NFL 2021 Regular Season Thread

[Swaggs]

Originally Posted by Solecismic

I've been searching for the last time we had a moment like that - a quarterback definitely headed to the Hall of Fame playing what's almost certainly his last game at home - never played for any other team.

Eli might not get the call and Daniel Jones started most of 2019, including the last home game. Aikman and Young were injured and didn't get to finish the season. Marino wanted to play another season, there was some bitterness there and he was told he couldn't come back.

I would say John Elway in the AFC Championship game at Denver 23 seasons ago. I think people knew at the time.

We make fun of how bad the quarterbacking was tonight, but the moment was real - Roethlisberger was a great one and the fans appreciate that. I'm glad the NFL featured the game, glad to see that moment.

I was thinking about Phil Simms and Jim Kelly. I didn’t realize that Simms isn’t in the HoF. Kelly won his regular season finale and then they were upset at home in the playoffs, but I think he retired before Elway (and I don’t remember if he’d announced beforehand).

[albionmoonlight]

I've always thought Roethlisberger was a bit overrated. But he's a Super Bowl winning HOF QB who played his whole career for the team that drafted him. Like people here have noted, that's a pretty cool and rare thing.

[Lathum]

Originally Posted by albionmoonlight

I've always thought Roethlisberger was a bit overrated. But he's a Super Bowl winning HOF QB who played his whole career for the team that drafted him. Like people here have noted, that's a pretty cool and rare thing.

That 2004 first round was really something else. You have 3 HOF QBs who won a combined 4 Superbowls. Larry Fitz, Sean Taylor, Deangelo Hall, Vilma, Wilfork, and a few other really solid players.

[BYU 14]

Originally Posted by Lathum

That 2004 first round was really something else. You have 3 HOF QBs who won a combined 4 Superbowls. Larry Fitz, Sean Taylor, Deangelo Hall, Vilma, Wilfork, and a few other really solid players.

I was looking at that last night on the pre game graphic. Definitely a very solid top of the draft that year.

[spleen1015]

Roethlisberger will always be the NFL QB who had to resort to getting college girls drunk so he could take advantage of them.

[GrantDawg]

Originally Posted by spleen1015

Roethlisberger will always be the NFL QB who had to resort to getting college girls drunk so he could take advantage of them.

That we know of...

[molson]

The Buccs have not actually cut Antonio Brown yet.....

[Brian Swartz]

That stupid OT tie with the Lions could keep Pittsburgh out of the playoffs.

[JPhillips]

I love the Chiefs fans that are convinced the NFL is working to ensure the on-field success of the Bengals.

[henry296]

Originally Posted by Brian Swartz

That stupid OT tie with the Lions could keep Pittsburgh out of the playoffs.

I think they would still be out in a tie at 10-7. In a 3 way tie with Colts/Chargers or Vegas, the Colts and Chargers have a better conference record and Vegas wins a head-to-head tiebreaker.

[Solecismic]

Originally Posted by henry296

I think they would still be out in a tie at 10-7. In a 3 way tie with Colts/Chargers or Vegas, the Colts and Chargers have a better conference record and Vegas wins a head-to-head tiebreaker.

Just taking a very quick look (I haven't updated my app for this for the 17-game schedule), I think they'd need a loss from Buffalo and a win from New England or a loss from Indianapolis.

[MIJB#19]

Originally Posted by henry296

I think they would still be out in a tie at 10-7. In a 3 way tie with Colts/Chargers or Vegas, the Colts and Chargers have a better conference record and Vegas wins a head-to-head tiebreaker.

Almost.
They'd lose to Cincinnati on hth and then for the wild cards beat Buffalo on conference record in 3way or 4way or hth if it's just a 2way tie, but lose to New England, Indianapolis and Las Vegas on conference record, while a 2way with just LA Chargers or Las Vegas would go against Pittsburgh on hth.

[MIJB#19]

Originally Posted by Solecismic

Just taking a very quick look (I haven't updated my app for this for the 17-game schedule), I think they'd need a loss from Buffalo and a win from New England or a loss from Indianapolis.

Yeah, this. With the third option then being the much discussed LA Chargers - Las Vegas tie.

[miami_fan]

Originally Posted by molson

The Buccs have not actually cut Antonio Brown yet.....

Based on some of the things on the internet, that seemed to be coming from the Brown side of the story, this become a bit more relevant every day. I don't think he will ever play for them again but hey Arians has sold himself out before.

[GrantDawg]

Originally Posted by miami_fan

Based on some of the things on the internet, that seemed to be coming from the Brown side of the story, this become a bit more relevant every day. I don't think he will ever play for them again but hey Arians has sold himself out before.

What it sounds like has happened is:
Brown and Arians got into a fight on the sidelines that resulted in Brown rage-quiting.
Brown's agent calls the team to claim his player was injured. Brown never told anyone on the Bucs about the injury but an injury claim stopped the team for being able to cut him.
Brown's agents find surgeon to back him up to save his salary.
He will never play for Tampa Bay again, but they aren't getting rid of him without paying him off.

[albionmoonlight]

Someone just filed an insanely hilarious lawsuit against the Giants and Jets for calling themselves New York teams when they really play in New Jersey. He asks for $6 billion in damages and for the court to order the teams to move to New York by 2025.

https://www.schwimmerlegal.com/wp-co...Y-DOCUMENT.pdf

[flere-imsaho]

I mean, he's not wrong....

[QuikSand]

Learn from Trump. File for $6 billion. Threaten to take the whole thing down. Settle quietly for a season ticket. Win Bigly. Tell everyone you grabbed 'em by the pussy.

[NobodyHere]

Originally Posted by QuikSand

Learn from Trump. File for $6 billion. Threaten to take the whole thing down. Take the thing to court and get awarded $3. Tell everyone you grabbed 'em by the pussy.

Fixed

[sterlingice]

Originally Posted by albionmoonlight

Someone just filed an insanely hilarious lawsuit against the Giants and Jets for calling themselves New York teams when they really play in New Jersey. He asks for $6 billion in damages and for the court to order the teams to move to New York by 2025.

https://www.schwimmerlegal.com/wp-co...Y-DOCUMENT.pdf

This is fun:

In a 1986 ruling by a New Jersey District Court judge, the court stated that, “Plaintiff, the New York Football Giants, Inc., owns and operates the New York Giants, a major league professional football team which plays all of its home games in New Jersey yet eschews a New Jersey identification as resolutely as a vampire eschews the cross.”

Many NFL fans would not attend live games of the Giants or Jets if they were warned in advance that they play in the State of New Jersey.

I agree with them, in a way. And before you all jump to
"The government doesn't control the sky. What if you lived in a balloon?" "That's it!"
"Did you hear that mom? She's just as dumb as me."

They're not going to win the case, but they do have a point:

The NFL engages in this practice with other popular franchises, including the Dallas, Cowboys (who play in Arlington, TX), the Washington Football Team (who play in Landover, MD), and the San Francisco 49ers (who play in Santa Clara, CA)

The “Arlington Cowboys” would not be the most valuable franchise in the NFL at $6.5 billion without the “Dallas” name and brand.

The “Maryland Football Team” or “Landover Football Team” would not be the 5th most valuable franchise at $4.2 billion without the “Washington D.C.” name and brand.

The “Santa Clara 49ers” would not be the 6th most valuable franchise in the NFL at $4.175 billion without the “San Francisco” name and brand.

And the “New Jersey Giants/Jets” or “East Rutherford Giants/Jets” would not have their current revenue and valuation if they were properly named and branded.

They cite Anaheim sticking it to the Angels for changing their name.

As a taxpayer, I get that by me living out in the suburbs, I'm taking advantage of the urban core. People move out of the main city or county, property values go down, schools get gutted, transit taxes go away, etc. And the disingenuous among us will even say things like "well, if city X (Detroit, Chicago, whatever) doesn't like it, then fix the core". By virtue of its density, cities are going to have some plusses and minuses that smaller towns just don't.

If suddenly everything inside the city limits of Houston were blown up, my suburb would be a podunk little town with little industry. People would flee as most people work in Houston or surrounding suburbs that are also reliant on Houston. Property values would fall through the floor, businesses and schools would be decimated, but, hey, less traffic. I'm not so naive to realize we derive a ton of value from being near Houston. And honestly I feel a little guilty about that. You could say "that's just how it is" and it's technically true. But it's also a very incomplete picture.

Businesses also get to take advantage of these arbitrary lines. They can pit city and suburbs against each other to drive down their tax bill, which screws all of the potential suitors by creating artificial competition. So, to bring this back around - I'd be fine if teams had to take up the name of the city they resided in rather than the metro they are nearest. Enjoy being the Cobb Braves or the Arlington Rangers. You want the rights to be called the Dallas Cowboys, you locate in Dallas. You took the tax breaks from the best offer by pitting suburbs against one another to screw all of us, so live with those consequences. Or heck, maybe Dallas can license the city name for you to make a profit off it, for a hefty fee, of course.

SI

[Solecismic]

The Anaheim lawsuit was based on an agreement with the city of Anaheim paying to renovate the ballpark in return for the team name change. When the team was sold, the new owner reneged. The city of Anaheim sued and lost.

The implication is that it's a mutual benefit. Teams benefit from identification with a region and regions benefit from identification with a team.

Quick question: what is the largest city in Ohio?

The topic of taxation and redistribution of tax revenue is a difficult one. Politics has become so unpleasant in recent years that it seems a waste of time to even enter a discussion. Just a feeling that no matter what you do or what you hope for, people will find a reason to hate you for it.

[sterlingice]

Originally Posted by Solecismic

The Anaheim lawsuit was based on an agreement with the city of Anaheim paying to renovate the ballpark in return for the team name change. When the team was sold, the new owner reneged. The city of Anaheim sued and lost.

The implication is that it's a mutual benefit. Teams benefit from identification with a region and regions benefit from identification with a team.

Quick question: what is the largest city in Ohio?

The topic of taxation and redistribution of tax revenue is a difficult one. Politics has become so unpleasant in recent years that it seems a waste of time to even enter a discussion. Just a feeling that no matter what you do or what you hope for, people will find a reason to hate you for it.

By metro area, I'm almost certain it's Cleveland. However, I'm guessing that's not the question and since you're asking it in this context, it's going to be something like Columbus, right, which has fewer suburbs and more "city" population. It's kindof like how Houston is supposedly "only" 2M people or New York is "only" 8M when their metros are 6M and 20(?)M, respectively, and that's much more indicative of the size of city each is.

SI

[sterlingice]

Originally Posted by sterlingice

By metro area, I'm almost certain it's Cleveland. However, I'm guessing that's not the question and since you're asking it in this context, it's going to be something like Columbus, right, which has fewer suburbs and more "city" population. It's kindof like how Houston is supposedly "only" 2M people or New York is "only" 8M when their metros are 6M and 20(?)M, respectively, and that's much more indicative of the size of city each is.

SI

And I'm wrong on the MSA guess

Metropolitan statistical area - Wikipedia
2.26M Cincy (30)
2.14M Columbus (32)
2.09M Cleveland (34)

They're essentially all the same size, tho Columbus is growing faster than the other two.

List of United States cities by population - Wikipedia
However, if you're going by "city" size
905K Columbus
372K Cleveland
309K Cincinnati

And, I guess to illustrate my point - which is more accurate?

372K Cleveland is closer to 350K Honolulu and 346K Anaheim. Or Cincy and Columbus's comparable metro areas? I would argue the latter.

Is 905K Columbus bigger than 873K San Fransisco, 737K Seattle, and 675K Boston? Or is its 2.1M metro area mean the city is basically half the size of San Fran's 4.7M, Seattle's 4.0M, and Boston's 4.9M? Again, I would argue the latter.

SI

[larrymcg421]

Originally Posted by sterlingice

By metro area, I'm almost certain it's Cleveland. However, I'm guessing that's not the question and since you're asking it in this context, it's going to be something like Columbus, right, which has fewer suburbs and more "city" population. It's kindof like how Houston is supposedly "only" 2M people or New York is "only" 8M when their metros are 6M and 20(?)M, respectively, and that's much more indicative of the size of city each is.

SI

Yeah, Atlanta only has a population of 500,000, but its metro area is almost 7 million.

[Solecismic]

What is a city? Now explain Jacksonville, Florida or Nashville, Tennessee.

And I wonder if Dallas owes some of its fame to the historic Greek site of Delos - my understanding is that ancient Greek cheerleaders were a sight to behold.

[Solecismic]

Originally Posted by larrymcg421

Yeah, Atlanta only has a population of 500,000, but its metro area is almost 7 million.

You can go to Google Maps, turn off some of the border stuff, and try and figure out what is what based on building type and density or general look and feel.

The census has done a decent job trying to decipher some of it, but the bottom line is that states and cities around the country have developed boundaries and structures differently. Same is true around the world.

We can only try and make comparisons fairly. But even those who do it full-time and have a lifetime of understanding sometimes have to make decisions that work in some places and don't work in others. Metropolitan areas are particularly inconsistent because sprawl leads to new centers and new identifications. Anaheim is a good example. It is not easy even to get from Anaheim to Los Angeles, and they are 25 miles apart.

A sports team is an important part of perception. But what is the value of marketing your city? Economists suggest that it's just window-dressing and when a city uses hundreds of millions of dollars to build a fancy new stadium with lots of luxury boxes to market to businesses, it's a poor investment.

However, the investment in high-density shopping districts, which used to be a great investment for a city, is becoming a poor one as well since people shop more online.

I think people who file lawsuits like this should have to pay for the defense if they lose. And then they should have to pay the court system for its time.

[Bobble]

Originally Posted by Solecismic

What is a city? Now explain Jacksonville, Florida or Nashville, Tennessee.

And I wonder if Dallas owes some of its fame to the historic Greek site of Delos - my understanding is that ancient Greek cheerleaders were a sight to behold.

The ancient Greek texts are notoriously unreliable on the subject of cheerleading...

[Solecismic]

Originally Posted by Bobble

The ancient Greek texts are notoriously unreliable on the subject of cheerleading...

I suppose. The Egyptians were far more supportive, thinking about the name they gave their sun god.

[Ksyrup]

They must be pissed their WR got drafted by the Lions.

[Honolulu_Blue]

It’s been 30 years since the Lions last (and only) playoff win in the Super Bowl era.

I was 17. They haven’t won a playoff game during my entire adult life.

[JPhillips]

It's been 31 years for the Bengals.

[molson]

I love this Bengals team. I hope my Patriots play the Bills again in the first round.

[Brian Swartz]

The Bengals at least can say they went to a Super Bowl. Who wants to bust out the Ickey Shuffle?

[JPhillips]

They are fun, especially now that Taylor seems to understand that the best part of the team is the passing game. I don't expect them to throw for 400 every game, but they are a threat to every time they take the field.

And they have two more seasons before they have to start paying the offensive stars!

[Thomkal]

Some good news for my beloved Cards-they have activated J.J. Watt off Injured Reserve-I really didn't think he was going to play again this season

[JPhillips]

The Broncos are one QB away from challenging the Chiefs. Too bad there's no good way for them to get a QB.

[QuikSand]

That's a really interesting franchise situation there. Doesn't even feel like they need a really good quarterback, but merely a league average one would do the trick. I wonder if Minnesota is feeling revolutionary... Kirk Cousins is the caliber that I sorta have in mind, and if he were available I think Denver would have to consider that. Jimmy Garoppolo, perhaps? Baker Mayfield? Daniel Jones? Marcus Mariota?

They have so many ingredients seemingly in place to be fairly good, maybe very good, especially if Surtain develops into the CB1 they envision.

[JPhillips]

They certainly need to try something. They have the defense and the offensive skill positions look pretty good if they have the right guy throwing the ball.

[Ksyrup]

Bridgewater was a league average QB this year, by rating. But maybe he's never going to be a 17 game a year guy. And I wasn't all that impressed with him against better teams. He looked so good not losing games against the Jets, Giants and Jags to start the year. But this offense is - and has been - less than the sum of its parts for several years.

I would like to see them fire Fangio. I assume they would be in the market for Wilson or Rodgers if either become available.

[bhlloy]

Yeah, this. Bridgewater is about the definition of the league average QB in any statistical category you want to pick and they were 7-7 with him in. Definitely injury issues, but I'm not seeing some team who is a SB contender if the QB didn't stink.

[JPhillips]

I don't see enough Denver games to have a good opinion of what problems they have on offense outside of QB, but skill positions of Sutton, Jeudy, Fant, and Williams should be able to move the ball.

[RainMaker]

Bridgewater is a guy who is fine if your team is just loaded on defense. I wish the 2018 Chicago Bears had a QB like him instead of Trubisky. But I think it's really tough to win in the league if he is your QB1. Just such little margin for error in the other areas.

[thesloppy]

7 years after getting drafted Teddy Bridgewater has never thrown for more than 18 TDs in a season. I don't think you can win with that these days.

[cuervo72]

SCORIGAMI!!!

[Ksyrup]

...And Fangio fired. Good.

Next up is Elway.

[thesloppy]

Reverse flea flicker TD from undrafted former pro-lacrosse player in the Lions game.

[Ksyrup]

Riveting first halves in the early games...

[Ksyrup]

The best story of the season waited until the last week. A Jax sponsor sued the team to try to get itself removed as a sponsor because fans were organizing a "clown out" and they didn't want the negative publicity of being associated with the team.

[QuikSand]

...meanwhile the Clown-out team is beating the payoff-bound Colts and their MVP candidate.

[QuikSand]

A sign of difficult times for the Giants’ offense as they run a QB sneak from their own 4-yard line on 3rd & 9 from this formation. pic.twitter.com/zFHSHsJikA

— Field Yates (@FieldYates) January 9, 2022