WW CVI: Evil Star Trek--GAME OVER!! (Results in Post #643)

[Danny]

Wow, I think that was a poor decision to use that ability

[DaddyTorgo]

zoinks...well that certainly blows. so we're down 4 villagers before n2 deadline.

[Danny]

Unvote J23
Vote Jackal

We now know J23 was good so I am going to go back to the theory that a wolf would likely to follow a vote there and since Lathum is obviously not a wolf, I'm going to put some pressure on Jackal.

[Danny]

Vote count as of Post #151

ntndeacon (7)-- Darth Vilus (106), J23 (111), dubb93 (125), JAG (130), Telle (133), Schmidty (148), KWhit (150)
KWhit (5)-- hoopsguy (91), lerriuqs (117), DaddyTorgo (129), Lathum (132), Render (139)
Darth Vilus (1)-- PurdueBrad (87)
J23 (1)-- Danny (109)


No vote : The Jackal, ntndeacon

[Danny]

I'm still not sold on a Kwhit/Hoopsguy run off, and am wondering about DT and Lathum's read since we now know he is good.

[hoopsguy]

I'm not sold on a showdown with KWhit either - it was a best theory at the time, but I'm willing to adopt with more voting info.

If you assume that KWhit is a villager, then the wolves would certainly have had at least one vote on him as a leading vote getter.

If you assume that KWhit is a wolf (has been discussed by many, self included), I still think there is a chance that the wolves do not line up all of their numbers saving him.

Therefore, I think looking at the KWhit voters from Day 1 suddenly has gotten more appealing. I know I'm legit, so that leaves two people to consider - Lerriuqs and DaddyTorgo. One of them has voted for me today and has felt a little off from a vibe standpoint - Lerriuqs.

VOTE BACKWARDS SQUIRREL (LERRIUQS)

[Danny]

Also, I;d have to think that if Kwhit or Hoops was a wolf, a wolf would have been quick to jump on J23 and help make him a candidate as well, but that looks iffy just depending on Jackal's allegiance.

[Danny]

Hoops you didnt vote earlier?

[hoopsguy]

Oops, thanks.

UNVOTE KWHIT
VOTE LERRIUQS

[J23]

Originally Posted by Danny

Wow, I think that was a poor decision to use that ability

I'm out for the night momentarily, which is why I used the ability. I wanted to use it before I got lynched while away tonight, since it appeared that a run could very well have been building, and being lynched before I was able to use it seemed foolish. If I had netted a wolf, I'd have been praised, like you so aptly pointed out the games where you duked villagers early on. I'd have preferred to wait a little while first to see who else jumped on board, but time constraints didn't allow for it. However, I didn't want to wait too long, in case our potential seer wasn't around to be able to switch their targets, as Lathum has often been an early target for scans. I also wanted to allow some analysis of voting if Lathum came back as a wolf.

Vote Jackal

[J23]

With that, I'm out for the night. Good luck villagers.

[Danny]

J23, you're out of the game.

[Danny]

And that;s the reason I said that, if it was just a straight duke, it would have been ok, but it hurts cause instead of clearing yourself, you are out of the game.

[Chief Rum]

Originally Posted by J23

I'm out for the night momentarily, which is why I used the ability. I wanted to use it before I got lynched while away tonight, since it appeared that a run could very well have been building, and being lynched before I was able to use it seemed foolish. If I had netted a wolf, I'd have been praised, like you so aptly pointed out the games where you duked villagers early on. I'd have preferred to wait a little while first to see who else jumped on board, but time constraints didn't allow for it. However, I didn't want to wait too long, in case our potential seer wasn't around to be able to switch their targets, as Lathum has often been an early target for scans. I also wanted to allow some analysis of voting if Lathum came back as a wolf.

Vote Jackal

Sorry, J23, your one shot was a clear out, unfortunately. You have been brigged for killing a villager. Sorry, bud. I shoulda sent you a PM to be clear (since I didn't "kill" you like I did Lathum).

[hoopsguy]

Yeah, I read that as "wrong call = out of game" and "right call = out of game, take wolf with you".

I'm hoping you understand your role better than I do, but unless I've failed reading comprehension our next conversation should probably be in the post-game.

[Chief Rum]

Originally Posted by hoopsguy

Yeah, I read that as "wrong call = out of game" and "right call = out of game, take wolf with you".

I'm hoping you understand your role better than I do, but unless I've failed reading comprehension our next conversation should probably be in the post-game.

Pretty close. There was a way to stay in the game (attempt to kill Kirk would have left both alive but revealed). But most options end the way you have it.

[PurdueBrad]

Originally Posted by Danny

Vote count as of Post #151

ntndeacon (7)-- Darth Vilus (106), J23 (111), dubb93 (125), JAG (130), Telle (133), Schmidty (148), KWhit (150)
KWhit (5)-- hoopsguy (91), lerriuqs (117), DaddyTorgo (129), Lathum (132), Render (139)
Darth Vilus (1)-- PurdueBrad (87)
J23 (1)-- Danny (109)


No vote : The Jackal, ntndeacon

Based on this, I'm willing actually to have a Hoops/KWhit showdown. What are the odds that all six players involved in the KWhit vote (including KWhit himself) are all evil? I would guess that there is at least one wolf there, if not two. And I could see a scenario where Hoops put up KWhit as an early vote even if both are wolves.

I feel very comfortable with where my vote is, especially given the fact that Hoops is now seeming to back off that run-off.

[Chief Rum]

As of Post #316

hoopsguy (3)-- KWhit (243), dubb93 (244), lerrieuqs (288)
KWhit (2)-- Darth Vilus (238), PurdueBrad (282)
Darth Vilus (1)-- Schmidty (284)
The Jackal (1)-- Danny (303)
lerriuqs (1)-- hoopsguy (309)

Have Not Voted (Or Have Not Voted For A Player Still Living): The Jackal, DaddyTorgo, JAG, Telle

[PurdueBrad]

So after that, we're down to 12 players. And that puts us at either 8-3-1 (if cultist is in play), 8-4, or 9-3 (w/ no cultist but I find this pretty unlikely).

We're running out of mistakes rather quickly.

[Danny]

Hoops' decision to back off does not seem strange at all since we now have different information to work with.

[PurdueBrad]

Originally Posted by Danny

Hoops' decision to back off does not seem strange at all since we now have different information to work with.

I must have missed it, but what was that information? Hoops says that he's willing to back off with more voting info as well. What did I miss in catching up?

[Danny]

J23 and Lathum are both out of the game and known to be villagers.

[Danny]

Which since they are villagers is not groundbreaking, but it does give additional information.

[JAG]

Crud, what a rotten start.

[DaddyTorgo]

i wasn't around at deadline yesterday and it being D1 i'm not going to apologize for putting a vote on kwhit to keep things close and see if there was any action down the line.

[PurdueBrad]

Originally Posted by Danny

J23 and Lathum are both out of the game and known to be villagers.

See, and I read this info the other way. What are the odds that all the wolves avoided the KWhit issue on day 1? Looking at Lerriuqs, DT, Hoops, and KWhit himself, I'm willing to take a shot there.

KWhit makes the most sense. If he's bad, I would follow the earliest vote to find the next wolf. If he turns up good, I would look at second or third vote. But it all comes down to KWhit's goodness.

[Chief Rum]

All right, I was delayed leaving work today because of J23's action and the following writeup and some other stuff, so it's likely I won't be able to get home by the deadline.

The deadline is still 9 p.m. EST/ 6 p.m. PDT, and I will process results when I get home (shouldn't be too long after, unless I hit serious traffic, I can be home in a little over an hour).

[The Jackal]

unvote j23

[The Jackal]

I have no qualms in voting for either hoops or KWhit, Danny. If you think I was trying to steer voting away from them, I wasn't.

[hoopsguy]

Originally Posted by PurdueBrad

See, and I read this info the other way. What are the odds that all the wolves avoided the KWhit issue on day 1? Looking at Lerriuqs, DT, Hoops, and KWhit himself, I'm willing to take a shot there.

KWhit makes the most sense. If he's bad, I would follow the earliest vote to find the next wolf. If he turns up good, I would look at second or third vote. But it all comes down to KWhit's goodness.

I'm not entirely convinced that KWhit = good, but multiple voices have said that they don't think I was drawing good conclusions from interpreting the data. I think it is entirely possible I was on the right candidate with the wrong reasons, something that is always frustrating for wolves and would be just as consistent with KWhit's defense as adamant villager having to defend himself.

But, even if KWhit is a wolf I'm not convinced they needed "all hands on deck" for the vote yesterday. Wolves frequently bury one of their own in a vote and I think that makes DT + Lerriuqs pretty compelling candidates for the vote as well. In fact, they are probably even better candidates if KWhit is a villager.

Anyway, that is why I switched at this point. Best case is I'm moving from wolf to wolf, but that is probably wishful thinking on my part.

Like I said, if you and others want me in the runoff then go ahead but there is no more info to squeeze out of me in terms of role. Only thing you would see is "redshirt #3" out of four dead, which might be a reason to start turning up the heat on others claiming this role in a diminishing group of villagers.

[The Jackal]

I agree that lerriuqs and DT make compelling candidates if only for the fact that I doubt more than 3 wolves (and possibly/probably less) were on NTN. It would certainly help to know KWhit's allegiance, though.

[DaddyTorgo]

so what are we looking at tonight? hoops vs. kwhit?

[Telle]

Can anyone give me a quick recap of today? I had the day off and was out shopping with the family all day and I'm not sure there's enough time to catch up before deadline.

[DaddyTorgo]

Originally Posted by The Jackal

I agree that lerriuqs and DT make compelling candidates if only for the fact that I doubt more than 3 wolves (and possibly/probably less) were on NTN. It would certainly help to know KWhit's allegiance, though.

if we were villager/villager then i'm not sure there's too much that can be drawn out of the ntn/kwhit runoff. wolves wouldn't care which of the 2 villagers they were on.

one day i'm going to be a wolf with some other humor-inclined wolves and we're going to do all the things that "WW common sense" says not to. all vote together and push runs on villagers and fun stuff like that

[The Jackal]

Problem with that is, DT, when things like that happen the wolves often get caught.

[DaddyTorgo]

but not necessarily, because everyone is so wrapped up in "oh the wolves would NEVER do that" that if it was just done once it might be monstrously successful...i dunno. be an interesting experiment.

[lerriuqs]

Originally Posted by hoopsguy

I'm not sold on a showdown with KWhit either - it was a best theory at the time, but I'm willing to adopt with more voting info.

If you assume that KWhit is a villager, then the wolves would certainly have had at least one vote on him as a leading vote getter.

If you assume that KWhit is a wolf (has been discussed by many, self included), I still think there is a chance that the wolves do not line up all of their numbers saving him.

Therefore, I think looking at the KWhit voters from Day 1 suddenly has gotten more appealing. I know I'm legit, so that leaves two people to consider - Lerriuqs and DaddyTorgo. One of them has voted for me today and has felt a little off from a vibe standpoint - Lerriuqs.

VOTE BACKWARDS SQUIRREL (LERRIUQS)

What wrong vibe am I giving you exactly? I'm playing the first two days the way I normally play - relatively quiet and then more forceful as the days go on...I know where I stand and I'm no wolf...

[lerriuqs]

Just to add - hoops, you may be on to something about DT though. I seriously doubt all the wolves would vote on KWhit. Of course, that assumes you're actually telling the truth...

[Schmidty]

Crazy day.

Unvote Darth

Since it appears to be a wasted vote.

Vote Kwhit

Because I just think what hoops said is logical - He wouldn't have come out that strong this early and targeted KWhit. He would have used some kind of slimy, intellectual-sounding bullcrap that pointed at no one in particular. Well, that's what I would have done if I were wolf-hoops and had to play like him.

[Telle]

vote KWhit

Since nobody's given me a recap, I'm going to start going back through the day.. but I want to get a vote in first.

[DaddyTorgo]

i'm not sure which of those scenarios (hoops or kwhit's) i find more likely...

[The Jackal]

vote count?

[The Jackal]

KWhit is up 4-3 with me and JAG left to vote?

[DaddyTorgo]

and me jackal

[The Jackal]

how you feeling DT?

[DaddyTorgo]

i don't feel particularly hot about either candidate and with people tossing my name around i'm sitting here evaluating how my possible votes could be used against me tomorrow.

[DaddyTorgo]

if i think they're both villagers i guess the vote for kwhit tells us more about the voters there? i'm not sure...

[Danny]

Unvote Jackal
Vote Hoops


Not sure about this vote, but there's obviously no support for Jackal, also considering switching to Lerriuqs.

[The Jackal]

In the interest of preventing a tie, and the fact I think hoops hasn't done anything suspicious enough to not let him live another day..

VOTE KWHIT

[The Jackal]

Yes, there's also that, DT.