Pro Wrestling Discussion Thread **Spoilers Possible**

[Joe]

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

As bad as this WWECW trainwreck is, there could be at least some trivial value in having Flair pull off the upset tonight, as it would make him the only person to have won World Titles in the NWA, WCW, WWF/E, and ECW.

Odd bit of wrestling trivia for you: prior to RVD & Big Slow accomplishing the feat in the new (mockery of) ECW, there were two previous wrestlers that had won both an ECW World Title and another recognized World Title (as acknowledged by PWI)

Can you name them (without looking it up)?

For the record, one of them I would have gotten but the other had slipped my mind.

Mike Awesome

[sabotai]

Was Chris Jericho one of them?

[duckman]

Originally Posted by sabotai

Was Chris Jericho one of them?

I don't think so. I believe that his stint was very short there before jumping to WCW.

[sabotai]

Originally Posted by duckman

I don't think so. I believe that his stint was very short there before jumping to WCW.

I looked him up and he had the ECW World TV Title (don't know if Jon meant "any" World title or "the" World title)

[JonInMiddleGA]

Well, that was ... gratuitious.

As well as unfulfilling and sad in a number of ways.

[duckman]

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

Well, that was ... gratuitious.

As well as unfulfilling and sad in a number of ways.

I find it funny how Flair went on in his book about Foley yet he allowed himself to be booked in this style of match. He did a lot of the things Foley did in his prime. I guess the almighty dollar speaks loudly. *shrug*

[General Mike]

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

Odd bit of wrestling trivia for you: prior to RVD & Big Slow accomplishing the feat in the new (mockery of) ECW, there were two previous wrestlers that had won both an ECW World Title and another recognized World Title (as acknowledged by PWI)

Can you name them (without looking it up)?

For the record, one of them I would have gotten but the other had slipped my mind.

Terry Funk is one of them.

Edit: I really should read more before I post.

[condors]

didn't "superstar" steve austin lose the title to mikey? maybe he didn't have the title though i can't remember exactly but mick foley and steve austin are my guesses

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by condors

didn't "superstar" steve austin lose the title to mikey? maybe he didn't have the title though i can't remember exactly but mick foley and steve austin are my guesses

Whipwreck won the title from Sandman & then lost it back to Sandman about six weeks later in a 3-way match that also included Austin.

Meanwhile, MapleLeafs answered the question about 10 posts ago -- Rhino & Steve Corino were the two that the question was looking for.

[TazFTW]

So RVD loses 2 titles and is suspended for 30 days while Sabu gets a week off and a DQ because it wasn't an extreme rules match?

[General Mike]

Originally Posted by TazFTW

So RVD loses 2 titles and is suspended for 30 days while Sabu gets a week off and a DQ because it wasn't an extreme rules match?

Well the weed was RVD's, and he had a prescription for the mystery pills.

[duckman]

Looks like people are still tuning in:

ECW On Sci-Fi last night did a 2.4 rating, its second best rating yet. Despite heavy criticism towards the show, it continues to perform well beyond the expectations from both WWE and Sci-Fi.

Credit: WrestlingObserver.com

I've been watching strictly for the main events. There has been some good ones the past few weeks.

Okay, maybe to see Kelly too.

[TazFTW]

Ugh, Big Show = Ratings?

[Toddzilla]

Man, TNA looks better and better all the time. Kinda strange for a company that rarely, if ever, does house shows. I haven't been to see wrestling since Starrcade 2000 (Bret Hart's 1st appearance in WCW as guest referee), and I would be all over a TNA house show in DC.

[saldana]

Originally Posted by Toddzilla

Man, TNA looks better and better all the time. Kinda strange for a company that rarely, if ever, does house shows. I haven't been to see wrestling since Starrcade 2000 (Bret Hart's 1st appearance in WCW as guest referee), and I would be all over a TNA house show in DC.

their shows are free to anyone at Universal Studios Orlando...they just recently started doing shows outside of that arena, but i dont know where a listing of them is.

[DeToxRox]

Originally Posted by saldana

their shows are free to anyone at Universal Studios Orlando...they just recently started doing shows outside of that arena, but i dont know where a listing of them is.

Their first non Orlando PPV is next month (I believe, but October kind of sounds familiar too) in Detroit. I'll be there.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Only 2 events outside of Orlando currently scheduled for TNA, both are promoted in conjunction with the UWF (Hermie Sadler's promotion)

July 21, 2006
Senator Bob Martin Eastern Agricultural Center
Williamston, NC 27892 (252) 792-5802

July 22, 2006
Jacksonville Commons Recreation Center
Jacksonville, NC 28541

from http://www.tnawrestling.com/news/fullnews2.php?all=683

[DeToxRox]

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

Only 2 events outside of Orlando currently scheduled for TNA, both are promoted in conjunction with the UWF (Hermie Sadler's promotion)

July 21, 2006
Senator Bob Martin Eastern Agricultural Center
Williamston, NC 27892 (252) 792-5802

July 22, 2006
Jacksonville Commons Recreation Center
Jacksonville, NC 28541

from http://www.tnawrestling.com/news/fullnews2.php?all=683

Yeah -- I think it's October. My buddy is currently training with Truth Martini, who trained a lot of guys (Like Alex Shelley) and Martini told them about it, assuming he heard it from a Shelley or the like.

[molson]

Originally Posted by Toddzilla

Man, TNA looks better and better all the time. Kinda strange for a company that rarely, if ever, does house shows. I haven't been to see wrestling since Starrcade 2000 (Bret Hart's 1st appearance in WCW as guest referee), and I would be all over a TNA house show in DC.

There's also a lot of small promotions that essentially run TNA cards, with TNA wrestlers, even though they're not promoting under the TNA banner. (Most of the TNA guys aren't exclusive). You might be able to find a show like that in the DC area.

[MikeVic]

I would love for a Winnipeg show to include guys like Joe, Styles, Daniels, and Petey Williams...

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by molson

There's also a lot of small promotions that essentially run TNA cards, with TNA wrestlers, even though they're not promoting under the TNA banner. (Most of the TNA guys aren't exclusive). You might be able to find a show like that in the DC area.

And there's even more promotions that include 1 or 2 TNA guys on a given night.

Senshi lost in the main event at a suburban roller rink north of Atlanta the night before appearing at the last PPV in Orlando. He's booked to return (ostensibly for revenge) the night before the upcoming PPV. And this is a pretty low end indy we're talking about, very likely that nobody here has ever heard of any of the other wrestlers they use regularly.

Point being, a lot of the guys work a lot outside of TNA, it just takes some digging to find them sometimes.

[JonInMiddleGA]

See folks, every comedy bit doesn't have to be overdone.

It wasn't the Big Wiggle that made me LOL, it was the crossing guard stop sign Norman threw up before it that provided the humor.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Meanwhile, considering the (seemingly) fairly kayfabe fan tendencies of the TNA audience, explain to me exactly how the heck Samoa Joe has remained a face.

I mean, he already broke the unwritten code of the X Division by trying to injure Daniels after winning a match, he abandoned Sting to the hands of Jarrett & Steiner after their tag match. He cuts promos like a heel, his expressions & mannerisms are largely heelish ... but he's arguably the most over guy in the company.

Don't get me wrong, he's a helluva talent & I understand completely why he's such a rising star ... I just don't understand why he generates such overwhelming support from fans that appear oriented toward more traditional faces.

edit to add: There's a lot about Joe that reminds me of Taz in his prime, but that was in front on an ECW crowd that often had reactions that ran contrary to traditional face/heel roles.

[General Mike]

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

Meanwhile, considering the (seemingly) fairly kayfabe fan tendencies of the TNA audience, explain to me exactly how the heck Samoa Joe has remained a face.

I mean, he already broke the unwritten code of the X Division by trying to injure Daniels after winning a match, he abandoned Sting to the hands of Jarrett & Steiner after their tag match. He cuts promos like a heel, his expressions & mannerisms are largely heelish ... but he's arguably the most over guy in the company.

Don't get me wrong, he's a helluva talent & I understand completely why he's such a rising star ... I just don't understand why he generates such overwhelming support from fans that appear oriented toward more traditional faces.

edit to add: There's a lot about Joe that reminds me of Taz in his prime, but that was in front on an ECW crowd that often had reactions that ran contrary to traditional face/heel roles.

The TNA fans are smarks. There were a heck of a lot more marks in the WWF audience in 97 when Austin became the biggest face in the universe than there are in the "Impact Zone", and I mean percentage wise.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by General Mike

The TNA fans are smarks. There were a heck of a lot more marks in the WWF audience in 97 when Austin became the biggest face in the universe than there are in the "Impact Zone", and I mean percentage wise.

My initial tendency was to chalk it up to the same thing, that it's just the nature of a different modern audience ... until I realized that he was also high on the list of my 8 y/o son's favorites too. Granted, he knows it's all a work, he knows about bookers, angles, shoots, etc. at least in a basic way. But the rest of his reactions to characters are pretty much exclusively along kayfabe lines -- he thinks AJ is the most talented guy he's ever seen, marks big for Sting, hates Jarrett & Steiner, etc., all pretty much the reactions that viewers are "supposed" to have -- except that he's made a clear exception for Joe.

I guess that's what throws me, I don't quite get how he gets the free pass even from the marks.

Shrug. It's not like it matters, I was just sort of intrigued by the anamoly. Maybe he's more of a smart than I'm giving him credit for. After all, after watching the Sabu/Sandman Highway to Hell match for the first time last night, he said he now understood why I've not been excited by the "new" ECW

[SirFozzie]

BTW, that was one hell of a promo by Rhino last night on IMPACT. Goosebump worthy.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by SirFozzie

BTW, that was one hell of a promo by Rhino last night on IMPACT. Goosebump worthy.

Agreed. 2nd straight week for strong work from him too.

[molson]

I finally just got around to watching Monday's RAW. The Diva search segment was hilarious. That Miz guy flubbed his lines worse than anyone I've ever seen on a nationally televised wrestling show.

[jbmagic]

Originally Posted by molson

I finally just got around to watching Monday's RAW. The Diva search segment was hilarious. That Miz guy flubbed his lines worse than anyone I've ever seen on a nationally televised wrestling show.

IF Miz continues to do that, I won't be surprise if he gets replace with the Coach.

[molson]

Originally Posted by jbmagic

IF Miz continues to do that, I won't be surprise if he gets replace with the Coach.

I wouldn't be surprised if they made it part of his gimmick.

[wade moore]

Miz? Is this the Miz from Real World/Road Rules?

[albionmoonlight]

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

My initial tendency was to chalk it up to the same thing, that it's just the nature of a different modern audience ... until I realized that he was also high on the list of my 8 y/o son's favorites too. Granted, he knows it's all a work, he knows about bookers, angles, shoots, etc. at least in a basic way. But the rest of his reactions to characters are pretty much exclusively along kayfabe lines -- he thinks AJ is the most talented guy he's ever seen, marks big for Sting, hates Jarrett & Steiner, etc., all pretty much the reactions that viewers are "supposed" to have -- except that he's made a clear exception for Joe.

I guess that's what throws me, I don't quite get how he gets the free pass even from the marks.

One of the cool things about wrestling is how some guys just get heat, and no one can really explain why. I always give the example of Hacksaw Jim Duggan. I LOVED Duggan growing up. All of my friends loved him. He was totally awesome.

Now, looking back, he was just a guy who said "HOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!" a lot and stomped around the ring for a while. There was no reason to like him. But we did. Now, granted, he was pushed as a face--so it is not quite the same thing as Joe--but I see some similarity there.

Some guys just get the crowd support. And some guys don't. And sometimes (if you are a good booker) you don't try to figure it out. You just work with it.

[jbmagic]

Originally Posted by wade moore

Miz? Is this the Miz from Real World/Road Rules?

yes

He also on Smackdown.

[jbmagic]

Originally Posted by albionmoonlight

One of the cool things about wrestling is how some guys just get heat, and no one can really explain why. I always give the example of Hacksaw Jim Duggan. I LOVED Duggan growing up. All of my friends loved him. He was totally awesome.

Now, looking back, he was just a guy who said "HOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!" a lot and stomped around the ring for a while. There was no reason to like him. But we did. Now, granted, he was pushed as a face--so it is not quite the same thing as Joe--but I see some similarity there.

Some guys just get the crowd support. And some guys don't. And sometimes (if you are a good booker) you don't try to figure it out. You just work with it.

He was a heel too on WCW.

[wade moore]

Originally Posted by jbmagic

yes

He also on Smackdown.

Interesting... I might have to watch just to see how he does...

[jbmagic]

Originally Posted by wade moore

Interesting... I might have to watch just to see how he does...

He is not a wrestler.

They got him on Smackdown just doing the introduction who will be wrestling that night.

On raw, they got him being the host for the Diva competition.

[molson]

Originally Posted by jbmagic

He is not a wrestler.

He has wrestled in the past, and I've heard he's decent. Not sure if WWE will go that way with him though.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by molson

He has wrestled in the past, and I've heard he's decent. Not sure if WWE will go that way with him though.

They seem to be hoping he'll develop into something they can use, looks like he's been given a decent enough run through their developmental territories. He was the champion of Deep South Wrestling (basically their AA minor league territory) before being moved up to work at OVW where he got a run as tag champ.

http://www.obsessedwithwrestling.com...e-mizanin.html

[saldana]

Originally Posted by molson

He has wrestled in the past, and I've heard he's decent. Not sure if WWE will go that way with him though.

he won the last Tough Enough contest, the one that didnt actually have a show of its own, but was intermingled into smackdown....then they did the same thing they always do with those guys...sent him to work in the developmental schools and promotions until he could actually not suck...i am sure at some point they will run an angle to get him into the ring, but from what i have heard, all the guys in the locker room fucking hate him, so i think they are a little apprehensive about actually putting him into matches.

[General Mike]

Originally Posted by saldana

he won the last Tough Enough contest, the one that didnt actually have a show of its own, but was intermingled into smackdown....then they did the same thing they always do with those guys...sent him to work in the developmental schools and promotions until he could actually not suck...i am sure at some point they will run an angle to get him into the ring, but from what i have heard, all the guys in the locker room fucking hate him, so i think they are a little apprehensive about actually putting him into matches.

Actually Daniel Puder won the last Tough Enough.

[saldana]

Originally Posted by General Mike

Actually Daniel Puder won the last Tough Enough.

you sure? then did miz come in second? they always give contracts to the top 2 finishers, and i cant imagine any other reason that they would have kept miz around.

[jbmagic]

Originally Posted by saldana

you sure? then did miz come in second? they always give contracts to the top 2 finishers, and i cant imagine any other reason that they would have kept miz around.

Miz never won.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tough_Enough


Tough enough 1 was

Maven (winner)
Nidia (winner)

Tough Enough #2 was

Shaniqua
Jackie

Tough Enough #3 was

John (Johhny Nitro)
Matt Cappotelli (cancel his career because of brain tumor)

[jbmagic]

dola

the 4th Tough Enough was called $1,000,000 Tough Enough.

Miz didn't win it.

Only one winner

Daniel Puder. Puder competed in his first (and only) WWE pay-per-view event on January 30, 2005, being the third entrant in the 2005 Royal Rumble match. Soon after, he was sent to OVW before eventually being released in September 2005.

[jbmagic]

Why did the first diva winner Christy Hemme leave WWE and went to TNA?

[jbmagic]

Interesting things on $1,000,000 Tough Enough

Some finalist that was on the show is on WWE now.

Nick Mitchell (later became part of the Spirit Squad)

Marty Wright (who was cut before the finalists were selected for lying about his age, but was later hired by WWE. He now wrestles as 'The Boogeyman')

Mike Mizanin (who was later hired by WWE, currently working in OVW; Debuted on Smackdown! on the June 2, 2006 edition.)

[Joe]

Originally Posted by jbmagic

Why did the first diva winner Christy Hemme leave WWE and went to TNA?

she was released from the WWE due to "budget cuts"

[JonInMiddleGA]

re: TNA House shows

3 new shows under the UWF banner announced this week, tickets went on sale this morning for
Thurs Aug 10 - Charleston, SC
Fri Aug 11 - Columbia, SC
Sat Aug 12 - Anderson, SC

TNA stars scheduled to appear include: AJ Styles, "The Fallen Angel" Christopher Daniels, Samao Joe, The James Gang, America's Most Wanted, Petey Williams, Jay Lethal, Chris Sabin, Rhino, Ron Killings and the monster Abyss (Jeff Jarrett also scheduled for the first two shows)

And guess who has a pair of "Ultimate Fan Package" (pre-show meet & greet, autograph session, and guaranteed seating in either row 1 or 2) for the show in Anderson?

And, lest anyone think I've suddenly gone mark, I thought the pre-show stuff would be extremely cool for Will otherwise I wouldn't have done it. He goes back to school 2 days later, so I thought this would be a killer last-weekend- of-summer thing to do for him, and it works great since Anderson, SC is just 80 miles from our new house (that we are supposedly going to be living in by then).

Anyhow, not really posting cause I'm going, just posting in case there's anybody else who is the area & would be interested.

[DeToxRox]

Some huge Indy matches are signed for ROH after tonights Death Before Dishonor.

KENTA comes back to ROH to take on Bryan Danielson* 9/16 in NYC for the ROH Title.

* Danielson takes on Samoa Joe next month for the title, furthered tonight by Danielson turning on Joe and ROH in the Cage of Death.

Homicide made the save however as it appeared Cornette gave into his 3 demands. Cornette said he gives into 2, which were a rematch with Steve Corino (Presumably at Glory by Honor, same night/place as Danielson/Kenta) and a title shot. His third demand was a match with Low Ki, but Cornette said no, then turned heel on him as Adam Pearce beat down 'Cide.

All in all, definetly things are looking pretty intriguing for ROH down the road.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Indeed, the ROH plot does appear to have thickened. Although I only follow it on the 'net, I really didn't see a Danielson turn coming at all.

[Raiders Army]

I'm sorry, but I can't watch this. The six man tag last night of Mark Henry, King Booker T, and Fit Findlay against Bastista, Rey Misterio Jr., and Bobby (?) Lasher was horrible.

Okay, I get that wrestling is scripted. I also believe that what they do is real to a certain extent. Any way you cut it, you can't fake getting hit with a steel chair (although you can throw your arms up to take the impact). But that six man tag was the worst. Rey Misterio gets beat on and instead of tagging he tries to beat on his opponent, setting it up for no tag. Then Bastista runs out to save him, but the ref holds him back. There is no way a ref is going to hold back Bastista but they made it look like it. It wasn't the whole "he's got his fist in the air" and the ref is holding up his hands to stop him; it was Bastista charging into the ring and the ref physically stopping him. Now, I'm supposed to believe that Bastista wins the match with his fearsome Bastista Bomb when he's stopped by a puny ref?

At least script the matches so they look more realistic. I can handle the midget running out to help Fit Findlay. I can handle DX winning a handicap match (after all, both were multiple WWE champs and Shawn outlasted 29 other people to win the Royal Rumble). I can handle the obvious skits setting up Vince McMahon. I can handle Viscera and (can't remember) fighting over Lillian. What I can't handle is bad scripting during the matches. Ugh.