The Trump Presidency – 2016

[GrantDawg]

Someone tell me if I am wrong here. According to the article, Trump owes 400+ million in personal loans. There is a mortgage on Trump Tower that is of 100 million dollars. Even if that is on top of that intial loan money (which I think it is), isn't Trump Tower worth somewhere in the neighbor hood of 600-700 million dollars? Heck, it was worth $300 million when he originally bought it a couple of decades ago.

Is this story either ignoring the increasing value of his properties? I am not saying it is right he didn't pay taxes (it is shady as crap), but isn't his actual wealth in the real estate he owns? Some of those he might lose money in a sale, but not many.

[albionmoonlight]

In case you are wondering how this is playing on GOP facebook, I am seeing lots of memes about how if protesters choose to stand in the road, then they must actually think that their lives don't really matter that much.

[Bee]

Originally Posted by albionmoonlight

In case you are wondering how this is playing on GOP facebook, I am seeing lots of memes about how if protesters choose to stand in the road, then they must actually think that their lives don't really matter that much.

Sorry, I know it's inappropriate but that made me laugh. "If BLM, why you standing in the street?"

[albionmoonlight]

This isn't Trump related directly, but I remember reading kind of a fun article where the writer tried to figure out who the "poorest" person in the world was. Acknowledging that real poverty means living on the street without food, the article instead just went with the definition of "lowest amount of money."

The writer decided that the "poorest" person in the world was this French businessman who had lost a ton of money and then kept going into debt to keep a pyramid-like scheme going and by the end of it, he was $5 billion in debt. He, of course, was living like a high-wealth European businessman the whole time.

The point being, you have to actually be pretty rich to be one of the poorest people in the world.

[RainMaker]

Originally Posted by GrantDawg

Someone tell me if I am wrong here. According to the article, Trump owes 400+ million in personal loans. There is a mortgage on Trump Tower that is of 100 million dollars. Even if that is on top of that intial loan money (which I think it is), isn't Trump Tower worth somewhere in the neighbor hood of 600-700 million dollars? Heck, it was worth $300 million when he originally bought it a couple of decades ago.

Is this story either ignoring the increasing value of his properties? I am not saying it is right he didn't pay taxes (it is shady as crap), but isn't his actual wealth in the real estate he owns? Some of those he might lose money in a sale, but not many.

If he has a mortgage on those properties, he doesn't necessarily own them outright.

[JPhillips]

I expect he could sell enough property to pay his debts, but if he does it opens up new problems. First, what are the properties worth? He says the golf courses are long-term money losers, so if that's true, what can he get for them? If they are really money makers, does he open himself up to tax fraud? Second, the easiest properties to sell are going to be the best earners, so every thing sold makes it harder to keep a positive cash flow going.

This is where I think Ivanka was initially smart. Her brand was built to provide her own source of income because I expect she was smart enough to see that the Trump empire may not be around in ten or twenty years. She's in trouble now, because her brand was built for the suburban woman that has moved from the GOP to hating all things Trump, but it was a good idea.

Don Jr. can maybe ride the outrage machine forever, but Eric better figure out something or he's going to end up managing a chain of Motel 6 in the Sun Belt.

[albionmoonlight]

It’s not entirely incorrect to say that he ran for President, in part, to escape his creditors.

Grudging respect for the hustle.

[Flasch186]

The talking point rolling out is business like Apple and Amazon pay no taxes.

Gaslight in overdrive

[albionmoonlight]

LOL Nothing Matters.

But I can't imagine that the GOP-leaning captains of industry are psyched that the talking points to save Trump are all going to be some variations of "rich people and big corporations never pay taxes, so no big deal."

They have spent a lot of time over the last 5 decades trying to convince us that rich people actually pay their fair share (or even more than their fair share). Indeed, you could argue that the one consistent GOP message has been trying to convince us all that "rich people already pay a lot in taxes."

Kind of amazing that they will give that up in a heartbeat to make a story that wasn't going to move the needle anyway slightly less embarrassing for Trump.

It is a party beholden to one man.

Which, whatever. But if you are going to do that, why pick such a shitty man?

[JPhillips]

Every day the conversation is about Trump is a bad day for Trump.

[sterlingice]

Originally Posted by JPhillips

Every day the conversation is about Trump is a bad day for Trump.

You think the Times was like "hell, let's get this out there now because in a month, it's not going to matter because we'll already be 4 ever escalating crises down the road and this won't even make the front page"?

SI

[miami_fan]

Originally Posted by JPhillips

Every day the conversation is about Trump is a bad day for Trump.

Since when?

The conversation has been all about Trump politically since say late 2014?

Seems to have worked out well so far.

[larrymcg421]

Originally Posted by miami_fan

Since when?

The conversation has been all about Trump politically since say late 2014?

Seems to have worked out well so far.

Didn't work out in the midterms. Also, the conversation was not about the Trump at the end of the 2016 campaign. It was all about Hillary.

[JPhillips]

Yes. Look at his approval number and the time where he has gone up a bit correspond to the times when he's been relatively quiet.

[Ksyrup]

Which is why the Trump campaign is trying to make such a big deal about Biden "going dark" time and time again because they know he's taking the smart tack of "when you're opponent is doing more harm to himself than you could do to him, you just sit back and let him hang himself."

[JPhillips]

And Biden is actually preparing for the debate while Trump says he doesn't have any idea what he'l do tomorrow night.

[sterlingice]

Originally Posted by JPhillips

And Biden is actually preparing for the debate while Trump says he doesn't have any idea what he'l do tomorrow night.

I'm guessing a non-zero amount of Biden debate prep time has gone into things you'd never have thought of in the past: "what do you do if walks off the stage (i.e what do you do/talk about/one-liner)?" "what if he takes a swing at you/tries to gnaw your ear?" The type of stuff, say, George W Bush, Al Gore, John Kerry, Barack Obama, John McCain, or Mitt Romney never had to. I mean, there was the weird Trump stalking Hillary on stage thing.

SI

[GrantDawg]

I saw someone actually break down what he owes versus wealth. He is actually in total (including mortgages on properties owned and partially owned) $1.1 billion in debt. His actual yearly income from the properties is somewhere in the neighborhood of $215 million dollars annually. Most of the debts he has not even touched the principle on, so it looks unlikely he would be able to pay off the debt when they come due. Except...
The total value on the properties is roughly 2.2 billion dollars. So, he is still technically a billionaire. Further, most of these loans are very low interest rate loans that are easily going to be rolled into new loans when needed and long as property values don't plummet (and of course if they do, he will just file bankruptcy and start over like he has done many times before). The idea he is broke is laughable.
It is just another prime example of the rich not being like the rest of us.

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[Ksyrup]

HA!

Ivanka talking to Jared about the New York Times story. pic.twitter.com/tpfzdWm1Nk

— The Lincoln Project (@ProjectLincoln) September 28, 2020

[JPhillips]

Originally Posted by sterlingice

I'm guessing a non-zero amount of Biden debate prep time has gone into things you'd never have thought of in the past: "what do you do if walks off the stage (i.e what do you do/talk about/one-liner)?" "what if he takes a swing at you/tries to gnaw your ear?" The type of stuff, say, George W Bush, Al Gore, John Kerry, Barack Obama, John McCain, or Mitt Romney never had to. I mean, there was the weird Trump stalking Hillary on stage thing.

SI

Ron Klain, one of his preppers, said debating Trump is like playing at Carnegie Hall while someone in the front row blows an air horn.

[miami_fan]

Originally Posted by larrymcg421

Didn't work out in the midterms. Also, the conversation was not about the Trump at the end of the 2016 campaign. It was all about Hillary.

Originally Posted by JPhillips

Yes. Look at his approval number and the time where he has gone up a bit correspond to the times when he's been relatively quiet.

Trump did not lose during the midterms. He was not on the ballot. Yes Republicans lost the house, but they ended up strengthening their hold on the Senate. I guess we can say that Clinton lost as opposed to Trump won. Six of one, half a dozen of the other as far as I am concerned. The reality is Trump became the president so he won that and has won the spoils that come with that. His approval numbers have stayed the same for his entire presidency good or bad. We have said that over and over again. He was not removed from office after being impeached. Is that a loss or a win. The most recent example, he has talked openly about putting another Justice on the Supreme Court and despite the disapproval of the majority of Americans, he won that too IMO

My point is he has made it to this point by making sure everyone talked about him no matter what. I have heard enough people tell me that the talk about him is a main reason for their support for him, that I have decided to listen. He has been rewarded for that talk. He may lose the election in November but that has not happened to him yet.

[JPhillips]

Even the Trump cmpaign as been cleat that they don't want the election to be about Trump. That's why they hope the SCOTUS fight could be a positive electorally. Trump can't win, al leat in an honest election, if the voters are casting ballots on a Trump referendum.

The GOP literally has no platform and Trump has been asked multiple times what he wants to do in term 2 and has no answer, so it's hard for him or the GOP to turn this into a policy fight. Tey've tried Biden's health, socialism, Hunter Biden, all to little effect so far. In 2016 people weren't voting on Trump or someone else, but now we are, and given his approval ratings, that doesn't favor Trump.

[Brian Swartz]

Originally Posted by miami fan

Trump did not lose during the midterms. He was not on the ballot. Yes Republicans lost the house, but they ended up strengthening their hold on the Senate

The president is always symbolically on the ballot during midterms. Not literally of course, but practically speaking that doesn't matter. The Senate issue was a case of what seats came up and which ones didn't; Republicans did significantly worse than the historical average for midterms, and during a good economy.

I still see no reason not to look at the reality of how people have voted since '16. Every vote has been bad for Trump in comparison to that election. Midterms, special elections, etc. Biden is polling better than Clinton was without as many negatives. There aren't nearly as many undecideds to swing one way or the other at the end. It's possible Trump could win, but virtually all the evidence points the other way.

[RainMaker]

Originally Posted by Flasch186

The talking point rolling out is business like Apple and Amazon pay no taxes.

Gaslight in overdrive

Well it is true. The takeaway should be how this is a system where the wealthiest people don't really have to pay taxes.

[RainMaker]

Originally Posted by Thomkal

Man, that's pretty horrible-I'm glad he didn't hurt himself or his wife and is getting the help he needs now.

And a big FU to the all the people on Twitter cheering this news

He's a drunk wife-beater who will hide behind fake suicide threats to get out of trouble.

[Flasch186]

Originally Posted by RainMaker

Well it is true. The takeaway should be how this is a system where the wealthiest people don't really have to pay taxes.

Totally true, just not really comparable under the title of the current expose, issue. It deserves a topic all it's own.

[GrantDawg]

A teacher is only allowed deduct $250 a year in school supplies when they average spending ten times that. Trump wrote off $70,000 for hair cuts. That should be the take away. His tax returns highlights how the system is rigged against everyone but the Uber rich.

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[BYU 14]

Got this out before the ink on the tax return story was even dry
https://twitter.com/TeamJoe/status/1...132157928.html

[Ben E Lou]

I have received a half dozen or so applications for absentee ballots--all, I think, from the same source. My wife has received....zero. We both registered to vote in NC on the same day back in 2014, a few weeks after we moved here. She registered as an R; I registered as an I. (She has since changed hers to I because Trump.) We're not sure if it's because she's a former R or if it's because she's white and I'm black, but today I googled the group that sent the latest one (yesterday...but again, I think they've all come from this same place,) and here's what I found:

Some NC voters are receiving unsolicited absentee ballot requests | wcnc.com

[albionmoonlight]

Maybe they just know how awesome you are, Ben.

[GrantDawg]

I have gotten multiple absentee ballot requests atom both sides. I will say it is as mostly democratic groups, but at least two were Republican.

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[Ksyrup]

USA Today wrote a long article fact-checking a known satirical website's (Babylon Bee) article that the 9th Circuit overturned RBG's death. Their conclusion? It's satire.

WTF life are we living right now?

[BYU 14]

The perfect example of if you say something enough it becomes true.

Alan Knight can list the reasons he won’t trust the results of the Nov. 3 election if President Donald Trump loses.

First, almost everyone he knows is supporting the president. “Just from everything I see around me, it’s going to be a landslide,” the 68-year-old Republican from Sahuarita, Arizona, said.

Sylvia Rhodes Blakey, 73, of Green Valley, Arizona, was categorical: The only way Trump will lose is if the Democrats rig the election in favor of former Vice President Joe Biden, she said.

Two rural towns, population 30K and 23K respectively in Pima county situated just about halfway between Tucson and the border with Mexico. Two people right in Trumps wheelhouse, rural, elderly whites whose main source of information is likely Fox news and who live in places where fear mongering "border militia" are active.

Arizona is the literal definition of a purple state and after this election we will likely have 2 democratic senators and a legit chance to flip the vote for president blue. But this state is full of people just like this, in their little bubbles who believe the words of the most prolific prevaricator to ever occupy the Whitehouse, over any facts you can present to them.

[kingfc22]

Biden and Harris get their tax returns out so that should be a fun topic tonight.

https://www.cnbc.com/2020/09/29/joe-...al-debate.html

[cuervo72]

Good gravy. NBC just had a segment with Ohio voters, including some old, fat farmers who are happy for their subsidies and are convinced COVID was sent from China to aid in taking us over.

[JPhillips]

Four years from now I doubt news organizations will be running stories on Biden voters that are still Biden voters.

[spleen1015]

@BYU

That's my grandfather. He felt that way back in 1992 when Clinton won. He moved back to WV, where he grew up, from MD because he was tired of living in a state that supported Democrats. Democrats always cheat and rob the good Republicans.

[Ben E Lou]

Originally Posted by cuervo72

Good gravy. NBC just had a segment with Ohio voters, including some old, fat farmers who are happy for their subsidies and are convinced COVID was sent from China to aid in taking us over.

I had a conversation on Saturday with a retired schoolteacher from rural PA who now lives in NC. She is 100% convinced that the virus “will just go away after the election. We will never hear about it again. It’s just about the election. That’s all it is.” Fox has really done a number on these folks. Brainwashed,

[RainMaker]

Originally Posted by Ben E Lou

I had a conversation on Saturday with a retired schoolteacher from rural PA who now lives in NC. She is 100% convinced that the virus “will just go away after the election. We will never hear about it again. It’s just about the election. That’s all it is.” Fox has really done a number on these folks. Brainwashed,

Just a remarkably dumb country

[JediKooter]

Originally Posted by RainMaker

Just a remarkably dumb country

Sadly yes and one that allows for that dumb minority to actually pick who gets to be president even if they don't win the majority of votes. Don't get me wrong here, trump is a HUGE outlier, the proverbial exception to the rule, that's why this election is so damn important. At least Bush seemed to care about America.

[Lathum]

Originally Posted by BYU 14

The perfect example of if you say something enough it becomes true.





Two rural towns, population 30K and 23K respectively in Pima county situated just about halfway between Tucson and the border with Mexico. Two people right in Trumps wheelhouse, rural, elderly whites whose main source of information is likely Fox news and who live in places where fear mongering "border militia" are active.

Arizona is the literal definition of a purple state and after this election we will likely have 2 democratic senators and a legit chance to flip the vote for president blue. But this state is full of people just like this, in their little bubbles who believe the words of the most prolific prevaricator to ever occupy the Whitehouse, over any facts you can present to them.

I read this article also. The quotes from the people interviewed are straight out of Fox News. I hear it all from my mother in law. It is nothing short of brainwashing.

[thesloppy]

Originally Posted by Ben E Lou

I had a conversation on Saturday with a retired schoolteacher from rural PA who now lives in NC. She is 100% convinced that the virus “will just go away after the election. We will never hear about it again. It’s just about the election. That’s all it is.” Fox has really done a number on these folks. Brainwashed,

Those folks have failed to account for every other country & person on the planet but will still insist that they've got everything figured out.

[albionmoonlight]

Originally Posted by JPhillips

Four years from now I doubt news organizations will be running stories on Biden voters that are still Biden voters.

Trump gets eyeballs, so I get it. Gotta get dem clicks.

But it is still strange how we've gotten so many "news" stories that are just "here are people telling you why they like Trump."

I mean, can you see how weird that would be with any other politician? If there were just "These people are voting for Bush; let them tell you why" stories?

It gives Trump tons of free advertising. And it feeds into the myth that this person who has 95% GOP approval is still somehow an outsider. That it is newsworthy to find people who support him.

[Lathum]

Appreciate Trump reminding everyone 3 seconds in elections have consequences.

[JediKooter]

Jesus. Out of the gate trump sounds like a moron.

[Atocep]

Trump talked in a circle for 2 minutes. He did zero prep.

[JediKooter]

I know Biden is a stutterer, but, he seems a bit nervous.

[Lathum]

Chris Wallace needs to get control of this or Biden will never be able to make a point

[JediKooter]

Good lord, trump is just god awful.

[spleen1015]

Man, Trump is bullying and Joe doesn't seem to be able to handle it.