Pro Wrestling Discussion Thread **Spoilers Possible**

[RainMaker]

Also would like to add that WWE has been adding more of their stuff to Netflix Instant. Some good documentaries. Just watched The Rise and Fall of WCW.

[molson]

Ya, that's a pretty cool development, here's what's currently available on Netflix streaming:

-The True Story of Wrestlemania (this one's new)
-The Rise and Fall of WCW
-The Top 50 Superstars of All-Time
-Breaking the Code: Behind the Walls of Chris Jericho
-Ricky Steamboat: The Life Story of the Dragon
-Bobby "The Brain" Heenan
-The Big Show: A Giant's World
-Twist of Fate: Matt & Jeff Hardy
-Hart & Soul: The Hart Family Anthology
-The John Cena Experience
-Legendary
-Knucklehead
-The Chaperone

[RainMaker]

It would be sweet if they could put in some of the old PPVs. Although I think they have their own service that they have been selling so it's unlikely.

[Scarecrow]

Internet Wrestling Database

[Matthean]

http://www.wrestlezone.com/news/arti...esponds-127137

Cole used the word faggot on his Twitter account.

[RainMaker]

It's so out of character for WWE lately that I can't figure out why he would write that. They insinuate stuff but they never really use crude language anymore. The account is clearly kayfabe and he should have known better.

I'd also add that he tries way too hard to play the heel. It was good when he was subtle, now it's just a caricature.

[Mota]

Is it really out of character? GLAAD had to get involved just last week because of the gay bashing going live on the air. It is a culture of bullying and intolerance. Look how they treat women with good bodies but not fitness model type. It is Fat fat fat until they quit or are fired. Or even look at their "humbling" process where they take a promising talent and humiliate them on air for months to see if they can take it.

[Maple Leafs]

An online casino has posted odds for Wrestlemania:

Edge (+175) vs. Alberto Del Rio (-245)
The Miz (+550) vs. John Cena (-1,050)
The Undertaker (-2,600) vs. Triple H (+1,200)
Randy Orton (-160) vs. CM Punk (+120)
Jerry Lawler (-5,850) vs. Michael Cole (+1,950)
Rey Mysterio (+105) vs. Cody Rhodes (-145)
Sheamus (-260) vs. Daniel Bryan (+180)
Trish Stratus, Snooki, and John Morrison (-750) vs. Dolph Ziggler, Layla, and Michelle McCool (+450)

hxxp://www.covers.com/articles/articles.aspx?theArt=228164

[molson]

Originally Posted by Maple Leafs

An online casino has posted odds for Wrestlemania:

Edge (+175) vs. Alberto Del Rio (-245)
The Miz (+550) vs. John Cena (-1,050)
The Undertaker (-2,600) vs. Triple H (+1,200)
Randy Orton (-160) vs. CM Punk (+120)
Jerry Lawler (-5,850) vs. Michael Cole (+1,950)
Rey Mysterio (+105) vs. Cody Rhodes (-145)
Sheamus (-260) vs. Daniel Bryan (+180)
Trish Stratus, Snooki, and John Morrison (-750) vs. Dolph Ziggler, Layla, and Michelle McCool (+450)

hxxp://www.covers.com/articles/articles.aspx?theArt=228164

That's funny.

I'd take Cole with those odds - the face usually wins that kind of match but I could see them moving forward with the Cole character as a heel, and him getting a win here with someone else turning heel and aligning with him. Or course, it's much more likely that Lawler kills him, Austin stunners everyone, and Cole goes back to being a regular announcer, but with those odds, i could bet against it and hope for a more interesting outcome.

I'd take Miz to retain, with those odds, if that match wasn't going on last.....and I think they will end with Taker/HHH. Rock might stick around for a couple of weeks or months post-Mania, and if he has some kind of feud with Cena, they don't need the title for that.

Those odds might not favor Taker enough.

Cody Rhodes has been awesome lately, and those are great odds on him - especially with talk that Mysterio may want out soon, and with the younger version of Mysterio coming in soon.

But the best bet might be the mixed tag - the faces will win unless Snooki turns heel and stays with the company for some reason.

[RainMaker]

Originally Posted by Mota

Is it really out of character? GLAAD had to get involved just last week because of the gay bashing going live on the air. It is a culture of bullying and intolerance. Look how they treat women with good bodies but not fitness model type. It is Fat fat fat until they quit or are fired. Or even look at their "humbling" process where they take a promising talent and humiliate them on air for months to see if they can take it.

I guess what I'm saying is that if you told me that a WWE talent was caught saying that on Twitter, Michael Cole would be far down the list of suspects. The guy has been with the organization for 10 years, has to be vocal with the public for hours a week. Just surprised that he wouldn't have known better, especially on a WWE account.

[Mota]

That was quite the bad slipup though, I agree. They do that stuff all the time but usually a bit more subtle. And yes, Cole should know better.

Some people forget that Twitter isn't the locker room or shower. I'm sure things like that get said all the time there, but saying something on Twitter is more like making a press conference.

[JonInMiddleGA]

I doubt he'll get much credit for it, but Cena is delivering a hell of a promo.

[cmp]

I hadn't watched WWE in years but I've now watched the past three weeks. That was a pretty good final segment. I also hated the way they had been building Taker/HHH until tonight. Tonight's segment should have happened three weeks ago.

[Maple Leafs]

HHH/Taker segment was odd. The whole thing was built around planting the seed that HHH can't win. But nobody thinks he's going to win.

Still, was nice to see the patented Shawn Michaels "sad walking away face" one last time.

[Suicane75]

I thought both the Undertaker/HHH and Cena/Rock/Miz segments were saved by how they finished.

Undertakers smile and tip of his hat while his music played made me mark out a little bit and made up for TRIPLE H TALKING for about 30 minutes.

Poor Miz, I know it's not his fault but very few main eventers have ever looked as out of place in an angle as he does. Cenas promo was interesting but I have no idea where it's going or who's supposed to be the hell or the face or what. The FU on Rock was the perfect heel act but I don't think Cena is going heel so I don't know what to make of it.

[Neon_Chaos]

Originally Posted by Suicane75

I thought both the Undertaker/HHH and Cena/Rock/Miz segments were saved by how they finished.

Undertakers smile and tip of his hat while his music played made me mark out a little bit and made up for TRIPLE H TALKING for about 30 minutes.

Poor Miz, I know it's not his fault but very few main eventers have ever looked as out of place in an angle as he does. Cenas promo was interesting but I have no idea where it's going or who's supposed to be the hell or the face or what. The FU on Rock was the perfect heel act but I don't think Cena is going heel so I don't know what to make of it.

He is the greatest WWE champ in history. He's the Miz, and he's awesome.

[Suicane75]

That shtick worked when he was a nuisance undercard heel. Which is what he'll be again in about a week, thank heaven.

[Toddzilla]

Originally Posted by Neon_Chaos

He is the greatest WWE champ in history. He's the Miz, and he's awesome.

[jbergey22]

So is it going to be
Rock, Miz and Cena in a Triple threat at Backlash? Cena/Rock main eventing Summerslam?

or do you think the WWE can hold off on using the Rock in a match until Summerslam?

[RainMaker]

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

I doubt he'll get much credit for it, but Cena is delivering a hell of a promo.

He's really good when he's not doing the cheesy babyface gimmick. He had some great moments during the Nexus feud that they screwed up.

[molson]

Originally Posted by jbergey22

So is it going to be
Rock, Miz and Cena in a Triple threat at Backlash? Cena/Rock main eventing Summerslam?

or do you think the WWE can hold off on using the Rock in a match until Summerslam?

He's filming a movie (I think more than 1) this summer, so he won't be around that long, but he is confirmed for the Raw after Mania, and he's said he's open to wrestling again. A Backlash match wouldn't shock me, but it wouldn't shock me if never wrestled again either.

[Maple Leafs]

Originally Posted by molson

I'd take Cole with those odds

You're rich!

[jbergey22]

Undertaker puts on another WM classic.

Looks like Undertaker may have gotten a real injury. Had to be stretchered out after the match.

From ewrestlingnews.com:

On his way out of the ring, Taker falls to his knees and on his face. Hunter attempts to help, but he's waved off by the referee. Taker grabs the ring apron to get back to his feet, but he can't. Taker appears to be passed out on the arena floor, and the referee and trainer are waiting for a stretcher. Medics roll down to the ring with a mobile gurney, and Taker is helped to his feet and placed on the back of the gurney with the help of medical staff. Taker is taken out of the ring on the back of the mobile stretcher.

[BYU 14]

Just out of morbid curiosity, how big of a trainwreck was Snookies match?

[jbergey22]

Originally Posted by BYU 14

Just out of morbid curiosity, how big of a trainwreck was Snookies match?

She actually looked decent. She did the Muta Flip and a Back Flip into a SPLASH.. to end the match. The match itself was so short it was hard to get messed up too badly.

[BYU 14]

Originally Posted by jbergey22

She actually looked decent. She did the Muta Flip and a Back Flip into a SPLASH.. to end the match. The match itself was so short it was hard to get messed up too badly.

I find that borderline amazing....Maybe there is a use for her after all

[RainMaker]

Yeah, she was actually pretty good in the match considering she has no experience.

[saldana]

that was the worst wrestlemania i have ever seen

lawler carried cole for almost 20 minutes

the taker/hhh match was boring as balls

the miz cant work at all, and the finish was terrible

i feel really bad for anyone unfortunate enough to have paid for that.

the only match that didnt suck was orton/punk

[Comey]

Originally Posted by saldana

that was the worst wrestlemania i have ever seen

lawler carried cole for almost 20 minutes

the taker/hhh match was boring as balls

the miz cant work at all, and the finish was terrible

i feel really bad for anyone unfortunate enough to have paid for that.

the only match that didnt suck was orton/punk

It's funny...a lot of people are saying it was the best WM since 19.

I was entertained (it was the first WM I've ever seen live), and now they have the biggest feud in years lined up for the summer.

[jbergey22]

Im not sure that many people expected this to be much of a Wrestlemania. The card was weak.

I only got it because of The Rock, Undertaker and its half priced for me.

I disagree with your UT/HHH analysis as I found that another great match in UT's career.

[saldana]

Originally Posted by jbergey22

Undertaker puts on another WM classic.

Looks like Undertaker may have gotten a real injury. Had to be stretchered out after the match.

From ewrestlingnews.com:

no offense, but what exactly was classic about him laying on the ground for the last 10 minutes of the match, not hitting a single move for that entire time and blowing the spot trying to lock in his goofy ass looking submission...the close up of HHH in the corner was about 2 minutes long...i cant imagine how boring that match must have been for the people in the stands.

[Comey]

Originally Posted by jbergey22

Im not sure that many people expected this to be much of a Wrestlemania. The card was weak.

I only got it because of The Rock, Undertaker and its half priced for me.

I disagree with your UT/HHH analysis as I found that another great match in UT's career.

It was a spotfest. But it was a climatic spotfest, and I enjoyed it.

The injury looked severe and legit; there's speculation (don't know how credible) that he had a heart attack. I wonder if the ending changed to the submission. Considering he wasn't even supposed to wrestle, due to his shoulder being so weak, I think Taker did okay, and let HHH dictate things.

Really, even though I thought Taker playing the Flair card (being ultra-vulnerable) was goofy at the time, it was the way to go; I don't recall Taker's streak ever appearing so ready to be vanquished as tonight.

[jbergey22]

Originally Posted by saldana

no offense, but what exactly was classic about him laying on the ground for the last 10 minutes of the match, not hitting a single move for that entire time and blowing the spot trying to lock in his goofy ass looking submission...the close up of HHH in the corner was about 2 minutes long...i cant imagine how boring that match must have been for the people in the stands.

Because they were able to suspend belief and while it didnt top either HBK/UT match this was very well done in their own way. Its gotta be tough for the performers to try and sell that UT is going to actually lose when everyone knows he isnt. After the tombstone piledriver I thought the streak may be over.

[saldana]

Originally Posted by jbergey22

Because they were able to suspend belief and while it didnt top either HBK/UT match this was very well done in their own way. Its gotta be tough for the performers to try and sell that UT is going to actually lose when everyone knows he isnt. After the tombstone piledriver I thought the streak may be over.

i thought that was going to be the end too.

it just didnt do anything for me...they each had one "holy shit" spot, with the backdrop off one announce table and the spinebuster through the other, but beyond that, it wasnt even close to hell in a cell with foley, or UT/Edge

[saldana]

dola, and if there was a real injury in that match, i think it was HHH's left wrist...he was cradling it after that backdrop and when the showed the replay, you could see it hit the pad kind of awkwardly.

[Comey]

Originally Posted by saldana

i thought that was going to be the end too.

it just didnt do anything for me...they each had one "holy shit" spot, with the backdrop off one announce table and the spinebuster through the other, but beyond that, it wasnt even close to hell in a cell with foley, or UT/Edge

I don't know why you'd expect to get that. Taker wasn't even supposed to wrestle, from everything I've read over the last several weeks. The fact that he did what he did is a bit of a miracle in itself.

[jbergey22]

Originally Posted by Comey

It was a spotfest. But it was a climatic spotfest, and I enjoyed it.

The injury looked severe and legit; there's speculation (don't know how credible) that he had a heart attack. I wonder if the ending changed to the submission. Considering he wasn't even supposed to wrestle, due to his shoulder being so weak, I think Taker did okay, and let HHH dictate things.

Really, even though I thought Taker playing the Flair card (being ultra-vulnerable) was goofy at the time, it was the way to go; I don't recall Taker's streak ever appearing so ready to be vanquished as tonight.

As a disclaimer these are just web rumors but they are saying UT had very low blood pressure after the match and had to be taken to the hospital. Sounds scary enough.

[Comey]

Originally Posted by jbergey22

As a disclaimer these are just web rumors but they are saying UT had very low blood pressure after the match and had to be taken to the hospital. Sounds scary enough.

The scene of the trainer waving his hand in Taker's eye and Taker not responding told me something was more severe. HHH being waved off by the ref, when he was trying to help, also comes off as being legit.

[Neon_Chaos]

AWWEEEESOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOME!

[Neon_Chaos]

I would also like to add that CM Punk was the best thing about the PPV. The guy is gold on he mic, and a diamond in the ring. His facial expressions during his match against Orton were priceless.

[Terps]

It was pretty meh, glad I don't pay to watch these. Sheamus/Danielson gets bumped to a dark match, the placement of where matches were on the card was terrible. The ending was awful (but as a Miz fan, Cena not having the belt makes up for that.)

Very surprised Del Rio didn't win, Cole/Lawler went on far too long (just like Bret/Vince did last year,) Rey/Cody, LayCool/Dolph vs. Snooki/Trish/JoMo, and Corre vs. Kane/Show/Santino/Kofi were smoke break matches for me, so I can't comment on them.

Taker's streak is what it is, you can buildup suspense all you want, but everyone knows what the end result will be.

Punk/Orton was probably the best match, but that's not saying much.

[Suicane75]

I thought it was a fine show that suffered from 2 average workers trying to rush through the main event. Add in them being pigeonholed with Rock and it was sort of a big clusterfuck.

Anyone who wasn't into the last 10 minutes of HHH/Undertaker, well I dunno. I thought it was brilliantly done, sloppy devils gate aside. I guarantee a good portion of that crowd who didn't believe for one second that HHH was gonna win were on the edge of their seats when he delivered the tombstone.

Punk/Orton was really fun, Del Rio/Edge was good and Cody Rhodes fucking ruled the night with a beautiful delayed superplex.

The shit was short and the main matches were all solid. The problem is that we were expecting an iconic or memorable finish to the show when really there was none to be had other than Rock somehow coming out of the show with the belt.

[jbergey22]

Originally Posted by Suicane75

The shit was short and the main matches were all solid. The problem is that we were expecting an iconic or memorable finish to the show when really there was none to be had other than Rock somehow coming out of the show with the belt.

I was actually thinking this might happen when he came back to the ring. With WM's being so predictable about having the face winning the final match of the night I thought this was coming to have the fans leave "happy."

And I agree the ending of the Main Event didnt make a whole lot of sense and usually WM isnt an event they use for advancing storylines.

[RainMaker]

The show wasn't that great although not as big of a disaster as it could have been. It suffered from the same problems that have plagued the company for years now. Horrible writing, no build-up, and no true main eventers. It was disguised a bit in years past because HBK-Undertaker stole the show.

Punk/Orton was good and Punk really should be a main eventer in the business. He rarely wins anymore which is sad because he is so good on the mic and in matches. Definitely gets the crowd riled up. While I like Miz, he's nowhere near as skilled as Punk is in the ring. The main event would have been better if it was Punk/Cena, although I do understand why they went with Miz (he gives good interviews).

Taker is well past his prime although I don't mind him on the card. It's a good match in the middle of the show. I'd rather have seen him go against a young star who could carry the match a bit more. You could tell these two had not been in a ring in some time. They don't have to turn every Taker WM match into an "epic" performance. Could have been about 5 minutes less and I'd be fine with it.

Don't really understand some of the decisions either with young talent. Not putting Sheamus-Bryan on the card seems dumb. Having The Corre job to some guys who don't need the win was bad. And building Del Rio up to just have him crap out in a WM opener seems dumb. Miz winning and looking somewhat strong was a plus, although I thought the end was really stupid. There was no point to the countout and they could have had the Rock come out when the ref took the bump. The crowd also seemed to be dead during the match which I guess is expected since neither guy is really that over with the crowd.

Not sure where the buyrate will fall for this. Sort of sad that the main attraction to their biggest event of the year is a guy who hasn't wrestled a match in 7 years. Shows how weak the roster is. A below average WM that is hampered by the same problems the company has faced for years. Should be interesting to see how low buyrates and ratings drop without the Rock there to drive it up.

[Neon_Chaos]

Here is a little Wrestlemania tidbit to wrap your heads around:

Snookie has more Wrestlemania wins than Jerry Lawler.

[Toddzilla]

Up until the HHH-Taker match, WM was a total trainwreck bordering on a TNA-level disaster.

[Toddzilla]

From the Torch:

During WWE's WrestleMania 27 PPV on Sunday night, TNA wrestler Kurt Angle expressed irritation with WWE wrestlers for what he considered move-stealing at WrestleMania.

Angle pointed a finger at Randy Orton, who executed the Angle Slam during his match against C.M. Punk, and Jack Swagger, who uses the Anklelock manuever. Orton then responded to Angle's Twitter posts overnight after Mania.

-- Angle posted on Twitter: "To WWE wrestlers, Don't use my Finish. Get more Creative. Hmmmm- Orton. Did I say that? I heard Orton had an Awesome match though. Ur welcome.

"I guess Swagger will use my Ankle Lock as well. Very creative. I'm the Best in the World. You Guys will never be Kurt Angle. Can I get an AMEN.

"Kurt Angle will never die. TNA. WWE. I'm a leader. Not follower. Why would WWE use my finishes? Is it because I won't go back? R Orton- Angle Slam. M Cole- Ankle Lock? They have some nerve.

"Jerry Lawlor did it too. But He is a Legend. WWE really stuck it to Me. No Love lost. I'm glad that I helped Your biggest Event of the Year."

-- Orton replied on Twitter (without naming Angle by name): "Everything's been done before as far as 'moves' go in the sports entertainment. I want to thank SCSA for the 'Thesz Press.' And I know for a fact that SCSA got the 'Thesz Press' from Dutch Mantell.

"Point being, instead of taking offense to someone using your move, consider it a sign of respect. Btw does anyone know what Ken Shamrocks finish was? I believe Jack Swagger used ankle lock outta respect for Ken?

goddamn that's great stuff from Orton.

[molson]

Originally Posted by Toddzilla

goddamn that's great stuff from Orton.

To be fair, I'm pretty sure Kurt Angle thinks pro wrestling was invented in 1998.

[Maple Leafs]

The booking of the main event was just bizarre.

You've spent two months selling the entire show around the Rock's involvement in the main event, so you have to know that the crowd won't be into anything until he shows up. Nobody cares about the action, nobody buys the fake finish. Fine.

But then when he does show up, you get 30 seconds and then an immediate payoff? No tension, no suspense, just a quick sneak attack? It's as if the writers really don't understand what makes a crowd work.

Not to mention that they apparently just used the main event of Wrestlemania to set up a feud for the next PPV. Strange.

[bulletsponge]

nothings strange in the modern WWE. vince and company have lost it. i and everyone expect them to botch it, and they do