Werewolf XXXVII: Middle-Earth - GAME ENDS. Who Won? Check it out!

[Mr. Wednesday]

For good or ill, yet to be seen.

[Jonathan Ezarik]

Originally Posted by Swaggs

I generally trust the people voting for him more than those voting for ntn right now. I don't want us to not have a lynch today.

Then why were you the first to jump on the Thomkal lynch? Izulde was dead. He had his nine votes. How do you explain your decision to throw away a lynch in order to go into a last minute dash to get Thomkal?

[DaddyTorgo]

okay...i'm headed off to bed in a little while here. i'm done checking this thread for the night...if i'm logged in it's just b/c the tab is still open and i don't want to close it and have to open it again tomorrow...i'mma be in another tab for an hour or so

[Swaggs]

Originally Posted by Jonathan Ezarik

Then why were you the first to jump on the Thomkal lynch? Izulde was dead. He had his nine votes. How do you explain your decision to throw away a lynch in order to go into a last minute dash to get Thomkal?

How do you figure that I, personally, threw away the lynch? As was proven, there was plenty of time to get over 50% of the vote. The people that bailed out, at the last minute, thanks to Thomkal's questionable "reveal" are the ones you should be looking at.

[Jonathan Ezarik]

Originally Posted by LoneStarGirl

Good question, i think the real seer would have scanned a couple of vets at least, not three quiet guys

Why? Especially when all the talk has been going after UTR people.

[Jonathan Ezarik]

Originally Posted by Swaggs

How do you figure that I, personally, threw away the lynch? As was proven, there was plenty of time to get over 50% of the vote. The people that bailed out, at the last minute, thanks to Thomkal's questionable "reveal" are the ones you should be looking at.

His reveal isn't questionable to me. It was a risky move to jump from Izulde to Thomkal and you know it. With Izulde, unless someone switched at the last minute, it was a done deal.

[Jonathan Ezarik]

Since I've been outed as a villager, there's a good chance I'll die tonight. So I might as well get this off my chest.

What this whole thing screams to me is Blade got scared because a teammate was about to get lynched. Now, who is the teammate?

First, he tries to confuse things by claiming that Alan doesn't want ntn lynched (this despite the fact that Alan voted for ntn, and never claimed that he didn't want him lynched). Second, when ntn gets to 7 votes, Blade starts railing about how he wishes everyone would stop following Alan (who cast the first vote for ntn). Blade wants us to follow him instead. As he says in post 1416: ""and today he [Alan] led us down the NTN road, which i feel will likely end in another wasted day". This was when ntn had 7 votes to Izuldes 6. Immediately after this, DaddyTorgo switches from ntn to Izulde. Blade also consistently says that the ones he considers suspecious are the ones voting for ntn.

Now, here's where it gets interesting. In post 1389, LSG says she will switch from Izulde to ntn if it helps get a lynch. At this time, both have 6 votes. But then after Thomkal votes for ntn to bring his total to 7, LSG then posts that she wishes ntn voters would switch to Izulde. I'm not sure exactly what this means, but LSG just went way up on my suspected list.

Right after Izulde gets 9 votes, Blade issues his run on Thomkal (and notice that ntn is the first to voice his support for this move). What's the point of this? Was he trying to pull voters from Izulde (and it was almost entirely voters for Izulde who switched to Thomkal)? Or was he using it as a distraction to keep anyone from switching back to ntn? He had been pushing Izulde and was one of his early votes, so I don't see this as trying to protect him. I see this more as Blade trying to keep attention away from ntn in the last minutes.

Why risk himself this way? He offered himself up for sacrifice if it turned out Thomkal was good (which I think he is, by the way). That says a lot right there. That means that the person he is protecting is pretty important. So, who is ntndeacon, Blade? Why is he so valuable to you?

A couple more things to think about. Remember that Alan stated he wouldn't be around before the lynch. This was the perfect time for Blade to pull something like this. I also find it odd that Blade calls for this drastic move, but doesn't stay around to see the result. He gets the ball rolling and then leaves. If he was really convinced that Thomkal was evil, wouldn't he stay until the final vote was cast? Finally, what does Thomkal's name and role have to do with anything? Why does Blade need this? This smells like something needed for black magic.

[Swaggs]

Originally Posted by Jonathan Ezarik

His reveal isn't questionable to me. It was a risky move to jump from Izulde to Thomkal and you know it. With Izulde, unless someone switched at the last minute, it was a done deal.

With all due respect, it is not uncommon to make a claim like that when your head is on the chopping block. Maybe it is true, maybe it is not. I think he was probably grasping at straws with that type of claim, but you are welcome to think it was not questionable. You taking it as a statement of absolute fact makes no difference to me, as you have done little this game to earn any trust.

Izulde had said some things throughout the day that caught my, and apparently others', attention. Sorry if you missed them, but I am alright with him surviving for another day. I think he will be helpful to the side of light.

[Jonathan Ezarik]

Originally Posted by Swaggs

With all due respect, it is not uncommon to make a claim like that when your head is on the chopping block.

I understand this, but again, what good did it do to pull my name out? I didn't vote against him, and I wasn't leaning on voting against him. Same goes for Schmidty. And if it was just a ploy to save his neck, why not throw out someone as being evil in an attempt to distract attention?

[Swaggs]

Originally Posted by Jonathan Ezarik

I understand this, but again, what good did it do to pull my name out? I didn't vote against him, and I wasn't leaning on voting against him. Same goes for Schmidty. And if it was just a ploy to save his neck, why not throw out someone as being evil in an attempt to distract attention?

I can find holes in any of your arguments here. They all make sense, but none of them are foolproof.

Why name you or Schmidty? Maybe you are teammates--perhaps Rangers, perhaps agents of Darkness. Perhaps he has scanned you, but is not on the side of light. Perhaps he is telling the truth and has scanned you. Several scenarios here.

[Blade6119]

Originally Posted by Jonathan Ezarik

I understand this, but again, what good did it do to pull my name out? I didn't vote against him, and I wasn't leaning on voting against him. Same goes for Schmidty. And if it was just a ploy to save his neck, why not throw out someone as being evil in an attempt to distract attention?

Because if he names someone evil, thats checkable. We would go lynch them, and when they came up good he would be dead. What reason do we have to want to go kill you, to see if your good, just so we can learn about him. Naming 3 good guys has 2 positives. First, there is no incentive to check them right away. Second, if bad, you know who the good guys are(everyone not on your team). This game its a little lower with maybe another 2 man faction, but even then 17 of the 19 others are good. Its by far the safest route possible.

If i had to guess, he included one bad guy in his group of 3. I feel its mr. w, but only time will tell. Including one gives him the chance of clearing that person if say schmidty dies tonight and is good. We would be more inclined to trust the others as good and just assume thomkal gifted us 3 good guys.

[Blade6119]

Originally Posted by Jonathan Ezarik

His reveal isn't questionable to me. It was a risky move to jump from Izulde to Thomkal and you know it. With Izulde, unless someone switched at the last minute, it was a done deal.

Unless someone swapped at the last minute like Grammat and Mr. W did? It was just as risky to leave it where it was.

As for it not being questionable, i will say one thing to you. Dont be swayed by the fact he named you. You say why would he name you if you werent voting for him. This is why. He named 3 players he thought he could get to support him. Swing voters means they can support either way. And look what has happened, the two people he appealed to in his quote are his two biggest defenders right now. If your good, consider that he might have named you so you would act like you are right now

If your bad, dont worry about it

[Blade6119]

Originally Posted by Jonathan Ezarik

Why? Especially when all the talk has been going after UTR people.

You answer your own question. If all the lynches and talk of suspects centers around quiet players why would you scan them. You would expect them dead. In the scenario this game has presented, the vets are the safer choice. Think about this jon, connect the dots.

[Swaggs]

Tomorrow should be an interesting day. Hopefully I am still around to play.

[Blade6119]

[quote=Jonathan Ezarik;1302266]Since I've been outed as a villager, there's a good chance I'll die tonight. So I might as well get this off my chest.

What this whole thing screams to me is Blade got scared because a teammate was about to get lynched. Now, who is the teammate?
Every player on the light side, nothing more nothing less

Originally Posted by Jonathan Ezarik

First, he tries to confuse things by claiming that Alan doesn't want ntn lynched (this despite the fact that Alan voted for ntn, and never claimed that he didn't want him lynched).

Which i quoted and explained that he wanted LSG and NTN safe, when he wanted LSG and Tyrith safe. Dont leave out the LSG part, or the fact i explained it literally 3 posts later.

Originally Posted by Jonathan Ezarik

Second, when ntn gets to 7 votes, Blade starts railing about how he wishes everyone would stop following Alan (who cast the first vote for ntn). Blade wants us to follow him instead. As he says in post 1416: ""and today he [Alan] led us down the NTN road, which i feel will likely end in another wasted day". This was when ntn had 7 votes to Izuldes 6. Immediately after this, DaddyTorgo switches from ntn to Izulde. Blade also consistently says that the ones he considers suspecious are the ones voting for ntn.

Where is the point here? All of my top suspects were on NTN, and all of those same players ended up on thomkals side of things in the end. Alan, Mr. W, you, sublime. What changed between now and then? Nothing..the same group just got shifted from lynch NTN to save Thomkal from being exposed.

Originally Posted by Jonathan Ezarik

Now, here's where it gets interesting. In post 1389, LSG says she will switch from Izulde to ntn if it helps get a lynch. At this time, both have 6 votes. But then after Thomkal votes for ntn to bring his total to 7, LSG then posts that she wishes ntn voters would switch to Izulde. I'm not sure exactly what this means, but LSG just went way up on my suspected list.

LSG stated, as most of us have, that having a lynch is more important then killing an innocent. At the deadline, it was Mr. W and gramat who took away a lynch. I stated we needed a lynch, tyrith did, daddy torgo did, LSG did...you want everyone to believe our evil faction is that big? Come on jon...

Originally Posted by Jonathan Ezarik

Right after Izulde gets 9 votes, Blade issues his run on Thomkal (and notice that ntn is the first to voice his support for this move). What's the point of this? Was he trying to pull voters from Izulde (and it was almost entirely voters for Izulde who switched to Thomkal)? Or was he using it as a distraction to keep anyone from switching back to ntn? He had been pushing Izulde and was one of his early votes, so I don't see this as trying to protect him. I see this more as Blade trying to keep attention away from ntn in the last minutes.

Yes, i had a lynched canidate in Izulde and i drew initially 3 other voters off of him onto Thomkal. I took izulde away from the lynch, set NTN up to a big lead...he and i are great teamates, you guessed it. I moved a bunch of votes away from NTN's biggest competitor in the final hour(when we wouldnt have had enough votes to lynch anyone but NTN) becuase im trying to save NTN. We got lucky and some people came back to help lynch thomkal, but that got stolen at the last second.

Originally Posted by Jonathan Ezarik

Why risk himself this way? He offered himself up for sacrifice if it turned out Thomkal was good (which I think he is, by the way). That says a lot right there. That means that the person he is protecting is pretty important. So, who is ntndeacon, Blade? Why is he so valuable to you?

Hes likely a villager...i feel the same about him as chief and lathum when they were on the block. I protested then, and said lets lynch alan. I didnt have any support then, but i got some today from people sick of being wrong. And it sure looks like we found an interesting choice. Im willing to risk my neck, like if you know me i have done many games, becuase every fiber of my being tells me he is bad. And since i am a simple villager, a 1-1 swap is more then worth it. Especially if it grants us all of his friends in this hissy fit.

Originally Posted by Jonathan Ezarik

A couple more things to think about. Remember that Alan stated he wouldn't be around before the lynch. This was the perfect time for Blade to pull something like this. I also find it odd that Blade calls for this drastic move, but doesn't stay around to see the result. He gets the ball rolling and then leaves. If he was really convinced that Thomkal was evil, wouldn't he stay until the final vote was cast? Finally, what does Thomkal's name and role have to do with anything? Why does Blade need this? This smells like something needed for black magic.

Yes, the perfect time to get 9 players to swap was the second Alan left. Becuase those 9 wouldnt have swapped with alan around...Alan rules the 9 votes of Bree.

Im a college student, it is well documented in games(even this one, back on day 2 i believe) that i have classes. I had a class at 7:30 PM at ASU, a half hour drive from my scottsdale home. I left at 7...ive said ASU trumps WW, and to assume if i wanted thomkal lynched because i was bad i would leave when we were just hitting our peak is crazy. I would have stayed, tried to swing brian(who never swapped) or others. Bad guys dont leave when their needed most. Bad guys make late swaps at the deadline(read the last game, the football game, and take a look at day 3 for a How To on being a bad guy and swapping late to win the game).

What else ya got jon? I think sides have been drawn pretty clearly, its just a matter of numbers tomorrow now.

[Blade6119]

Originally Posted by Jonathan Ezarik

Why do you need this information? What good does his name and role do you?

Becuase we all have a name and a role in the village. I dont need to know hes the seer, i need to know his role in the village. I wont explain why past the fact if hes the seer he will tell us his role in the village, as it shouldnt exactly be a problem now that hes outed himself. I dont care much about his name really, but i have a pretty good way of checking what he claims his role in the village is true or not. If hes the seer, he should have no problem with this as it wont give away anything he hasnt already claimed

What reason does he, and by the sounds of things you, have to fear with reavealing what he does in our village?

[Blade6119]

Ok, since i dont see Jon on i dont expect a response until the morning...so ill likely be off to bed soon. will check in and out until i got to bed if anyone wants to toss ideas around

[Sublime 2]

Originally Posted by Sublime 2

Vote Izulde


Sorry guys, I know a vote and run is generally looked down upon, but I havne't been around much for the day because of exams, and right now I'm getting ready for my drive back to NH. I won't be home till 1030-11ish.

Blade:

Where is the point here? All of my top suspects were on NTN, and all of those same players ended up on thomkals side of things in the end. Alan, Mr. W, you, sublime. What changed between now and then? Nothing..the same group just got shifted from lynch NTN to save Thomkal from being exposed.

Blade:

Im a college student, it is well documented in games(even this one, back on day 2 i believe) that i have classes. I had a class at 7:30 PM at ASU, a half hour drive from my scottsdale home. I left at 7...ive said ASU trumps WW, and to assume if i wanted thomkal lynched because i was bad i would leave when we were just hitting our peak is crazy.

Ok, first off I said BEFORE the whole Thomkal run that I wouldn't be here! In fact, the only reason I voted for Izulde was b/c I had no time to read through everything and just saw the previous 5-10 posts and saw it was a race. I admit, certainly not the way to vote, but would it be better if I didn't vote at all, b/c that was the alternative.

Also, if you get to use the college student excuse, I sure as hell get to use it as well. I have class from 11-630 on Tues/Thurs at BU, I did get to view some of the posts b/c of our wireless, but I don't have time between taking notes/paying attention to post anything meaningful (which doesn't stray from what most have to say anyways).

Next, as has been noted in the 'Official Weight Loss Dynasty" in the dynasty section, I have stated that I have an arthroscopic surgery coming up. Today (Friday) I have one of 2 pre-op appointments, and I needed to drive home from Boston, about a 2-2 1/2 hour drive. So I didn't even get back until 11ish, from there i visited my sister, seeing as it was already past lynch time. And here I am at 2am reading through your complete bogus accusations.

As far as i know you never even answered my question from Thursday about your reasoning of suspecting me. And then you jump on me for not changing my vote to Thomkal, who I'm not sure about either, DESPITE me saying, before all your crap, that I wouldn't be around. Yet you say that I WAS around at some point (gotta check the post #), which unless I'm mistaken, would completely conflict with our whole notion of the time/space continuum.

Needless to say I'm sick and tired of your accusations with (as far as I can tell) absolutely no STATED reasons.

[Sublime 2]

Originally Posted by Blade6119

I said not sure..i meant sublime, the player who was around to swap and didnt(and whose vote would have meant a lynch for us)

So, here is where you, Blade, accuse me of being around for the swap. I wasn't even around for the initial Thomkal vote! I said I wouldn't be around for the lynch at around 8:30 pm EST, at that time I said I wouldn't be around till 10:30-11 well after the lynch. Your whole accusation against me, is completely whack, until you bring forth some better proof.

[Lorena]

*sigh*

Wow, I cannot believe we didn't lynch anyone... so now, here we are with absolutely no information. Gosh darnit, RL reared its head and I wasn't around during lynch... usually nothing exciting happens and the one day I miss it, my vote was needed. Man, that's really frustrating.

So let's see, Thomkal names Jonathan (who I think is doing an excellent job on his analysis for being a first timer), Schmidty, and Mr. W as villagers. I'm not entirely sure I buy it. I mean is it possible that they're all part of the same team and he named them because he wanted to "clear them" in a way? I've had my suspicions on Schmidty and Mr. W, but that's all they are, suspicions and unfortunately I don't have anything concrete that can 100% assure me of their allegiance. Gosh darnit, why can't I be a seer for once?

After reading 5+ pages, I was pretty frustrated at everything that went down and I probably should have quoted certain posts but now that I'm at the end, I forgot what I was gonna say. All I know is that Mr. W and Thomkal don't look good right now. Mr. W, I still don't understand all the swaps. I mean you voted for people that weren't even on the chopping block (with the exception of Thomkal). Frankly, I'm too tired to go back and look at the switches you made, but I have a feeling you went along with it and once you saw a lot of people following Blade's lead, you freaked out and changed your vote, thus saving a possible teammate. Is it because you wanted to be trusted but once Thomkal was in danger you changed your vote at the last minute hoping others would follow? I don't get it. If you wanted to confuse us villagers, you accomplished that goal.

Tomorrow should be very, very interesting. BTW, where in the heck (darn the no curse rule!!) are all these clues ya'll are talking about because I've only seen 1... 1 out of how many? Dang, am I really that slow at looking at stuff? Sheesh.

[Lorena]

Originally Posted by Jonathan Ezarik

Now, here's where it gets interesting. In post 1389, LSG says she will switch from Izulde to ntn if it helps get a lynch. At this time, both have 6 votes. But then after Thomkal votes for ntn to bring his total to 7, LSG then posts that she wishes ntn voters would switch to Izulde. I'm not sure exactly what this means, but LSG just went way up on my suspected list.

Jon, LSG has always been a proponent of a lynch. She and I (as well as a few others, I think blade might have mentioned them) strongly feel that we need someone to die to get information... for good or bad and that's why I think she said what she did.

You saw the disaster that ensued because we didn't lynch someone.

[Abe Sargent]

Night turns into dawn and you awaken to the sound of a chant coming from one of the common areas of the town. You quickly bundle yourself against the day’s drizzle. Heading out, you find most of the town gathered around the tent and cot of Valen Gutters.

His body was found in the night when someone crept up and smashed his head in with a timber from the nearby fire. The sound was enough to wake nearby sleepers, but not before whoever did it disappeared into the night.

Valen’s body has already been prepared and a small service is about to begin. At least this night you are spared the grisly sight of another of your number dying. On the other hand, you have to wonder at the quickly diminishing assembly. Who can you trust?


Night Four has ended. Day Five has begun and will end at 10:00 pm EST Friday Night.



-Anxiety

[Lorena]

Originally Posted by Anxiety

15. Blade6119 - Killed Night Four. Valen Gutters the Crazy Human who Thinks He's a Hobbit. On the side of Light and Townsfolk.

I need to step away from the keyboard because I'm pretty upset right now. Part of me thinks that Thomkal is behind this, and the other part thinks that he's been set up.

I'm gonna

Vote Thomkal

I don't think I need to give an explanation as I gave one a couple of posts earlier.

[Lorena]

I know the only person on right now is Izulde, but I need to go to bed. I guess I'm kinda writing down my thoughts, but I'm not sure I entirely trust Alan either. He and blade have been at it from the start and I have seen Alan play the "helpful villager" role when he was evil.

Just something to think about. Til sometime tomorrow.

[Abe Sargent]

And me?

[DaddyTorgo]

actually I am awake (just heading off to bed)

DARNIT (no cursing rule or i'd say worse) we lost BLADE!?!?!

I can't analyze anymore right now, I need to be up in 4.5 hours, but this definately hurts the village, especially on top of a no-lynch

[Alan T]

Before things get further out of control, I'm going to reveal. This is probably the best place for it before stuff spins the wrong direction. The night kill I think was a wonderful frame up job and without this reveal people likely will fall for it.

My name is Magnolia Goodbody, I am the town gossip. I am a very nosy hobbit, I like tea, and to overhear any juicy bit of news. What I get is to listen in to Izulde's "conversations" so to speak. For Daddy Torgo and Swaggs's case I can vouch for Izulde, but I also think you need to give Thomkal reasonable doubt for now and i will explain why.

From my PMs that I get, if it truly is overhearing Izulde's conversations he only gets role information of people. He does not find out necessarily their allignment. Thomkal coming out and saying he only gets the allegiance and no role information might sound like a fishy reveal to you, but to me it sounds too true to be made up. How would he independently know that someone else out there got the role information part if he was making it up?

Could Thomkal be lying? Sure its possible, I don't know anything about him and don't have any control over who is or is not scanned. I just get to eavesdrop.

I'm also going to give out what i know. I knew Lathum was the dwarven storyteller.. remember me changing my opinion about him? Well I also dropped a hint to him BEFORE he died in this post trying to let him know that I knew he was a "short" storyteller

Originally Posted by Alan T

Hmm ok, I remember that part. The talk about the failed conversion made me curious as well, but in the end i think he was just telling a short story about tombstone and moved on. Keeping in mind he was the one doing the converting in tombstone and he had direct experience with getting blocked day 1.

I don't think i really agree with him about the signs pointing to a failed conversion, but after his explanation I didnt think as much of it.

Swaggs.. I know you are the inn keeper.. I dropped a hint to you in this post here to try to let you know.

Originally Posted by Alan T

lol... well I was reading it and figured something like that happened. Looks like your thought process was trying to find a link between Swaggs and me.

I can easily say I have no link with Swaggs this game and I doubt he knows anything about me other than what I said in the thread. I would love to hear more of his thoughts on Daddy Torgo, but as of right now I think he's probably barking up the wrong tree. Inn keeping along with that general line of thinking, I would love for him to be a bit more involved so we have more to base our thoughts and opinions on.

I know Grammaticus, Jonathan Ezarik, Izulde, Daddy Torgo all have roles which appear to be on the side of light but not tried to drop them any hints as I haven't seen a huge place or need to as of yet.

I can NOT vouch for Thomkal or Schmidty or Mr. Wednesday right now, I'm hoping Izulde is doing some other behind the scenes investigation on him, that should be easy enough to be done. However for now I am willing to at least take those names out of lynch consideration on the premise that Thomkal is telling the truth.

Yesterday's lynch I obviously did not want Izulde lynched or I would lose my information. I didn't have any trust for Lonestargirl, but said I didnt want her lynched either just so people wouldn't suspect I'm trying to save a seer type role. I did not know if ntndeacon was bad or not, but he was a better lynch for me -yesterday- then the others just to try to protect the information the village leaves.

So if for now I'm trusting Thomkal, and I know what I know of others.. that leaves the following people as people to look at:

2. BrianD
6. ntndeacon
7. spleen1015
9. Tyrith
12. Dodgerchick
17. LoneStarGirl
23. Sublime 2

I am no seer and get all of my information one day delayed.. So I won't know who or what they scanned until after they come out and tell us today. I hope you'll look back at the posts I quoted and understand I'm telling the truth. Does my reveal mean Thomkal was telling the truth? No not at all.. but what I am saying is the way he revealed created enough reasonable doubt that I would believe it for now.

[Lorena]

Well, that's nice to know. Alan I did notice the "Inn" comment you made and wasn't sure if it was a typo or what, but it's an interesting reveal.

I'm keeping my vote where it is. We now know blade to be of the light, and I feel my vote should remain on Thomkal. It's like doing it for a fallen comrade, ya know? But to me, at this point anyway, it's either Thomkal or Mr. W that needs to go.

[Alan T]

Originally Posted by Dodgerchick

Well, that's nice to know. Alan I did notice the "Inn" comment you made and wasn't sure if it was a typo or what, but it's an interesting reveal.

I'm keeping my vote where it is. We now know blade to be of the light, and I feel my vote should remain on Thomkal. It's like doing it for a fallen comrade, ya know? But to me, at this point anyway, it's either Thomkal or Mr. W that needs to go.

I think its a bit hasty. I personally am waiting to see what at least Izulde brings us today. I'm also wanting to know who thomkal scanned last night and what he found out.

[Lorena]

I noticed you left Swaggs out Alan, do you have any info on him?

[Swaggs]

Well, time for me to break things open a bit more, then...

I am Barliman Butterbur, owner of the Prancing Pony. Barliman was a real character name in Middle Earth lore and Chief Rum's character, Nob, was a real character that worked at the Inn, as well. Yesterday, I was fishing around to see if there was a player named "Bob," as he was also a worker at the Inn, but no one stepped forward and now I would not trust anyone who did.

As a barkeep, I have the ability to make people comfortable enough to tell me the truth. I can do this only once every two nights. If you will notice, I have been trying, with pretty poor results, my ass off since day one to make people come out and say that they were on the side of light.

Even though I kept fishing and fishing, I could not find any quote of value on Night 1. On Night 2, I caught Lathum saying, "Honestly I am a plain villegar so if I am lynched all you'll get is voting patterns which could be helpfull," which I found out to be true. He was not on the block the following day, so I kept the information to myself and he was lynched that night.

Yesterday, there were a number of folks who made usable statements, including Thomkal and Izulde. And I even asked Blade which he suspected more... but then Thomkal made an even better quote in self defense, "I get which side they are on-light, darkness. I have viewed Jonathan, Mr. W, and Schmidty-all are good." Unfortunately, I found out that my ability only works on one fact, so after thinking about it, I chose to the part about whether or not Jon, Mr. W, and Schmidty are all good and Thomkal believes that they are.

These four players: Jonathan, Mr. Wednesday, Schmidty, and Thomkal all jump into my circle of trust. Alan and Izulde are now on the cusp of it, as well. And Alan's list is very similar to my own, it appears, so I think we now have the ability to break things open.

[Swaggs]

I will be back between 1:00-2:00 PM EST.

Wish I could see things develop, but I should be around some this afternoon to play.

[Alan T]

Originally Posted by Dodgerchick

I noticed you left Swaggs out Alan, do you have any info on him?

I included Swaggs and put a quote in that I had dropped to him. I knew he was the inn keeper.

[Lorena]

Originally Posted by Alan T

I included Swaggs and put a quote in that I had dropped to him. I knew he was the inn keeper.

Oh duh, there it is. Sorry 'bout that, I'm functioning on like 2 hours of sleep.

Well, it's gonna be one of those days I see where a lot of stuff is gonna be thrown out and us vanilla villagers will have to trust some people over others. I'm a little hesitant on who to trust based on previous games and having been had one too many times.

[Alan T]

Originally Posted by Dodgerchick

Oh duh, there it is. Sorry 'bout that, I'm functioning on like 2 hours of sleep.

Well, it's gonna be one of those days I see where a lot of stuff is gonna be thrown out and us vanilla villagers will have to trust some people over others. I'm a little hesitant on who to trust based on previous games and having been had one too many times.

Well, Swaggs' reveal makes me feel better about Mr.W and Schmidty. I'm not sure if Swaggs's scan clears Thomkal in my mind, but for now I'm giving him a pass.

I think my list of people not cleared is the best place to start, but I'm holding off until we learn more from Izulde and Thomkal.

[Lorena]

Just a note to myself in my groggy state: Alan makes his reveal at 6:38am and Swaggs makes his reveal at 7:16am. Not sure if this is orchestrated or what. Based on my previous experience with both players, they've played enough of these to know what to say and get people to follow them.
________________________

With that, I REALLY need some sleep, cya'll later.

[LoneStarGirl]

So Swaggs, you found out that jon, mr.w, and schmidty are all good? and by that fact thomkal must be good?

[LoneStarGirl]

Swaggs, all that means is those three players aren't on the same team as Thomkal, he called on them because he knew they would sway and change their vote off of him

[LoneStarGirl]

Thomkal, I have some follow up questions to the questions Blade asked that you ignored....

As the seer do you visit these people at night? How do you get your information? Also, who did you scan last night? What does anxiety tell you in your night pms?

[Lorena]

Okay, I'm officially a WW geek, I was laying in bed and thought of something: Alan, there are 16 players remaining, your "untrusted list" has 7 (me included). I KNOW where my allegiance lies and it's of the light. Your post made it seem that you gave a lot of people the benefit of the doubt with the exception of us 7.

I just find it hard to believe that you pretty much trust 9 players left in the game. Of note, most of the 7 are what some consider utr folks that don't usually say much and might possibly be easy lynches, me definitely included for I have never built a decent case against anyone. Actually, not even me when my head has been on the chopping block.

[Lorena]

So I guess what I'm trying to figure out is... are you trying to get one of the 7 "untrusted" lynched? I'm not sure on anyone right now, the only person I trusted is now dead.

I'm probably delirious because of my lack of sleep, but I wonder...

[Alan T]

Originally Posted by Dodgerchick

Okay, I'm officially a WW geek, I was laying in bed and thought of something: Alan, there are 16 players remaining, your "untrusted list" has 7 (me included). I KNOW where my allegiance lies and it's of the light. Your post made it seem that you gave a lot of people the benefit of the doubt with the exception of us 7.

I just find it hard to believe that you pretty much trust 9 players left in the game. Of note, most of the 7 are what some consider utr folks that don't usually say much and might possibly be easy lynches, me definitely included for I have never built a decent case against anyone. Actually, not even me when my head has been on the chopping block.

For whatever its worth, my list is a vouched for vs not vouched for list.

Not necessarily a trust list. Before Swaggs reconfirmed Schmidty is good, I already felt pretty decent about Schmidty, where I didn't feel good about Mr.Wednesday and had him on my suspect list but willing to pass on him for now if that makes any sense.

You for instance, my take on you is that I trust you more than I don't trust you right now, I could see yesterday that you were at least looking for logical directions even if I didn't agree with them, I could see where you were going with it. I don't think that was a move that a bad guy would be looking for info from. I just don't have any way to vouch for you yet is all so you are on my unvouch for list.

And yes, I think today we shouldn't kill off people that are vouched for, thats counter productive. Even if I dont believe Thomkal, Swaggs vouches for Thomkal's list and I do trust Swaggs fully.

[Alan T]

dola, now that Swaggs vouched for Mr.W I don't suspect him anymore. But not because THomkal said it, because Swaggs did. I have information that Swaggs is telling the truth, but don't know for sure about Thomkal.

[Lorena]

Let me follow it up with this: 7 villagers have been killed. How many bad guys have we gotten? 1, maybe 2, I'm not sure if Sndvls is considered bad. But with all the villagers that have died I find it even harder to believe that THAT many "trusted" people on your list are actually good. The villagers are down a heck of a lot and I cannot fathom that 9 people on your list are all villagers.

It just doesn't make sense.

[Lorena]

Well doesn't vouched for mean trust? That's the way I read it anyway.

[Alan T]

Originally Posted by Dodgerchick

Let me follow it up with this: 7 villagers have been killed. How many bad guys have we gotten? 1, maybe 2, I'm not sure if Sndvls is considered bad. But with all the villagers that have died I find it even harder to believe that THAT many "trusted" people on your list are actually good. The villagers are down a heck of a lot and I cannot fathom that 9 people on your list are all villagers.

It just doesn't make sense.

I'm guessing there was 15-17 villagers + bree folk to start the game, with 5-7 saruman + sauron and 1-3 independants.

7 dead villagers, 8 people I trust pretty completely:

Alan T, Jonathan, Swaggs, Grammaticus, Daddy Torgo, Schmidty, Izulde, Mr.Wednesday

I don't know if I trust Thomkal yet or not, but i haven't found out anywhere that i can prove he's lied and Swaggs seems to confirm at least part of his story. Since Swaggs I have independant trust of, I believe him.

That tells me of the 8 people left, I think its a great list to lynch from since at most there is 1-3 villagers on it and the rest are bad.

[spleen1015]

If everything everyone is saying is to be trusted then the following people are bad guys.

2. BrianD
6. ntndeacon
9. Tyrith
17. LoneStarGirl
23. Sublime 2

I have no idea what to do. I know that I am of the light. I don't have a role that grants me any sort of information, so like DC, I am left trusting in what other are telling me. Which has been the case in every freaking game of WW I have played.

Let's see what happens the rest of the day. Sigh.

[Alan T]

Originally Posted by Dodgerchick

Well doesn't vouched for mean trust? That's the way I read it anyway.

Not necessarily, just because no one has vouched for you yet means that I distrust you. Out of the people left on the list, the one I least suspect to be evil is you. BrianD probably next and then third Spleen. However I have to assume any of you -could- be evil without anyone to vouch for you. Today I doubt anyone should push for your head for instance though because that doesn't make much sense to me.

[ntndeacon]

I suspect that Thomkal viewed me if he is the seer. We shall see if that assumption turns valid later I guess. Both myself and Izulde had to be high on the list (if either or both of us has not been scanned)

[ntndeacon]

Originally Posted by spleen1015

If everything everyone is saying is to be trusted then the following people are bad guys.

2. BrianD
6. ntndeacon
9. Tyrith
17. LoneStarGirl
23. Sublime 2

I have no idea what to do. I know that I am of the light. I don't have a role that grants me any sort of information, so like DC, I am left trusting in what other are telling me. Which has been the case in every freaking game of WW I have played.

Let's see what happens the rest of the day. Sigh.

Which means of course that someone who is "trusted " shouldn't be.