Trump Indictment/Trial thread-2023

[Edward64]

I'm thinking he'll find a way to delay the trial/verdicts after election. Rallying cry for his troops.

I think it's 99% that he'll try a blanket pardon for himself if he gets elected. Then the fun really begins.

[Ksyrup]

That would require him to be elected, and if that happens, him pardoning himself is the least of our worries...

[PilotMan]

Originally Posted by Galaril

So what is the likelihood he stalks all these trials and /or gets convicted in a few then gets elected and pardons himself. I am starting to think he cosnsiders a way to get votes on the right. The first NY Times poll came out today and Biden Trump were each at 43 % with 14 % saying they will either vote 3rd party or still not decided. Geez our the Democrats going to screw this up ?

Have you met the Bernie Bros? And don't get me started on the far left, conspiracy minded, health focused, q-adjacent dems.

[Brian Swartz]

I'd actually be quite interested in getting you started on them. It would be a nice diversion from the usual topics .

Originally Posted by KSyrup

That would require him to be elected, and if that happens, him pardoning himself is the least of our worries...

Yup. The American people have been on record for decades as not thinking being guilty of felonies should prevent somebody from being President. But if they elect Trump after everything he's said and done, it'll just be a worse version of the T-shirt that went around after he was elected the first time: 'Donald Trump is President. Who gives a $@*&'. I know it definitely changed my perspective on what is possible in the United States, and not in a good way.

[RainMaker]

Originally Posted by PilotMan

Have you met the Bernie Bros? And don't get me started on the far left, conspiracy minded, health focused, q-adjacent dems.

Can't figure out why people aren't excited to vote for the dementia riddled 80 year old who has been on the wrong side of every major issue over the past 4 decades.

Blame everyone but the people who wanted Biden.

[JPhillips]

Dementia riddled is such horseshit. He's old, but there's no indication that he isn't mentally sharp.

[RainMaker]

Originally Posted by JPhillips

Dementia riddled is such horseshit. He's old, but there's no indication that he isn't mentally sharp.

The fact they're terrified to have him interviewed or give press conferences is a pretty good indication. He's 80 years old. No one is mentally sharp at that age. Especially someone who was never known for his mental sharpness when he was young.

I just think these excuses are lame. The party chose to strap their hopes and dreams to him. Don't blame others if he hasn't inspired enough people to vote for him in 2024. Only so many times you can run on "well the other guy is worse".

The party should have had some younger candidates lined up in 2024. Especially if their plan was to have Biden do nothing for 4 years.

[PilotMan]

Originally Posted by RainMaker

Can't figure out why people aren't excited to vote for the dementia riddled 80 year old who has been on the wrong side of every major issue over the past 4 decades.

Blame everyone but the people who wanted Biden.

We wouldn't be in this situation if the Bernie Bros could have pulled their collective heads out of their asses long enough to realize that 2016 was all about the Supreme Court and not Hillary. But they weren't smart enough to see that.

[RainMaker]

Originally Posted by PilotMan

We wouldn't be in this situation if the Bernie Bros could have pulled their collective heads out of their asses long enough to realize that 2016 was all about the Supreme Court and not Hillary. But they weren't smart enough to see that.

Hillary lost because she is one of the most unlikable politicians in the country that ran one of the dumbest campaigns in history. Again, blaming everyone but the shitty politicians these parties desperately wanted as their candidate.

[PilotMan]

Had nothing to do with that 20+ year attack from the right on her. Nothing at all. I didn't like her, don't like Biden, but you look at the end game, and if you're clutching your pearls because you are making a political point, in spite of yourself, you're losing and you're whining about the party, when the voters made the choices.

[CrimsonFox]

I've lost track. How many idictments is that

[Edward64]

Trifecta aka 3

[RainMaker]

Originally Posted by PilotMan

Had nothing to do with that 20+ year attack from the right on her. Nothing at all. I didn't like her, don't like Biden, but you look at the end game, and if you're clutching your pearls because you are making a political point, in spite of yourself, you're losing and you're whining about the party, when the voters made the choices.

If the election is so important as you and others say, why run someone who is such a liability? Why run someone who has a 20+ year record of negative attacks against her? Why spend the past few decades fighting harder against progressives in your own party than Republicans (and expecting those progressives to vote for you)?

It's the same shit with Biden in 2024. We're going to hear about how this election is for the future of our democracy but the party just couldn't be bothered to run a better candidate for this supposedly important race.

If the party doesn't give a shit, why should voters?

[RainMaker]

Reading that indictment, I have to assume co-conspirator 4 is going to be arrested. Has anyone broke down which person is which co-conspirator?

[CrimsonFox]

Originally Posted by Edward64

Trifecta aka 3

I thought three was a turkey

[PilotMan]

Originally Posted by RainMaker

Reading that indictment, I have to assume co-conspirator 4 is going to be arrested. Has anyone broke down which person is which co-conspirator?

https://abcnews.go.com/Politics/Trum...y?id=101919066

[RainMaker]

So this trial is in DC with a judge not appointed by Trump. In fact, a judge who has been quite harsh on the J6 defendants and gone above prosecution sentencing requests. DC juries have also convicted every single person that took it to trial. I have to admit that I think there is a possibility this man goes to prison (or more likely house arrest).

In fact, Biden's best campaign strategy might be that voting him in again means you get to see Trump go to prison. I know people will complain about delays, but that might be the motivation to surpass even turnout in 2020.

[Brian Swartz]

I don't think there are that many people who care. Last poll I saw (July 6, Politico) has only a third of independents who think Trump should be indicted if he is convicted. That may have changed some with additional charges since then, but a similar number said a conviction would have no impact on their decision of whether to support his candidacy, and amusingly similar numbers of Republicans and Democrats said the same - presumably because they've already decided and wouldn't be moved by anything.

Still, I don't think this an issue that a massive amount of people care about. Enough to make a difference in the election? Sure, and I definitely hope so. But not a 'I wasn't going to vote, but I will to see him rot in jail' surge.

[Edward64]

Originally Posted by Brian Swartz

Last poll I saw (July 6, Politico) has only a third of independents who think Trump should be indicted if he is convicted.

What does this mean? Isn't it normally someone gets indicted first, then trial, and then convicted?

[albionmoonlight]

I assume he meant imprisoned

[Edward64]

Ah. Thanks.

[Qwikshot]

Originally Posted by RainMaker

If the election is so important as you and others say, why run someone who is such a liability? Why run someone who has a 20+ year record of negative attacks against her? Why spend the past few decades fighting harder against progressives in your own party than Republicans (and expecting those progressives to vote for you)?

It's the same shit with Biden in 2024. We're going to hear about how this election is for the future of our democracy but the party just couldn't be bothered to run a better candidate for this supposedly important race.

If the party doesn't give a shit, why should voters?

The problem I see, is that it's all culture war. Both sides have determined spotlighting wedge issues works better than actually governing, it keeps them in power and the donation money flowing. Actually governing/legislating leads to divisiveness and openings for losing ones job.

Link below, shows how many are very wealthy and thus drive all issues towards the rich while blockading anything that would support the common or poor person.

https://rollcall.com/2018/03/02/ever...-in-one-chart/

Average age of members of congress is 58, it's an old man's game because power is held by the old and rich.

Age of Members of 118th Congress (& Averages) | FiscalNote.

New blood is never going to rise to the top, only the divisive who spout shit everyday get the spotlight. The quiet ones who actually govern/legislate will quickly be dropped for the hot take of the minute assholes.

Now the Republicans want to disrupt/destroy local politics and then their stranglehold will be complete.

Good times for everyone!

[Edward64]

Yup, it'll be a cluster if Trump gets re-elected.

Could Donald Trump serve as president if convicted? | CNN Politics

Donald Trump has been indicted on federal charges related to 2020 election subversion, a stunning third time this year that the former president has faced criminal charges.

But could the former president, who remains the front-runner for the 2024 Republican presidential nomination, assume the Oval Office again if convicted of the alleged crimes? In short, yes.

University of California, Los Angeles law professor Richard L. Hasen – one of the country’s leading experts on election law – said Trump still has a path to serving as president should he win reelection in 2024.

“The Constitution has very few requirements to serve as President, such as being at least 35 years of age. It does not bar anyone indicted, or convicted, or even serving jail time, from running as president and winning the presidency,” he said in an email to CNN.

Could a president serve from prison? That’s less clear.

“How someone would serve as president from prison is a happily untested question,” Hasen said.

If Trump were to be convicted before the 2024 election and win the contest, he could try to grant himself a pardon, according to Hasen.

“Whether he can do so is untested. The Supreme Court may have to weigh in,” Hasen said, adding that Trump could potentially appeal a conviction to the conservative Supreme Court.

[Galaril]

Originally Posted by Edward64

Yup, it'll be a cluster if Trump gets re-elected.

Could Donald Trump serve as president if convicted? | CNN Politics

Yes , which is why I see the SC totally allowing him or another Republican president to pardon him in the end. Best case is under Trump we have an Autocracy like Turkey/ Hungary and worse case the beginning of the Fourth Reich.

I agree the D party needs to get younger and we need to have more parties that are actually relevant. I think 4 parties and two can join to create a coalition type governing model. But, if we have people voting 3rd party or staying home because they aren’t getting what they want that is a bad decision. I am a white hetero former US veteran male corporate VP they aren’t coming for me the day Trump declares himself King. I am amazed at the people who have every reason to stop another Trump presidency yet are not on board to vote against him.

Republican friends always say and they are right that the Rs can always count on the Dems breaking up and fighting against each other. They do join under the one nominee it seems better than us. Make no mistake the 2016 election never ended.

[Sweed]

Originally Posted by Edward64

Yup, it'll be a cluster if Trump gets re-elected.

Could Donald Trump serve as president if convicted? | CNN Politics

Well, they could impeach him and remove him from office....

Wait a second..

[Atocep]

Originally Posted by RainMaker

So this trial is in DC with a judge not appointed by Trump. In fact, a judge who has been quite harsh on the J6 defendants and gone above prosecution sentencing requests. DC juries have also convicted every single person that took it to trial. I have to admit that I think there is a possibility this man goes to prison (or more likely house arrest).

In fact, Biden's best campaign strategy might be that voting him in again means you get to see Trump go to prison. I know people will complain about delays, but that might be the motivation to surpass even turnout in 2020.

Jack Smith landed the perfect judge for this. She wasn't appointed by Trump, she's been very tough on J6 defendents, but hasn't directed any attacks at Trump during sentencing.

This is also the judge that ruled against Trump when the House was trying to access his white house records as part of the J6 hearings by basically saying "a president is not king and you are no longer president."

[GrantDawg]

Pence is not having it:

Pence: Let’s be clear on this point. It wasn't that they asked for a pause. The president specifically asked me and his gaggle of crackpot lawyers asked me to literally reject votes which would have resulted in the issue of being turned over to the house of representatives pic.twitter.com/QTyw99l8sc

— Acyn (@Acyn) August 2, 2023

[albionmoonlight]

I did not have Mike Pence as the Republican who was going to grow balls on this issue.

[Edward64]

That's a beautiful quote "gaggle of crackpot lawyers".

[Ksyrup]

Originally Posted by albionmoonlight

I did not have Mike Pence as the Republican who was going to grow balls on this issue.

I just read the other day that he is in danger of not even making the debate stage. He may be in "ah well, fuck it" territory like Chris Christie.

[Galaril]

Originally Posted by Edward64

Yup, it'll be a cluster if Trump gets re-elected.

Could Donald Trump serve as president if convicted? | CNN Politics

Yes , which is why I see the SC totally allowing him or another Republican president to pardon him in the end. Best case is under Trump we have an Autocracy like Turkey/ Hungary. Worse case the beginning of the fourth Reich.

[RainMaker]

Originally Posted by albionmoonlight

I did not have Mike Pence as the Republican who was going to grow balls on this issue.

Would have been nice if he did that on January 6th. Instead he supported the guy for years until it became socially acceptable for him to not.

[Thomkal]

Finally he is being held accountable for his actions on Jan 6

[Lathum]

Originally Posted by Thomkal

Finally he is being held accountable for his actions on Jan 6

yeah. Not really.

If anything this will help him and his rubes are footing the bill.

Accountability will only come in the form of an actual conviction and jail time.

[Thomkal]

Originally Posted by Lathum

yeah. Not really.

If anything this will help him and his rubes are footing the bill.

Accountability will only come in the form of an actual conviction and jail time.

Correct me I'm wrong though Lathum-you did not think that even this day would happen right? We are now in the process to that accountability which we could not say until today

[Lathum]

Originally Posted by Thomkal

Correct me I'm wrong though Lathum-you did not think that even this day would happen right? We are now in the process to that accountability which we could not say until today

Not sure I ever said he won't be indicted, but I definitely said he will never see a jail cell and I stand by this. He is already receiving insanely preferential treatment. Anyone else, literally anyone, who possessed even ONE of the documents he had, let alone 100s, would be locked up in a cell pending trial as a national security risk.

[Atocep]

I was telling my wife yesterday that its absolutely insane that a former President was just indicted for a plot to overturn an election and it doesn't feel like it's a big deal.

Where we are in politics vs pre Trump is crazy and happened so fast.

[GrantDawg]

Indictment number 4 officially coming next week:
The main street in front of Fulton County courthouse to shut down next week – WSB-TV Channel 2 - Atlanta

[Galaril]

Trumps lawyer just admitted on Fox tv to his client committing the crime he is being charged with.

[Brian Swartz]

Originally Posted by Edward64

What does this mean? Isn't it normally someone gets indicted first, then trial, and then convicted?

You're absolutely right, and so is albionmoonlight's explanation. Wow was that an impressive mis-statement on my part

[RainMaker]

I had to try and overthrow the government because they're offering a tax rebate on which type of stove I buy.

John Eastman, Co-Conspirator 2 in this week's Trump indictment and architect of the fake elector strategy, blames trans women in public locker rooms and Drag Queen Story Hour for making him try to steal an election https://t.co/jQeSQa5Dkx

— Gillian Branstetter (@GBBranstetter) August 4, 2023

[albionmoonlight]

There's a weird disconnect. If he were to have said this in a private meeting that was secretly recorded, it would be a scandal.

But because he's proud of it, we treat it as a normal mainstream political position.

[Ksyrup]

There's this odd convergence of the old conservative academic thought process that has merged with fantastical/religious "end of times" fringe political cosplay that is now threatening to become a legitimate mainstream position that it's time to reclaim the country or tear it all down. Scary shit.

[PilotMan]

Threatens? Eastman has gone from looney bin to rising star on the right.

[RainMaker]

I can't tell if their brains are just mush now and they're buying into whatever shit Grandmas are screaming about on Facebook. Or if they are just fascists who are using some culture war issues as an excuse to implement authoritarian rule.

[CrimsonFox]

who else here wants to be indicted

[Thomkal]

We knew he wouldn't shut up:


https://twitter.com/MacFarlaneNews/s...44636175593474


Special Counsel already on it

[Qwikshot]

Originally Posted by Thomkal

We knew he wouldn't shut up:


https://twitter.com/MacFarlaneNews/s...44636175593474


Special Counsel already on it

He should be behind bars.

[Lathum]

Originally Posted by Qwikshot

He should be behind bars.

That is the irony in all this. his supporters claim he is being targeted when in reality he is getting special treatment literally no one else on the planet would receive.

[CrimsonFox]

he's all out crying like tantrum crying