The 2008 Euro Cup Thread

[MIJB#19]

And what kind of success, it made Greece the most unexpected tournament winners in the history of soccer (no, Denmark does'nt qualify with Peter Schmeichel and Brian Laudrup). I have to admit that I felt good about them being the cupcakes of this tournament. It points out that most of the time it just makes the difference between losing by 3 goals and losing by 1 goal.

[Radii]

2-1 now! I'm glad I didn't turn it off when Germany scored their second goal, this should be a great second half.

[Celeval]

Germany running away with it, 3-1 now...

[Crapshoot]

Good game. This has been a great tournament - definitely higher quality than the World Cup. Turkey - Czech Republic may be one of the best sporting events I have ever seen.

[ISiddiqui]

Nice ending to that game. The late goal by Postiga made the end really interesting.

[cthomer5000]

Set pieces killed it for Portugal obviously. Aside from that I thought it was very even. This tournament has been fantastic so far all-in-all, it's great to be able to come home from work every day and have a good game to watch.

[Chief Rum]

Originally Posted by daedalus

the issue could be in our definitions of bunkering. i think of bunkering as having everybody but, say, one striker in the defensive third, behind the ball...

We call this style "Italian".

[DaddyTorgo]

had a great thought re:cutting down faking and diving

obviously you can't seek to control it during the run of play, but what if you had postgame review and issued postgame "cards" (call them what you will) for dives and faking injuries and after a certain number the player had to miss a game or whatever? given it wouldn't be perfect, but would it really be worse than the game is now?

[ISiddiqui]

Funny thing is for all the talk about Portugese diving, the German diving was far more blatant. Andy Grey even called it out a few times.

[DaddyTorgo]

oh I agree isiddiqui - in fact it was ballack's dive that made me think of this idea

[ISiddiqui]

That was just shameful... I mean come on! And then the ref didn't buy it and he STILL flopped around!

[samifan24]

I don't understand all this flopping in soccer. If you did that crap in football or hockey you'd get your ass kicked.

[ISiddiqui]

Well, I don't understand why you'd flop in baseball in the first place .

But in football, WRs do exaggerate for pass interference calls... there are less fouls for getting tackled though.

[scooter]

I had an idea this afternoon while I was watching the game. It seems in this tournament (more than I remember in just plain old league games) that players are going down under challenges and it's almost like they are listening to the crowd. If the crowd starts going nuts (the other team is attacking the other way), they roll around until the other team kicks the ball out or the referee stops play. If there is no immediate danger (the other team is not really attacking), they get up and "walk it off". If the referee does stop play, a lot of players are then taking the opportunity to show the referee the injury, complain, etc.

So I had an idea: if a player goes down and stays down, they must leave the field of play and remain off the field for 2 full minutes of playing time (like in hockey as in the ball is actually in play, not chasing after a ball kicked out, etc.). The fourth official would be in charge of keeping the time (what else do they have to do?) and permitting the player to re-enter the field of play. If the manager wants to make a substitution, then that would negate having to wait the full time (an injury like Ribery when you know the player can not continue). If 2 minutes doesn't seem like enough time, make it 4 minutes.

What I would hope this would do is make players really think about staying down after a challenge. Do they really need treatment? Is it worth playing a man down for 2 (or 4) minutes to point out to the referee that you feel you should have been awarded a free kick? Or do you just get up and play on? If they do need treatment, the 2 minutes will do them some good as they will be able to get all the treatment they need off the field (and play can continue). I also feel that any player that rolls over more than two times after being fouled should be automatically yellow carded. It's just a disgrace to see some of these "professionals" acting like children.

[BishopMVP]

Originally Posted by DaddyTorgo

oh I agree isiddiqui - in fact it was ballack's dive that made me think of this idea

Ronaldo's fake injury was also terrible. He actually waited like 3 seconds until he started grabbing the "injury". And I thought he had gotten some of that out of his system in the EPL. I guess being around Portugese players brings it out.

Portugal deserved to lose for leaving Quaresma on the bench. Nani and Postinga may have combined for a nice goal, but he's still better than both and Simao played pretty poorly all tournament.

Also, DT, on the Spain-Greece switch, espn360.com should work for you. It does for me both in Concord and in Amherst, although the connection is obviously a little choppier here than at school.

[Mac Howard]

They need to go back to the referee deciding on whether the game should be stopped when an injury occurs. Currently players are being intimidated by the crowd to stop the play - how often do you see an opposition player in response to the crowd try to carry on but then slow down, stop, look around him, listen to the opposition fans whistle and boo and then kick the ball out. The sportsmanship aspect of this has disappeared from the game now. It's just being abused by players. And referees are currently shirking their responsibilities in this and leaving the decision up to the players.

The players can tell if a player is in dire need of treatment and can stop the game in that circumstance if the referee doesn't know it - that only occurs about once every 10 matches or more. But the pressure on a player to stop the game should be removed by FIFA stating that the ref stops the game in all but the most extreme circumstances. I believe the Premiership have stated that but the crowd still gets on to the players and forces a stop. A loud and clear statement needs to be made. Announce it over the loud-speaker system before a few games to get it across to the crowds.

[AlexB]

Originally Posted by scooter

I had an idea this afternoon while I was watching the game. It seems in this tournament (more than I remember in just plain old league games) that players are going down under challenges and it's almost like they are listening to the crowd. If the crowd starts going nuts (the other team is attacking the other way), they roll around until the other team kicks the ball out or the referee stops play. If there is no immediate danger (the other team is not really attacking), they get up and "walk it off". If the referee does stop play, a lot of players are then taking the opportunity to show the referee the injury, complain, etc.

So I had an idea: if a player goes down and stays down, they must leave the field of play and remain off the field for 2 full minutes of playing time (like in hockey as in the ball is actually in play, not chasing after a ball kicked out, etc.). The fourth official would be in charge of keeping the time (what else do they have to do?) and permitting the player to re-enter the field of play. If the manager wants to make a substitution, then that would negate having to wait the full time (an injury like Ribery when you know the player can not continue). If 2 minutes doesn't seem like enough time, make it 4 minutes.

What I would hope this would do is make players really think about staying down after a challenge. Do they really need treatment? Is it worth playing a man down for 2 (or 4) minutes to point out to the referee that you feel you should have been awarded a free kick? Or do you just get up and play on? If they do need treatment, the 2 minutes will do them some good as they will be able to get all the treatment they need off the field (and play can continue). I also feel that any player that rolls over more than two times after being fouled should be automatically yellow carded. It's just a disgrace to see some of these "professionals" acting like children.

It's something I've often thought of as well: the only danger I thought of is that it might encourage a team to try and injure the opposition to gain an advantage...

An idea I think would work quite well with this is a system like rugby league, where the player is treated while play carries on regardless. This would definitely stop players rolling around pretending as there would literally be no point: the game would carry on around them and they would be disadvantaging their own team.

Play would only need to be stopped if the injury was serious: if play were then stopped, the player would either have to be subbed or spend a set period off the field like you suggest.

Again you have the risk of deliberate attempts to injure, so I think to counter that again a system similar to rugby league would work - after the game video evidence should be used to punish players for offences that the referee missed, or the ref can put players 'on report' for incidents where he didn't see exactly whether the play was dangerous. They then have different levels of punishment ranging from a slap on the wrists, fines, and bans from 1-6 weeks.

However, as a big generalisation, the governing bodies don't seem to care about diving, feigning injury and cheating, so the chances of anything actually happening are practically zero.

Just to show a little sense of perspective, although I've only seen maybe 1 in 5 of the games of the Euros, the diving etc has actually seemed a little less to me than in the Champions League for example.

[ISiddiqui]

Originally Posted by BishopMVP

Ronaldo's fake injury was also terrible. He actually waited like 3 seconds until he started grabbing the "injury".

Watch the replay. A German player stepped on the instep of Ronaldo's foot... and considering he's getting foot surgery (not sure if its on that one or the other though), I can definitely see it being painful.

No fake injury on that one at all.

[DaddyTorgo]

yeah. Ronaldo got stepped on as the guy went over him.

I definately thought the German diving was actually worse: Ballack's as I mentioned, the time Metzelder got brushed by a guy's forearm and started grabbing at his EYE, etc.

[MikeVic]

Is anyone watching this game live? I'm at work... but I'd like updates if something noteworthy happens please.

[MikeVic]

Thanks, I'm following that BBC thing too. I hope this miss doesn't cost them.

[SirFozzie]

That was a clothesline worthy of the WWE.

[SirFozzie]

Originally Posted by Ronnie Dobbs2

Turkish keeper being tested in stoppage time.

I was just going to say he's looking like he has a case of the yips.. twice he spilled a free kick, just luck that 2nd one didn't go in

[kingfc22]

I smell PK's

[kingfc22]

Wow. What was the keeper thinking.

[miked]

Incredible!!

[kingfc22]

Holy shit! Are you kidding me!!!

[SirFozzie]

Trying to save the Corner.. and just lost his head.

[MIJB#19]

OMG, another miracle escape from Turkey!

[MikeVic]

Come on, don't tell me it's 1-1.

[miked]

I can't believe that ending.

[MIJB#19]

It's 1-1. Last second of overtime.

[SirFozzie]

Holy Fuck!

[MIJB#19]

putting my money on Turkey to win the penalty series.

[kingfc22]

Incredible how this game is ending

[MikeVic]

Fucking bullshit. I am so sad right now.

[MIJB#19]

This could be a wild night out here, there's pretty large Turkish community in Maassluis.

[Critch]

Well that's Germany in the final then.

[Crapshoot]

The Guardian noted this - Turkey has been in the lead for exactly 4 of the 390 minutes they have played in this tournament. That's surreal.

[Crapshoot]

Originally Posted by Critch

Well that's Germany in the final then.

At this point, is anyone comfortable betting against the Turks? the SOB's keep coming back - tis amazing.

[Ajaxab]

Amazing game. 117 minutes of pretty dull football and then 3 minutes of absolute craziness.

Can someone explain the cards rule for semifinals? Derek Rae and Tommy Smyth were going on today about how much trouble Turkey would be in because of injuries and suspensions from cards. But yesterday, Adrian Healy and Andy Gray were saying that the slate gets wiped clean after the quarters? Who is right?

[SirFozzie]

http://breakingnews.iol.ie/sport/sto...876z8&t=soccer

It also came against the odds as injuries and suspension left Terim with just 15 outfield players and eight of his starting XI on a yellow card.

Victory came at a cost as Tuncay Sanli, Arda Turan and Emre Asik will be banned for the semi-final after picking up yellow cards. Nihat Kahveci also appeared to pick up a groin strain.

[ISiddiqui]

Turkey is fucking amazing. Team of Destiny.

[ISiddiqui]

Originally Posted by Ajaxab

Can someone explain the cards rule for semifinals? Derek Rae and Tommy Smyth were going on today about how much trouble Turkey would be in because of injuries and suspensions from cards. But yesterday, Adrian Healy and Andy Gray were saying that the slate gets wiped clean after the quarters? Who is right?

Both. Suspensions carry over to the semis, but those with only one card so far in the tourney get that card wiped away after the QFs. It is to, as explained by the commentators, prevent suspensions during the Final Match.

[cthomer5000]

That was one of the craziest endings I've ever seen. Turkey really does have a tough of magic about them right now. Of course nowthey'll REALLy need some luck withso many guys missing for the semis.

This tournament has been excellent so far. Just excellent.

[Ajaxab]

Originally Posted by ISiddiqui

Both. Suspensions carry over to the semis, but those with only one card so far in the tourney get that card wiped away after the QFs. It is to, as explained by the commentators, prevent suspensions during the Final Match.

Thanks ISiddiqui! That is much clearer than the commentators' explanation yesterday.

Go Oranje!

[B & B]

Ive been burned twice with late minute heroics on my wagers.

Was going to play the draw in todays DUTCH/ROOSKIE game but will play

1st half draw instead. Pays out better than even money and my mathematical numbers have this at 51.7 % chance.

The full game draw line is ~+300 and worth a shot for those interested.

[DaddyTorgo]

no way the russian defense holds the dutch to a full game draw

Russia is too inconsistent for that

[Crapshoot]

Jesus Christ, the Russians can shoot - the guy's taken 3 shots from 35 yards out, and all have been nasty.

[DaddyTorgo]

akinfeev just saved you some serious $$ B&B