Official 2010-11 College Basketball Thread

[duckman]

Here's what Dean Blevins (Arkansas native) from News 9 in OKC says about his source:

1. There have been and are ongoing conversations between the two parties (Mike Anderson and the University of Arkansas). The source went as far as to say that Anderson “shot them a big number.”

2. There are at least two factions in play with completely different preferences. One involves long-time Razorback people of influence who basically don’t want to have anything to do with anyone connected to Nolan Richardson (Anderson played for Richardson at Arkansas and was a long-time assistant under him, including a run at UA when they won a national title.) Some players from that title team and a host of other former Arkansas players are in another corner pushing for former Oklahoma Associate AD and current UA AD Jeff Long to hire the current Missouri coach.

3. The source says he has been told by Arkansas insiders that it is the preference of Long to go with Anderson—although like all other coaching hires, if Anderson is not the hire, everyone from the AD on down will deny, deny, deny. No one will put any merit in any of the very real discussions that have taken place.

4. The source tells me that if he had to “put money on it I’d go with Anderson,” but that it is by no means a done deal and that the difference in opinion between the “factions” has pushed the potential hiring back from the first of the week.

So that’s most of what I know. I’d expect this to take a little time. A Missouri journalist friend of mine said Mike was back home recruiting last night. I’m sure things are moving pretty fast for him right now.

http://okblitz.com/Article.aspx?id=36410

[Mizzou B-ball fan]

Originally Posted by duckman

Here's what Dean Blevins (Arkansas native) from News 9 in OKC says about his source:

1. There have been and are ongoing conversations between the two parties (Mike Anderson and the University of Arkansas). The source went as far as to say that Anderson “shot them a big number.”

2. There are at least two factions in play with completely different preferences. One involves long-time Razorback people of influence who basically don’t want to have anything to do with anyone connected to Nolan Richardson (Anderson played for Richardson at Arkansas and was a long-time assistant under him, including a run at UA when they won a national title.) Some players from that title team and a host of other former Arkansas players are in another corner pushing for former Oklahoma Associate AD and current UA AD Jeff Long to hire the current Missouri coach.

3. The source says he has been told by Arkansas insiders that it is the preference of Long to go with Anderson—although like all other coaching hires, if Anderson is not the hire, everyone from the AD on down will deny, deny, deny. No one will put any merit in any of the very real discussions that have taken place.

4. The source tells me that if he had to “put money on it I’d go with Anderson,” but that it is by no means a done deal and that the difference in opinion between the “factions” has pushed the potential hiring back from the first of the week.

So that’s most of what I know. I’d expect this to take a little time. A Missouri journalist friend of mine said Mike was back home recruiting last night. I’m sure things are moving pretty fast for him right now.

http://okblitz.com/Article.aspx?id=36410

Now this is much better reporting.

I have little doubt that #1 is true. Not because he has any interest in Arkansas, but because this is Anderson's usual MO. I've heard that Anderson and Mizzou have already put together a new extension that raises his base salary over $1M a year to around $2.5M. If he can play Arkansas as he and his agent have done in previous years, he'll easily get that deal finalized.

I can't speak to #2 or #4, but it certainly is something that is repeated pretty often out of Razorback circles. It's a house divided at best and a clusterf$#@ at worst.

#3 isn't anything more than what I stated previously. Anderson is the #1 option, but they've got the denials all ready to go.

[MJ4H]

@GaryParrishCBS Mike Anderson to Arkansas is NOT done, but a source told CBSSports.com it is headed that way. Still, a Sunday introduction is unlikely

[the_meanstrosity]

Originally Posted by Mizzou B-ball fan

Now this is much better reporting.

I have little doubt that #1 is true. Not because he has any interest in Arkansas, but because this is Anderson's usual MO. I've heard that Anderson and Mizzou have already put together a new extension that raises his base salary over $1M a year to around $2.5M. If he can play Arkansas as he and his agent have done in previous years, he'll easily get that deal finalized.

I can't speak to #2 or #4, but it certainly is something that is repeated pretty often out of Razorback circles. It's a house divided at best and a clusterf$#@ at worst.

#3 isn't anything more than what I stated previously. Anderson is the #1 option, but they've got the denials all ready to go.

Isn't this like the third or fourth time Anderson has played another gig for an extension or raise at Missouri? Seriously when does Alden say enough is enough?

[MJ4H]

Arkansas close to naming Anderson its next coach - NCAA Division I Mens Basketball - CBSSports.com

Missouri coach Mike Anderson is close to reaching an agreement in principle to become Arkansas' men's basketball coach, but a deal has not been finalized and no formal introduction is planned for Sunday, a source close to the Arkansas program told CBSSports.com late Saturday.

An attempt to reach Anderson late Saturday was unsuccessful.

The source said there are still things to work out despite a television report suggesting otherwise, but that barring a breakdown it appears Anderson will ultimately leave Missouri for Arkansas -- the place where he assisted Nolan Richardson for 17 seasons before landing his first head coaching job at UAB. Anderson has been at Missouri five seasons. He made the NCAA tournament each of the past three years. His Tigers lost to Cincinnati in the Round of 64 on Thursday.

Arkansas is looking for a coach because it fired John Pelphrey last Sunday.

Pelphrey made one NCAA tournament in four years.

[Mizzou B-ball fan]

Originally Posted by the_meanstrosity

Isn't this like the third or fourth time Anderson has played another gig for an extension or raise at Missouri? Seriously when does Alden say enough is enough?

It's an excellent question. At some level, I'm not sure Alden has any say. It's just a case of when the donors don't feel like they're getting enough bang for their buck.

[the_meanstrosity]

Originally Posted by Mizzou B-ball fan

It's an excellent question. At some level, I'm not sure Alden has any say. It's just a case of when the donors don't feel like they're getting enough bang for their buck.

If I'm Alden, I call his bluff this year. I just don't think he's done anything that warrants a raise over the last two years at Missouri. Next year Anderson will have a number of returners and if he's able to turn it into a Big 12 championship then you reward the guy.

[Mizzou B-ball fan]

Originally Posted by the_meanstrosity

If I'm Alden, I call his bluff this year. I just don't think he's done anything that warrants a raise over the last two years at Missouri. Next year Anderson will have a number of returners and if he's able to turn it into a Big 12 championship then you reward the guy.

I'd agree with that. You're making far too much sense.

It's pretty apparent that the 'leak' is Anderson's agent hoping to jump-start the final negotiations on the extension with Mizzou. This is as good of an opportunity that he's going to get a big contract. Not many bluffs left after this one.

[Atocep]

I was wondering what Mike Anderson has done to get paid roughly the same as Thad Matta, Coach K, and Rick Pitino.

He's a good coach, but if you're Missouri or Arkansas are you really sure he's worth paying a top 5ish salary to?

[the_meanstrosity]

Originally Posted by Atocep

I was wondering what Mike Anderson has done to get paid roughly the same as Thad Matta, Coach K, and Rick Pitino.

He's a good coach, but if you're Missouri or Arkansas are you really sure he's worth paying a top 5ish salary to?

Anderson isn't worthy of that type of salary, but I can understand why both AD's might pay him on that level. For Missouri, it may be cheaper in the long run to give him the raise rather than go on a long drawn out coaching search for an unknown commodity. Missouri knows what they have in Anderson and his system thus far has been competitive in the Big 12 especially at home. For Arkansas, Anderson gives the fans some of those good feelings of yesteryear when Nolan was prowling the sidelines.

Again, my only argument against Missouri giving him the raise is because this will be the third or fourth time he's received a raise off of the threat of other job openings. Eventually the Missouri AD has to wonder if this is a bigger headache than it's worth.

[Wolfpack]

Coming late to the party on this. Obviously it'll get swallowed up and disappear amongst the ongoing flame-war-in-disguise that is the Mike Anderson rumor mill, but having said that, here's an omnibus respose to the Sidney Lowe dismissal.

Originally Posted by Swaggs

Sidney Lowe has resigned from NC State: http://www.newsobserver.com/2011/03/...oon-today.html

The article lists Sean Miller of Arizona and Mark Turgeon of Texas A&M as the top targets. I think they'll have a tough time getting established, power conference coaches like those guys to listen after chasing Sendek out.

Miller was the #1 target, albeit very much a longshot and Miller himself has been pretty firm in his denials of interest. I'm not holding my breath on him.

I'm intrigued by Turgeon as a possibility. I've seen speculation (nothing more than internet stuff, so that's a very heavy grain of salt) that he's not thrilled with things at A&M, but don't know where that leaves him with interest in going to another job, let alone NC State. He had pretty good success at Wichita State, but doesn't seem to be doing much earth-shattering at A&M, including an early exit from the NCAAs this year.

Originally Posted by muns

Wasn't Sean's Brother Archie on Sendek's staff when he got forced out???

Archie was at NC State when Sendek left and went to ASU. He then moved to an assistant job at Ohio State before Sean brought him on staff when he got the Arizona job.

Originally Posted by dawgfan

Yeah, I'm not seeing any good reasons why he would do so. Seems like a backward step. And at this point, it would probably be a backward step for Turgeon too. NC State fans are probably going to have to get used to less established guys as the realistic targets...

It's hard to know. I do think it's not a step back from the A&M job, though. A&M is still very much a football school, especially compared to NC State. If NC State were to start winning again like they did pre-1990, it would be incredibly evident that State was still a basketball school. Hell, we damn near worshipped Sendek when he got us into the NIT the first year he had the job. That was how hard we had fallen during the early 1990s and how desperate we were to get back to where we were. State supporters thought that first NIT appearance was going to be the return to our rightful place alongside Duke and UNC. However, I do agree, the Arizona job is a step up from the State job as it currently stands.

Originally Posted by muns

I cant wait to see what big time coach wants to go work for Debbie Yow. She killed relationships at Maryland with all of her tier one head coaches and tried to push out a legend of the game. All any basketball coach needs to do is call Gary Williams up and they will find out all they need to know about how she handles her business. I dont think its going to be as easy as she thinks its going to be as she has pubically stated that she wants to go after coaches that are currently coaching in the NCAA tourament.

From ESPN

Yow may have had lousy relationships with coaches at Maryland, but you have no idea how much the fanbase here detested the prior AD. Suffice to say, while there was skepticism in some corners about her coming here, just about everyone was in agreement that things couldn't be any worse than they have been in the athletics department under Lee Fowler. What's more, they don't expect that this search will be so thoroughly mismanaged as it was when Fowler hired Lowe after getting publicly rejected by so many other coaches five years ago. (Whether that will be true or not, well, we'll see about that.)

Originally Posted by Dark Cloud

Wichita State's coach might end up being a target for that gig after all of the big names say no thanks. Maybe Shaka Smart at VCU?

The feeling about Smart is that he might not be ready for a job like this one yet, though he shows promise (as evidenced by his team surviving the play-in to get to the round of 32). My sense is that if he were hired, there would be a new split in the fanbase almost immediately because a lot of fans are looking for the big fish on this one, or at least someone with more chops and a track record to point to like Brad Stevens at Butler. Smart isn't the home-run hire people are looking for, though there are some who would look favorably on him should he get the job.

The Wichita State guy is Gregg Marshall, who was former head coach at Winthrop, just across the state line from Charlotte, so he's got some roots in the area. He was very successful at Winthrop and a strong personality to boot (which was another issue lots of fans had about Sendek...good intellect, but an utter lack of passion, especially in areas that State fans were very passionate about like rivalries). Much like Turgeon, he's not been a raging success at Wichita State since they've not made the NCAAs since he got the job. Still, his ties and success at Winthrop means he's in the discussion for the job.

Originally Posted by gstelmack

Yeah, State's going to have loads of fun finding someone, especially with the Sendek fiasco so fresh in everyone's minds. Going to have to be an up-and-comer from the non-BCS-conferences, or some young assistant wanting to establish themselves and willing to take the risk.

Originally Posted by Swaggs

I'm not positive, but I think you are right.

I know that Sean got his start under Sendek, so I cannot imagine him having good feelings for the way that he and his staff were treated.

I still think NC State is a pretty good job, so I imagine that just about any assistant (with any ambitions of ever becoming a HC) would be willing to accept the challenge. I would just worry that Yow is going to end up trying to get a successful, established BCS-type and miss out on some of the more promising, in-demand candidates.

With CJ Leslie and the other freshmen already saying they'll be back, it's not going to be an empty cupboard like it was at the end of the Les Robinson or the Sendek years, so there's a lot of parts to work with. That alone may suffice to get someone higher up the food chain as they won't be thrown into an automatic 10-18 (4-12 ACC) situation. This team underachieved badly this year. Also, getting an assistant is pretty much not going to happen. The only one I could see even getting a look is perhaps Archie Miller, but even then, I don't think anyone wants to go the "untested alumni" route again.

With Miller, I don't now what his personal feelings are about State. He spent a lot of years under Sendek there, but he left for Xavier a few years before Sendek left. He then had no qualms about taking the Arizona job in spite of the fact that his old boss was at the rival school. That's not to say he doesn't like or respect Sendek, but it's still a business.

Originally Posted by muns

I'm with you there as well. I don't see the ousting of Herb and his staff as a positive for Sean to jump on the bandwagon. Couple that with Yow and I think that rumor is DOA.

I also agree that the NC State job is a good one, however I don't think Debbie is going to be on board with going after an up and coming assistant. I think she thinks she is going to get a good established coach(what the job would usually command) and I just don't see that happening strictly because of the way she is, and how she treats her tier one coaches. As a side note, she has done a fantastic job of hiring non tier one sports coaches, and has won several national championships in those areas. It's weird how on one hand you have how great she is spotting coaching talent and on the other hand(at the exact same time) she has been ripped apart for the way she handles people.

I also can't help but throw this out there. I think the way NC State handled the Herb Sendek thing was one of the crappiest and most idiotic moves I've seen in a while. I think they deserve to stay down in the dumps a bit longer for thinking that they were better than what he made them, however I also think them getting Yow as AD is punishment enough. Sidney Lowe is a good individual and a big man for the way he just stepped down, but now they are back in the same boat as they were when they hired him (over inflated opinion on their own program and unrealistic expectations). Yow doesn't help this situation as she needs to prove her worth. isn't this her first big hire there??? So this in my eyes has the potential to be a disaster all over again.

State didn't do anything to Sendek. Sendek left of his own volition. The national media (God help me, I sound like one of those conspiracy theorists) continues to have this mistaken impression and it colors everything about the State job whenever it's brought up. He was *NOT* fired. He voluntarily left for the Arizona State job.

Also, it gets ignored that Sendek had the job for 10 years. Not three or five years, ten years. (Guthridge and Doherty only got six years combined at UNC after Smith left and no one complained when they did what they felt necessary to get Roy Williams) He only had one Sweet 16 to show for it and that was an upset against UConn in the second round to get that much. Yes, the first couple of years are forgivable for just how bad the team was, but once his players were in, the program never really took off like many thought it should have. It always advanced haltingly if at all. Meanwhile, Duke took advantage of the power vacuum left by State cratering its program in the early 1990s to cement its place in the national consciousness. Unfortunately, this coincided with the rise of ESPN as a national media force, so with NC State in the toilet during the early 1990s and Duke and UNC winning three national championships in a row, it was Duke-UNC all the time and has been ever since. Sendek never really did anything to break up the new Duke-UNC hegemony and, as mentioned before, didn't seem to care about it.

Also, there are two national championship banners and 10 ACC banners hanging in the rafters at the RBC Center, so you'll have to forgive State fans a bit for "thinking that they were better than what he made them". We can be a very delusional lot at times (I've seen my fair share of embarrassing behavior from internet fans, trust me), but it's not like it's without something to back it up with. College basketball history goes back further than 1990. While it seems unrealistic in this day and age to go back to the way it was, it seems the bigger sin would be to not try and just accept being middle-of-the-road.

[MizzouRah]

Originally Posted by the_meanstrosity

Isn't this like the third or fourth time Anderson has played another gig for an extension or raise at Missouri? Seriously when does Alden say enough is enough?

I'm asking the same question.. you want to go to Arkansas Anderson, take care but we are not going to keep re-negociating your contract every time Arkansas is looking for a new basketball coach.. or any other school for that matter.

I'm getting tired of reading about it to be honest.

[MizzouRah]

Originally Posted by the_meanstrosity

Anderson isn't worthy of that type of salary, but I can understand why both AD's might pay him on that level. For Missouri, it may be cheaper in the long run to give him the raise rather than go on a long drawn out coaching search for an unknown commodity. Missouri knows what they have in Anderson and his system thus far has been competitive in the Big 12 especially at home. For Arkansas, Anderson gives the fans some of those good feelings of yesteryear when Nolan was prowling the sidelines.

Again, my only argument against Missouri giving him the raise is because this will be the third or fourth time he's received a raise off of the threat of other job openings. Eventually the Missouri AD has to wonder if this is a bigger headache than it's worth.

I say after the tourney we call up Butler's coach, Brad Stevens.

[Mizzou B-ball fan]

Originally Posted by MizzouRah

I'm asking the same question.. you want to go to Arkansas Anderson, take care but we are not going to keep re-negociating your contract every time Arkansas is looking for a new basketball coach.. or any other school for that matter.

I'm getting tired of reading about it to be honest.

To be fair, the renegotiation of his contract started in late January. The Arkansas coaching opening didn't trigger anything. Both Alden and Anderson wanted to do a contract that would set Anderson to put everything to rest for good and ensure Anderson a final contract that would allow him to finish his career at Mizzou. That contract, if signed, will include a HEAVY poison pill that would make it extremely difficult for him to move. MU is willing to give him the big contract in return for a contract that seals his loyalty to the program.

There's more info coming out this morning concerning Anderson's restrictions in his current extension. He and/or his agent is required in the contract to request written permission from the MU program before any contact with another program. At this point, no request has even been received by MU admin. This only further strengthens the argument that this was a seed planted by Anderson's agent without any actual contact with Arkansas. Just trying to push the buttons a bit more, as he has done in the past.

[MizzouRah]

Originally Posted by Mizzou B-ball fan

To be fair, the renegotiation of his contract started in late January. The Arkansas coaching opening didn't trigger anything. Both Alden and Anderson wanted to do a contract that would set Anderson to put everything to rest for good and ensure Anderson a final contract that would allow him to finish his career at Mizzou. That contract, if signed, will include a HEAVY poison pill that would make it extremely difficult for him to move. MU is willing to give him the big contract in return for a contract that seals his loyalty to the program.

I'm all for that if true.

[MrBug708]

Originally Posted by MizzouRah

I say after the tourney we call up Butler's coach, Brad Stevens.

I'm trying to think what major job openings are coming up that are worth waiting for.

[cartman]

Billy Gillespie is the next coach at Texas Tech

Billy Gillispie accepts offer to be Texas Tech's coach - ESPN

[the_meanstrosity]

Originally Posted by Mizzou B-ball fan

To be fair, the renegotiation of his contract started in late January. The Arkansas coaching opening didn't trigger anything. Both Alden and Anderson wanted to do a contract that would set Anderson to put everything to rest for good and ensure Anderson a final contract that would allow him to finish his career at Mizzou. That contract, if signed, will include a HEAVY poison pill that would make it extremely difficult for him to move. MU is willing to give him the big contract in return for a contract that seals his loyalty to the program.

There's more info coming out this morning concerning Anderson's restrictions in his current extension. He and/or his agent is required in the contract to request written permission from the MU program before any contact with another program. At this point, no request has even been received by MU admin. This only further strengthens the argument that this was a seed planted by Anderson's agent without any actual contact with Arkansas. Just trying to push the buttons a bit more, as he has done in the past.

That would make a lot more sense if true given MU's early success and the seniors he has returning next season. An extension would have definitely been warranted before the conference season.

Sounding like Texas Tech has hired Gillespie. Great hire if true.

[sterlingice]

Originally Posted by the_meanstrosity

Sounding like Texas Tech has hired Gillespie. Great hire if true.

He keeps getting referred to as "Former Kentucky coach Billy Gillespie" but I still think of him as a Texas guy with the jobs at UTEP and A&M.

SI

[MrBug708]

Homerun hire for Tech.

[sterlingice]

Originally Posted by MrBug708

Homerun hire for Tech.

Agreed- good on them and the Big XII just got even better

SI

[TargetPractice6]

CBG has some serious personality problems to work on, but hopefully he's used the last couple years to get cleaned up and do some soul searching. He seems more attuned to being at the helm of a smaller Texas school so I think he'll do well if he's really off the bottle.

[MrBug708]

Originally Posted by TargetPractice6

CBG has some serious personality problems to work on, but hopefully he's used the last couple years to get cleaned up and do some soul searching. He seems more attuned to being at the helm of a smaller Texas school so I think he'll do well if he's really off the bottle.

You forgot to mention there aren't any asshat Kentucky fans either.

[TargetPractice6]

Because of course Kentucky is the only place there are asshat fans... It's easy to lump the blame on the fans, but many of Gillispie's actions while coach here were clearly beyond the pale and occurred while he was still supported by a majority of the fanbase. He refused to sign a contract which created tension within the athletic department from the beginning, was abrasive with reporters, and employed some unusual (to put it nicely) methods of player development. The final straw was before his last SEC Tournament when he publicly declared that he is not an ambassador for the university, meaning he shouldn't have to be civil with the press or humane to his players. And let's not forget he got a DUI in the state of Kentucky a full six months after his termination, which I'm fairly sure wasn't the fault of asshat UK fans.

[MrBug708]

Originally Posted by TargetPractice6

Because of course Kentucky is the only place there are asshat fans... It's easy to lump the blame on the fans, but many of Gillispie's actions while coach here were clearly beyond the pale and occurred while he was still supported by a majority of the fanbase. He refused to sign a contract which created tension within the athletic department from the beginning, was abrasive with reporters, and employed some unusual (to put it nicely) methods of player development. The final straw was before his last SEC Tournament when he publicly declared that he is not an ambassador for the university, meaning he shouldn't have to be civil with the press or humane to his players. And let's not forget he got a DUI in the state of Kentucky a full six months after his termination, which I'm fairly sure wasn't the fault of asshat UK fans.

So he didn't sign a contract and he was rough with reporters? That's what makes him so bad? What inhumane things did he do to his players? Did he force them to go without food and water? Chinese Water Torture? Hell, put a player in a shed for not being able to practice?

He's made some poor personal decisions, but the fact that you are bringing up a DUI that happened 6 months after he wasn't the coach, as reason for why he was a bad coach, shows me that Kentucky fans were probably a bit more unreasonable, and this is coming from a UCLA fan whose fan base has the reputation for being the most impatient with their college coaches. (Comes with the territory from having the most prestigious basketball program)

[Radii]

Originally Posted by MrBug708

(Comes with the territory from having the most prestigious basketball program 40 years ago with decade long periods of irrelevance since)

You hit submit without completing your statement I assume, I fixed it for you.

[MrBug708]

Originally Posted by Radii

You hit submit without completing your statement I assume, I fixed it for you.

You shouldn't assume, but a UNC fan would be the last person I would think who would argue for Kentucky supremacy.

[panerd]

Originally Posted by Radii

You hit submit without completing your statement I assume, I fixed it for you.

Aren't they near the top of the list of most final fours this decade?

[Radii]

Originally Posted by MrBug708

You shouldn't assume, but a UNC fan would be the last person I would think who would argue for Kentucky supremacy.

Ohhh, I didn't realize you just meant most prestigous between the two schools.

[Warhammer]

Yep

[MrBug708]

Originally Posted by panerd

Aren't they near the top of the list of most final fours this decade?

Radii is towing the IC company line. Only at UCLA is a championship game appearance in every decade considered "irrelevant"

[Radii]

Originally Posted by panerd

Aren't they near the top of the list of most final fours this decade?

Yup, but irrelevant by any top program's standards from 1981-1991 and 1998-2005 so while I'm mostly poking light fun at MrBug I don't think I'm incorrect either. I'd expect any Kansas, UNC, or Duke fan to come alive at a blanket declaration that UCLA is "the most prestigious program"

[TargetPractice6]

First off, I brought up the DUI because the biggest issue he seemed to face was his problem with alcohol. It wasn't his first DUI and pretty much every local watering hole had its own stories of some late night Billy G escapades. The school even went as far as to hire him a driver to keep him out of trouble.

I don't see how you can trivialize Gillispie not signing a contract after being on the job two years. Where else do you see an employee hold out that long and still stay in the good graces of management? His strained relationship with the AD gave him little leeway with on court performance, and his abrasive manner manifesting itself in the media (especially acting like a dick to Jeanine Edwards twice during halftime interviews) didn't help either.

It was also clear he wasn't popular with players. Deandre Liggins refused to enter the game against West Virginia in 2008. Derrick Jasper transferred to UNLV because Gillispie was pressuring him to play before he was fully recovered from an injury. He clearly lost the respect of Jodie Meeks when he told him to stop shooting against Florida, even though he was the league's leading scorer and had recently broke the school single game record for scoring. Those were only the public incidents... After he was fired, it leaked that he made Josh Harrellson sit in a bathroom stall during halftime at Vanderbilt because he couldn't stand to look at him and after become frustrated with his inability to gain weight, made Perry Stevenson eat a box of Pop-Tarts each day before practice.

Maybe all of this sounds minor to you, but combined with the worst on court performance in twenty years there really wasn't anything positive he had going for him after his second season in Lexington. He had no friends in the administration, on the bench, or in the stands; got bounced early in the NIT; was facing a potential mass exodus of players; and had poor recruiting classes signed up for the next five years (famously taking a commitment from an eighth grader). Like I said, I wish BCG well and hope he's cleaned up his own life because he made his own bed at Kentucky.

[Radii]

Originally Posted by MrBug708

Radii is towing the IC company line. Only at UCLA is a championship game appearance in every decade considered "irrelevant"

Nah I went all the way back to Elite 8 appearances to go easy on you.

[Radii]

dola, What's "IC", I dunno that abbreviation.

[TargetPractice6]

Originally Posted by Radii

Yup, but irrelevant by any top program's standards from 1981-1991 and 1998-2005 so while I'm mostly poking light fun at MrBug I don't think I'm incorrect either. I'd expect any Kansas, UNC, or Duke fan to come alive at a blanket declaration that UCLA is "the most prestigious program"

Because they all know it's Kentucky.

[MrBug708]

Originally Posted by Radii

dola, What's "IC", I dunno that abbreviation.

Inside Carolina.

[MrBug708]

Originally Posted by Radii

Nah I went all the way back to Elite 8 appearances to go easy on you.

Until the merciful end of the Steve Lavin era, UCLA had the longest streak of consectutive winning seasons in basketball. I think you should work on what irrelevant means

But yes, EE as the measuring stick is a great way to go

[Radii]

Originally Posted by MrBug708

Inside Carolina.

Oh, meh. Honestly, not just poking fun, I feel like there are a small number of teams in the stratosphere of college basketball throughout its history whose overall success matters year to year yes but the bar is absolutely raised because of their tradition and, to use MrBug's words, prestige.

Are you really telling me that as a UCLA fan with UCLA's history that a run of 5 straight sweet 16 seasons is ok by you, they tried hard, they made the tournament and won a game or two before getting knocked out, so its all good!

If UCLA, Kansas, Duke, Carolina, Kentucky... Michigan State trying hard to add themselves to the list over the last 15 years... go more than 3 years without a final four, something's missing. I don't mean go fire Ben Howland because he hasn't made one the last 3 years, but expectations as a UCLA fan I assume are higher than that and reasonably so.

[sterlingice]

3 years without a Final Four? That's an awfully high standard even for the most prestigious programs

SI

[Radii]

Originally Posted by sterlingice

3 years without a Final Four? That's an awfully high standard even for the most prestigious programs

So what are your general expectations of Kansas? Winning records like MrBug?

Like I said I'm not saying you question your coach or fire your coach after a few years without a final four. I also said "more than 3 years" so 4+. Its a small but important distinction I think when you're looking over a long period of time. What if I'd state it a different way? If you're a Kansas fan and I told you from 2011-2020 your team would make the tournament every year but one, but you'd only get to one final four and wouldn't win any titles. As a Kansas fan I'd expect you to feel slightly disappointed at that outlook. I expect a Kansas fan to be used to an extremely high level of results. We're not talking about firing coaches left and right, or talking about "omg where did kansas go?" but you I assume have a very reasonable expectation of more than that and you probably would hope for that one final four to have ended up in a title or for more final four runs.

[Scoobz0202]

C'mon Mishitigan!

[Mizzou B-ball fan]

This Arkansas situation is starting to look like Oregon all over again.

1. MU players are posting tweets mocking Chris Lincoln. Pretty clear indication that they believe Anderson isn't going anywhere. Couple of different sources now posting what I suggested earlier (no interest by Anderson and it's merely a contract extension ploy by agent).

2. Arkansas big-wigs have now decided that their second target is Bill Self according to rumors?!?!?! If so, not only are they delusional, but they'll have to wait near the end of the tournament to attempt a hire. They also risk missing out on several qualified candidates who may take other jobs in the meanwhile. Who knows who else they think they can hire away if they think Self is actually in play.

[jbergey22]

Originally Posted by Mizzou B-ball fan

This Arkansas situation is starting to look like Oregon all over again.

1. MU players are posting tweets mocking Chris Lincoln. Pretty clear indication that they believe Anderson isn't going anywhere. Couple of different sources now posting what I suggested earlier (no interest by Anderson and it's merely a contract extension ploy by agent).

2. Arkansas big-wigs have now decided that their second target is Bill Self according to rumors?!?!?! If so, not only are they delusional, but they'll have to wait near the end of the tournament to attempt a hire. They also risk missing out on several qualified candidates who may take other jobs in the meanwhile. Who knows who else they think they can hire away if they think Self is actually in play.

I'm sure.

[MrBug708]

Originally Posted by Radii

So what are your general expectations of Kansas? Winning records like MrBug?

Like I said I'm not saying you question your coach or fire your coach after a few years without a final four. I also said "more than 3 years" so 4+. Its a small but important distinction I think when you're looking over a long period of time. What if I'd state it a different way? If you're a Kansas fan and I told you from 2011-2020 your team would make the tournament every year but one, but you'd only get to one final four and wouldn't win any titles. As a Kansas fan I'd expect you to feel slightly disappointed at that outlook. I expect a Kansas fan to be used to an extremely high level of results. We're not talking about firing coaches left and right, or talking about "omg where did kansas go?" but you I assume have a very reasonable expectation of more than that and you probably would hope for that one final four to have ended up in a title or for more final four runs.

Where did I say my expectations are winning records? It was more of a counter point to your EE's matter

[MrBug708]

Originally Posted by Mizzou B-ball fan

This Arkansas situation is starting to look like Oregon all over again.

1. MU players are posting tweets mocking Chris Lincoln. Pretty clear indication that they believe Anderson isn't going anywhere. Couple of different sources now posting what I suggested earlier (no interest by Anderson and it's merely a contract extension ploy by agent).

2. Arkansas big-wigs have now decided that their second target is Bill Self according to rumors?!?!?! If so, not only are they delusional, but they'll have to wait near the end of the tournament to attempt a hire. They also risk missing out on several qualified candidates who may take other jobs in the meanwhile. Who knows who else they think they can hire away if they think Self is actually in play.

A lot of big-wig Arkansas boosters posting on the Missouri message board?

I think if Arkansas fans can land a coach like Dana Altman, they'd be more ecstatic than if they landed Anderson

[JonInMiddleGA]

My son asked a question after seeing some old highlight clip this weekend & I haven't been able to come up with a satisfactory answer.

As he put it "why did everybody in the 80's wear those short shorts"? I explained that those were the norm for years, that what he sees now is what's actually kind of odd. Thing is, I can't really remember when/how the style changed. Was there some trendsetting team that starting the change to the longer shorts? Did everybody just suddenly switch at about the same time (which is kind of how I remember it)? Anybody remember how that came about, and have a better idea of when it happened?

Obviously not a big deal, I'm just sort of bugged that I can't give a decent answer or explanation of it.

[Passacaglia]

I'm a bit of a homer, but I thought it was the Fab Five.

[MJ4H]

It was certainly around that time.

[Logan]

Jalen Rose talked about it with Bill Simmons. They weren't the first ones to go beyond the short shorts, but they were the first to go "long".