Werewolf XXI - Werewolf goes to Hollywood - Game Over!! Death Eaters win!! - Page 49

Thomkal · 01-19-2006, 10:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dubb93

Superman wasn't a DE at that point. We actually thought he had dark detectors and then we took a shot at him and actually got him converted.

Ah never knew you could convert for some reason.

Thomkal · 01-19-2006, 10:29 PM

Well my grumblings aside, the evil guys pulled out a big victory after a disastrous first couple days, so good job again.

Buccaneer · 01-19-2006, 10:32 PM

Thomkal, what's the beef? Jeebs needed to vote.

Eaglesfan27 · 01-19-2006, 10:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Buccaneer

Thomkal, what's the beef? Jeebs needed to vote.

True. It's not like he wouldn't have voted with his DE buddies.

Thomkal · 01-19-2006, 10:34 PM

Oh almost forgot this. Back when Dubb was making sure I knew the DE's could PM each other, I posted that I knew and debated over adding the fact that yes and your vote switching could be a prime example of the DE's changing their voting plan mid-day. Wish I had kept it in now of course, but I'm not sure it would have convinced anyone other than Desnudo who had already brought it up, and I felt more strongly about Ardent at the time, and was trying to stay focused on him.

Grammaticus · 01-19-2006, 10:39 PM

Dammit, I knew I should have Duked Dubb. At one point, I sent in the PM to change the lynch to him, If I won the vote. That was the day I said I was going to do something pivotal. But, I did not win. Then I decided on Schmidty

Thomkal · 01-19-2006, 10:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Buccaneer

Thomkal, what's the beef? Jeebs needed to vote.

Bucc,

I agree-he needed to vote. It was certainly fair that the DE's got a replacement for one of their missing members like the good guys did. It was the timing of it that bothered me. I would have much rather had you active the entire day so we could question you about things. Who knows maybe we would have caught you in a lie, or you would say something that got people voting for you. Unlikely it would have happened, but hey its werewolf.

Thomkal · 01-19-2006, 10:43 PM

Oh what the heck happened with WVUFan's Cloak? Who cast the spell on him to confuse him so he couldn't remember, and how could you see him when he was invisible. Whatever it was really saved the day for the bad guys.

Buccaneer · 01-19-2006, 10:43 PM

Thomkal, that's cool. You pointed out the reason why I have not and could not join a WW game, I am only on FOFC for about 2 hours prior to the 9:30pm deadline. Not being on at all during the weekday and only on close to the deadline are sure ways of ending up dead. In this case, I truly didn't hear back from Saldana until 15 mins before deadline. He said the game was in the bag so I could come in and have a little fun if I wanted.

Poli · 01-19-2006, 10:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Eaglesfan27

By the way, I was fairly sure that AE was a DE after I read everything, but didn't have a good idea who the others were. That is part of why I was trying to support AE's post (which was a good post.)

Thanks.

Sorry, Coder. You never were on my ignore list. I just had to fake some emotion there.

Faking emotion was incredibly hard for me. I had to do it a couple of times. By emotion I mean when I'm a villager, I hold nothing back. I'm looking at everything. As a DE, I had to force myself to do things.

Grammaticus · 01-19-2006, 10:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TazFTW

RPI? Wasn't RPI already dead?

I think he meant Raiders Army

Poli · 01-19-2006, 10:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TazFTW

RPI? Wasn't RPI already dead?

I believe he meant...you.

Thomkal · 01-19-2006, 10:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Buccaneer

Thomkal, that's cool. You pointed out the reason why I have not and could not join a WW game, I am only on FOFC for about 2 hours prior to the 9:30pm deadline. Not being on at all during the weekday and only on close to the deadline are sure ways of ending up dead. In this case, I truly didn't hear back from Saldana until 15 mins before deadline. He said the game was in the bag so I could come in and have a little fun if I wanted.

Ah I see. Apologies then-I'm glad you got to play even if it was for about five minutes.

Poli · 01-19-2006, 10:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thomkal

Oh what the heck happened with WVUFan's Cloak? Who cast the spell on him to confuse him so he couldn't remember, and how could you see him when he was invisible. Whatever it was really saved the day for the bad guys.

You can thank me for that. Jeeber and I were in on the kill. As we went our separate ways, WVU chose the wrong one to follow. I had the ability to alter his memory so he wouldn't remember me.

I was the only DE in on every kill.

SnDvls · 01-19-2006, 11:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dubb93

And when I switched to Sun I did so against the support of the team. My thought was I didn't want the seer around another day. And if Sun lived the seer would get another scan. Sorry Sun, but I'd take 1 less seer over 1 more wolf any day.

well it looks like my death wasn't all that bad. It threw so many people off so many ways.

Coder - thanks for actually picking up on my wikipeda search. I actually got both my spells from there and took almost direct quotes from it.

SnDvls · 01-19-2006, 11:08 PM

I sure learned a lot from watching and know who the DE's were that's for sure. But I did suck as a bad guy. I'll admit that.

path12 · 01-19-2006, 11:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thomkal

Lathum voted Path three times-I went back and checked his votes when his role was revealed. If he was that suspicious of him, why didn't he view him?

I wish he would have

Good job, DE's.

Desnudo · 01-19-2006, 11:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Grammaticus

Dammit, I knew I should have Duked Dubb. At one point, I sent in the PM to change the lynch to him, If I won the vote. That was the day I said I was going to do something pivotal. But, I did not win. Then I decided on Schmidty

I can't believe how many times I felt like we needed to string him up, including today. I guess that's why he's good though.

Edit: at the end I kept coming back to that SunDvls vote. I had a nagging thought that a truly devious person would do something like that, but it didn't seem to make sense. I can understand the logic now although it was definitely risky.

saldana · 01-19-2006, 11:24 PM

a couple quick answers while i am still at work...

superman was converted on Night 5

i will post all the secret roles and such later tonight or tommorow morning, they are on my laptop and i am at work right now with no connection for that computer

as he said, the game was technically over when i told bucc he could vote...one way or another a wizard was going to die, making it 5 to 4 with the night action coming

as far as the balance goes, a typical game with 20 players has 3 wolves plus a turncoat...or a max of 1 wolf for every 4 villagers. this game had a 5+1 wolves with 28 players or a max of 1 DE for every 3.667 villagers, but in return, the villagers got 2 seers, the possibility of 3 blessed, 2 PK wizards, and a free turn on night 0 (which you hit on)

Ardent Obliviated WVUFan the night he tried to use his role...it was literally a coin flip to see if he followed jeebs or ardent, and it just didnt work out for WVU.....as a general theme, the breaks all went to the DE's after sndvls was killed

kingfc22 · 01-20-2006, 01:01 AM

I knwe AE was a death eater. I put it together that dubb must be a DE as well once I died since he defended AE so quickly.

saldana · 01-20-2006, 01:52 AM

here are some of the extra roles, including who played them and a brief explanation of what went on with them.

Additional secret roles/abilities:
Dubb - Master of Non-verbal spells – (DE) if you are the lynch candidate, you may choose one other wizard to cast a spell at non-verbally, allowing you to kill another player before your own death. (simply just the brutal wolf)

Superman - Pure blood wizard – as a descendant of a long line of pure blood wizards, you have some respect for what the Dark Lord is doing. If the Death Eaters choose to attack you at night, you will decide to join them instead of being killed.(The DE's never knew this role existed until after the conversion, which i thought kept the balance a little bit better, and superman almost choked on it if you go back to the first day when he almost dared them to come and kill him. he was converted on night 5)

Ardent - Master of the Confundus Charm – (DE) if you are witnessed by a wizard wearing the invisibility cloak, you can perform the Confundus charm, altering his memory of seeing you. (basically, i felt like the witness is too powerful a role, so i put this mechanic in as a defense against it...ardent could not be witnessed, but the night WVU went out, he saw 2 death eaters, ardent and jeebs, so i flipped a coin to see if WVU would "follow" jeebs or ardent...since the toss chose ardent, WVU was confunded instead of making the read...had he gotten jeebs on the flip, he would have been told.)

Taz - Felix Felicis – you possess a small vial of liquid luck. You may choose one day or night cycle to drink the potion, and during that cycle, you will benefit from incomparable luck. (i am not sure Taz ever really understood how to use this and that may have been my fault, but the intended mechanic was that if drank it, basically nothing bad would happen to him, he would not have been lynched, poisoned, or murdered if taken during the right cycle.)

Blade - Master of Defense Against the Dark Arts - in the event of a tie lynch vote, you may choose to defend one of the lynch candidates with your defense skills. This ability may only be used once, and your decision to use it may be sent to the DM at any point during the Day cycle, including the first 15 minutes after the Lynch Deadline.(this was the tie breaker role, if he had used it, Blade would have cast a Patronus Charm to defend his choice in the tie...the patronus of course would have come out of his wand in the form of a giant spectral yak with a huge penis)

This was part of barkeep's role - Auror Power – if you choose to protect yourself, you gain the benefit of your dark detectors. Should the Death Eaters target you on a night you are protecting yourself and only one Death Eater attacks you, you will duel with the Death Eater and have a 50/50 chance of killing him instead of dying yourself. (so actually the auror was part blessed, part assassin, and part bodyguard, just not all at once. the death eaters didnt know about this at all, and actually sent out at least 2 killers every night, even though they didnt have to at all after night one was over)

Jeeber and AlanT - Potions Master – after years of practice, you have perfected the skills necessary to make the finest potions known to Wizarding kind. As a one time night action, you may choose to administer an extremely potent poison to another player, killing them. You will not be revealed by this action. (the mechanic for this role was that you started the game with one potion...if you were still alive after 5 days, you would get another..thats why there were 2 nights with 2 kills...alan died without ever using his 1st one)

Lathum and Qwikshot - Student of Magic – even though your years at Hogwarts are long since past, you continue to advance yourself in the magical arts. (the mechanic here was if the potions master or seer for each side died, 2 nights later, you would assume their role...qwik never got a chance, but Lathum became the Legilimens on night 5, only to die quickly the next night)

the biggest problem the wizards had were two decisions that Grammaticus made and then unmade. on successive nights, he decided to Duke Jeeber, but only if he were the lynchee, which he wasnt, so nothing happened. the next night he sent in that he was going to Duke Dubb, no conditions, and then at the last minute changed it to only if he were the lynchee, which he wasnt. And then obviously lost his power when he duked Schmidty, so that chain of events was a 6 player swing, because he would have kept his power when duking jeebs, saved lathum from being poisoned, duked dubb, spared both the wizards that were lynched in their places, and maybe not duked schmidty...this was basically the turning point in the whole game.

Desnudo · 01-20-2006, 02:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kingfc22

I knwe AE was a death eater. I put it together that dubb must be a DE as well once I died since he defended AE so quickly.

When you died, that really took the wind out of me. After the day cycle, I trusted you and felt like we had a chance. The DEs really killed all the right people at the right times. And we all made the wrong decisions at the wrong times.

kingfc22 · 01-20-2006, 02:03 AM

Yea, the DE's did a great job of targeting the wizards and disposing of them at the perfect time.

saldana · 01-20-2006, 02:04 AM

in case anyone was wondering, if you count the 4 guys alive at the end that were killed by voldemort, there were 20 consecutive wizards killed in this game

TazFTW · 01-20-2006, 02:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by saldana

Taz - Felix Felicis – you possess a small vial of liquid luck. You may choose one day or night cycle to drink the potion, and during that cycle, you will benefit from incomparable luck. (i am not sure Taz ever really understood how to use this and that may have been my fault, but the intended mechanic was that if drank it, basically nothing bad would happen to him, he would not have been lynched, poisoned, or murdered if taken during the right cycle.)

I knew what it was after I PM'd you about it. Apparently I mistook the statement about "gain some special insights into what is happening around you." as receiving some sort of clue about the DEs.

It wasn't that useful an item since I had to guess if the DEs would attack me and then when they want to kill me. Day cycle it had no use since I wasn't getting much heat until Desnudo kept accusing me late in the game.

Lathum · 01-20-2006, 03:49 AM

OK, to answer the seer questions.

I didn't become the seer until night 5 because as a student I needed time to learn the trait. I viewed schmidty my first night because he was just as suspicious as anyone and I needed somewhere to start. Dubb was my next choice. The reason why I was obvious about schmidty was I knew we were close to losing and I didn't want him to get duked which I knew would be the end of us.

The next night I viewed dubb but got whacked.

At the risk of sounding concieted I was one day away from breaking the game open.

MVP goes to Dubb, great game.

Blade6119 · 01-20-2006, 04:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mr. Wednesday

WTF was up with Blade trying to get himself killed (and succeeding) on day 1?

I knew i was going down regardless from night actions even if i said nothing, so i shared what info i had.

My other goal was since i was merely the tie-breaker i could draw attention to myself, and protect the seer and bodyguard for a night...and then they both died/revealed anyways

Blade6119 · 01-20-2006, 04:14 AM

And i still dont get how you guys dont get dubb and ardent...Practically every vocal experienced player was killed off but those two and no one seemed to notice until like the last day...the first few days were just vets, but these two didnt die...that should be a big clue

Alan T · 01-20-2006, 04:14 AM

Thanks for the great game you ran this time. Im sorry that i did not get to stay around a little longer

As was mentioned, I never used my potion to kill someone in the night. Mainly that was because after 2 days I had not gotten a great feel for who was on my side and who wasn't. I felt it would be wasting my ability to just blindly use it on someone and hope I got a bad person.

For whatever its worth, i casted 3 votes in this game. 2 of the 3 I picked were DEs. (Qwikshot and Jeebers). I think the turning point of this game was day 2 when we thought we did ourselves a favor in getting our second wolf. I think in hindsight it hurt us a bit because from that point on we never focused on narrowing down our circle of trust and instead blindly picked every day from then on based on guessing. I think that alot of people ran off with Neon's witch hunt which in the end proved very poorly for ourside. I think a few people played an excellent game, I think St.Cronin was on the right track early on, and thats why he was killed. I think Dubbs did a good job, he had me fooled.

Fun game to participate in for a few days and then to watch from here on out. Thanks for letting me join everyone

Blade6119 · 01-20-2006, 04:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alan T

I think that alot of people ran off with Neon's witch hunt which in the end proved very poorly for ourside.

Im stunned at this, as the night he died neon couldnt stop telling you all to go after dubb....and nobody seemed to care...he said it like 20 times that night...and everyone just overlooked it...i was shocked....

Lathum · 01-20-2006, 04:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Blade6119

Im stunned at this, as the night he died neon couldnt stop telling you all to go after dubb....and nobody seemed to care...he said it like 20 times that night...and everyone just overlooked it...i was shocked....

i didn't overlook it, i was just to late.

Blade6119 · 01-20-2006, 04:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lathum

i didn't overlook it, i was just to late.

lol, late review? Im also a little dissapointed that no one noticed it was only people talking about dubb or ardent that were getting killed....neon, cronin, schmidty(he was dead by night if not by duking), coffee...no one seemed to notice after the barkeep and i were killed night 1 that only players calling out the right people were getting killed...just a lot of things i saw that could have been taken advantage of, but i guess every game is a learning situation

Lathum · 01-20-2006, 05:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Blade6119

lol, late review? Im also a little dissapointed that no one noticed it was only people talking about dubb or ardent that were getting killed....neon, cronin, schmidty(he was dead by night if not by duking), coffee...no one seemed to notice after the barkeep and i were killed night 1 that only players calling out the right people were getting killed...just a lot of things i saw that could have been taken advantage of, but i guess every game is a learning situation

i saw it but took a 50/50 shot and picked wrong.

Desnudo · 01-20-2006, 05:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Blade6119

lol, late review? Im also a little dissapointed that no one noticed it was only people talking about dubb or ardent that were getting killed....neon, cronin, schmidty(he was dead by night if not by duking), coffee...no one seemed to notice after the barkeep and i were killed night 1 that only players calling out the right people were getting killed...just a lot of things i saw that could have been taken advantage of, but i guess every game is a learning situation

So you would have had Superman and Jeeber nailed down too? I agree that we should have had a vote on Dubb, despite his vote for SnDvls, that was a serious error on our part. The main problem is that no one stepped forward from the wizards side and really drove decisions. I've always been a consensus builder, not an all or nothing type, but I think in this game we needed someone on the wizards side to step up and take a risk. That didn't happen, so we lost.

Anyway, it's obvious that the wizards screwed the pooch, but despite the fact that we got two DEs early we also lost all of our good roles early, except Lathum who only factored late, and briefly. Another non-favorable factor, imo, was the disapearance of Pass, WVU, Jeeber and Superman for several votes. I believe that it should be miss two votes and you are gone, as I've seen implemented in other games. It's really not fair to the people who are active.

Lathum · 01-20-2006, 05:21 AM

I think the death eaters did a nice job but we screwed ourselves. I was pushing 3 days for path, if we had killed him earlier maybe I would have been able to focus on someone else.

Lathum · 01-20-2006, 05:24 AM

dola. putting blame on myself there.

Desnudo · 01-20-2006, 05:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lathum

I think the death eaters did a nice job but we screwed ourselves. I was pushing 3 days for path, if we had killed him earlier maybe I would have been able to focus on someone else.

I think we all made major errors in judgement. I knew we needed to have a vote on Dubb, but I kept putting off pushing for a vote because I wanted him to be wizard and it was plausible enough so I let it go. This game was a classic case of errors compounding on errors to create a disastrous situation.

Raiders Army · 01-20-2006, 06:37 AM

So Ardent and dubb were pulling the strings!

Lathum · 01-20-2006, 06:42 AM

damn RA, what are you doing up?

Raiders Army · 01-20-2006, 07:04 AM

I gotta get ready for work. I'm usually up this time of the day.

Lathum · 01-20-2006, 07:15 AM

i never knew

Thomkal · 01-20-2006, 07:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Blade6119

Im stunned at this, as the night he died neon couldnt stop telling you all to go after dubb....and nobody seemed to care...he said it like 20 times that night...and everyone just overlooked it...i was shocked....

He also couldn't stop telling us he felt he was safe.

Coder · 01-20-2006, 07:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ardent enthusiast

Thanks.

Sorry, Coder. You never were on my ignore list. I just had to fake some emotion there.

Faking emotion was incredibly hard for me. I had to do it a couple of times. By emotion I mean when I'm a villager, I hold nothing back. I'm looking at everything. As a DE, I had to force myself to do things.

I understand that, and I felt it all along (hence my constant smiley-faces). However, I felt that you were overplaying it a few times, i.e. pushing a bit too hard. I was VERY surprised that the others weren't picking this up. There was no way you were the seer, which should have been picked up by the others when Lathum died at least, but you were pushing my guilt as if you KNEW I was a baddie, yet you didn't want to reveal a role too easily.

This game was frustrating for me at the end since I was too suspected to get my voice heard properly. I was resigned to die because everyone was so focused on me that I had to go to be able to get them to open their eyes towards Ardent. I was absolutely SHOCKED that the wizards didn't pile on Ardent after I was lynched.

I knew the last day I was alive that the AE, Dubb and Superman were killers. I had Dubb on my list the longest, but never actually voted for him.. there were too many inscrepancies.. You guys did an awesome job keeping me alive but constantly the most suspected player for two-three days. That confused the hell out of all wizards I think.

Thomkal · 01-20-2006, 07:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Blade6119

And i still dont get how you guys dont get dubb and ardent...Practically every vocal experienced player was killed off but those two and no one seemed to notice until like the last day...the first few days were just vets, but these two didnt die...that should be a big clue

By the same logic, Raiders was a very vocal experienced player and yet he was a wizard. So your logic doesn't work all the time there.

Thomkal · 01-20-2006, 08:01 AM

Coder,

I tried after you died-I voted for Ardent right away. I guess I should have posted some long detailed vote analysis like he did.

Thomkal · 01-20-2006, 08:15 AM

I waited till the game was over to bring this up. In the early games Blade and I went at it over his comments as a ghost influencing the games-especially because he commented about me in one of them. One of the reasons (besides the fact that I suck at Werewolf) that I stop playing.

Blade whether you think so or not, comments by ghosts CAN influence people still alive in the game. People do think differently than you, and comments that seem "safe" to you may trigger thoughts in someone else that lead to someone figuring out something about the game and/or a still living person in the game. The fact is if you are a ghost you were killed off either/or because of your power, your knowledge, or your analysis of the voting trends or who you think the wolves are. They killed you off to STOP you from continuing to use all that. You should respect that and keep your comments to yourself or with the other ghosts privately. In my opinion the only thing a ghost should be saying is either "Go good guys or go bad guys" after a lynch/kill if their role had been revealed upon death.

Blade6119 · 01-20-2006, 09:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Desnudo

So you would have had Superman and Jeeber nailed down too? I agree that we should have had a vote on Dubb, despite his vote for SnDvls, that was a serious error on our part. The main problem is that no one stepped forward from the wizards side and really drove decisions. I've always been a consensus builder, not an all or nothing type, but I think in this game we needed someone on the wizards side to step up and take a risk. That didn't happen, so we lost.

Anyway, it's obvious that the wizards screwed the pooch, but despite the fact that we got two DEs early we also lost all of our good roles early, except Lathum who only factored late, and briefly. Another non-favorable factor, imo, was the disapearance of Pass, WVU, Jeeber and Superman for several votes. I believe that it should be miss two votes and you are gone, as I've seen implemented in other games. It's really not fair to the people who are active.

Jeeber im not sure i ever would have gotten, but thats more becuase of his quietness then anything...super i would have had early in the game. He asked to be night killed instead of lynched, and that exact comment was quoted like 10 times....that screams turncoat

Blade6119 · 01-20-2006, 09:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thomkal

By the same logic, Raiders was a very vocal experienced player and yet he was a wizard. So your logic doesn't work all the time there.

I think raiders should have been a suspect by that logic, yes...but 2-3 is amazing odds

Coder · 01-20-2006, 09:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Blade6119

Jeeber im not sure i ever would have gotten, but thats more becuase of his quietness then anything...super i would have had early in the game. He asked to be night killed instead of lynched, and that exact comment was quoted like 10 times....that screams turncoat

Super wasn't a deatheater until night 6 according to dubb.

Blade6119 · 01-20-2006, 10:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Coder

Super wasn't a deatheater until night 6 according to dubb.

he was the turncoat...he becomes a DE when he is night attacked and only that...so lynching him before he becomes a DE is a smart move...turncoats also win with wolves, so even though he was a villager he wasnt. Thats why all the dead found it soo funny that he was the last second vote that killed sun, as he wanted just the opposite

01-20-2006, 01:01 AM	#2420
kingfc22 Head Coach Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Morgan Hill, CA	I knwe AE was a death eater. I put it together that dubb must be a DE as well once I died since he defended AE so quickly. __________________ Fan of SF Giants, 49ers, Sharks, Arsenal

01-20-2006, 01:52 AM	#2421
saldana Pro Starter Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Bethlehem, Pa	here are some of the extra roles, including who played them and a brief explanation of what went on with them. Additional secret roles/abilities: Dubb - Master of Non-verbal spells – (DE) if you are the lynch candidate, you may choose one other wizard to cast a spell at non-verbally, allowing you to kill another player before your own death. (simply just the brutal wolf) Superman - Pure blood wizard – as a descendant of a long line of pure blood wizards, you have some respect for what the Dark Lord is doing. If the Death Eaters choose to attack you at night, you will decide to join them instead of being killed.(The DE's never knew this role existed until after the conversion, which i thought kept the balance a little bit better, and superman almost choked on it if you go back to the first day when he almost dared them to come and kill him. he was converted on night 5) Ardent - Master of the Confundus Charm – (DE) if you are witnessed by a wizard wearing the invisibility cloak, you can perform the Confundus charm, altering his memory of seeing you. (basically, i felt like the witness is too powerful a role, so i put this mechanic in as a defense against it...ardent could not be witnessed, but the night WVU went out, he saw 2 death eaters, ardent and jeebs, so i flipped a coin to see if WVU would "follow" jeebs or ardent...since the toss chose ardent, WVU was confunded instead of making the read...had he gotten jeebs on the flip, he would have been told.) Taz - Felix Felicis – you possess a small vial of liquid luck. You may choose one day or night cycle to drink the potion, and during that cycle, you will benefit from incomparable luck. (i am not sure Taz ever really understood how to use this and that may have been my fault, but the intended mechanic was that if drank it, basically nothing bad would happen to him, he would not have been lynched, poisoned, or murdered if taken during the right cycle.) Blade - Master of Defense Against the Dark Arts - in the event of a tie lynch vote, you may choose to defend one of the lynch candidates with your defense skills. This ability may only be used once, and your decision to use it may be sent to the DM at any point during the Day cycle, including the first 15 minutes after the Lynch Deadline.(this was the tie breaker role, if he had used it, Blade would have cast a Patronus Charm to defend his choice in the tie...the patronus of course would have come out of his wand in the form of a giant spectral yak with a huge penis) This was part of barkeep's role - Auror Power – if you choose to protect yourself, you gain the benefit of your dark detectors. Should the Death Eaters target you on a night you are protecting yourself and only one Death Eater attacks you, you will duel with the Death Eater and have a 50/50 chance of killing him instead of dying yourself. (so actually the auror was part blessed, part assassin, and part bodyguard, just not all at once. the death eaters didnt know about this at all, and actually sent out at least 2 killers every night, even though they didnt have to at all after night one was over) Jeeber and AlanT - Potions Master – after years of practice, you have perfected the skills necessary to make the finest potions known to Wizarding kind. As a one time night action, you may choose to administer an extremely potent poison to another player, killing them. You will not be revealed by this action. (the mechanic for this role was that you started the game with one potion...if you were still alive after 5 days, you would get another..thats why there were 2 nights with 2 kills...alan died without ever using his 1st one) Lathum and Qwikshot - Student of Magic – even though your years at Hogwarts are long since past, you continue to advance yourself in the magical arts. (the mechanic here was if the potions master or seer for each side died, 2 nights later, you would assume their role...qwik never got a chance, but Lathum became the Legilimens on night 5, only to die quickly the next night) the biggest problem the wizards had were two decisions that Grammaticus made and then unmade. on successive nights, he decided to Duke Jeeber, but only if he were the lynchee, which he wasnt, so nothing happened. the next night he sent in that he was going to Duke Dubb, no conditions, and then at the last minute changed it to only if he were the lynchee, which he wasnt. And then obviously lost his power when he duked Schmidty, so that chain of events was a 6 player swing, because he would have kept his power when duking jeebs, saved lathum from being poisoned, duked dubb, spared both the wizards that were lynched in their places, and maybe not duked schmidty...this was basically the turning point in the whole game. Last edited by saldana : 01-20-2006 at 01:52 AM.

01-20-2006, 02:03 AM	#2423
kingfc22 Head Coach Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Morgan Hill, CA	Yea, the DE's did a great job of targeting the wizards and disposing of them at the perfect time. __________________ Fan of SF Giants, 49ers, Sharks, Arsenal

01-20-2006, 04:14 AM	#2428
Blade6119 Coordinator Join Date: Dec 2000 Location: Scottsdale, Arizona	And i still dont get how you guys dont get dubb and ardent...Practically every vocal experienced player was killed off but those two and no one seemed to notice until like the last day...the first few days were just vets, but these two didnt die...that should be a big clue __________________ *Underachievement* The tallest blade of grass is the first to be cut by the lawnmower. *Despair* It's always darkest just before it goes pitch black. *Demotivation* Sometimes the best solution to morale problems is just to fire all of the unhappy people. http://www.despair.com/viewall.html

01-19-2006, 10:29 PM	#2402
Thomkal Head Coach Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Surfside Beach,SC USA	Well my grumblings aside, the evil guys pulled out a big victory after a disastrous first couple days, so good job again.

01-19-2006, 10:32 PM	#2403
Buccaneer Head Coach Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Colorado	Thomkal, what's the beef? Jeebs needed to vote.

01-19-2006, 10:34 PM	#2405
Thomkal Head Coach Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Surfside Beach,SC USA	Oh almost forgot this. Back when Dubb was making sure I knew the DE's could PM each other, I posted that I knew and debated over adding the fact that yes and your vote switching could be a prime example of the DE's changing their voting plan mid-day. Wish I had kept it in now of course, but I'm not sure it would have convinced anyone other than Desnudo who had already brought it up, and I felt more strongly about Ardent at the time, and was trying to stay focused on him.

01-19-2006, 10:39 PM	#2406
Grammaticus Pro Rookie Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Tennessee	Dammit, I knew I should have Duked Dubb. At one point, I sent in the PM to change the lynch to him, If I won the vote. That was the day I said I was going to do something pivotal. But, I did not win. Then I decided on Schmidty

01-19-2006, 10:43 PM	#2408
Thomkal Head Coach Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Surfside Beach,SC USA	Oh what the heck happened with WVUFan's Cloak? Who cast the spell on him to confuse him so he couldn't remember, and how could you see him when he was invisible. Whatever it was really saved the day for the bad guys.

01-19-2006, 10:43 PM	#2409
Buccaneer Head Coach Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Colorado	Thomkal, that's cool. You pointed out the reason why I have not and could not join a WW game, I am only on FOFC for about 2 hours prior to the 9:30pm deadline. Not being on at all during the weekday and only on close to the deadline are sure ways of ending up dead. In this case, I truly didn't hear back from Saldana until 15 mins before deadline. He said the game was in the bag so I could come in and have a little fun if I wanted.

01-19-2006, 11:08 PM	#2416
SnDvls Pro Starter Join Date: Jul 2001	I sure learned a lot from watching and know who the DE's were that's for sure. But I did suck as a bad guy. I'll admit that.

01-19-2006, 11:24 PM	#2419
saldana Pro Starter Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Bethlehem, Pa	a couple quick answers while i am still at work... superman was converted on Night 5 i will post all the secret roles and such later tonight or tommorow morning, they are on my laptop and i am at work right now with no connection for that computer as he said, the game was technically over when i told bucc he could vote...one way or another a wizard was going to die, making it 5 to 4 with the night action coming as far as the balance goes, a typical game with 20 players has 3 wolves plus a turncoat...or a max of 1 wolf for every 4 villagers. this game had a 5+1 wolves with 28 players or a max of 1 DE for every 3.667 villagers, but in return, the villagers got 2 seers, the possibility of 3 blessed, 2 PK wizards, and a free turn on night 0 (which you hit on) Ardent Obliviated WVUFan the night he tried to use his role...it was literally a coin flip to see if he followed jeebs or ardent, and it just didnt work out for WVU.....as a general theme, the breaks all went to the DE's after sndvls was killed

01-20-2006, 02:04 AM	#2424
saldana Pro Starter Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Bethlehem, Pa	in case anyone was wondering, if you count the 4 guys alive at the end that were killed by voldemort, there were 20 consecutive wizards killed in this game

01-20-2006, 03:49 AM	#2426
Lathum Favored Bitch #1 Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: homeless in NJ	OK, to answer the seer questions. I didn't become the seer until night 5 because as a student I needed time to learn the trait. I viewed schmidty my first night because he was just as suspicious as anyone and I needed somewhere to start. Dubb was my next choice. The reason why I was obvious about schmidty was I knew we were close to losing and I didn't want him to get duked which I knew would be the end of us. The next night I viewed dubb but got whacked. At the risk of sounding concieted I was one day away from breaking the game open. MVP goes to Dubb, great game.

01-20-2006, 04:14 AM	#2429
Alan T Hall Of Famer Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Mass.	Thanks for the great game you ran this time. Im sorry that i did not get to stay around a little longer As was mentioned, I never used my potion to kill someone in the night. Mainly that was because after 2 days I had not gotten a great feel for who was on my side and who wasn't. I felt it would be wasting my ability to just blindly use it on someone and hope I got a bad person. For whatever its worth, i casted 3 votes in this game. 2 of the 3 I picked were DEs. (Qwikshot and Jeebers). I think the turning point of this game was day 2 when we thought we did ourselves a favor in getting our second wolf. I think in hindsight it hurt us a bit because from that point on we never focused on narrowing down our circle of trust and instead blindly picked every day from then on based on guessing. I think that alot of people ran off with Neon's witch hunt which in the end proved very poorly for ourside. I think a few people played an excellent game, I think St.Cronin was on the right track early on, and thats why he was killed. I think Dubbs did a good job, he had me fooled. Fun game to participate in for a few days and then to watch from here on out. Thanks for letting me join everyone

01-20-2006, 05:21 AM	#2435
Lathum Favored Bitch #1 Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: homeless in NJ	I think the death eaters did a nice job but we screwed ourselves. I was pushing 3 days for path, if we had killed him earlier maybe I would have been able to focus on someone else.

01-20-2006, 05:24 AM	#2436
Lathum Favored Bitch #1 Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: homeless in NJ	dola. putting blame on myself there.

01-20-2006, 06:37 AM	#2438
Raiders Army Coordinator Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: The Black Hole	So Ardent and dubb were pulling the strings!

01-20-2006, 06:42 AM	#2439
Lathum Favored Bitch #1 Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: homeless in NJ	damn RA, what are you doing up?

01-20-2006, 07:04 AM	#2440
Raiders Army Coordinator Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: The Black Hole	I gotta get ready for work. I'm usually up this time of the day.

01-20-2006, 07:15 AM	#2441
Lathum Favored Bitch #1 Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: homeless in NJ	i never knew

01-20-2006, 08:01 AM	#2445
Thomkal Head Coach Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Surfside Beach,SC USA	Coder, I tried after you died-I voted for Ardent right away. I guess I should have posted some long detailed vote analysis like he did.

01-20-2006, 08:15 AM	#2446
Thomkal Head Coach Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Surfside Beach,SC USA	I waited till the game was over to bring this up. In the early games Blade and I went at it over his comments as a ghost influencing the games-especially because he commented about me in one of them. One of the reasons (besides the fact that I suck at Werewolf) that I stop playing. Blade whether you think so or not, comments by ghosts CAN influence people still alive in the game. People do think differently than you, and comments that seem "safe" to you may trigger thoughts in someone else that lead to someone figuring out something about the game and/or a still living person in the game. The fact is if you are a ghost you were killed off either/or because of your power, your knowledge, or your analysis of the voting trends or who you think the wolves are. They killed you off to STOP you from continuing to use all that. You should respect that and keep your comments to yourself or with the other ghosts privately. In my opinion the only thing a ghost should be saying is either "Go good guys or go bad guys" after a lynch/kill if their role had been revealed upon death.

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