2015 MLB thread

[MrBug708]

Originally Posted by kingfc22

A slide should not take you 10 feet past the bag. Despicable. Dodger or not. Just plain dirty.

Since you had to clarify, I'm forced to take your comment with a grain of salt giants fan

And he's still basically a Phillie

[Glengoyne]

Originally Posted by MrBug708

He missed the bag, thought he was close enough for the "neighborhood" imo

Absolutely in the neighborhood. But the side of his foot appeared to be touching the bag. The ball was in the glove.

I'm not buying the MLB's " The throw pulled him from the bag" bit. That was a clear cut out at second and a take out slide to boot.

I'm stumped.

Edit: the throw made it so there couldn't be a double play, but it didnt pull Tejada away from the bag. Just awful.

[bhlloy]

Not a huge baseball guy but I have no idea how that is a legal play and doesn't result in a ejection. That's not even close to being a legitimate slide to the bag.

[cuervo72]

Here's a question too, for all the old-school types who say that's a fair slide to break up a double play. Is that an acceptable slide if it's for just a force play?

[bhlloy]

He didn't even leave his feet until he was a foot from the bag and he went knee high away from the bag. That's just mind boggling how that's legal.

[ISiddiqui]

Really, really fucked up. Tejada has a broken fibula. Kind of sours me on the rest of the NLDS right now.

[stevew]

Originally Posted by bhlloy

Not a huge baseball guy but I have no idea how that is a legal play and doesn't result in a ejection. That's not even close to being a legitimate slide to the bag.

Basically you gotta just choke on dicks as a fan cause #hustle

[MrBug708]

Originally Posted by bhlloy

He didn't even leave his feet until he was a foot from the bag and he went knee high away from the bag. That's just mind boggling how that's legal.

I think you pass into a gray area of when someone is supposed to slide? And when they are expected to slide.

Pedro is a really terrible analyst.

[Atocep]

If you're not making a legitimate attempt to slide into a bag you should be out and ejected. At no point did Utley even attempt to reach for or slide into 2nd.

Absolutely crazy that the NFL protects defenseless players from contact better than MLB.

[MrBug708]

About a quarter of slides into second on double play balls see the runner not bothering to reach for the bag.

[Atocep]

Originally Posted by MrBug708

About a quarter of slides into second on double play balls see the runner not bothering to reach for the bag.

And it would be an out in college, high school, and every level below.

[bhlloy]

Maybe, but I can't ever think of a more egregious one I've seen. If there is I'd love to see it

[MrBug708]

Originally Posted by Atocep

And it would be an out in college, high school, and every level below.

They also use metal bats in those levels

Originally Posted by bhlloy

Maybe, but I can't ever think of a more egregious one I've seen. If there is I'd love to see it

Belle crushes Vina to break up double play - YouTube

1977 ALCS Gm2: McRae takes out Randolph at second - YouTube

Neither of them were in the postseason

[Atocep]

Originally Posted by MrBug708

They also use metal bats in those levels

So wood bats and take out slides are manly things that go hand in hand?

[bhlloy]

Originally Posted by MrBug708

They also use metal bats in those levels



Belle crushes Vina to break up double play - YouTube

1977 ALCS Gm2: McRae takes out Randolph at second - YouTube

Neither of them were in the postseason

Neither of those are even close. Keep trying. Hint: tonight a guy ended up with a broken leg

[Suicane75]

Originally Posted by MrBug708

They also use metal bats in those levels

What in tarnation does one thing have to do with the other?

[EagleFan]

Just saw the replay. Awesome slide. He slid at the base.

[MrBug708]

Originally Posted by Atocep

So wood bats and take out slides are manly things that go hand in hand?

Just because they are one way on different levels, doesnt mean they are in MLB

[Suicane75]

Just saw it. Perfectly legal slide. Now if you want to outlaw sliding to the sides of 2nd base, I'd be all for it. He's not doing anything there but trying to interrupt the throw, but he goes right over the base.

[Vince, Pt. II]

You have to realize you're fighting a losing battle on this one though, right Kyle? I know it was a guy on your team, but that was a completely ridiculous play that ended up ruining a player's season and potentially his career.

I would not at all be surprised to see another Buster Posey type rule after this play.

[MrBug708]

Originally Posted by bhlloy

Neither of those are even close. Keep trying. Hint: tonight a guy ended up with a broken leg

Those were worse TBH. The Iron Horse was fine with it. He's forgotten more about playing SS than I'll every know so I'll defer to him on the actual play and how clean or not it was.

[Vince, Pt. II]

Also, to clarify, I do agree that it is a legal slide. It's the fact that it is legal that is crazy.

[MrBug708]

FWIW - The slide is going to be under review by MLB to see if any discipline will be handed out

[BishopMVP]

Originally Posted by bhlloy

Neither of those are even close. Keep trying. Hint: tonight a guy ended up with a broken leg

The McRae one was pretty brutal. Maybe he didn't go low, but he launched himself once he was past the bag and already out. http://cdn.barstoolsports.com/wp-con...aro.gif?6a89d0 was probably the worst one from last year's playoffs.

I hate it. Get rid of the area rule, but call runner interference for any slide that intentionally ends up off the bag (and yes, making it a judgment call would also lend itself to controversy, but it would cut down on the more egregious takeout slides). But as long as you have the area rule I don't understand how this wasn't at least ruled an out at 2nd.

[Vince, Pt. II]

Originally Posted by Vince, Pt. II

Also, to clarify, I do agree that it is a legal slide. It's the fact that it is legal that is crazy.

I stand corrected:

[Vince, Pt. II]

Although I'm not sure that applies, as the ball has already been fielded, so I don't think it's a 'batted ball' any longer.

[BishopMVP]

Originally Posted by Vince, Pt. II

I stand corrected:

Your mistake is looking at the written rules. It's the unwritten rulebook that matters in playoff baseball. Brian McCann, Carlos Gomez, the Royals pitching staff or any Molina brother will probably let you borrow their copy as long as you don't get too excited about finding the answer.

[Vince, Pt. II]

I know that it was never going to be called, but the thought is that the written rulebook defends Utley on this one. That snippet may (or may not) prove otherwise.

[Atocep]

Rule 6.05

A batter is out when --

(m) A preceding runner shall, in the umpire's judgment, intentionally interfere with a fielder who is attempting to catch a thrown ball or to throw a ball in an attempt to complete any play:

[Chief Rum]

Utley shouldn't be allowed to play the rest of this postseason.

[EagleFan]

Didn't know the fielder was injured when I first saw this. Sucks for the player, hope he recovered. But with that said, what he did was within the rules. The rule states that you should be able to reach the bag. He was in that area where he could reach the bag (not "10 feet away" as I have seen thrown around).

[Chief Rum]

Originally Posted by EagleFan

Didn't know the fielder was injured when I first saw this. Sucks for the player, hope he recovered. But with that said, what he did was within the rules. The rule states that you should be able to reach the bag. He was in that area where he could reach the bag (not "10 feet away" as I have seen thrown around).

Sorry this isn't a situation for rules. This is a situation for right or wrong. Allowed by MLB or not, this was a wrong wrong wrong and terrible move. Utley should be fined and suspended and then next year thrown at by the first 10 pitchers he faces.

[Atocep]

Originally Posted by EagleFan

The rule states that you should be able to reach the bag. He was in that area where he could reach the bag (not "10 feet away" as I have seen thrown around).

Can you post where in the rulebook it states you have to be able to reach the bag?

Torre said after the game the slide was "a little late" and MLB is looking at it. He also stated they'll be testing sliding rules similar to college in the AFL.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by Vince, Pt. II

I would not at all be surprised to see another Buster Posey type rule after this play.

I wouldn't be surprised by that either.

And it would be just as fucking stupid, just as detrimental to the fundamental game of baseball as that candyass bullshit rule is.

[stevew]

So I guess Kang wasn't enough

[Scoobz0202]

Yea that play should be kept legal but Lord help me if some piece of shit does a bat flip or celebrates too much.

[Scoobz0202]

dola

But Utley isn't any more dirty than the majority of the league in regards to that type of play. Slides like that should be against the rules, and now they will be, but you can find every team throughout the season, Mets and Pirates alike, that make slides like that. Not saying it should be a legal slide, but I think the outrage and some fans on Twitter and what not calling the Dodgers and Utley scum is a little bit overboard.

[AENeuman]

I thinks it's Tajada fault, the feed meant he should not have attempted a throw to first. When he went to throw to first his back was turned to a runner he knew would be trying to obstruct him. His decision to throw meant he was intentionally giving up his ability to defend himself from a completely predictable slide.

[TroyF]

I just watched the replay because I was interested in all the attention this received. Before watching the replay, I was ready to say "A hard slide, is a hard slide, Protecting the players is important, but sometimes crap happens and people need to deal with it"

After watching it? Holy hell. Who in their right mind is even calling that a slide? He does NOT go for the bag. Watch his hand people, it landed close to two feet after the base. His supposed "slide" happened when he was even or maybe a hair past the bag.

It is one of the sickest, most disgusting plays I have ever seen in my life. Utley should be suspended for the playoffs and any umpire involved in that travesty should be sent home NOW. Seriously, what the Fing F?!?!?! How can anyone try to defend this? It's against the rules of the game, it's cheap and dirty and the player involved should have been ejected.

Two more things:

1) You don't need to change the rules for this. Just enforce the damned rules on the books that already exist for this cheap ass behavior.

2) I don't give a damn about the "result" here. If Tejeda doesn't break his leg, it's still cheap, the intent is still to injure, Utley should still be ejected and the inning should have been over.


So disgusting. So unbelievably disgusting.

[MrBug708]

Lol

[tucker rocky]

[stevew]

Originally Posted by AENeuman

I thinks it's Tajada fault, the feed meant he should not have attempted a throw to first. When he went to throw to first his back was turned to a runner he knew would be trying to obstruct him. His decision to throw meant he was intentionally giving up his ability to defend himself from a completely predictable slide.

I don't think anyone would care if it was a normal slide. This was essentially a dirty WWE style attack.

[Logan]

I have a 7 year old nephew who's middle name is Chase after Utley, thanks to his Phillies fan father.

I can't wait to plant him on his ass during our next football game.

[cuervo72]

I want to see a player go in with a flying horizontal leap, wrestling-style. Just do it where your hand can pass close enough over the bag.

[molson]

Originally Posted by MrBug708

About a quarter of slides into second on double play balls see the runner not bothering to reach for the bag.

I'd say more than a quarter - it happens so often I always just assumed the proper "fundamental" move there is to slide directly at the fielder without regard to where the base is.

The mechanics of the slide seemed a little different, maybe there's an element of the slide itself that could be considered dirty, but I'm not sure the people who are saying that "not going for the base" is the big problem have ever watched baseball before.

[Suicane75]

Originally Posted by TroyF

Rant.

Just curious, do you watch a lot of baseball? Because as others have said, it's a relatively normal occurrence. He goes directly over the bag, which is the letter of the law and happens quite often.

I get being against that sort of slide being legal, but to act like it's the dirtiest thing you've ever seen is hyperbole.

[Atocep]

Originally Posted by molson

but I'm not sure the people who are saying that "not going for the base" is the big problem have ever watched baseball before.

I'm not sure those that defend plays like that have ever read a baseball rulebook.

[molson]

Originally Posted by Atocep

I'm not sure those that defend plays like that have ever read a baseball rulebook.

I can't say I've ever sat around and read a baseball rulebook.

All I said is that runners commonly slide into the fielder rather than the base. I've never seen one of those runners called out that I can remember. The difference here is the injury.

Edit: If you search "breaks up double play" on youtube you can find dozens of examples of players sliding at fielders, and not the base, with no ejection. Usually in the context of MLB.com celebrating the great hard-nosed effort of the runner. Maybe there will be some off-season "re-emphasis" on the rule about fielder inference, but it's not part of the way the game is called right now.

[Vince, Pt. II]

Outside of Hal McRae, most ballplayers' conception of 'sliding into the runner' is slightly different than what Utley did, methinks.

[Atocep]

Originally Posted by molson

I can't say I've ever sat around and read a baseball rulebook.

All I said is that runners commonly slide into the fielder rather than the base. I've never seen one of those runners called out that I can remember. The difference here is the injury.

By the letter of the law those plays are outs per 6.05m which I posted above.

The rule is there to protect players from "illegal slides" and to keep players from leaving the basepath to take out fielders.

The problem is there's nothing in the rulebook that details what, exactly, a legal slide is. Being able to reach and touch the base is what is most often cited, but it's nowhere in the book and fans like to throw it out there like its a hard rule because it's what the announcers will state. Its become part of the game and accepted.

Baseball needs to clean up its rules on the bases. They're vague and the vagueness of the bluebook rules when it comes to baserunning is why every other level of baseball has had to create their own amendments to clarify what is actually allowed to take place on the bases.

When you've coached and instructed kids from age 8 through high school and you see them trying to emulate their heroes on the bases and "help their team win" with takeout slides that injure other players you get tired of it.