NFL 2019 Season Thread

[Atocep]

Originally Posted by Carman Bulldog

Definitely take the under. Take a look at this list. I'd say he's probably no better than 35 or so. There are about 10 guys he's debatable with. So really, as high as 35 but not lower than 45.

I got to 40 QBs that I'd definitely take over Trubisky right now by looking at Football Outsiders QB rankings. I'm sure I could find another 5 that haven't played a snap yet this year. I'm going the over.

[Carman Bulldog]

Originally Posted by Atocep

I got to 40 QBs that I'd definitely take over Trubisky right now by looking at Football Outsiders QB rankings. I'm sure I could find another 5 that haven't played a snap yet this year. I'm going the over.

No way. There's probably about 30-35 for sure picks but then you are into debatable territory. Most of your 31-40 guys have to be maybe's.

[Edward64]

Originally Posted by Edward64

A Hog QB to start this week!

Hopeful for an impressive showing but not betting on it. If I remember correctly, he sucked until his senior year where he was competent.

But what do I know. I would have bet Ryan Mallett would have done a lot better than he really did.

Brandon Allen comfortable in Broncos offense as he prepares to start vs. Browns; Rypien ready to serve as backup if called upon

Not able to watch the game but he seems to be doing pretty well so far.

6/9 125 yards 2 TD's

[PilotMan]

You can complain about officiating all day long, but really, the game has gotten too difficult to contain. Every call is questioned. Every penalty could be challenged. Every review kills the flow. How can you even do that job well at all?



In the Steelers/Colts game a couple of really questionable calls against both teams made a difference. Just hard to argue when the other team is getting screwed as often as your team is.

[bhlloy]

For Kitchens, read Kingsbury above. Both should have their damn challenge flags superglued to the inside of their pockets.

[bhlloy]

Originally Posted by PilotMan

You can complain about officiating all day long, but really, the game has gotten too difficult to contain. Every call is questioned. Every penalty could be challenged. Every review kills the flow. How can you even do that job well at all?



In the Steelers/Colts game a couple of really questionable calls against both teams made a difference. Just hard to argue when the other team is getting screwed as often as your team is.

There was a really interesting Athletic article the other day about how it used to be officiating crews had 20-30 years of experience per member on average, and there would maybe be one new official per crew a year. Can’t remember the exact numbers but some inordinate number of officials are new in the last few years and you’ve got head referees who barely have 5-10 years of experience.

It’s way too complicated to assign to any one reason, but that’s got to be a big one. Obviously replay and things like Sunday Ticket haven’t helped.

[JPhillips]

How much do the Dolphins hate Adam Gase? After all the tanking they've done, they were willing to lose the top pick just to see him defeated and probably fired from the Jets.

[bhlloy]

Lol, Gruden takes a time out to allow the Lions a shot to win the game from the 1 with time running out on fourth down, but gets away with it

[Atocep]

It took all of 16 minutes for the Ravens to score the most points on the Pats defense this year.

[jbergey22]

Patriots defense doesnt look so good when facing a team with a pulse.

[EagleFan]

Just putting this out there but the Ravens may not want their linemen pulling their quarterback by his head trying to get him across the goal line.

[jbergey22]

Originally Posted by bhlloy

Lol, Gruden takes a time out to allow the Lions a shot to win the game from the 1 with time running out on fourth down, but gets away with it

Detroit would have gotten a play in. 8 seconds left. He probably didnt want an unorganized fiasco where Stafford QB sneaks it in from the 1 to win the game. Oakland had their nickel defense in. Its not like Detroit wasnt going to get a play in and they probably had two plays called in the previous huddle. It was a good move IMO.

[stevew]

Did Tomlin really challenge 2 PIs in a row?

[PilotMan]

Originally Posted by stevew

Did Tomlin really challenge 2 PIs in a row?

The first one was so damned obviously not PI. Of course, the NFL has decided that they cannot overturn PI now, so nearly every challenge on that has been lost. Of course, he lost, and I the second one wasn't even a PI call. I think he was just pissed that the first one was so obvious that NY wouldn't change it, that he wanted it on the record for some reason. There wasn't even contact on it.

[jbergey22]

Originally Posted by PilotMan

The first one was so damned obviously not PI. Of course, the NFL has decided that they cannot overturn PI now, so nearly every challenge on that has been lost. Of course, he lost, and I the second one wasn't even a PI call. I think he was just pissed that the first one was so obvious that NY wouldn't change it, that he wanted it on the record for some reason. There wasn't even contact on it.

100 percent. If they arent going to change PI upon further review why even allow it as an option? They need to be specific on what situations allow for an overturn or just dont allow it to go under review. Maybe the dumbest change to rules in a major sport since around 1990 when MLB decided for about 1/4 year they were going to make the balk a heavy emphasis and were calling balks 7X the normal amount.

Yesterday, a player from the Vikings was called for head to head contact. He missed the Chiefs runner by a good 2 feet and it was actually his forearm that got his head as the runner was ducking. Apparently, that blatant error isnt reviewable. NFL might just be a better game without instant replay. If it cant correct the obvious errors I think its just better to live with human error. Picking and choosing what can be corrected is just infuriating.

[MizzouRah]

Thank you Ravens. :P

[albionmoonlight]

The Saints/Rams double no call (PI and helmet to helmet) was so egregious that the NFL felt the need to so something.

But it fell into the logical fallacy of (1) Something should be done; (2) this is something; (3) thus, we should do this.

Making PI reviewable was never the right response.

Much better responses would have been

(1) Putting a sky judge in the booth at every game who just has this God-like ability to reverse anything. It would maybe come up once or twice every couple of seasons to correct only the most egregious errors (like Saints/Rams); or

(2) fundamentally changing the way officials are trained and hired; or

(3) simply acknowledging that Saints/Rams was one of the most egregious and significant missed calls in the history of world team sports, giving the teams and the fans a sincere and unalloyed apology, and not changing anything because mistakes are inevitable and sometimes you make things worse when you try to fix them.

[Warhammer]

Originally Posted by albionmoonlight

The Saints/Rams double no call (PI and helmet to helmet) was so egregious that the NFL felt the need to so something.

But it fell into the logical fallacy of (1) Something should be done; (2) this is something; (3) thus, we should do this.

Making PI reviewable was never the right response.

Much better responses would have been

(1) Putting a sky judge in the booth at every game who just has this God-like ability to reverse anything. It would maybe come up once or twice every couple of seasons to correct only the most egregious errors (like Saints/Rams); or

(2) fundamentally changing the way officials are trained and hired; or

(3) simply acknowledging that Saints/Rams was one of the most egregious and significant missed calls in the history of world team sports, giving the teams and the fans a sincere and unalloyed apology, and not changing anything because mistakes are inevitable and sometimes you make things worse when you try to fix them.

#2 is something that should happen anyway. #3 should also have been done. #1 you start going down the slippery slope of what is blatant and egregious.

Again, from the Rams-Saints game, on the previous drive, Goff is taken down inside the 10 on 2nd or 3rd down by a pretty blatant facemask. No call. Was that blatant enough? Now consider how roughing the QB was handled that year, how in the world was that not called?

#3 should be done far more. On some level, we all acknowledge we make mistakes. Apologize and move on. It blows over, and it goes down as a storied what if in team history. Fans love this sort of thing, it hurts at the time, but how often do we sit with friends and go over what-if scenarios?

[molson]

What does #2 mean exactly?

And I always ask - if the NFL refs are terrible, and the college refs are terrible, where exactly are the people that can do this job to the standards of the people who constantly complain about this stuff? Aren't at least some of the people who tried but failed to get these jobs possibly not very good at it?

The rhetoric used to be that the refs across sports had too much seniority and we needed fresh blood. Now I look in this thread and apparently the problem is that there's too many new refs and they lack experience. OK.

I think the main thing that's different is that social media echos bad calls that have always been there. So we used to just move on to the next play, where now the people inclined to cry about this stuff forever have a soapbox to do so.

There's also been a shift in how we've looked at making calls generally. We used to understand that calls would be missed, but that was a million times better than calling something where there wasn't a penalty. But now, maybe because of this social media echo, more people want everything called, and that has led to a billion flags (and foul calls in other sports), so when something is missed now there's more reason to complain about it. (And the games have been more sluggish). But if you watch a full length NBA or NFL game from the 80s on youtube or something, two of the things that stand out is that the players are much less athletic and easier to officiate, and that tons of fouls and penalties don't get called - and the game flow is much better as a result. It used to be considered part of the game to keep your fouls and penalties subtle.

[Warhammer]

As someone pointed out, not sure if it was here, or somewhere else, referees used to have 15-25 years of experience. They would work guys into the crews one at a time. Now, we are lucky to have refs with 5-10 years of experience. They are working more guys into the crew, and we see the results.

[molson]

Originally Posted by Warhammer

As someone pointed out, not sure if it was here, or somewhere else, referees used to have 15-25 years of experience. They would work guys into the crews one at a time. Now, we are lucky to have refs with 5-10 years of experience. They are working more guys into the crew, and we see the results.

So the solution is to keep refs around longer and have less new blood?

OK, but that's literally the opposite of what I've read for the last decade or two. Wasn't the problem that these guys had too much seniority and no accountability and would stay forever no matter what? Now they NFL just has to try harder to keep the same refs that apparently all suck?

I think this game is just harder to officiate than people think. And I'll believe that until these mythical humans that can get all these calls right are discovered. Wherever they are, they're not currently employed as referees.

[Warhammer]

They need to do a better job working new guys in. In the past they were all old guys. They had a trickle of new guys coming in. In the last decade, they had a ton of guys leave, so they had to bring in a bunch of new guys. Ideally, you have a constant flow in/out so it becomes more consistent and you have guys of all levels of experience so they are not all old or young.

[JPhillips]

Year-round refs with a training schedule to match would have to help.

[MizzouRah]

Originally Posted by PilotMan

The first one was so damned obviously not PI. Of course, the NFL has decided that they cannot overturn PI now, so nearly every challenge on that has been lost. Of course, he lost, and I the second one wasn't even a PI call. I think he was just pissed that the first one was so obvious that NY wouldn't change it, that he wanted it on the record for some reason. There wasn't even contact on it.

It's a joke.. maybe I don't know what PI is anymore but that was definitely PI against the Giants receiver that Shurmur challenged to no avail.

That was huge in this game.

[Thomkal]

Cam Newton on season-ending IR

[Lathum]

Is there any doubt this game will end with the chargers needing to drive the length of the field with 44 seconds left.

[Chief Rum]

Originally Posted by Lathum

Is there any doubt this game will end with the chargers needing to drive the length of the field with 44 seconds left.

That was maybe the worst attempt at a game winning drive I have ever seen.

[PilotMan]

Rivers just looked like a man who had a shitty week in practice, hated playing on a Thursday, was pissed at everyone from teammates to refs, to himself. He had good moments, but mostly he looked like a 2nd year backup.

[Lathum]

Originally Posted by Chief Rum

That was maybe the worst attempt at a game winning drive I have ever seen.

After watching a washed up eli for several years I know what a QB looks like when he is done and Rivers is done.

[albionmoonlight]

Originally Posted by Lathum

After watching a washed up eli for several years I know what a QB looks like when he is done and Rivers is done.

There are a couple of factors at play, I think.

First, Brady and Brees are big weirdos who are obsessed with football and keeping their bodies in shape and I think that their success into their early 40s has caused us all to forget that people almost never play professional sports at this high of a level while that old. They are outliers, and we shouldn't consider playing for that long as a new normal. It seems much more normal to just mentally and physically drop off once you hit 35 or so.

Second, before the rules protecting QBs, we didn't used to see guys play past their early/mid 30s because they would be forced to retire with multiple concussions or neck injuries or the like. Now, guys like Eli and Rivers don't have a career-ending injury (which is great). But that means that we watch them slowly just lose skills/drive until they have to retire or get benched.

[Lathum]

Originally Posted by albionmoonlight

There are a couple of factors at play, I think.

First, Brady and Brees are big weirdos who are obsessed with football and keeping their bodies in shape and I think that their success into their early 40s has caused us all to forget that people almost never play professional sports at this high of a level while that old. They are outliers, and we shouldn't consider playing for that long as a new normal. It seems much more normal to just mentally and physically drop off once you hit 35 or so.

Second, before the rules protecting QBs, we didn't used to see guys play past their early/mid 30s because they would be forced to retire with multiple concussions or neck injuries or the like. Now, guys like Eli and Rivers don't have a career-ending injury (which is great). But that means that we watch them slowly just lose skills/drive until they have to retire or get benched.

Having 17 kids probably wears on you also

[revrew]

Originally Posted by Lathum

Having 17 kids probably wears on you also

I can attest that this is true.

[NobodyHere]

Originally Posted by Lathum

Having 17 kids probably wears on you also

I imagine it would wear more on the mother.

[albionmoonlight]

After placing OT Trent Williams on the non-football injury list, the Redskins have elected to not pay him the remaining balance of his $5.1 million base salary for the 2019 season, league sources tell @FieldYates
and me.

— Adam Schefter (@AdamSchefter) November 8, 2019

If you made Dan Snyder a movie villain, the audience would complain that he was unrealistically evil.

[Atocep]

I'm adding Jeff Driskel to the list of QBs better than Trubisky.

[Atocep]

Apparently I offended Mitch with that post and he decided it's time to start completing basic passes.

[Lathum]

The Chiefs have so much speed its ridiculous.

[JPhillips]

It probably won't matter, but Gase just threw away two timeouts on stupid challenges.

[Edward64]

Now those are the Falcons I was expecting at the beginning of the season.

Pretty solid performance against the Saints.

[EagleFan]

Seriously lame roughing the passer call there.

[PilotMan]

Originally Posted by EagleFan

Seriously lame roughing the passer call there.

Story of the year.

[SirFozzie]

How you can't get past the sticks on fourth down... especially when you're closely covered..

[NobodyHere]

Might as well send the Colts to the glue factory after losing to Miami.

[Atocep]

Brian Flores for Coach of the Year

[Lathum]

What a joke. McCaffrey was in there

[stevew]

How did they trade Minkah Fitzpatrick? Insanity

[PilotMan]

Originally Posted by stevew

How did they trade Minkah Fitzpatrick? Insanity

He has suddenly become the missing piece of the puzzle and the speed on that defense is just amplified with him running around back there. Easily the best secondary player we've had since Polamalu.

[Atocep]

Originally Posted by PilotMan

He has suddenly become the missing piece of the puzzle and the speed on that defense is just amplified with him running around back there. Easily the best secondary player we've had since Polamalu.

Not really a surprise. He was solid as a safety and one of the top 3 rated slot corners when lined up there with the Dolphins. Miami was moving him all over the place and he's not really an outside guy and hates playing in the box.

Letting him settle into one spot was going to do nothing but help (85% of his snaps are as a deep safety in Pittsburgh as opposed to 22% in Miami). Giving up a 1st to get him until 2023 is a steal.

[stevew]

Maybe double Clowney?

[PilotMan]

I swear that all the rules protecting the players, resulting in unintentional personal fouls, hits on 'defenseless' players, and such, all seem so arbitrary sometimes. There's almost no consistency between crews and it's really, really frustrating as a fan. It makes the game feel arbitrary and they swing the game so much.