The Official 2019 NBA Off-season Thread

[Arles]

I'm not sure how Boston is better -
Out: Irving, Horford, Morris, Rozier, Baynes
In: Kemba, Grant Williams, Kanter

Even if Tatum, Brown and Hayward take a big step forward (which is still a question), they will be relying on a lot of unproven guys for depth and injury replacements. I can go with Kemba for Kyrie being close to a fair swap, but Willams and Kanter for Horford, Morris, Rozier and Baynes is a big downgrade.

[Sublime 2]

I think Horford is an undeniable downgrade, everything else feels like a wash. Terry Rozier, without starter touches, is not good. The grand hope is that Tatum is a #1...and I'm still unsold on that.

It's a talent downgrade overall, but a wish on potential.

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[bhlloy]

Yeah, seems like it's replacing a deep muddled roster in which you hoped at least a few players stepped up on a given night with one where you hope players reach their potential and do it every night in more minutes. It's a risky proposition for sure.

Also think the bad rap Kyrie got in the dressing room is obscuring his value as a player - you're switching a .465/.390 career shooter who wasn't a negative in defensive advanced stats for a .418/.357 career shooter who was. It's not a huge downgrade but I also don't think it's a wash.

[Lathum]

I can't wait to play Rozier in DFS next year, he is going to be a usage monster.

[Vince, Pt. II]

Warriors manage to retain Kevon Looney at $15m over three years, and pick up Cauley-Stein and Glenn Robinson III for the minimum. Youth with upside for cheap; loving all of these moves.

The Warriors are going to look so very different next year. We'll get to see how good Kerr's coaching chops really are; can he adapt to different roster strengths like Popp is so good at?

[jbergey22]

Originally Posted by Vince, Pt. II

Warriors manage to retain Kevon Looney at $15m over three years, and pick up Cauley-Stein and Glenn Robinson III for the minimum. Youth with upside for cheap; loving all of these moves.

The Warriors are going to look so very different next year. We'll get to see how good Kerr's coaching chops really are; can he adapt to different roster strengths like Popp is so good at?

Cauley-Stein seems like a very nice signing and at that price? Young Athletic 7 footers losing value in the NBA or what? Nice find GS.

[Chief Rum]

Originally Posted by jbergey22

Cauley-Stein seems like a very nice signing and at that price? Young Athletic 7 footers losing value in the NBA or what? Nice find GS.

Agreed. I think WCS didn't like the long term deals he was being offered, so decided a short term show me deal with the Ws would give him a chance to better show off his offensive skills. Terrific move by the Dubs.

[Vince, Pt. II]

Yeah, win-win I think, as the third year is a player option so he can opt out if he does right.

[stevew]

In theory the Lakers minimum players won't matter if they get Kawhi. But it's getting close to slim pickings.

[korme]

Originally Posted by bhlloy

Also think the bad rap Kyrie got in the dressing room is obscuring his value as a player - you're switching a .465/.390 career shooter who wasn't a negative in defensive advanced stats for a .418/.357 career shooter who was. It's not a huge downgrade but I also don't think it's a wash.

Let's see how Kemba does with a full season surrounded by talented players. I'm guessing his efficiency gets a nice boost.

[molson]

Obvious talent downgrade for Celtics, but exceeding last year's win total seems at least do-able. (I don't know if there's any over/under numbers floating around yet.)

Considering there was no hope in bringing back Hoford and Irving, they did pretty well.

[Arles]

Originally Posted by molson

Obvious talent downgrade for Celtics, but exceeding last year's win total seems at least do-able. (I don't know if there's any over/under numbers floating around yet.)

Considering there was no hope in bringing back Hoford and Irving, they did pretty well.

I agree here. Given the hand they were dealt, Danny did pretty well. For the Lakers, if you assume they get Kawhi, here's a potential roster:

Lebron - Iggy* - Kawhi - Kouzma - Davis

Bench - Jared Dudley, Troy Daniels and 4-5 more from:

TJ McConnell, Austin Rivers, Justin Holiday, Jeremy Lin, Quinn Cook, Alex Caruso (PG)
JaMychal Green, KCP, Avery Bradley, Morris Twins, Jabari, Melo? (wing)
Cousins, Noah, Bender (C)

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by Arles

Austin Rivers

strictly fyi, Rivers re-signed with HOU

[bhlloy]

Just read one of the most mindblowing sports stats I think I've ever heard - the Knicks haven't had a first round pick sign a multi-year second contract since Charlie Ward 25 years ago. That's... incredible.

[molson]

Originally Posted by bhlloy

Just read one of the most mindblowing sports stats I think I've ever heard - the Knicks haven't had a first round pick sign a multi-year second contract since Charlie Ward 25 years ago. That's... incredible.

A while ago I was killing time looking at the careers of NBA draft picks outside the top 15. The odds of hitting on something productive at that point are minuscule. Every year there's so much discussion of the potential of late draft picks and even un-drafted guys on summer league rosters and the G-League. But they truly are long-shot lottery tickets. Of course, the Knicks are in the top 15 most of the time.

[bhlloy]

Originally Posted by Arles

I agree here. Given the hand they were dealt, Danny did pretty well. For the Lakers, if you assume they get Kawhi, here's a potential roster:

Lebron - Iggy* - Kawhi - Kouzma - Davis

Bench - Jared Dudley, Troy Daniels and 4-5 more from:

TJ McConnell, Austin Rivers, Justin Holiday, Jeremy Lin, Quinn Cook, Alex Caruso (PG)
JaMychal Green, KCP, Avery Bradley, Morris Twins, Jabari, Melo? (wing)
Cousins, Noah, Bender (C)

What kind of contracts are the Lakers able to add assuming Kawhi puts them right at the cap? Are mid-level exceptions still a thing? I haven't actually been able to find anything that says what they'd be able to add. Most things going around (especially from Lakers fans, ugh) seem pretty optimistic about players who will take lesser deals to ring chase, but I'm not sure what they are actually working with.

[bhlloy]

Originally Posted by molson

A while ago I was killing time looking at the careers of NBA draft picks outside the top 15. The odds of hitting on something productive at that point are minuscule. Every year there's so much discussion of the potential of late draft picks and even un-drafted guys on summer league rosters and the G-League. But they truly are long-shot lottery tickets. Of course, the Knicks are in the top 15 most of the time.

It's worse when you look at the players they've drafted and then jettisoned. You can probably argue they are pretty much in the middle of the pack for drafting, they just do an absolutely awful job getting rid of those picks to fail to compete or muddle forward without a plan.

At a glance over the last 15 years or so:
Nene
Ariza (never knew he was a Knicks pick or second rounder)
Channing Frye
David Lee
Wilson Chandler
Gallinari
Jordan Hill
Shumpert
Tim Hardaway Jr.
Porzingis

Not an all-NBA team by any means, but some useful players they've dumped along the way and the Porzingis deal is another huge strike out if they can't actually attract any FA with the cap space they freed up.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by bhlloy

What kind of contracts are the Lakers able to add assuming Kawhi puts them right at the cap? Are mid-level exceptions still a thing?

I believe it's one player at the $4.7m exception and the rest would be min sal guys

This isn't the only place I've seen that breakdown of it but it was the handiest one

[bhlloy]

Iggy's an interesting case as a guy who doesn't need money or rings... but even if you assume he's going to take the exception, there's a lot of guys on that list who I can't see being minsal guys.

[JPhillips]

Originally Posted by bhlloy

Just read one of the most mindblowing sports stats I think I've ever heard - the Knicks haven't had a first round pick sign a multi-year second contract since Charlie Ward 25 years ago. That's... incredible.

And I have no idea what they are doing now. On the one hand almost all of what they gave out are really one year contracts with a team option, but on the other, why are they putting together a team that could compete for the 8th seed when they have so little long-term talent?

[Atocep]

Originally Posted by JPhillips

And I have no idea what they are doing now. On the one hand almost all of what they gave out are really one year contracts with a team option, but on the other, why are they putting together a team that could compete for the 8th seed when they have so little long-term talent?

The defense of what they're doing, and I'm not saying I buy it, is that they've realized they're not going to sign guys by simply being the Knicks at this point. They feel they need to show they have sort of idea what they're doing and show a direction with improvement because free agents are buying what they're selling.

[miami_fan]

More cleanup of the McDonough era

Sources - Suns to waive Korver after Jackson deal

[Groundhog]

I'm really interested to see what happens with WCS in GSW. I liked him coming out of college but there have been a lot of whispers about him in Sacramento and he hasn't consistently been the type of player I thought he would be be in today's NBA, with the tools he has. Maybe Draymond and the Warriors will get him turned around.

[Arles]

Originally Posted by miami_fan

More cleanup of the McDonough era

Sources - Suns to waive Korver after Jackson deal

I think you could make the argument that Ryan McDonough rivals Billy King in New Jersey as one of the more incompetent GMs in recent memory. Here’s his resume:
1. Drafted all these busts in the top 8 over four seasons:
Alex Len
Dragen Bender
Marquise Chriss
Josh Jackson

2. Traded Isaiah Thomas and the Lakers first round pick to Boston and Philly to get Brandon Knight. Then, he gave Knight a massive extension to where he had to attach players to turn it into and equally awful Ryan Anderson contract.

3. Signed Tyson Chandler to a big FA deal as part of a plan to lure Lemarcus Aldridge that failed miserably.

4. Extended TJ Warren to a contract that made the team give up a high 2nd rounder to dump after he was injured and missed over 40 games.

5. Failed to bring in an FA PG despite having cap space after taking a big man #1 overall. This left Ayton to play his rookie season with DeAndre Melton, Isaiah Cannan, Jamal Crawford and Ellie Okobo as his PGs.

All in all, a pretty brutal showing of incompetence

[BishopMVP]

Originally Posted by miami_fan

More cleanup of the McDonough era

Sources - Suns to waive Korver after Jackson deal

Josh Jackson sucks, but why are they giving up Melton & a (probably high) 2nd round pick next year to save $4 million? I know those aren't great assets but why are the Suns giving up any assets? Ryan McDonough wasn't good, but he wasn't the real issue.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by BishopMVP

Josh Jackson sucks, but why are they giving up Melton & a (probably high) 2nd round pick next year to save $4 million? I know those aren't great assets but why are the Suns giving up any assets? Ryan McDonough wasn't good, but he wasn't the real issue.

from arizonasports.com

The Suns have agreed to a three-year, $51 million deal for point guard Ricky Rubio, leaving them short of the cap space required to fit Rubio’s contract on the books for next season. Jackson’s 2019-20 salary of $7 million comes off the books, now leaving the Suns enough room to add Rubio.

[bhlloy]

Any time you can jettison two recent first rounders plus give up additional assets to throw a ton of money at a guy who averaged 12 and 6 and was barely above replacement level, you just got to do it, amirite?

[Chief Rum]

Originally Posted by bhlloy

Any time you can jettison two recent first rounders plus give up additional assets to throw a ton of money at a guy who averaged 12 and 6 and was barely above replacement level, you just got to do it, amirite?

Well, but McDonough is so bad,.he does stuff like this.

Wait, he was fired last year?

[Groundhog]

Really hard to find a good reason to watch any of these California Classic summer league games given who is and isn't playing.

[bhlloy]

Looks like Iggy will be traded, not bought out

[Groundhog]

Earthquake hit during the 3rd Q of the Knicks-Pelicans summer league game, which was something else. Zion took a little while to get going but once he got started he looked like basically what I expected him to look like before a knee-clash took him out. The earthquake was about 3 quarters too late for Barrett though, 4-18 and looked like a real chucker.

[Vince, Pt. II]

Holy shit Clippers. They just got Kawhi and Paul George. Traded Shea Gilgeous-Alexander, Danilo Gallinari, five first round picks (four of them unprotected), and two pick swaps.

[bhlloy]

Holy shit is right. Pretty incredible that he’d choose a barebones Clippers roster just to play with George.

[stevew]

Holy shit!!!

[Chief Rum]

Originally Posted by bhlloy

Holy shit is right. Pretty incredible that he’d choose a barebones Clippers roster just to play with George.

Hmm... you didn't watch the Clips much last year, huh?

[Groundhog]

Yeah, didn't see that coming. Especially combined with the OKC trade. We have a wide open league next season, should be great.

[Groundhog]

30 mil over 2 years to Danny Green is pretty insane, but what else can the Lakers do I guess - Green had a lot of bargaining power on his side with who else is left on the market.

[stevew]

I thought Kawhi bought a house in Toronto, though

[BishopMVP]

Originally Posted by Groundhog

30 mil over 2 years to Danny Green is pretty insane, but what else can the Lakers do I guess - Green had a lot of bargaining power on his side with who else is left on the market.

We were joking about Marcus Morris getting overpaid if the Lakers didn't sign Kawhi, but good for Danny Green. Who knows, Mook might get a bag too.

[stevew]

I can’t make sense of the Clippers roster right now. Anyone have a rotation somewhere?

Beverly/KL/PG/Harkless/??? Then Harrell/Lou Will on the bench?

[BishopMVP]

Zubac at the 5? Idk, gonna sleep now & assume the details will be known by tomorrow. I like SGA, but if OKC doesn't flip him & tries to pair him with Russ good luck. Given that future draft pick collection the Thunder would be dumb not to trade Russ now.

[stevew]

Seriously who wants Westbrook? Flip him for Chris Paul?

[BishopMVP]

Originally Posted by stevew

Seriously who wants Westbrook? Flip him for Chris Paul?

I think Bill Simmons had him at like #18 on his mid season trade list, so I'm sure teams will be beating down their door...

In the real world I actually think I'd take that CP3 idea further & flip him for John Wall + a couple firsts. The Houston idea works on paper, but I don't think Chris Paul on a tanking team would work out well.

[stevew]

Yeah John Wall was my other thought. Or Wiggins and some picks? There’s not a lot of teams that would need Westbrook. And it’s not like he’d be worth watching in PHX/CLE some other trash team.

I guess maybe the Knicks are still in the league.

[stevew]

What about OKC flipping something for Kevin Love. Schroeder and enough contracts to stay under the tax. Does that make them pretty?

[Chief Rum]

Originally Posted by stevew

I can’t make sense of the Clippers roster right now. Anyone have a rotation somewhere?

Beverly/KL/PG/Harkless/??? Then Harrell/Lou Will on the bench?

PG: Beverly
SG: Shamet/LouWill/Robinson
SF: Kawhi/Harkless/Magruder
PF: PG/Harrell/their #1 pick this year
C: Zubac (RFA)

That's off the top of my head. Might still have Ty Wallace, Jawun Evans and Sindarius Thornwell. I'm sure they will add a couple veteran depth pieces.

[miami_fan]

Kawhi tells the big market Clippers to go get Paul George
Paul George forces the small market Thunder to trade him to the big market Clippers

Where are the tears for the small market teams?

[jbergey22]

LOL @ Lakers. Well played Kawhi in taking your time and letting the market dry up and screw the Lakers even more. Where is Boogie Cousins and are the Lakers a possibility?

Wished he(Kawhi) had wanted to stay in Toronto. He was treated like a star.

I think the 76ers have the best and most balanced roster.

1. 76ers
2. Bucks
3. Clippers
4. Lakers
5. Rockets
** Warriors bump ahead of the Lakers IF Klay comes back sooner than expected

[stevew]

Interesting that Toronto apparently passed on a RW/PG trade. Besides Siakam, I'm assuming Lowry and a bunch of other stuff to OKC. Toronto probably was not thrilled about paying a zillion dollars in luxury taxes.

[Arles]

Crazy last 12 hours. If you have 4 minutes to spare, you could do worse than watching this fantastic summary of NBA free agency in 2019:

NBA Fans During Free Agency 2019 ������ pic.twitter.com/HhFCvKxO3C

— Cameron Magruder (@ScooterMagruder) July 6, 2019