WW Small Game II: Football Tryouts (Day 5)

[Neuqua]

Bah, I thought maybe we had a chance to go two for two tonight with getting lucky.

[SnDvls]

lost might be on in other parts of the country too...I still have an hour

[SnDvls]

ooc: gotta give the little one a bath be back in a bit, but not during Lost

[Blade6119]

Originally Posted by SnDvls

Blade - what are you thoughts on spleen beign that Saldana voted for him with what he would know w/ his pseudo good guy role? smoke screen?

Id say no...i would imagine someone of saldana's exp level would know that when he died, with the knowledge of the bad guys he had, those he mentioned would be under the most scrutiny. Its different from if he were a wolf, and id assume it more clears spleen then damns him. Now, i by no means trust spleen(even less so after what he and LSG were doing today), but i dont think the saldana vote-vote reflects poorly upon him as he would have no knowledge of saldanas role and i dont think saldana would make it that easy for us.

[LoneStarGirl]

Barkeep, you know you missed some of the votes right? And why dont you write in red like the rest of the hosts? it makes it pretty

[LoneStarGirl]

sorry, not some of the votes... just mine.

I forget we only started with 12, my bad

[Neuqua]

Originally Posted by LoneStarGirl

And why dont you write in red like the rest of the hosts? it makes it pretty

Such a girl.....

[Barkeep49]

Originally Posted by LoneStarGirl

Barkeep, you know you missed some of the votes right? And why dont you write in red like the rest of the hosts? it makes it pretty

For the record I was the first one to use pretty colors. Or at least I was the first one to use colors for description and voting. Though I think I was the first to use pretty colors.

[LoneStarGirl]

Originally Posted by Barkeep49

For the record I was the first one to use pretty colors. Or at least I was the first one to use colors for description and voting. Though I think I was the first to use pretty colors.

Well why did you stop? I would appreciate pretty colors please sir, thank you.

[path12]

So I got lynched?

Totally understand and I apologize for not being around. I hope you all realize I would certainly have more of a presence if I could have. For some reason I have not been able to access from work the past two days and I've had plans in the evenings. I am able to access a bunch of other sites from work (including a forum using the same software as this one), and my work is not a place that really blocks access, so I'm not sure what the problem is -- but obviously I can't go to IS and say "Um, I need to access this werewolf forum that I always play on and can't reach right now".......

So.....good luck to the good guys and congrats to saldana!

[Barkeep49]

The night goes by. However, that day at school it is SnDvls who is not there. Seems like his parents found beer bottles in their garbage last night. SnDvls protested that they weren't his, and when did he have time to drink anyway? No matter, SnDvls has been told that he cannot try out for the football team. Of bigger concern for him is what happened when the Dean heard. While the school couldn't take formal action, it was enough of a concern to cause SnDvls to lose his job as Dean's Asisstant. Another tryout day and it feels like the moles are getting ever closer to getting on the team.

Day 3 now underway. 9 PM Lynch.

[Alan T]

Ugh

[spleen1015]

LSG's late vote for path doesn't look good for her.

Claiming the need to break the tie is good enough cover, but I'm not falling for it today.

VOTE LoneStarGirl

[Lathum]

time to go through sndvls posts

[Alan T]

Originally Posted by Lathum

time to go through sndvls posts

I did that earlier. He voted for the same person on day 2 after voting for them on day 1. I was thinking about voting for ntndeacon based on that, however it is sndvls' comment about the vote that made me reconsider. He stated it was another random vote for the same person as day 1.

This could have been cover to keep from outing himself as seer for anyone who asked why vote for the same guy two days in a row, or it could be that he voted ntn randomly day 1, chose to scan someone else night 1, found them to be a good guy and voted ntn again day 2.

THe only other thing I caught was Sndvls commented that he didn't like St.cronin's defending Lonestargirl, but my read on that was just his personal taste and nothing profound based on his role.

Right now I guess I am leaning towards voting Ntndeacon with the thought why would the seer vote for the same guy 2 days in a row, but I don't know that its a dead lock to me.

[Alan T]

Day 1

(1) Alan - Lathum (84)
(1) Blade - Ntndeacon (66)
(1) Sndvls - Neuqua (72)
(2) Spleen - Saldana (73), Lonestargirl (75)
(1) ntndeacon - Sndvls (74)
(1) Path - Tyrith (76)
(1) Lonestargirl - Alan (77)
(3) Saldana - Spleen (78), Blade (90), St.cronin (94)


(64) St.cronin votes alan (1)
(66) ntndeacon votes blade (1)
(72) neuqua votes Sndvls (1)
(73) Saldana votes spleen (1)
(74) Sndvls votes ntndeacon (1)
(75) Lonestargirl votes Spleen (2)
(76) Tyrith votes path (1)
(77) Alan votes Lonestargirl (1)
(78) Spleen votes Saldana (1)


Day 2
(1) Blade - Lathum (130)
(1) Lonestargirl - Alan (137)
(1) Lathum - Blade (143)
(3) path - St.cronin (147), Neuqua (155), Lonestargirl (179)
(1) Neuqua - ntndeacon (158)
(1) ntndeacon - sndvls (162)
(1) St.cronin - Spleen (167)


(130) Lathum votes Blade (1)
(137) Alan votes Lonestargirl (1)
(143) Blade votes Lathum (1)
(147) St.cronin votes Path (1)
(155) Neuqua votes path (2)
(158) ntndeacon votes neuqua (1)
(162) sndvls votes ntndeacon (1)
(164) Lonestargirl votes St.cronin (1)
(167) Spleen votes st.cronin (2)
(179) Lonestargirl UNVOTES St.cronin (1) ***
(179) Lonestargirl votes path (3)

[Alan T]

I guess my big question today is who do we think Sndvls scanned night 1. Do we think he scanned ntndeacon because he put votes on him day 1 and 2? Or do we think he voted for ntndeacon again day 2 because his night 1 scan ended up being good (and who would that have possibly been?).

[ntndeacon]

Originally Posted by Alan T

I guess my big question today is who do we think Sndvls scanned night 1. Do we think he scanned ntndeacon because he put votes on him day 1 and 2? Or do we think he voted for ntndeacon again day 2 because his night 1 scan ended up being good (and who would that have possibly been?).

That is a good question Alan. I do not think he scanned me. But since he did not scan me, did he go after another UtR player or was it someone who has been saying a bit more? I am not sure yet.

[SnDvls]

well two games I'm a seer and night killed both of them (one night on one this one night two) kinda sucks, I seem to last longer in a plain role.
good luck all

[Alan T]

Originally Posted by ntndeacon

That is a good question Alan. I do not think he scanned me. But since he did not scan me, did he go after another UtR player or was it someone who has been saying a bit more? I am not sure yet.

Can you explain to me what motivation he would have had to vote for you, then scan someone else Under the Radar and then come back to vote for you?

I could picture him voting for you, scanning someone like Lathum or Blade and finding they are good then going back to vote for you again out of default.

(I use blade there in that example as someone who I would think he could have scanned. Based on Sndvls comments to blade that day about making a hit and run, my assumption is that Blade was not who he scanned).

[ntndeacon]

isn't SnDvls someone that votes the same way in the majority of his games? I remember someone is. If the scan was a player for any player, SnDvls might not had anybody better he liked.

[spleen1015]

Neuqua has voted for 2 confirmed good guys. Just putting it out there.

[Lathum]

Let me bounce this off you guys- If post 180 Sndvls says he doesn't trust St.Cronin but doesn't give out much information why.

I don't like St. C either though.

Then in post 196 Sndvls says

and I do understand a self protection for the BG on day one...under normal circamstances, but we knew who the duke was...and in this case he happened to be good. it would have given our seer at least a chance to view him to help us down the road is all.

It seems to me sndvls is basicly coming out and telling us he seer scanned tyrith night one. Is it possible sndvls viewed the murder and was trying to protect himself by not coming right out and saying who it was?

[ntndeacon]

if we don't get a mole today the game will be over.

[spleen1015]

Originally Posted by ntndeacon

if we don't get a mole today the game will be over.

How? There are 8 of us left. Lynch player, kill player, we still have 4-2 numbers.

[Lathum]

Originally Posted by ntndeacon

if we don't get a mole today the game will be over.

unless the BG can get a succesfull protect tonight. I think.

[Alan T]

Originally Posted by Lathum

Let me bounce this off you guys- If post 180 Sndvls says he doesn't trust St.Cronin but doesn't give out much information why.





Then in post 196 Sndvls says



It seems to me sndvls is basicly coming out and telling us he seer scanned tyrith night one. Is it possible sndvls viewed the murder and was trying to protect himself by not coming right out and saying who it was?

You're probably right about him scanning Tyrith. Would be useful to know if the duke is good or bad, and thats as good of a place to start as any.

St.cronin is on my suspicion list and I noticed his comments about St.C, but I was assuming it was based on his not liking St.Cronin's arguement or the link between St.C and Lonestargirl moreso than based on anything he knew in his role. I don't think the seer had the ability to witness a night action. I guess its possible, but I think that part is a stretch.

[Lathum]

dola-
St. Cronin also voted for Saldana who was an assumed good guy and Path who was a good guy.

It seems to me there is enough evidence to

VOTE ST.CRONIN

[Lathum]

alanT- Considering there is a 9-3 villegar to wolf ratio plus the sabatour I think the possibility for the seer to witness a murder could be balancing.

[Alan T]

Originally Posted by Lathum

alanT- Considering there is a 9-3 villegar to wolf ratio plus the sabatour I think the possibility for the seer to witness a murder could be balancing.

Like I said, its possible, but I think its a stretch that they can witness a nightkill.

According to the rules, the moles do their night action at the -home- of the player they are removing. The Bodyguard does his night action at the -home- of the player they are guarding. the Seer does his night action at the -school- locker of the player they are checking out.

Doesn't seem likely to me that the seer's action takes them to the scene of the crime so to say.

So is St.Cronin a good target? perhaps so, I had him in my sights earlier anyways, but I think it would be a mistake to place any extra weight on the thought that Sndvls witnessed St.Cronin doing anything. For arguement sake if we assume Sndvls scanned Tyrith, then anything he commented about any others (such as his negative comment to Blade and St.Cronin) should be viewed just as any other player making the comment based on intuition only. Its just better intuition to lean on in this case as its not purposefully misleading to try to guide a vote.

[ntndeacon]

Spleen there are 3 moles, not 2

[Lathum]

alan- thats a good point i missed

[spleen1015]

Originally Posted by ntndeacon

Spleen there are 3 moles, not 2

saldana being one of them. Reading his role, it mentions him knowing who the other 2 are. Maybe I'm not interpretting the rules correctly.

[Alan T]

Originally Posted by spleen1015

saldana being one of them. Reading his role, it mentions him knowing who the other 2 are. Maybe I'm not interpretting the rules correctly.

That was an error in his role. Barkeep said before the game started that he edited it to having 3 moles instead of 2 moles. Saldana was not a mole, he was the sorceror who knows who the moles were but they didn't know who he was. Saldana was a villager who won with the wolf side.

The people saying there are 3 moles left are correct based on barkeep's post at the start of the game

[Alan T]

Originally Posted by Barkeep49

3. I fiddled around a bit with that number but decided it wasn't quite balanced with just 2 moles. However, I expanded the seer's power so they now would learn who the BG was, if they scanned that person. I think 9-3, with the 1 villager working for the bad guys, is the right balance in a 12 player game.

Found the post i was referring to for you Spleen.

[spleen1015]

Alright. Thanks for clearing that up Alan.

[Neuqua]

Originally Posted by spleen1015

Neuqua has voted for 2 confirmed good guys. Just putting it out there.

SnDvls was a random day 1 vote like everyone else made. And I made my reasons for voting on path clear last night. I just thought that since he was having trouble accessing to FOFC that we could A) get lucky two days in a row with the bad guys having bad connections or B) path, through no fault of his own, wasn't able to participate much anyway so he might've been leaving the game anyway. I stated that I was open to hearing an argument about anybody else when I got back and for hours nothing was brought up and I found no reason to change my vote.

Bottom line is, we need to make up ground at this point.

[LoneStarGirl]

Damnit.... how the hell would the moles know who the seer was? Sndvls was right, this has happened twice lately

[LoneStarGirl]

And spleen, every single game we have played together you have won, which means you are a wicked smart player. Now in this game you are screwing up the number of moles? It seems you are trying WAY too hard to be simple, confused villager and I dont think im going to buy it this game.

[Alan T]

I'm going to vote for one of the people who voted for Path also I think today. Rereading what all Sndvls wrote is pushing me in that direction. Not because of any incredible insight that he provide to a particular player like Lathum's vote, but instead the thought of what happened to the bodyguard on night 1 with Tyrith's death.

The possibility it could have been Path could have been enough to keep someone from voting for him just to keep a possible important role in the game longer. I think I won't go the same direction as Lathum though, while St.Cronin has seemed off to me he has felt a bit less suspicious than the other two.

Neuqua gave an untrue reason for why he was voting for Path, I brought that up to him and he said that was right and he was mixed up, yet still kept his vote there without giving any real good reason.

Lonestargirl seemed eager enough to break the tie last minute with the switch over to Path. She could have easily enough moved her vote off of St.Cronin on to someone else with 1 vote as well.

I think I'm going to vote for one of these two unless convinced otherwise.

[spleen1015]

Originally Posted by LoneStarGirl

And spleen, every single game we have played together you have won, which means you are a wicked smart player. Now in this game you are screwing up the number of moles? It seems you are trying WAY too hard to be simple, confused villager and I dont think im going to buy it this game.

I've had good teammates.

[LoneStarGirl]

Alant, if i would have voted for anybody else it still would have been a tie. The one thing i've learned from Every other WW game is that you NEVER want a tie unless you are a WW.

[Alan T]

Originally Posted by LoneStarGirl

Alant, if i would have voted for anybody else it still would have been a tie. The one thing i've learned from Every other WW game is that you NEVER want a tie unless you are a WW.

That is completely not true. There were plenty of people you could have voted for to make it not a tie. I agree that we didn't want a tie, but you chose to vote for Path which pretty much condemned him.

[Alan T]

Sndvls, Spleen and myself all had 0 votes and a vote for any of us would have untied it. The only catch though is untieing it still would have put Path in the lead, so perhaps was a damned if you do, damned if you don't moment for you. Maybe the more suspicious person would have been Spleen who voted to tie it up in the first place with only path's vote remaining, forcing a tie and not being there to untie it at the end.

[LoneStarGirl]

(1) Blade - Lathum (130)
(1) Lonestargirl - Alan (137)
(1) Lathum - Blade (143)
(3) path - St.cronin (147), Neuqua (155), Lonestargirl (179)
(1) Neuqua - ntndeacon (158)
(1) ntndeacon - sndvls (162)
(1) St.cronin - Spleen (167)

Alan, how do you figure? Everybody has one vote except for path. There is NOBODY i could have voted for to break a tie besides path. If i would have voted for anybody else it would have been a 2-2 tie unless i voted for you or spleen, and to be honest i didn't even think about that last night

[LoneStarGirl]

Originally Posted by Alan T

Sndvls, Spleen and myself all had 0 votes and a vote for any of us would have untied it. The only catch though is untieing it still would have put Path in the lead, so perhaps was a damned if you do, damned if you don't moment for you. Maybe the more suspicious person would have been Spleen who voted to tie it up in the first place with only path's vote remaining, forcing a tie and not being there to untie it at the end.

Thank you devil's advocate, you said what i was thinking. Damned if i do, damned if i dont. No matter what i did last night Path was going down. So you can't blame me for his demise

[Alan T]

Originally Posted by LoneStarGirl

(1) Blade - Lathum (130)
(1) Lonestargirl - Alan (137)
(1) Lathum - Blade (143)
(3) path - St.cronin (147), Neuqua (155), Lonestargirl (179)
(1) Neuqua - ntndeacon (158)
(1) ntndeacon - sndvls (162)
(1) St.cronin - Spleen (167)

Alan, how do you figure? Everybody has one vote except for path. There is NOBODY i could have voted for to break a tie besides path. If i would have voted for anybody else it would have been a 2-2 tie unless i voted for you or spleen, and to be honest i didn't even think about that last night

I am assuming you wrote this before seeing my last post.

[Alan T]

Originally Posted by LoneStarGirl

Thank you devil's advocate, you said what i was thinking. Damned if i do, damned if i dont. No matter what i did last night Path was going down. So you can't blame me for his demise

Sure I can blame you for path's demise. That is the great thing about Werewolf, I can blame you for anything I want

[LoneStarGirl]

AlanT if that is one thing i do know about you is that you have the ability to blame everybody for everything. What would have you done if you were me oh great alant?

[Alan T]

Spleen, can you take me through the thought process that you went through where you went from asking LoneStargirl who to vote for, and then voting for her candidate to the next day feeling that she was the most suspicious for doing a vote move that you pretty much forced her to do?

Ie: if you were planning to vote for whoever she did, it was going to tie the vote count regardless of who she voted for unless it was someone who already had a vote. With only Path left to vote and likely not showing up, you were forcing a tie and thus forcing either her hand or someone else's hand to make a move to avoid the tie that you created and were not around to resolve.

I guess my question is what your thought process around yesterday's vote which you claimed to be random was. It obviously was not random as you set it up with the question before the vote, and then said the reason for the vote was because Lonestargirl did.