Werewolf 107, Terror at Blizzcon, Basic Game, GAME OVER, HORDE WINS

[EagleFan]

Originally Posted by Autumn

All right, if Danny's theory was correct about EF then the Warlock would likely have been on Darth, and probably been someone who wasn't here to move their vote.

Why on earth would the warlock be on the cunning? Why take that chance?

[dubb93]

Ah my favorite defense. The "Look guys, I wouldn't be stupid enough to do exactly what I did" defense.

[EagleFan]

Originally Posted by dubb93

[KWhit]

Originally Posted by Autumn

All right, if Danny's theory was correct about EF then the Warlock would likely have been on Darth, and probably been someone who wasn't here to move their vote. That's my assumption.

DV-8- J23 (100), MartinD (126) Schmidty (154) PD (160) Kwhit (166) Sal (173) CF (221) Autumn (226)

I know I was there, CF, I'd have to look back to see who else was, but that would be one way to narrow down the field if we stick with that theory.

The other theory alwyas is that EF made kind of a boneheaded villager play and that we shouldn't get so caught up in that as to ignore everything else. I'm going to look at the day when I have a moment and see if we can learn anything knowing htat Darth was bad and DAnny was good.

I was around at deadline, for the record.

I'm not convinced that a wolf whose vote counted twice would have put it on a wolf - especially the most important wolf of all, the cunning.

I see what you're saying in that it makes EF's crazy switch somewhat logical, but still... That seems like a very risky move for a wolf to make.

[Lathum]

Originally Posted by Autumn

This has Darth voting for himself?

Sorry, that should say Crimson

[Autumn]

(154) Schmidty unvotes Poli, votes Darth Vilus (saldana 4, Darth Vilus 4, dubb93 3, Kwhit 3, EagleFan 1)
(160) PurdueBrad unvotes Kwhit, votes Darth Vilus (Darth Vilus 5, saldana 4, dubb93 3, Kwhit 2, EagleFan 1)
(166) Kwhit votes Darth Vilus (Darth Vilus 6, saldana 4, dubb93 3, Kwhit 2, EagleFan 1)
(171) GoldenEagle votes saldana (Darth Vilus 6, saldana 5, dubb93 3, Kwhit 2, EagleFan 1)
(173) saldana unvotes dubb93, votes Darth Vilus (Darth Vilus 7, saldana 5, dubb93 2, Kwhit 2, EagleFan 1)
(187) dubb93 unvotes Darth Vilus, votes saldana (Darth Vilus 6, saldana 6, dubb93 2, Kwhit 2, EagleFan 1)
(220) EagleFan unvotes Kwhit, votes saldana (saldana 7, Darth Vilus 6, dubb93 2, Kwhit 1, EagleFan 1)
(221) CrimsonFox unvotes dubb93, votes Darth Vilus (saldana 7, Darth Vilus 7, dubb93 2, EagleFan 1)
(222) claphamsa unvotes saldana
(224) claphamsa votes saldana (saldana 7, Darth Vilus 7, dubb93 2, EagleFan 1)
(226) Autumn unvotes saldana, votes Darth Vilus (Darth Vilus 8, saldana 6, dubb93 2, EagleFan 1)

First glance says Schmidty, PurdueBrad and KWhit look very good for piling votes on Darth when he wasn't necessarily going to die. Saldana's vote would look good, but it was self defense so it's less noteworthy. Dubb's unvote of Darth doesn't look great if we're looking for wolf-save votes, as obviously EF's does not. CF's vote looks good at the end.

These are just thoughts that I think would be apparent to anyone looking at that voting stretch, not a complete analysis. Just thinking outloud here.

[EagleFan]

Originally Posted by dubb93

Ah my favorite defense. The "Look guys, I wouldn't be stupid enough to do exactly what I did" defense.

You're misreading the entire arguement in that case. The stupid play would have been for warlock to vote the cunning. My arguement is that the entire group of wolves wouldn't be that stupid, thus forcing a desparate play by me.

You can't tell me that you think that all of the wolves wuold not have been online at the time of the vote and instead of trying to be subtile about moving the vote off DV they would decide that a last minute desparate play would be better?

[KWhit]

Originally Posted by EagleFan

You're misreading the entire arguement in that case. The stupid play would have been for warlock to vote the cunning. My arguement is that the entire group of wolves wouldn't be that stupid, thus forcing a desparate play by me.

You can't tell me that you think that all of the wolves wuold not have been online at the time of the vote and instead of trying to be subtile about moving the vote off DV they would decide that a last minute desparate play would be better?

I almost agree with you. EXCEPT: I can't think of any logical reason why a villager would make the move you made either.

[Autumn]

Originally Posted by EagleFan

Why on earth would the warlock be on the cunning? Why take that chance?

It's a good question. The answer might be 1) It wouldn't be, and wasn't, or 2) It was on very early and didn't get a chance to move, at the time it didn't seem to be a threat.

But it's a good point. If we assume the Warlock was instead voting Saldana, we would assume the wolves would leave it be, unless Saldana was a wolf, in which case they would want Darth to have one more vote and make it a tie. If we assume the warlock was voting elsewhere we would assume the wolves would let the tie be, or that they would try to switch to Saldana and talk their way out of it.

[EagleFan]

At the moment, PB, Schmidty, KWhit and Autumn look pretty good with their votes.

Obviously I look bad with my vote.

[EagleFan]

Originally Posted by KWhit

I almost agree with you. EXCEPT: I can't think of any logical reason why a villager would make the move you made either.

As I said, it wasn't logical, it was gut reaction.

[Autumn]

Though I will see the early day voting between Darth and Dubb makes Dubb look better. It was early, but still risky for Dubb to push Darth into the fray like that.

[J23]

Originally Posted by Autumn

All right, if Danny's theory was correct about EF then the Warlock would likely have been on Darth, and probably been someone who wasn't here to move their vote. That's my assumption.

DV-8- J23 (100), MartinD (126) Schmidty (154) PD (160) Kwhit (166) Sal (173) CF (221) Autumn (226)

I wasn't here until just after deadline, but I was the one to bring up DV's name in the first place and had every opportunity to move it earlier.

[J23]

With Darth being the cunning, would it be a stretch to think it might be more likely that the wolves would try to save him?

[Autumn]

I don't think so, J23. I know whenever I play cunning I do my best to get scanned. Being a vote getter who then fades at the end is a good way to do that. So if there's ever a time to put a target on you to save a wolf, it's when that's the cunning or you're the cunning.

[EagleFan]

Changing one of my thoughts from earlier. PB's vote shouldn't be given absolute trust. He did put DV up one but if the warlock was on saldana his vote would have caused a tie. DV would have been scan/cleared at some point and would have gained PB trust.

Just another scenario to think about. Want to leave you with enough to think over when I come up vanilla.

[Schmidty]

Just saw the results - That was very good luck!!! Yay!!!

[dubb93]

No one should be listening to EF at this point. Worst case he is a wolf. Best case he thinks we all are a bunch of idiots and that he knows better than we do.

[Poli]

Originally Posted by dubb93

If EF shows wolf my next vote is for Poli. He likes to vote wolf, wolf, wolf, etc. when he is a wolf. This is just the kind of off the wall vote on a wolf that he would make.

I support this line of thinking with one exception. I'd have made sure I was on Darth in the end to solidify my position. If Ef shows up as a wolf tomorrow, then I'd likely be voting for him tomorrow as well.

I didn't see what he did, surfing on my phone isn't exactly the love of my life, but it appears he tried to keep darth alive? Well, I'm guessing someone was going to get hit with that.

At this point, my vote tomorrow is going to whoever was the second person to sign up.

[dubb93]

Consider what happened. We discussed for a half hour or more that we wanted a tie. We all agreed that this was the best way to flush out the warlock.

So what does EF do, he comes in one minute before deadline, announces that he thinks this is best and votes to save the cunning wolf. I can't remember the last time we actually had this much evidence against someone.

[Poli]

Reading dubbs posts...what a
guy <3

[EagleFan]

vote dubb93

He is pushing this way too much. Especially with his "don't listen to EF" bullshit. Only a wolf would think that way.

Vote dubb tomorrow and scan me. I have nothing to hide.

[Poli]

Originally Posted by dubb93

Consider what happened. We discussed for a half hour or more that we wanted a tie. We all agreed that this was the best way to flush out the warlock.

So what does EF do, he comes in one minute before deadline, announces that he thinks this is best and votes to save the cunning wolf. I can't remember the last time we actually had this much evidence against someone.

That is...wow, not the best scenario for EF.

[EagleFan]

Originally Posted by dubb93

Consider what happened. We discussed for a half hour or more that we wanted a tie. We all agreed that this was the best way to flush out the warlock.

So what does EF do, he comes in one minute before deadline, announces that he thinks this is best and votes to save the cunning wolf. I can't remember the last time we actually had this much evidence against someone.

Nice try wolfboy!!!

[Poli]

I'm hitting the hay. Waves at the crowd.

[EagleFan]

Originally Posted by Poli

That is...wow, not the best scenario for EF.

Don't let dubb steer you on this one. I made a bad decision, plain and simple. Fortunately it turned out for the best for us. If we kept it at a tie we would have at best learned where the warlock was and potentially had the cunning scan/cleared at some point.

The biggest arguement against me is the ILLOGICAL one that the warlock voted for the cunning. That would be the ONLY way that my vote "saved" the cunning.

[EagleFan]

Originally Posted by dubb93

No one should be listening to EF at this point. Worst case he is a wolf. Best case he thinks we all are a bunch of idiots and that he knows better than we do.

Fuck YOU!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Vote me out if you want to be a panty waste jackass like that.

[EagleFan]

vote nightfall

[Schmidty]

Originally Posted by dubb93

No one should be listening to EF at this point. Worst case he is a wolf. Best case he thinks we all are a bunch of idiots and that he knows better than we do.

EF might be a wolf, but I don't put much stock in this statement. It's dubb being dubb. I love ya man, but I just don't take you seriously anymore. It's not that I think you're a bad player, because I think you're one of the better players. It's just that the overly-aggressive thing with grumpy overtones doesn't really affect me as much anymore, especially after last game.

Having said that:

Vote EF

[dubb93]

Whatever EF. I've asked Lathum to find me a replacement. I don't know why I signed up for this game. I haven't had fun actually playing this game since the last one that BK hosted. I'm out for a long while.

[Schmidty]

Originally Posted by dubb93

Whatever EF. I've asked Lathum to find me a replacement. I don't know why I signed up for this game. I haven't had fun actually playing this game since the last one that BK hosted. I'm out for a long while.

You have to be shitting me.

Are we not adults here? Wow.

[The Jackal]

good lord what happened, calm down

[Lathum]

Render is now taking the roll of Dubb.

[RendeR]

Someones was looking for adult supervision.

Here I am bitches.

[The Jackal]

will do my best to put aside this bickering tomorrow and take a good long look at what EF tried to pull at the deadline with an open mind

[CrimsonFox]

Originally Posted by Schmidty

EF might be a wolf, but I don't put much stock in this statement. It's dubb being dubb. I love ya man, but I just don't take you seriously anymore. It's not that I think you're a bad player, because I think you're one of the better players. It's just that the overly-aggressive thing with grumpy overtones doesn't really affect me as much anymore, especially after last game.

Having said that:

Vote EF

Oh I'm sorry, we're supposed to take dubb seriously?

[Lathum]

Dubb's vote for EF doesn't count.

[Schmidty]

Originally Posted by CrimsonFox

Oh I'm sorry, we're supposed to take dubb seriously?

Apparently, yes.

I gave him too much credit, I guess.

[CrimsonFox]

Originally Posted by claphamsa

moved off you to preserve the tie... saw the other vote so revoted...

clap you absolutely cleared yourself in my eyes by how you unvoted then voted again AND you were paying attention!

Autumn on the other hand was either a slow typist, not paying attention, or he WAS paying attention and is a wolf trying to save the warlock's identity. If the third is the case than both Autumn and saldana would be wolves then tho.

[MartinD]

Just finished catching up on what looks to have been a very interesting day 1 - very nice result!

I don't have time for more than a quick read through the posts made overnight in the morning, and things seem to be a bit confused at the moment - will need to go through what happened in more detail later on.

[EagleFan]

I aplogize to everyone if they think that I went too far. I just don't appreciate someone saying that "I think you are all idiots". I made a bad play and you can judge it however you like on that basis.

On the plus side, it turned out well for us. (but I'm not trying to use that as an excuse for keeping me)

I will step aside and let someone else take my spot if you feel that I went too far. If the consensus is okay with my staying, I will remain.

RendeR's here now so it must be about to calm down...

[CrimsonFox]

Don't sweat it, EF. This is just like last game

[CrimsonFox]

Originally Posted by Poli

At this point, my vote tomorrow is going to whoever was the second person to sign up.

DAMMIT!!!

[CrimsonFox]

Originally Posted by EagleFan

At the moment, PB, Schmidty, KWhit and Autumn look pretty good with their votes.

Obviously I look bad with my vote.

not thoroughly convinced of that after last game seeing hoops, ntn, and dubb all voting for each other.

[Schmidty]

Originally Posted by CrimsonFox

not thoroughly convinced of that after last game seeing hoops, ntn, and dubb all voting for each other.

Meh.

[CrimsonFox]

Standby for long analysis of votes and chatter during day 1

clap claiming vanilla vilalger
j23 claiming villager
darth overenthusiastically claiming villager, a known wolf
realdeal claiming vanilla villager


quick voters: saldana (on dubb), spleen (on saldana)

kwhit: role fishing
dubb: voting kwhit claiming rolefishing, kwhit/dubb bickering, dubb still pissed
EF: First to put someone at 2 votes (kwhit)
j23: voting darth 1st
realdeal: voting GE for no reason, never changes it. THe 8th new vote
Darth: voting kwhit making it 3 2 1 1 1 1 1 1...trying to start a run :P, clears Kwhit somewhat
claims quarter flipping...right....I will NEVER believe people that say "coin flip" as an excuse
dubb: unvote kwhit/vote Darth making it 2 2 2 1 1 1 1 1 , somewhat clears dubb.
darth: unvote kwhit/vote dubb. More dubb clearance? or a fake wolf fight.
martin: unvote j23, the indecisiveness of a villager I think
martin: vote darth. 3 2 2 ...more that he's a villager
realdeal: UV GE V kwhit. I'm smelling wolf as I think kwhit is clear.
PB: Also seems weird. Another wolf.
Autumn: says a bunch of stuff, then votes for someone else. No idea how he thinks. Seems wolfish as he made more sense last game
Danny: A Known villager also voting for saldana. I sense both danny and autumn are fishing for wolves at this point trying to see who else will put him over the top.
Saldana: whines. That's normal I think.
Jackal and Schmidty: Are indecisive and non commital: normal for both
saldana: whining again.
Schmidty: Unvote poli, vote darth. Starting to make this a runaway on darth. Very villagerish.
Sald: arguesa against saving himself and wants to sacrifice himself.
PB: Unvote kwhit, vote darth. Not cleared. He might think it's a forgone conclusion DV will be lynched. Not cleared.
From a possible villager with potential tie TO a known wolf tho.
kwhit: finally votes and it's for a wolf. Why did he wait so long?
Golden Eagle: Votes Saldana "to keep it close". Very suspicious! Possible wolf
saldana: unvote dubb, vote darth. After being all selfrighteous and saying he doesn't save himself for the good of the group. He does that. Someone else sees this as him doing self preservation which is not at all what he said.
Jackal: ponders some more. Make up your mind! or quit stalling, wolf.
Danny: suspects PB outloud. Since Danny was the first nightkill, PB is now a clear suspect.
EF: thinks DV is a villager, but then again so did Danny. BUt this is a guilty statement now.
dubb: unvote darth vote saldana. Very guilty looking. After looking innocent all day from his posts, he does this which now is very suspicious.
Danny: gets the idea for the tie agreeing with Jackal who thinks revealing the warlock is a good idea
EF: Agrees with Jackal and Danny! SO what the hell? Also tries to throw guilt on saldana.
dubb: says he had that same idea was afraid of looking wolf. I've not seen dubb afraid of saying anytyhing before. THis actually is very villagerish , but with dubb anything is possible.
saldana talks of wolves deciding the votes
Danny furtther talks about how we have this sewn up and instructs not to waste scan on sald or darth.
saldana answers questions and is further helpful to my questions. People that do this in the past have been wolves :P
Danny outs his high suspicion of Saldana as wolf for the second time. Danny died that night.
Jackal is indecisive...zzz...
Saldana questioned danny's tie idea accuse him of acting like dubb and acting wolfish...for no reason really. Is he the warlock?
Autumn agrees with tie idea. 3 minutes left.
CF is ready to type to change his vote from dubb to sald or darth depending if someone screws this up.
EF screws us up, but he was the first one to acknowledge it was a good idea. BZZZZ. I really don't buy this.
clap unvotes sald to save the situation without seeing my vote, then votes sald again. Clap is definitely a villager at this point.
Autumn: shifts his vote from Sald to Darth. Definitely on drugs but not necessarily a wolf.
clap: infuriated at the clusterfuck.


Okay

Villagers: clap
Probable villagers: kwhit Schmidty
Who the hell knows: dubb Autumn
Really suspicious wolflike: Saldana - duspewcted by Danny outloud at the end, also voting doesn't match his commentary
Golden-Eagle - Voted sald to save darth. This would make sald innocent of course
PurdueBrad - looked guilty to Danny but changed vote TO darth from tie. LEast suspicious of the 4
realdeal - voted GE then Kwhit. I already suspect GE so I THink he voted for wolf GE just for fun then tried to nail Kwhit.

[CrimsonFox]

oh yeah forgot to add EF to the suspicious list. DUH!

[CrimsonFox]

Revised trust list:
Villagers: clap
Probable villagers: kwhit Schmidty Martin
Who the hell knows: dubb Autumn j23 jackal
Really suspicious wolflike: Saldana - suspected by Danny outloud at the end, also voting doesn't match his commentary
Golden-Eagle - Voted saldana to save darth. This would make sald innocent of course
PurdueBrad - looked guilty to Danny but changed vote TO darth from tie. LEast suspicious of the 4
realdeal - voted GE then Kwhit. I already suspect GE so I THink he voted for wolf GE just for fun then tried to nail Kwhit.
Eaglefan - The voting at the end despite being the first one that liked the idea of fleshing out the warlock. Tries to clear DV. Tries to throw guilt on saldana. 1st to escalate to 2 votes on anyone.

Order: EF, realdeal, Golden Eagle, saldana, purduefan, Autumn

[Poli]

I'm home with hives...yea for stressing about putting my baby girl to sleep.

I am surprised, shocked even, at dubb's exit. I hope I garner a phone call after this is over. I have to admit it is nice to be on the outside looking in, though.

vote crimson fox

I may end up on EF before it's said and done though. I hate to meta game, but I just find it super hard to believe that Dubb would willingly give up a wolf role...knowing him and me, we sign up for
these games hoping to be a wolf.

[Poli]

Dear crimson,

pls know Ed itz, k, tanks.