11-30-2022, 04:43 PM | #1251 | |
College Prospect
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: Newcastle, Australia
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Quote:
Thanks for that link. There's some good stuff there. |
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11-30-2022, 07:07 PM | #1252 |
College Benchwarmer
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Canada
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I agree with some of what you are saying.
I do have to push back on this narrative that Geno Smith is a running quarterback. He's never been a running QB. That's like referring to Alex Smith as a running QB. Geno is definitely athletic but he's not Lamar, Fields, Hurts, Newton, RGIII, etc., or even Russell Wilson. Geno is still a pocket passer at the end of the day. I also don't agree with the assessment of Russell Wilson having amazing field vision. In his prime, he had a very strong arm, great deep-ball accuracy and fantastic mobility. But his whole career he's often overlooked passes that were available that he didn't attempt. His ability to find open receivers wasn't a result of field vision as much as it was him running around in the backfield until guys got open. His play has arguably been on the decline since mid-2020. It does come down to systems, but the success of Wilson in any system, and the ability to create passing windows for him, has always been dependent upon his mobility. He's never shown an ability to sit in the pocket, go through his progressions quickly and dump the ball off. Those were within Brees' skill set. |
11-30-2022, 09:57 PM | #1253 |
Solecismic Software
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Definitions are tricky. By running quarterback, I mean someone who is always aware that running is a weapon. Someone with good speed (Smith was timed at 4.59 40 at the Combine) and who runs the ball frequently.
I found it most useful to divide quarterbacks into five groups, based on how often they run the ball as a percentage of runs+sacks+pass attempts (kneel-downs removed from all plays). Smith runs the ball 18.0% of the time, which places him on the border of the fourth and fifth quadrants. Wilson is at 19.5%. These quarterbacks have unusually short careers compared to their peers. Then you get to the extreme end of the fifth quadrant, and for a long time, that was just Michael Vick (25.5%) when it came to more than 10-20 starts in the league. But now that's been eclipsed by Hurts, Fields, Tebow and Lamar Jackson. Jackson runs the ball 31.3% of those touches, Fields a mind-boggling 34.3%. So that extreme end now reaches almost twice as frequent run attempts as that borderline, and perhaps it deserves a split of its own somewhere around Randall Cunningham or Cam Newton. On the lowest end you get the Mannings, Brees, Brady, Marino, Rivers. That's below 8%. Alex Smith is third quadrant at 14.7% - notable peers are Donovan McNabb, John Elway, Joe Burrow. These are more the guys who can run, and often have good athletic skills, but it's not a "looking to run" like that fifth quadrant. Wilson's vision doesn't come from the mobility alone. Deep passes are very risky and he is elite at avoiding interceptions despite throwing a very high percentage of deep balls. He might be looking for that deep ball too much, but it takes exceptional vision to throw it that often without getting picked. Brees, since he is as height-challenged as Wilson, and that's very unusual among starting quarterbacks, has been asked a lot about how he sees what's out there. His response is that he developed a sense of how to move around the pocket to create throwing lanes and vision lanes. Wilson can't do that and used his athleticism to create his own sight lines. I would agree he is in decline. |
11-30-2022, 10:32 PM | #1254 |
Coordinator
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I would say the biggest difference between Geno and most QBs that are mobile is Geno doesn't like to run. At WVU it took a lot of prodding to get him to use his mobility and even then it wasn't that often. He is credited with 245 rush attempts, but IIRC nearly 100 of those are sacks because he played behind poor pass blocking lines his sophomore and junior seasons.
So when he does run, he rarely does so in situations where he's going to take a hit. It's usually toward the sideline to get OOB or he gets down into his slide pretty early. |
12-01-2022, 09:15 AM | #1255 |
Head Coach
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To bolster Jim's point about it being a synergy between team/coaching and QB, the Saints always made of point of investing in top-tier guards during Brees' time. Because Brees was short, the team knew he needed a clean front of the pocket so he could literally see what was happening. They, of course, wanted good tackles as well. But b/c of Brees' quick release, they weren't as essential as top guards (which was nice b/c top guards are cheaper than top tackles).
The QB that reminds me the most of Brees right now is Dak. He wins through quick processing and amazing understanding of what's going on around him. He's more athletic than Brees. And a touch taller. And not quite as accurate. But I think that he's the closest we have to Brees right now. |
12-01-2022, 09:25 AM | #1256 |
Head Coach
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dola: To get back to Wilson, it seems like Denver's ownership need to fire the coach and maybe GM. And then 100% of the hiring process for the next coach/GM needs to be a frank discussion of what Wilson does well, what Wilson does poorly and what can we do as a team to lean on the former and make the latter irrelevant.
Financially, they are stuck with him for a few years. So every single decision they make--from FA signings, to draft, to scheme, to the color they decide to re-paint the locker room has to be made with the idea of "how does this help Russ help us?" Last edited by albionmoonlight : 12-01-2022 at 09:26 AM. |
12-01-2022, 12:41 PM | #1257 |
Death Herald
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Location: Le stelle la notte sono grandi e luminose nel cuore profondo del Texas
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the new team name will be "Denver Broncos Country Let's Ride"
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Thinkin' of a master plan 'Cuz ain't nuthin' but sweat inside my hand So I dig into my pocket, all my money is spent So I dig deeper but still comin' up with lint |
12-01-2022, 01:15 PM | #1258 |
This guy has posted so much, his fingers are about to fall off.
Join Date: Nov 2000
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It's funny how they ran so far away from Tebow because it would require them to build an entire offensive scheme around him, and then fast forward 10-12 years, they're effectively in the same situation - with a likely HOF QB.
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M's pitcher Miguel Batista: "Now, I feel like I've had everything. I've talked pitching with Sandy Koufax, had Kenny G play for me. Maybe if I could have an interview with God, then I'd be served. I'd be complete." |
12-01-2022, 01:38 PM | #1259 |
Hall Of Famer
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That Russell TikTok was so bad I need mind bleach.
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12-01-2022, 02:26 PM | #1260 | |
Hall Of Famer
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Quote:
Except that Tebow isn't anywhere near the talent the Wilson is. I mean, at some level, it's worth building a system around a QB if he's good enough. Building a system around me at QB? Not so much. SI
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12-01-2022, 03:15 PM | #1261 |
Solecismic Software
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Tebow had many skills, but throwing a ball accurately was not one of them. I don't know how you build a team around that, because if you stop the run and the run option, you might give up some long plays, but you'll also have to deal with drive-killing incompletions and potential interceptions. You were really looking at 4-5 extra incompletions per game simply because of his inaccuracy.
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12-01-2022, 03:18 PM | #1262 |
This guy has posted so much, his fingers are about to fall off.
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I haven't seen much of the talent Wilson may have left this season. It feels like Wilson may ultimately have as many negatives as someone like Tebow had.
I mean, aside from a few deep balls, it feels like 90% of Wilson's game is check-downs to a RB or TE who is at or behind the LOS. That's it.
__________________
M's pitcher Miguel Batista: "Now, I feel like I've had everything. I've talked pitching with Sandy Koufax, had Kenny G play for me. Maybe if I could have an interview with God, then I'd be served. I'd be complete." |
12-01-2022, 04:14 PM | #1263 | |
Grizzled Veteran
Join Date: Nov 2004
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Hear me out. We put you in at Qb, we line up 9 offensive lineman, and then we line Derek Henry up deep behind you.
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12-01-2022, 04:21 PM | #1264 |
Favored Bitch #1
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: homeless in NJ
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Sounds like Antonio Brown is in a stand off with police in Florida over a warrant stemming from a DV complaint.
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12-01-2022, 05:27 PM | #1265 | |
Coordinator
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Quote:
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12-01-2022, 08:29 PM | #1266 | |
Hall Of Famer
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Quote:
You can hand off the ball and then run screaming backwards towards the other end zone legally, right? SI
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Houston Hippopotami, III.3: 20th Anniversary Thread - All former HT players are encouraged to check it out! Janos: "Only America could produce an imbecile of your caliber!" Freakazoid: "That's because we make lots of things better than other people!" |
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12-01-2022, 08:41 PM | #1267 |
Coordinator
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: Concord, MA/UMass
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Marcus Jones is the greatest WR in NFL history. (By yards per route run.)
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12-01-2022, 08:48 PM | #1268 | |
Pro Starter
Join Date: Feb 2003
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Quote:
This is the kind of the way I look at it as well....yes it sucks to have your QB go gunshy and consistently throw RB check-downs and to players 3 yards out, but the coach/coordinator has to call the plays that explicitly put the players in those positions before Russell can even think about throwing to them. If you've got multiple RB/TE/skill position players that are neither protecting OR running routes beyond the LOS every play maybe that's just it's own obvious issue (which certainly isn't meant as a defense/denial of Wilson's horrible play).
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Last edited by thesloppy : Today at 05:35 PM. Last edited by thesloppy : 12-01-2022 at 08:53 PM. |
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12-03-2022, 05:45 PM | #1269 |
Hockey Boy
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: Royal Oak, MI
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Stafford has gone on IR and the Lions have activated Jameson Williams. Two positive trends for Lions fans.
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Steve Yzerman: 1,755 points in 1,514 regular season games. 185 points in 196 postseason games. A First-Team All-Star, Conn Smythe Trophy winner, Selke Trophy winner, Masterton Trophy winner, member of the Hockey Hall of Fame, Olympic gold medallist, and a three-time Stanley Cup Champion. Longest serving captain of one team in the history of the NHL (19 seasons). |
12-04-2022, 01:08 PM | #1270 |
Solecismic Software
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: Canton, OH
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Exciting start to the Browns/Texans. Seven seconds in, a challenge flag. Another five minutes of commercials. Feel like I'm watching a college game.
Challenge confirmed - an interception. And we miss the Texas crowd responding to Watson coming into a game for the first time since the Reagan administration. They're really not showing much of the crowd at all. I'm wondering if it's embarrassingly empty there. A three-and-out, still 14+ remaining in the first quarter and we're in another full break. Long shot of the Houston open roof - they must not have anyone in the stands at all. Last edited by Solecismic : 12-04-2022 at 01:13 PM. |
12-04-2022, 01:16 PM | #1271 |
Grizzled Veteran
Join Date: May 2006
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How is Stafford going on IR a positive?
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12-04-2022, 01:18 PM | #1272 |
Solecismic Software
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12-04-2022, 01:52 PM | #1273 |
Hockey Boy
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: Royal Oak, MI
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Being able to get Will Anderson or Jalen Carter would be great.
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Steve Yzerman: 1,755 points in 1,514 regular season games. 185 points in 196 postseason games. A First-Team All-Star, Conn Smythe Trophy winner, Selke Trophy winner, Masterton Trophy winner, member of the Hockey Hall of Fame, Olympic gold medallist, and a three-time Stanley Cup Champion. Longest serving captain of one team in the history of the NHL (19 seasons). |
12-04-2022, 01:53 PM | #1274 |
Head Coach
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Location: North Carolina
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AJ Brown just had a TD celebration (though it looks like score will be called back b/c his foot was out of bounds) where he beat the goalpost with a towel and then hugged it. And it was so weird that I’m not sure what he was even trying to communicate.
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12-04-2022, 02:47 PM | #1275 |
Head Coach
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: North Carolina
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If Marcus Mariota were an FOF quarterback, he would have the weirdest mix of bars. He is really good at what he’s really good at. And he is really bad at what he’s really bad at.
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12-04-2022, 03:51 PM | #1276 |
Solecismic Software
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: Canton, OH
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Every time Kyle Allen throws a pass, an angel throws up his wings and expresses exasperation that there's no hope for football in Houston. Not sure if you can call "tanking" because they still have decent football players who are putting in effort. But I also see no evidence they're trying to win games.
It's 24-8 Cleveland, but the offenses - Houston 6, Cleveland 3. Watson seems more than rusty. That was to be expected. |
12-04-2022, 04:25 PM | #1277 |
Head Coach
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Location: Maryland
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YEAH TIE
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12-04-2022, 04:30 PM | #1278 | |
This guy has posted so much, his fingers are about to fall off.
Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: In Absentia
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Quote:
Not even Denver has anything to say about it! Lions and Seahawks about to get top 3 picks thanks to trades.
__________________
M's pitcher Miguel Batista: "Now, I feel like I've had everything. I've talked pitching with Sandy Koufax, had Kenny G play for me. Maybe if I could have an interview with God, then I'd be served. I'd be complete." |
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12-04-2022, 06:28 PM | #1279 |
Hall Of Famer
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Newburgh, NY
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Too many mistakes for the Bengals. They've got a real uphill climb to beat the Chiefs.
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12-04-2022, 06:33 PM | #1280 | |
College Benchwarmer
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: A sports era long ago when everything didnt require a Nike logo
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Yes yes, plz yes. OTOH if we use this windfall and draft one of the big 3 QBs then go ahead and set the franchise back another 6 years. Want absolutely nothing to do with Stroud (Hou) Young or Levis. Plenty of developmental QBs that will go 4th round or longer.
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12-04-2022, 07:12 PM | #1281 | |
Grizzled Veteran
Join Date: May 2006
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Quote:
Thank you, that makes sense. I thought there was a ... less practical reason behind it. |
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12-04-2022, 08:17 PM | #1282 |
This guy has posted so much, his fingers are about to fall off.
Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: In Absentia
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Mr. Irrelevant thrown into a playoff race.
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M's pitcher Miguel Batista: "Now, I feel like I've had everything. I've talked pitching with Sandy Koufax, had Kenny G play for me. Maybe if I could have an interview with God, then I'd be served. I'd be complete." Last edited by Ksyrup : 12-04-2022 at 08:18 PM. |
12-05-2022, 09:14 AM | #1283 |
Coordinator
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12-05-2022, 09:19 AM | #1284 |
Hall Of Famer
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: the yo'
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I was convinced B. Purdy was some AI generated create a player.
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12-05-2022, 09:25 AM | #1285 |
This guy has posted so much, his fingers are about to fall off.
Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: In Absentia
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He was a decent player at Iowa State. Took over the job early in his freshman season and started the rest of his career.
His brother Chubba flipped from Louisville to FSU as one of Norvell's first signing class, but he never did much of anything and transferred to Nebraska.
__________________
M's pitcher Miguel Batista: "Now, I feel like I've had everything. I've talked pitching with Sandy Koufax, had Kenny G play for me. Maybe if I could have an interview with God, then I'd be served. I'd be complete." |
12-05-2022, 10:18 AM | #1286 |
Head Coach
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Location: Surfside Beach,SC USA
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Hard to believe they won't find someone with experience to step in here. Be a cool story if he does well though.
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Coastal Carolina Baseball-2016 National Champion! 10/17/20-Coastal Football ranked in Top 25 for first time! |
12-05-2022, 10:30 AM | #1287 | |
Head Coach
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: North Carolina
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Quote:
Who though? Trade deadline is passed. Get Fitzpatrick to come out of retirement? Blake Bortles? These are the names at the top of the "not currently on a roster" list. All of the non "are you kidding?" names are currently holding clipboards on teams right now. It really sucks that a Super Bowl caliber team lost its top 2 QBs this season. But I don't see what's out there that's not better than what they have. Last edited by albionmoonlight : 12-05-2022 at 10:30 AM. |
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12-05-2022, 10:32 AM | #1288 |
Head Coach
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: North Carolina
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dola: Maybe bring in Drew Brees or Philip Rivers for a workout?
Their bodies could not hold up for a full season. But for a playoff run? Maybe? Probably not. Is it worth the distraction of a workout? |
12-05-2022, 11:18 AM | #1289 |
Hall Of Famer
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: the yo'
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Mayfield just got cut. Probably the best of the rest.
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12-05-2022, 01:11 PM | #1290 |
Solecismic Software
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: Canton, OH
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They could probably ask, but it's rare that someone with that kind of experience would be in shape, be able to learn enough playbook. And even if that's the case, the cap gyrations would be significant. Not much season left, but teams are only carrying a few million in cap space right now.
They signed Josh Johnson off of Denver's practice squad. Purdy was OK, but the Dolphins had zero film of him. It takes 2-3 weeks of full film for an opponent to get a good read on what a quarterback is doing and who he is. They also had snagged Jacob Eason (fourth rounder out of Washington a couple of years ago) from someone's practice squad in recent weeks. And they have Kurt Benkert on their practice squad as well. So they have plenty of guys learning the book. Since Carolina is out of it and they've seen enough of Mayfield to know they don't want to sign him long-term, might as well cut him in time to possibly hook on elsewhere. I wouldn't rule it out. Mayfield did Carolina a favor by agreeing to a pay cut to make the trade with Cleveland possible so that he'd get a shot at starting. He did that in good faith, and it didn't go well. So the Panthers will do what they can to make sure he has another shot if he's going to get one. It's possible they communicated with someone. Perhaps Baltimore, which only has one completely inexperienced body on the practice squad, no third guy up on the roster, and we don't know how bad Lamar Jackson's knee injury was. They'll go with Tyler Huntley because he knows the system and did well yesterday. But they will be signing someone this week. |
12-05-2022, 01:35 PM | #1291 | |
Coordinator
Join Date: Oct 2000
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He was one of those guys that got on the map as a freshman and seemed to stick around forever. He came in for Iowa St. in their 5th game of the year, beat back-to-back ranked teams (I remember it well because WVU was undefeated and #6 at midseason) and went like 7-1 in his first 8 starts. He had a decent amount of hype early in his career and was a good college starter. but never really got to the 'next level' when the team had expectations to win the conference (lost to Louisiana to start the 2020 season and then barely beat Northern Iowa before losing to mighty, mighty Iowa to start the 2021 season), so his star kind of faded despite having pretty good numbers and Iowa State having historical levels of success. He seems like the kind of guy that Parcells would have drafted and liked back in the pre- and early free agency years. |
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12-05-2022, 01:56 PM | #1292 | |
Coordinator
Join Date: Oct 2000
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Quote:
I hadn't considered it, but Mayfield to the Ravens might be fun if Jackson is out for more than a game or two. The Ravens play 4 out of their remaining 5 games against AFC North teams and Mayfield should still be pretty familiar with them (including one with the Browns). Last edited by Swaggs : 12-05-2022 at 01:57 PM. |
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12-05-2022, 09:18 PM | #1293 |
Coordinator
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Land O Lakes FL
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These are two bad teams.
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"The blind soldier fought for me in this war. The least I can do now is fight for him. I have eyes. He hasn’t. I have a voice on the radio, he hasn’t. I was born a white man. And until a colored man is a full citizen, like me, I haven’t the leisure to enjoy the freedom that colored man risked his life to maintain for me. I don’t own what I have until he owns an equal share of it. Until somebody beats me and blinds me, I am in his debt."- Orson Welles August 11, 1946 |
12-05-2022, 11:28 PM | #1294 |
Solecismic Software
Join Date: Oct 2000
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On one hand, Tampa Bay has only scored more than 22 points once this season (same game they gave up more than 27 for the only time). And they're 6-6 and seemingly destined for a first-round playoff exit (right now, they'd draw Dallas, which they beat in week 1).
They trailed, 16-3, with five minutes to play. On the other hand, at this point, Brady went 14-19-118-2-0, not including a 44-yard pass interference call and two offensive holding calls, one of which nullified another touchdown pass. Strange game. |
12-05-2022, 11:39 PM | #1295 |
Pro Starter
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: PDX
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That game was something alright. It nearly drove me into a coma with the first 57 minutes, so I was not at all prepared for the last 3.
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Last edited by thesloppy : Today at 05:35 PM. |
12-06-2022, 07:47 AM | #1296 |
Head Coach
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Location: North Carolina
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Letting go of a head coach after one season (unless it is an Urban Meyer level disaster) is what dysfunctional franchises do. So I don't want the Saints to fire Dennis Allen.
But this team is sloppy and undisciplined. And that comes back to coaching. I also don't know if Kamara is injured or mentally checked out or what. But he's a shell of himself right now. I think (though I might be wrong) that his dead cap makes it hard to trade him this offseason. But if it is possible, I'd look into it if I were the Saints FO. |
12-06-2022, 07:48 AM | #1297 |
Head Coach
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dola: Basically, this season is over. And I'd be fine eating some money in 2023 in order to pretty much treat that as a get-the-house-in-order season and come back in 2024 with draft picks.
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12-06-2022, 08:28 AM | #1298 |
This guy has posted so much, his fingers are about to fall off.
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The Saints and Broncos are very similar this year - disappointing seasons for which another team is going to reap the 1st round benefits - but at least the Saints don't have a 5-7 year albatross around their necks.
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M's pitcher Miguel Batista: "Now, I feel like I've had everything. I've talked pitching with Sandy Koufax, had Kenny G play for me. Maybe if I could have an interview with God, then I'd be served. I'd be complete." Last edited by Ksyrup : 12-06-2022 at 08:28 AM. |
12-06-2022, 09:12 AM | #1299 | |
College Benchwarmer
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Is this a disappointing season for the Saints? They certainly didn't look like a playoff team at any point.
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12-06-2022, 09:13 AM | #1300 | |
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