The Official 2016 NBA Playoffs Thread

[wustin]

Nitty gritty battles in the west and meanwhile in the east, Cleveland is sweeping and raining 3s.

[Groundhog]

I would totally not be shocked to see Cleveland go 4-0 in every East series and then lose the Finals 0-4.

[nol]

Originally Posted by Brian Swartz

Heck of a game by Durant. Normally he's a less effective post-season player but he was amazing tonight. San Antonio has been the better team overall but not by much and they are in a real fight now. Expecting the intensity both ways to be even higher in Game 5.

Yeah, it was pretty crazy to see that his playoff career high was "only" 41, especially because I got to see him score 36, 39, and 40 points against the Clippers in 2014 while making it look relatively routine. The battles for rebounds in yesterday's game down the stretch should be must-see viewing for anyone who thinks that basketball was so much more physical and intense in the past.

Originally Posted by Groundhog

I vaguely remember that - I think that was the same team that beat my team in the NBA finals? Pretty much the same squad that Luke Walton led to a 39-4 if I remember correctly. Lakers looking good next year, Walton is an offensive genius.

Yeah, don't think there are too many distressed Laker fans out there regretting that the team hired Luke Walton before knowing that Frank Vogel was going to be available. So, if you don't watch the team's games and seem to imply that the coach doesn't do anything but unlock the gym and roll out the balls, what evidence do you have to suggest that Frank Vogel is one of the top 5 or so coaches in the league? You did seem awfully confident in that assessment for someone who didn't watch the actual games.

I was just stating that Frank Vogel was good on the defensive side of the ball but bad on offense (in contrast to other coaches whose teams manage to be good at both), but you got me thinking that players like Paul George, George Hill, Roy Hibbert, David West, and Ian Mahinmi have all had very good defensive reputations not just with the Pacers, but as prospects coming into the league or while on other teams. If Steve Kerr can't get any credit for the Warriors' offense going from 12th to 1st/2nd (or for the defense getting even better at the same time), who are we to say that Frank Vogel had anything to do with the Pacers' defense also improving from 12th when all those players I listed were either not yet on the Pacers or were a few years from reaching their prime back in 2011?

So either all coaches are doing jack shit, in which case it seems like a pretty good financial decision to not fork over more money to sign one one to an extension when you could just hire a cheaper one, or Frank Vogel just happens to be the one exception whose team's strengths are mostly attributable to him and whose team's weaknesses are solely due to a talent deficiency.

Really interested in particular to make note of all those missed jumpers from Vogel down the stretch. He's just so bad at offense.

It's against the rules for the coach to shoot shots, but the coach does get to choose who's in there shooting the shots. In Game 5, he sat Paul George for too long out of routine, I suppose, and the Pacers blew much of the lead with him on the bench getting cold (George played 41 minutes and was +15 in a game his team lost. That's something you don't see every day). The Pacers were beaten 19-1 in 7 minutes with Paul George not in the game, and that ended up being the difference when it came to losing a very winnable series to a team Indiana had a better matchup against than any other team seeded above it. It wasn't even the outcome from Game 5 as much as the fact that the playcalling was the definition of punting on offense and playing not to lose rather than to win - and if you're going to do that you may as well put in your best possible defensive lineup rather than have guys like Ty Lawson and Monta Ellis out there. When something's that readily apparent as it's happening, there are surely many more things that Larry Bird (a very good coach in his own right, especially considering he was essentially dabbling in it) saw from his vantage point.

Originally Posted by murrayyyyy

His shooting percentage has gone down with Curry missing the last 6 quarters but that would be me draggin in stats again. (1-5 in 2nd half of game 1, 4-15 in game 2)

In the 5 games since then Draymond Green is averaging 22 points, 11 rebounds, 8 assists, 2 blocks, 1 steal, and 48% from 3. Good try.

[nol]

Looks like Curry is good to go for tonight. I think this is a situation where he definitely is 100 percent and is not just being pushed back into action because the series is 2-1 or whatever.

[kingfc22]

Oh Scott Foster....

[kingfc22]

I guess Curry is okay. Lol. What a performance.

[bhlloy]

Steph isn't human. This is absolutely unreal given the circumstances. Feel sorry for Lillard but he's just an all-star and Curry is an extraterrestrial

[wustin]

Most points in OT by a single player in NBA history lol

[nol]

The Warriors were losing 16-2 when he came in, and once you saw his presence on the court causing the Blazers to tighten up just a little, the comeback was inevitable.

[SirFozzie]

One of those final three's, the ball barely leaves his hand and his teammate is already celebrating. When your teammates can do that, you KNOW you're good.

[Comey]

Originally Posted by SirFozzie

One of those final three's, the ball barely leaves his hand and his teammate is already celebrating. When your teammates can do that, you KNOW you're good.

Draymond does that a lot. It takes absolutely nothing away from how awesome it is when it happens, though.

[Vince, Pt. II]

That was unreal. Just...wow.

Originally Posted by Comey

Draymond does that a lot. It takes absolutely nothing away from how awesome it is when it happens, though.

There was one game about 2/3's the way through the season where Bogut passed to Curry on the wing, saw that he was wide open, and he started running back down the court with one arm raised before Steph even shot. From the angle, it looked like he actually almost blocked Curry with his celebratory arm raised. It was pretty amazing.

[whomario]

Curry also started the game 0-9 from 3 before getting hot, that´s pretty remarkable on its own.

Hats off to the Blazers as well though, hell of an effort all season long.

[albionmoonlight]

I never thought that a shoot-first point guard with attitude would be one of my favorite players in the league. But Westbrook proved me wrong there. Dude is just flat out fun to watch.

[Alf]

Originally Posted by albionmoonlight

I never thought that a shoot-first point guard with attitude would be one of my favorite players in the league. But Westbrook proved me wrong there. Dude is just flat out fun to watch.

If he ever wanted to make an effort on defense he would gain some respect from me, otherwise, well, he won't.

[Alf]

dola, for those who watched the San Antonio game : Duncan scoring 5 points and being absent from the rebound stat line too ?? Is he being overmatched by Steve Adams or what ?

[MrBug708]

Originally Posted by Alf

If he ever wanted to make an effort on defense he would gain some respect from me, otherwise, well, he won't.

You are thinking of Harden

[korme]

Originally Posted by Alf

dola, for those who watched the San Antonio game : Duncan scoring 5 points and being absent from the rebound stat line too ?? Is he being overmatched by Steve Adams or what ?

It's hard to grab boards when you have a giant metal fork weighing your back down.

[Alf]

Originally Posted by MrBug708

You are thinking of Harden

Harden of course, but Westbrook stops defending at times when he doesn't want to.

[nol]

Originally Posted by Alf

Harden of course, but Westbrook stops defending at times when he doesn't want to.

Yeah, he's not that good on defense. This is no secret. There are plenty of guys who stand around and don't do much on the offensive end, and they're not close to as good defensively as Westbrook is on offense.

[wustin]

Originally Posted by Alf

dola, for those who watched the San Antonio game : Duncan scoring 5 points and being absent from the rebound stat line too ?? Is he being overmatched by Steve Adams or what ?

OKC is playing bigball, Spurs big men do not match up well. Diaw and West are undersized and are more effective against smaller lineups. Duncan is an old fart who gets outworked by Adams and Ibaka.

[cartman]

This is a surprising stat: As a coach, Popovich is 2-10 when facing elimination in a road game.

[nol]

Originally Posted by cartman

This is a surprising stat: As a coach, Popovich is 2-10 when facing elimination in a road game.

I mean, to be facing elimination in a road game you're either playing a team with a better regular season record in a Game 7 (forgot the exact number but historically the home team wins 80+ percent of game 7s) or a team that was already good enough to win a game or two on your home court, so it's not like .500 would be the expectation. All that number really says is that Pop and the Spurs have been so good for so long that all of their elimination games have taken place in May/June rather than the March/April ones that don't go on a coach's postseason record.

More often than not the team that wins the championship goes the entire postseason without facing elimination once, and that's probably has as much to do with of a team that plays a bunch of longer series being slightly worn down relative to an equally talented opponent that's been sweeping through the competition as it does with a team like the 2001 Lakers just being head and shoulders above everybody. In other words, I'd be surprised to see a player, team, or coach that wins even 1 out of every 3 road elimination games over any sample larger than 3 or so games. Jordan was 1-2 in road elimination games for his career, with the 1 being his buzzer-beater against Cleveland, and 2-5 in home elimination games.

Coming back from a 3-1 hole has only happened 9 times and even that gives you 'only' a 1-0 or 2-0 record in road elimination games (edit: I'd suspect that most of the 9 involved 1 road game in the final 3 - yeah, 7 of 9. The two times it happened without homecourt, teams led by Hakeem and Bill Russell defeated ones led by Barkley and Wilt Chamberlain, which tells you not only how rare it is but probably how big a role a comeback/collapse like that goes in defining a player's, rather than a coach's, big game reputation and hey, Russell also happened to be the Celtics' coach back in 1968). Phil Jackson was 1-5 in road elimination games, so I'd say it's not like there's some type of coach who gets his team to play well in road elimination games; if you can make that happen, you or your team are likely good enough to avoid that situation in the first place.

I was gonna say after Game 3 that San Antonio could win its next 10, lose its next 3, or anything in between and it was going to be Duncan's last season. He's been pretty adamant over the years about not outstaying his usefulness, which sucks because he still had a very good regular season but I think the writing's on the wall considering that even if the Spurs came back and won this series Duncan would hardly see the floor against Golden State.

[Subby]

This is CJ McCollum playing for Canton Glenoak as a sophomore in 2007. Way to make the most out of a growth spurt. pic.twitter.com/Gwemd95N6Z

— David Baugh (@Worm02) May 12, 2016

[whomario]

As i normally prefer more fundamentally sound players it´s admittedly a guilty pleasure, but i really love watching this guy play. Such great energy and his shot blocking is a sight to behold. Bonus Points for doing the Mutombo-wag and Usain Bolts thingy within 30 seconds

Best backup C in the league ? Definitely on the defensive end at least (though even there he´s still making some weird decisions). If only he could reliably catch passes or had even a little more feel for the offensive side of things ...

[bob]

So is this Duncan's last game?

[whomario]

Originally Posted by bob

So is this Duncan's last game?

Nope. Last season though i think

Will be interesting if Pop goes unconventional if they are down around the halfway mark. I would still think that trying to go with Marjanovic might be wort a shot if Duncan is struggling. Thunder are not that good a shooting team that you can´t get away with him in there, unless they go small without Adams/Kanter.

[korme]

The best backup center in the league next year will be Dwight Howard. Just kidding. But he's maybe only 2-3 years away.

[bob]

Can't say I saw this coming

[Groundhog]

Semi-surprising because Spurs were so good all year, but like I said earlier, a team with Durant and Westbrook can beat any team in a 7 game series if those both of them are balling.

[wustin]

Everyone is playing checkers while Pops is playing 3D chess!

This series should be a huge eye opener for Kahwi. Hopefully he literally puts his team on his back next season.

[Brian Swartz]

Spurs never got to that point where everyone is rolling like they did a couple years ago. Great series by the Thunder, they surprised me. Going in they were dangerous but the way they'd done basically nothing in the 4th quarter at times I thought discipline would prevail for San Antonio. OKC turned the corner. Will be interesting to see how much fight they give the Warriors.

[Groundhog]

Westbrook/Durant aside, that Kanter/Adams combo was pretty key for OKC for most of the wins, but I don't know if they can get away with playing those two together vs the Warriors. Going to take a hell of a Durant/Westbrook show for them to have a chance.

[Alf]

Originally Posted by Groundhog

Westbrook/Durant aside, that Kanter/Adams combo was pretty key for OKC for most of the wins,

I agree here. OKC pounded in the inside and San Antonio couldn't resist. Even though I am a big fan of San Antonio fluid game, this series was very well coached by Billy Donovan (and well executed by his players).

[albionmoonlight]

It would be fitting for Duncan to retire. The parallel with Kobe is just too symbolic to let slide.

Kobe goes out after leading his team to the worst record in the West while gunning and gunning and gunning and shutting down Downtown Los Angeles for his final meaningless game.

Duncan takes a backseat for the good of the team and wins 67 games in his final season and does not draw any extra attention to himself.

[albionmoonlight]

dola:

and for the record, I am not a Kobe Hater.

I think that he's the second best player of his generation (behind Duncan)
the third best Laker ever (behind Magic and West)
and the third best shooting guard ever (behind Jordan and West(and if you think West was a PG, then Kobe moves to #2))

I can shake my old-man fist at his self-aggrandizing hero ball without being a hater.

[AENeuman]

Caveat: I'm no nol expert, nor do I understand most nol tome posts

Is the NBA playoffs mostly useless? I'm not sure, but I can't really think of a 4 or lower seed even being in the finals...

If that's true, then a) the season does a really good job of determining the best teams, b) first 2 rounds seem to be just practice for the 1-3 teams.

Not saying this is bad. There are many nfl and mlb teams that were clearly not in the top 3 and winning it all because they got hot. I just am amazed how long the playoffs are, given the almost certain outcomes.

[Gary Gorski]

Originally Posted by AENeuman

Is the NBA playoffs mostly useless? I'm not sure, but I can't really think of a 4 or lower seed even being in the finals...

If that's true, then a) the season does a really good job of determining the best teams, b) first 2 rounds seem to be just practice for the 1-3 teams.

It really all depends on the talent in the league. If you don't have the elite talent to match up then it's not going to matter which IMO is how it should work. When the upper echelon talent wasn't so great then it was sort of a crap shoot but lets be real - you're not beating Curry, LeBron, Durant in 4 out 7 unless you've got plenty of star power of your own and even that might not be enough (see Spurs, San Antonio) or something freaky happens with injuries (and that didn't help Houston one bit).

I don't mind this at all - I don't want to see Memphis v. Indiana for the title. I don't really have any interest in CLE/TOR (CLE/MIA only interesting for the LeBron angle) but GSW/OKC will be fantastic as will be the finals with one of those teams against LeBron.

[Gary Gorski]

Decided to let DDS:PB 2016 play out the WCF - if it comes close to what the sim predicted we're in for a treat.

We Simmed It - WCF : Golden State vs Oklahoma City - Wolverine Studios

[wustin]

I don't understand how OKC always gets away with things down the stretch.

[korme]

So sick of Barkley shitting on the Warriors

[Vince, Pt. II]

Really disappointed that the Warriors couldn't take advantage of mortal Durant. There are plenty of reasons to blame the refs, but being real, the Warriors blew a very winnable game. Hopefully this gives them the edge they need, because this is not going to be a cakewalk.

[vex]

Originally Posted by wustin

I don't understand how OKC always gets away with things down the stretch.

You mean like getting fouled before the travel?

[Suicane75]

What is the point of the NBA coming out after seemingly every game and saying "the refs fucked this up and so and so should have/should not have counted"? I kind of understand why they do it, but considering they don't and never will, overturn anything after the fact, it seems pretty pointless. If I were a fan of the league or a team involved, I imagine it'd be fairly infuriating at this point.

[albionmoonlight]

When playing the Warriors, it has to be so tempting to want to go small to match them when they are abusing your bigs. But that is just what they want you to do because they are the greatest smallball team ever.

Props to Donovan in sticking with his plan, even as GS tried to run them off the floor early. It may not win them the series, but it gives them the best chance to win four games.

[law90026]

Russ was crazy good in the 3rd quarter. It didn't help that Curry looked quite ordinary throughout the game.

[Vince, Pt. II]

Curry had a few moments of greatness in the game, but he could never sustain it. And maybe that is what you need to do against him - keep him just uncomfortable enough that he can't get into that rhythm.

[wustin]

Originally Posted by vex

You mean like getting fouled before the travel?

Referring to OKC and their lucky breaks the entire postseason. GSW offense went down the drain in the 2nd half even if they had gotten the ball back from the travel, they would've bricked a 3 anyways.

[murrayyyyy]

Originally Posted by wustin

Referring to OKC and their lucky breaks the entire postseason. GSW offense went down the drain in the 2nd half even if they had gotten the ball back from the travel, they would've bricked a 3 anyways.

I'm not sure you call that lucky. GSW was the ones who chose to shoot with 20 seconds on the shot clock down the stretch while OKC had it's two best players go 17-51 from the field. The entire game I kept thinking OKC is still somehow in this game and can steal it because GSW couldn't pull away. Thompson also disappeared in the game. I don't know if it was good D or what but I barely noticed him after the middle of the 3rd.

[wustin]

Originally Posted by murrayyyyy

I'm not sure you call that lucky. GSW was the ones who chose to shoot with 20 seconds on the shot clock down the stretch while OKC had it's two best players go 17-51 from the field. The entire game I kept thinking OKC is still somehow in this game and can steal it because GSW couldn't pull away. Thompson also disappeared in the game. I don't know if it was good D or what but I barely noticed him after the middle of the 3rd.

Klay is a streaky shooter. When he goes into full chuck mode he is either better than Curry or down right horrible.