FBI Opens Investigation into Shooting of Michael Brown

[illinifan999]

Originally Posted by lighthousekeeper

I take back my previous statement - this is now the most insane thing I've ever heard.

Cause of Death: Sloppy Doctors - TIME

[lighthousekeeper]

Originally Posted by cuervo72

Why are people always anticipating the worst?

I think in general we evolved to be this way.

[cuervo72]

Originally Posted by lighthousekeeper

I take back my previous statement - this is now the most insane thing I've ever heard.

Oh, it's a lot more sane than you might think. Keep in mind that number of around 15,000 homicide deaths per year.

Researchers: Medical errors now third leading cause of death in United States - The Washington Post

[murrayyyyy]

Originally Posted by digamma

I think this is where the disconnect is.

I don't fear cops at all. I have absolutely zero fear that when I get pulled over or questioned on the street or whatever that anything will happen to me. I'm fortunate, lucky, privileged, you choose the word. For many, and unfortunately the many are disproportionately minorities or poor, that isn't the case and there is real and justifiable fear.

So I assume you've never been pulled over for a DWB? Happened to me all the time when in HS when Memphis was #1 in murders and has happened to me in Vegas 8 years ago for doing 41 in a 35 (I had a hoody on and the cop walked up with his hand on his gun until he got to the window and saw I was white). I've seen enough shit to where I know keep your hands on the wheel. I still think it's the only thing that kept that gun out of my face that day. Once he saw I was white he told me that it was 35 on that road and walked off. Never asked for proof of insurance or my license. Just a courtesy call I guess for going to work at 5 AM in the morning in the wrong neighborhood.

I'll never trust a cop because of the shit I got/saw 30 years ago by going to a black high school to the shit I've seen since then on TV or the internet.

[illinifan999]

Originally Posted by lighthousekeeper

I don't take any prescription medicine, and even if I did, I'm the paranoid type (see above) who would triple check things, so I still think it's insane that you think a doctor's handwriting is more likely to kill me than a cop.

So you're the paranoid type who wouldn't resist a cop while holding a firearm right? You wouldn't point a gun, or advance aggressively towards a cop while holding a bladed weapon? You wouldn't fight a cop? You wouldn't ignore commands while hiding your hands/reaching for something?

Then I'd say you're more than likely going to be just fine.

[molson]

Originally Posted by illinifan999

Cause of Death: Sloppy Doctors - TIME

Different topic, kind of, but it's interesting to me how little we care in a society about the 200,000 - 400,000 people killed by medical malpractice every year. I think both police officers and doctors/nurses who kill through negligence, recklessness, or intent, should be held accountable, but not too many people see medical malpractice that way.

And I think that's where I have some disconnect with people on this stuff, I see the majority of unjustified officer shootings as falling in that negligence - recklessness range. Punishable, for sure, including criminally, in some cases, but I see it as something different than "capital punishment", "executions", etc. I mean, think about your job and what happens when you fuck up, and compare it an officer or doctor's fuck-up. Those are harder jobs, the stakes are higher, and it doesn't take much fear/incompetence/recklessness/bad training to push things over the edge into tragedy. The difference with police is that a officer fucking up in Minnesota can make a Washington officer's job more difficult and dangerous. Keeping that cycle of officer and suspect fear from escalating is one of the most important things in policing, IMO. And it's not like that's some big mystery - law enforcement agencies WANT officers like that. It's not some new idea that officers should de-escalate situations or keep them from escalating in the first place. It's not always easy to find people who are actually able to do that 100% of the time in the conditions most U.S. police officers work under - though most pull it off, or at least, their fuck-ups are more of the being rude variety, which can also get them in trouble with their supervisors.

And shit, about the fear thing, I'm nervous when I have contact with officers, and I've trained them. Someone having power over you is scary. I can't imagine how scared I'd be if I actually had committed a crime. And feeling like you're being wronged (pulled over illegally, even if you're mistaken about that, or not understanding when an officer has the authority to make a Terry stop), makes your adrenaline just go crazy. We've all felt that in small doses with the TSA.

[larrymcg421]

It's not like African-Americans woke up one day and with no reason at all just decided to be afraid of police officers. There is a very real, distinct history with their experience that has led to this current fear.

[Dutch]

Originally Posted by murrayyyyy

Once he saw I was white he told me that it was 35 on that road and walked off. Never asked for proof of insurance or my license. Just a courtesy call I guess for going to work at 5 AM in the morning in the wrong neighborhood.

Congratulations, you just profiled cops.

I was pulled over a couple of weeks ago and once the cop saw I was white, he let me go. Was it because of white privilege?

I was in a black Dodge Charger (rental car) and the cop explained a black Dodge Charger had just been stolen by a black guy. Once he saw I was white, he walked away. He stated (paraphrased), "Nope, looking for a black guy." Which many would rush to judgement as a racist thing to say as well. Despite the fact that he was looking for a black guy who stole a car! Point being. There is always more to the story. We shouldn't rush to judgement so quickly else we play the exact game we want to stop.

[CU Tiger]

Originally Posted by cuervo72

This I think speaks to the disconnect between gun owners and non-gun owners. How does one arrive at a mindset where they are constantly in fear of their surroundings? I can't fathom living life like this. I can't live life in a continued state of alarm. Especially given that I have advantages that others don't (gender, race, income). Why are people always anticipating the worst?

Nature vs Nurture my friend.

Look by all accounts I am in the safe group.
White(ish), Hetero-Sexual, Upper Middle Class, Homeowner, Parent, etc etc etc.

I'm also the kid that grew up in the projects and then a boarding reform school. Then juvi. I was in more fist fights before I was 15 than most of my current peers will ever see in their lives. So even if I live in a half million dollar house on acreage or drive a nice car or wear decent clothes. Every restaurant I eat at, I always sit where I can see the door. I position my back towards a corner. Yes I will ask to sit elsewhere if that's not possible. I choose my parking spots carefully. I am always self protected. I dont live in fear, frankly I fear very little, but I do prepare to need to defend myself at all times. I analyze everyone I meet and determine their threat potential. I do this sub-consciously.

Just like you can not fathom living life the way I do, and possibly even feel sorry for me; likewise I can't imagine living as irresponsibly and recklessly as I judge you to based on your comments here. I'm not angry and I hope that doesn't come off as condescending, it's just my perception of the different realities we all live in. I don't think many people take time to analyze the history and experiences that everyone you meet brings to the encounter and how those experiences jade their viewpoint. They should. We all should.

I think the main take away, is I do not anticipate the worst but I do not blindly assume it wont happen either.

Do you have health insurance? Car Insurance? What about Short or long term disability? Why are you anticipating you are going to get sick? Same thing, you dont. You make reasonable preparations in case the unfortunate happens. So do I.

[cuervo72]

Originally Posted by larrymcg421

It's not like African-Americans woke up one day and with no reason at all just decided to be afraid of police officers. There is a very real, distinct history with their experience that has led to this current fear.

Yep.

Slave patrol - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

("State militias as patrollers" - where have I heard that militia term before???)

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by Ben E Lou

I didn't say it was justification. I said it was why. (There's a difference.)

Okay, that's fair.

Neither case is "right," per se. But to ignore the fact that it may well inform the split-second decision-making process is terribly naive. *shurg*

Then if the process is indeed that bad, bluntly put: good riddance.

(And you know I'd say the same thing in a heartbeat about some of the good ol' boys I was raised around -- a few of whom ain't ever really developed past that lack of decisionmaking -- so I have no real reluctance to be that blunt)

[CU Tiger]

Now that said there is also an art to controlling from the bottom.

I was pulled over for speeding just the other day. Before the cop got out of his car both my driver side windows were down, my left hand was on the door sill and open and my right wrist was across the wheel with my palm open. I was calm and casual but also positioned so the officer could see I wasnt armed.

When he asked if I knew why he stopped me I said no. When he asked for license and registration I told him my wallet was in my right rear pocket and my registration was in my glove box. I informed him I was a permitted concealed weapon carrier and had weapons in the vehicle. I asked if he wanted me to get out and let him get my resgistration or if he was comfortable with me getting it. I said this with confidence that I had broken no law (beyond the speeding) and calmness to let him know he need not fear me.

The stop went off without incident and he left me in the vehicle with multiple weapons while he ran my license.

That situation could have gone differently if I acted differently. I had no faith in the officer to remain composed if he got nervous so I made sure to put him at ease

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by CU Tiger

I analyze everyone I meet and determine their threat potential. I do this sub-consciously.

Hell, that's just common sense. I do the same, and have for 30+ years, with a virtually completely different set of circumstances to inform it.

And that was where I intended to hit "submit reply" ... until a couple of thoughts hit me.

1) We've all heard how "common sense ain't so common any more" ... and I thought about how few people I trust to sit facing the door instead of me.

2) If it is indeed somewhat rare, then no wonder we've ended up with so many victims looking for a place to happen.

[molson]

Originally Posted by larrymcg421

It's not like African-Americans woke up one day and with no reason at all just decided to be afraid of police officers. There is a very real, distinct history with their experience that has led to this current fear.

When one officer pulls over one criminal suspect, the entire country's history of racism, violent crime, officer abuses, officers being killed, family history, anecdotal stories, etc, hovers over everything, and influences the feelings of the people involved in that moment. We all vary in how well we can get past that and see each other as individuals, and we all vary in which of those two people in that meeting we relate to more.

I don't think anybody has to confront their feelings about race and race-based fear more than police officers. But the reality is, I'd bet that a good chunk of Americans would be more scared of a black person walking down the street than a white person. That doesn't automatically make them a bad person, because fear isn't really a choice. And I'm sure group that includes many people who in their heads, sincerely believe that they have no prejudices. Most of us don't have to because those things in a practical sense because doesn't really come up in our lives.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by molson

But the reality is, I'd bet that a good chunk of Americans would be more scared of a black person walking down the street than a white person.

Location & situation both come to mind instantly there though.

[molson]

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

Location & situation both come to mind instantly there though.

True, there's lots of factors besides rate can contribute to fears on both sides of police/suspect interactions. And the law recognizes this. A judge is more likely to deny suppression motions for drugs found in a Terry stop and/or frisk when the encounter takes place in a bad neighborhood, at night, when there's no clear reason for the suspect to be there, when there's a known criminal history, gang indicators, etc. And of course in the U.S., those factors are going to disproportionately impact minorities and poor people, even if we had race-neutral fearless police robots.

[nol]

Originally Posted by molson

But the reality is, I'd bet that a good chunk of Americans would be more scared of a black person walking down the street than a white person. That doesn't automatically make them a bad person, because fear isn't really a choice. And I'm sure group that includes many people who in their heads, sincerely believe that they have no prejudices. Most of us don't have to because those things in a practical sense because doesn't really come up in our lives.

The reality is, the average American citizen does not have a nearly undefeated record when it comes to shooting and killing a black person and getting off scot-free by citing that fear as justification. Even George Zimmerman had some superficial cut to bolster his claim of self-defense.

[AENeuman]

Originally Posted by Dutch

Well, again, I know for a fact that LEO get to deal with the criminal element far greater than you or I do. We have the advantage of avoiding it (mostly) whereas they are propelled into it, pretty much daily. Does that fit into the equation somewhere?

Think you are missing the point. They are not treating the "criminal element" equally. That's the issue. More whites kill cops, far less whites are murdered by cops. Far more black men will be the victim of lethal force. That is the equation that needs to be fixed.

If a cop feels more threaten by a person for no other reason than their skin color, that equation also should stop. Or, I guess another way of saying it- many white police officers seem scared to death of black males.

[molson]

Originally Posted by nol

The reality is, the average American citizen does not have a nearly undefeated record when it comes to shooting and killing a black person and getting off scot-free by citing that fear as justification. Even George Zimmerman had some superficial cut to bolster his claim of self-defense.

Fear isn't a "justification" for killing someone, but is often part of the reason things go badly.

[AENeuman]

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

I don't empathize, much less sympathize, with wastes of oxygen & DNA like that.

Never have, highly unlikely I ever will. And I kind of vaguely pity people who waste either on them frankly.

We are all wastes of oxygen and DNA. In our highly competive, resilient and intelligent world, the living will continue to thrive regardless of the loss of any individual. The inevitable nature of death, does/should preclude most forms of empathy.

However, when that death is tragic, there is room for empathy for the sudden loss of the living who loved the waste of oxygen and DNA. Furthermore, for the living who want to avoid a tragedy of their own wastes of oxygen and DNA, we can emphasize with their angst (in very much the same way we emphasized with worried wastes of oxygen and DNA on planes after 9/11).

You are no better than any other oxygen and DNA waster. In the end, we are forgotten by everyone, except those that loved and now miss us.

[Dutch]

Originally Posted by AENeuman

Think you are missing the point. They are not treating the "criminal element" equally. That's the issue. More whites kill cops, far less whites are murdered by cops. Far more black men will be the victim of lethal force. That is the equation that needs to be fixed.

If a cop feels more threaten by a person for no other reason than their skin color, that equation also should stop. Or, I guess another way of saying it- many white police officers seem scared to death of black males.

Out of curiosity, regardless of the accuracy of this statement, how do you propose we get to the point where white cops aren't scared of black males?

[cuervo72]

Integration. Education. Empathy. Stop teaching that they are a threat, that they are other, that they are lesser.

[molson]

Originally Posted by cuervo72

Integration. Education. Empathy. Stop teaching that they are a threat, that they are other, that they are lesser.

Officers aren't taught that black people are bad (or that suspects generally are bad, or lesser). But if that's what you think is happening I understand why you think this issue is so simple.

[nol]

Not lionize cops and treat them as though they are working in a war zone and need military-style training/equipment when in actuality they are much more likely to make it home safely to their families after a day's work than a logger, miner, construction worker, warehouse employee, electrician, and so many other types of employees.

Originally Posted by molson

Officers aren't taught that black people are bad (or that suspects generally are bad). But if that's what you think is happening I understand why you think this issue is so simple.

But the reality is, I'd bet that a good chunk of Americans would be more scared of a black person walking down the street than a white person. That doesn't automatically make them a bad person, because fear isn't really a choice. And I'm sure group that includes many people who in their heads, sincerely believe that they have no prejudices. Most of us don't have to because those things in a practical sense because doesn't really come up in our lives.

Uh, the second quote says that just about everyone is taught that black people are bad. Are you trying to say that police officers are recruited from the nonexistent sector of society that isn't?

[cuervo72]

Originally Posted by molson

Officers aren't taught that black people are bad (or that suspects generally are bad, or lesser). But if that's what you think is happening I understand why you think this issue is so simple.

I'm not talking about officers.

[Dutch]

Originally Posted by cuervo72

Integration. Education. Empathy. Stop teaching that they are a threat, that they are other, that they are lesser.

Does the same hold true in reverse? Should black males do better at integrating, education, empathy, and halting the teaching that white cops are a threat?

Is this a two-way street or just on white cops? Because I suspect, if it's just on white cops because of privilege, or whatever, I don't see much changing or not as fast of a change as I think you would like. Not a gotcha question, just wondering how this works in your mind.

[cuervo72]

Dutch, see above.


Anecdote. I was visiting the in-laws last week at a bit of a resort residence. Lots of money, lots of old people. There was a social event at the clubhouse, which has a pool in back (we'd been swimming there earlier). My FIL says to me, "well would you look at that over there." There was a little black boy, maybe 4 or so, strolling around happy as could be in his little floaties. Only black person in the place. Hell, the only black person I saw the entire trip.

The boy didn't look like he was having any issues integrating.

[Dutch]

Have you told your FIL how you feel? Meaning: Are you helping him or do you expect him to take a class?

[Dutch]

And you are correct, this isnt a child issue. I hope you didn't think it was!

[AENeuman]

Originally Posted by Dutch

Out of curiosity, regardless of the accuracy of this statement, how do you propose we get to the point where white cops aren't scared of black males?

I really hope that question becomes part of, hopefully, a new dialogue.

I think stress/trauma and PTSD plays much larger role than we recognize today, for all sides.

A big UCSF study just said the single biggest factor in the sucess of child in school is the amount of stress they had pre K. Stress like safety, food, stability, loss, security. The most common symptom of living in stress? Failure to delay gratification and lack of self control.

On the other side a very good friend here is a firefighter who had/has significant job related PTSD. The response from colleagues, supervisors and union ranged from apathy to encouragement to self medicate to out right shaming. I'm not saying white cops have been traumatized by black criminals. I'm saying the amount of stress, fear of safety, concern for ones own family, seeing and dealing with trauma, etc, all sticks in the brain. And without proper processing, fear, bias, rage, mind blindness and lack of self control can be triggered.

[Edward64]

Originally Posted by cuervo72

This I think speaks to the disconnect between gun owners and non-gun owners. How does one arrive at a mindset where they are constantly in fear of their surroundings? I can't fathom living life like this. I can't live life in a continued state of alarm. Especially given that I have advantages that others don't (gender, race, income). Why are people always anticipating the worst?

I'm a gun owner and I think the majority of gun owners do not have that mindset. There's no constantly in fear of surroundings.

[RainMaker]

Originally Posted by nol

Not lionize cops and treat them as though they are working in a war zone and need military-style training/equipment when in actuality they are much more likely to make it home safely to their families after a day's work than a logger, miner, construction worker, warehouse employee, electrician, and so many other types of employees.

I agree with this. Not sure when we decided to turn cops into the biggest bunch of pussies on the planet.

[RainMaker]

Where's the NRA? Legal gun owner killed by the government for legally carrying a weapon. They are usually all over these stories. Can't figure out what's different about this one. Hmmmmm.

[Edward64]

Originally Posted by AENeuman

You are no better than any other oxygen and DNA waster. In the end, we are forgotten by everyone, except those that loved and now miss us.

In general and philosophically, I would agree. However, in reality, there are extremes and therefore I disagree. There are people that are much worse than others, there are some that are truly "oxygen and DNA wasters".

[cuervo72]

Originally Posted by Dutch

Have you told your FIL how you feel? Meaning: Are you helping him or do you expect him to take a class?

Honestly, he's in his late 70s. After he said it, he paused, and said, basically, the equivalent of "not that there's anything wrong with that." So he knows, but at the same time it's ingrained. The instinct is that hey, something doesn't belong here. He grew up in FL and GA in the 40s. He'll make jokes about dialect, he'll use the term "jigaboo." Which I suppose is better than his MIL, who we were visiting once; our then-young nephews were watching Keenan and Kel on Nickelodeon. She caught a glimpse of it and asked "what is this nigger tv??" (Of course, she was originally from Maine...)

So I'm not going to rock the boat. I bite my tongue, tolerate Fox News, tolerate comments about Obama or gays or whatever. But you can be darned sure that I more freely express my concerns with my kids. And with my generation (I don't have to be a house guest with any of you guys. )

[NobodyHere]

Uh oh,

There may be some policemen down in Dallas

[NobodyHere]

2 cops are said to be shot.

[JonInMiddleGA]

best coverage I've found online thus far -- one that has avoided any speculation but is slowly adding pics & info -- has been the local paper Twitter (their website has crashed)

Dallas Morning News (@dallasnews) | Twitter

[NobodyHere]

They're saying 2 shooters with one being neutralized. 3-6 officers injured.

[RainMaker]

That Fox News video looks bad. I'd be shocked if that one cop survived.

[JonInMiddleGA]

If someone here has seen the amateur footage (39 secs OR 40 secs worth) where you hear the string of shots, I have a question:

do the two rapid bursts of shots (6-8 each I guess) sound identical to you?

It's single heavy shot, then semi-auto fire of smaller caliber, then ... something else ... then more semi-auto. It's the similarity of the semi-auto sequences that don't sound right to me.

Yes, my paranoia about whether footage is real or doctored is fairly high, especially with amateur sources on Twitter.

But if someone else has seen the clip I'm talking about (the one shot kinda facing the bldg with the green lighting around it, BOA bldg maybe?), I'm curious to know what you thought of it.

[Groundhog]

I've seen enough murder clips the past couple of days... Don't know what is real news and what is noise, but just saw a tweet that 4 dead, 3 critical, and another couple injured.

[Groundhog]

Just walked past a TV here at work and saw an amateur video. It's like the Wild West out there. Holy hell.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by Groundhog

I've seen enough murder clips the past couple of days... Don't know what is real news and what is noise, but just saw a tweet that 4 dead, 3 critical, and another couple injured.

ftr/fwiw, the video was in the massive flow on Twitter while I tried to find straight news minus conjecture. I definitely wasn't looking for it but I paused long enough in the feed that it autoplayed. And the sound just caught my ear funny {shrug}

[Julio Riddols]

I feel like when it comes to cops/criminals, the criminals are the bigger variable, so the cop should be the one that adjusts his line of thinking to accommodate that variable. You can't control how someone is brought up, what they know and see all their life, what their parents and elders tell them about police, what their past experiences with police have been. The cop should take it upon themselves to find a way to address every non violent situation on the surface the same way (politely) regardless of the color of someones skin or the neighborhood they come from. People like me who have a fear of the police because of bad experiences in the past are understandably nervous when they see or get pulled over by a cop, even when they haven't done anything wrong.

I'll give specific instances, with the caveat that I am generally very naive about the less obvious points of the law, often anxious around authority figures, and also a generally fidgety person. I don't consider the potential interpretation of every physical action I make when I get pulled over. This is because I don't ever anticipate being pulled over. My family never put much emphasis on how to deal with police because we so seldom have involvement with them I guess.

1: I was 18, finally got a car of my own, enjoying one of my first days as a licensed driver. Going to get ice cream with friends. Got pulled over for running a yellow light (one of those slam on the brakes or cruise through the intersection coin flips where the light went yellow about 100 feet before I hit the intersection) by a hot shot undercover cop who seemed like he was trying to show off for a trainee or something. Despite my telling him I was nervous because I had never been pulled over, he acted like I was pissing him off the whole time, acted very threatening and didn't try to diffuse the tension at all. Made me walk a line, touch my nose and all that embarrassing stuff, and just generally harassed me for a good while before giving me a ticket and letting me go. Thankfully he left my friends alone. Not sure why.

2: Pulled over for expired tags on a car I had borrowed from a friend to get to and from work - I had no idea about the tags being expired (I know thats my fault as much as anyones) and I let the officer know that I had borrowed the car from a friend right up front, told him who I borrowed it from, gave them her phone number to confirm it, etc. They still talked to me like I was some kind of career criminal, just so disdainfully.. It left me feeling as though I was lucky I didn't do anything that was actually bad.

3: Pulled over for a drivers side headlight being out, and the headlight went out as I was driving, so I wasn't really in a position to do anything about it. I was nearing work at the time, so I pulled into the parking lot at work without knowing I was being pulled over and got out of my car as normal only to hear the cop yelling at me to get back in the car. He didn't use his sirens to pull me over and I didn't even know he was there til he started yelling, but I had apparently passed him at an intersecting road about 300 yards from work. He never calmed down even after the misunderstanding was addressed, just basically threatened me and held me up for a good half hour over a malfunctioning headlight (There was a bad wire causing the light to occasionally shut off if you hit a bump just right and I had never noticed because there were street lights all the way to and from work) Got a ticket for that one too.

4: Border Patrol station in Arizona - My 2 friends and I are heading back to Phoenix after visiting family in Yuma for the weekend, and there is a place in Yuma called Mr G's. Some of the best burritos ever made come from there. We were bringing about 20 of them back with us in the back of the truck, in a duffel bag to protect them from any potential inclement weather since it was calling for rain that day. They get all weird when we drive through, so they have the dogs sniff the vehicle. Now, my friends and I had smoked weed on occasion in the past, but during this trip we hadn't smoked for at least a couple months and had absolutely nothing on us. Well, they tell us to pull over because the dog is going nuts over the bag in the back, with the burritos in it. The cops tear the fuck out of the upholstery of my friends truck, doing everything they can to look for any trace of weed. One officer comes back after like 30 minutes and 3 searches, and he has pinched between his fingers the most miniscule piece of green something I could imagine, which could have been anything to be honest.. I mean like the size of a couple millimeter long beard hair. And the guy lays into my friend who was driving, threatening him with prison time for this tiny little piece of what he said was weed.. Telling us we lied to them about having weed with us, etc. We had even told them we had smoked before but had nothing with us and hadn't smoked in months, and consented to the search because we had nothing to hide.. But I mean, this guy had his hand on his gun and was just berating us for several minutes before they finally relented and let us go. Nothing remotely cordial, and none of us are threatening looking in the least. We were scared, we felt like criminals and we hadn't done anything.

I've only once been pulled over by an officer who has been cordial and polite, and that was the only officer who I felt gave me a reasonably legit ticket too (I was doing 85 in a 75). Outside that, I've always been made to feel as though I am a criminal, and there is a saying that I think holds true for that. You treat someone like a criminal, they will eventually begin to act like one. You treat someone like a person, they will almost always do the same in return. Officers in my experience have nearly always seemed like they are power tripping instead of protecting and serving. I can only imagine what it would be like if I was black. I feel like I honestly would have spent some time in jail at some point on one of those occasions, even if my behavior was exactly the same.

I mean, if I can be cooperative and white and have a completely clean record and still get treated like that, I feel pretty sure someone from a "bad" neighborhood with the "wrong" color of skin is going to get it worse, and I don't think either of us deserve it.

You have instances like that roadside beating a long time ago where the guy flips a vehicle and is clearly unconscious on the side of the road, then the cops come in en masse and beat the living shit out of his motionless body - That makes me think maybe cops are being trained improperly on how to deal with criminals to begin with in some cases. In other cases I think it is just a matter of an officer who is not cut out for that line of work getting emotionally in over his head. I mean, when you see these situations where people are being sat on and knelt on and choked and beaten after they are already cuffed, you wonder why there is still force being applied. The person is cuffed. Let them be. Handle your business like a respectable person and stop being a bully. What are they gonna do with cuffs on that you aren't trained to easily protect yourself against?

This is a world where I have been sold the illusion enough to truly start to believe that there is just so little dignity in anyone's actions anymore. The media continues to drive the wedge deeper between people in any way they can, the more divisive the opinion the better. It's what sells. It's how we live now. We're not quite civilized enough to know what to do with ourselves in the information age.

EDIT: Wow, so shit blew up in Texas while I took about 5 hours to type this up during down time at work. All I can do is sigh heavily.

[Groundhog]

It's kinda hard to miss them too - The only one I sought out was the Sterling video, but I've seen the other 2 just because they have been shown on our news.

[SirFozzie]

Multiple snipers, from what I've seen.

It's like they're trying to start a war.

[Groundhog]

Horrible. but not the least bit surprising either, unfortunately.

[RainMaker]

Dallas PD also saying something about a potential bomb.

Here is the video for those who haven't seen it. Just incredible firepower being used.

EL FOOSAY on Twitter: "Jesus RT @JeffersonObama: Here is the firefight as it happened in Dallas. https://t.co/xVKy4CtxEZ"

[panerd]

What a brilliant way to protest the police state and militarization of the police force. This shouldn't create any sort of blowback at all.