WW CXLVI: Portal GAME OVER - Test8

[britrock88]

Originally Posted by CrimsonFox

vote for another tester using your new tools.

Hmm.

[Narcizo]

Britrock88? What like The Wonderstuff and The Wedding Present and stuff?

[Narcizo]

So on to the eternal warewolf (sic) question of whether day one no shows should be voted out asap or not. I don't like voting guys just because they missed a day so I won't be going there. Leaving things pretty much/exactly where we were yesterday.

Say we assume that the wolves were equally in the dark about the stuck vote mechanic. Assume one (or more) of Autumn, Golden Eagle or Jackal are wolves. I think you might see a late move to protect one of them by one (or more) wolves who hadn't voted before it became clear that there was no vote-switching allowed. Leaving Ragone, tyketime and, possibly, Passacaglia (might have realised without commenting on it) with a potential connection with one of Autumn, GoldenEagle or The_Jackal. Not much to go on but, you know, there's not going to be that much to go on after a day one like that.

Vote Ragone

For now.

[Barkeep49]

Originally Posted by Narcizo

Last time I checked in I thought everyone was all about the not voting for people who aren't around D1. You know what with the potential role-reveals and whatnot. Then again with no roles listed I've no idea what sort of role reveal would be accepted in this sort of game anyway.

Doing some major catch-up here (wasn't around after 9 AM Central) but I am a firm believer that a more active game is more fun.

[Barkeep49]

Alright given what's transpired, I would like to propose the following: Crimson is gradually introducing WW game mechanics, in the same way that Portal gradually introduces its game mechanics.

So, this would mean:
1. We were all Vanilla Villagers on Day 1.
2. We now have a BG in the game, in the form of the cube. Could be the cube is a player or an object, I would lean towards object and thus the BG is not a person but whoever has the cube.
3. I have a 3rd supposition but I hesitate to post it at this time. I post this here now, so that I can later cite it should it come into play.

Questions I still have:
*Are we going to see a lynch today?
*Have wolves been gradually introduced into the game yet as well?

[Narcizo]

Originally Posted by Barkeep49

So, this would mean:
1. We were all Vanilla Villagers on Day 1.

Um... that's a big assumption right there isn't it? I hadn't thought of it and it's a neat idea so it's worth considering but I don't think it's something we want to assume. Might explain why there was no lynch but then again the tied vote might explain it as well.

I think we're going to see a lynch today - but the only way to be sure is to vote and see.

[PackerFanatic]

Originally Posted by Barkeep49

Alright given what's transpired, I would like to propose the following: Crimson is gradually introducing WW game mechanics, in the same way that Portal gradually introduces its game mechanics.

That's an interesting thought...and definitely something to consider based on how things played out yesterday.

There is definitely a lot still up in the air and it would be dangerous of us to be so hasty in our assumptions.

[Marc Vaughan]

Rubs eyes .... never ever do international travel when subscribed to a WW game

(now where were we again )

[Simbo Klice]

Hmmm, so the first day was just a joke vote, nothing happened at night, and this will now be the official start of the regular game then? I guess I'll wait and let some of the vets hypothesize and take the initiative before I throw a vote down on anyone.

[Marc Vaughan]

Originally Posted by Narcizo

Unfortunately MV being a no-show doesn't surprise me. I think I've been in a couple of games "with" him and never seen him post.

Aha - I'm back in the US now, so have to spoil my record with you

(previously the games I played were when I was in the UK which always made it challenging as I tended to find alliances setup and myself voted out before I even woke up )

For me:

Vote Marc Vaughan

As I'm feeling a bit left out .... normally by now someones thrown me to the wolves, this time I'm so hard done by I'll have to do it myself

[Autumn]

I wonder three things:

1. today CF introduces unvoting, but perhaps actual lynching won't be introduced until tomorow?
2. Do his instructions imply that we need to do an unvote if we want our vote to stick?
3. At what stage will night kills be introduced? I think BK may be on to something with the introduction of roles as well. It's an interesting ruleset.

I will make sure to unvote at some point today just in case.

[hoopsguy]

I think that BK's theories are as good as any at this point.

But if we assume that the BG came into the game, then I would also expect that we now have a wolf in the game as well. So how would the wolf/wolves have been assigned last night? Would it be driven in some way by the "non vote" yesterday or an entirely different mechanic?

My initial thoughts are to return to the candidates from yesterday with the idea that there would be some correlation between the people we voted yesterday and the emergence of wolves as roles evolved. Otherwise, the Day 1 vote was an even bigger waste of time than normal

[Julio Riddols]

UNVOTE JAG

[JAG]

I would guess the lynch happens starting today, at least I'm going with that, though I'm open to the idea it might not since it's not spelled out. Two days with no lynching would be a pretty slow start.

[Ragone]

Honestly Narcizo, i felt as if this wasn't going to be a standard lynch.. and that jackal was getting railroaded as goldeneagle had voted for him. Thats why i tied it up, in hopes that it would save jackal. Or at worst lynch both of them and get a wolf with a villager sacrifice.

I do also like the theory that everyone was villagers on day 1... and roles will be gradually introduced..

[Ragone]

As i consider a villager sacrifice to be a worst case scenario..

[PackerFanatic]

I would find it hard to believe if there was not at least one wolf yesterday. The way things are playing out so far, it's not farfetched to think that that wolf (or wolves) will not be given a NK until somewhere down the road (tonight, tomorrow) - or based on the tie, he wasn't able to use it?

[Simbo Klice]

I agree, PackerFanatic. I would have to think at least one person started as GlaaDos. Do you guys ever have cults in your games?

[Ragone]

We have the cube in game now.. so we are assuming its bg power.. so its also giving the assumptions that wolf or wolves will get a nk tonight

[Passacaglia]

So MV has checked in with an excuse, that makes me ready to roll on Chubby.

VOTE CHUBBY

I plan to unvote later after CF posts a vote count, just to make sure I can. But if I can't, I won't be torn up about it.

[The Jackal]

This is some interesting theorizing. I find it hard to believe that everyone was vanilla on D1. Unless we can be fairly sure of that mechanic as the days progress that would put the village at a huge disadvantage in terms of analyzing posts. Flinging wild accusations and such. But maybe's that what Crimson wants. Crazy bastard.

[The Jackal]

Analyzing posts AND votes, missed that.

[Passacaglia]

Originally Posted by The Jackal

This is some interesting theorizing. I find it hard to believe that everyone was vanilla on D1. Unless we can be fairly sure of that mechanic as the days progress that would put the village at a huge disadvantage in terms of analyzing posts. Flinging wild accusations and such. But maybe's that what Crimson wants. Crazy bastard.

I kind of feel the same way, that this all may be barking up the wrong tree, in a way. On the other hand, I don't really have anything better to talk about, so felt no reason to speak out against it.

I guess it would be interesting to see who's on what side of this argument, then maybe we can look back and see if someone was trying to dismiss Day 1 voting as invalid, knowing that it could be potentially useful to us? Although I don't see how it would be with no unvoting allowed, and no lynch.

[Julio Riddols]

I'm with Passacaglia on this one.

VOTE CHUBBY

[The Jackal]

FWIW, I could definitely see Crimson pulling something like this, where roles are doled out as the days go on. Hard to speculate at this point, so will try to make an educated vote based on yesterday.

[bhlloy]

I can't believe Ragone is a wolf tying it up there. A bad villager play maybe but a wolf is more careful. So I'm not lookin there yet

Not much we can go on from day one, but I'm going to go here for now

Vote britrock88

[Autumn]

I can't imagine CF would so transparently tie the vote in with the introduction of wolves. I can imagine that there werne't any wolves day one, but I assume the introductoin would be random.

I don't know anythinga bout the bad guys in Portal. Are there any clues there in the game as to what hte mechanics might be?

[Marc Vaughan]

Originally Posted by Autumn

I don't know anythinga bout the bad guys in Portal. Are there any clues there in the game as to what hte mechanics might be?

From what I remember of 'Portal' the only bad guy was the computer who was running the tests ....

It could be that the entire thing is just one big psychological test to see how many people will be sacrificed for no real reason, would be kinda cool

That being said I'd have also thought the Portal setup would suit people being 'offered' assistance by the (slightly demented) computer system and thus gaining roles during the game ..... in return for doing certain things for the computer possibly? ..... dunno, working this out will be all part of the fun ...

[The Jackal]

It's been awhile since I played portal, I don't remember much about it except how cool advancing through the beginning part of the game was. Come to think of it I'm not sure I ever finished it.. need to rectify that.

[The Jackal]

VOTE RA

[The Jackal]

His was the 8th vote placed on a person (me)! Moreso this is for the timing of the vote, as 6 people had 1 vote and two had just gotten their second.

[The Jackal]

Well, Julio had been at 2 for a bit, but yeah.

[tyketime]

I'm also willing to go with Barkeep's theory regarding a gradual introduction of abilities (as others have pointed out - consistent with the game). Wouldn't that support the idea that perhaps the wolves didn't have the NK ability Night 1, but now with the protective cube in play, NK will most certainly begin tonight?

[PackerFanatic]

Originally Posted by tyketime

I'm also willing to go with Barkeep's theory regarding a gradual introduction of abilities (as others have pointed out - consistent with the game). Wouldn't that support the idea that perhaps the wolves didn't have the NK ability Night 1, but now with the protective cube in play, NK will most certainly begin tonight?

That was my thinking as well.

[KWhit]

Originally Posted by tyketime

I'm also willing to go with Barkeep's theory regarding a gradual introduction of abilities (as others have pointed out - consistent with the game). Wouldn't that support the idea that perhaps the wolves didn't have the NK ability Night 1, but now with the protective cube in play, NK will most certainly begin tonight?

I'm leaning toward this theory as well. But I think the wolves were probably already assigned at the beginning of the game. Otherwise day 1 would have no game play purpose whatsoever, right? Other than to confuse us by making it harder to get a handle on voting patterns later on.

[tyketime]

Originally Posted by hoopsguy

My initial thoughts are to return to the candidates from yesterday with the idea that there would be some correlation between the people we voted yesterday and the emergence of wolves as roles evolved. Otherwise, the Day 1 vote was an even bigger waste of time than normal

On one hand this could possibly prove valuable. Yet, if the wolves know that the candidates are all Villagers, it would be a good way to waste another vote or two.

[GoldenEagle]

Interesting. Essentially, we at a Day 1A. Today's vote will be another crapshoot with votes all over the place.

I tend to agree with bholiy that Ragone is not a direction we need to go today. I don't see him making that vote either if he is a wolf.

It looks like Chubby may be the choice as even a couple of people vote for him he will probably still have some form of punishment. I am curios if MV's votes will carry over as well, even though he has woken up.

[Narcizo]

Originally Posted by Ragone

Honestly Narcizo, i felt as if this wasn't going to be a standard lynch.. and that jackal was getting railroaded as goldeneagle had voted for him. Thats why i tied it up, in hopes that it would save jackal. Or at worst lynch both of them and get a wolf with a villager sacrifice.

I've no problem with your vote, it's probably the one I would have made in the circumstances as well. But you've got to look for information where you can get it and finding out if you are a wolf will give us (very little) information. But if it was all-villager on day one then the whole day was a waste and reveals nothing (except as a control experiment of how people act when it's all villager).

I just have difficulty seeing a whole day go by when it's all-villager. What's the point of that? But I'll agree it makes sense in terms of what (hasn't) happened.

[tyketime]

In reading over CF's instructions for today, he mentions a Special Test at 3PM PST today. I checked to see if there was any correlation with votes being locked in yesterday, but that message was at 5:46pm. So I don't think time is necessarily the mechanic in play.

[PackerFanatic]

Originally Posted by Narcizo

I just have difficulty seeing a whole day go by when it's all-villager. What's the point of that? But I'll agree it makes sense in terms of what (hasn't) happened.

That's been my feeling too.

[PackerFanatic]

Originally Posted by CrimsonFox

Thank you for your concise and brief interrogative. The tie mechanism is as follows. Those involved in a tie will be processed in the tie-evaluation chamber and be put through a series of tests involving, in no particular order of importance, their age, their weight, the number of hairs on their head, how much cake they have eaten that day, how much cake they can eat, the amount of posts made, and how much everyone hates them.

And the most important factor, beyond any previously listed is...ASFIJIUFAAAAAIIIIIIIIIIIEEEMNMEZZZZZZHHZZHHEEEEEEF--*FFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFF*

*>CHIRP<*

Unless I missed it, has this been looked into at all? Do we know how many posts Jackal and GE had at the time of the vote?

[Narcizo]

Originally Posted by bhlloy

I can't believe Ragone is a wolf tying it up there. A bad villager play maybe but a wolf is more careful. So I'm not lookin there yet

Why not? He's got to vote - he thinks there are two people left to vote. He can't make a throwaway vote because that would look terrible. I'd say he's pretty much got to make that vote whether he's a wolf or a villager. I certainly don't see it as a bad villager play.

[tyketime]

My unofficial tally:

Ragone (1) - Narcizo (253)
Marc Vaughn (1) - Marc Vaughn (260)
Chubby (2) - Passacaglia (270), Julio Riddols (274)
Bitrock88 (1) - bhlloy (276)
Raiders Army (1) - The Jackal (280)

[tyketime]

Originally Posted by Narcizo

...But you've got to look for information where you can get it and finding out if you are a wolf will give us (very little) information. But if it was all-villager on day one then the whole day was a waste and reveals nothing (except as a control experiment of how people act when it's all villager).

Originally Posted by Narcizo

Why not? He's got to vote - he thinks there are two people left to vote. He can't make a throwaway vote because that would look terrible. I'd say he's pretty much got to make that vote whether he's a wolf or a villager. I certainly don't see it as a bad villager play.

But if it turned out he was a wolf, wouldn't that point us towards one of the other two as another probable suspect?

[bhlloy]

Originally Posted by Narcizo

Why not? He's got to vote - he thinks there are two people left to vote. He can't make a throwaway vote because that would look terrible. I'd say he's pretty much got to make that vote whether he's a wolf or a villager. I certainly don't see it as a bad villager play.

Better a throwaway vote than a vote that ties it up with no vote switching and the two people left nowhere to be seen. If he is a wolf and he was advised to make that play then we have some bad wolves. I hope if we have roles he was scanned or is on the radar to be scanned just in case but it's enough of a non wolf move that I feel very comfortable not using a lynch there today.

[bhlloy]

If anyone cares why I have britrock btw, the early vote with the disclaimer that he won't be around for the rest of the day, and then apologizing to Zinto and saying he wouldn't have voted for him if he'd been around but not actually unvoting him is interesting to me. In the kind of could be a wolf trying to avoid attention and doing his hardest to not piss anyone off way

But I'm sure I'm reading way too much into day one, as usual

[Narcizo]

I disagree - better a tie than a throwaway vote.

Okay there's the risk that a tie will result in a no-lynch but otherwise I don't understand why everyone is so down on ties. And even if it results in a no-lynch there's still information to be gained from the voting. A throwaway might as well be a no vote.

All pretty theoretical however. I'm still trying to decide if there is any information at all to be taken from day one or if it's just time to start a-fresh. I really hope it isn't the latter.

[Barkeep49]

Have I missed it or have neither of the winners explained what they won from the vote yesterday? I have to think something happened such that Day 1 wasn't a complete waste of time. We know it wasn't a lynch, so I'm really curious what it might have been.

[Barkeep49]

Originally Posted by Barkeep49

Have I missed it or have neither of the winners explained what they won from the vote yesterday? I have to think something happened such that Day 1 wasn't a complete waste of time. We know it wasn't a lynch, so I'm really curious what it might have been.

Winners and won should be in quotes in this post.

[GoldenEagle]

I didn't "win" anything special from the vote yesterday. That means either The Jackal beat me in the duel and won whatever there was to win or it was a complete waste of time.