Werewolf XLVI - Sun And Shadow (Game Thread) - Game Over! Cultists win!

[Alan T]

Originally Posted by Barkeep49

I find it odd that you thought I was defensive.

I find it odd that you found me odd!

[Alan T]

dola looks like Imthecrew is the selection of the masses. He hasn't done or said anything to make me feel he shouldn't be punished. Unless that changes soon, that will be what I vote as well

[Mr. Wednesday]

I've seen the tiebreaker be all over the place. I wouldn't want to guess at what Peregrine's doing with it.

[DaddyTorgo]

VOTE PUNISHMENT FOR KWIT

just for the record, although he's not even on the block at this point.


oh yay...barkeep+alan fireworks

[Peregrine]

Originally Posted by SnDvls

Peregrine - you mention in the rules that if converted to a shadow a player loses their magical role/powers. Would this also effect them if they had created something as well they would lose it too? This goes into my analysis of the roles which is why I ask.

Do you mean like if they created a magical item?

[Barkeep49]

Ok here's a rule question I'm not completely clear on:

Does my punishment vote on Joe hold over to ITC or do only the ITC voters matter?

[Alan T]

Originally Posted by DaddyTorgo

VOTE PUNISHMENT FOR KWIT

just for the record, although he's not even on the block at this point.


oh yay...barkeep+alan fireworks

Originally Posted by Barkeep49

Ok here's a rule question I'm not completely clear on:

Does my punishment vote on Joe hold over to ITC or do only the ITC voters matter?

I brought this up earlier. They are two seperate votes. Daddy just voted punishment for Imthecrew, not Kwhit. You voted punishment for Imthecrew and not Joe.

[Alan T]

Dola to clarify..

you vote a particular person

AND

you vote for punishment or mercy of the person who is selected.

I mentioned this earlier when people were voting punishment early in the day. They dont even know who will be up for punishment yet they had their minds decided.

[Peregrine]

This is in the rules but just to clarify, a punishment vote is separate from the name vote and will apply to WHOEVER gets the most name vote.

[Alan T]

Voting

Each day all players can vote publicly for whoever they want, and can change their votes as many times as they want. This is called the name vote. They also must vote publicly whether they want to punish the person who receives the most votes, or show mercy. This is a separate vote, called the punishment vote, and will apply to whoever gets the most votes! All name votes must be received by 7:30 pm EST, however, there is a small grace period until 8 pm EST, where anyone can change their punishment votes ONLY. This will allow players to make an informed decision knowing who the victim will be. If you won't be around for that time of day, make sure to get your punishment vote in before then!

Ties in the name vote can be broken by particular roles or magical items. If the tie is not broken, no punishment happens that day.

Ties in the punishment vote end in a result of mercy.

So right now for Imthecrew, punishment vs mercy count is:
(10) Punishment - Chief Rum, Lathum, Mustang, Hoopsguy, Kwhit, TYrith, Mr.Wednesday, Barkeep, Path12, DaddyTorgo
(4) Mercy - Ntndeacon, Swaggs, Sndvls, Joe

[Peregrine]

Well ImTheCrew has been chosen in the name vote. You have until 8:00 to change any punishment votes, at this point it looks like it's leaning substantially towards punishment.

[Barkeep49]

Ok my punishment vote was based on the theory that an indvidual needs to justify not having the punishment via role reveal. ITC has not done that and so my punishment vote happily remains.

[Tyrith]

Originally Posted by Alan T

Dola to clarify..

you vote a particular person

AND

you vote for punishment or mercy of the person who is selected.

I mentioned this earlier when people were voting punishment early in the day. They dont even know who will be up for punishment yet they had their minds decided.

Give me a reason to vote mercy, and I'll consider it. Otherwise, we need to be getting clears, even if it costs us some roles.

[BrianD]

Vote Punishment

I think I agree that punishment makes more sense than mercy without additional information. I realize this is a reversal of my earlier position.

[DaddyTorgo]

okay...i misunderstood about the punishment not applying to a particular person, but for the record for later in the game

VOTE PUNISHMENT

[Alan T]

Originally Posted by Tyrith

Give me a reason to vote mercy, and I'll consider it. Otherwise, we need to be getting clears, even if it costs us some roles.

Don't look at me for a reason to vote mercy. I've said it often that unless given a reason, I think punishment NEEDS to be the default vote from us. Likewise that will be the direction I go if ITC isnt more talkative in the next 2-5 minutes.

My only comments was trying to make sure everyone has an informed reason for their votes, as I won't buy anyone saying they didn't understand the rules for punishment votes later. Peregrine has said twice now (once in the rules), and I've mentioned it twice how it works. So ignorance is no excuse tonight or later in the game.

[Peregrine]

I expected a lot of questions in this game, there's some tricky rules and I haven't made everything as clear as I could have in every case. Honestly, I'm pretty curious about how the whole thing will play out.

[hoopsguy]

Catching up - is there anything that ITC has posted that would be reason to move my vote from Punishment to Mercy? I'm about 50 posts behind, so will be trying to catch up on reading prior to deadline.

[Mr. Wednesday]

I don't think there's anything that ITC has posted, period.

[Alan T]

Originally Posted by ImTheCrew

Checking in..... ill reveal if nessicary

Originally Posted by ImTheCrew

cultist BTW

This is his contributions thus far.

I guess being on the line to be cleansed is not necessary for a reveal.

Vote punishment

[Mr. Wednesday]

Dunno if he's been in since he went up, in fairness — he's not in right now.

[SnDvls]

Originally Posted by Peregrine

Do you mean like if they created a magical item?

yes

[Alan T]

This is what I have for the final votes:

(5) Imthecrew - Lathum (96), Kwhit (139), Tyrith (143), Path12 (185), Joe (187)
(3) Joe - Chief Rum (92), Mustang (119), Barkeep (182)
(2) Hoopsguy - Ntndeacon (161), BrianD (183)
(2) Chief Rum - Swaggs (103), Mr.Wednesday (179)
(1) Barkeep - Sndvls (159)
(1) Swaggs - Alan (110)
(1) Tyrith - Hoopsguy (120)
(1) Kwhit - DaddyTorgo (170)

(12) Punishment - Chief Rum, Lathum, Mustang, Hoopsguy, Kwhit, TYrith, Mr.Wednesday, Barkeep, Path12, DaddyTorgo, BrianD, Alan T
(4) Mercy - Ntndeacon, Swaggs, Sndvls, Joe


No votes:


10) Schmidty
14) ImTheCrew

[Peregrine]

Originally Posted by SnDvls

yes

No, all magical items or mundane roles are kept if someone goes over to Shadow.

[Peregrine]

The votes are in, and today you vote for ImTheCrew. He is put in the ritual circle and the rest of you, with grim faces, perform the ritual of cleansing on him. He thrashes and writhes as the magic is ripped out of him, but there is no sign of Shadow corruption. After it is all over, he collapses to the ground. Based on what you saw of his magic during the ritual, you have determined that he was the Summoner.

All night actions should be in by midnight, I'll try to post daytime as soon as I can after that.


1) Mustang
2) BrianD
3) ntndeacon
4) Joe
5) Swaggs
6) Barkeep49
7) Kwhit
8) Lathum
9) Chief Rum
10) Schmidty
11) Mr. Wednesday
12) hoopsguy
13) DaddyTorgo
14) ImTheCrew - Summoner - Cleansed Day 1
15) Tyrith
16) Path12
17) Alan T
18) SnDvls

[SnDvls]

Originally Posted by Barkeep49

I'm sad to be called on it, but surprised you didn't figure out the rationale:

I don't actually believe that there is no mechanism for resolving ties. Therefore, I feel a tie would have given us a defacto role reveal. More public information = good thing for the villagers.

the Seal of Command can break ties

[SnDvls]

the Summoner role won't really hurt us so not a bad role to lose early on.

[Barkeep49]

Originally Posted by Mr. Wednesday

Dunno if he's been in since he went up, in fairness — he's not in right now.

ITC is a hit or miss WW player in my experience.

[Barkeep49]

Originally Posted by SnDvls

the Summoner role won't really hurt us so not a bad role to lose early on.

Agreed.

[Mr. Wednesday]

I think the Summoner offered more to the player than to the group at large.

[DaddyTorgo]

must...refer to list to see summoner's power

[Tyrith]

Not a huge loss. I'm wiling to cope with this.

[SnDvls]

okay going back to my lists of items & roles

completely bad items - Potion of Weariness & Potion of Darkness; neither help us at all. The second turns someone right away and the first actually limits us on the votes.

I did have some as good, but after rereading them and knowing what Peregrine said some of them can actually be used for bad as well as good so I'd list all the other items here.

As far as roles go Artificer & Sorceror are the two worst for us and can only do us harm so it'd be nice to have them cleansed and out of the way. Next dangerous as the game progresses and depending on how the players use their roles are Alchemist, Researcher, Witch, & Craft Mage (I added witch from my last list) so if you have a role in the 2nd four you are either playing with us by your night actions or playing in hopes of getting converted by you actions.

[BrianD]

Seems like the summoner could have spotted a conversion attempt in process.

[SnDvls]

Originally Posted by Mr. Wednesday

I think the Summoner offered more to the player than to the group at large.

could have been dangerous if he lasted longer, but not a huge threat or danger unless his Imp found something and he was converted.

[Mr. Wednesday]

Originally Posted by BrianD

Seems like the summoner could have spotted a conversion attempt in process.

True. I was thinking more in terms of the other actions the imp could do.

[SnDvls]

Peregrine - do we know how many of one kind of potion can be in the game?

[ImTheCrew]

Peregrine, sorry im in 4 other werewolf games and i thought this ones deadline was nine! well it was fun anyways

[hoopsguy]

Crew, you are not dead. Just cleansed. So you can still participate in this one with votes, items, etc.

Congratulation, I guess, on being cleared.

[hoopsguy]

Dola ...

What better - Congratulation or Congratulations?

[Swaggs]

I'm back and caught up.

I didn't really understand the mercy/punishment stuff until Peregrine cleared it up.

[Mustang]

I was mixed up on the mercy/punishment, thought you were voting all on one guy but, that wouldn't have affected me today.

2 dynamics to watch.. flipping on mercy and punishment votes.

[path12]

So we have two shadows right now and each of them have a 50% chance of converting someone else but it can only be one conversion total, correct?

I also assume that since each one of them will put 50% chance that will make a conversion automatic tonight.

Sorry for thinking out loud, it helps me understand the rules better......

[path12]

I think the next question is reminiscent of the superheroes game......who would you convert if you could? Those are the people we'd want to watch/protect tonight, IMO.

[path12]

Originally Posted by ImTheCrew

Peregrine, sorry im in 4 other werewolf games and i thought this ones deadline was nine! well it was fun anyways

Are you doing the BGG crash course?

Too many games will mess you up, man. I know from experience.

[Lathum]

Originally Posted by path12

I think the next question is reminiscent of the superheroes game......who would you convert if you could? Those are the people we'd want to watch/protect tonight, IMO.

I think it may be best to ask the opposite. Who WOULDN't you convert because they would be likely seer scans.

[SnDvls]

Originally Posted by path12

So we have two shadows right now and each of them have a 50% chance of converting someone else but it can only be one conversion total, correct?

I also assume that since each one of them will put 50% chance that will make a conversion automatic tonight.

Sorry for thinking out loud, it helps me understand the rules better......

if they both put in the same name (which also assumes they've had good communication and either can be cleansed and at some point half clear some people who's names have been thrown about) then it's an automatic conversion. If they both put in different names then each has an equal 50% chance to convert, but only one conversion will happen.

[SnDvls]

Originally Posted by path12

I think the next question is reminiscent of the superheroes game......who would you convert if you could? Those are the people we'd want to watch/protect tonight, IMO.

depends on how we're going to play the game. if we continue on cleansing the "quiet" people then they should go after a more vocal person. if we change it up tomorrow and cleanse a more vocal person and the shadows went this route then we might have a change at nailing a shadow...it's a great chess game at this point.

[Mr. Wednesday]

Originally Posted by path12

I think the next question is reminiscent of the superheroes game......who would you convert if you could? Those are the people we'd want to watch/protect tonight, IMO.

At risk of making their job easier for them (in case I point out someone they hadn't already thought of)... I don't know that I'd have an exhaustive list, but a couple of names that spring to mine are your own (for very solid play as a bad guy on a couple of occasions, and usually insightful analysis even when you're not) and hoops (for a lot of good analysis as a good guy, been a while since I've been in a game where he's bad).

[Mr. Wednesday]

Originally Posted by SnDvls

if they both put in the same name (which also assumes they've had good communication and either can be cleansed and at some point half clear some people who's names have been thrown about) then it's an automatic conversion. If they both put in different names then each has an equal 50% chance to convert, but only one conversion will happen.

Actually, 50% or more (rather than more than 50%) is automatic. No details on what happens tonight if they go for different people, as both would be automatic but there's a one conversion cap.