02-03-2020, 01:06 PM | #21251 | ||
Head Coach
Join Date: Oct 2005
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Quote:
Yes, I agree and conceded this in the above post. It would be nice to see this represented as a % of GDP, I think it is a more fair comparison vs raw $.
Last edited by Edward64 : 02-03-2020 at 01:14 PM. |
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02-03-2020, 01:42 PM | #21252 | |
Grizzled Veteran
Join Date: Nov 2013
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Quote:
https://www.thebalance.com/us-deficit-by-year-3306306 It doesn't really change the discussion ETA: By which I mean the percentages go up under GOP presidents and down during Democratic presidents.
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"I am God's prophet, and I need an attorney" Last edited by NobodyHere : 02-03-2020 at 02:29 PM. |
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02-03-2020, 01:51 PM | #21253 | |
Head Coach
Join Date: Oct 2005
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Quote:
Let me make sure I understand you. You think rate of change in the annual deficit is a better measure than total deficits for a President? |
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02-03-2020, 02:29 PM | #21254 | |
Grizzled Veteran
Join Date: Nov 2013
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Quote:
Yup, it shows direction. If the president left the yearly deficit lower than when he entered office I consider that positive change and vice versa. A president can't control where he starts from which is why I don't like the total deficits metric.
__________________
"I am God's prophet, and I need an attorney" |
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02-03-2020, 02:36 PM | #21255 |
Hall Of Famer
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Newburgh, NY
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And external factors matter. The Great Recession demanded increased federal spending.
In that sense, Trump has been the worst, by far. He's run up trillion dollar plus deficits with a good economy for all four years.
__________________
To love someone is to strive to accept that person exactly the way he or she is, right here and now.. - Mr. Rogers |
02-03-2020, 02:37 PM | #21256 | |
Coordinator
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: San Diego via Sausalito via San Jose via San Diego
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Quote:
Exactly! He has pretty much done exactly the opposite of what you are supposed to do when the economy is good. It's nothing short of us getting fleeced by him and the rich.
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I'm no longer a Chargers fan, they are dead to me Coming this summer to a movie theater near you: The Adventures of Jedikooter: Part 4 |
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02-03-2020, 02:43 PM | #21257 | |
Head Coach
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: Green Bay, WI
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You can fuck right off to Fuckyourselfville with that bullshit. Quote:
Once acquitted, what incentive for good behavior does he have? He now demonstrably has a Senate with neither the balls nor the spine to tell him no. |
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02-03-2020, 02:45 PM | #21258 | |
Head Coach
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: Green Bay, WI
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Quote:
In '2016 they were yammering about having enough material for years of hearings to slam Clinton with and ohbytheway we're gonna impeach her for Benghazi. Nothing new. |
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02-03-2020, 03:09 PM | #21259 |
Hall Of Famer
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: Decatur, GA
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If Biden wins, the House is likely going to stay Democratic... so... no, they won't.
__________________
"A prayer for the wild at heart, kept in cages" -Tennessee Williams |
02-03-2020, 03:56 PM | #21260 | |
Coordinator
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Puyallup, WA
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Very McConnell-esque
Virginia GOP delegate tries to kill own bill to remove Democratic segregationist statue | TheHill Quote:
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02-03-2020, 04:53 PM | #21261 | |||
Head Coach
Join Date: Oct 2005
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Quote:
Guess not interested in fair & balanced? Quote:
I thought I answered it.
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02-03-2020, 05:08 PM | #21262 | |
Head Coach
Join Date: Oct 2005
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Quote:
Per the Maddow chart, the first year of a Presidency is multi-colored. Take out all first year deficits because it came from the previous year/administration. So for Obama, remove 2009 from the discussion. In 2010, 2011 & 2012, the deficit is > $1T each year. Far greater than any other Presidents before him in raw $ (not sure where to get $ adjusted for inflation but that would be a better measure). In 2013 it drops to $650B. That would be a dramatic drop but I don't think the "rate of decrease" is as relevant because 2010-2012 were such dramatically bad years. The damage was front loaded and already done. I don't care as much the decrease was 40-50% from 2012 to 2013 when we were already $3-4T up in 2010-2012. Hence, my position that the total accumulated deficit is more important than rate of increase/decrease. Let's agree to disagree. |
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02-03-2020, 05:12 PM | #21263 |
Morgado's Favorite Forum Fascist
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: Greensboro, NC
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Let's take a break, Sack.
__________________
The media don't understand the kinds of problems and pressures 54 million come wit'! |
02-03-2020, 05:19 PM | #21264 | |
Head Coach
Join Date: Oct 2005
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Quote:
This is fair. Much of Obama's deficits were because of the GR. Just like we can say much of GWB deficits were because of 9/11 wars. Look at Obama's 2013, 2014, 2015, 2016. Those deficits were just as great as GWB who had a war to deal with. For Trump, according to Maddow's chart, its not all 3 years but your point is taken. He is headed in the wrong direction in a record way for sure. One caveat for future conversations -- I think we have to look at raw deficit/debt $ but it needs to be complemented by "as a % of GDP" and normalized for today's $. The wiki article had % of GDP but only went through Obama's first term and (obviously) nothing on Trump. Last edited by Edward64 : 02-03-2020 at 05:20 PM. |
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02-03-2020, 06:04 PM | #21265 |
Hall Of Famer
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: the yo'
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Why do you guys keep engaging the Russian bot troll
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02-03-2020, 06:13 PM | #21266 | |
Grizzled Veteran
Join Date: Nov 2013
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Quote:
Define "9/11 wars"
__________________
"I am God's prophet, and I need an attorney" |
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02-03-2020, 06:18 PM | #21267 |
Grizzled Veteran
Join Date: Nov 2013
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I was made in Singapore thank you very much!
__________________
"I am God's prophet, and I need an attorney" |
02-03-2020, 06:33 PM | #21268 |
Hall Of Famer
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Chicago, IL
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02-03-2020, 06:35 PM | #21269 | |
Grizzled Veteran
Join Date: Nov 2013
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Quote:
And Iraq War
__________________
"I am God's prophet, and I need an attorney" |
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02-03-2020, 06:40 PM | #21270 |
Hall Of Famer
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Chicago, IL
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02-03-2020, 08:29 PM | #21271 |
Head Coach
Join Date: Oct 2005
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02-03-2020, 08:29 PM | #21272 |
Head Coach
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Georgia
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Using the Iraq War as a mitigating factor in Bush's management of the deficit is a really weird argument considering many of the arguments against the war centered around how much it would cost, especially because it would take much longer than the administration was touting. No shit the war was a major factor in the deficit increase. That's kinda the point.
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Top 10 Songs of the Year 1955-Present (1976 Added) Franchise Portfolio Draft Winner Fictional Character Draft Winner Television Family Draft Winner Build Your Own Hollywood Studio Draft Winner |
02-03-2020, 08:32 PM | #21273 |
Head Coach
Join Date: Oct 2005
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02-03-2020, 08:34 PM | #21274 | |
Grizzled Veteran
Join Date: Nov 2013
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Quote:
I was just making sure you lumped the Iraq War (because Saddam caused 9/11) in the "9/11 wars" before I put words in your mouth It was first time I've heard that phrase.
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"I am God's prophet, and I need an attorney" Last edited by NobodyHere : 02-03-2020 at 08:36 PM. |
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02-03-2020, 08:36 PM | #21275 | |
Grizzled Veteran
Join Date: Nov 2013
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Quote:
You'll have to ask my maker.
__________________
"I am God's prophet, and I need an attorney" |
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02-03-2020, 08:40 PM | #21276 | |
Head Coach
Join Date: Oct 2005
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Quote:
Okay, I understand. Yes, agree my wording could be better but I was thinking Afghanistan and Iraq part deaux. |
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02-03-2020, 09:55 PM | #21277 |
Coordinator
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Puyallup, WA
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It's like watching a toddler that can't sit still. There seriously has to be something medically wrong with the man.
Trump is caught on camera waving his hands during national anthem - Business Insider |
02-04-2020, 07:25 AM | #21278 | |
Pro Starter
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Newbury, England
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Quote:
Have you ever seen Bladerunner?
__________________
'A song is a beautiful lie', Idlewild, Self Healer. When you're smiling, the whole world smiles with you. Sports! |
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02-04-2020, 07:53 AM | #21279 | |
Hall Of Famer
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Newburgh, NY
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Quote:
That looks like a guy suffering from dementia.
__________________
To love someone is to strive to accept that person exactly the way he or she is, right here and now.. - Mr. Rogers |
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02-04-2020, 09:25 AM | #21280 | |
Coordinator
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: The scorched Desert
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Quote:
So kneeling and remaining silent is disrespectful, but talking, waving your arms, gesturing and being otherwise disruptive is perfectly respectful? Okay. |
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02-04-2020, 09:36 AM | #21281 | |
Death Herald
Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: Le stelle la notte sono grandi e luminose nel cuore profondo del Texas
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Quote:
Remember, he has Article II of the Constitution, which allows him to do what ever he wants
__________________
Thinkin' of a master plan 'Cuz ain't nuthin' but sweat inside my hand So I dig into my pocket, all my money is spent So I dig deeper but still comin' up with lint |
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02-04-2020, 09:45 AM | #21282 |
Head Coach
Join Date: Oct 2005
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02-04-2020, 10:19 AM | #21283 | |
Head Coach
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Morgan Hill, CA
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Quote:
The “I am rubber and you are glue” approach.
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Fan of SF Giants, 49ers, Sharks, Arsenal |
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02-04-2020, 01:56 PM | #21284 | ||
Head Coach
Join Date: Oct 2005
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I think Trump's odds of a second term just went up a some. Lot's of time left for something to happen but he's likely to go into November with a good/strong economy/market (e.g. too late for us to get into an official recession now but market could still crash).
https://news.gallup.com/poll/284156/...onal-best.aspx Quote:
Quote:
Last edited by Edward64 : 02-04-2020 at 01:56 PM. |
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02-04-2020, 01:59 PM | #21285 |
Head Coach
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Seven miles up
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Sure, he's got as good a chance as a sitting president, who has gotten the green light to manipulate the system for his benefit, as any other previous president has.
__________________
He's just like if Snow White was competitive, horny, and capable of beating the shit out of anyone that called her Pops. Like Steam? Join the FOFC Steam group here: http://steamcommunity.com/groups/FOFConSteam |
02-04-2020, 02:02 PM | #21286 |
Head Coach
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Seven miles up
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Sure, he's got as good a chance as a sitting president, with special needs, as any other previous president has.
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He's just like if Snow White was competitive, horny, and capable of beating the shit out of anyone that called her Pops. Like Steam? Join the FOFC Steam group here: http://steamcommunity.com/groups/FOFConSteam |
02-04-2020, 02:07 PM | #21287 |
Head Coach
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Seven miles up
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Sure, he's got as good a chance as a sitting president, who is defended by rape, murder, and child porn lawyers, as any other previous president has.
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He's just like if Snow White was competitive, horny, and capable of beating the shit out of anyone that called her Pops. Like Steam? Join the FOFC Steam group here: http://steamcommunity.com/groups/FOFConSteam |
02-04-2020, 03:22 PM | #21288 |
Hall Of Famer
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Newburgh, NY
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He's an incumbent with a good economy, he should be the favorite.
Also, don't put too much stock in one poll.
__________________
To love someone is to strive to accept that person exactly the way he or she is, right here and now.. - Mr. Rogers |
02-04-2020, 04:25 PM | #21289 |
Coordinator
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Puyallup, WA
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I'm sure I missed this at some point, but we're pro landmine now?
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02-04-2020, 06:56 PM | #21290 | |
Coordinator
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: San Diego via Sausalito via San Jose via San Diego
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Quote:
Yes. And if by 'we', you mean trump and his ilk...yes.
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I'm no longer a Chargers fan, they are dead to me Coming this summer to a movie theater near you: The Adventures of Jedikooter: Part 4 |
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02-04-2020, 07:02 PM | #21291 | |
Head Coach
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Seven miles up
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Quote:
Bone Spurs for all! Real ones this time too!
__________________
He's just like if Snow White was competitive, horny, and capable of beating the shit out of anyone that called her Pops. Like Steam? Join the FOFC Steam group here: http://steamcommunity.com/groups/FOFConSteam |
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02-04-2020, 08:13 PM | #21292 |
Head Coach
Join Date: Oct 2005
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That breathing again.
And Nancy busy doing work in the background. It would be hilarious if she took out her iPhone and started texting! |
02-04-2020, 08:25 PM | #21293 |
Head Coach
Join Date: Oct 2005
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Forgot about the clapping after every sentence.
GOP clapping and cheers seem almost ... giddy? MSM will analyze the inaccuracies and provide more context but Trump is giving a pretty good speech right now. |
02-04-2020, 09:27 PM | #21294 |
Head Coach
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Colorado Springs
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The Pelosi paper rip becomes a massive meme within 24 hours.
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02-04-2020, 09:36 PM | #21295 | |
Head Coach
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Morgan Hill, CA
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Quote:
A pretty good speech if you’re living in an alternative universe where the only thing that matters is what The Great Leader tells us should matter. Facts be damned.
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Fan of SF Giants, 49ers, Sharks, Arsenal |
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02-04-2020, 10:05 PM | #21296 |
Head Coach
Join Date: Oct 2005
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Didn't watch all of it so catching up some.
Inviting Juan Guaido was a good move. I hope this means we will be doing more in Venezuela. Pelosi supposedly tearing up the SOTU speech at the end is fun. Both are trying to show each other up and it's entertaining. |
02-04-2020, 10:11 PM | #21297 |
Pro Rookie
Join Date: May 2002
Location: Prairie du Sac, WI
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02-04-2020, 10:28 PM | #21298 | |
Head Coach
Join Date: Oct 2005
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Quote:
So has there been any US support of an existing foreign government or opposition leader that you would support? Trying to understand what would be "good/justifiable" vs "bad" |
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02-04-2020, 10:44 PM | #21299 | |
Pro Rookie
Join Date: May 2002
Location: Prairie du Sac, WI
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Quote:
I’m not sure I get the question. I am opposed to meddling in the internal politics of other countries because quite frankly, we do not have a very good history in that regard and it has a direct correlation to troubled spots we deal with today. We supported the overthrow of Mossadegh in Iran in 1953, which gave us the Shah. Which in turn gave us the Revolution in 1979 and our current enmity with Iran. Our support of corrupt Cuban military governments gave us Castro. And the pattern repeats over and over in Latin America. Supporting the overthrow of Ghadaffi in Libya and Assad in Syria has done nothing but give more power to Islamists. We needed a do over in Egypt after we realized we didn’t really like the results of their free elections. Point being, I can’t think of any meddling we have been a part of in other country’s internal politics that has been a long term positive for us. And if we are going to bitch about Russia meddling with our elections, we really ought to have a leg to stand on. And we don’t. Not even close. |
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02-04-2020, 10:53 PM | #21300 | |
Hall Of Famer
Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: Behind Enemy Lines in Athens, GA
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Quote:
Which is why you haven't heard me bitch about that stuff. Every nation acts in their own best interest, not particularly more or less than we do historically.
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"I lit another cigarette. Unless I specifically inform you to the contrary, I am always lighting another cigarette." - from a novel by Martin Amis |
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