NFL 2022-23 Season Thread

[albionmoonlight]

Originally Posted by Ryche

Is this a disappointing season for the Saints? They certainly didn't look like a playoff team at any point.

*ahem* [points to 4th quarter of week 1]

[Solecismic]

Seems Mayfield is a Ram, since the Wolford, Stafford's primary backup, was injured on Sunday. An interesting waiver claim. The Rams get decent compensation if he signs as a free agent elsewhere in the off-season. Plus a relatively inexpensive way to finish out the season since they don't really have other options.

[GrantDawg]

It is pretty crazy that Mayfield "bad play"-ed himself into playoff contention.

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[Lathum]

Originally Posted by GrantDawg

It is pretty crazy that Mayfield "bad play"-ed himself into playoff contention.

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The Rams are 3-9...

[Thomkal]

Saw a report on espn I think that Jimmy G may not need foot surgery after all so could be back before the end of the season.

[GrantDawg]

Sorry, that was the wrong. I was still thinking 49ers.

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[Ksyrup]

Looks like the Falcons have thrown in the towel. Desmond Ridder starting for the rest of the year.

[Edward64]

I make an effort to watch the Falcons now, just to see how he develops.

[albionmoonlight]

The Bucs beating the Saints was good for the long-term health of the Falcons. It let them give up on the "maybe we can catch Tampa and win the division" idea and start seeing how their rookie QB looks for 4 games.

[albionmoonlight]

So apparently Mayfield might play for the Rams.

Jim, or anyone else who knows this stuff, how much can he possibly have down of the playbook? You hear over and over how much details matter and reps matter and how crazy hard it is to play QB from a mental standpoint. Then a guy shows up early in the week, and the team says "He's good to go"

How does that work?

[stevew]

A:not well

[Ksyrup]

I swear there was a situation on one of the teams within the past month or so where they picked someone up and they played that week because I remember hearing the announcer talk about how the QB had the plays on his phone and listened to them day and night to get them down. Something to that effect. I can't remember who it was or what the team situation was.

[rjolley]

Originally Posted by Ksyrup

I swear there was a situation on one of the teams within the past month or so where they picked someone up and they played that week because I remember hearing the announcer talk about how the QB had the plays on his phone and listened to them day and night to get them down. Something to that effect. I can't remember who it was or what the team situation was.

I remember hearing something like that for McCaffery in San Fran, but not for a QB.

[Solecismic]

Originally Posted by albionmoonlight

So apparently Mayfield might play for the Rams.

Jim, or anyone else who knows this stuff, how much can he possibly have down of the playbook? You hear over and over how much details matter and reps matter and how crazy hard it is to play QB from a mental standpoint. Then a guy shows up early in week, and the team says "He's good to go"

How does that work?

Teams have a rigorous schedule for installing a game plan during the week leading up to a game. A game plan is a subset of the team playbook.

Familiarity with plays and terminology is vital. The coach can put together a package basically providing an overview (the same one they'd repeat as an introduction to the year's playbook at the start of training camp) of terminology and core concepts. That would be a good start. A veteran quarterback would be capable of working through that quickly.

By Tuesday, coaches are finalizing the game plan for an upcoming game. That means they've selected the plays that will be installed that week. On Wednesday, they start going through those plays on the practice field, often starting with the plays they're pretty certain they're going to use (the big sections like first-and-ten-earned, first-and-ten-at-possession, second and mid-range. By Friday, they're down to special-use plays and they've practiced through just about everything they're prepared to do on Sunday. Saturday is a review day and practice is short and easy and there might be travel.

If this were an ordinary week, Mayfield would likely start. The Rams have nothing to lose and this is a good test. But Thursday games are different. Everything is condensed. It's important that the Rams are home tonight, because at least the schedule doesn't have to allow for team travel time. It's a night game, so right now, they're probably doing the final in-sweats walkthrough they'd ordinarily do on Saturdays.

It's not ideal, and they're probably dealing with half of the usual number of installed and understood plays (call it 20) with many of the variations and line-calls off the table entirely, but it's possible. It's strange, but a lot of this is up to Mayfield. If he makes a call, it's only important that he understands what he's calling, because the rest of the team will react in a specific way. In that way, it's easier to plug in a quarterback and run a restricted game plan than plug in an offensive lineman who might be clueless how the rest of the team will react to a defensive shift or possible blitz.

Still, I'd expect the Raiders to take advantage tonight and blitz more than usual, because Mayfield can't possibly know everything about how the team will react.

[Ksyrup]

Originally Posted by rjolley

I remember hearing something like that for McCaffery in San Fran, but not for a QB.

Maybe that's what it was. He fits, since he switched teams mid-week.

[Honolulu_Blue]

Whatever happens with Baker Mayfield and the Rams, they just have to keep losing. Daddy wants Will Anderson or Jalen Carter in Honolulu Blue next year!

[cartman]

So Congress released their report on the Washington Commaners (nee Redskins). Buried in the report was that the leaked emails that got Gruden fired came from the Washington side.

https://twitter.com/SportsLawLust/st...09011963940864

[Swaggs]

I saw this headline on ESPN with a headline saying "Would Burrow, Tagovailoa, Herbert, or Hurts go #1 If We Did A Redraft?" :Ranking 2020 NFL draft QBs: Burrow, Tua, Herbert, Hurts

Am I out of it, or would anyone on Earth possibly not choose Burrow? I would think that maybe Mahomes and possibly Allen would be the only players in the league even in consideration to be better, long-term, than Burrow.

[Solecismic]

The question with Hurts is how long can he do what he's doing this season? He's the MVP. Mahomes is the generational standard. Yes, since Mahomes, Burrow seems like the best HoF bet. I'm not yet convinced Allen is at that level.

Another name I'd throw into the mix, right behind the Herbert level perhaps, is Jared Goff. History justifies the Rams' decision, but I think the Lions could win with him if they commit - build a defense that can keep them in games.

[BishopMVP]

Jared Goff just behind Allen & Herbert? Hard pass.

[Solecismic]

Originally Posted by BishopMVP

Jared Goff just behind Allen & Herbert? Hard pass.

I was expecting that response. I think it's a common gut reaction to hearing the name.

So, what happened? After his second season, the NFL did its annual ranking of the top 100 players - he was 38th overall, or 10th among QBs (you should see where Wentz was). After his third season, a second Pro-Bowl appearance, a loss in the Super Bowl, up to 32nd and 8th.

These rankings are little better than what I have in mind. I'm not as positive about Allen as many.

And certainly, as the relationship with Sean McVay seemed to deteriorate, his numbers dropped after that third year. That year, he was 6th in the NFL in ANY/A. He's currently 8th this season and his interception numbers are excellent with the Lions.

So you've got a 28-year-old with a 53-47-1 career record and some excellent surrounding stats who doesn't have Stafford's arm strength, but can make most throws. He reached near-elite status quickly, but clashed with his coach and was traded to the worst team in the league, but with lots of draft picks.

I feel like Detroit's turning a corner here, and if they can get a guy like Anderson who looks like he'll be a force in the pass rush, that could change everything.

[thesloppy]

This is playing out almost exactly like the MNF game.

An absolutely horrible game, 16-3 until 3:00 to go in the 4th...

[thesloppy]

Crazy. And practically the same scoring as MNF at the end there, down to the seconds.

[BishopMVP]

Originally Posted by Solecismic

I was expecting that response. I think it's a common gut reaction to hearing the name.

So, what happened? After his second season, the NFL did its annual ranking of the top 100 players - he was 38th overall, or 10th among QBs (you should see where Wentz was). After his third season, a second Pro-Bowl appearance, a loss in the Super Bowl, up to 32nd and 8th.

These rankings are little better than what I have in mind. I'm not as positive about Allen as many.

And certainly, as the relationship with Sean McVay seemed to deteriorate, his numbers dropped after that third year. That year, he was 6th in the NFL in ANY/A. He's currently 8th this season and his interception numbers are excellent with the Lions.

So you've got a 28-year-old with a 53-47-1 career record and some excellent surrounding stats who doesn't have Stafford's arm strength, but can make most throws. He reached near-elite status quickly, but clashed with his coach and was traded to the worst team in the league, but with lots of draft picks.

I feel like Detroit's turning a corner here, and if they can get a guy like Anderson who looks like he'll be a force in the pass rush, that could change everything.

He didn't have a personality clash with his coach, his coach thought his limitations as a QB were holding the offense and the team back, traded for a QB with a career record of 74-90-1 and immediately won a Super Bowl.

If you want to convince me Goff is the 16th best QB or whatever and the Lions can win with him, go for it. If you want to argue he would even be considered in a re-draft over Josh Allen or Justin Herbert by any NFL team I don't buy it.

[Ksyrup]

The Lions can't catch a break even when they don't play.

[Edward64]

22/35 for 230 yards and 1 TD. Was sacked 4 times though

All things considered, a good showing

[Solecismic]

Originally Posted by thesloppy

Crazy. And practically the same scoring as MNF at the end there, down to the seconds.

I was working on a graphic to this end. It's beyond remarkable.

As for Goff and McVay, a lot was written about their personality clashes. Goff is definitely laid back and not a 24-hour film guy. McVay is intense.

I wrote in the tier right behind Herbert and Allen, not ahead of them. Probably in the 10-12 range (I'd have to count it out carefully - I'm more a Herbert fan, if he can stay healthy, though he is gutty about playing hurt).

[thesloppy]

After watching all of Goff's games with Detroit and a bunch with the Rams, Goff seems like he wears his strengths and weaknesses on his sleeve pretty plainly. He throws a great ball as long as you keep him clean, and as soon as he starts getting hit he coughs up the ball too easily, loses confidence & starts making bad throws.

Goff seems like he needs confidence support and McVay lost his confidence in Goff, whereas Campbell seems like he's willing to give all 'his guys' unconditional support & they seem like a good match.

I think we all knew the Lions were married to Goff for at least this long and he's probably outplaying most people's expectations at this exact point in time. TBD whether that's actually a good or bad thing for the Lions long term plans.

[thesloppy]

Originally Posted by Solecismic

I was working on a graphic to this end. It's beyond remarkable.

I'd like to see that!

[Ksyrup]

Originally Posted by thesloppy

I think we all knew the Lions were married to Goff for at least this long and he's probably outplaying most people's expectations at this exact point in time. TBD whether that's actually a good or bad thing for the Lions long term plans.

Seems like this is as close to "best of both worlds" as the Lions could have hoped for. They are starting to win a bit, but they still own the Rams 1st round pick, which (even after last night's unlikely victory) could end up staying in the top 10. That would give them the ability to pick a QB. So they can ride Goff a little longer if he keeps up his good play and groom the successor.

Of course, knowing the Lions, the Rams will go on a hot streak, the pick will end up about the same place as Detroit's own pick, and they'll end up choosing the one QB who craters.

[Honolulu_Blue]

I didn’t see the end of the game, but very disappointing that the Raiders blew it.

As far as Goff and the Lions go, I have been very much in the “we need a QB of the future now” camp since the trade. As things stand now, however, there doesn’t seem to be too end QB talent in this draft (after Young, who has question marks) and given how the Lions offense has played, spending the picks on upgrading the defense seems like the best course of action.

By all accounts Stroud sounds like a young Goff - a great, accurate passer if everything is going right and he isn’t facing pressure. I have no confidence in Levis.

Goff has great chemistry with OC Ben Johnson and when St. Brown has been healthy this offense is pretty potent.

[miked]

Goff seems like he's having a great season considering what seems to be a lack of talent around him at skill positions. If the Lions were to draft a Chase-type WR, could Goff not get them a WC? He was far outplaying Stafford this season and his worst season seems to have come from when he threw like 650 times. He's not the guy who should throw 40 times a game.

[Ksyrup]

Posted this in the college thread but it applies here as news:

Sounds like Liam Coen, who left the Rams to be UKs OC last year and really is responsible for the Will Levis hype, then went back to the Rams this year as OC after the former OC took the Vikings job, is headed back to UK to reclaim the OC job.

I assume some of this has to do with McVey being a known short-timer? Especially with the crash-and-burn this year.

[Honolulu_Blue]

Originally Posted by miked

Goff seems like he's having a great season considering what seems to be a lack of talent around him at skill positions. If the Lions were to draft a Chase-type WR, could Goff not get them a WC? He was far outplaying Stafford this season and his worst season seems to have come from when he threw like 650 times. He's not the guy who should throw 40 times a game.

They have Jameson Williams for the first time this year. St. Brown is fantastic. Between those two, a great offensive line, and solid running backs in Swift (when healthy) and Jamal Williams they have some good weapons.

[thesloppy]

Originally Posted by Honolulu_Blue

They have Jameson Williams for the first time this year. St. Brown is fantastic. Between those two, a great offensive line, and solid running backs in Swift (when healthy) and Jamal Williams they have some good weapons.

Yeah, in their current state they've got more skill player depth than they've had in a long time.

Like maybe 5-6 weeks ago I was starting to consider if maybe Brad Holmes was all smoke. Paschal was still injured with Williams sitting on IR & Hutchinson was looking suspect in the very early stretch. Now, those injured guys are finally back, Hutchinson has looked every bit of a stud, Rodriguez has been an immediate contributing starter and even dudes like James Houston and Kerby Joseph have had multiple huge games, after being invisible early. Great to see.

[Brian Swartz]

We'll see. I've seen this movie before. They're on a good stretch right now, but sustaining it is a lot harder.

[QuikSand]

I really want it to happen for the Lions. So many angles to root for there.

[Honolulu_Blue]

Originally Posted by thesloppy

Yeah, in their current state they've got more skill player depth than they've had in a long time.

Like maybe 5-6 weeks ago I was starting to consider if maybe Brad Holmes was all smoke. Paschal was still injured with Williams sitting on IR & Hutchinson was looking suspect in the very early stretch. Now, those injured guys are finally back, Hutchinson has looked every bit of a stud, Rodriguez has been an immediate contributing starter and even dudes like James Houston and Kerby Joseph have had multiple huge games, after being invisible early. Great to see.

I was right there with you. Right around the Hockenson deal I was super suspect of Holmes. His drafts started to look weak and then, all of a sudden, like you said people got healthy and the rookies started to round into form and now this year’s draft is looking like it could be the foundation for a decent defense and the offense - when St. Brown is healthy (the numbers when he’s there vs. when not are crazy) - has been really good.

It will likely all fall apart or amount to nothing, this being the Lions at all, but it is fun to have a little excitement and hope.

[cuervo72]

Originally Posted by QuikSand

I really want it to happen for the Lions. So many angles to root for there.

They need to get their threads in order though. That Boise State mono ultra blue shit has got to go.

[Swaggs]

God bless our friends here that are Bears’ fans. Four seasons of Trubisky must have taken years off your lives.

[Carman Bulldog]

Originally Posted by Solecismic

The question with Hurts is how long can he do what he's doing this season?

When I watch Hurts, he just seems to take a lot less hits than his contemporaries. Whereas it feels like Josh Allen takes a lot of contact - and in fact almost seeks out contact - Hurts is very good at getting his yards and getting out of bounds. He just doesn't seem to take the kind of damage of other guys such as Allen, Lamar, Cam Newton, etc.

[bhlloy]

Hutchinson is for real. St Brown and Williams feel like they could be a top 5 WR pairing. They seem to have got some real contributors in the later rounds of the draft the last few years. Still a way to go, but the Lions feel like they are going in the right direction for the first time in… forever?

[Carman Bulldog]

That definitely looked like a Chris Moore touchdown by the Texans. Weird that they didn't even show any replays of it.

[Thomkal]

Pretty brutal day if you want your QB to stay healthy. I think it was almost Emergency QB vs Backup QB in Pit/Bal today

[thesloppy]

I really expected the Lions to collapse today, but they look legit. Despite just giving up 400 passing yards, their defense has turned a bit of a corner & their remaining schedule is also pretty soft.

[Solecismic]

Originally Posted by Carman Bulldog

When I watch Hurts, he just seems to take a lot less hits than his contemporaries. Whereas it feels like Josh Allen takes a lot of contact - and in fact almost seeks out contact - Hurts is very good at getting his yards and getting out of bounds. He just doesn't seem to take the kind of damage of other guys such as Allen, Lamar, Cam Newton, etc.

He kept on a classic option run early on. Looked like the same play Trey Lance lost his season on. He didn't get hit hard, but he was in the right place for a big hit.

I think we say this about all running quarterbacks - it looks that way until there's a big hit.

Quarterbacks are tough creatures. Many coaches say the good ones are the toughest players they've ever coached. But they can't accumulate damage. We see the long careers now. I'm sure Tom Brady and others would readily admit that what he's done would not have been possible in the days before a defensive lineman flopping full-weight on a quarterback was 15 yards.

What we don't see is that translating to that top fifth of quarterbacks who run the most. Maybe Hurts will be the exception. He threw some darts today. As long as he throws like that, he's elite level. How many big hits before he can't throw like that anymore?

So... Lions.

When they were 1-6, they had scored 24.7 points per game and allowed 32.1 - a pace to break the NFL record for points allowed.

Over the last six games, they're 5-1, and have scored 25.1 over that stretch, but allowed 17.4. No longer threatening history.

I can't say I'm convinced yet that they're good, but at least they're competitive. But after three straight games at home, they're on the road for three of their last four. Not the toughest schedule, but they have no room for error.

[NobodyHere]

I refuse to let the Lions get my hopes up.

[miami_fan]

Deebo Samuel was just carted off the field.

[Ksyrup]

It appears Deebo is done for the season, at least by his reaction and being carted off.

[Ksyrup]

Smile if you need to go home and be a family man. pic.twitter.com/UQAjfjFEbp

— . (@Nigerianscamsss) December 11, 2022