2022-2024 Video Games Thread

[Atocep]

Dragon Age 4 is set for a full reveal June 11th. I'm of the mindset that EA has ruined Bioware until I'm proven wrong.

[Kodos]

This looks good. Too bad I don't have an Xbox...

[GrantDawg]

Why did I read that as Indiana Jones and the Great Circle Jerk? I thought it might be commentary on the last movie.

[dubb93]

Originally Posted by Atocep

Dragon Age 4 is set for a full reveal June 11th. I'm of the mindset that EA has ruined Bioware until I'm proven wrong.

Inquisition was too good for them to be ruined. Anthem, Andromeda, and DA 2 were all pretty rough but everything else they have released has been quality from the entire MA Trilogy (I don’t care how you feel about the ending all 3 games were solid) to the rest of the Dragon Age games.

[Atocep]

Originally Posted by dubb93

Inquisition was too good for them to be ruined. Anthem, Andromeda, and DA 2 were all pretty rough but everything else they have released has been quality from the entire MA Trilogy (I don’t care how you feel about the ending all 3 games were solid) to the rest of the Dragon Age games.

Inquisition was ok. The biggest problem the series has it's moved so far away from its roots. The MMO style combat is just meh and the open world was mediocre. It's like they just made a single player MMO with a solid story because the world and towns within the game lacked any feeling of being alive. It had that feeling of MMO staleness.

Andromeda was complete trash. I know it wasn't the primary ME team that worked on the game, but it was embarrassing for Bioware to release. Anthem was similarly bad. EA's obsession with trying to turn a single player RPG developer into a live service studio has failed miserably and Bioware has bled talent because of it.

[Edward64]

Originally Posted by Atocep

Inquisition was ok. The biggest problem the series has it's moved so far away from its roots. The MMO style combat is just meh and the open world was mediocre. It's like they just made a single player MMO with a solid story because the world and towns within the game lacked any feeling of being alive. It had that feeling of MMO staleness.

I remember Dragon's Age 1 & 2 which were top down. I never caught on with 3 and probably won't with 4. But the first 2 were great.

[dubb93]

The issue with Inquisition’s combat was that it was better on controller than it was mouse and keyboard. You ask why?

With a mouse and keyboard it was real-time press a button to pause. With a controller it was auto pause when combat starts, issue orders, hold right trigger to advance time, release to stop again. I have no idea why they made that design choice.

EDIT: Well that and they eliminated healing spells. They famously said that “healing isn’t fun.”

[Atocep]

Inquisition released at a very opportune time. It got solid reviews and was generally well received, but 6 months later Witcher 3 released and everyone forgot about it. Now, looking at the 2 games, they look like they were released in different generations rather than 6 months apart.

[dubb93]

Originally Posted by Atocep

Inquisition released at a very opportune time. It got solid reviews and was generally well received, but 6 months later Witcher 3 released and everyone forgot about it. Now, looking at the 2 games, they look like they were released in different generations rather than 6 months apart.

I don’t think it’s fair to say people forgot about it considering how well received the DLC was and I don’t consider the two games even in the same genre. One is an action RPG and the other is a party based (isomeric lite) real time with pause based RPG.

If you are going to compare the new dragon age to Elden Ring and Cyberpunk, yea it’s not going to stack up very well. Those games are going to combat much cooler than DA is with its isometric base. The bar for it going to be BG3, Pathfinder, and Pillars.

[dubb93]

All of that being said I agree that, yes, Witcher 3 changed videogames forever. When it released it was possibly the best videogame for it’s time of all time. It sucked attention off of everything for a long time in the same way that GTA 6 is about ready to do.

[CrimsonFox]

I am all in on started valley. It's my third time attempting it snd I finally am super into it.

[CrimsonFox]

Originally Posted by dubb93

All of that being said I agree that, yes, Witcher 3 changed videogames forever. When it released it was possibly the best videogame for it’s time of all time. It sucked attention off of everything for a long time in the same way that GTA 6 is about ready to do.

Pffff...Peter Molyneux here

[dubb93]

Originally Posted by CrimsonFox

Pffff...Peter Molyneux here

I will never forgive that man for what he said Black and White would be. He’s dead to me.

[Atocep]

Originally Posted by dubb93

I don’t think it’s fair to say people forgot about it considering how well received the DLC was and I don’t consider the two games even in the same genre. One is an action RPG and the other is a party based (isomeric lite) real time with pause based RPG.

If you are going to compare the new dragon age to Elden Ring and Cyberpunk, yea it’s not going to stack up very well. Those games are going to combat much cooler than DA is with its isometric base. The bar for it going to be BG3, Pathfinder, and Pillars.

The comparison between Witcher 3 and Inqusition is for the game world. Bioware chose to go with an open world with Inquisiton that puts it in the same class as other open world games even if the combat is different. Both Bioware and CDProjekt were making their fist open world games coming of games that offered some choice and exploration but in more confined areas.

When you look them through that lens and as large budget games released within 6 months of each other there's a monumental gap. That is why I think they were fortunate to hit a release window before Witcher 3. CDPojekts open world felt alive, the towns were populated, and Inqusition felt like a stagnate world that you would see in WoW or other MMOs by comparison.

All of this is probably because one of my pet peeves in game development is a pointless open world. I wouldn't call Inquisition's approach to an open world pointless, but it definitely felt dated fairly soon after release.

I'm hoping that Bioware has taken some notes from Larian and CDProjekt and we see that in Veilguard. The trailer they released was pretty terrible and didn't feel anything like Dragon Age, but the stuff that's come out so far today is far more positive. I'm happy the game is releasing this year instead of another 1-2 year wait after the reveal.

[Edward64]

Made me check on Star Citizen. Still in Alpha.

Old saying "don't let perfection get in the way of good". I like to think this is what's happening vs out of control project & wanton milking the cash cow.

[rjolley]

Originally Posted by Edward64

Made me check on Star Citizen. Still in Alpha.

Old saying "don't let perfection get in the way of good". I like to think this is what's happening vs out of control project & wanton milking the cash cow.

From what I've heard it's a bit of perfection, but more out of control scope creep. And I'm sure that cash milk is slowing SC's release down. Still waiting on word of a release date for the single player mode Squadron 42 which is supposed to be feature complete.

[JonInMiddleGA]

fwiw, I received a Valorant console beta invite this afternoon.

I'm not gonna redeem until I see if Will gets one (it'd mean more to him than to me honestly, he's a daily player, I'm moderately curious to see how they execute a very different control scheme) but by next weekend at the latest one or the other of us should be in.

[RainMaker]

Anyone tried V Rising? Not a fan of vampire stuff but the crafting and survival aspect look really good.

[Atocep]

Originally Posted by RainMaker

Anyone tried V Rising? Not a fan of vampire stuff but the crafting and survival aspect look really good.

I've wanted to like it. I've tried to get into multiple times and have friends that have put countless hours into it. I can't get around to liking it.

If you play on a controller, the controls are bad. I'm not sure how it is when the game progresses, but the day cycles early on are painfully boring.

The combat is ok but I didn't think the building was all that interesting. It's really just run of the mill survival building with a vamp/goth theme.

[GrantDawg]

Man, Paradox keeps getting hit with bad news after bad news. The latest is that their version of The Sims, "Life By You", has been cancelled. This thing has been in the making for years, and was supposed to go into early access a couple of months ago. After three delays in release, they just announced they are stopping development all together. Paradox has just had flop after failure after flop recently.

[Coffee Warlord]

Originally Posted by Atocep

I've wanted to like it. I've tried to get into multiple times and have friends that have put countless hours into it. I can't get around to liking it.

If you play on a controller, the controls are bad. I'm not sure how it is when the game progresses, but the day cycles early on are painfully boring.

The combat is ok but I didn't think the building was all that interesting. It's really just run of the mill survival building with a vamp/goth theme.

I liked it ... for like a day or two. Then you start to realize how shallow the gameplay actually is, and yes, the building isn't particularly interesting either.

[dubb93]

Originally Posted by GrantDawg

Man, Paradox keeps getting hit with bad news after bad news. The latest is that their version of The Sims, "Life By You", has been cancelled. This thing has been in the making for years, and was supposed to go into early access a couple of months ago. After three delays in release, they just announced they are stopping development all together. Paradox has just had flop after failure after flop recently.

Wow. Must have been really bad. It sounded really good on paper too.

[Thomkal]

I always thought it was a poor choice to take on the Sims, but surprised it didn't make it to release.

[GrantDawg]

There are a number of companies that are doing it. "Paralives" look like it has a lot of promise, and is supposed to come out next year. "InZoi" is targeting later this year, and at least graphically looks pretty amazing.

Sent from my SM-S916U using Tapatalk

[Mota]

I think it's the perfect time to take on The Sims, what have they released lately? The game is oooooold now and a more modern version with possibly a slightly different take on the category would be given a chance by the fans.

[bhlloy]

Not only old but basically the DLC is so ubiquitous and such a buggy mess that the game they sell as part of the packages on Steam is almost unplayable for many people.

Which is probably the only reason Paradox were interested in the first place to be honest, shit buggy DLC that makes the game worse is their bread and butter.

[GrantDawg]

The Sims 4 has made lots of money, but it has not been a "success" to fans at all. The Sims 3 and The Sims 2 had better features and game-play. The direction they took with TS4 was a set back. There is just so many people who love that kind of game, that I am really shocked it has taken this long for other companies to start trying to knock them off.

That is also part of why the "Life By You" failure is so painful. Most fans will say that TS2 was the best version of the game, and the lead designer of "Life By You" was a designer on TS2. It just makes you wonder how so many projects tied to Paradox have gone off the rails.

[dubb93]

Big yikes that one of the producers of DA 4 came out and said that “Veilguard is the first game in the Dragon Age franchise where the combat is actually fun.”

If that is the mindset of the dev team I think it’s safe to say this one is going to miss the mark for actual fans of the series. Maybe they make up enough new fans willing to jump into part 4 of the story to make it worthwhile to EA, but that seems like a long shot.

[Mota]

Originally Posted by dubb93

Big yikes that one of the producers of DA 4 came out and said that “Veilguard is the first game in the Dragon Age franchise where the combat is actually fun.”

If that is the mindset of the dev team I think it’s safe to say this one is going to miss the mark for actual fans of the series. Maybe they make up enough new fans willing to jump into part 4 of the story to make it worthwhile to EA, but that seems like a long shot.

Hopefully it will be fun for the people who bought DA 1-3, and not just another souls-like game.

[Atocep]

Originally Posted by dubb93

Big yikes that one of the producers of DA 4 came out and said that “Veilguard is the first game in the Dragon Age franchise where the combat is actually fun.”

If that is the mindset of the dev team I think it’s safe to say this one is going to miss the mark for actual fans of the series. Maybe they make up enough new fans willing to jump into part 4 of the story to make it worthwhile to EA, but that seems like a long shot.

It looks like they've Assassin's Creed'd the combat. In the gameplay trailer it looks like the just a small party RPG version of that style. That's not at all what I'm looking for out of Dragon Age.

I don't think EA has any understanding of what PC players want and very likely see BG3's success as a fluke and CRGP resurgence as a fad.

[dubb93]

Originally Posted by Atocep

It looks like they've Assassin's Creed'd the combat. In the gameplay trailer it looks like the just a small party RPG version of that style. That's not at all what I'm looking for out of Dragon Age.

I don't think EA has any understanding of what PC players want and very likely see BG3's success as a fluke and CRGP resurgence as a fad.

I don’t even know if you can say “party”. From what I read you can’t even control your party members. You can pause it and ask them to use their abilities but you are stuck controlling the main character at all times.

[GrantDawg]

Wow. That sounds like high-level suckage.

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[Mota]

I can just see the typical video game board room.
"Guys, I know that I know that Baldur's Gate 3 has sold very well, but our demographic is limited. What we really need is to appeal to more customers by introducing action based combat and really reduce the amount of choices to be made. People don't like that."
And that has dumb-ified the entire gaming industry for years now. It's like all video game makers are trying to make the same game for the same customer now, instead of smaller companies trying to make a product for their particular customer base.

[dubb93]

My favorite Reddit comment was that DA:4 appears to be 10x as far away from the gameplay of DA:I as the gameplay of DA:I was from DA:O. Also everyone saying Valorant based on the choice of art style but I couldn’t care less about art style.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by Mota

I can just see the typical video game board room.
"Guys, I know that I know that Baldur's Gate 3 has sold very well, but our demographic is limited. What we really need is to appeal to more customers by introducing action based combat and really reduce the amount of choices to be made. People don't like that."
And that has dumb-ified the entire gaming industry for years now. It's like all video game makers are trying to make the same game for the same customer now, instead of smaller companies trying to make a product for their particular customer base.

At the seemingly endless escalation of cost of creation in recent years, I'm not sure you can produce a product for a smaller base while making a meaningful profit without a significant step backwards in perceived quality.

[dubb93]

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

At the seemingly endless escalation of cost of creation in recent years, I'm not sure you can produce a product for a smaller base while making a meaningful profit without a significant step backwards in perceived quality.

There are tons of examples of successful “niche” games coming to market in recent years. The problem is these companies can’t set a budget and keep it. A game like Dragon Age that SHOULD be a CRPG should not have taken 10 years to develop.

What’s next? Civ 6 gonna drop empire building in favor of smiting Aztecs first personas Abe Lincoln?

[Atocep]

EA has been pushing Bioware toward being more on a console developer since they acquires them. ME2 ditched the more tactical elements of combat in favor of making it straight shooter. Andromeda added on the live service elements that publishers thought was a way of printing money. Then Anthem was a console-y live service game that just didn't make sense for bioware to develop.

Origins was a a CRPG that was widely recognized at the time as being the game that showed there was still a market for those type of games. Since then they've the series more into a fantasy Mass Effect game rather than build off of what worked in Origins. Inquisition sold 6 million copies, which is pretty good. However, Larian decided to decided to build off of the success of Origins, Pillars of Eternity, and some of the more recent CRPGs and had to self publish because publishers like EA have insisted there isn't a market for those games anymore. As a result we had D:OS2 outsell Inquisiton and BG3 has sold 15 million copies and counting.

IMO the one thing we keep seeing publishers do with successful developers is force them to create bad games because market research says this is what gamers want rather than allow them to make games they want to and are comfortable making.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by dubb93

There are tons of examples of successful “niche” games coming to market in recent years.

Come to market vs make a large enough margin to satisfy ownership/ shareholders are two vastly differently things.

The latter is the standard I was thinking of.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by Atocep

IMO the one thing we keep seeing publishers do with successful developers is force them to create bad games because market research says this is what gamers want rather than allow them to make games they want to and are comfortable making.

Here's the thing though, an easy fix

1) Don't take money from the publisher
2) Continue to do whatever you want however you want

The problem is when devs try to skip step one.

[dubb93]

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

Come to market vs make a large enough margin to satisfy ownership/ shareholders are two vastly differently things.

The latter is the standard I was thinking of.

Which is weird because other entertainment mediums don’t seem to have this issue. Every movie doesn’t have to be a summer blockbuster anymore than every TV show has to be Game of Thrones. But in videogames every game released by the major publishers seems to have to check the same boxes (I’m looking at EA, WB Games, and Ubisoft primarily here.)

[JonInMiddleGA]

Game Pass may be pricing itself out of my use at some point, but in the meantime it has allowed me to discover that FC 2024 (I think that's the current naming convention for the soccer game, right?) might be the best console sports game not named The Show.

Granted, coming into one of these HUT/MUT deals late in the game's life cycle through game pass isn't the actual year-long experience -- there's so much to do and so many high end cards available by that point -- but having not touched a soccer game on console in many many years, I'm pretty content with just how sweaty-but-winnable-if-I-don't-screw-up matches I've gotten at the semi-pro difficulty (that's the minimum for satisfying most challenges, achievements, etc). The one downside to it seems to be that it's a game mode really designed for online play vs real people & I have no real interest in that.

It's pretty much "I'd actually consider buying this when it's new" level of engaging for MUT stuff, I'll have to give franchise a go soon to see how that feels. If it's engaging -- something that I haven't gotten out of baseball, hockey, or basketball in several years now -- then it might be a legit purchase candidate ... something I sure wouldn't have expected when I installed it on a whim.

[GrantDawg]

Interesting. I was just fooling around looking at games available through Game Pass and almost loaded it. I always liked it but never played it long. It is one of the more playable button mash games fir ne, but because mainly I can player-lock myself and let the team do most of the actual scoring. I can't for the life of me hit a shot.

Edit: I don't player-lick myself. I am not that nimble.

[cartman]

Yeah, I agree with FC 24. They changed the mechanics a bunch from the last version of FIFA. The gameplay is more realistic, and you do need some strategy. The teams all play differently too, so it isn't a parade of the same thing with different color jerseys.

[Brian Swartz]

Without a publisher that knows what they are doing, most devs will just lose money. It's very difficult to get exposure for even a great game with the amount that are currently available.

[dubb93]

I guess Microsoft got me. I was on their side during the standoff with regulators as they were saying all the right things. Well, in the face of this new price increase to Gamepass, it's clear they were doing just that. They told regulators that prices wouldn't increase due to the Activision merger and then as they get ready to release Call of Duty onto the service Day 1 they increase the prices and introduce new tiers that don't include game one releases.

I'm sure at this point in the process no one cares. I'm sure no one definitely cares as the Supreme Court deregulates everything, but I wish there was some way to hold them accountable for straight up lying to regulators.

[dubb93]

Faith restored a bit in the FTC I guess as they have called out Xbox.

hxxps://www.thegamer.com/xbox-game-pass-price-increases-new-tier-product-degradation-ftc/

[EagleFan]

Xbox is down, looks like it's been down for a few hours.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by EagleFan

Xbox is down, looks like it's been down for a few hours.

But very weirdly, my son is playing his pre-loaded College Football 25 for the past several hours. (which wasn't supposed to launch until midnight I thought)

Ultimate Team is working so I know it's not just local stuff.

Which strikes us increasingly strange based on the outtage reports.

edit to add: to add another layer of weirdness, I'm currently pre-loading CF25 ... but can't play any games because they won't connect.

[JonInMiddleGA]

An outtage of more than five hours and counting isn't a great look for XB in the same week where looming price increases were announced.

[RainMaker]

I'm guessing it's the Crowdstrike issue causing their downtime? Seems to have messed up a lot of stuff.