WW CXLIX SPAWN IV - GAME OVER (Post 3845)

[britrock88]

Because he can't issue orders at night.

[Julio Riddols]

I am not sure why there is any question about Shiggles at this point. When we lynch him tonight, we will have made the right move, whether we lose a doctor or not.

The second spawn is a much murkier subject, but I think after tonight we will have an idea where to go with our votes on that front.

Wanted to confirm one thing though - If we don't get off this rock tonight, which is a distinct possibility since we haven't yet weeded out the last 2 spawn, will we certainly be able to get water tomorrow? Because we will need it and we will need to ensure that our mission to get it is successful.

[Barkeep49]

Originally Posted by CrimsonFox

I'm going to ask a scary question that no one has asked nor probably would.

BK, did you make a mistake about bed count?

and

BK, according to all those damage reports, it said there were 9 beds not damaged. That does mean that 9 people can sleep right?

There was no mistake made about the beds.

9 people could sleep if there are 9 undamaged beds.

[CrimsonFox]

Originally Posted by JAG

I thought it would've been smart by them to mutate me, but I guess they felt like it was too obvious a move since it didn't happen.

I mean there's the whole JAG/DANNY/HOOPS thing going on here. One would think that ONE of these three would be a target for sure just to shut them up. (because they are good at analysis not because they talk too much.... Then it'd be me). It isn't me and it seems it's not hoops. Not Danny I guess because he wasn't a big role.

This also possibly suggests new wolves or "quick last minute submissions without reading much" wolves.

That really points to Jag/Hoops. So if not them, then Abe/Brit/GE/DV for important roles. Are any of them cleared today based on cross-role action?

[Barkeep49]

Originally Posted by CrimsonFox

You see...I KNEW IT! This HAS to be the answer! It's in the rules even! (just kidding but so many things happen that we don't understand that it makes me wonder sometimes)

It is true. I have made mistakes this game. It's in the rules (and early on at that) for a reason .

[CrimsonFox]

Originally Posted by Barkeep49

There was no mistake made about the beds.

9 people could sleep if there are 9 undamaged beds.

Thanks man.

Okay there is no doubt in my mind then.

[Julio Riddols]

Never mind, going back and reading morning 6 says we still have water for 1.5 days. I guess we tossed all that extra crystlium in the garbage instead of putting it in our warehouse. Good.

[JAG]

Originally Posted by Julio Riddols

I am not sure why there is any question about Shiggles at this point.

1. He could not have attacked from the brig. No one was in there with him. It did not lose power until the end of the evening.

2. He claimed a villager role that wasn't countered.

3. His voting record...no vote D2 when there was a Spawn on the line to be killed, D4 voted Zinto then Simbo when he could've latched onto another villager that had votes.


I can't explain the bed / exhaustion thing, but neither can I explain the above points. Because of points 2 and 3, I don't think he's starting Spawn, based on point 1 I don't see how he could be Spawn at all.

[CrimsonFox]

And yeahyeahyeah voting analysis but as last game showed, you can't JUST look at voting analysis. Danny said it best. YOU have to look at both things that complement each other.

Voting, Reactions/posting, and with this game rules/roles/ingame work actions

[CrimsonFox]

Originally Posted by JAG

1. He could not have attacked from the brig. No one was in there with him. It did not lose power until the end of the evening.

2. He claimed a villager role that wasn't countered.

3. His voting record...no vote D2 when there was a Spawn on the line to be killed, D4 voted Zinto then Simbo when he could've latched onto another villager that had votes.


I can't explain the bed / exhaustion thing, but neither can I explain the above points. Because of points 2 and 3, I don't think he's starting Spawn, based on point 1 I don't see how he could be Spawn at all.

Number 1 is NOT confirmed whatsoever. You don't know that the kill didn't happen at the end of the night cycle. Look at Autumn's game last game. Kill happened at the end of the cycle there too.

[JAG]

True, it's not confirmed, but BK said most actions happen immediately and conversion / repair happens at the end of the evening. To confirm it we would need a dead body that would've otherwise been working on conversion / repair and the only two dead are the two that were killed last night, neither of which were doing either of those two things.

Julio, can you explain what you saw from the HQ since you manned it? You could probably shed some light on this. You said something about 'getting kicked from the HQ before the end of the night' I believe?

[Barkeep49]

Current Vote Count:

Votes Needed to lynch: 5

Brit 2 - JAG (3357) Danny (3359)
Shiggles 5 - CF (3081) Julio (3096) Chubby (3155) DV (3203) brit (3391)
DV 2 - Shiggles (3101) Abe (3296)

[JAG]

Originally Posted by CrimsonFox

And yeahyeahyeah voting analysis but as last game showed, you can't JUST look at voting analysis. Danny said it best. YOU have to look at both things that complement each other.

Voting, Reactions/posting, and with this game rules/roles/ingame work actions

If you look at my long post of analysis, you'll see I didn't 'just' use voting record to come up with my thoughts on people.

So speaking of non-voting analysis reasons, you didn't think Abe's reaction to being scanned by Shiggles was weird?

Originally Posted by Abe Sargent

unvote Shiggles
Vote DV

I suspect that if Shiggles were spawn, he would have said I was when I wasn;t to get a day of voting off me and then him the next day. Take out the trainer and end any more doctors, that's how I would have played that.

Originally Posted by Danny

Why would he do that Abe? If you were spawn and he wasn't, you both would have exploded. He's not going to claim something that is impossible.

Originally Posted by Abe Sargent

He could claim I was tainted, like dubb was, that;s what I was referring to.

Originally Posted by Danny

But that;s also impossible. We know Zinto died and the spawn did not remake the queen, so you couldn't be a spawnling.

[Julio Riddols]

Originally Posted by JAG

True, it's not confirmed, but BK said most actions happen immediately and conversion / repair happens at the end of the evening. To confirm it we would need a dead body that would've otherwise been working on conversion / repair and the only two dead are the two that were killed last night, neither of which were doing either of those two things.

Julio, can you explain what you saw from the HQ since you manned it? You could probably shed some light on this. You said something about 'getting kicked from the HQ before the end of the night' I believe?

I wasn't notified that I had seen anything. I was just forced to stop watching things at some point because the conversion work hindered my duties. I'm assuming spawn actions took place after that and out of my view.

[Abe Sargent]

Originally Posted by JAG

If you look at my long post of analysis, you'll see I didn't 'just' use voting record to come up with my thoughts on people.

So speaking of non-voting analysis reasons, you didn't think Abe's reaction to being scanned by Shiggles was weird?

And I responded just a couple of minutes later so it must have been coordinated...

[Abe Sargent]

I haven't been following work and converting on module son today's super long day, is there work I can do since it looks like we need to hold off until tomorrow for training?

[LoneStarGirl]

Kinda forgot I was playing. Lots to catch up on, but the whole bed situation seems pretty damning dor Shiggles.

Execute shiggles

[JAG]

Originally Posted by Julio Riddols

I wasn't notified that I had seen anything. I was just forced to stop watching things at some point because the conversion work hindered my duties. I'm assuming spawn actions took place after that and out of my view.

Alright, pulling up the security HQ info:

The Security HQ contains security systems which monitor and protect important ship and planet areas. While on the planet and manned, the security system will report anyone who enters buildings A, B, C, or the ship, though there is a 10% chance at night of avoiding detection. Additionally it prevents, both on the planet and after lift-off, anyone from attacking the Slave Pens, Crew Quarters, Armory, and the Brig while manned. Both of these functions may be impaired if the Security HQ becomes damaged. A successful spawn attack requires 2-5 man cycles of repair time. Conversion is optional, but the Brig and the Armory will not function on the ship without it.

Since saldana and CR didn't have night actions they could take, both should've been in the crew quarters I would think. The crew quarters are in building D (Building D: Crew Quarters, Medical Facilities, Scientists’ Lab, Officers’ Offices), which is not covered by the security HQ. So you wouldn't have seen the killings of saldana and CR at any point in the night, whether the conversion interfered with your duties or not.

[JAG]

Originally Posted by Abe Sargent

And I responded just a couple of minutes later so it must have been coordinated...

I didn't say anything about things being coordinated, I was talking about your response to being scanned and then response to Danny when he made his comment.

[JAG]

Originally Posted by JAG

Alright, pulling up the security HQ info:



Since saldana and CR didn't have night actions they could take, both should've been in the crew quarters I would think. The crew quarters are in building D (Building D: Crew Quarters, Medical Facilities, Scientists’ Lab, Officers’ Offices), which is not covered by the security HQ. So you wouldn't have seen the killings of saldana and CR at any point in the night, whether the conversion interfered with your duties or not.

Actually, I take that back. The crew quarters are on the ship now. So that does take the shine off the first part of my argument for Shiggles not being Spawn, though not for why he isn't a good candidate for a starting Spawn.

[JAG]

Originally Posted by Shiggles

Alrighty, so i'll be out of the house till probably later than orders, but ill try to get mine out, friends from out of town. BUT! conditions! In case i miss my orders, JAG, you can assign me where to go, i believe were going on more conversion runs, but it looks like those are completed due to autumn's number crunching. Any other group activities, maybe collecting water for the masses? I'll try to keep up to date on the goings on, but again, may be late. Submitting a PM to barkeep soonish!

Here's an early post by Shiggles where he's talking about wanting to be involved in 'group activities', which squares away with his claim of being Spawn Aware.

Originally Posted by Shiggles

ooo, away team. i could totally help with that right? and i could first aid anyone who gets attacked. totally!

Another post of his that tends to lean towards Spawn Aware.

You'd think if he were planting these things as a Spawn with the idea of fake revealing later on he might want to point to them in his own defense, no?

[hoopsguy]

Originally Posted by JAG

Post 3219 he quoted the rule, I'll re-post:



That specifically says conversion happens at the end of a cycle.

I still have not seen an answer from people voting Shiggles how they explain him claiming the spawn aware role. As a Spawn, that would be a very risky option when you don't know that another person is going to claim the same. It would be a nice move to pull if he was the mutated spawn and knew he previously had that role, but that basically removes him from being a starting spawn in my eyes.

Right, but that seems to suggest day cycle, as opposed to night cycle. Maybe I'm missing the context of the original question but the real-time element would seem to be restricted to daytime actions - which we see processed in real time. Processing night-time actions in real time would be quite a surprise to me ... if that is the case, then there are probably a few people kicking themselves over not knowing this prior to Day 6.

[Abe Sargent]

Originally Posted by JAG

I didn't say anything about things being coordinated, I was talking about your response to being scanned and then response to Danny when he made his comment.

I thought when you said "weird" you meant coordinated, wolfish weird. Otherwise, why mention it at all if "weird" doesn't strike you as wolfish?

[britrock88]

Originally Posted by JAG

Here's an early post by Shiggles where he's talking about wanting to be involved in 'group activities', which squares away with his claim of being Spawn Aware.



Another post of his that tends to lean towards Spawn Aware.

You'd think if he were planting these things as a Spawn with the idea of fake revealing later on he might want to point to them in his own defense, no?

All this said, Spawn Aware would have to be one of the easiest secret roles for a spawn to fake (if he's on the spawn council, which would seemingly be the case here, and knows the identity of other spawn).

[JAG]

Originally Posted by britrock88

All this said, Spawn Aware would have to be one of the easiest secret roles for a spawn to fake (if he's on the spawn council, which would seemingly be the case here, and knows the identity of other spawn).

The point is that his claim seems to be supported by his earlier posts. The argument against Shiggles as Spawn is that he did the attack with Zinto on someone which is why he was exhausted with Zinto. That means that Shiggles would have to be the original Spawn, not the mutated Spawn. If that's the case, then it doesn't match up with the gist from some of his earlier posts.

[JAG]

Originally Posted by hoopsguy

Right, but that seems to suggest day cycle, as opposed to night cycle. Maybe I'm missing the context of the original question but the real-time element would seem to be restricted to daytime actions - which we see processed in real time. Processing night-time actions in real time would be quite a surprise to me ... if that is the case, then there are probably a few people kicking themselves over not knowing this prior to Day 6.

That could be the case, yeah. I don't subscribe to my point about him being in the brig and couldn't do the attack thing anymore based on what Julio said with the building losing power before the end of the night. I just don't think the evidence points to him being an original Spawn.

[hoopsguy]

Yep, co-opting a late role is an easier play for the wolves - can take the one that the guy they grabbed Night 4 on a conversion play had, for example.

In terms of Spawn Aware mechanics, I'm not positive how that one plays out in terms of how early someone learns about holding that role. I suppose it is possible someone could have it and not know by now ... I was considering that as one of my roles earlier in the day before Julio clued me in on what I actually have.

I really am struggling to get past the empty bed thing with Shiggles. I'm trying to listen to arguments posed by JAG/Shiggles, but it really hasn't moved me off my spot today.

[hoopsguy]

Going to be spotty with availability the rest of the way, and I need to get my vote in.

VOTE SHIGGLES

[GoldenEagle]

VOTE SHIGGLES

I am not really sure at this point, but that is my best guess.

[Danny]

With Julio's statement about the power that clears up the shuffles thing quite a bit. I think he is a solid vote. I'm sticking wthy current one cause it's already a runaway but will keep an eye in case I need to switch

[Barkeep49]

Votes Needed to lynch: 5

Brit 2 - JAG (3357) Danny (3359)
Shiggles 8 - CF (3081) Julio (3096) Chubby (3155) DV (3203) brit (3391) LSG (3419) hoops (3428) GE (3428)
DV 2 - Shiggles (3101) Abe (3296)

[Abe Sargent]

If we're voting off Shiggy, we need to train someone, who do you want as the new doctor?

[Abe Sargent]

BK I noticed that CR is listed as having died Night SIX not Night Five, was that a typo is is that some ability to kill early one night but miss your action the next or something?

[hoopsguy]

doc = death sentence

[Danny]

Abe since we haven't converted medical facilities would it even matter?

[JAG]

No point in making a doctor if we're lifting off as expected.

[Abe Sargent]

Okay then, I guess we'll find out. I hope we won't though

[Shiggles]

Well good luck guys. I weep for the other survivors.

[Barkeep49]

Originally Posted by Abe Sargent

BK I noticed that CR is listed as having died Night SIX not Night Five, was that a typo is is that some ability to kill early one night but miss your action the next or something?

Typo

[Shiggles]

*busily starts drawing protective runes all over his body* My CHANTING will protect ME! *starts sprinting down the hallways singing a rendition of 'we shall not be moved' whilst doing the electric slide every other verse*

[Barkeep49]

Deadline I believe.

[Barkeep49]

The day seemed to go on forever. There was a good deal of discussion, but in the end the suspect entering the day was the man chosen at the end of the day for Spawn Detection of the most violent kind. Shiggles makes an effort to defend himself but it falls on deaf ears.

Despite the flesh torn from the body there is no sign of anything but the normal internal organs one finds. Shiggles was a SURVIVOR

Locations

Building A:
Warehouse 4 7 cycles required for conversion
40 / 40 units filled
Warehouse 5 7 cycles required for conversion
33 / 40 units filled
Water Supply – 17 units Enough for about 1.5 days at present rate of consumption
Crystilium Supply – 56 units (at least 20 required for lift-off)

Slave Pens Fully Operational
Slave Pen 1 2 cycles required for conversion
4 slaves present
Slave Pen 2 2 cycles required for conversion
4 slaves present
Slave Pen 3 2 cycles required for conversion
4 slaves present
Slave Pen 4 2 cycles required for conversion
4 slaves present
Slave Pen 5 2 cycles required for conversion
4 slaves present

Building B:
Power Facilities Fully Operational
Power Facility 3 5 cycles required for conversion
Powering Building D


Building C:
Security HQ Unpoweredl 2 cycles required for conversion

Armory Unpoweredl 4 cycles required for conversion
18 phasers accounted for

Brig Unpoweredl 4 cycles required for conversion


Building D:

Medical Facilities Fully Operational 4 cycles required for conversion


Peremiter Fence
Offline

Ship
Warehouse 1 Converted Inaccessible
Warehouse 2 Converted Inaccessible
Warehouse 3 Converted Inaccessible

Officers’ Offices Fully Operational Converted
Crew Quarters Damaged; 9 sleeping berths; 11 cycles to repair Converted

Power Facility Fully Operational Converted

Water Plant Fully Operational Converted
Producing enough water for all Survivors each day

Scientists’ Lab Fully Operational Converted
2 Spawn Detected
2 Engineer equivalent tools present


The Crew

Command Staff
Captain - JAG
First Officer - Lonestargirl
Second Officer - Danny

Chief Engineer - hoopsguy Exhausted
Engineers
Crimson Exhausted
Darth Exhausted

Security Staff
Slavemaster - Chubby
Sergeant-at-Arms - Julio Exhausted

Scientists
GoldenEagle
britrock
Trainer - Abe Sargent

Slaves
20 slaves accounted for

Deceased
mauboy - Lynched Day 2 SURVIVOR
Danny- Lynched Day 3 SURVIVOR
Autumn Killed Night 3 SURVIVOR
dubb Killed Night 3 SPAWN
Simbo Klice Lynched Day 4 SCRYING SPAWN
Zinto Lynched Day 5 SPAWN QUEEN
saldana Killed Night 5 SURVIVOR
Chief Rum Killed Night 5 SURVIVOR
Shiggles Lynched Day 6 SURVIVOR

Night 6 has begun

[hoopsguy]

Pretty quiet at the end there ... time to see if we made a good decision.

[hoopsguy]

OK - BK, please put the bed thing down as something to answer at the end of the game. K, thanks.

[Darth Vilus]

well son of a horse's ass

[JAG]

BK, we would like to Lift Off

[Danny]

Damn, we ready to take off though?

[Danny]

Damn, we ready to take off though?

[JAG]

The good news is there were no mutations during the day.

[Danny]

Wait, every room in the ship is playing failure to launch right now, I j