[Lathum]

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

I think I'm starting to see the root of at least some of the disconnect here. When the Gameboy was released I was 22. By then I was routinely reading to distract myself while driving.

I dunno, the gameboy came along pretty late in the game for me.

[Lathum]

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

Most of the decent parents won't, they will have already learned the same lessons you talked about AND have/are trying to teach them.

What exactly is the lesson? You should be bored unnecessarily?

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by DaddyTorgo

You're so silly. He went on to say that he accepted that any charges would be his responsibility.

{rubs eyes} Not that I'm seeing. And not even indirectly, since afaik there's no mention that notifications like that hypothetical Amazon email aren't provided (hell, I get an email every time I buy a .99 track from iTunes, are you telling me the same doesn't happen w/ iPhone purchases?) If nothing else, you'll know something was purchased when it hits your CC.

Seriously, is your computer showing you sentences that mine isn't?

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by Lathum

What exactly is the lesson? You should be bored unnecessarily?

That you better find a way to alleviate boredom that doesn't involve buying shit you shouldn't. Again, that's the point here. All the crying in this thread ultimately involves people unwilling to use a little common sense,namely, that if you hand little Suzi your wallet & stick her in front of a shiny machine that takes cash, and have failed to adequately teach the concept of not buying shit without approval (or do so with a child too young to understand the concept of electronic transactions in today's world) you're liable to find your wallet lighter when you get it back. And that it's your own damned fault when/if it happens.

[mauchow]

I never finished my entire point but dt and jimga both hit it for me.

My laptop sits at home. Nobody uses it but my wife and I so for someone to order shit they'd need to break into my house then my amazon account is the least of my concerns. And like you said Jim I get an email for every purchase that is made on that account. Come to think of it I may ask my credit card company to send me an email for every transaction made. Hmmm.

[Lathum]

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

That you better find a way to alleviate boredom that doesn't involve buying shit you shouldn't. Again, that's the point here. All the crying in this thread ultimately involves people unwilling to use a little common sense,namely, that if you hand little Suzi your wallet & stick her in front of a shiny machine that takes cash, and have failed to adequately teach the concept of not buying shit without approval (or do so with a child too young to understand the concept of electronic transactions in today's world) you're liable to find your wallet lighter when you get it back. And that it's your own damned fault when/if it happens.

We're arguing 2 completely different points. You are arguing for responsibility. I am saying there is nothing wrong with using modern technology to entertain your kids.

As to your point, do I think parents should be responsible for their kids actions, absolutly. IMO this case the parents were led to believe the kid was playing a free game.

[Dallasin2k3]

Originally Posted by Lathum

We're arguing 2 completely different points. You are arguing for responsibility. I am saying there is nothing wrong with using modern technology to entertain your kids.

To a point, I agree. I would state, however, that kids these days are too entertained by modern technology and not entertained enough by things that are more useful to their development. As an example, I believe that TV is largely mindless and not a good way for children to spend much of their time. Most kids sit and watch TV for too many hours, become fat and obese, acquire health problems, and fail to do anything for themselves mentally while they spend hours zoning out in front of the television.

Perhaps you agree, perhaps you do not. But that is where I stand on the issue. I never said that all forms of technology or even TV should be avoided in children. I think there should be reasonable limits, and I don't think that it is too much to ask children to LEARN to do something productive (like read a book instead of watching TV) and LEARN to be PATIENT while on car rides and situations where they are waiting, etc.

Simply turning on a TV/DVD or handing over the IPad to watch cartoons any time the kid gets bored is probably a little over the top, and probably only teaches the child instant gratification and a habit of mindless TV-zoning at any moment they desire... but most parents do it these days so what do I know. Like I said, there is a balance.. Not trying to be a tech nazi or anything, we are on a video game forum after all... my 02

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by Lathum

We're arguing 2 completely different points. You are arguing for responsibility. I am saying there is nothing wrong with using modern technology to entertain your kids.

I'm arguing that you should use it responsibly, which combines the two points. If your kid is buying shit without approval, that <> responsible use afaic. These are interactive consumer devices designed to make buying trivial shit as easy as possible, if someone hasn't figured that out already then my argument is that they're probably too stupid to own one and almost certainly too fucking stupid to be breeding.

IMO this case the parents were led to believe the kid was playing a free game.

I call bullshit, they weren't led to believe it nearly so much as they wanted to believe it and were dumb enough to delude themselves into thinking it were so. My 13 y/o knows "free" is a red flag and has for years, that leaves me no sympathy for adults who can't figure that out.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by Dallasin2k3

To a point, I agree. I would state, however, that kids these days are too entertained by modern technology and not entertained enough by things that are more useful to their development. As an example, I believe that TV is largely mindless and not a good way for children to spend much of their time.

Almost curiously enough, I consistently argue just the opposite with regard to technology & its impact on children.

Now I'm using "TV" broadly here to cover the whole tech spectrum, and I'm quick to say that I know mine is unusual in his viewing/use patterns at times, but that's actually one of the few good parenting things I'll take credit for*: almost anything is a teachable moment if you're willing to put in the effort to make it so.

*most of his positive traits I attribute to being the product of good fortune/birth/blessings far more than good parenting

[DaddyTorgo]

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

Almost curiously enough, I consistently argue just the opposite with regard to technology & its impact on children.

Now I'm using "TV" broadly here to cover the whole tech spectrum, and I'm quick to say that I know mine is unusual in his viewing/use patterns at times, but that's actually one of the few good parenting things I'll take credit for*: almost anything is a teachable moment if you're willing to put in the effort to make it so.

*most of his positive traits I attribute to being the product of good fortune/birth/blessings far more than good parenting

There's a difference between mindless TV and educational TV though.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by DaddyTorgo

There's a difference between mindless TV and educational TV though.

Eh, in some ways (just to pick a favorite example) you could call No Reservations "mindless TV" or certainly for that matter could easily dismiss most FPS games. I've had incredible conversations with my son jumpstarted by both, conversations that I'm consistently surprised to see come back around even years later with increasingly sophisticated questions.

It's harder to do with, say, iCarly, Drake & Josh, or Spongebob but we're all entitled to some mindless decompression entertainment at times.

[Passacaglia]

And on the other side of that, we're finding that even "educational" TV doesn't seem all that worthwhile and more like flashing stuff to stare at for our 1-year old.