Pro Wrestling Discussion Thread **Spoilers Possible**

[molson]

Originally Posted by Maple Leafs

I don't know what's sadder... that you're saying that bringing back Hulk Hogan in ther year 2009 isn't boring and stale, or that relative to the WWE product you're probably right.

At this point, I would welcome a WWE booking commitee of Vince Russo, Hulk Hogan, Kevin Nash, Kevin Sullivan, Verne Gagne, Herb Abrams, and Jim Herd.

It's not that the WWE product is bad, it just has looked and felt exactly the same for years and years. There's nothing remotely intersting about it right now.

[Maple Leafs]

Originally Posted by molson

It's not that the WWE product is bad, it just has looked and felt exactly the same for years and years. There's nothing remotely intersting about it right now.

Come on. Remember how it got sort of stale when the main event was always some combination of HHH, Cena and Orton, so they mixed it up and started going with some combination of Orton, Cena and HHH instead?

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by molson

At this point, I would welcome a WWE booking commitee of Vince Russo, Hulk Hogan, Kevin Nash, Kevin Sullivan, Verne Gagne, Herb Abrams, and Jim Herd.

Dusty Rhodes & Bill Watts FTW

[rjolley]

You know, I was really hoping they'd have Cena lose Sunday, leave RAW, and turn to the dark side of wrestling. Didn't think the booking team had the balls to do it, but I was hoping for it.

The Big Show turning on his team was extremely predictable.

And Cena having Big Show on his back for that closing move is still damn impressive.

[SirFozzie]

Holy shit. They just gave Kofi Kingston a motherfucking MEGAPUSH there

[Neon_Chaos]

Chris Masters might have found his niche.

[Flasch186]

Boy is WWE sucking, thank goodness there's so much good MMA the next 3 months.

[Neon_Chaos]

Originally Posted by Flasch186

Boy is WWE sucking, thank goodness there's so much good MMA the next 3 months.

I actually think that the WWE is getting better as we approach the Royal Rumble/Wrestlemania season.

[Mota]

I find the WWE has been unwatcheable the last few months. And I'm a hardcore wrestling fan. I've still been watching every show up until the last few weeks, but since then I've been filling the time watching old Ring of Honor cards. Sure it's the "minors" but these guys are WAY more talented and work ten times harder than jokers like HHH and John Cena. 3/4 of the WWE roster just calls it in night after night, it's pretty pathetic. But what do they have to look forward to, all of their roster spots are written in concrete, there's no upwards or downwards mobility.

[Mota]

Dola

In Ring of Honor at least the heels get booed and the faces get the cheers. In the WWE the most hated wrestler is their #1 face (John Cena) and all the fans start cheering for Batista now that he's gone heel. They just have it all wrong, and have totally lost control over their product.

[RainMaker]

Does WWE really even do wrestling on Monday Night's anymore? Seemed like a bad sketch comedy show the last time I watched. Matches were like 2 minutes long.

[bulletsponge]

they had a good show a few weeks back if i remember correctly, but by and large its been crap

[JonInMiddleGA]

Sad news today it appears, as 36 y/o Eddie Fatu aka Umaga, apparently suffered a massive heart attack (or some other cause depending upon the sketchy report) & has reportedly been taken off of life support. Several wrestlers have been Tweeting about it this afternoon including Bobby Lashley who said "a good friend is gone".

Reports earlier in the day indicated that he wife found him unconscious & not breathing sometime after he fell asleep watching television at their home .

[molson]

Damn.

I really liked him as Umaga.

I was just thinking this morning how it's been a while since we had a wrestling death (a "while" based relatively on wrestling deaths, of course)

[DeToxRox]

Well I hate to say it but he was let go for Wellness Violations. They gave him an ultimatum of either rehab or being fired and he chose to be fired. Sad, sad turn of events.

[WVUFAN]

Spoiler

I'm very, VERY surprised that Cena lost to the newcomer tonight. Sheamus, the new WWE Champion? Doesn't have a great ring to it.

[Schmidty]

Originally Posted by WVUFAN

Spoiler

I'm very, VERY surprised that Cena lost to the newcomer tonight. Sheamus, the new WWE Champion? Doesn't have a great ring to it.

I agree.

Spoiler

I'm one of the only Cena fans I know, and was pretty bummed, although Sheamus has a tiny bit of potential. Also, this was the first PPV I've watched in a long time, and I was really disappointed. The best match was the first one (to me). Oh, and I watched it for free on channelsurfing.net.

[DeToxRox]

Honestly, I think the ending may have been botched but maybe not. Either way, he's the definition of transition champ. I suspect you'll see someone win the title at the Rumble if not tomorrow on a 3 Hour Raw.

[molson]

It's not often these days that the WWE does something unexpected, so I'm all for that.

Though it would have worked better if the WWE championship hasn't already changed hands 6 billion times this year.

[ageofquarrel]

does anybody here follow chikara? I just got into it over the last couple months and seriously its probably the most fun I have had watching wrestling since ECW in the mid 90s.

[DeToxRox]

Originally Posted by ageofquarrel

does anybody here follow chikara? I just got into it over the last couple months and seriously its probably the most fun I have had watching wrestling since ECW in the mid 90s.

Yup. It's a blast to watch. I love how it doesn't take itself too seriously yet there is some serious talent there. Very, very fun.

[ageofquarrel]

Originally Posted by DeToxRox

Yup. It's a blast to watch. I love how it doesn't take itself too seriously yet there is some serious talent there. Very, very fun.

Yeah its awesome, did you see the season finale? So funny during the unmasking you can hear someone in the crowd saying Noooooooo in the most overdramatic voice. Plus Ultra Mantis Black is ridiculous supposedly he wears his mask in public and stays in his character all the time. Must be interesting

[Maple Leafs]

Sheamus won? Ugh.

That sounds like one of those deals where they realize that nobody takes a guy's chances seriously, so they decide to put him over just out of spite.

[Flasch186]

This is why, if handled correctly (and thats a huge IF) TNA's move to Monday night on Spike in January could actually have a shot.

If they handle it like I expect they will it'll die a thousand deaths.

[DeToxRox]

Originally Posted by ageofquarrel

Yeah its awesome, did you see the season finale? So funny during the unmasking you can hear someone in the crowd saying Noooooooo in the most overdramatic voice. Plus Ultra Mantis Black is ridiculous supposedly he wears his mask in public and stays in his character all the time. Must be interesting

Haha yes. UMB is awesome. He is just hilarious. I love watching random Chikara vids on youtube when I am bored as I always end up in stitches.

[JonInMiddleGA]

The DX promos for WWE shop are sooo bad they're actually entertaining.

[Terps]

Originally Posted by Maple Leafs

Sheamus won? Ugh.

That sounds like one of those deals where they realize that nobody takes a guy's chances seriously, so they decide to put him over just out of spite.

I'd rather a guy win out of spite, then have John Cena be the champion still.

[DeToxRox]

Meltzer is reporting Bret Hart has signed a short term deal with WWE through WrestleMania. That is awesome to see. I wonder how they'll end up using him if it ends up being true.

[Schmidty]

Originally Posted by Terps

I'd rather a guy win out of spite, then have John Cena be the champion still.

I'm so sick of you Cena haters.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by DeToxRox

Meltzer is reporting Bret Hart has signed a short term deal with WWE through WrestleMania. That is awesome to see. I wonder how they'll end up using him if it ends up being true.

I have to think he'll return on the Monday (Jan 4?) that they're head to head with Hogan on TNA.

[Terps]

Hopefully he's the RAW GM, or a manager to the Hart Dynasty.

[molson]

Here's a little more from Meltzer:

"According to a WWE source who would have full knowledge of the situation, Hart, 52, signed a short-term talent contract with WWE this past week covering the period from 1/1 to 4/10, or through WrestleMania and about two weeks after the 3/28 show at the University of Phoenix Stadium in Glendale, AZ. Hart simply told us that he wasn’t going to lie about anything and thus wasn’t going to say anything on the story. It was said that Hart wanted his signing to be kept quiet and his return to be a surprise, but that WWE couldn’t help itself but all but announced it publicly on the first Raw after the ink was dry.

Sources who were let in on the plans for Hart were told he would actually be wrestling, perhaps only once, and had agreed to do an angle based off the Survivor Series of 1997. Keep in mind McMahon told people the same thing in 2006, but the difference is none of the prior talks ever reached the stage where a contract was signed and where an angle aspect of the return was started on television.

It is not confirmed Hart will guest host the Jan. 4 show in Dayton, but we do know he is currently not scheduled to appear prior to that date and the angle made it appear he would debut under the guise of a one-time only guest host appearance."

The wrestling thing would be pretty shocking, even if it would most likely just be a Vince v. Bret "street fight" or something at Mania.

[DeToxRox]

Originally Posted by molson

Here's a little more from Meltzer:

"According to a WWE source who would have full knowledge of the situation, Hart, 52, signed a short-term talent contract with WWE this past week covering the period from 1/1 to 4/10, or through WrestleMania and about two weeks after the 3/28 show at the University of Phoenix Stadium in Glendale, AZ. Hart simply told us that he wasn’t going to lie about anything and thus wasn’t going to say anything on the story. It was said that Hart wanted his signing to be kept quiet and his return to be a surprise, but that WWE couldn’t help itself but all but announced it publicly on the first Raw after the ink was dry.

Sources who were let in on the plans for Hart were told he would actually be wrestling, perhaps only once, and had agreed to do an angle based off the Survivor Series of 1997. Keep in mind McMahon told people the same thing in 2006, but the difference is none of the prior talks ever reached the stage where a contract was signed and where an angle aspect of the return was started on television.

It is not confirmed Hart will guest host the Jan. 4 show in Dayton, but we do know he is currently not scheduled to appear prior to that date and the angle made it appear he would debut under the guise of a one-time only guest host appearance."

The wrestling thing would be pretty shocking, even if it would most likely just be a Vince v. Bret "street fight" or something at Mania.

Bret vs Vince would do absurd buys honestly. I think a lot of people would tune in for that but I could see a tag match to get two guys over, like Vince & Drew McIntyre, who has a storyline with Vince, vs Bret and Morrison or someone.

Ideally it'd be Bret & Hart Dynasty vs Vince & DX but no way DX ever goes heel so I can't see it.

[saldana]

Originally Posted by DeToxRox

Bret vs Vince would do absurd buys honestly. I think a lot of people would tune in for that but I could see a tag match to get two guys over, like Vince & Drew McIntyre, who has a storyline with Vince, vs Bret and Morrison or someone.

Ideally it'd be Bret & Hart Dynasty vs Vince & DX but no way DX ever goes heel so I can't see it.

i was thinking bret & harts vs vince and legacy without orton

[DeToxRox]

Originally Posted by saldana

i was thinking bret & harts vs vince and legacy without orton

I could see that also.

Lots of intrigue regardless.

[saldana]

Originally Posted by DeToxRox

I could see that also.

Lots of intrigue regardless.

honestly, wanting to know what they are going to do with him is probably going to be enough to get me to watch raw again.

i am interested to see what they are going to do on TNA with hogan (according to bubba the love sponge, the first thing is getting rid of the hexagonal ring), but i was always more of a hitman mark than a hogan one.

[Mota]

Originally Posted by Schmidty

I'm so sick of you Cena haters.

But why? He's the most pushed guy on the roster, and doesn't even get cheers from anybody other than kids and women.

His wrestling skills are mediocre, no match of the year candidates from this guy. So eventually you wonder why he gets pushed so much.

I think the WWE is in a horrible spot right now. They turn Batista heel, he starts getting cheered. Their top face gets booed in every arena. They've completely lost control of their product and can't get the fans to react the way they want. That's something that always was in their control in the past, they could always tell the crowd what to think and the peeps would buy into it whole-heartedly. That's no longer the case.

[SirFozzie]

Most of the anti-Cena reaction is knee jerk "He's on top, so I hate his guts" type shit.

[DeToxRox]

I like Cena but lately my hatred is because he is the symbol for WWE creative. He has made too many up and comers like the Miz, Swagger and Punk look like total idiots lately. I know it's not him personally but he's easiest to blame.

[saldana]

Originally Posted by Mota

But why? He's the most pushed guy on the roster, and doesn't even get cheers from anybody other than kids and women.

His wrestling skills are mediocre, no match of the year candidates from this guy. So eventually you wonder why he gets pushed so much.

I think the WWE is in a horrible spot right now. They turn Batista heel, he starts getting cheered. Their top face gets booed in every arena. They've completely lost control of their product and can't get the fans to react the way they want. That's something that always was in their control in the past, they could always tell the crowd what to think and the peeps would buy into it whole-heartedly. That's no longer the case.

i would have to disagree with this....i went to the Raw show that was the monday after survivor series, and the only people that got bigger pops from the entire place (granted, the giant center in Hershey isnt the biggest place in the world) were DX...in the 3 hours of the show plus the 20 minutes after it went off the air, cena came out 3 or 4 times and the place exploded each and every time.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Cool news tonight from Fozzy's Facebook page as Martyr No More is announced as an official theme song for the Royal Rumble



Don't blame me, just spreadin' the Fozzpel

[Maple Leafs]

OK, here's my question about a Hart/McMahon angle: how do you ignore the elephant in the room? How do you do it with HBK still prancing around as a face on the same show?

[Chubby]

Originally Posted by brassmonkey32

They can make Bret Hart the heel.

won't work, everybody will cheer him regardless.

[Neon_Chaos]

Back in '06, the WWE came to Manila.

Me and my buddies were big Cena haters...

We saw him perform live, and he got us cheering.

You can't help but root for him the way his matches are set up.

He's got that Hogan face-in-peril-to-superman vibe going during his matches, and you feel it in the arena whenever he performs and starts going nuts.

Cena's OK in my book.

It's the relative lack of creative freedom being given the wrestlers is what I think is wrong with the 'E. Every now and then they'd let someone off the creative leash, and they'd be able to show how good they are on the mic and on cam (Morrison, Kingston)... but not often enough.

[DaddyTorgo]

Cena is the cousin of one of my clients.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by Neon_Chaos

You can't help but root for him the way his matches are set up ... Cena's OK in my book.

That's kind of where I'm at with him I think. He's come quite a way from the annoying white rapper character & while it's all extremely packaged, there aren't many guys who aren't these days. It's not a terrible gimmick, he does what he can with it, and I feel like he genuinely tries to do the best he can most of the time. And his delivery of the gimmick is pretty solid.

Better that than watching the oldtimers phone it in.

[Maple Leafs]

Originally Posted by brassmonkey32

They can make Bret Hart the heel.

Even though I think the anti-American Hart Foundation is the single greatest angle of all-time, I can't see this working. Besides, why would Bret agree to come back just to be booed?

On that note, how many pages do you think the "creative control" section of Bret's new contract is? 300? 500?

[molson]

Originally Posted by Maple Leafs

Even though I think the anti-American Hart Foundation is the single greatest angle of all-time, I can't see this working. Besides, why would Bret agree to come back just to be booed?

On that note, how many pages do you think the "creative control" section of Bret's new contract is? 300? 500?

Ya, I'm sure everything that's going to happend had to be all plotted out before he signed.

I think it'll be more Vince v. Hart than HBK v. Hart. I wouldn't be surprised if HBK went on vacation or otherwise wasn't a huge part of the angle.

[SirFozzie]

So a hot blonde just spent the beginning of RAW chasing a man in a tiger suit with a golf clun, all around the ring and to the back. Yah. Great start.

[SirFozzie]

edit: It's gone downhill from there. I swear, McMahon is TRYING to drive people to TNA.