Werewolf XXXIV: Tombstone (GAME OVER - Night 13) - Page 47

Glengoyne · 10-17-2006, 02:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Racer

Shouldn't you be appearing tired then?

My night action is immune to the "tired" penalty.

Glengoyne · 10-17-2006, 02:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hoopsguy

In the event that Glen is who he says he is please vote to jail/lynch Chief Rum as quickly as possible. His monster post last night - which included no references to post numbers for anyone to cross-reference his "findings" - is very reminiscent of an Ardent Enthusiast move from the Harry Potter game Saldana ran. Basically, it was a bad guy coming out with tremendous "analysis" mid-way through the game which convinced everyone that he was innocent all the way until the end. Long posts do not equal good guy - I speak as a guy who isn't afraid to throw words together on either side of past games.

Also, I think it is important to note that I'm not able to provide information on any conversion activity beyond the initial one. The fact that two people who had money (both had loot in their house when they were killed) are now dead is a strong indicator to me that there is going to be another conversion. There may have been another one already, as the initial conversion took place alongside a kill on Night 1.

Wait a second. IF I am who I say I am, lynch Rum? One of the guys I've vouched for? That makes no sense.

Racer · 10-17-2006, 02:46 PM

Glengoyne, how many people can you view each night?

hoopsguy · 10-17-2006, 02:49 PM

Glen, you are correct. I'm sorry I missed that earlier while seething about the collection of posts I read when I checked in. I was fixating on him supplying research that would put two villagers (in event you are good) in jail while missing your cleared list.

Glengoyne · 10-17-2006, 02:51 PM

Spleen,

Given that I've come out and revealed my role, didn't have a gun, placed myself at the top of the Cowboy's target list, and expanded the CoT that we so desperately need to include Rum and Swaggs, how could a reasonable villager vote to lynch me?

Even before my revelation, at least I think it was before, Swaggs indicated that my analysis was sensible. Can you really make a case to lynch me that involves something more than the fact that I'm in jail?

Glengoyne · 10-17-2006, 02:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Racer

Glengoyne, how many people can you view each night?

As many as are in jail.

Glengoyne · 10-17-2006, 02:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Glengoyne

As many as are in jail.

I want to correct that. I review everyone who spent the day in jail.

path12 · 10-17-2006, 03:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Glengoyne

One note. Not only are Hoops and Path on the short list of would be cowboys, but so are the perpetrators of the false CoT. That should be food for thought, as I wasn't able to get a read on Lathum.

That makes it a pretty big short list. Did I miss it earlier, or did you share the results you've gotten so far along with your attempts to date?

path12 · 10-17-2006, 03:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Glengoyne

I want to correct that. I review everyone who spent the day in jail.

It would seem then that you would be able to use your power on anyone who is in there with you. You hinted earlier that you don't think you can. Do you have confirmation of that or is it just your feeling?

I'm thinking if we believe you that jail is the best place for you to be.....protected at night and able to 'process' the prisoners.

hoopsguy · 10-17-2006, 03:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Glengoyne

Spleen,

Given that I've come out and revealed my role, didn't have a gun, placed myself at the top of the Cowboy's target list, and expanded the CoT that we so desperately need to include Rum and Swaggs, how could a reasonable villager vote to lynch me?

Even before my revelation, at least I think it was before, Swaggs indicated that my analysis was sensible. Can you really make a case to lynch me that involves something more than the fact that I'm in jail?

Revealed role = 2nd to last person to reveal, with most convenient role in game

Didn't have gun = Cronin killed with knife, another Cowboy killed with knife last night. Obviously there is a Cowboy with a gun but this does not clear you at all

Atop Cowboy list = Cowboys are not atop Cowboy's lists.

The best way for a good role to prove they are innocent is by fingering a bad guy. Saving a good guy is a secondary measure, but it doesn't cost the bad guys anything to do this in relation to the trust garnered in the process. If you have had a good guy role and been able to use it multiple times per day (without being tired) I would have hoped that you would have been able to identify one Cowboy. Even if you don't have a 100% likelihood of success I find it pretty amazing that you haven't found us one Cowboy in seven days.

hoopsguy · 10-17-2006, 03:28 PM

In terms of the lynch decisions, obviously people have to lynch today. There are three people in jail. If there are three villagers in here, we still need to clear a spot so the Sheriff can put a Cowboy in for future votes. If you distrust me more than the other players, then you should string me up. Good game, catch you guys next time around, etc.

hoopsguy · 10-17-2006, 03:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Glengoyne

On lynching.

If we lynch I say we lynch Hoops.

Alternatively release me, see what efforts can be made to keep me alive for the night. I will possibly be able to come to a conclusion on anyone still in jail, and let you know what the outcome is.

I wasn't able to consider Barkeep's case last night, as Hoop's whimpering kept me awake

.

As for protecting me. I don't think even making me sheriff would help...as I would be unprotected while performing my night action.

This post stinks.

"If we lynch" - um, we pretty much have to lynch SOMEONE today. Not lynching is not an acceptable play with three of us in here.

"I say we lynch Hoops" - of course you would. If we are both released I will take my gun and shoot you down in the street. That is a promise.

"Alternatively release me ... I will possibly be able to come to a conclusion on anyone still in jail, and let you know what the outcome is." - because I can't use my role in jail, which gives you a reason to release me, right? And because you have done such a good job of ferreting out Cowboys with your seer role so far, right?

Glengoyne · 10-17-2006, 03:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hoopsguy

Revealed role = 2nd to last person to reveal, with most convenient role in game

Didn't have gun = Cronin killed with knife, another Cowboy killed with knife last night. Obviously there is a Cowboy with a gun but this does not clear you at all

Atop Cowboy list = Cowboys are not atop Cowboy's lists.

The best way for a good role to prove they are innocent is by fingering a bad guy. Saving a good guy is a secondary measure, but it doesn't cost the bad guys anything to do this in relation to the trust garnered in the process. If you have had a good guy role and been able to use it multiple times per day (without being tired) I would have hoped that you would have been able to identify one Cowboy. Even if you don't have a 100% likelihood of success I find it pretty amazing that you haven't found us one Cowboy in seven days.

As far as I know we haven't jailed a single cowboy in seven days. Pretty remarkable isn't it?

Oh and like I'm bold enough to come out and claim the seer role in my second game. How could I know that two posts later someone wouldn't come along and claim to be the real seer.

Lynch Hoops

hoopsguy · 10-17-2006, 03:44 PM

Between Glen and I, here are the roles we revealed late:

Glen (Retired Judge) - can scan people in jail. Gets some reliable results, but never finds someone who is guilty over five days with multiple people in jail most of these days (Lathum, GE, Swaggs, Chief Rum, Gramm, LSG, Barkeep, me - am I missing any?). Never leaves his house to execute the role. Never tired from using the role. Can only use the role when outside of jail.

Hoops (Brother) - can identify the convert. If a fake reveal there would be at least two people who could call him on it. Carries a gun, one of the few remaining villagers who can call for a showdown if we take people at their word on their roles and weapon possession. Gets tired like everyone else in the game.

Obviously this is a representation of the facts as I see them. But if there is something that I'm missing I would encourage people to point it out to me.

hoopsguy · 10-17-2006, 03:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Glengoyne

As far as I know we haven't jailed a single cowboy in seven days. Pretty remarkable isn't it?

Oh and like I'm bold enough to come out and claim the seer role in my second game. How could I know that two posts later someone wouldn't come along and claim to be the real seer.

Lynch Hoops

Glen, werewolf is a team game when you are playing as a wolf. And after seven days of this game I am not affording you rookie status anymore.

You knew that you could claim seer because you were the last person besides me to declare your role. I'm not disputing that a seer should be cautious about coming out, but it is mighty nice for you to have a super-role (see my above account) that only works when you are outside of jail.

Glengoyne · 10-17-2006, 03:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hoopsguy

This post stinks.

"If we lynch" - um, we pretty much have to lynch SOMEONE today. Not lynching is not an acceptable play with three of us in here.

"I say we lynch Hoops" - of course you would. If we are both released I will take my gun and shoot you down in the street. That is a promise.

"Alternatively release me ... I will possibly be able to come to a conclusion on anyone still in jail, and let you know what the outcome is." - because I can't use my role in jail, which gives you a reason to release me, right? And because you have done such a good job of ferreting out Cowboys with your seer role so far, right?

I still don't think it is a necessity. Let me out. If I can get a bearing on either you or BK, then we lynch you or release you. Either we nab a bad guy, or we clear a villager. We don't further the Cowboy's mission by killing another villager. I think we are down to the wire with the Cowboys very close to their finishing line. I don't want to carry them across it.

That said. If we have to lynch someone. At least lynch someone who may well be a cowboy. By my assessment of voting records, that is you. I'd rather have had you and Path in jail, to duke it out. That wasn't the case. Spleen is headed to the top of my suspect list with a bullet.

Glengoyne · 10-17-2006, 03:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hoopsguy

Glen, werewolf is a team game when you are playing as a wolf. And after seven days of this game I am not affording you rookie status anymore.

You knew that you could claim seer because you were the last person besides me to declare your role. I'm not disputing that a seer should be cautious about coming out, but it is mighty nice for you to have a super-role (see my above account) that only works when you are outside of jail.

Hey I don't KNOW that my role only works when I'm in jail. I do suspect that because prisoners aren't allowed to perform their night actions that that includes me.

hoopsguy · 10-17-2006, 03:54 PM

Glen, if we let out a Cowboy then it will take another action to jail them and another day to lynch them. In the meantime they are running around with money and I'm positive they will drop another bribe.

We are not close to winning the game with one dead Cowboy, one convert still at large, and the Cowboys having silver and money from the bodies of the dead to run at least one more conversion. Attempts to make it seem as such, or to forestall a lynch today, are extremely suspect.

Glengoyne · 10-17-2006, 04:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Glengoyne

Hey I don't KNOW that my role only works when I'm in jail. I do suspect that because prisoners aren't allowed to perform their night actions that that includes me.

Oops that should read " I don't KNOW that my role Won't work when I'm in jail.

Chubby · 10-17-2006, 04:56 PM

Lynch glengoyne
Lynch hoopsguy

Neither had revealed their roles prior to jailing (or claimed a role whether it's their role or not) and both appeared on multiple people's lists of suspected baddies.

Glengoyne · 10-17-2006, 05:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hoopsguy

Glen, if we let out a Cowboy then it will take another action to jail them and another day to lynch them. In the meantime they are running around with money and I'm positive they will drop another bribe.

We are not close to winning the game with one dead Cowboy, one convert still at large, and the Cowboys having silver and money from the bodies of the dead to run at least one more conversion. Attempts to make it seem as such, or to forestall a lynch today, are extremely suspect.

FIrst, I'm not suggesting that we let out a cowboy. I'm saying let me out. I should be cleared by now.

I meant to ask about this money bit earlier. How do you know about the loot in people's houses? Did I miss something?

Also I don't mean that we, the villagers are close to winning. I mean that the cowboys are close. That much should be obvious.

Either we throw the dice and lynch could be villager's tonight or we stand pat and only let the villagers lose one to the cowboys. If I'm released, perhaps Chubby can watch me tonight. That would at least give him a chance to catch someone in the act.

I should also note that my action occurs automatically, I do not have to know if I'm going to be free in order for me to get the action in. So perhaps play it close to the vest. If I'm released, maybe I'll get a hit on BK or Hoops. Maybe the Cowboys will try for me tonight, and if I'm in jail we will not suffer a kill tonight. Play a game of chicken with me.

Same thing works if I'm sheriff. I may be able to forego my night action, and have occasional safety as sheriff. I don't know how that works.

My thinking is honestly that we villagers should let the cleared folks decide.
That is Chubby, Swaggs, Rum, and essentially Bullet.

Glengoyne · 10-17-2006, 05:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chubby

Lynch glengoyne
Lynch hoopsguy

Neither had revealed their roles prior to jailing (or claimed a role whether it's their role or not) and both appeared on multiple people's lists of suspected baddies.

What ? Like I'm going to reveal that I'm the retired judge?

That doesn't make sense. At least to me that role screamed seer before it was assigned to me. No way I'm declaring that up front.

Glengoyne · 10-17-2006, 05:12 PM

Chubby How do you figure on lynching me?

Barkeep49 · 10-17-2006, 05:13 PM

I remember that hoops was found out and about one or two nights. Which nights were those? I ask because I don't live near Thomkal and if he was visiting me night 1 as he claims then he shouldn't have been near that scene of the crime.

Glengoyne · 10-17-2006, 05:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hoopsguy

Between Glen and I, here are the roles we revealed late:

Glen (Retired Judge) - can scan people in jail. Gets some reliable results, but never finds someone who is guilty over five days with multiple people in jail most of these days (Lathum, GE, Swaggs, Chief Rum, Gramm, LSG, Barkeep, me - am I missing any?). Never leaves his house to execute the role. Never tired from using the role. Can only use the role when outside of jail.

Hoops (Brother) - can identify the convert. If a fake reveal there would be at least two people who could call him on it. Carries a gun, one of the few remaining villagers who can call for a showdown if we take people at their word on their roles and weapon possession. Gets tired like everyone else in the game.

Obviously this is a representation of the facts as I see them. But if there is something that I'm missing I would encourage people to point it out to me.

Is there anything to contradict my account? Has anyone seen me outside of my house at night?

As for me not successfully identifying a Cowboy in jail. What cowboys have we had in jail? huh? I've scanned everyone, but haven't come up with any. That isn't my fault.

How can CR come out as the brothel girl, and we clear him but I come out as the seer and I get lynched.

This is throwing the game away. The cowboys are already way ahead. This is ridiculous.

Glengoyne · 10-17-2006, 05:34 PM

This is frustrating. Everytime I come back to the baord today, there is no one here.

Since when do we let the Cowboys run the show, and drive discussion?

Glengoyne · 10-17-2006, 05:35 PM

I'm to the point that if I go down, you all should take BK and Hoops as well. It might even the score a little bit.

If not it has a chance to at least end this miserable villager outing in its tracks.

Glengoyne · 10-17-2006, 05:37 PM

I see Cronin is here.

He has to be loving this!

Barkeep49 · 10-17-2006, 05:40 PM

Glen, I'll be honest. CR presented, in my mind, a pretty compelling case against you. Is there any reason for us to believe you have the role you claim? Any hints from days gone by? To be honest I would have never predicted the ex-Judge for the strongest seer role we have to date.

ntndeacon · 10-17-2006, 05:42 PM

Lynch Hoops

I am not buying him as the brother. Of course if he is telling the truth, it should be fairly easy to find the other brother.

Alan T · 10-17-2006, 05:45 PM

2 hours 15 minutes till deadline. Current votes:

Election votes: (7 votes needed for new sheriff)

No new sheriff votes.

Lynch votes: (7 votes needed for lynch)

(3) Barkeep - Spleen (2271), swaggs (2272), hoopsguy (2295)

(6) Glengoyne - Chief Rum (2234), Barkeep (2241), Racer (2245), Spleen (2271), Hoopsguy (2295), Chubby (2320)

(8) Hoopsguy - Chief RUm (2234), Barkeep (2241), Racer (2245), Spleen (2271), Swaggs (2272), Glengoyne (2313), Chubby (2320), Ntndeacon (2330)

Glengoyne · 10-17-2006, 05:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Barkeep49

Glen, I'll be honest. CR presented, in my mind, a pretty compelling case against you. Is there any reason for us to believe you have the role you claim? Any hints from days gone by? To be honest I would have never predicted the ex-Judge for the strongest seer role we have to date.

Compelling? I don't have a gun. How could I have killed anyone. Cronin used a knife, and I was in jail last night.

His case was that I didn't have a alibi for a night when someone was gunned down.

Like it or not, we haven't arrested any wolves. Well, either that or the wolves have friends at random.org.

I don't hold him any ill will, Chief that is. He was doing his part, eventhough I've cleared him. He is a villager. He is also wrong.

Glengoyne · 10-17-2006, 05:48 PM

If I survive, or if I'm lynched and the game continues, you have to look hard at Racer and Spleen. Probably not in that order. Hell I'm not even certain we can trust Chubby at this point.

Glengoyne · 10-17-2006, 05:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Barkeep49

Glen, I'll be honest. CR presented, in my mind, a pretty compelling case against you. Is there any reason for us to believe you have the role you claim? Any hints from days gone by? To be honest I would have never predicted the ex-Judge for the strongest seer role we have to date.

Hints from days gone by.

I was among the first to clear GE. I nominated him to be sheriff even.
I came out solidly in Cheif Rum's court.
I came out solidly on Swaggs' behalf. I wanted him as sheriff.

Glengoyne · 10-17-2006, 05:51 PM

Dola,

It should be clear if you review my posts.

Glengoyne · 10-17-2006, 05:53 PM

Well perhaps I SUGGESTED GE as sheriff. I didn't want to paint a target on my back as his staunchest advocate.

Swaggs · 10-17-2006, 05:53 PM

Hoops has built a pretty compelling case against Glen, who I had previously pencilled into my CoT, for now.

If it were anyone but hoops, I might go for it in a hurry, but this smells of him trying to either 1.) try to separate him and Glen (if they are both cowboys) or 2.) to take Glen down with him.

Anyone have any thoughts on this? I am seriously considering adding Glen and just taking all three to the gallows today.

Glengoyne · 10-17-2006, 05:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Swaggs

Hoops has built a pretty compelling case against Glen, who I had previously pencilled into my CoT, for now.

If it were anyone but hoops, I might go for it in a hurry, but this smells of him trying to either 1.) try to separate him and Glen (if they are both cowboys) or 2.) to take Glen down with him.

Anyone have any thoughts on this? I am seriously considering adding Glen and just taking all three to the gallows today.

What case is that? I'm curious, cause all I have him saying is that he doesn't believe me, and that I've falsely revealed.

I don't know if he is a cowboy or not, so I don't know what his motive is. I'm just saying that he is wrong about my reveal.

Take a look at who had GE's back, your back, and Chief Rum's

Look back at it. When did I back you hardest? After you had spent a day in jail. Check it out. Hoops allegation won't hold up if you investigate it.

Chief Rum · 10-17-2006, 06:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Glengoyne

Hints from days gone by.

I was among the first to clear GE. I nominated him to be sheriff even.
I came out solidly in Cheif Rum's court.
I came out solidly on Swaggs' behalf. I wanted him as sheriff.

I had to leave work early today, so I happened to get a chance to get here and come on.

I have to admit this bolded statement hits a cord. No one was really backing me while in jail, just people trying to decide if I was telling the truth. No one, that is, but Glen. He was the first to proclaim any sort of trust in me, and I remember thinking it odd that he came out for me as much as he did. Even though I was happy for the support, I wondered why he would come out strongly for me and multiple times, too.

So I am going to change my vote there...

UNVOTE LYNCH GLENGOYNE

There are possibilities for the cowboys. I still believe we should hang hoops. Frankly, he should have come out sooner with this (and so should have Glen; we have lots of seer types running around). And he was around to duel st cronin, too, but I didn't see him pulling a gun to kill cronin.

Plus, if he goes down and is telling the truth about being a brother, we might then find his brother as well.

I know there has been a lot of supposition about path and Racer. I didn't get any indications on Racer last night (he turned me down after much consideration). I am up in the air on both. My list only shows who could possibly the gunman, so the ones with knives are out there, too (although the list provided is probably a good a place to start as any).

I have to admit the pair that I think about must outside of the two currently in the pokey are Anxiety and Lathum. They are both vets in this game who have been very, very quiet since starting strong in the beginning. They essentially vouch for each other. The only person vouching for them who is not them is ntn, and he has admittedly swung and missed on st cronin, too. And Lathum has a gun, and hasn't said what his role is.

All right, I am out until after the deadline.

BTW, hoops, I challenge you to find any facts I have fudged in my analysis. It took a lot of work to put that up, and I assure you, everything I put in my spreadsheet was based on posts I read in this thread, painstakingly, all last night.

LoneStarGirl · 10-17-2006, 06:16 PM

Kill em all!

oops, sorry, forgot i was dead.

Swaggs · 10-17-2006, 06:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Glengoyne

What case is that? I'm curious, cause all I have him saying is that he doesn't believe me, and that I've falsely revealed.

I don't know if he is a cowboy or not, so I don't know what his motive is. I'm just saying that he is wrong about my reveal.

Take a look at who had GE's back, your back, and Chief Rum's

Look back at it. When did I back you hardest? After you had spent a day in jail. Check it out. Hoops allegation won't hold up if you investigate it.

The biggest problems that I see are that the people you have accounted for were largely accounted for already, while you seemed to have whiffed on hoopsguy and Lathum, who are a little less trustworthy right now in my eyes. Could just be bad luck, but it is a reasonable enough sized sample to raise my suspicion. The other problem I see is that you seem to be putting a lot of weight into the fact that you do not have a gun, which we now know is not a factor, since st. cronin was a cowboy and did not have a gund AND every player, good or bad, appears to have a knife.

I am not voting for you just yet, but I think you belong in jail tonight.

Glengoyne · 10-17-2006, 06:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Swaggs

...

I am not voting for you just yet, but I think you belong in jail tonight.

Fair enough. Remember me leading the charge for you as sheriff over Chubby?

I'm hoping that I don't see a late charge from folks looking to lynch me at the deadline. We haven't heard from Path, Lathum, or Anxiety yet. So I'm not counting on sleeping on a bed rather than in a box quite yet.

path12 · 10-17-2006, 06:32 PM

OK, time to vote before I'm out. I've been following along with the discussion such as it has been today.

I'm not sure I buy Glen's story, but the only fair thing I can think of is to give him one chance to see if he can use his claimed power in jail to scan either Barkeep or hoops, with the other being lynched. Now, it may be possible that he can't use his power while in jail, but since apparently he doesn't need to be out and about to use it in the past (since he's not been tired) I don't see why that wouldn't be the case tonight.

Lynch hoops.

The story just doesn't sit right. Hoops hinted very clearly that he could scan for the convert and would discover if anyone else had been converted. Now he claims the brother role and says that that's who he is searching for. (I'm paraphrasing, but that's the way I understood it).

Besides, I do think there needs to be at least one lynch, and I lean BK being villager since my service was so damn poor last night while eating. So if I give Glen a night to prove himself, and lean good on BK, that only leaves one choice.

Glengoyne · 10-17-2006, 06:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Swaggs

The biggest problems that I see are that the people you have accounted for were largely accounted for already, while you seemed to have whiffed on hoopsguy and Lathum, who are a little less trustworthy right now in my eyes. Could just be bad luck, but it is a reasonable enough sized sample to raise my suspicion. The other problem I see is that you seem to be putting a lot of weight into the fact that you do not have a gun, which we now know is not a factor, since st. cronin was a cowboy and did not have a gund AND every player, good or bad, appears to have a knife.

I am not voting for you just yet, but I think you belong in jail tonight.

On the gun thing. CR's case was all about who could have shot someone. I was in jail for the knife killing that Cronin didn't go down for. Wasn't me.

Also about the false reveal angle. I came out and declared myself a "weak" seer type. Why wouldn't I just come out and say "I'm the seer!"

hoopsguy · 10-17-2006, 07:16 PM

You guys are missing the boat with me as the only lynch. You are not going to get a Cowboy and you are going to have the Sheriff in a position where he can only fill one slot.

I'm not positive that Glen is a Cowboy - I never looked him up while I was outside of jail. But his role reveal is unbelievably convenient and that is a hallmark of bad guy fake reveals. I say that as someone who has run a couple of them in my WW career ...

Also, there has been all day for people to reveal if they had the Brother role. For me to fake this I would have to dodge not one, but two players on a flat lie.

Glen, you would declare as a "weak" seer because you need an excuse for never catching a wolf. It is statistically improbable that we would fail to ever put a Cowboy in jail for you to "scan". It is even less so when you start factoring in a trust list.

Swaggs, I am most certainly not trying to clear Glengoyne. What I worry about here is that I'm giving Barkeep too much space by focusing on Glen. But BK has been in here for two days and has not perpetrated a junk story. I think we have a better case for getting a Cowboy by lynching both of them and that is why I'm voting for that but it is pretty clear I'm on an island at this point with that position.

hoopsguy · 10-17-2006, 07:18 PM

Path, I can scan for the convert by visiting their quarters. In terms of how I played it earlier in the game, I was hoping to overstate my role a little bit to create some pressure on the Cowboys. It appears that all I have done is create pressure on myself.

hoopsguy · 10-17-2006, 07:20 PM

Quote:

BTW, hoops, I challenge you to find any facts I have fudged in my analysis. It took a lot of work to put that up, and I assure you, everything I put in my spreadsheet was based on posts I read in this thread, painstakingly, all last night.

Chief, I'll start looking at it since I'm the only one posting at this point. However, if you went through the trouble to painstaking detail all of this how much harder would it be to multi-quote or reference post numbers? Seriously, this is going to take the remaining 40 minutes I have left in the game to track down posts, let alone respond to them.

Lathum · 10-17-2006, 07:27 PM

does anyone else get the feeling Glen and hoops are playing it up a bit to much to try and save one of them? I think there is definantly a cowboy vet leading the team and it would make alot of sense for 2 cowboys in jail to go at each other to try and make one of them look good so with that

VOTE LYNCH HOOPS
VOTE LYNCH GLEN

I've een at work all day but this seems to me the only way to be sure.

Glengoyne · 10-17-2006, 07:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hoopsguy

You guys are missing the boat with me as the only lynch. You are not going to get a Cowboy and you are going to have the Sheriff in a position where he can only fill one slot.

I'm not positive that Glen is a Cowboy - I never looked him up while I was outside of jail. But his role reveal is unbelievably convenient and that is a hallmark of bad guy fake reveals. I say that as someone who has run a couple of them in my WW career ...

Also, there has been all day for people to reveal if they had the Brother role. For me to fake this I would have to dodge not one, but two players on a flat lie.

Glen, you would declare as a "weak" seer because you need an excuse for never catching a wolf. It is statistically improbable that we would fail to ever put a Cowboy in jail for you to "scan". It is even less so when you start factoring in a trust list.

Swaggs, I am most certainly not trying to clear Glengoyne. What I worry about here is that I'm giving Barkeep too much space by focusing on Glen. But BK has been in here for two days and has not perpetrated a junk story. I think we have a better case for getting a Cowboy by lynching both of them and that is why I'm voting for that but it is pretty clear I'm on an island at this point with that position.

Statistically improbable, perhaps, but that seems to be the case BK and Lathum excluded, no one showed up wolf. I think that has more to do with how well the wolves have controlled the agenda.

Perhaps it is that I've been viewing the game with the benefit of my "cleared" list. It has been incredibly frustrating to not have those that you suspect be arrested. That is how I have felt about everyone on that list of folks that voted for GE and Gram. It seemed obvious to me that there would be multiple cowboys on it. I've been wanting to form a CoT between Swaggs, CR, Chubby, and Bullet. I was thinking that if only we could get four or so people together on the same page, that we could get on a roll. The only problem was that we just can't seem to get the ball moving.

On the timing of my reveal. I was hoping last night to clear or condemn BK, and then come out this morning. That is, IF I survived the night. I was hoping that action would give us the momentum to make a run at the Cowboys. Even if it did make me a target/bait for the Cowboys.

Glengoyne · 10-17-2006, 07:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lathum

does anyone else get the feeling Glen and hoops are playing it up a bit to much to try and save one of them? I think there is definantly a cowboy vet leading the team and it would make alot of sense for 2 cowboys in jail to go at each other to try and make one of them look good so with that

VOTE LYNCH HOOPS
VOTE LYNCH GLEN

I've een at work all day but this seems to me the only way to be sure.

Today has been incredibly frustrating as it seems I'm the only one posting most of the time.

Have you even gone and checked out my positions on GE, CR, and Swaggs? How and when I came out for them. It should be pretty clear in hindsight.

Are you paying attention to the fact that CR's analysis showed that I was a suspect in shooting someone, yet I have no fire arm?

10-17-2006, 05:45 PM	#2331
Alan T Hall Of Famer Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Mass.	2 hours 15 minutes till deadline. Current votes: Election votes: (7 votes needed for new sheriff) No new sheriff votes. Lynch votes: (7 votes needed for lynch) (3) Barkeep - Spleen (2271), swaggs (2272), hoopsguy (2295) (6) Glengoyne - Chief Rum (2234), Barkeep (2241), Racer (2245), Spleen (2271), Hoopsguy (2295), Chubby (2320) (8) Hoopsguy - Chief RUm (2234), Barkeep (2241), Racer (2245), Spleen (2271), Swaggs (2272), Glengoyne (2313), Chubby (2320), Ntndeacon (2330) Last edited by Alan T : 10-17-2006 at 05:45 PM.

10-17-2006, 05:53 PM	#2337
Swaggs Coordinator Join Date: Oct 2000	Hoops has built a pretty compelling case against Glen, who I had previously pencilled into my CoT, for now. If it were anyone but hoops, I might go for it in a hurry, but this smells of him trying to either 1.) try to separate him and Glen (if they are both cowboys) or 2.) to take Glen down with him. Anyone have any thoughts on this? I am seriously considering adding Glen and just taking all three to the gallows today. __________________ DOWN WITH HATTRICK!!! The RWBL Are you reading In The Bleachers?

10-17-2006, 06:32 PM	#2343
path12 Coordinator Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Seattle, WA	OK, time to vote before I'm out. I've been following along with the discussion such as it has been today. I'm not sure I buy Glen's story, but the only fair thing I can think of is to give him one chance to see if he can use his claimed power in jail to scan either Barkeep or hoops, with the other being lynched. Now, it may be possible that he can't use his power while in jail, but since apparently he doesn't need to be out and about to use it in the past (since he's not been tired) I don't see why that wouldn't be the case tonight. Lynch hoops. The story just doesn't sit right. Hoops hinted very clearly that he could scan for the convert and would discover if anyone else had been converted. Now he claims the brother role and says that that's who he is searching for. (I'm paraphrasing, but that's the way I understood it). Besides, I do think there needs to be at least one lynch, and I lean BK being villager since my service was so damn poor last night while eating. So if I give Glen a night to prove himself, and lean good on BK, that only leaves one choice. __________________ We have always been at war with Eastasia.

10-17-2006, 02:46 PM	#2303
Racer College Benchwarmer Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Fort Wayne, Indiana	Glengoyne, how many people can you view each night?

10-17-2006, 02:49 PM	#2304
hoopsguy General Manager Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Chicago	Glen, you are correct. I'm sorry I missed that earlier while seething about the collection of posts I read when I checked in. I was fixating on him supplying research that would put two villagers (in event you are good) in jail while missing your cleared list.

10-17-2006, 02:51 PM	#2305
Glengoyne Grizzled Veteran Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Fresno, CA	Spleen, Given that I've come out and revealed my role, didn't have a gun, placed myself at the top of the Cowboy's target list, and expanded the CoT that we so desperately need to include Rum and Swaggs, how could a reasonable villager vote to lynch me? Even before my revelation, at least I think it was before, Swaggs indicated that my analysis was sensible. Can you really make a case to lynch me that involves something more than the fact that I'm in jail?

10-17-2006, 03:28 PM	#2311
hoopsguy General Manager Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Chicago	In terms of the lynch decisions, obviously people have to lynch today. There are three people in jail. If there are three villagers in here, we still need to clear a spot so the Sheriff can put a Cowboy in for future votes. If you distrust me more than the other players, then you should string me up. Good game, catch you guys next time around, etc.

10-17-2006, 03:44 PM	#2314
hoopsguy General Manager Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Chicago	Between Glen and I, here are the roles we revealed late: Glen (Retired Judge) - can scan people in jail. Gets some reliable results, but never finds someone who is guilty over five days with multiple people in jail most of these days (Lathum, GE, Swaggs, Chief Rum, Gramm, LSG, Barkeep, me - am I missing any?). Never leaves his house to execute the role. Never tired from using the role. Can only use the role when outside of jail. Hoops (Brother) - can identify the convert. If a fake reveal there would be at least two people who could call him on it. Carries a gun, one of the few remaining villagers who can call for a showdown if we take people at their word on their roles and weapon possession. Gets tired like everyone else in the game. Obviously this is a representation of the facts as I see them. But if there is something that I'm missing I would encourage people to point it out to me.

10-17-2006, 03:54 PM	#2318
hoopsguy General Manager Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Chicago	Glen, if we let out a Cowboy then it will take another action to jail them and another day to lynch them. In the meantime they are running around with money and I'm positive they will drop another bribe. We are not close to winning the game with one dead Cowboy, one convert still at large, and the Cowboys having silver and money from the bodies of the dead to run at least one more conversion. Attempts to make it seem as such, or to forestall a lynch today, are extremely suspect.

10-17-2006, 04:56 PM	#2320
Chubby Grizzled Veteran Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Syracuse, NY	Lynch glengoyne Lynch hoopsguy Neither had revealed their roles prior to jailing (or claimed a role whether it's their role or not) and both appeared on multiple people's lists of suspected baddies.

10-17-2006, 05:12 PM	#2323
Glengoyne Grizzled Veteran Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Fresno, CA	Chubby How do you figure on lynching me?

10-17-2006, 05:13 PM	#2324
Barkeep49 Coordinator Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: Not too far away	I remember that hoops was found out and about one or two nights. Which nights were those? I ask because I don't live near Thomkal and if he was visiting me night 1 as he claims then he shouldn't have been near that scene of the crime.

10-17-2006, 05:34 PM	#2326
Glengoyne Grizzled Veteran Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Fresno, CA	This is frustrating. Everytime I come back to the baord today, there is no one here. Since when do we let the Cowboys run the show, and drive discussion?

10-17-2006, 05:35 PM	#2327
Glengoyne Grizzled Veteran Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Fresno, CA	I'm to the point that if I go down, you all should take BK and Hoops as well. It might even the score a little bit. If not it has a chance to at least end this miserable villager outing in its tracks.

10-17-2006, 05:37 PM	#2328
Glengoyne Grizzled Veteran Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Fresno, CA	I see Cronin is here. He has to be loving this!

10-17-2006, 05:40 PM	#2329
Barkeep49 Coordinator Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: Not too far away	Glen, I'll be honest. CR presented, in my mind, a pretty compelling case against you. Is there any reason for us to believe you have the role you claim? Any hints from days gone by? To be honest I would have never predicted the ex-Judge for the strongest seer role we have to date.

10-17-2006, 05:42 PM	#2330
ntndeacon Pro Starter Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Alabama	Lynch Hoops I am not buying him as the brother. Of course if he is telling the truth, it should be fairly easy to find the other brother.

10-17-2006, 05:48 PM	#2333
Glengoyne Grizzled Veteran Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Fresno, CA	If I survive, or if I'm lynched and the game continues, you have to look hard at Racer and Spleen. Probably not in that order. Hell I'm not even certain we can trust Chubby at this point.

10-17-2006, 05:51 PM	#2335
Glengoyne Grizzled Veteran Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Fresno, CA	Dola, It should be clear if you review my posts.

10-17-2006, 05:53 PM	#2336
Glengoyne Grizzled Veteran Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Fresno, CA	Well perhaps I SUGGESTED GE as sheriff. I didn't want to paint a target on my back as his staunchest advocate.

10-17-2006, 06:16 PM	#2340
LoneStarGirl College Starter Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Little Rock, AR	Kill em all! oops, sorry, forgot i was dead.

10-17-2006, 07:16 PM	#2345
hoopsguy General Manager Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Chicago	You guys are missing the boat with me as the only lynch. You are not going to get a Cowboy and you are going to have the Sheriff in a position where he can only fill one slot. I'm not positive that Glen is a Cowboy - I never looked him up while I was outside of jail. But his role reveal is unbelievably convenient and that is a hallmark of bad guy fake reveals. I say that as someone who has run a couple of them in my WW career ... Also, there has been all day for people to reveal if they had the Brother role. For me to fake this I would have to dodge not one, but two players on a flat lie. Glen, you would declare as a "weak" seer because you need an excuse for never catching a wolf. It is statistically improbable that we would fail to ever put a Cowboy in jail for you to "scan". It is even less so when you start factoring in a trust list. Swaggs, I am most certainly not trying to clear Glengoyne. What I worry about here is that I'm giving Barkeep too much space by focusing on Glen. But BK has been in here for two days and has not perpetrated a junk story. I think we have a better case for getting a Cowboy by lynching both of them and that is why I'm voting for that but it is pretty clear I'm on an island at this point with that position.

10-17-2006, 07:18 PM	#2346
hoopsguy General Manager Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Chicago	Path, I can scan for the convert by visiting their quarters. In terms of how I played it earlier in the game, I was hoping to overstate my role a little bit to create some pressure on the Cowboys. It appears that all I have done is create pressure on myself.

10-17-2006, 07:27 PM	#2348
Lathum Favored Bitch #1 Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: homeless in NJ	does anyone else get the feeling Glen and hoops are playing it up a bit to much to try and save one of them? I think there is definantly a cowboy vet leading the team and it would make alot of sense for 2 cowboys in jail to go at each other to try and make one of them look good so with that VOTE LYNCH HOOPS VOTE LYNCH GLEN I've een at work all day but this seems to me the only way to be sure.

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