Front Office Football, the Card Game

[Izulde]

Originally Posted by Logan

I seem to recall a guy with "Phillies" and "80" in his handle taking shots at Jim here...

Me too.

[Logan]

He edited the offending posts, but one stuck around within a quote by Marmel. He's since been boxed.

Front Office Football Central - View Single Post - 2012 Election Result Analysis

So yeah man, if you're following Jim's project around to different boards just to shit on it, go get some help.

[Ben E Lou]

Yes, this is the same dude.

[Ben E Lou]

Heh. He deleted the ugliest stuff.

[PilotMan]

Originally Posted by Solecismic

It's just me. If I had a team behind me, social networking would be in someone's purview. Definitely not mine. I find I really don't have a lot to say to promote my products. I'd rather let people see what's out there and let them make their own decisions. What I do appeals to people who have a lot of imagination and don't need to be led. It will never sizzle or pop. I don't sizzle and pop, or even crackle a little. I care much more about replay value. I've always thought that, in time, customers will find me. My products are more evergreens, as the sales world terms them, than trendy and flashy. That's worked pretty well for me. It might not be an ideal paradigm for kickstarter-ing a completely new project, however.

I get that. I've been around here for years, but you're right when you mention the project. You are taking advantage of the kickstarter platform for some fund raising, and while that is great you are failing to drive interest in your product by missing out on one of the easiest, and cheapest ways to drive people to your product, and drive your business. When I see that part below your profile that says "Has not connected Facebook" it sticks out like a sore thumb. It shouldn't take much legwork at all, and the beauty of FB is that it allows for a place like FOFC for people to gather and communicate, and it's completely in the mainstream. On top of that, you can control what is on there.

Hell, there's already a link to it, you just need to own it!

https://www.facebook.com/pages/Front...ref=ts&fref=ts

[Flasch186]

Originally Posted by Solecismic

It's just me. If I had a team behind me, social networking would be in someone's purview. Definitely not mine. I find I really don't have a lot to say to promote my products. I'd rather let people see what's out there and let them make their own decisions. What I do appeals to people who have a lot of imagination and don't need to be led. It will never sizzle or pop. I don't sizzle and pop, or even crackle a little. I care much more about replay value. I've always thought that, in time, customers will find me. My products are more evergreens, as the sales world terms them, than trendy and flashy. That's worked pretty well for me. It might not be an ideal paradigm for kickstarter-ing a completely new project, however.

But it can. When you invent something great and you focus on what you do well but you know that there's a market for adding a little sizzle, go get the guy or girl who sizzles and enlist their help to make your invention better. Its not a slight or makes your product unworthy but it should also be considered as taking your invention and making it better. Thus you wont look back someday and say if only I wouldve done X, Y, or Z. Get Cuervo or some people (who Im volunteering without asking) to draw up some prototype bonus cards and see what you think... The influx of new buyers might help you fund a second iteration more easily.

[kcchief19]

Good luck, Jim. I hope it's a success!

There is a time in my life when I would have been all over this, but it's not something I have a deep interest in at this time. I'll likely kick in a small amount because I've gotten more enjoyment from Jim's products than I've paid him in the past, and I'd like to see his future work.

Anyone who thinks there isn't a market for this out there doesn't appreciate the diversity out there. Jim's biggest roadblock to reaching the goal is simply exposure. While I'm not a tabletop or card gamer, there are a lot of people that are out there.

I really don't get the people dismissing this because they have no interest in it and don't understand how someone else could. I know no one who watches the Kardashians and have no idea why someone would, but they are flippin' millionaires on every third magazine and TV show.

[Danny]

Originally Posted by kcchief19

Good luck, Jim. I hope it's a success!

There is a time in my life when I would have been all over this, but it's not something I have a deep interest in at this time. I'll likely kick in a small amount because I've gotten more enjoyment from Jim's products than I've paid him in the past, and I'd like to see his future work.

Anyone who thinks there isn't a market for this out there doesn't appreciate the diversity out there. Jim's biggest roadblock to reaching the goal is simply exposure. While I'm not a tabletop or card gamer, there are a lot of people that are out there.

I really don't get the people dismissing this because they have no interest in it and don't understand how someone else could. I know no one who watches the Kardashians and have no idea why someone would, but they are flippin' millionaires on every third magazine and TV show.

I am basing my thoughts on being a regular follower of kickstart board, card and tabletop games, not on my own interest. There are certain kinds of products with certain traits which have a lot of success and traits of projects that do not. I am just trying to be honest about what I see. I hope I am proven wrong.

[miked]

Originally Posted by Solecismic

It's just me. If I had a team behind me, social networking would be in someone's purview. Definitely not mine. I find I really don't have a lot to say to promote my products. I'd rather let people see what's out there and let them make their own decisions. What I do appeals to people who have a lot of imagination and don't need to be led. It will never sizzle or pop. I don't sizzle and pop, or even crackle a little. I care much more about replay value. I've always thought that, in time, customers will find me. My products are more evergreens, as the sales world terms them, than trendy and flashy. That's worked pretty well for me. It might not be an ideal paradigm for kickstarter-ing a completely new project, however.

That's pretty lame. If you want money for it and you want people to get excited about it, you need to actually promote it. Especially since it seems the vast number of people who love FOF aren't into it.

[molson]

Philliesfan980 is a creepy dude.

[Blackadar]

Originally Posted by molson

Philliesfan980 is a creepy dude.

Don't insult my sockpuppet login!

Whoops.

[Passacaglia]

Originally Posted by molson

Philliesfan980 is a creepy dude.

How so? Maybe I missed some deleted stuff.

[DaddyTorgo]

Originally Posted by Passacaglia

How so? Maybe I missed some deleted stuff.

He went bonkers on Jim in the elections prediction thread that Jim started (like over-the-top-personal bonkers), and it looks like there were 3 deleted posts of his in that thread in the other forum that was linked above - I can only imagine what was in them.

[Ben E Lou]

Originally Posted by Passacaglia

How so? Maybe I missed some deleted stuff.

I wish I'd taken a screen shot. Didn't anticipate him deleting all of it. He took multiple personal shots at Jim, and tried to run down FOF, Solecismic Software, you name it. Probably the worst of it was along the lines of "All of you should beware. Jim will keep your money and won't deliver the game."

[molson]

And this vendetta is all over interpretations of polling data.

[JPhillips]

I've never understood the idea that Jim, or any developer, owes the world a new game. I'd love a new FOF or TCY, but Jim can do whatever he pleases. People shouldn't get that invested in a single product.

[Ben E Lou]

Originally Posted by molson

And this vendetta is all over interpretations of polling data.

Originally Posted by JPhillips

I've never understood the idea that Jim, or any developer, owes the world a new game. I'd love a new FOF or TCY, but Jim can do whatever he pleases. People shouldn't get that invested in a single product.

Yeah...I got the impression that the polling stuff was just the trigger. My guess is that the disagreement there brought out anger he had at Jim over something FOF or TCY related to the forefront. The attack in the polling thread ultimately seemed to be about "you are making a board game and I want you to make another FOF/TCY, you asshole." I'd say this vendetta is all over a computer game. *shurg*

[molson]

Ya, that's probably it. Either way, intentionally trying to hurt someone's livelihood over a grudge is pretty low.

[Passacaglia]

Probably a combination. Like, this guy who's not giving me the game I want has the audacity to also have other interests besides making the game I want.

[Ben E Lou]

Originally Posted by molson

Either way, intentionally trying to hurt someone's livelihood over agrudge is pretty extremely low.

Fixed.

[Ben E Lou]

Originally Posted by Passacaglia

Probably a combination. Like, this guy who's not giving me the game I want has the audacity to also have other interests besides making the game I want.

Fair point.

[Passacaglia]

So, what seems to be missing to me in the game is personality. Maybe this goes hand-in-hand with career mode, I don't know. But, so, okay, New England has some team-specific plays, great, that's supposed to make them more New-England-y. But, in what way? Can my opponent get that flavor by looking at the play cards? Is "Pass Y8" going to have some kind of meaning? I think that the lack of actual players in the game is what hurts here. If Pass Y8 is a dangerous play, it should be because of the personnel that run it, not because of the play itself.

But who knows, maybe familiarity with the cards will bring about that personality. And maybe the cards can be mixed, and moved around in some way to simulate player movement, creating a career mode in a sense.

[Solecismic]

Originally Posted by PilotMan

I get that. I've been around here for years, but you're right when you mention the project. You are taking advantage of the kickstarter platform for some fund raising, and while that is great you are failing to drive interest in your product by missing out on one of the easiest, and cheapest ways to drive people to your product, and drive your business. When I see that part below your profile that says "Has not connected Facebook" it sticks out like a sore thumb. It shouldn't take much legwork at all, and the beauty of FB is that it allows for a place like FOFC for people to gather and communicate, and it's completely in the mainstream. On top of that, you can control what is on there.

Hell, there's already a link to it, you just need to own it!

https://www.facebook.com/pages/Front...ref=ts&fref=ts

I have a Front Office Football page on my facebook, but I've never done anything with it. How would I own this one?

No idea who PhilliesFan is. I was surprised by the election item anger, and even more surprised by yesterday's posts. Kinda sucks to have someone so mad at you that he's willing to go out of his way to harm you, and have no idea why. I've never taken a cent of anyone's money without doing my best to ensure he receives what he expects.

[Solecismic]

Originally Posted by Passacaglia

So, what seems to be missing to me in the game is personality. Maybe this goes hand-in-hand with career mode, I don't know. But, so, okay, New England has some team-specific plays, great, that's supposed to make them more New-England-y. But, in what way? Can my opponent get that flavor by looking at the play cards? Is "Pass Y8" going to have some kind of meaning? I think that the lack of actual players in the game is what hurts here. If Pass Y8 is a dangerous play, it should be because of the personnel that run it, not because of the play itself.

But who knows, maybe familiarity with the cards will bring about that personality. And maybe the cards can be mixed, and moved around in some way to simulate player movement, creating a career mode in a sense.

The idea is that with more downfield passing to the tight ends, New England has strategies available that are difficult to defend. The basic cards provide a league-average offense. The team-specific cards, which will comprise 30% of an offense and 30% of a defense, are all where that team varies from the average.

With a MtG card distribution (which would require multiple copies of cards, and thus less-varied playbooks), you could have a lot of extra personality, but the game would produce less realistic results. A big part of what a team is in football is not its ability to produce alone, but what it produces given its play choices. A team that throws 9s 20 times a game will immediately find defenses taking that option away.

What I hope is unique about this game is the playbook construction and play-calling mechanism, which gives you a measure of control, but also simulates (rather artificially) how defenses adjust to what you're doing. Hence the hand limits. When I was testing this game, it felt unique, like I was having a different kind of sports sim experience. I'm not trying to recreate what Strat does so well, or even what FOF does.

[PilotMan]

Originally Posted by Solecismic

I have a Front Office Football page on my facebook, but I've never done anything with it. How would I own this one?

You have to Create the Page. I would do one for both your Company and your Products. On the home page, mid screen, right side you'll see the Facebook copyright. Below that is Language, privacy, terms, cookies, and More. Click on the More and go to create page. From there you can create for both your Company and your products on different pages.

Then the rest is up to you my friend.

[tarcone]

Originally Posted by Passacaglia

There's a link to the rules on the KS page.

Thanks. I found it.

Jim, Im sure you dont care, but wanting people to "find your product" isnt going to get you $42,066 in 25 days.
If you truly believe in this, you need to be promoting it.
I have been following this thread and the one over at BGG. And what Im seeing is that people want you to sell them on it.
If this is just a side project that you dont really care if it gets printed or not, then enjoy playing it with your buddies. But if you want to produce it for us, sell it.

Is there any thought of a solo variant?
Im sure it would be as easy as Placing the opposing teams cards face down and drawing them, then rolling for them. Is that what you think a solo variant would or should be?

[Marc Vaughan]

Originally Posted by Solecismic

I have a Front Office Football page on my facebook, but I've never done anything with it. How would I own this one?

Take a look at the Football Manager Handheld facebook page (its not official but shows what can be done with such a page) ...

https://www.facebook.com/fmhandheld

[MajikMan77]

I also wish Jim well on this project, its not something I'm personally interested in (I'd have nobody to play with) and sadly reading about it being basically limited to US only for postal cost reasons (which is kinda understandable) further reduces any likelyhood I'd toss a donation.

To be honest, I'd be willing to chip in if it meant a new patch or better for FoF but thats something else entirely.

[Solecismic]

Originally Posted by tarcone

Thanks. I found it.

Jim, Im sure you dont care, but wanting people to "find your product" isnt going to get you $42,066 in 25 days.
If you truly believe in this, you need to be promoting it.
I have been following this thread and the one over at BGG. And what Im seeing is that people want you to sell them on it.
If this is just a side project that you dont really care if it gets printed or not, then enjoy playing it with your buddies. But if you want to produce it for us, sell it.

Is there any thought of a solo variant?
Im sure it would be as easy as Placing the opposing teams cards face down and drawing them, then rolling for them. Is that what you think a solo variant would or should be?

I care. When you run everything yourself, there's always 100 more things you wish you had time for. I thought I put the right irons out there, it honestly never occurred to me people would care whether I had a product facebook page. It's hard to get real publicity, though I have gotten a lot of traffic on my web site. So it seems more a matter of trying to publicize a product not a lot of people want. And, unfortunately, a miscalculation on some of the more national-level contacts I thought I could turn to help publicize. Probably for the same reason. This is a completely new market for me.

I've responded a couple of times on the BGG item, hopefully in the right tenor. I don't think this type of product, like my computer games, warrants a hard sell.

Yes, I've put a lot of thought into a solo variant. It's a little more than drawing cards, because you need a realistic offense. Instead of hands, you separate the offensive playbook into piles based on type of play, then there's a table you roll against that takes the situation and chooses a pile. On defense, it's based on situation and the offensive personnel and there are fewer piles. This would be on the web site as well. There's also a solo variant where you're running the offense and drawing cards for the defense based on personnel.

[jbergey22]

I am going to pledge not because I am particularly interested in this game but I believe in Jim.

I really wish you would put this energy back into your computer games where I think you can make the money you deserve for having this creative mind. Board games were popular back when people didnt have 300 options of TV, internet, and so many other things going on. It filled a need when options werent available. I think you are fighting an uphill battle and wish you the best of luck.

[Danny]

Originally Posted by jbergey22

I am going to pledge not because I am particularly interested in this game but I believe in Jim.

I really wish you would put this energy back into your computer games where I think you can make the money you deserve for having this creative mind. Board games were popular back when people didnt have 300 options of TV, internet, and so many other things going on. It filled a need when options werent available. I think you are fighting an uphill battle and wish you the best of luck.

Actually non mainstream board games are at an all time high overall. Even games like settlers, carc and quite a few others are appearing at b&n, target and toys r us

[jbergey22]

Originally Posted by Danny

Actually non mainstream board games are at an all time high overall. Even games like settlers, carc and quite a few others are appearing at b&n, target and toys r us

I guess I wasnt aware of this. Which demographic is buying games at this rate? The children that Im around dont seem very interested in board games and the younger adult crowds seem like they are too busy on their smart phones to care about anything else.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by Solecismic

though I have gotten a lot of traffic on my web site.

Are you doing your due diligence on monitoring the analytics of that traffic? Lots can be learned from that, even at some of the most basic levels. You're a data guy so I'm guessing that's a no-brainer, but seemed worth asking.

[Danny]

Originally Posted by jbergey22

I guess I wasnt aware of this. Which demographic is buying games at this rate? The children that Im around dont seem very interested in board games and the younger adult crowds seem like they are too busy on their smart phones to care about anything else.

Don't get me wrong, it's still a niche, it's just a pretty thriving one is all. Those who are into it are really into it and sustain the hobby pretty well. However, it is becoming more mass market. I do think this is largely dependent on area, but it's not uncommon for a random person to have played Settlers of Catan before. Other games like Dominion, Small World and others are becoming pretty main stream as well. Even in the small town I live in, a video game store was advertising on the radio that they also carry games like Settlers, Small World and a couple others.

Also, MTG and Warhammer miniatures are huge among the slightly to heavily nerdy youth and adults. Sometimes these can lead to someone finding interest in other games as well.

[Danny]

And just to put out sales, Settlers of Catan and it's various versions have sold over 15 million copies. Certainly nothing compared to the top selling video games, but still a solid niche.

And just to show how mainstream magic the gathering is, one of the charter schools at the district I work for, has a class on it.

[PadresFan104]

Originally Posted by Danny

Don't get me wrong, it's still a niche, it's just a pretty thriving one is all. Those who are into it are really into it and sustain the hobby pretty well. However, it is becoming more mass market. I do think this is largely dependent on area, but it's not uncommon for a random person to have played Settlers of Catan before. Other games like Dominion, Small World and others are becoming pretty main stream as well. Even in the small town I live in, a video game store was advertising on the radio that they also carry games like Settlers, Small World and a couple others.

Also, MTG and Warhammer miniatures are huge among the slightly to heavily nerdy youth and adults. Sometimes these can lead to someone finding interest in other games as well.

Great points. Oh, and I would love a football game with the aesthetic appeal and addictive gameplay of Dominion. I love that game... It's dissapointing to read that Jim doesn't see the need for his game to be as flashy in the artwork department.

[cuervo72]

Originally Posted by Danny

And just to put out sales, Settlers of Catan and it's various versions have sold over 15 million copies. Certainly nothing compared to the top selling video games, but still a solid niche.

And just to show how mainstream magic the gathering is, one of the charter schools at the district I work for, has a class on it.

Is that domestic, or worldwide (game being German and all)?

Speaking of Magic...looks like my son and I (daughter too, maybe) are getting back to playing Pokeomon TCG. I know I suggested in a past thread that maybe Jim would think about going in that direction. It occurred to me to check to see if there was a card version of Blood Bowl, and sure enough, there is. I realize it's a different dynamic than what Jim is going for (more stats oriented), but it sounds at least a bit interesting.

[Danny]

Blood Bowl is a good game. You basically have a center row of cards and are playing your players to those cards on your side in an attempt to win that card (which are game highlights). Almost a more complex version of battle line. It plays well though and has a fun theme, takes about an hour to play.

[KWhit]

Originally Posted by PadresFan104

Great points. Oh, and I would love a football game with the aesthetic appeal and addictive gameplay of Dominion. I love that game... It's dissapointing to read that Jim doesn't see the need for his game to be as flashy in the artwork department.

Yep. Artwork matters a great deal. In fact Three Moves Ahead recently did a podcast about exactly this type of thing. The quality of a game's components make a big difference to one's experience playing the game.

[Barkeep49]

I'll just echo that if Jim is serious about this game I would recommend an iOS version. I could never find anyone to play this in person (and this despite offering a class on Board Games at my school) but would enjoy it on my iPad. Seems like a way to get around the printing cost, since there's not a huge cost to having all those cards in an electronic form.

[Senator]

Doesn't look like it will reach the goal, but to help it along, I will pledge 120.

[Vince, Pt. II]

[CU Tiger]

+1 on wishing Jim the best of luck.

Did anyone else note the thread starter...this is their only post yet they knew to come here?

hrmmm...

BTW, Jim on the marketing philosophy I truly appreciate your soft sell, but will add if you dont believe in it enough to think its great and will improve my life, I probably wont either.

[Solecismic]

Originally Posted by Senator

Doesn't look like it will reach the goal, but to help it along, I will pledge 120.

I really appreciate your support. Yes, it appears the game will never be made, but it was a nice experience getting something completely new ready for publication and I felt confident it was a quality product that many football fans would enjoy.

Originally Posted by CU Tiger

Did anyone else note the thread starter...this is their only post yet they knew to come here?

hrmmm...

I wondered about that myself. It was up very quickly after I launched the Kickstarter. And, of course, a lot of you know by now I always launch in the dead of night.

But no, it wasn't me. I don't see the value of having a second account here - for one, why shouldn't announcements come from me directly, and two, if I use it for anything else, that's something that could easily backfire quite badly.

Originally Posted by CU Tiger

BTW, Jim on the marketing philosophy I truly appreciate your soft sell, but will add if you dont believe in it enough to think its great and will improve my life, I probably wont either.

I feel too close to my work to tell you if it's great. If I sell something, it's because I feel confident it's a product I would enjoy myself. I stand behind what I produce. This is a huge leap for me, going from PC games to a card game. I underestimated the size of that leap.

So it took a lot of extra work to get it where I liked it. And then playtesting revealed game flaws, so I took more time to adjust the concept to a place where it still had what I bring to the genre (statistical integrity, a sense of football strategy) and what I wanted to accomplish with the game (bringing a new dynamic of game play that captures the spirit of what coordinators and coaches do) and was accessible in terms of game time and play resolution.

But to tell you it will improve your life? That's not me. I'm not marketing a cancer drug or even something simple like a bouquet of roses that will brighten your wife's day. It is what it is, and my view of how a game should be marketed is to simply provide accurate information about it. Unfortunately, I can't advertise. And my attempts to get people who could provide a meaningful boost in terms of word-of-mouth weren't all successful.

The bottom line is that I had to provide a new product that captured the market I've already established. And it only does to a limited extent.

My style is to provide clean, useful graphics that don't take up so much room that I have to sacrifice *any* utility. With the PC game, that worked quite nicely in 1998, and has for more than ten years. With a modern card game, maybe not so much. I don't think the graphics are "poor", but it's not economically feasible to hire an artist to create unique card artwork rather than my diagrams. And if someone can do that for me, to be viable, it requires enough time to do it well that I ethically should be paying for that time.

That's a long answer just to say I believe in my work. And I also believe that a good product that has complexity eventually sells itself through design, and the best long-term marketing strategy is low-key honesty. I don't do short-term well, and that's not ideal for the Kickstarter model. If it fails to fund, I have to accept the blame and figure out what is next. Certainly I appreciate your positive wishes, along with all of you who expressed that sentiment without pre-ordering.

Though I do wish there was something special I could do for those of you who would like this product and probably will never see it (reiterating, of course, that no money changes hands when a Kickstarter project doesn't receive full funding).

[CU Tiger]

Jim,
Please don't mistake this, I think you have a brilliant statistical vision, and a unique perspective on football. But I think I may have just stumbled upon a big business flaw.

No one will ever value your worth more than you do. Ever.

No your game will not cure cancer, but if I take my valuable and scarce time and grant it your product for my entertainment, you can bet your ass I do it because I want to escape reality, provide my self some entertainment and refresh and recharge my batteries. Thus, if you sell entertainment you most certainy improve people's (quality of) lives. if you take your self any less serious than that you are selling yourself short.

Your games are great, heck I even bought the up the river game and never tried to play it. I bought it completely out of support for you and in appreciation for the hours of pleasure I had received from your other products.

I wish I could convince you that what you think, is less important than what your customers think, in regards to marketing, presentation and packaging. It's one of the first rules of marketing, what you think your customers like isnt important. But you're very intelligent, you know these things.

Any way I wish you tremendous success, and hope we see a card footballl game AND a future computer game revision. I'll buy both.

[Young Drachma]

Originally Posted by Solecismic

Though I do wish there was something special I could do for those of you who would like this product and probably will never see it (reiterating, of course, that no money changes hands when a Kickstarter project doesn't receive full funding).

Why not a "kickstarter" for an FOF6.5 for $15 or FOF7? I know you can't actually kickstarter an existing project, but the sentiment remains the same and I think you'd have a long line of people who'd support that.

[cubboyroy1826]

Originally Posted by Young Drachma

Why not a "kickstarter" for an FOF6.5 for $15 or FOF7? I know you can't actually kickstarter an existing project, but the sentiment remains the same and I think you'd have a long line of people who'd support that.

I had the same thought. I am sure a kickstarter for a new FOF computer game would do well. While I love the football card game idea I just do not have the time to sit down and play nor do I have the friends that would sit down and play. PurdueBrad and I have played a couple tabletop football games but the key is getting enough people to make it a league, which has been almost impossible.

[Senator]

Originally Posted by Solecismic

Though I do wish there was something special I could do for those of you who would like this product and probably will never see it (reiterating, of course, that no money changes hands when a Kickstarter project doesn't receive full funding).

Let me know if you decide to offer anything for those of us who want to play this. I will disregard what you have in parenthesis.

[TroyF]

Originally Posted by cubboyroy1826

I had the same thought. I am sure a kickstarter for a new FOF computer game would do well. While I love the football card game idea I just do not have the time to sit down and play nor do I have the friends that would sit down and play. PurdueBrad and I have played a couple tabletop football games but the key is getting enough people to make it a league, which has been almost impossible.

Too bad they cannot be combined. A new FOF, TCY and card game. Even without playing the card game, I'd throw 200 to 250 at it. Hell, I'd have thrown 60 at the table top game if it were close to hitting the goal.

Even though I would not be playing the game, I really wish it had been funded. I have no doubt it would have been a great game. Bummer.

[A-Husker-4-Life]

Originally Posted by TroyF

Too bad they cannot be combined. A new FOF, TCY and card game. Even without playing the card game, I'd throw 200 to 250 at it. Hell, I'd have thrown 60 at the table top game if it were close to hitting the goal.

Even though I would not be playing the game, I really wish it had been funded. I have no doubt it would have been a great game. Bummer.

TCY2 kickstarter, I'd throw in 500 or so on that.