WW CXXIV: When Worlds Collide - Game Over!

[JAG]

Well, I think it's just Jackal / ntn left as wolves so there was no other option for me to use the bomb. It wasn't ideal but better than not using it on a wolf. But yeah, your last paragraph basically.

[Autumn]

Originally Posted by JAG

In case others might not cone up with the reasons:

1. Would've killed me by now? I disagree. I'm not in the top tier of trusted people and I only started going after you yesterday.

2. You might've considered dubb to be more dangerous from an attacking perspective. He also seemed to agree with me about you with his last post.

3. Killing me would've really pointed the finger at you as a wolf. If you were a villager, I think I might've been an interesting NK choice to try to frame you as being a wolf.

So, point one and three contradict each other. First we're supposed to think it wouldn'lt make sense for him to have killed you by now, but in point three you dying would incriminate him. Seems like you're trying to have it both ways, which is unusual for JAG.

[JAG]

1 and 3 are not contradictory. I gave some evidence why I would've been an unlikely NK target in a general sense in point 1. In point 3, I mentioned that if I had been the NK, people probably would've been suspicious of Jackal because I had been going after him all day Friday. That's additional information why I was unlikely to have been NK'ed.

[mauchow]

I think JAG tried buying some trust like myself, except he knew his wouldn't kill Thursday Next. Kind of a goofy reach to think that JAG knew as a wolf that ntn wouldn't die because he knew she was hiding in a book again (carry-over from the day?) so the wolves knew there was no chance of a death and helps JAG a minuscule amount on the totem pole of trust.

That's how I view this move in a nutshell.

[EagleFan]

Duke attacks Thursday Next

[EagleFan]

ntn has only 7 HP and 0 defense. We should be able to manage this. The troublesome issue will be tryin to get the last wolf depending on HP of that player. We need to get Hulk out of the way too as he is killing our chances.

[Barkeep49]

JAG, can you tell us about the powers you've used? I used my Harry Potter ability on you and would love for some more information about what you've done.

[JAG]

Originally Posted by Barkeep49

JAG, can you tell us about the powers you've used? I used my Harry Potter ability on you and would love for some more information about what you've done.

Melisandre has the ability to look into her flames and see the future. Thats how I knew that Autumn's muppet wouldn't die when Nelson attacked him.

I'm purposefully trying to be vague and still answer your question. Let me know how I'm doing or if you feel like you need more detail.

[Barkeep49]

What about the attack you moved?

[JAG]

Alright, well I'm going to lower the vagueness after that response.

The day I mentioned above, I had predicted Nelson's attack that day. I knew nothing would happen to Autumn because I had already sent Nelson against someone else (can't recall who it was).

[Barkeep49]

Originally Posted by JAG

Alright, well I'm going to lower the vagueness after that response.

The day I mentioned above, I had predicted Nelson's attack that day. I knew nothing would happen to Autumn because I had already sent Nelson against someone else (can't recall who it was).

Alright. FWIW, given what we know I feel good about JAG then.

[Barkeep49]

And by feel good I mean I think his chances of being a wolf are low. I have not actually gotten a scan or anything. But, assuming Thursday Next is a wolf, JAG's actions seem far more in line with that of a villager than wolf.

[Barkeep49]

Originally Posted by Danny

Today's characters

James Bond
King Arthur
Aragorn
Dr. Mccoy

Despite my mucking it up last time is there interest in doing coordinated work on services? If there is I promise to submit for the correct person this time.

[JAG]

I definitely think it should be done. I don't think there are enough villagers to put two people on everything, but I think McCoy should be one of the ones with two, since there's a reasonable chance his service involves healing (in case we only injure instead of getting a kill).

[The Jackal]

Originally Posted by JAG

In case others might not cone up with the reasons:

1. Would've killed me by now? I disagree. I'm not in the top tier of trusted people and I only started going after you yesterday.

2. You might've considered dubb to be more dangerous from an attacking perspective. He also seemed to agree with me about you with his last post.

3. Killing me would've really pointed the finger at you as a wolf. If you were a villager, I think I might've been an interesting NK choice to try to frame you as being a wolf.

1) I realize you're not top tier trusted, but looking back it was really only Autumn who had suspicious feelings about you. What I mostly meant by this is that you've been the only person to have outspoken thoughts about me, and if I was a wolf I'd be much more comfortable trying to convince people of my innocence without you around. Instead I have to convince you that we're both villagers, and your gut has just led you astray in this instance.

2) It's true that dubb may have been coming around on the idea of me being bad, probably trusting your gut as his gut had led him to a wolf. But as I have had no say in killing people.. I don't really know how to respond.

3) This is true. It would be a nice frame job, and I think the only reason it hasn't happened is because of what you mentioned above, that you're not top tier trusted. It's a smart play by the wolves leaving you alive since you're so pigeon holed on me and that's going to buy whoever is left an extra day if you can convince others.

[The Jackal]

I will be perfectly fine moving this attack to the hulk if it looks like we have enough to take out Thursday, but at this point I'd rather go after someone that looks pretty damn wolfish.

KEYSER ATTACKS THURSDAY NEXT

[mauchow]

mal and Jayne standard attack Thursday next

Here is two attack power for ya.

[The Jackal]

I should addon to what I said above that mckerney was perfectly happy voting me as well, but you -know- I wasn't responsible for killing him. I was clearly reaching for straws there with the D1 vote but generally when people are after you the first thing you need to do is figure out if it's a misguided villager or a wolf, and his actions seemed much more likely to be wolfy.

[Danny]

As of 1318

Thursday Next: Grover, Oscar, Athena, Duke, Keyser, Malcolm, Jayne
Keyser Soze: Melisandre

[Autumn]

We've just lost power and I'm running on battery for the moment. I'll put in an attack since who knows if I'll be able to get back on. I'm a bit worried that we're being led by the nose, but since I don't have the time to look back right now, I'll have to follow suit, to avoid any random attacks.

ANIMAL ATTACKS THURSDAY NEXT
SWEDISH CHEF ATTACKS THURSDAY NEXT

[Danny]

As of 1320

Thursday Next: Grover, Oscar, Athena, Duke, Keyser, Malcolm, Jayne, Animal, Chef
Keyser Soze: Melisandre

Missing: Hulk, Cthulu, Dwight

[Zinto]

Alright I will follow suit and go after Thursday Next. Hopefully NTN is a wolf or we are looking pretty poor after today.

Dwight attacks Thursday Next

[ntndeacon]

Originally Posted by EagleFan

To answer the question about ntn and my assumption.

I didn't know anything about his brutal ability.

I find it suspicious that he first refers to that ability but leaves it open ended. Then a little later he comes back with the Ahab explanation.

I find it suspicious for multiple reasons.

1st, I see no reason that a brutal would not be in this game. The village has a chance to gain a lot of good powers so the wolves need a way to even that out.

2nd, I have won a few encounters and also seeing what some of the other encounter winners have gained I have noticed that it seems that villagers are gaining villager type powers from these encounters. I don't see it that big of a stretch that Danny would have the wolves gain wolf type powers if they win an encounter.

3rd, ntn has been playing like an UTR wolf. He was quite silent all game until I called him out. Yet he has been here to post but has made hit and run posts. Even when he is his normal quiet self he usually makes multiple posts when he is on.

4th, but I need to go back to get the specifics, there was an attack that stood out to me as wolfish the other day. Sadly I don't remember the specifics at the moment, just remember having that "remember that post" feeling.... sadly I obviously didn't remember it.

I realize y'all are even more convinced about my wolvish nature, but let me address these in some semblance of order. as to these ideas...
1. I see no reason that the brutal would be in the game. Everything I have seen gives me the impression that those standand game abilities are won not a part of our characters. Do we assume that the wolves don't get a chance to grab the villager powers and block them from using them. If we do, isn't it at least plausible thatthe reverse is true? (btw in case you missed it, I do make that claim)
2. kinda dovetails into 1. Although ido not have EF's grand experience with winning these folks, I doubt that if Samwise , to use the first one to pop in my head, had been won by a Wolf he would have different powers.
3. That only really means Iwas silent day 1. Since you have been "calling me our" since day 2. There was a reason I was quiet all week.... more than usual I mean... This was the last week of summer so with a exam and a Final to write and grade, I had less time than I thought I would.

[ntndeacon]

Originally Posted by EagleFan

Now I see what I was talking about. t was day two. ntn's 3 posts of the day...

I don't know who to attack.
A joke about mispelling.
Attack TMIMITW.

All within a couple minutes of each other and nothing that helps us at all. Not even an explanation for his vote.

4. since this was a part of the last post...
basically I had no good reason and little time. Since I was unsure I went the way to get some info. (IIRC that was the day we learned about who TMIMITW was.)

[JAG]

If you're a villager, then you flat out made a serious mistake in saving yourself the way you did. It's considerably more believable you had nefarious reasons for it.

But on the off chance you are a villager, I still suggest using your brutal on Keyser.

[ntndeacon]

Originally Posted by dubb93

Thursday clearly said he was going to die andwas going to take Jackal with him. For that to not happen makes he know he is a wolf. A villager wouldn't have allowed us to waste our votes on him and then make us remove them form the other major suspect of the day. NtN is clearly a wolf.

I thought 1st that I was going to die. I clearly said that I would use the Ahab on Jackal. I can not find the post that said Iwas going to die. (I am probably just missing it.) I assumed from the way Eagle was talking that it was a special ability, which could have reached me...(at least the description of the power says as much) So I am in as much shock as you are to see myself able to post today.

I would make the comment when I first agreed to use Ahab on Jackal, I said there I did not plan on dying. And certainly meant by that I was going to do everything I could to prevent it.

[ntndeacon]

Originally Posted by JAG

If you're a villager, then you flat out made a serious mistake in saving yourself the way you did. It's considerably more believable you had nefarious reasons for it.

But on the off chance you are a villager, I still suggest using your brutal on Keyser.

I can't. Ahab was a one day deal.

[Autumn]

I agree that EF made it sound as if NTN were dead meat. I'm confused about the timeline of events though, having to do with NTN's ability, EF's, the thing JAG did ...

Could someone who has it well in mind write out what seemed has happened over the past weekend play with those things?

(btw, my power is back)

[mauchow]

Things could get real ugly if cthulu and hulk attack randomly.

[ntndeacon]

Originally Posted by Autumn

I agree that EF made it sound as if NTN were dead meat. I'm confused about the timeline of events though, having to do with NTN's ability, EF's, the thing JAG did ...

Could someone who has it well in mind write out what seemed has happened over the past weekend play with those things?

(btw, my power is back)

I am sure this will be corrected where wrong (I am going from memory)
Someone suggested sharing info from the interactions... and several did..
The EF claimed to know several things abou me that he wanted explaining before he let them out...(He might had mentioned the save of Tyrith at this time) Regardless, this led me to believe he was referring to one of my powers (The Banish power that can remove a player from using his special abilities and being able to attack (they can speak while in banishment though))
In a separate post I went along with the growing consensus and revealed that which I had won...leading to many believing I had always been the brutal wolf , or had won a wolf power because I was a wolf.

EF claimed that he could kill me on his own and everyone else should look elsewhere for possibilities.. (I think the idea of killing 2 wolves was in his head there , butthat is mere speculation) I used a power to hide in books for a day, to avoid most attacks (my description claimed that there were some that could still reached me) I put the Ahab win on Jackal as had been requested , just in case.

[Autumn]

Looking back ... I don't understand why JAG used a bomb on Thursday Next. What would the reasoning have been before knowing he had dodged the attack?

I don't understand why everyone has latched onto Thursday as being a wolf. He dodged an attack. Any villager would do that if being targeted. He could have revealed that fact, I suppose, but I don't see why this is an ironclad wolf move to not say anything.

Myself I'm leaning toward voting JAG and EF myself.

[Barkeep49]

Originally Posted by Autumn

Looking back ... I don't understand why JAG used a bomb on Thursday Next. What would the reasoning have been before knowing he had dodged the attack?

I don't understand why everyone has latched onto Thursday as being a wolf. He dodged an attack. Any villager would do that if being targeted. He could have revealed that fact, I suppose, but I don't see why this is an ironclad wolf move to not say anything.

Myself I'm leaning toward voting JAG and EF myself.

JAG had the ability to change someone's attack. He choose to move Nelson's attack away from you. Assuming you're a villager, this seems like a poor wolf play to make if you're not going to take credit for it. We only know that this happened, or at least I only know, because of the power I used on JAG.

[The Jackal]

I think people see NTN using his ability as an action that a villager wouldn't have taken, because it's forcing us to use another day of resources on him. But in a game when everyone has special powers, I can see everyone wanting to use them for the fun factor.

[The Jackal]

Do we know if Schmidty (condolences, it always seems like something crappy happens to you during these games!) is going to be replaced? At this point we've got a lot focused on Thursday and I'm willing to have a splinter attack to try and prevent anymore random damage to us. Though I doubt I can finish hulk off myself.

[Barkeep49]

Whether Schmidty is replaced or not (I always feel for him personally at times like this) I think the Hulk is worth taking out as we have no real history/understanding and he's a powerful powerful character. I'm just not sure how divided we can make our votes against Thursday at this point.

[Danny]

Originally Posted by The Jackal

Do we know if Schmidty (condolences, it always seems like something crappy happens to you during these games!) is going to be replaced? At this point we've got a lot focused on Thursday and I'm willing to have a splinter attack to try and prevent anymore random damage to us. Though I doubt I can finish hulk off myself.

Schmidty offered to be replaced. I told him as long as he can get his vote in it I would prefer he stayed. That said, if someone is willing to sign up to take his place, please PM me. If he hasn't checked in or voted in the next few hours, I will let the replacement take over.

[Autumn]

At this point I think we're in a bind, if we take out Hulk we're going to waste days of voting (I think it will take a number of days, even if we focus on it), and there's a good chance he's just a villager. I'm more inclined to just bite the bullet and hope he kills a wolf. His chances should be getting better.

That's a good point about JAG, BK If he has a one time power and no wolves are under attack, I can see him using it on me, but yo'ure right he would probably make a deal out of it.

[JAG]

Originally Posted by Autumn

Looking back ... I don't understand why JAG used a bomb on Thursday Next. What would the reasoning have been before knowing he had dodged the attack?

I don't understand why everyone has latched onto Thursday as being a wolf. He dodged an attack. Any villager would do that if being targeted. He could have revealed that fact, I suppose, but I don't see why this is an ironclad wolf move to not say anything.

Myself I'm leaning toward voting JAG and EF myself.

dubb laid out his reasoning why ntn's actions made him a wolf. I read them and agreed, and before night actions had processed, said ntn and Jackal were wolves. I really don't have a clue what you don't understand as I laid out my reasoning in-thread.

Can I ask why Jackal seems to be getting a pass from people? Even if you aren't getting the same vibe I am from him, his four attacks have been on two confirmed villagers over four days and whatever Hulk is after he switched off mckerney on D4. I'm very surprised I'm the only one to be mentioning him.

[Autumn]

Hmm, I don't feel Thursday is an open and shut (hah) case, and there's plenty of people attacking her. I'd rather make a contest out of it and give us something to learn from the vote. EF it just giving me a gut feel, looking back through his posts, he seems to be just generally encouraging suspicion, saying things I'd expect from a wolf. We should at least learn something from who moves to him, who doesn't.

ANIMAL UNATTACKS THURSDAY NEXT
SWEDISH CHEF UNATTACKS THURSDAY NEXT

ANIMAL ATTACKS DUKE NUKEM
SWEDISH CHEF ATTACKS DUKE NUKEM

[Autumn]

Originally Posted by JAG

dubb laid out his reasoning why ntn's actions made him a wolf. I read them and agreed, and before night actions had processed, said ntn and Jackal were wolves. I really don't have a clue what you don't understand as I laid out my reasoning in-thread.

I read dubb's reasoning and commented on it. But my understanding is that you placed the bomb on Thursday before the results were posted. You said that you put it on Thursday instead of Keyser in case Thursday was telling the truth about a brutal ability, didn't you? So that means you placed the bomb before you knew Thursday dodged the attack, no?

[Danny]

As of 1340

Thursday Next: Grover, Oscar, Athena, Duke, Keyser, Malcolm, Jayne, Dwight
Keyser Soze: Melisandre
Duke: Animal, Chef

Missing: Hulk, Cthulu

[JAG]

Originally Posted by Autumn

I read dubb's reasoning and commented on it. But my understanding is that you placed the bomb on Thursday before the results were posted. You said that you put it on Thursday instead of Keyser in case Thursday was telling the truth about a brutal ability, didn't you? So that means you placed the bomb before you knew Thursday dodged the attack, no?

I put the bomb on Thursday instead of Keyser because Keyser claimed to have an ability to make night actions against him randomly hit someone else once / game (or something like that, he revealed that sometime D4). I didn't want to take the chance of him using it and figured I would use it against the other suspected wolf. I didn't realize when I sent it against him that he was still hiding out.

[Chubby]

I'm waiting at the dmv so ill try this from phone. Pardon the runon paragraph tho. Nobody is getting a pass from me, to me its an issue of prioritizing who is the best target to nail another wolf and I think that is ntn. I agree with the people saying the hulk needs to be removed as well, if u aren't helping the viillage u r hurting it and right now the hulk is hurting the village.

[Zinto]

If the Hulk gets another random attack then if we do attack him we have to make sure we kill him. If I remember correctly Hoops said he does more damage if he is attacked and that is more then likely why McKerney was killed.

[Zinto]

Also I think wasting another day of voting for him is bad news. We really can not afford to waste anymore days on attacking villagers regardless of how active they can be.

[Zinto]

Autumn why do you think Eagle is a wolf and why do you think Jag is a wolf?

[Autumn]

Well, frankly Zinto I'm beginning to think I'm just lost in this game. JAG and EF stood out to me reading back over the weekend just from the vibe of their posts. I find I have best success from that.

However, BK makes a good point about JAG, and I think I'm just not understanding the sequence of events with everybody's special actions as well. My ability to participate has been real spotty as I'm under a bunch of deadlines. I feel that I'm either out of the loop or being led by the nose as a lot of people seem to feel we've got the wolves fairly dead to rights and I'm not following.

We're seeing so much consensus on Thursday Next it makes me worry, since usually only a seer scan makes people line up like that. It seems unlikely that if Thursday was a wolf everybody would have so easily hopped on what doesn't seem an airtight case.

But I'm starting to get the feeling it's just me. These work projects have just messed with my game.

[The Jackal]

Originally Posted by JAG

Can I ask why Jackal seems to be getting a pass from people?

I don't think I'm getting a pass, I think people are more convinced NTN is a wolf than me and we've seen it isn't very smart to split resources when you think you have a wolf nailed. And on top of that people are pissed that the hulk has been taking out villagers, especially when we're not positive what side he's on. I'm sure I'll be one of the main candidates once we deal with NTN's allegiance.

[Zinto]

I understand the worry on the consensus on NTN. If he is a wolf though I doubt a wolf would not vote for him and if he is a villager then the wolves would just pile on him.

The thing I most do not buy about NTN's response on Eagle's attack is why would he use his book hiding ability if he thought he was going to die anyways? Or why would he not tell us he was going to use it. It does not make much sense to me.

[Zinto]

I was really just trying to gauge your thoughts on people I and I am sure others are not sure on. Since if it comes to a Jackal and Jag face off sometime soon every thought counts.