OT: A Song of Ice and Fire Series (spoilers inside)

[Honolulu_Blue]

Originally Posted by JAG

His descriptions of feasts make me hungry.

Agreed.

Speaking of this, Lady H_B is starting a project in which she's going through the books again and highlighting all the passages were he describes food. (Not all of them, mainly just the feasts, not the hard chees and dried bread stuff they eat on the road or Arya eating worms). Her plan is to go through them all and then come up with recipes for them.

She's quite the cook and is currently in a nutrional sciences program. Who knows if she'll ever get through it all and, if so, what she'll do with it once she's finished, but it should be fun.

Perhaps there will be many a lamprey pie in my future... Manderley-style!

[DaddyTorgo]

Originally Posted by Honolulu_Blue

Agreed.

Speaking of this, Lady H_B is starting a project in which she's going through the books again and highlighting all the passages were he describes food. (Not all of them, mainly just the feasts, not the hard chees and dried bread stuff they eat on the road or Arya eating worms). Her plan is to go through them all and then come up with recipes for them.

She's quite the cook and is currently in a nutrional sciences program. Who knows if she'll ever get through it all and, if so, what she'll do with it once she's finished, but it should be fun.

Perhaps there will be many a lamprey pie in my future... Manderley-style!

that's hawt

[Honolulu_Blue]

This is taken from GRRM's latest "Not a Blog" entry and is just one, in a dozen of reasons, why I like the guy so much.

http://grrm.livejournal.com/

"Before that, though, there's the NFL Draft. Always one of my favorite weekends of the year. Unlike the actual season, my teams can't actually lose in the draft (or if they do, you don't realize it for three years), so you have less chance of crushing disappointment. The Giants pick 20th and the Jets 25th, so they won't be getting any of the big marquee players, but I'm still hoping they will come away with some guys who can make a difference. I will probably post some thoughts and comments here after the Saturday selections, so those of you who like football should check back then... and those of you who don't want to read anything but DANCE WITH DRAGONS news should stay away."

[terpkristin]

Has anybody listened to the "Winter is Coming" podcast? Apparently put together by 2 fans (a guy and a girl, maybe husband/wife?) going over theories and such..
http://winteriscoming.vox.com/

I've downloaded the 2nd podcast to see if it's any good (first is 1.25 minutes long, 2nd is where they start actually talking about series it seems), but haven't given it a listen yet (probably won't til Monday)...

/tk

[Honolulu_Blue]

Originally Posted by terpkristin

Has anybody listened to the "Winter is Coming" podcast? Apparently put together by 2 fans (a guy and a girl, maybe husband/wife?) going over theories and such..
http://winteriscoming.vox.com/

I've downloaded the 2nd podcast to see if it's any good (first is 1.25 minutes long, 2nd is where they start actually talking about series it seems), but haven't given it a listen yet (probably won't til Monday)...

/tk

First I've heard of these, TK.

Let us know if they're worth the download.

Thanks!

[terpkristin]

Originally Posted by Honolulu_Blue

First I've heard of these, TK.

Let us know if they're worth the download.

Thanks!

Hmm.

Well, I listened to all the episodes (10 are out so far, and 2-10 are ones that actually have meat to them).

I must say, I'm torn on them. They are done by a guy (Dan) and a girl (Kate) who apparently were roommates in college or some such, and both enjoyed the series a lot. Each episode is about 30 minutes long.

When these guys are on topic, they're pretty decent. Unfortunately, they're on topic for only about 2/3 of the show. The rest of the show is filled with them insulting each other ("F you," "No, F YOU!" in a playful manner but still could/should be edited out), making references to other sci-fi and pop culture items (Star Trek, Star Wars, Serenity/Firefly, and Shrek have all made appearances), and sharing random thoughts that have nothing to do with the series. But 20 minutes out of 30 isn't bad, I suppose.

The only thing that stops me from saying they're "great" in those 20 on-topic minutes are that they both swear a bit, and it's completely unnecessary. Every 2nd or 3rd sentence, somebody says f#^k or a$$ or s*&t with no real need to ("the f&*king others" instead of "the others"), and it's almost jarring. Don't get me wrong, I'm not against swearing when it's warranted (I swear like a sailor when I'm upset), but it really seems unimaginative and unintelligent in the show.

Admittedly, I hold podcasts about books to a high standard. The two I listen to about the Harry Potter series are fantastic (one done by high school/college age kids), and this definitely not in the realm of either of those shows. That said, I think I'll keep listening, as it's a nice way to get back into the series, well-timed with the end of the Harry Potter series...

The episodes, so far, have been on interesting subjects...
2-9 were about regions of Westeros and what's going on in each region
10 is about who they think will be killed off
11 and on (not released yet) are to be about character analyses

All in all, I give it a 3 out of 5. Without the profanity and the off-topic junk, it'd probably be a 4-4.5.

First few episodes are available for download at http://winteriscoming.vox.com/library/posts/page/2/ and episodes 7-10 are up on iTunes if anybody is interested...

/tk

[terpkristin]

There's an update out on GRRM's LiveJournal:
http://grrm.livejournal.com/

25th June 2007

7:52pm: The Only Living Boy in New York.
... or New Mexico, in my case.

It's been too long since I last posted here, but I have a good excuse. Parris has been off in Ireland since June 6, and I have been trying to take advantage of the (comparative) isolation to get some serious work done on A DANCE WITH DRAGONS. I've only been partially successful there. It has been a good few weeks, work wise, but not the great few weeks that I was kinda sorta hoping for. I did manage to finish one especially troublesome chapter that I have been fussing and fretting over since before I split the two books, so that's good. (At least I THINK I finally finished it. Tomorrow I may reread the thing and decide, no, it's no good at all. But I hope not). Finished some other chapters too, and did some more revision, so I've been productive, but still... there's no way around it, DANCE is simply coming more slowly than me, my editors, or my readers would like.

I am trying to deal with that, in a couple of ways. First, I have gone and hired an actual assistant, for the first time in my career. Ty Franck has been fixing some glitches with my computer system, running a lot of my annoying, time consuming, but necessary errands, and putting my files on a database, which will finally allow me to phase out the extremely idiosyncratic, pen-and-paper-index-cards-manila-folders-and-adding-machine record-keeping system that I made up myself at the beginning of my career in 1971 and have been using ever since. Once that's done, Ty will keep my records up to date, and I may also have him take over some part of my correspondence and emails. I have been very reluctant to do that, since I value the contact with my fans and like being accessible to them, but I've have reached the point where that simply may not be possible any longer. Still, it's hard to let go, at least for me. We'll see how this all plays out.

Also, sad to say, I have begun to question whether or not I can make this year's worldcon in Japan. I hate to cancel, I truly do. I have not missed a worldcon, foreign or domestic, since Aussiecon II in 1985, and I do not want to break my twenty-one year streak. I love worldcons. Plus, I have never been to Japan, and I really wanted to go. Of course, I am not going to fly across the Pacific just for five days at a con. If I am going to Japan, I want to stay a few weeks and see Japan. My Japanese publisher has invited me to make some promotional appearances when I am over there as well. And my Chinese publisher has suggested I come in for a conference in China before the worldcon. And now my Korean publisher would like me to visit South Korea and do some signings after Japan. I would love to do all of this, and see the sights besides, but if I do it will mean at least a month-long trip, and maybe two months, and I just don't think I can spare the time.

A year ago, it would never have dawned on me that DANCE would not be done by the time the Japanese worldcon rolled around, but that's looking like a very real possibility now. Much as I might want to, I just can't take off for a month of Asian travel with the book undone. I have to finish if it kills me... and some days I think it may. So I think my streak is going to have to end. (And no, skipping Japan does NOT mean I will now be free add the San Diego Comicon, the St. Louis NASFic, Dragoncon, or Bubonicon to the schedule. If I cancel one con then turn around and add others, it sort of defeats the purpose of cancelling). If I decide to stay home, that's what I will do. Stay home.

Parris gets home July 2. She's having a great time in Ireland, she tells me, despite a flight from hell, being stranded in O'Hare, a bum knee that is hobbling her still, pouring rain, an auto accident that totalled two cars. Which just goes to show how much she loves Ireland and her friends there. Still, it will be nice to have her home. Our two houses both feel very empty with her gone, especially at night. Current Mood: lonely
Current Music: Simon & Garfunkle, of course

/tk

[Honolulu_Blue]

Originally Posted by terpkristin

There's an update out on GRRM's LiveJournal:
http://grrm.livejournal.com/

25th June 2007

7:52pm: The Only Living Boy in New York.
... or New Mexico, in my case.

It's been too long since I last posted here, but I have a good excuse. Parris has been off in Ireland since June 6, and I have been trying to take advantage of the (comparative) isolation to get some serious work done on A DANCE WITH DRAGONS. I've only been partially successful there. It has been a good few weeks, work wise, but not the great few weeks that I was kinda sorta hoping for. I did manage to finish one especially troublesome chapter that I have been fussing and fretting over since before I split the two books, so that's good. (At least I THINK I finally finished it. Tomorrow I may reread the thing and decide, no, it's no good at all. But I hope not). Finished some other chapters too, and did some more revision, so I've been productive, but still... there's no way around it, DANCE is simply coming more slowly than me, my editors, or my readers would like.

I am trying to deal with that, in a couple of ways. First, I have gone and hired an actual assistant, for the first time in my career. Ty Franck has been fixing some glitches with my computer system, running a lot of my annoying, time consuming, but necessary errands, and putting my files on a database, which will finally allow me to phase out the extremely idiosyncratic, pen-and-paper-index-cards-manila-folders-and-adding-machine record-keeping system that I made up myself at the beginning of my career in 1971 and have been using ever since. Once that's done, Ty will keep my records up to date, and I may also have him take over some part of my correspondence and emails. I have been very reluctant to do that, since I value the contact with my fans and like being accessible to them, but I've have reached the point where that simply may not be possible any longer. Still, it's hard to let go, at least for me. We'll see how this all plays out.

Also, sad to say, I have begun to question whether or not I can make this year's worldcon in Japan. I hate to cancel, I truly do. I have not missed a worldcon, foreign or domestic, since Aussiecon II in 1985, and I do not want to break my twenty-one year streak. I love worldcons. Plus, I have never been to Japan, and I really wanted to go. Of course, I am not going to fly across the Pacific just for five days at a con. If I am going to Japan, I want to stay a few weeks and see Japan. My Japanese publisher has invited me to make some promotional appearances when I am over there as well. And my Chinese publisher has suggested I come in for a conference in China before the worldcon. And now my Korean publisher would like me to visit South Korea and do some signings after Japan. I would love to do all of this, and see the sights besides, but if I do it will mean at least a month-long trip, and maybe two months, and I just don't think I can spare the time.

A year ago, it would never have dawned on me that DANCE would not be done by the time the Japanese worldcon rolled around, but that's looking like a very real possibility now. Much as I might want to, I just can't take off for a month of Asian travel with the book undone. I have to finish if it kills me... and some days I think it may. So I think my streak is going to have to end. (And no, skipping Japan does NOT mean I will now be free add the San Diego Comicon, the St. Louis NASFic, Dragoncon, or Bubonicon to the schedule. If I cancel one con then turn around and add others, it sort of defeats the purpose of cancelling). If I decide to stay home, that's what I will do. Stay home.

Parris gets home July 2. She's having a great time in Ireland, she tells me, despite a flight from hell, being stranded in O'Hare, a bum knee that is hobbling her still, pouring rain, an auto accident that totalled two cars. Which just goes to show how much she loves Ireland and her friends there. Still, it will be nice to have her home. Our two houses both feel very empty with her gone, especially at night. Current Mood: lonely
Current Music: Simon & Garfunkle, of course

/tk

A "good" news and "bad" news type of post. I am just about to finish my audio book of Storm of Swords. Very close. Tyrion just got out of prison and his making his way up to his old bedchamber. After that, I have "Feast For Crows" after that... I will no longer be capable of doing household chores of any kind.

[Honolulu_Blue]

Originally Posted by terpkristin

Hmm.

Well, I listened to all the episodes (10 are out so far, and 2-10 are ones that actually have meat to them).

I must say, I'm torn on them. They are done by a guy (Dan) and a girl (Kate) who apparently were roommates in college or some such, and both enjoyed the series a lot. Each episode is about 30 minutes long.

When these guys are on topic, they're pretty decent. Unfortunately, they're on topic for only about 2/3 of the show. The rest of the show is filled with them insulting each other ("F you," "No, F YOU!" in a playful manner but still could/should be edited out), making references to other sci-fi and pop culture items (Star Trek, Star Wars, Serenity/Firefly, and Shrek have all made appearances), and sharing random thoughts that have nothing to do with the series. But 20 minutes out of 30 isn't bad, I suppose.

The only thing that stops me from saying they're "great" in those 20 on-topic minutes are that they both swear a bit, and it's completely unnecessary. Every 2nd or 3rd sentence, somebody says f#^k or a$$ or s*&t with no real need to ("the f&*king others" instead of "the others"), and it's almost jarring. Don't get me wrong, I'm not against swearing when it's warranted (I swear like a sailor when I'm upset), but it really seems unimaginative and unintelligent in the show.

Admittedly, I hold podcasts about books to a high standard. The two I listen to about the Harry Potter series are fantastic (one done by high school/college age kids), and this definitely not in the realm of either of those shows. That said, I think I'll keep listening, as it's a nice way to get back into the series, well-timed with the end of the Harry Potter series...

The episodes, so far, have been on interesting subjects...
2-9 were about regions of Westeros and what's going on in each region
10 is about who they think will be killed off
11 and on (not released yet) are to be about character analyses

All in all, I give it a 3 out of 5. Without the profanity and the off-topic junk, it'd probably be a 4-4.5.

First few episodes are available for download at http://winteriscoming.vox.com/library/posts/page/2/ and episodes 7-10 are up on iTunes if anybody is interested...

/tk

I listened to the first podcast. Your analysis is spot on tk. The off topic stuff and swearing seemed really unnecessary. It was like they were trying to be cool and it wasn't really warranted. Sure, it's great to be amusing, but they are really not all that witty (e.g., referring to Stannis as the constantly PMSing king), so they should stick to the core material.

I had one big issue with the first podcast about the Wall. The guy went on and on about how Mance Rayder's plan to bring the Wall down with the Horn of Winter was stupid and not well thought out. Mance explains his plan in some detail. He planned to use the Horn as a bargaining chip to get his people through the Wall. He specifically explained that he didn't want to bring the Wall down because of the Others. He only threatened to do so if the Night's Watch refused to let his people pass through the Wall. At that point his only options were to bleed his people against the Wall, stay there and get taken by the Others, or bring the Wall down and let his people flee as far south as they could. It was really a solid plan.

[ISiddiqui]

Ick... Dance is taking FOREVER (especially considering how long Crows took and one of the explinations/rewards for it was because he really did two books and was splitting them). At least he's canceling WorldCons. I used to hate reading his blog when talked about all sorts of crap he was doing and I was like "FINISH THE BOOK!", though I realize that's completely unfair (I guess GRRM deserves a life too ).

At least he hired an assistant and seems ready to go full out to finish.

[Chief Rum]

Originally Posted by ISiddiqui

Ick... Dance is taking FOREVER (especially considering how long Crows took and one of the explinations/rewards for it was because he really did two books and was splitting them). At least he's canceling WorldCons. I used to hate reading his blog when talked about all sorts of crap he was doing and I was like "FINISH THE BOOK!", though I realize that's completely unfair (I guess GRRM deserves a life too ).

At least he hired an assistant and seems ready to go full out to finish.

It still amazes me that he released Book Three during the Clinton administration and Book Four in the second term of Bush Jr. administration.

Love his books. Not so much in love with his approach to writing them.

[ISiddiqui]

Originally Posted by Chief Rum

It still amazes me that he released Book Three during the Clinton administration and Book Four in the second term of Bush Jr. administration.

Love his books. Not so much in love with his approach to writing them.

Agreed. I know he has disdain for J.K. Rowling (which I decidedly do not share), but he'd do well to emulate her work rate. I realize that the Song of Ice and Fire is a bit more complex (Rowlings last few books, however, have been just as big and full of details, however), but she did 7 books in 10 years.

[Honolulu_Blue]

Originally Posted by ISiddiqui

Agreed. I know he has disdain for J.K. Rowling (which I decidedly do not share), but he'd do well to emulate her work rate. I realize that the Song of Ice and Fire is a bit more complex (Rowlings last few books, however, have been just as big and full of details, however), but she did 7 books in 10 years.

Tell me about it. Lady H_B and I had some sort of bet back when the last Harry Potter book was released about which book would be released first. At the time it seemed inconceivable (in Vizzini sense of the word) that the Potter book would come out before Feast for Crows. In the end, it wasn't even close.

I remember Martin's blog posting a few months back about his "great" day with Dance. I was happy to hear he made some progress, but one day? One day? COME ON!

[ISiddiqui]

I know... I wonder if he's lost interest in doing the series after Storm of Swords, or if this is how it has always been.

Dance was supposed to be a companion to Crows. Supposed to come out the year afterwards, because it was mostly written. It may take 3 years for it to come out. And then we'll have two more books (from scratch) to wait for. Hopefully GRRM survives long enough to finish the story!

[cougarfreak]

I am just about done with SOS, and wonder if he'll ever finish the series? Should I even bother? I LOVE the series, but will I just get pissed off waiting 5 years in between books. Did this guy used to write for enjoyment, and now he sees it as work?

[ISiddiqui]

It seems SoS is nice breaking point (one story ends there another begins with FfC). If you will hate waiting (I just somewhat forget about the series sometimes), just pick it up again after he releases DwD, and then maybe let it go and pick it up again after the last two.

[flere-imsaho]

Originally Posted by ISiddiqui

I know... I wonder if he's lost interest in doing the series after Storm of Swords, or if this is how it has always been.

That's occurred to me as well. It seems to me that the books have increased in scope and complexity as the series has progressed, and I wonder if he feels he's looking at a growing mountain of work and has, at times, just lost the will to complete it.

Dance was supposed to be a companion to Crows. Supposed to come out the year afterwards, because it was mostly written. It may take 3 years for it to come out. And then we'll have two more books (from scratch) to wait for. Hopefully GRRM survives long enough to finish the story!

I hate to say it, but this could really end unfinished. I wonder if he has a son ala Christopher Tolkein?

[Honolulu_Blue]

Originally Posted by ISiddiqui

It seems SoS is nice breaking point (one story ends there another begins with FfC). If you will hate waiting (I just somewhat forget about the series sometimes), just pick it up again after he releases DwD, and then maybe let it go and pick it up again after the last two.

I think this is exactly the problem. I am just finishing Storm of Swords (for the third time) and despite the various cliff hangers, there is just a ton of stuff that's wrapped up. Almost all of the mysteries from books 1-3 are solved (e.g., who killed Jon Arryn, who tried to kill Bran, the real story behind Tysha and Tyrion, why the Wildings were attacking the Wall, etc.) and it basically ends the War of the Five Kings, save for a siege or two here and there.

"Feast For Crows" was pretty much that. It was the various people picking at what remained of the kingdom. It didn't really move things along that much and the story archs setup in it aren't too terribly clear.

I imagine it was a very difficult book to write, as a Dance of Dragons would be. What does Tyrion do now? Does Dany just sit a rule? (If Feast did one thing, it did setup some very interesting potential in the east with various people headed towards Dany.) What happens at the Wall? What does Bran do? A lot of the characters are thrust into situations that very different from their progression in the first three books. I could see where he'd be struggling with it all.

While I sincerely hope he finishes, I can't imagine he'll be able to finish it all in 7 books as planned. It just seems too much time needs to pass (and Martin already scrapped his original plan set Book 4 X number of years ahead) for a number of main characters to be in a position to play a major role (e.g., Dany and her dragons and Arya).

[DaddyTorgo]

Originally Posted by Honolulu_Blue

I think this is exactly the problem. I am just finishing Storm of Swords (for the third time) and despite the various cliff hangers, there is just a ton of stuff that's wrapped up. Almost all of the mysteries from books 1-3 are solved (e.g., who killed Jon Arryn, who tried to kill Bran, the real story behind Tysha and Tyrion, why the Wildings were attacking the Wall, etc.) and it basically ends the War of the Five Kings, save for a siege or two here and there.

"Feast For Crows" was pretty much that. It was the various people picking at what remained of the kingdom. It didn't really move things along that much and the story archs setup in it aren't too terribly clear.

I imagine it was a very difficult book to write, as a Dance of Dragons would be. What does Tyrion do now? Does Dany just sit a rule? (If Feast did one thing, it did setup some very interesting potential in the east with various people headed towards Dany.) What happens at the Wall? What does Bran do? A lot of the characters are thrust into situations that very different from their progression in the first three books. I could see where he'd be struggling with it all.

While I sincerely hope he finishes, I can't imagine he'll be able to finish it all in 7 books as planned. It just seems too much time needs to pass (and Martin already scrapped his original plan set Book 4 X number of years ahead) for a number of main characters to be in a position to play a major role (e.g., Dany and her dragons and Arya).

mmmm dragons.

i assume that everyone else has already made the leap that Dragons > Others hmm?

[Honolulu_Blue]

Originally Posted by DaddyTorgo

mmmm dragons.

i assume that everyone else has already made the leap that Dragons > Others hmm?

That certainly is shaping up to be the Big Showdown of the series at the moment. Books 1-3 dealt with the wars of men, while books 4-? deal more with a war between the gods.

Not surprisingly, there doesn't really seem to be a "good" guy in the fight. Clearly the Others and their Wights/Zombies are pretty evil. That said, Cold Hands appears to be at least some form of Wight and seems to be a decent fellow.

R'hollor isn't that good a "guy" either. Melisandre is creepy as all get out and while the Brotherhood Without Banners seemed a decent lot while Dondarrion was in charge, it was very clear from Feast that with Lady Stoneheart (Fuck you, Catelyn Stark!) at the helm they clearly had lost their way. Like Maester Aemon said, "Fire consumes."

Then what do you do with the Seven, the gods of Westeros? They really have never been shown to have any kind of power outside of faith (no wights, no fire, no giving birth to killer shadow men), but they are becomming a major player with the new Septon and Cersei's (insanely stupid, even for her) decision to allow him to build a Holy Army.

If that's where the series is going (who knows really), it will be very interesting to see what role those characters who don't really seem to fit in (Jamie, Arya, Sansa, Tyrion, etc.) any of the camps will play.

[DaddyTorgo]

Originally Posted by Honolulu_Blue

That certainly is shaping up to be the Big Showdown of the series at the moment. Books 1-3 dealt with the wars of men, while books 4-? deal more with a war between the gods.

Not surprisingly, there doesn't really seem to be a "good" guy in the fight. Clearly the Others and their Wights/Zombies are pretty evil. That said, Cold Hands appears to be at least some form of Wight and seems to be a decent fellow.

R'hollor isn't that good a "guy" either. Melisandre is creepy as all get out and while the Brotherhood Without Banners seemed a decent lot while Dondarrion was in charge, it was very clear from Feast that with Lady Stoneheart (Fuck you, Catelyn Stark!) at the helm they clearly had lost their way. Like Maester Aemon said, "Fire consumes."

Then what do you do with the Seven, the gods of Westeros? They really have never been shown to have any kind of power outside of faith (no wights, no fire, no giving birth to killer shadow men), but they are becomming a major player with the new Septon and Cersei's (insanely stupid, even for her) decision to allow him to build a Holy Army.

If that's where the series is going (who knows really), it will be very interesting to see what role those characters who don't really seem to fit in (Jamie, Arya, Sansa, Tyrion, etc.) any of the camps will play.

nice analysis H_B!

[ISiddiqui]

http://grrm.livejournal.com/

I am, however, getting bloody sick of all the off-topic comments, and the trolls who use any LJ post of mine, regardless of subject, as another excuse to slam me about DANCE being late. I can't stop you from posting such comments, of course... but I can and will remove 'em, and ban the posters. LJ makes that pretty easy, I'm glad to say. And life is too short to deal with trolls.

God Damn It, George... you think there MAAAAY be a reason people are slamming you on your LiveJournal (LJ) for having Dragons late? I mean, really. The last update you had was one month ago, saying you've finished the prologue... wonderful.

[StarBuck]

I'm glad someone bumped this thread. I just finished "He, She and It" by Marge Piercy and am in serious GREAT sci-fi/fantasy book withdrawal now. I will have to check out this series mentioned by the original poster.

I so look forward to heading into bed at night knowing I have a book waiting for me that is hard to put down.

[Chief Rum]

Originally Posted by StarBuck

I'm glad someone bumped this thread. I just finished "He, She and It" by Marge Piercy and am in serious GREAT sci-fi/fantasy book withdrawal now. I will have to check out this series mentioned by the original poster.

I so look forward to heading into bed at night knowing I have a book waiting for me that is hard to put down.

That is a great feeling. The downside is when you're done with Book Four, and you know you won't get to read Book Five for a year or two or three while Martin takes his slow, fat ass time finishing the damn thing.

Naw, I'm not bitter.

[DaddyTorgo]

Originally Posted by Chief Rum

That is a great feeling. The downside is when you're done with Book Four, and you know you won't get to read Book Five for a year or two or three while Martin takes his slow, fat ass time finishing the damn thing.

Naw, I'm not bitter.

you can just keep re-reading

[StarBuck]

I know what you mean. Kind of like The Wheel of Time series and Sword of Truth series. I finally gave up and decided to wait until the authors finished the damn series, then I will re-read them in uninterrupted succession! Then again those two series really needed to wind up, They were milking it way too long.

Maybe I should wait until this hut (yup, I saw his LJ ) finishes them all?

[DaddyTorgo]

Originally Posted by StarBuck

I know what you mean. Kind of like The Wheel of Time series and Sword of Truth series. I finally gave up and decided to wait until the authors finished the damn series, then I will re-read them in uninterrupted succession! Then again those two series really needed to wind up, They were milking it way too long.

Maybe I should wait until this hut (yup, I saw his LJ ) finishes them all?

by the time you get through them all twice (prolly minimum for a good understanding) he will hopefully be close to done.

[Honolulu_Blue]

I can see where people are frustrated, but seriously, it's ridiculous and crass to hound the guy.

He's a busy man. He's got a lot of toy knights to collect and conventions to go to.

Also, he just delivered you some ASOIF lead miniatures. Be happy with that!

As of the moment, I've read each of the first three books three times. I've only read "Feast" once, but that will change soon. I just need to download it onto my iPod though I've heard some very negative things about the reader.

While I don't love all of Roy Dotrice's voices (mainly for women/smallfolk), I think he simply nails some of the scenes and is perfect for Tyrion and Jamie. I wish he'd been able to read for "Feast."

[sachmo71]

Sword of Truth is on a romance novel publishing schedule compared to Martin. OTOH, I'd rather George not "Jordan it" and ruin a great, if not the best, fantasy series of all time.

[ISiddiqui]

Originally Posted by Honolulu_Blue

I can see where people are frustrated, but seriously, it's ridiculous and crass to hound the guy.

He's a busy man. He's got a lot of toy knights to collect and conventions to go to.

Also, he just delivered you some ASOIF lead miniatures. Be happy with that!

LOL! I think though the comments wouldn't be as much an issue if he didn't basically say he's giving no updates on Dance with Dragons until it's done... which could be any year now. If he gave regular updates, it'd really cut the rope out from the people complaining. I'm sure most of them are wondering where he is.

And you don't throw a freaking hissy fit about it. That just makes people wonder what was said. Just delete them, warn (and then ban if they keep at it) the posters, and stay quiet about it.

[flere-imsaho]

The lateness annoyed me for a while, but then I decided to just live with it and realized I have a whole queue of good stuff waiting to be read. Tolkein's Children of Hurin just arrived, Kage Baker's latest Company book should be out soon, and apparently the next Iain Banks SF will be another Culture novel, so it's all good.

Plus, FM08 will be out in the next few months, and worst-case scenario, I could start playing WoW again (in fact, I will do this when the wife takes a couple of business trips in the autumn).

Oh yeah, and there's these cartoons I seem to recall something about....

[Honolulu_Blue]

Originally Posted by flere-imsaho

Plus, FM08 will be out in the next few months, and worst-case scenario, I could start playing WoW again (in fact, I will do this when the wife takes a couple of business trips in the autumn)

This reminds me of when "Storm of Swords" came out. It came just about the same time I first ever started playing FM (well, it was CM back then). I was so obsessed with both that I would play FM, click "continue", and then swivel around in my chair and read a paragraph or two of the book, while I wanted for the computer to do it's thing. I spent entire, and I do mean, ENTIRE weekends doing that.

[Honolulu_Blue]

Originally Posted by ISiddiqui

LOL! I think though the comments wouldn't be as much an issue if he didn't basically say he's giving no updates on Dance with Dragons until it's done... which could be any year now. If he gave regular updates, it'd really cut the rope out from the people complaining. I'm sure most of them are wondering where he is.

And you don't throw a freaking hissy fit about it. That just makes people wonder what was said. Just delete them, warn (and then ban if they keep at it) the posters, and stay quiet about it.

I agree.

When he made those last two posts, the one about the prologue and then one about the "good day" he had with a Dance of Dragons, two things immediately came to mind:

First, was the Chris Rock "you low expectation havin' motherf**ker!" routine.

Second, was this scene from "The Princess Bride":

Fezzik: You just shook your head... doesn't that make you happy?

Westley: My brains, his steel, and your strength against sixty men, and you think a little head jiggle is supposed to make me happy?

[mrsimperless]

For some reason today I randomly googled for a song of ice and fire MUD. Sure enough I found one.

Unfortunately it seems to be very new. There doesn't seem to be much being done with the forum administration because there's rampant pr0n spam.

Also they have some pretty lame rules about language and behavior. It seems like they're trying to make it a family friendly environment which is a bit of a downside for me. I want to be IN the book, not in some My Little Pony version of it.

I've yet to give it a shot.

[terpkristin]

Kinda stumbled onto some random things on iTunes today.

1. If you search on the iTunes Music Store for "Interview with George R.R. Martin" the result is an "audiobook" interview with GRRM. It doesn't reveal anything about the books, but was interesting to listen to. I think I originally found this by searching on "A Song of Ice and Fire" or "George R.R. Martin" but I downloaded it ages ago and forgot about it until today. It's only about 40 minutes, free, and was interesting.

2. GRRM did a podcast of sorts in late 2006, the episodes of which are on iTunes if you search under "A Song of Ice and Fire." There are only 8 episodes, all pretty short (10-15 minutes), looks like again, more background of the man, but might be interesting. I'm downloading them now and will give them a listen this week.

Anyway, just thought others might like to know..

/tk

[Honolulu_Blue]

Thanks for the info, tk.

I just started to listen to "A Feast For Crows". They used a different reader. He's not very good. He seems to emphasize random words in sentences for no real apparent reason. I much prefer Roy Dotrice, but I am enjoying it nonetheless.

Listening to these books makes all sorts of tasks, yard work, house work, working out, all the easier to accomplish.

[terpkristin]

Originally Posted by Honolulu_Blue

Thanks for the info, tk.

I just started to listen to "A Feast For Crows". They used a different reader. He's not very good. He seems to emphasize random words in sentences for no real apparent reason. I much prefer Roy Dotrice, but I am enjoying it nonetheless.

Listening to these books makes all sorts of tasks, yard work, house work, working out, all the easier to accomplish.

I actually haven't listened to AFFC yet. However, before ADWD comes out, I will have (I have it on my iPod). I've found that with GRRM's books, I prefer to read them initially, and then instead of a "re-read," I listen to the audio. It lets me immerse myself in the world a bit more, and lets my imagination run a little wilder.

So before ADWD comes out (if it ever does!), I'll probably re-listen to all of the books, or at the very least AFFC. It makes driving go quicker, and is nice at work if I'm doing something completely mindless.

/tk

[BrianD]

Originally Posted by Honolulu_Blue

Thanks for the info, tk.

I just started to listen to "A Feast For Crows". They used a different reader. He's not very good. He seems to emphasize random words in sentences for no real apparent reason. I much prefer Roy Dotrice, but I am enjoying it nonetheless.

Listening to these books makes all sorts of tasks, yard work, house work, working out, all the easier to accomplish.

I had the same thought about the new reader. He also changed the pronunciation for many of the characters. I had to fight the urge to correct the guy every time he uttered a name I almost didn't recognize. It would be very nice if new readers either listened to an earlier book, or got a pronunciation guide. It is very jarring when the names suddenly change.

[Honolulu_Blue]

Originally Posted by BrianD

I had the same thought about the new reader. He also changed the pronunciation for many of the characters. I had to fight the urge to correct the guy every time he uttered a name I almost didn't recognize. It would be very nice if new readers either listened to an earlier book, or got a pronunciation guide. It is very jarring when the names suddenly change.

I agree. I didn't care for the changed pronunciations either.

I guess the one positive in the change is that the one Dotrice voice that annoyed me most of all was Brienne's. It was too small and mousy (I actually am not a fan of Dotrice's smallfolk/women voices) for her. I am not sure how long I could listen to "Have you seen an auburn hair maiden of three and ten?" in that voice.

Still, Dotrice is a great reader. He nails Tyrion. I really hope his schedule works out and he can read for "Dance" whenver that may be...

I never really imagined Aero Hotah as having a Scottish accent either, but I don't mind it.

[Warhammer]

If you want a pretty good board game based on the books, you can pick up A Game of Thrones. Pretty neat little game.

[BrianD]

Originally Posted by Honolulu_Blue

I agree. I didn't care for the changed pronunciations either.

I guess the one positive in the change is that the one Dotrice voice that annoyed me most of all was Brienne's. It was too small and mousy (I actually am not a fan of Dotrice's smallfolk/women voices) for her. I am not sure how long I could listen to "Have you seen an auburn hair maiden of three and ten?" in that voice.

Still, Dotrice is a great reader. He nails Tyrion. I really hope his schedule works out and he can read for "Dance" whenver that may be...

I never really imagined Aero Hotah as having a Scottish accent either, but I don't mind it.

Funny enough, I had to read each name you wrote very slowly. I have read and listened to the first book, but only listened to the next 3. A number of those names I've never even seen before.

Part of the problem is probably also inherent in the change of readers. We get used to a pronunciation and a voice and we can't accept anything else.

[Blade]

Originally Posted by Warhammer

If you want a pretty good board game based on the books, you can pick up A Game of Thrones. Pretty neat little game.

Definitely a fun game, and there are a few expansions out for it as well...I own one of them so far, and we have had a blast playing it...

[mrsimperless]

Dotrice's performances in the first 3 books are nothing short of spectacular. There's no way that this new chump could have lived up to that, but he could have at least studied Dotrice's work and tried to imitate as much as possible. The producers have to know that the same people who listened to the first 3 are the same ones who will be buying the fourth one. And yeah, the pronunciation differences are absolutely inexcusable. I will gladly pay for another copy if they re-release AFFC read by Dotrice. I know ASOS had 2 versions, one read by someone else, although I'm not sure which one was released first.

And I'm with Honolulu on the chores too. I've got quite a bit of painting I'm going to try and tackle this weekend and I don't dread it whatsoever. I used to try and listen at work when I could, but I kept having to rewind as I'd miss things thinking about something else. I guess for the same reason I could never study and watch TV at the same time. Perhaps if I ever change careers and do something a bit more mindless it would be an option.

[Honolulu_Blue]

Well, I just finished "A Feast For Crows" last night while walking my dog (Aegon). My house is about to fall into dis-repair (more so).

It took me about 20 months or so to listen to all 4 books. It was great. I picked up a on a ton of stuff I missed the first and second times through. I grew to appreciate "Feast" quite a bit more as well.

Time to find a new book to listen to...

[Galaril]

Originally Posted by Honolulu_Blue

Well, I just finished "A Feast For Crows" last night while walking my dog (Aegon). My house is about to fall into dis-repair (more so).

It took me about 20 months or so to listen to all 4 books. It was great. I picked up a on a ton of stuff I missed the first and second times through. I grew to appreciate "Feast" quite a bit more as well.

Time to find a new book to listen to...

I am curious how was the narrator for the books? I have read the four
in print but my try to listen to them againin audio book format.

[Honolulu_Blue]

Originally Posted by Galaril

I am curious how was the narrator for the books? I have read the four
in print but my try to listen to them againin audio book format.

Check out some of the posts above that go into some detail.

Roy Dotrice is the reader for the first three and he's amazing.

Jonathan Lee was the reader for the 4th. Some people hate him. He's not as good as Dotrice, but I actually got used to him and enjoyed it just fine. He actually reads very well for Cersei and given the number of Cersei chapters in "Feast" that's a very good thing.

[sachmo71]

Originally Posted by Honolulu_Blue

Check out some of the posts above that go into some detail.

Roy Dotrice is the reader for the first three and he's amazing.

Jonathan Lee was the reader for the 4th. Some people hate him. He's not as good as Dotrice, but I actually got used to him and enjoyed it just fine. He actually reads very well for Cersei and given the number of Cersei chapters in "Feast" that's a very good thing.

I agree with this. I'm on Feast as well, and didn't like Lee at first, but now I'm finding him ok. I think Dotrice had more range, but Lee isn't bad.

[timmynausea]

I actually prefer Lee, but I guess that puts me in the minority.

[Honolulu_Blue]

Here's the latest from Martin on "A Dance With Dragons"

THE DANCE GOES ON... AND ON... AND ON

The problem with doing these updates is that each of them is an attempt to predict the future, and if there's one thing that I have proved beyond a doubt these last few years, it's that I'm very bad at predicting the future, especially when my own work is concerned. I suppose I incline too much toward optimism.

My last formal update on A DANCE WITH DRAGONS was dated February 15, 2007.

If that seems like a long time ago to you, join the queue. It seems like forever and a day to me. When I wrote that update, I was sick of writing updates. So I tried to make that last update the final update, and ended it by saying, "The next update will be the one that announces that the DANCE is done."

Like all my other predictions about this book, however, that one turned out to be wrong. Ten-and-a-half months have passed, the book is still not done, and lately my mailbox has started filling up once again with readers pointing out that my last update is ah, quite old. So in the spirit of the holiday season, I decided, well, I can't give them DANCE, but I suppose I can give them a new update and a new sample chapter.

The new chapter you'll find on the Ice & Fire / Sample page of the website. For most of the past year, I've been rotating the first Daenerys chapter and the first Tyrion chapter on that page, changing back and forth every few months. By now, I fear, many of you have probably committed those two chapters to memory, so I'm adding a third wheel to the rotation, and giving you a taste of the first Jon Snow chapter as well. I hope you will enjoy it. And if you missed the Tyrion chapter and/or the Daenerys chapter, have no fear, both of them will be back up again in the months to come. I only offer one sample at a time, but my webmaster and I do try to change them out regularly.

As for the update part of the update... well, what can I say? The book's still not done.

Last February, when I wrote the previous update, my intent was to finish and deliver A DANCE WITH DRAGONS by the summer, so I could take off for the worldcon in Japan with a clear conscience, and follow it with a book tour through several other Asian countries. Obviously that didn't happen. I ended up cancelling the whole Asian tour and missing worldcon for the first time since 1985, so I could stay home, focus on the book, and make an all-out effort to finish it by the end of 2007. Unfortunately, that didn't happen either.

It is now 2008. I'm still working. There are no short cuts. It's a chapter at a time, a page at a time, a word at a time. I'm further along than I was, but not as far as I would like. During the last year, I had some good days (and months), some bad days (and months), and some days (and months) that I thought were good that turned out to be bad. The book is getting longer, and more importantly, the book is getting better. I've changed my mind about some of the things I said in earlier updates and on my Live Journal, and I reserve the right to change my mind again, though I am hoping I won't have to. Believe me, no one wants to finish this book more than me.
Sorry, I won't give you chapter and verse about the details of what I've been doing and undoing. I've never liked to talk much about a work-in-progress. Too much can and does change. Seeing as how I made you wait so long between updates, however, I'll throw out one small teaser, and mention I'm adding some chapters from the point of view of one of the characters featured in the first lot of Ice & Fire miniatures from Dark Sword, a character who has never had a POV in any of the earlier books.
This summer I am scheduled to travel to Spain to speak at Semana Negra in Gijon, make some appearances in Madrid and Barcelona, and then head over to Portugal to visit with my publishers and readers there. I want to have A DANCE WITH DRAGONS done and delivered before I leave. If that happens, the book will likely be published in the fall of 2008 in the U.S, and somewhat earlier in the U.K. I am pleased with the way the writing is going at the moment, and I think these projections are realistic ones... but as you all know, I've been wrong before. So I am not swearing any blood oaths here.

I probably won't update this page again for quite a long while, so let me close by saying once again that when A DANCE WITH DRAGONS is finished, I will post that news here. The moment I finish the book, I will log on and make the announcement. You guys will be the third ones to know, right after Parris and my publishers.

Until then, let me suggest that you check out HUNTER'S RUN, the new SF novel I wrote with Daniel Abraham and Gardner Dozois, and INSIDE STRAIGHT, the first volume in our new Wild Cards triad from Tor. They are not A Song of Ice and Fire, true, but I'm very proud of them both and I think a lot of you might enjoy them. Both books will be on sale in January in hardcover. And if it's more epic fantasy that you're yearning for, there's never been more good fantasies being published than there are right now. Try Daniel Abraham, try Scott Lynch, try S.L. Farrell and David Anthony Durham and Peter S. Beagle, try Lisa Tuttle and Robin Hobb and Ellen Kushner, or any of myriad other authors whose work is making fantasy such an exciting genre to be a part of... and if you want a change of pace, hop over to historical fiction and sample some Bernard Cornwell, some Cecilia Holland, some Steven Pressfield, some David W. Ball. You'll be glad you did.

Meanwhile, I'll keep working.

-George R.R. Martin, January 1, 2008

[ISiddiqui]

the book will likely be published in the fall of 2008 in the U.S

Yeah... not a chance. If he's predicting fall of '08, it'll be more like winter '09. *sigh*