The Trump Presidency – 2016

[RainMaker]

Since the day Trump began slapping tariffs on products (January 22nd), the Dow Jones has dropped over 2,600 points (10%). The S&P 500 is also down 10% and the Russell 2000 (small caps) is down 14% since that day.

"Trade wars are good and easy to win."

— Josh Jordan (@NumbersMuncher) December 18, 2018

[RainMaker]

Originally Posted by RainMaker

Another day of big losses in the market. Down for the year now.

Also we're borrowing money from China to pay farmers that got screwed over by the trade war with China.

Today I am making good on my promise to defend our Farmers & Ranchers from unjustified trade retaliation by foreign nations. I have authorized Secretary Perdue to implement the 2nd round of Market Facilitation Payments. Our economy is stronger than ever–we stand with our Farmers!

— Donald J. Trump (@realDonaldTrump) December 17, 2018

Just want to add to this that no one on the right demanding these farmers take drug tests to receive their welfare checks. Odd.

[JPhillips]

And don't even get me started on Bitcoin!

[Thomkal]

A little bit of info came out on the mystery subpoena case last week-no names yet-but its a company owned by a country. Court dismissed "company A's" attempt to quash the subpoena, and held them in contempt for failing to comply with a subpoena-they have a daily fine for each day they don't.

[Edward64]

Originally Posted by JPhillips

And don't even get me started on Bitcoin!

Thought about dabbling this time last year but never did. Are you a hodler?

[Thomkal]

So CNN has given Trump another reason to hate them. Chris Cuomo on his show tonight was talking about a letter of intent to move forward on the Moscow Trump Tower. People have known about this document since last year I think. The only problem was that it wasn't signed by anybody. Not sure how he got his hands on it, but tonight Cuomo has a copy of the letter of intent signed by Donald Trump:


Chris Cuomo Shows Signed Intent Letter for Trump Tower Russia

[JPhillips]

Originally Posted by Edward64

Thought about dabbling this time last year but never did. Are you a hodler?

No no no.

I still don't understand what value Bitcoin has outside of a speculative investment, so I'll be having none of that, thank you.

[lungs]

Originally Posted by JPhillips

No no no.

I still don't understand what value Bitcoin has outside of a speculative investment, so I'll be having none of that, thank you.

Bitcoin has been split a zillion times now. It seems like the decentralized wet dream just results in constant splits. Disagreement arises and the group that loses starts their own Bitcoin. I never stuck a penny in Bitcoin. I've done well on my XRP and XLM investments. Now, if I would've stopped there...... but I invested in a bunch of shit coins in the middle of the bull run. I've since converted them all to XRP and XLM. XRP has some interesting use case in moving money around (and saving banks money in the process). XLM is similar to XRP and has done some work with IBM.

I thought the platforms might be worthwhile but they seem to only be platforms for others to create their own shit coins.

[Fidatelo]

BitCoin is the worst, fuck that noise. Environment in the shitter? Let's double down and use all the electricity to make a fake currency that only criminals use. Good job, humanity.

[Butter]

Originally Posted by Fidatelo

BitCoin is the worst, fuck that noise. Environment in the shitter? Let's double down and use all the electricity to make a fake currency that only criminals use. Good job, humanity.

This is also how I understand Bitcoin, which is probably overly simplistic. I know I could pay my Dish Network bill with it if I wanted, or play poker with it, but other than that I don't know what use there is for it.

[PilotMan]

Meanwhile..


Yesterday the WH gave it's first 'daily' press briefing in 3 weeks, and it lasted all of 15 minutes, with next to nothing outside of just basic statements and generic answers.

[JPhillips]

SC and NH are looking to curtail or cancel their GOP presidential primaries. Trump can't lose a primary if their aren't any primaries!

[JPhillips]

Trump apparently is leaving Syria and this afternoon decided that Rusal, a Russian aluminum company will no longer be subject to sanctions.

Somebody's scared that Daddy Putin is going to reveal everything.

[albionmoonlight]

Originally Posted by JPhillips

SC and NH are looking to curtail or cancel their GOP presidential primaries. Trump can't lose a primary if their aren't any primaries!

My memory does not go back before Reagan, but I can't think of one of the two major parties being more beholden to its leader than the current GOP is to Trump. I mean, as a party, you want to support your President. But the idea of canceling your primaries just to avoid any chance of a challenge to him? Not even Reagan or Obama got that kind of treatment.

[albionmoonlight]

dola:

And put me in the camp of parties are private actors and can do what they want. There is nothing "illegal" or "undemocratic" about choosing to pick a nominee through something other than voting. I'm more interested in it as a symbol of how top-down the GOP has become in the age of Trump.

[RainMaker]

Bitcoin is good for funding my sportsbook and getting money out because this country won't let me bet on a football game.

[ISiddiqui]

Looks like we are getting out of Syria:

https://www.nytimes.com/2018/12/19/u...gtype=Homepage

Though saying "We have defeated ISIS in Syria" seems like something that would bite someone in the ass.

[ISiddiqui]

I found someone who is supportive of the decision to retreat from #Syria https://t.co/SlNs9hrXLG

— Marco Rubio (@marcorubio) December 19, 2018

[miami_fan]

Originally Posted by Thomkal

Trump Admin signals its backing down on its shutdowm threat and Sarah Sanders says they have found other ways to fund the wall. I'm sure all of which are legal and not ethics violations.

GoFundMe Page For Donald Trump’s Border Wall Raises More Than $900K in 3 Days

UPDATE: $1,374,544 raised as of this post.

[NobodyHere]

I can assume that the people funding the wall are Mexicans like Trump promised right?

[cuervo72]

I mean, if his supporters want to give money to build it, have at it. HOpefully some of them are rich and can kick in a sizable chunk. Big gap between $5B and $1.37M.

[bhlloy]

I really try to keep the outrage and the hyperbole with Trump to a minimum, but between leaving Canada completely out to dry while talking about coming to an agreement over the Huawei affair (ironically talking about using it to ease the Chinese sanctions while leaving the Canadian ones in place) and pulling out of Syria against pretty much everyone's advice allowing Russia and Iran to fill the power void (and Turkey to slaughter the Kurds most likely) I have no idea who the hell our allies are any more. Feels like the US has gone from the world benevolent policeman to a crooked cop willing to change direction daily based on the direction of a rich mafia boss.

[whomario]

Originally Posted by Butter

This is also how I understand Bitcoin, which is probably overly simplistic. I know I could pay my Dish Network bill with it if I wanted, or play poker with it, but other than that I don't know what use there is for it.

Technology behind it could be incredibly usefull though once you figure out a way to curb the energy demands.

[albionmoonlight]

Originally Posted by albionmoonlight

My memory does not go back before Reagan, but I can't think of one of the two major parties being more beholden to its leader than the current GOP is to Trump. I mean, as a party, you want to support your President. But the idea of canceling your primaries just to avoid any chance of a challenge to him? Not even Reagan or Obama got that kind of treatment.

Actually, further digging shows that the SC GOP cancelled its primary for W. Bush's re-election. So this may be more of a case of normal things happening around Trump, but because he's Trump, they become newsworthy.

[JPhillips]

But circumstances matter. In 2004 there was no hint of a credible primary opponent to W. In 2020 there will almost certainly be a decent name running against Trump. I would still expect Trump to win, but I'd be shocked if there isn't a credible challenge.

[Lathum]

I’m so embarrassed to live in a country where after the last two years we have had it’s a cinch Trump is going to win the primary.

[JPhillips]

.@LindseyGrahamSC just told me to expect him to tweet back at the president every time he tweets about Syria. "I'm not letting this go."

Lindsey's using every tool he has, even TWEETING!

[Ben E Lou]

Originally Posted by JPhillips

Lindsey's using every tool he has, even TWEETING!

Serious question, as I have not dug into the options here. What CAN Congress do about this one that's reasonable and doesn't set a hideous precedent? I mean, I don't want them declaring war or using the 25th amendment over this. Are there other options better than putting public pressure on Trump?

[albionmoonlight]

Originally Posted by bhlloy

I really try to keep the outrage and the hyperbole with Trump to a minimum, but between leaving Canada completely out to dry while talking about coming to an agreement over the Huawei affair (ironically talking about using it to ease the Chinese sanctions while leaving the Canadian ones in place) and pulling out of Syria against pretty much everyone's advice allowing Russia and Iran to fill the power void (and Turkey to slaughter the Kurds most likely) I have no idea who the hell our allies are any more. Feels like the US has gone from the world benevolent policeman to a crooked cop willing to change direction daily based on the direction of a rich mafia boss.

I think that a future President will be able to undo a lot of the damage that Trump caused.

What I don't think that any President will be able to do is convince the rest of the world that we won't elect another Trump to re-do all the damage. Even now, 45% of the country is happy he's President and hopes to re-elect him.

[Edward64]

I am supportive of us getting out of Syria and don't think anyone here would disagree. I don't think Trump should have done it unilaterally (seemingly surprising everyone) but the ultimate end goal is good.

Its a no win situation there.

• Assad is still in power (part of that blame goes to Obama)
• ISIL is pretty much defeated although their tentacles remain (and Obama gets some credit and also some blame, I'll give most of the credit to Obama for defeating ISIL from Iraq)
• Syria has been in Russia's sphere of influence for a while and has Russian support (the opportunity to topple Assad is long gone) and don't see it as a big con that Russia continues their influence

With that said, what would you have the US do? It seems leaving is better than another endless low-intensity conflict that we have in Afghanistan.

My best guess is Trump will back off from a complete withdrawal eventually after consulting with allies - Jordan, Israel, and SA.

[jeff061]

I am supportive of us getting out of Syria and don't think anyone here would disagree. I don't think Trump should have done it unilaterally (seemingly surprising everyone) but the ultimate end goal is good.

Every single person that Trump listened told him not to withdraw(including Mattis), all of the GOP has come out against it, all our allies have come out against it, most of these people have said it's worse than Obama's withdrawal from Iraq. Unilateral is an understatement. Has anyone said it's a good idea other than Russia?

So no, I don't agree. Assuming this goes forward, I can't any longer say this buffoon is all bark and no bite.

[Edward64]

So what do you think is a realistic end game here?

[kingfc22]

Originally Posted by ISiddiqui

I found someone who is supportive of the decision to retreat from #Syria https://t.co/SlNs9hrXLG

— Marco Rubio (@marcorubio) December 19, 2018

Just shut it already Rubio. He's gone along for the ride at every single turn.

Show me something with action first other than just the wasteful gum flapping.

[panerd]

Originally Posted by bhlloy

I really try to keep the outrage and the hyperbole with Trump to a minimum, but between leaving Canada completely out to dry while talking about coming to an agreement over the Huawei affair (ironically talking about using it to ease the Chinese sanctions while leaving the Canadian ones in place) and pulling out of Syria against pretty much everyone's advice allowing Russia and Iran to fill the power void (and Turkey to slaughter the Kurds most likely) I have no idea who the hell our allies are any more. Feels like the US has gone from the world benevolent policeman to a crooked cop willing to change direction daily based on the direction of a rich mafia boss.

You seriously believe this was the case pre-2016? I will even leave '08-'16 Obama out of it due to the liberal slant of the board (even though without question it wasn't a benevolent foreign policy) So I will just ask this... W. Bush was leading the benevolent policing of the world? Oh my.

Define benevolent: well meaning and kindly, serving a charitable rather than a profit-making purpose.

[stevew]

So now he's not going to sign the budget Gap hey

[bhlloy]

Originally Posted by panerd

You seriously believe this was the case pre-2016? I will even leave '08-'16 Obama out of it due to the liberal slant of the board (even though without question it wasn't a benevolent foreign policy) So I will just ask this... W. Bush was leading the benevolent policing of the world? Oh my.

Define benevolent: well meaning and kindly, serving a charitable rather than a profit-making purpose.

Maybe benevolent wasn't at all the right word, but I'll stand by the intent. Enabling Syria, Russia, Iran and Turkey to murder children and China to arrest Canadian citizens over a request that came from the US State Department in the first place is a startling departure from previous US policy.

Even under W, and I hold the second Iraq war in about as much disdain as I possibly could.

[bhlloy]

Originally Posted by Edward64

So what do you think is a realistic end game here?

I don't know if there is one immediately apparent, but keeping a relatively small number of US boots on the ground and the threat of US air strikes is a pretty small price to pay for not allowing children and families to be gassed in their homes or a minority group that has been allies of the US for the last 20 years to be slaughtered in a third country by a country with history of genocide.

That's even before considering the message this sends to the rest of the world, firstly that Russia now pretty much owns US foreign policy and secondly that if you run into any issues, look to Russia and China before us because unless it's in our president's interest we couldn't give two flying fucks.

[Ben E Lou]

On the House floor, leaders scrambling to see if they can pass $5 billion in wall funding as Republicans say they want President Trump to tweet before they say “yes.”

“That’s what the fuck serving in Congress has come to,” one GOP member of Congress tells me.

— Kasie Hunt (@kasie) December 20, 2018

[JPhillips]

Originally Posted by Ben E Lou

Serious question, as I have not dug into the options here. What CAN Congress do about this one that's reasonable and doesn't set a hideous precedent? I mean, I don't want them declaring war or using the 25th amendment over this. Are there other options better than putting public pressure on Trump?

I'll admit it's difficult. With any other President they could threaten to withhold X,Y, or Z unless the policy was reviewed and/or changed, but I'm not sure there's anything Trump would give a damn about losing or not getting passed. I expect the only things with teeth involve investigations, and the GOP loses too if Trump goes down in flames.

So, yeah, it's hard, but threatening to tweet is about the least useful option.

[JPhillips]

dola

Shutting down the government and running off to play golf at Mar-a-Lago is the perfect visual for this GOP.

edit: But I'm sure he'll give in tomorrow. Everybody now knows he's all bark and no bite.

[Jas_lov]

Jim Mattis retiring in February.

[kingfc22]

Originally Posted by Jas_lov

Jim Mattis retiring in February.

Resigns the day after the Syria decision. Just add Mattis as Exhibit 1,253,021,186,151 to the list of examples on how this is a one-man show in the White House that nobody can control. And one where the Republican party is wholly responsible for as they have been spineless for the 2 years where they had control and could have reigned this in a bit.

[Ben E Lou]

His resignation letter:

Katherine Faulders on Twitter: "! This line of Mattis resignation letter (h/t @Elizabeth_McLau): “Because you have the right to have a Secretary of Defense whose views are better aligned with yours on these and other subjects, I believe it is right for me to step down from my position.�… https://t.co/uA6cpfvhxA"

[digamma]

The Mattis letter is forceful. It's not a good day for the country.

[Thomkal]

Trump tweeting something nasty about Mattis in 3,2,1...

[RainMaker]

Markets took another bath today. Don't look at your retirement accounts if you want a nice holiday.

[Ben E Lou]

Originally Posted by digamma

The Mattis letter is forceful. It's not a good day for the country.

Yeah, that thing reads as "I believe in honor, loyalty, respect, wisdom, courage, etc. You don't, and you deserve someone like you in this position."

[Ben E Lou]

Originally Posted by Thomkal

Trump tweeting something nasty about Mattis in 3,2,1...

I'm thinking it'll be tomorrow, unless he watches TV tonight. He won't understand how harsh Mattis's letter is until the talking heads say it.

[spleen1015]

As someone ignorant to politics, I don't get it. He's one man. If no one supports him how can he get anything done? I know he's the president and he has certain powers, but hell man, no one help the guy out, everyone stand up to him and let's move on.

Not that simple?

[bhlloy]

Originally Posted by spleen1015

As someone ignorant to politics, I don't get it. He's one man. If no one supports him how can he get anything done? I know he's the president and he has certain powers, but hell man, no one help the guy out, everyone stand up to him and let's move on.

Not that simple?

No, because he has the rabid, undying support of (pick a number between 20 and 40) percent of the electorate, and people are terrified that standing against him means they don't get those votes for the next 20 years. Combine that with nearly all politicians being willing to do pretty much whatever it takes to get elected again, I don't think it's a hard equation to figure out.