The Trump Presidency – 2016

[Radii]

Originally Posted by tarcone

I dont think you want to characterize these Trump supporters as dumb asses and all the other things you are saying.

At the time of the election I would have agreed, there was a lot of weird shit happening. At this point after all the racism, hatred, bigotry, misogyny, lying, if you still support trump you are a piece of shit human being. The end.

[Radii]

dola, that said, it doesn't matter. Its all about turnout on the left imo in 2020. Nothing can be done about that base, its not going anywhere. Just gotta get people to actually believe this shit matters. Well, if you live in a state where it actually matters, since of most of us, it actually doesn't. That's fun.

[tarcone]

I live in the heart of Trump country. Billboards on I44 with pro Trump messages. Smart people who think he is doing a great job.

I do not trust polls. The same polls had HRC winning easily.

I dont think the mid terms re a point of emphasis either. That wasnt a big deal. Watch when the next presidential elections happen. The supporters will be out again.

To your point Radii about the racism, misogyny, etc. The supporters do not see it that way. There is a strong nationalistic sentiment in the middle of the country. They see it as taking back their country. Dems dont like it. But it is what it is. You say racism they say race card. You say misogyny, they say a womens place is in the kitchen.
1950s attitudes are nothing to be ashamed of. Are they out dated? Maybe. Was the country in better shape in the 1950s? Yes it was.

I see the same attitudes from you guys that I saw leading up to the 2016 election. You guys were wrong then and you are wrong now. Better get a grip on the reality and do something. Not throw up some establishment white guy that Trump will abuse and use to get that electoral college win.

Find another Obama type. One that speaks to the masses and not just the left end of your party.

[Lathum]

Originally Posted by tarcone

To your point Radii about the racism, misogyny, etc. The supporters do not see it that way. There is a strong nationalistic sentiment in the middle of the country. They see it as taking back their country. Dems dont like it. But it is what it is. You say racism they say race card. You say misogyny, they say a womens place is in the kitchen.
1950s attitudes are nothing to be ashamed of. Are they out dated? Maybe. Was the country in better shape in the 1950s? Yes it was.
.

This is some insane shit.

[tarcone]

Originally Posted by Lathum

This is some insane shit.

Its reality. Call it what you want. But Trump speaks to it. And guess who is President?

Your victimhood is just that. You arent getting your golden ticket. And getting that golden ticket pissed off all those who felt like they were paying for it.

Guess who Trump speaks too? Guess who elected him President?

You live in a fantasy world. Im just trying to point out the reality of the situation. You dont have to like it, but you better recognize it and stop playing the victim card and figure out how to beat the man.

[Atocep]

Originally Posted by tarcone

I live in the heart of Trump country. Billboards on I44 with pro Trump messages. Smart people who think he is doing a great job.

Exactly, you live where he's running up the score. He's not doing so hot in swing states.

Originally Posted by tarcone

I do not trust polls. The same polls had HRC winning easily.

This has been addressed countless times on here. The best polls ended up within the margin of error. 538 was repeatedly warning people that Trump had a legit shot at winning.

Somehow the myth that polling was way off for 2016 hasn't died.

Originally Posted by tarcone

I dont think the mid terms re a point of emphasis either. That wasnt a big deal. Watch when the next presidential elections happen. The supporters will be out again.

So the highest mid-term turnout in a century wasn't a point of emphasis? Are waiting for Trump supporters to "flip the switch" and start playing for real in 2020?

[JPhillips]

At best, the country in 1950 was only better for white men. I'll leave it to others to figure out what that might mean.

[tarcone]

Originally Posted by Atocep

Exactly, you live where he's running up the score. He's not doing so hot in swing states.



This has been addressed countless times on here. The best polls ended up within the margin of error. 538 was repeatedly warning people that Trump had a legit shot at winning.

Somehow the myth that polling was way off for 2016 hasn't died.



So the highest mid-term turnout in a century wasn't a point of emphasis? Are waiting for Trump supporters to "flip the switch" and start playing for real in 2020?

Look, you can bitch and moan about Trump all you want. You can throw out all sorts of facts,

But the real fact is that Trump is President. And with the attitude you guys have on this board, he will be again. What you guys are talking about is just what fires up his supporters that won him the election.

Change the message. You have to change the message.

[Radii]

Originally Posted by tarcone

1950s attitudes are nothing to be ashamed of. Are they out dated? Maybe. Was the country in better shape in the 1950s? Yes it was.

Wow.

[Atocep]

Originally Posted by tarcone

Its reality. Call it what you want. But Trump speaks to it. And guess who is President?

Your victimhood is just that. You arent getting your golden ticket. And getting that golden ticket pissed off all those who felt like they were paying for it.

Guess who Trump speaks too? Guess who elected him President?

You live in a fantasy world. Im just trying to point out the reality of the situation. You dont have to like it, but you better recognize it and stop playing the victim card and figure out how to beat the man.

Evangelicals believe they're more oppressed than minorities. Your President feels investigating his crimes is treason. The right in general has decided anything they don't agree with is fake news. White men feel they're losing their place of power in the country. Saying Happy Holidays equates to a war on Christmas.

Tell me again who's playing the victim card?

[Radii]

Originally Posted by JPhillips

At best, the country in 1950 was only better for white men. I'll leave it to others to figure out what that might mean.

Exactly.

[tarcone]

Originally Posted by JPhillips

At best, the country in 1950 was only better for white men. I'll leave it to others to figure out what that might mean.

This is exactly what I meant, And the white women loved it too. They got to stay at home and do that job.

Im not sugar coating this. It is what it is.

But understand, that there a lot of minorities that support Trump as well.

Regardless of how the dems feel, playing the victim is not going to win in 2020.

[Atocep]

Originally Posted by tarcone

This is exactly what I meant, And the white women loved it too. They got to stay at home and do that job.

What. The. Fuck.

[tarcone]

Originally Posted by Atocep

Evangelicals believe they're more oppressed than minorities. Your President feels investigating his crimes is treason. The right in general has decided anything they don't agree with is fake news. White men feel they're losing their place of power in the country. Saying Happy Holidays equates to a war on Christmas.

Tell me again who's playing the victim card?

Small portion of the supporters.

[tarcone]

Originally Posted by Atocep

What. The. Fuck.

Im stating what is happening with his supporters. You dont have to like it. And I know you dont. But you have to understand the reality of this country right now.

I think there needs to be a tour of the country by some of you guys. I feel like you are sheltered in your little liberal corners with like minded people that dont see the reality of this country.

[tarcone]

This reminds me of the time Iowa football coach called women "Little dumplins". Oh how the liberals howled. But the majority of the women of the state wore the title with pride.

[Lathum]

Originally Posted by tarcone

This is exactly what I meant, And the white women loved it too. They got to stay at home and do that job.

This may get me boxed, but you are a fucking idiot. I mean, a colossal fucking moron. If you got a lobotomy it would be an improvement. Your statement is beyond insulting. My wife is an executive for a Warren Buffet company. She has battled attitudes like yours her whole life and has won. To say she belongs in the kitchen is not only an insult to her, but all women who have worked hard to shatter the glass ceiling. You are a tiny man, with a tiny intellect, who is easily threatened by concepts that make you feel like you are losing a little bit of power. Deal with it, you live in this world now you stupid, fucking moron.

[Atocep]

Originally Posted by tarcone

Im stating what is happening with his supporters. You dont have to like it. And I know you dont. But you have to understand the reality of this country right now.

I think there needs to be a tour of the country by some of you guys. I feel like you are sheltered in your little liberal corners with like minded people that dont see the reality of this country.

Bullshit.

I've lived West Virginia, North Carolina, Texas, California, and now Washington. Within the past 3 years I've visited family in Texas, California, Oregon, North Dakota, and Idaho. I served in the military for 9 years with people from all over the country and all over the world.

I'm sheltered? Get off your fucking high horse while sitting the bible belt pretending to be the Trump Supporter Whisperer. The act is old.

The exact same things you said was going to lose the election for Hillary is what Trump is doing. Yet it's still those dumbass dems that don't get it.

For the 2016 election you went on and on about how people in certain parts of the country don't like being ignored and how Trump speaks to them. The only people he's spoken to for the past 2 years is his supporters while ignoring the other 60% of the country and now somehow that's a winning strategy. Keep moving those goalposts so you can shit on Dems more.

[JPhillips]

Dude, I grew up in rural Ohio. I lived in Mississippi for almost a decade. I lived in NC and IN. I know very few women that want to go back to 1950. I know no POC that want to go back to 1950. Even the men are smart enough to realize that going back to 1950 means lower household income, lower standard of living, and a short life span.

If you're desperate to get back to 1950 it's because you want a country that is run by white men. I get that a lot of people want that, but just because a lot of people want it doesn't mean it isn't based on some really repulsive ideology.

[tarcone]

Originally Posted by Lathum

This may get me boxed, but you are a fucking idiot. I mean, a colossal fucking moron. If you got a lobotomy it would be an improvement. Your statement is beyond insulting. My wife is an executive for a Warren Buffet company. She has battled attitudes like yours her whole life and has won. To say she belongs in the kitchen is not only an insult to her, but all women who have worked hard to shatter the glass ceiling. You are a tiny man, with a tiny intellect, who is easily threatened by concepts that make you feel like you are losing a little bit of power. Deal with it, you live in this world now you stupid, fucking moron.

Here is the problem with you, you are constantly on the defensive with your victim card in hand.

At no time did I say women belong in the kitchen. I stated that women in the middle of the country still live by that old fashioned way of life.

I think women should be able to do what ever they want. And more power to them when they do.

You should really stop typing to your emotions and think a little. There are plenty of women that think this way, And many that dont. But Im talking about Trump supporters, not all women. I live where women believe that type of thing.

Get over yourself for a bit. You are tiresome with how you play a victim. Sad and tiresome. You need to grow up a little and come to the table with open eyes.

Shoot, I have a daughter that wants to be an aerospace engineer. Guess maybe I dont think that way, huh?
Oh and my wife makes more money than I do. I wish she made more so I could stay home.

[Lathum]

To call me a victim is laughable. If anything I benefit financially from Trump being in office. I just have a moral compass and want the world to be a better place for my children.

If you honestly think women want to live that way you are, like I said, a fucking idiot. FWIW just about all Trump supporters are fucking idiots.

[tarcone]

Originally Posted by JPhillips

Dude, I grew up in rural Ohio. I lived in Mississippi for almost a decade. I lived in NC and IN. I know very few women that want to go back to 1950. I know no POC that want to go back to 1950. Even the men are smart enough to realize that going back to 1950 means lower household income, lower standard of living, and a short life span.

If you're desperate to get back to 1950 it's because you want a country that is run by white men. I get that a lot of people want that, but just because a lot of people want it doesn't mean it isn't based on some really repulsive ideology.

Im talking values here. Bot income, not health, values.

And being in those locales you know Im right. People are looking to go back to when the USA was number 1. And we controlled our destiny. And households had 2 parents. And there was discipline.

Its value based. Trump speaks to those values.

This is the post Obama hangover.

Maybe you are right, I may be way off base here. But I dont think I am. I really believe that the dems have the same attitude that lost them the election in 2016. You guys think calling Trump a bunch of names and moving the goal posts because the Mueller report didnt pan out like they hoped, will win. It wont.

Im just trying to point out that you guys are barking up the wrong tree. Instead of crying about Trump, get a damn candidate that canbeat him.

Start propping up Andrew Yang. he would beat Trump in a heartbeat.

But, no, here comes Biden. More of the same shit that Obama was that let Trump win.

[Atocep]

Originally Posted by tarcone

Small portion of the supporters.

No, they love playing the victim card

Interestingly, the demographic groups most offended by “Happy Holidays” include strong conservatives (21 percent), Gary Johnson voters (20 percent), Trump supporters (18 percent) and all men (18 percent).

And

Majority of Republicans think evangelical Christians are more discriminated against than minorities – ThinkProgress

I know you live in a world where white men are manly tough men that get dirty, work on cars, drive trucks, and have a wife in the kitchen but Trump supporters play the victim as much, if not more than anyone.

[lungs]

Where I'll agree with tarcone is that the people with the mindset he describes do exist, I'd vehemently disagree that those are the people we need to cater to in order to put an end to Trumpism. It's not about winning over people that you are diametrically opposed to, it's about getting your own people out to vote.

Wisconsin illustrates this well... Madison and Milwaukee showed up to the polls at the mid-terms and we re-elected Tammy Baldwin by a landslide and knocked Scott Walker out of office. Fast forward to this spring, Madison and Milwaukee don't show up and we elect a complete ingrate to the State Supreme Court.

Get somebody that will inspire turnout (or at least not suppress it), and I think Trump is toast.

[tarcone]

Originally Posted by Lathum

To call me a victim is laughable. If anything I benefit financially from Trump being in office. I just have a moral compass and want the world to be a better place for my children.

If you honestly think women want to live that way you are, like I said, a fucking idiot. FWIW just about all Trump supporters are fucking idiots.

Man, you should learn to listen. Why do you paint everything I say with such a broad brush?

Im not saying all women. I know better then that. I grew up watching a socialist, lesbian, feminist win a seat on the city council for years.

Im talking about Trump supporters. You should turn off your liberal colored glasses and listen to different points of view. When you do, the world becomes this utopia you are searching for. Calling people names because they think differently then you,gets us no where.

[Lathum]

Originally Posted by tarcone

Im talking values here. Bot income, not health, values.

And being in those locales you know Im right. People are looking to go back to when the USA was number 1. And we controlled our destiny. And households had 2 parents. And there was discipline.

Its value based. Trump speaks to those values.

So they idolize a guy who is on wife number three, has repeatedly committed adultery, and has virtually no hand in raising his children.

Solid values.

[tarcone]

Originally Posted by Atocep

No, they love playing the victim card



And

Majority of Republicans think evangelical Christians are more discriminated against than minorities – ThinkProgress

I know you live in a world where white men are manly tough men that get dirty, work on cars, drive trucks, and have a wife in the kitchen but Trump supporters play the victim as much, if not more than anyone.

Not necessarily. But I live in a place where the values of hard work and family are extremely important. As are law and order.

[Lathum]

Originally Posted by tarcone

Not necessarily. But I live in a place where the values of hard work and family are extremely important. As are law and order.

then why do they support Trump?

Honest question.

[tarcone]

Originally Posted by Lathum

So they idolize a guy who is on wife number three, has repeatedly committed adultery, and has virtually no hand in raising his children.

Solid values.

I know, right?

But he went in and said I am getting the jobs Obama lost, Hes bringing back the blue collar jobs again. He wants to make America great again. Dont tell me that doesnt speak to a lot of people.

[Atocep]

Originally Posted by lungs

Where I'll agree with tarcone is that the people with the mindset he describes do exist, I'd vehemently disagree that those are the people we need to cater to in order to put an end to Trumpism. It's not about winning over people that you are diametrically opposed to, it's about getting your own people out to vote.

Wisconsin illustrates this well... Madison and Milwaukee showed up to the polls at the mid-terms and we re-elected Tammy Baldwin by a landslide and knocked Scott Walker out of office. Fast forward to this spring, Madison and Milwaukee don't show up and we elect a complete ingrate to the State Supreme Court.

Get somebody that will inspire turnout (or at least not suppress it), and I think Trump is toast.

I don't disagree at all that those people exist. Despite my sheltered life I have family that are among those people. I'm calling bullshit on there being a massive group of them that stayed home during the mid-terms waiting for an election that counts despite record breaking turnout.

I also have no problem with them putting their ideas more in the open because it isolates them from the independents Trump needs to win another election. Despite what Tarcone believes, Trump won because he flipped independents. Not because he got red states excited to go to the polls.

[Atocep]

Originally Posted by tarcone

Not necessarily. But I live in a place where the values of hard work and family are extremely important. As are law and order.

Here in Washington we believe in sitting around on our asses and having abortions while in line at Starbucks. Along with Chaos and Anarchy.

[tarcone]

Originally Posted by Lathum

then why do they support Trump?

Honest question.

Because he came in and spoke to the blue collar american. Open up the steel woks and the coal mines. Which helps families when there are jobs.

People feel Obama neutered the police in this country in favor of criminals. And that didnt sit well. That makes people feel unsafe.

He is going after other countries. He is doing things that Make America Great Again.
Like it or not it speaks to a lot of people in this country.

[Radii]

Originally Posted by tarcone

But he went in and said I am getting the jobs Obama lost, Hes bringing back the blue collar jobs again. He wants to make America great again. Dont tell me that doesnt speak to a lot of people.

In theory, the fact that he didn't, and isn't doing any of that, and his policies that aren't based on hatred are blatant cash grabs for himself and his rich friends - that all should matter, but it won't.

Those people aren't going away (well, some are dying, b/c they skew older, but that's not going to be enough to matter by 2020), and their minds aren't going to be changed. So, that is what it is. So its all about turnout on the left, b/c I fully believe turnout and vote totals on the right are pretty much static.

[NobodyHere]

Originally Posted by Atocep

Here in Washington we believe in sitting around on our asses and having abortions while in line at Starbucks. Along with Chaos and Anarchy.

How do you feel about Booty Man?

[Atocep]

Originally Posted by tarcone

Because he came in and spoke to the blue collar american. Open up the steel woks and the coal mines. Which helps families when there are jobs.

People feel Obama neutered the police in this country in favor of criminals. And that didnt sit well. That makes people feel unsafe.

He is going after other countries. He is doing things that Make America Great Again.
Like it or not it speaks to a lot of people in this country.

Except none of it's true. Coal mines are closing at a faster rate under Trump than Obama.

Blue collar jobs have basically stayed about where they were from the time Obama left office until now. Slight increase, but in very specific parts of the country and very specific jobs.

We're not going to go back in time as far as technology goes and it's tech killing those jobs. Not Obama.

[Radii]

Originally Posted by tarcone

Because he came in and spoke to the blue collar american. Open up the steel woks and the coal mines. Which helps families when there are jobs.

People feel Obama neutered the police in this country in favor of criminals. And that didnt sit well. That makes people feel unsafe.

He is going after other countries. He is doing things that Make America Great Again.
Like it or not it speaks to a lot of people in this country.

Exactly. Not a word of this is true. But facts don't matter anymore. So, fuck it.

[tarcone]

Originally Posted by Atocep

Here in Washington we believe in sitting around on our asses and having abortions while in line at Starbucks. Along with Chaos and Anarchy.

You know, Im sure they have thoe values in places. But they are not a priority like in other states.

Shoot 4 of Washingtons electoral votes defected to Trump. Why?

[Lathum]

Originally Posted by tarcone

Because he came in and spoke to the blue collar american. Open up the steel woks and the coal mines. Which helps families when there are jobs.

People feel Obama neutered the police in this country in favor of criminals. And that didnt sit well. That makes people feel unsafe.

He is going after other countries. He is doing things that Make America Great Again.
Like it or not it speaks to a lot of people in this country.

Proof that Trump supporters are a bunch of simple minded idiots who are easily brainwashed.

[tarcone]

Originally Posted by Atocep

Except none of it's true. Coal mines are closing at a faster rate under Trump than Obama.

Blue collar jobs have basically stayed about where they were from the time Obama left office until now. Slight increase, but in very specific parts of the country and very specific jobs.

We're not going to go back in time as far as technology goes and it's tech killing those jobs. Not Obama.

Absolutely. Im just stating how he won the election. You know that it is true.

Its not a racist agenda. Its a make america great again agenda. And his head line grabs all play into that. Wether the reality of it is on the ground or not. But I know there a lot more jobs out there now than there were 4 years ago.

[Radii]

https://www.forbes.com/sites/chuckjo.../#5fe62ff15fa8

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/01/14/u...ies-trump.html

As atocep mentioned, there is no bringing back coal. Coal is dead. Obama's administration announced a number of different re-training grants to try to get those guys into viable work. Trump's lies fucked them. But it doesn't matter, b/c Trump saved us all from the scary black man. So, again, fuck it. Lets go as far left as we can while we've got this anger and momentum.

[tarcone]

Originally Posted by Radii

Exactly. Not a word of this is true. But facts don't matter anymore. So, fuck it.

You think HRC wouldnt have pandered to her rich cronies?

Its just the difference of spending on Military and tax cuts for the rich or spending money on social programs at the expense of the middle class.

The characters are the same. The parties are different.

[tarcone]

Originally Posted by Radii

https://www.forbes.com/sites/chuckjo.../#5fe62ff15fa8

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/01/14/u...ies-trump.html

As atocep mentioned, there is no bringing back coal. Coal is dead. Obama's administration announced a number of different re-training grants to try to get those guys into viable work. Trump's lies fucked them. But it doesn't matter, b/c Trump saved us all from the scary black man. So, again, fuck it. Lets go as far left as we can while we've got this anger and momentum.

I would say scary brown man.

I dont disagree. But there is more to it ten just race. You have to realize that.

[Atocep]

Originally Posted by tarcone

You know, Im sure they have thoe values in places. But they are not a priority like in other states.

Shoot 4 of Washingtons electoral votes defected to Trump. Why?

Because despite the stereotype, outside of the Seattle/Tacoma metro areas the majority of the state is republican.

And btw, Trump's 37% was the lowest total for a republican presidential candidate since Bob Dole.

[Radii]

Originally Posted by tarcone

You think HRC wouldnt have pandered to her rich cronies?

Its just the difference of spending on Military and tax cuts for the rich or spending money on social programs at the expense of the middle class.

The characters are the same. The parties are different.

Both sides have some gross shit going on to keep the same people in power. But this is not a "both sides" issue, no. Hillary wouldn't have lowered taxes on millionaires and billionaires, the left actively tries to increase social programs, the right tries to fight them and remove them. The bottom % of people in this country are in terrible shape, both white and black, and only one side of those has a single part of their platform to try to help.

You can say that the left only does it to pander to the poor for votes, and the people in power don't care, but once again, fuck it.. its the right thing to do, so I don't care why its done.

[tarcone]

Originally Posted by Lathum

Proof that Trump supporters are a bunch of simple minded idiots who are easily brainwashed.

Just like the dems are a bunch of simple minded idiots that are easily brain washed.

You are not as enlightened as you think you are. the first thing you do is attack and call names.

You were on the HRC boat. She is as corrupt or more so than Trump. You lost so you get to bitch. But your attitude is the attitude that brought out a bunch of voters in 2016 and will again.

[Lathum]

Originally Posted by tarcone

Just like the dems are a bunch of simple minded idiots that are easily brain washed.

You are not as enlightened as you think you are. the first thing you do is attack and call names.

You were on the HRC boat. She is as corrupt or more so than Trump. You lost so you get to bitch. But your attitude is the attitude that brought out a bunch of voters in 2016 and will again.

Show me where I was on the HRC boat.

I'll wait.

[tarcone]

Originally Posted by Radii

Both sides have some gross shit going on to keep the same people in power. But this is not a "both sides" issue, no. Hillary wouldn't have lowered taxes on millionaires and billionaires, the left actively tries to increase social programs, the right tries to fight them and remove them. The bottom % of people in this country are in terrible shape, both white and black, and only one side of those has a single part of their platform to try to help.

You can say that the left only does it to pander to the poor for votes, and the people in power don't care, but once again, fuck it.. its the right thing to do, so I don't care why its done.

I dont disagree on the big picture part.

But those social programs do not help the poor. It helps keep them down. There is no incentive to go out and better yourself. And why would you? Shoot, my BIL gets $3200 a month for disability because he is lazy. He was able to play the system into making more money than 60% of the country.

He used the GI bill to get $1000 a month for college. Which he spent not on college.

Sure, Im all for helping, but we need a better system then what the dems throw out. Their programs hurt and are wasteful.

[tarcone]

Originally Posted by Lathum

Show me where I was on the HRC boat.

I'll wait.

Played this game before and you spun it your way, even though you were wrong.. I wont play again.

[Atocep]

Originally Posted by NobodyHere

How do you feel about Booty Man?

Is he running with Deez Nuts?

[tarcone]

Originally Posted by Atocep

Because despite the stereotype, outside of the Seattle/Tacoma metro areas the majority of the state is republican.

And btw, Trump's 37% was the lowest total for a republican presidential candidate since Bob Dole.

State last voted republican in a presidential election in 1988. Both senators and the states house is democrat. I wouldnt say Washington is a republican state