Crusader Kings 3 - CK3, CKIII

[Icy]

Originally Posted by bhlloy

Yeah, this plus generally increasing the length of time to embark and tweaking the AI willingness to do it might solve two problems - firstly how trivial it is to fight wars on two landmasses at once and secondly how annoying it is when enemy armies just escape to the sea, wait for you to siege down a castle and then decide to land and target one of yours.

This pisses me off as really unrealistic, you attack an army, they lose, retreat into the sea (wtf??) and then land and attack you far from there.

Retreating forces should only be able to go back to the sea if they came from the sea, like vikings etc as they had their ships waiting for them, but a regular land army embarking all the suden is really weird.

[SackAttack]

I mean, Dunkirk turned into Normandy, a few years later. That sorta thing HAS happened in history. It's just that in CK3 it happens with a much faster turnaround than it should.

[MrBug708]

First to the capital wins the war!

[albionmoonlight]

I got this game the other day based on this thread. I’ve never played CK before. Very happy with the purchase. I am kicking around the tutorial and slowly acquiring Ireland. But as I was doing that, some Scottish King came in and kicked my ass, and now I am his vassal. I do not want to be a vassal. What is the best way to regain my independence? What sort of strategy should I be pursuing?

[GrantDawg]

Create an "Independence" faction, and attack when you are stronger. Usually the best time is when your overlord is involved in a big war (or two).

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[Izulde]

Also, concentrate on building up your capital. I'd suggest a mix of gold-generating and military-generating buildings. Money is critical, but you also need a good-sized garrison and substantial armies. Invest in men-at-arms regiments that are good against the Scottish armies (there's a rock-paper-scissors things with regards to units).

[albionmoonlight]

I got impatient and attacked him. He captured me and imprisoned me. I tried to escape, so he took away all my titles and had me executed. This is a really awesome game. I think I will start the tutorial over and be a little less impatient this time around :-)

[albionmoonlight]

So if I take prisoners, what good does that do me? I am capturing people in war, and I can only imagine that I can parlay that into huge leverage over the rulers who care about the captured people.

How do I maximize that value?

[GrantDawg]

Originally Posted by albionmoonlight

So if I take prisoners, what good does that do me? I am capturing people in war, and I can only imagine that I can parlay that into huge leverage over the rulers who care about the captured people.

How do I maximize that value?

1. If it is an heir or close family member, it will increase the war score.
2. If a ruler or rulers family, you can ransom them back for good old cash. If they don't have money, you can gain a hook from them.
3. If they are not someone who can be ransomed, you can negotiate with them to join your court, get a hook, convert their religion, or just let them go.

[Izulde]

Originally Posted by albionmoonlight

So if I take prisoners, what good does that do me? I am capturing people in war, and I can only imagine that I can parlay that into huge leverage over the rulers who care about the captured people.

How do I maximize that value?

You can get ransom or a hook, and/or take some other options. In one of your menus (I forget one), there's a Prisoners tab. I personally almost always take the money, but there might be cases where it's more advantageous to do something else with them - for example, taking a hook of a vassal and then using that hook to rewrite their Feudal contract for more advantageous terms or force them to vote your way if they're a voter, etc.

[albionmoonlight]

Thank y'all.

Learning that there is a "prisoners" tab is, I think, going to help me a lot here :-)

[JPhillips]

The reddit guy that had his Norseman eat the Pope is fantastic.

PC Gamer explains it a bit:

https://www.pcgamer.com/this-crusade...-ate-the-pope/

[kingfc22]

Played about 20-30 years in my first game and will likely start up a new one as I learned a few things and still am struggling with others.

I don’t quite have a grasp on the strategy as to when and who to grant titles too. I cut my tax and levies pretty harshly with some of my decisions.

I did learn that raiding is a thing and I should be doing that to get gold.

I’m definitely not comfortable with how to succeed via diplomacy vs. military dominance but can’t seem to figure out why my levies don’t replenish even when my counties have a high control number.

[Drake]

Originally Posted by albionmoonlight

Thank y'all.

Learning that there is a "prisoners" tab is, I think, going to help me a lot here :-)

...or you can just check in on them periodically to see how many are still alive because you forgot to ransom them after your last war...

I'm really not a bad person despite the fact that scores of people tend to die neglected in my dungeons. Let's just agree to call it a clerical oversight.

[Izulde]

Originally Posted by kingfc22

Played about 20-30 years in my first game and will likely start up a new one as I learned a few things and still am struggling with others.

I don’t quite have a grasp on the strategy as to when and who to grant titles too. I cut my tax and levies pretty harshly with some of my decisions.

I did learn that raiding is a thing and I should be doing that to get gold.

I’m definitely not comfortable with how to succeed via diplomacy vs. military dominance but can’t seem to figure out why my levies don’t replenish even when my counties have a high control number.

The last part is a bug. Raise your armies, let them get to full strength, and disband. I’m sure it’ll be fixed in first patch.

[spleen1015]

The other thing that may be effecting your levies is penalty traits.

I had a county receive a -25% levies penalty and I forgot about it. I was wondering why my levies were so low until 5 years later when the penalty expired and I was notified it had expired.

You can click on your counties and see what traits they have on the upper right of the window, both good and bad.

[Bee]

Originally Posted by GrantDawg

1. If it is an heir or close family member, it will increase the war score.
2. If a ruler or rulers family, you can ransom them back for good old cash. If they don't have money, you can gain a hook from them.
3. If they are not someone who can be ransomed, you can negotiate with them to join your court, get a hook, convert their religion, or just let them go.

You can also torture them which I believe reduces stress if you are that type of King...

[dubb93]

So far I'm enjoying it. I don't like that succession that splits all the land. Last game I generally got rid of that ASAP. In this game it isn't possible to do that. That being said it's easy enough to get what you want by revocation. If you revoke and they decline they start a rebellion and you can then revoke what you want after the war without penalty.

I've actually found myself not even worrying about that though and just going with the roleplay.

[SackAttack]

Originally Posted by dubb93

So far I'm enjoying it. I don't like that succession that splits all the land. Last game I generally got rid of that ASAP. In this game it isn't possible to do that. That being said it's easy enough to get what you want by revocation. If you revoke and they decline they start a rebellion and you can then revoke what you want after the war without penalty.

I've actually found myself not even worrying about that though and just going with the roleplay.

You actually can, but 'ASAP' in this context doesn't mean 'immediately.' You hafta upgrade the crown laws to be a bit more authoritarian before you can push that change through.

[Icy]

Two questions:

1) is there any events log like in CK2? else, how do you know what is going on?

2) Can you control your allies armies? I started a war for the freedom of Ital vs the HRE. Their army is 20k soldiers, mine is 5k, my 5 allies have 5k each, so it's 20k vs 25k and we should have the upper hand. The problem? Can't find the way to stack our 25k men, so instead the HRE uses his 20k stack to attack one by one our 5k stacks and wins us easily.

[Drake]

If there's a chronicle or other reporting, I haven't found it yet. I'm hoping it gets added in the first DLC.

[RainMaker]

This feels easier to play than CK2 which I thought was a bit tedious at times. I like taking good people and making them do bad things driving their stress up. Lot of Sims like action in this.

[lungs]

Shattered World mod has been fun.


Am I doing something wrong in wars? I pretty much declare war and immediately go to siege what I'm trying to take over. My allies don't do shit most of the time. They just march around in circles. I wish I could tell them to follow me.

[Izulde]

The AI ally stupidity is something I hope they fix in a patch. A lot of people have commented on it.

[GrantDawg]

Yes, the Ally AI is definitely bad. Also, I think the norse are over-powered early. Probably the whole religious system needs tweaking. I let the game run on observer a coupe of times and in a couple hundred years of starting (early starts), Catholics shrink to almost nothing.

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[bhlloy]

Yeah, there’s quite a few issues right now that once you get past the initial fun factor is killing this for me. The 867 start is basically unplayable and even in 1066 it’s not unusual to see Scandinavia eat large chunks of Europe. There are definitely more than a few factors contributing to that, but 80% of people playing the game seem to be saying the same things.

Given how Paradox has been patching EU4 in the last 18 months (or more accurately not patching things and just putting out new DLC that breaks things even further) I don’t have a ton of hope for this moving forward. I really wish I had held off on buying this to be honest.

[Izulde]

I dunno - the CK3 release is overall the cleanest of any major Paradox release. And CK2 was great after some patches and DLCs. I feel like CK3 will get the same treatment as its predecessor - my sense is it's clearly the studio's cash cow and so will get the best resources.

[GrantDawg]

I agree with Izlude. It will get patched up pretty quick. I am not able very worried.

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[bhlloy]

So after a few mods (increase embark cost and make the AI less likely to use it, increase the naval range needed for exclave independence, make wars less likely overall) it's definitely a much improved game... Europe still feels chaotic in the 867 start with the Karlings perpetually at war with each other, but the UK isn't immediately eaten by Vikings, and Sweden hasn't taken over any major landmasses in Europe either yet. Willing to give it more of a chance in this state.

[GrantDawg]

Which mods? Inquiring minds want to know.

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[Edward64]

I've been playing it some but know I'm still scratching the surface.

[Brian Swartz]

I don't expect particularly fast effective balance patches, that's why I'm waiting. Nice of you all to test it though while I do .

[tarcone]

And I will wait for a sale. After my experience with 2, waiting works for me.

[Drake]

My #1 observation is that there seems to be much less incest in CK3. I haven't decided if that's a bug or not.

[Izulde]

It seems like there's more incest to me, but that might be because so many players are going that route.

[Drake]

Yeah, I'm discounting that. I mean RNG incest -- the kind that if you didn't keep close tabs on your kids and grandkids, they'd be porking each other.

My sons referred to CK2 as my Mississippi Simulator.

ETA: It just occurred to me that I'm running a mod that specifically nerfs that seduction mechanic.That probably explains the difference.

[bhlloy]

Originally Posted by GrantDawg

Which mods? Inquiring minds want to know.

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These are all on the Steam workshop (the Paradox forum seems pretty quiet tbh)

More Game Rules (allows you to set the frequency of AI Wars)
[Boat Fix] Fewer AI Armadas
BSPW: Exclave Independence Enhanced
Rename Characters (this one has nothing to do with gameplay but seriously Paradox, why was this ever taken out)

[GrantDawg]

Thanks, bhlloy. One of the good things about CK2 was the mod community.

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[Edward64]

I'm always looking for a bride for me or heir with the "rose". Unfortunately, they never seem to pair up well with "alliance strength" or "prestige".

[GrantDawg]

Added the mods bhlloy listed, as well as one called "better AI PDX", which is supposed to help keep the AI from being random, but make it more strategic and roleplay like. Let's see how this goes. I'm just going to let it run and see how the map looks.
BTW, one other more cheaty type mod I like is SarcFa's Custom Ruler Designer. It won't let you make a new dynasty, but it will let you create your own ruler to start a dynasty. I always like to add a personal touch to my starting ruler.

[GrantDawg]

Ran from the earliest start date to 1066 using the mods above. In the first run, the Karlings stayed in control of most of Europe, dividing into two to three Kingdoms, West Francia, Lotharingia, and Aquitaine. That was untill about 1050, when the Umayyad swallowed Aquitaine and now controlls much of the Southern Med, including big chunks of Italy. Wrest Francia is just northern France and the Duchy of Kent. Lotharingia and Burgandy hold most of central Europe. The Byzantine Empire holds it's orginally territories as well as Southern Italy and stretches of North Africa.
This looks much more a likely play through than the Norse cultures holding stretches of lane all over the map. The Norse still hold the homelend and are raiding regularly, but largely have been removed from the British Isles. Britain instead is mostly being held by Alba, with all but a Duchy of Ireland being in their control as well as most of Northern England. The Anglo-Saxons stayed divided and in constant battle with each other until the Scots and Welsh took bites of of England, along with losing Kent to West Francia.
Going to try a run starting in 1066 next. Hope someone is interested in this.

[bhlloy]

Glad to hear you had some good experiences with it, but FWIW that cocktail of mods didn't seem to work in my game much past 900 or so... Sweden and Denmark still formed pretty early and ate all of Ireland/Wales - Wessex has done pretty well and actually just took over Jorvik, but half the UK owned by Sweden/Denmark or by Vikings who got independence based on Exclaves when the ruler died just isn't the game experience I'm looking for.

Downloading another mod called "Vikings Bordergore Contained" which has some good reviews, essentially nerfs Vikings from conquering anyone except direct neighbors. Shame it has to come to this, but I think this is the only way I'm going to get the game I'm looking for. And I'm bummed to lose that save because I'd gone from a one county minor to a 2 duchy council member/faction leader in West Frankia... but I just don't want to be looking at Sweden, Denmark and a bunch of duchies I can't pronounce holding most of the British Isles for the next 200 years.

[SackAttack]

Originally Posted by Edward64

I'm always looking for a bride for me or heir with the "rose". Unfortunately, they never seem to pair up well with "alliance strength" or "prestige".

So far 90% of the ones I've seen with 'comely,' 'pretty,' 'beautiful,' etc are lesbians. So that's been interesting.

But one of 'em popped out 12 kids, so.

[GrantDawg]

Patch out with huge list of fixes. This Reddit post does the best job of summarizing them. Crusader Kings 3 Patch 1.1 Notes: What They Actually Mean : CrusaderKings

[Drake]

Originally Posted by GrantDawg

Patch out with huge list of fixes. This Reddit post does the best job of summarizing them. Crusader Kings 3 Patch 1.1 Notes: What They Actually Mean : CrusaderKings

The actual patch notes were pretty funny in their own right (at least the "training the AI" bits), but that Reddit thread makes them even better.

Thanks for passing that along, GrantDawg. It was a fun read.

[Abe Sargent]

Originally Posted by GrantDawg

I also think it makes more sense for claims to come from the church rather than diplomacy.

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It';s more realistic for the era.

[thesloppy]

What's the consensus post-patch? I have this through gamepass, but still haven't fired it up yet, based on the complaints pre-patch.

[Coffee Warlord]

It's kind of telling I see NOBODY in my steam friends list playing it.

[bhlloy]

It’s fine. Still needs tweaking with mods to stop Scandinavia eating large parts of Europe, but most other issues were fixed with the patch and no game breaking stuff. Still has a ways to go to be as fun as CK2 was IMO, hopefully the early expansions are decent.

[MrBug708]

Originally Posted by Coffee Warlord

It's kind of telling I see NOBODY in my steam friends list playing it.

I'm in your friends list! Im playing!