08-15-2005, 11:07 PM | #251 |
Head Coach
Join Date: Apr 2001
Location: Whittier
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Anything is possible, according to NC
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08-15-2005, 11:09 PM | #252 | |
Head Coach
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: Green Bay, WI
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Quote:
Just reading this from the first post. If the Retired Officer protects somebody, would we know? |
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08-15-2005, 11:09 PM | #253 | |
FOFC Survivor
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Wentzville, MO
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Quote:
All I know is we're sucking.
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Cheer for a walk on quarterback! Ardent leads the Vols in the dynasty forum. |
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08-15-2005, 11:10 PM | #254 | |
FOFC Survivor
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Wentzville, MO
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Quote:
__________________
Cheer for a walk on quarterback! Ardent leads the Vols in the dynasty forum. |
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08-15-2005, 11:17 PM | #255 | |
Head Coach
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: Green Bay, WI
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Quote:
That's the thing. I figure if protecting = killing assailant, then yes, we would. Otherwise...unless either the protected or protectee knows (and outs the knowledge), then we'd be blissfully unaware. Now, the problem is that we can't be sure the guardee would be telling the truth if he says "Yes, I was protected from death last night," because what's going to prove it if we wouldn't otherwise know? He could be telling the truth, or he could be a Mafioso. If he's telling the truth, where's his percentage in attracting the spotlight to himself? If he's a Mafioso, that goes double. |
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08-15-2005, 11:18 PM | #256 |
Head Coach
Join Date: Apr 2001
Location: Whittier
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It would be a huge coincidence though, if the mafia went to kill the person that the police went to protect.
Seems like they probably went to bribe or found the mafia's son... |
08-15-2005, 11:23 PM | #257 |
Pro Rookie
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: VA
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I don't think we can ask the police guy to come out since he'd probably be a target for the mafia so I don't think we'll know if it was that. Leaning towards bribery/lost son myself.
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Chicago Eagles 2 time ZFL champions We're "rebuilding" |
08-15-2005, 11:28 PM | #258 | |
Head Coach
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: Green Bay, WI
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Quote:
About one chance in 200, by my calculations, that the officer and mafioso chose the same person. Again, always assuming we don't know the event occurred. I'd imagine the Mafia role allows them to check one person per night for ties to the Don, but what I wonder is, with multiple Mafia members, can one search for the Don's son, while another kills a random villager? Or do they have to act in concert, whatever their night action? |
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08-15-2005, 11:29 PM | #259 | |
Head Coach
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: Green Bay, WI
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Quote:
Agreed. I would prefer he stay incognito, as he'd be too valuable to lose the way things are going right now. |
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08-15-2005, 11:38 PM | #260 | |
Coordinator
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: Scottsdale, Arizona
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Quote:
Id assume they can do both...one guy scanning, the whole group killing...but remember there are sure to be at least a few hidden roles(witness for one)...NEON'S last game was riddled with them, every person having a role...id imagine were missing, or not sharing, quite a few...for good or bad...
__________________
Underachievement The tallest blade of grass is the first to be cut by the lawnmower. Despair It's always darkest just before it goes pitch black. Demotivation Sometimes the best solution to morale problems is just to fire all of the unhappy people. http://www.despair.com/viewall.html |
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08-15-2005, 11:47 PM | #261 | |
Head Coach
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: Green Bay, WI
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Quote:
I'm certain there are hidden roles, but I'm just as certain that a few of us are plain vanilla. |
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08-15-2005, 11:49 PM | #262 | |
Go Reds
Join Date: May 2001
Location: Bloodbuzz Ohio
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Quote:
Vote didn't count, but that's cool. I have legit questionmarks on a certain player and you don't like it because I half-assedly called us idiots for voting someone off who didn't seem like anything more than a villager. Smooth, Schmidty. |
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08-16-2005, 12:23 AM | #263 |
High School JV
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Indiana
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Gah I come home and find my first WW cut short on day two. I finally came up with a theory though, after getting a chance to really look through all the posts. I'll have to just keep up and see if any of it had some truth. Thanks for the invite to the game
Oh and sorry about the post from the dead, I rarely post on this board so you gotta give me slack on this one -Aes
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08-16-2005, 12:23 AM | #264 |
Pro Rookie
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: VA
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Save it and post it at the end of the game. It'll be cool to see what you came up with.
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Chicago Eagles 2 time ZFL champions We're "rebuilding" |
08-16-2005, 12:24 AM | #265 |
Head Coach
Join Date: Apr 2001
Location: Whittier
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Sorry man, just had to pick someone....
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08-16-2005, 12:30 AM | #266 | |
High School JV
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Indiana
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Quote:
-Aes
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Go Bears! #8 Grossman #33 Tillman |
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08-16-2005, 01:21 AM | #267 |
College Starter
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: California
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I'm not sure what to think about the no kill, but with 15 of us left we need to come up with some incriminating information. I know I don't look good with the kill of Aesyrqwe, but I was trying to stir up some chatter and we did get some talk going at the end of the day. We'll see what tomorrow brings.
*I won't be on until tomorrow afternoon as I have some appointments in the morning. |
08-16-2005, 01:30 AM | #268 |
Head Coach
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Morgan Hill, CA
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Go mafia!!!
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Fan of SF Giants, 49ers, Sharks, Arsenal |
08-16-2005, 01:33 AM | #269 |
High School JV
Join Date: Aug 2005
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We are really running on a bad streak here...we need to turn things around quickly...the no kill was very interesting...props to the officer if he really did protect someone
*might not be on tommorw as my new job training is taking up most of my time, ill see what I can do...unitl then... |
08-16-2005, 01:37 AM | #270 | |
Coordinator
Join Date: Apr 2001
Location: Early, TX
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Quote:
Are you sure that's why I voted for you Shorty? If so, you know more than I do.
__________________
Just beat the devil out of it!!! - Bob Ross |
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08-16-2005, 01:49 AM | #271 | |
Coordinator
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: Scottsdale, Arizona
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This is from a PM i recieved from bek..time stamp was:
Private Messages in Folder: Inbox Messages: 9 Today 08-15-2005 Mafia?!?!?!?!? 11:35 PM Bek Quote:
__________________
Underachievement The tallest blade of grass is the first to be cut by the lawnmower. Despair It's always darkest just before it goes pitch black. Demotivation Sometimes the best solution to morale problems is just to fire all of the unhappy people. http://www.despair.com/viewall.html |
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08-16-2005, 01:51 AM | #272 |
Coordinator
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: Scottsdale, Arizona
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anyone else have any reason to not lynch him, tell me...but i cant ignore that evidence...i know its early, and regardless of whether or not bek is one of my off-board friends, i just can't let him get away with this. Pending amazing evidence to change my mind:
Vote Bek
__________________
Underachievement The tallest blade of grass is the first to be cut by the lawnmower. Despair It's always darkest just before it goes pitch black. Demotivation Sometimes the best solution to morale problems is just to fire all of the unhappy people. http://www.despair.com/viewall.html |
08-16-2005, 01:58 AM | #273 |
Head Coach
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: Green Bay, WI
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Why would he reveal himself like that, though? That's what doesn't make any sense to me.
Either Bek is a Mafioso, and was amazingly stupid to think he could send a PM like that and not have it posted, or you're a Mafioso betting that since we have no idea what's going on right now, that we'll flood to the first sign of a breakthrough. I'm going to have to hold off for now and watch how the rest of the day unfolds. |
08-16-2005, 02:01 AM | #274 | |
Go Reds
Join Date: May 2001
Location: Bloodbuzz Ohio
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Quote:
You already criticized me in a prior post, it's not hard to go from Point A to Point B. That's real funny how you try to say as you little as you can to provoke me. Interesting. |
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08-16-2005, 02:02 AM | #275 | |
Coordinator
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: Scottsdale, Arizona
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Quote:
I think the thing you forget is bek is one of my best friends...we talk about the game when we hang out, and he has repeatedly told me he couldnt tell me his role...after i called him a mafia bastard when i got mad at him for voting me(a friendly insult, but still a jest) he sent that back...i fet it proper to share..do with it what you will, but i thought that any evidence i had should come forward for the benefit of the group...if i dit on it it only leads to more death, and coming out with it in three days would meet the same spectisim...i also dont think it makes the mafia want to kill me, since it doesnt allow me info on other members...its a mistake he made, and i hope you take it as such
__________________
Underachievement The tallest blade of grass is the first to be cut by the lawnmower. Despair It's always darkest just before it goes pitch black. Demotivation Sometimes the best solution to morale problems is just to fire all of the unhappy people. http://www.despair.com/viewall.html |
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08-16-2005, 02:03 AM | #276 |
Go Reds
Join Date: May 2001
Location: Bloodbuzz Ohio
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Wow, Blade. Pretty strong conviction on bek right there if you aren't hosing us. I'll be curious to see how other people feel about this, but it's about the only thing we might be going on right now, so yeah...
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08-16-2005, 02:37 AM | #277 | |
Head Coach
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: Green Bay, WI
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Quote:
Not criticizing you, don't misunderstand. I'm just saying that if we take it at face value, as it appears intended, it can only go one of those two ways. A third possibility is that he's trying to fuck with your mind, but again, he has to have realized the possibility of it getting posted, and I have to wonder why he would do that - and leave hard evidence - if he's an innocent villager just pulling your leg. It'd be much safer to say something like that man-to-man where it's just your word against his. That last seems the least likely, so it still boils down to that either-he-is-or-you-are scenario. I hope somebody else has some information that can shed light one way or the other, because we can't afford another "oops." |
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08-16-2005, 02:39 AM | #278 |
Head Coach
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: Green Bay, WI
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dola,
I also didn't know previously that you and Bek were buds, but it still comes down to the same thing. Either he is, and screwed up, or you are, and overplayed your hand too soon, or he's trying to screw with you outside the game and picked a really dumb way to do it. I'd almost prefer the first option. It would at least be a break in an otherwise stone-cold case. |
08-16-2005, 02:59 AM | #279 |
High School JV
Join Date: Aug 2005
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ARE YOU KIDDING ME. I may be new to the forum, but im not stupid. Why in the world would i reveal me role. I think that the real threat here is blade...he saw my last comment about maybe not being able to get on and thought he would try to take out another villager tonight...well let me tell you something... he got caught red-handed. I was just heading off for the rest of the evening and decided to check it one more time... and to my surprise i see this stunt trying to be pulled...with this stunt I can only believe that blade is mafia so im going to make my vote now...
Vote Blade6119 |
08-16-2005, 03:06 AM | #280 | |
Head Coach
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: Green Bay, WI
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Quote:
Do you deny sending him that PM, then? |
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08-16-2005, 03:12 AM | #281 |
High School JV
Join Date: Aug 2005
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I dont deny sending it but he took it out of context...he was calling me a mafia bastard out of forum(like he said a friendly jest)...i just happend to return the favor and play along with him thinking I'm mafia and send that wonderfully crafted PM back to him...If I'm to be faulted for anything then its for returning the jest in forum...If you do kill me you will find out that I'm not mafia, and once again us villagers have made another "oops"
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08-16-2005, 03:27 AM | #282 | |
Coordinator
Join Date: Apr 2001
Location: Early, TX
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Quote:
I jokingly called you a rookie. Didn't realize you were that sensitive or that you were taking the game so seriously. I'm actually not trying to provoke you at all. If you can't handle getting voted for in a game, maybe you shouldn't play.
__________________
Just beat the devil out of it!!! - Bob Ross |
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08-16-2005, 03:41 AM | #283 | |
Go Reds
Join Date: May 2001
Location: Bloodbuzz Ohio
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Quote:
| Man with history of sensitivity issues. You can play it off, but you were trying to bait me, I will not play along, and suspicion for you mounts! Last edited by korme : 08-16-2005 at 03:41 AM. |
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08-16-2005, 05:43 AM | #284 | |
Coordinator
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: Scottsdale, Arizona
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Quote:
enough said....you cant say that...simple as black and white
__________________
Underachievement The tallest blade of grass is the first to be cut by the lawnmower. Despair It's always darkest just before it goes pitch black. Demotivation Sometimes the best solution to morale problems is just to fire all of the unhappy people. http://www.despair.com/viewall.html |
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08-16-2005, 06:27 AM | #285 |
Grizzled Veteran
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: MA
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Frikken wierd.
Why would Bek send that and why would Blade twist it when there is no need to get aggressive like that. The whole situation makes no sense. |
08-16-2005, 09:03 AM | #286 |
Torchbearer
Join Date: Sep 2001
Location: On Lake Harriet
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So, the summary for last night is we have three options (and two of them don't look so good):
1. Don's son was found. Add one more to the mafia total. 2. Some sort of secret bribe. Add one more to the mafia total. 3. The retired officer blocked the kill. Things remain the same. (A win for the villagers.) Now, onto today, this Bek-Blade thing makes absolutely no sense. Why would Bek send a truthful PM like that? If Bek didn't send the PM, why would Blade make it up? Is Bek screwing with Blade? Where can I get a good cup of coffee? |
08-16-2005, 09:07 AM | #287 |
High School Varsity
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: here
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08-16-2005, 09:20 AM | #288 | |
College Benchwarmer
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Los Angeles, California
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Quote:
I agree with Bek here. Seems alittle fishy that Blade would wait until Bek says he won't be back for some time to release this "evidence" to us. Plus, I'm still trying to figure out why Bek would reveal himself in this manner and not think it was going to get back to the forum. I think Blade is trying to pull something here. Any ideas?
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08-16-2005, 10:28 AM | #289 | ||
High School JV
Join Date: Aug 2005
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Quote:
This being to Jeff's first post of Quote:
This is all he is doing to us villagers. Sending us down a road that is only going to get another one of us killed. We have to look who started this whole confrontation...which leads us the the doorstep of blade's house...lets not let a mafia member slip through our fingers when we have the chance to lynch one |
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08-16-2005, 10:29 AM | #290 | ||
Head Coach
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: Green Bay, WI
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Quote:
Bek has already confirmed that he sent the PM. Quote:
But he maintains it was taken out of context, that he isn't really a Mafioso, but that a joke he was playing on Blade backfired. Why he would do so on the board instead of in person since the two are apparently off-board friends makes no sense. If you aren't, what can it profit you to make such a comment? Never mind the possibility that Blade himself is a Mafioso, thus giving him a prime opportunity to offer you as the sacrificial lamb and make himself appear more trusted. If Bek IS Mafioso, then his buddies have to be pretty pissed off with him right now. |
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08-16-2005, 10:31 AM | #291 |
Grizzled Veteran
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: MA
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Well to be honest, you shouldn't be PMing someone you are currently engaged in the game with, unless your role dictates it.
Bolded for someone else . In anycase I'm of the opinion they are both villagers, just doesn't make sense otherwise. |
08-16-2005, 10:36 AM | #292 | |
Torchbearer
Join Date: Sep 2001
Location: On Lake Harriet
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Quote:
This is the only conclusion I can come to as well. |
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08-16-2005, 11:03 AM | #293 |
Pro Rookie
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: VA
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I agree with digamma and jeff. Just seems way to weird to be true, but I guess ya never know...
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08-16-2005, 12:07 PM | #294 |
Head Coach
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: Green Bay, WI
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I can't come to any conclusion where Bek is a Mafioso. It just doesn't make any sense for him to out himself this way.
The problem is, I can't come up with a profitable line of reasoning for why Blade would up and post the PM right away, rather than - if he truly believes Bek is guilty - try and build another argument and bring up the PM if he needs something to buttress it. By posting the PM immediately, he achieves one of three results: 1) Immediate condemnation of Bek followed by his subsequent lynching. This is followed by either: 1a) Cheers as Bek turns out to be Mafia, or 1b) Blade's immediate lynching for what seems to be a frame-up of a villager. If Blade is Mafioso, after all, he would know who his cohorts are, and thus he would know if Bek is truly Mafia. 2) General apathy because of the oddness of the scenario (which seems to be unfolding so far) 3) Suspicion of Blade himself because of the immediacy of his vote. I did some thinking about this during my statistics class. If the Mafia did convert somebody last night, either by finding the Don's Son, or by bribing somebody, then they potentially number as high as 4 of the remaining 15 players. Their end-game is to reach a 1:1 ratio, meaning they only need to off seven of us, plus one additional for any of theirs that die. Assuming that there are four Mafioso right now, and 11 villagers, consider this scenario: Blade is Mafioso, and seized on an innocent joke from his friend as an opportunity to lynch a villager. The Mafia get an opportunity to kill somebody tonight (unless the Retired Officer saves the day), and this time tomorrow morning, there are still 4 Mafia, but now only 9 villagers. Where things go at this point depend largely upon whether people give Blade a pass for his reading of the PM, or if they determine he is Mafioso and lynch him. And, most importantly, whether he actually IS Mafioso. If both Bek and Blade are innocent, then two days hence we could conceivably be in a 7-4 situation, and in deep, deep doo-doo. But I keep coming back to the fact that if Blade were innocent, why would he stick his neck out so far, so quickly, based on a PM from someone with whom he's friendly off-board - someone who might be expected to engage in some tomfoolery? I can respect the "I wanted to get the information out there in case it was important" line, but why not play your cards a little closer to the vest in the first place and try to draw Bek out, rather than go all-in on your hole cards? vote Blade6119, until we get some better information. |
08-16-2005, 12:15 PM | #295 |
Grizzled Veteran
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: MA
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Well, as far as I can tell I'll probably end up sticking with my vote from yesterday. I think yesterdays voting was even less helpful than day one. Hopefully it will benefit more towards the end of the game.
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08-16-2005, 12:38 PM | #296 | |
Coordinator
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: Scottsdale, Arizona
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Quote:
As i stated, sitting on this would only delay this same problem...if i brought it up on three days, you would just not believe me then and we would have already lost a few more villagers. Im in no way trying to be overtly aggressive, but after bek had given me countless hints and clues he was mafia during our off-board time, i waited for something concrete and this was it. I can guarantee you one thing, not about bek but about me...if you kill me it will help the mafia...the ratio will get tighter as i count as a villager(and dont yet know any of the mafia...i could soon though if i keep searching at night) and you will lose another tonight...do what you will, but after days of him saying he was mafia, he finally gave me some written evidence and i used it. At the end of the day, bek is still my buddy, and who you kill wont affect that...i just wanted to help the team and teach him a lesson of what not to do when your mafia...if he isnt mafia, then hes been playing with me for quite some time...and did a damn good job. Oh well, either way ill see you all next game
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Underachievement The tallest blade of grass is the first to be cut by the lawnmower. Despair It's always darkest just before it goes pitch black. Demotivation Sometimes the best solution to morale problems is just to fire all of the unhappy people. http://www.despair.com/viewall.html Last edited by Blade6119 : 08-16-2005 at 12:40 PM. |
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08-16-2005, 12:39 PM | #297 |
Grizzled Veteran
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: MA
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As an observation, I think any seers we have left should not even hint at their role unless they are about to be lynched or it's late in the game.
Last edited by jeff061 : 08-16-2005 at 12:42 PM. |
08-16-2005, 12:42 PM | #298 |
Head Coach
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: Green Bay, WI
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Blade, if you are truly a villager, you might still be giving away too much.
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08-16-2005, 12:44 PM | #299 |
Torchbearer
Join Date: Sep 2001
Location: On Lake Harriet
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I seem to be always a few minutes behind jeff with my comments, but I too am uncomfortable with a witness reveal this early and with no solid evidence against anyone.
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08-16-2005, 12:45 PM | #300 |
Grizzled Veteran
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: MA
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I'd also add, if there was a bribe(I'm assuming this is a convert?) the #1 target would be Sak . Just because he was cleared yesterday and now he's playing up the real/blade situation.
You Mafia veterans know what all these roles and actions are and I'm left in the lurch . |
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