WW XCIV Group Therapy - Game Over! - Page 72

PackerFanatic · 05-22-2009, 12:19 PM

Out of curiosity - why? Other than the fact that I was a lot more UTR than I usually am.

Autumn · 05-22-2009, 12:39 PM

You're certainly right that the semi-reveals combined with my role is what gave us all the ammunition at the end. Lathum's actually was easy for me to piece together despite not giving a lot of info, but what threw me off was that the "votes" for him were hidden so I wasn't sure if he was just making that up.

Without the semi-reveals I might have, for instance, noticed that CR and Hoops voted together and suspected their role but there wasn't much else I would have been able to figure out. I should have been able to guess ABe's, actually, and was kicking myself after the fact that I somehow missed that and got off of him too late.

I don't think we would have stood a chance without the roles, although I do feel like we tagged Telle and EF all on our own. After that though I don't see us getting anywhere.

hoopsguy · 05-22-2009, 12:47 PM

This ought to be a really, really good reminder that a voting record that seems too good to be true is probably just as dangerous as a really poor voting record.

The thing that the wolves did well - particularly Dubb - was have their "good" votes in good contexts as well. I don't think I've had a game where I've spent as much time looking at the timing of the votes and the potential for unvotes down the stretch as I did with this one. And those factors made his votes look even better. That is awfully impressive considering that there was not much of a precedent for that intensive a review process.

Alan T · 05-22-2009, 01:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hoopsguy

This ought to be a really, really good reminder that a voting record that seems too good to be true is probably just as dangerous as a really poor voting record.

The thing that the wolves did well - particularly Dubb - was have their "good" votes in good contexts as well. I don't think I've had a game where I've spent as much time looking at the timing of the votes and the potential for unvotes down the stretch as I did with this one. And those factors made his votes look even better. That is awfully impressive considering that there was not much of a precedent for that intensive a review process.

I followed along after my death and tried to guess the remaining wolves. I didn't figure out Dubb was a wolf until Danny told me. I think he did a good job of burying his vote like you said.

If I remember correctly, Dubb did that in a previous game too by switching right at the deadline when he was a wolf in order to nail a fellow wolf. After he did that, it was hard for me to be convinced that he was bad.

Telle and Eaglefan I finally figured out after I put together in my head what actually happened on the day 1 vote. (Since my vote on day 1 was the assumption that someone was covering for ntn, namely Telle.. and once Ntn showed up as good, it still didn't give me a good explanation for how the middle of the day happened. So the only logical conclusion for me from that was to look at Eaglefan.)

After I died, there was a period that I thought Passacaglia was a wolf for sure because of how he was playing. Later when I found he was the duke, that explained it a bit more to me.

Edit (now that I can edit!): I was a bit frustrated that days went by without anyone pushing for Telle and think it was pretty funny that for a day or two there, only the wolves were actually pushing for Telle, everyone else wanted to go elsewhere. The only reason I felt Eaglefan was likely bad was because of Telle. If I didn't suspect Telle being bad, I wouldn't have voted for Eaglefan on day 2 (as I said before I died).

DaddyTorgo · 05-22-2009, 01:07 PM

I think we all sort of kid-gloved Telle after her speaking up early in the game, and maybe that was to our detriment, but I think - i dunno...at least me was like "well telle hasn't played a lot lately...i don't want to vote her out quick even for legit reasons if it'll seem to her it was because of her speaking up early on d1"

Alan T · 05-22-2009, 01:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DaddyTorgo

I think we all sort of kid-gloved Telle after her speaking up early in the game, and maybe that was to our detriment, but I think - i dunno...at least me was like "well telle hasn't played a lot lately...i don't want to vote her out quick even for legit reasons if it'll seem to her it was because of her speaking up early on d1"

That makes sense, I suppose.

Would be mean to get rid of someone who hadn't played much lately before day 3! (I'm just playing!)

Passacaglia · 05-22-2009, 01:35 PM

Not to criticize the wolves, who played a great game, but if Poli puts his vote on PF in that last night, I think they win.

The Jackal · 05-22-2009, 02:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PackerFanatic

Out of curiosity - why? Other than the fact that I was a lot more UTR than I usually am.

It was the combination of UTR and at least one post that you made early on, I can go back and find those one or two posts if you like, but the timing and tone of them pinged me, and that in combination with the UTR and the vote you put on EF (the fact it was late, before PB voted) had me looking your way. You didn't do anything to give yourself away, just a gut call from me that ended up being right.

PackerFanatic · 05-22-2009, 02:06 PM

Understandable. Hence why I didn't say much, haha. I don't play wolf that often and I am usually a terrible liar to begin with. I felt that my typical UTR-play went well either way.

Danny · 05-22-2009, 04:34 PM

I'm glad some of you guys had fun

The Jackal · 05-22-2009, 04:36 PM

Was an interesting game Danny, I'm cool with the idea of hidden roles but being restricted in what you can and can't say for multiple people in the same game is tough. Definitely had fun though.

EagleFan · 05-22-2009, 04:39 PM

What's the over/under on the number of PM's Danny received during the game?

Danny · 05-22-2009, 04:40 PM

would have been even more, but Chief/Hoops moved their discussion/questions to email, so I got a lot of emails too

hoopsguy · 05-22-2009, 04:41 PM

Less than I did during Marvel?

Chief and I e-mailed him, but I would say that he had maybe 10-15 questions from us over the course of the game. He probably saw another 50 or so e-mails where Chief and I discussed doing things that turned out to be dumb when we did them.

Danny · 05-22-2009, 04:47 PM

For good or bad, I think this game will be remembered lol.

The Jackal · 05-22-2009, 04:56 PM

I bet Abe has you beat from Dungeon, hoops.

hoopsguy · 05-22-2009, 05:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Jackal

I bet Abe has you beat from Dungeon, hoops.

Maybe not - neither Alan nor I played in that game.

I'm guessing BK's Survivor game had a huge amount as well.

The Jackal · 05-22-2009, 05:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hoopsguy

Maybe not - neither Alan nor I played in that game.

I'm guessing BK's Survivor game had a huge amount as well.

But he had three? (I don't even remember now

) deadlines a day in which every participant sent a PM plus the influx of questions, I'd bet its close.

The Jackal · 05-22-2009, 05:30 PM

But I suppose since it wasn't technically WW..

hoopsguy · 05-22-2009, 05:44 PM

Well, it was on the WW board ... I think it is great when people try new ideas, as long as people know what they are getting into at the start of the game.

The Jackal · 05-22-2009, 05:46 PM

Certainly gave people a chance to interact without being at each other's throats.

Abe Sargent · 05-22-2009, 05:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hoopsguy

Maybe not - neither Alan nor I played in that game.

I'm guessing BK's Survivor game had a huge amount as well.

I had almost 200 a day and had to clean out my box constantly.

hoopsguy · 05-22-2009, 05:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Abe Sargent

I had almost 200 a day and had to clean out my box constantly.

Then you probably had us by virtue of # of days. Marvel volume was about the same but your game ran about two weeks longer.

The Jackal · 05-22-2009, 05:55 PM

I miss being the Shadow King.

hoopsguy · 05-22-2009, 05:58 PM

Least popular WW mechanic ever?

The Jackal · 05-22-2009, 05:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hoopsguy

Least popular WW mechanic ever?

Okay, so I might be the only one who misses it.

Alan T · 05-22-2009, 08:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hoopsguy

Least popular WW mechanic ever?

Not even close. Least popular WW mechanic ever still is and will always be.. "No reveal upon death"

dubb93 · 05-22-2009, 08:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alan T

Not even close. Least popular WW mechanic ever still is and will always be.. "No reveal upon death"

Someone should seriously run a game with random reveal upon death and just not tell anyone about that mechanic until after the game. That should would screw with people.

Alan T · 05-22-2009, 08:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dubb93

Someone should seriously run a game with random reveal upon death and just not tell anyone about that mechanic until after the game. That should would screw with people.

That would likely go over just as well as the game where I made everyone a wolf without telling them that everyone else was one too... except two players... I don't think Saldana talked to me for a month after that.

Lathum · 05-22-2009, 08:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alan T

That would likely go over just as well as the game where I made everyone a wolf without telling them that everyone else was one too... except two players... I don't think Saldana talked to me for a month after that.

He was really pissed.

I remember the phone call I got vividly.

Lathum · 05-22-2009, 08:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alan T

Not even close. Least popular WW mechanic ever still is and will always be.. "No reveal upon death"

No doubt and nothing is even close, it was easily the most pointless game ever.

Who was the genius that came up with that anyway?

EagleFan · 05-22-2009, 10:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Abe Sargent

I had almost 200 a day and had to clean out my box constantly.

douche that thang...

saldana · 05-26-2009, 12:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alan T

That would likely go over just as well as the game where I made everyone a wolf without telling them that everyone else was one too... except two players... I don't think Saldana talked to me for a month after that.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lathum

He was really pissed.

I remember the phone call I got vividly.

OMG..i think i created some new swear words that day...all the ones i already new didnt quite cover how pissed i was

05-22-2009, 12:19 PM	#3551
PackerFanatic Pro Starter Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Appleton, WI	Out of curiosity - why? Other than the fact that I was a lot more UTR than I usually am. __________________ Commissioner of the RNFL

05-22-2009, 01:07 PM	#3555
DaddyTorgo Hall Of Famer Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Massachusetts	I think we all sort of kid-gloved Telle after her speaking up early in the game, and maybe that was to our detriment, but I think - i dunno...at least me was like "well telle hasn't played a lot lately...i don't want to vote her out quick even for legit reasons if it'll seem to her it was because of her speaking up early on d1" __________________ Get bent whoever hacked my pw and changed my signature.

05-22-2009, 02:06 PM	#3559
PackerFanatic Pro Starter Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Appleton, WI	Understandable. Hence why I didn't say much, haha. I don't play wolf that often and I am usually a terrible liar to begin with. I felt that my typical UTR-play went well either way. __________________ Commissioner of the RNFL

05-22-2009, 12:39 PM	#3552
Autumn Head Coach Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Bath, ME	You're certainly right that the semi-reveals combined with my role is what gave us all the ammunition at the end. Lathum's actually was easy for me to piece together despite not giving a lot of info, but what threw me off was that the "votes" for him were hidden so I wasn't sure if he was just making that up. Without the semi-reveals I might have, for instance, noticed that CR and Hoops voted together and suspected their role but there wasn't much else I would have been able to figure out. I should have been able to guess ABe's, actually, and was kicking myself after the fact that I somehow missed that and got off of him too late. I don't think we would have stood a chance without the roles, although I do feel like we tagged Telle and EF all on our own. After that though I don't see us getting anywhere.

05-22-2009, 12:47 PM	#3553
hoopsguy General Manager Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Chicago	This ought to be a really, really good reminder that a voting record that seems too good to be true is probably just as dangerous as a really poor voting record. The thing that the wolves did well - particularly Dubb - was have their "good" votes in good contexts as well. I don't think I've had a game where I've spent as much time looking at the timing of the votes and the potential for unvotes down the stretch as I did with this one. And those factors made his votes look even better. That is awfully impressive considering that there was not much of a precedent for that intensive a review process.

05-22-2009, 01:35 PM	#3557
Passacaglia Coordinator Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Big Ten Country	Not to criticize the wolves, who played a great game, but if Poli puts his vote on PF in that last night, I think they win.

05-22-2009, 04:34 PM	#3560
Danny Head Coach Join Date: Jul 2001	I'm glad some of you guys had fun

05-22-2009, 04:36 PM	#3561
The Jackal Coordinator Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: New Hampshire	Was an interesting game Danny, I'm cool with the idea of hidden roles but being restricted in what you can and can't say for multiple people in the same game is tough. Definitely had fun though.

05-22-2009, 04:39 PM	#3562
EagleFan Hall Of Famer Join Date: Nov 2000 Location: Mays Landing, NJ USA	What's the over/under on the number of PM's Danny received during the game?

05-22-2009, 04:40 PM	#3563
Danny Head Coach Join Date: Jul 2001	would have been even more, but Chief/Hoops moved their discussion/questions to email, so I got a lot of emails too

05-22-2009, 04:41 PM	#3564
hoopsguy General Manager Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Chicago	Less than I did during Marvel? Chief and I e-mailed him, but I would say that he had maybe 10-15 questions from us over the course of the game. He probably saw another 50 or so e-mails where Chief and I discussed doing things that turned out to be dumb when we did them.

05-22-2009, 04:47 PM	#3565
Danny Head Coach Join Date: Jul 2001	For good or bad, I think this game will be remembered lol.

05-22-2009, 04:56 PM	#3566
The Jackal Coordinator Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: New Hampshire	I bet Abe has you beat from Dungeon, hoops.

05-22-2009, 05:30 PM	#3569
The Jackal Coordinator Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: New Hampshire	But I suppose since it wasn't technically WW..

05-22-2009, 05:44 PM	#3570
hoopsguy General Manager Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Chicago	Well, it was on the WW board ... I think it is great when people try new ideas, as long as people know what they are getting into at the start of the game.

05-22-2009, 05:46 PM	#3571
The Jackal Coordinator Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: New Hampshire	Certainly gave people a chance to interact without being at each other's throats.

05-22-2009, 05:55 PM	#3574
The Jackal Coordinator Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: New Hampshire	I miss being the Shadow King.

05-22-2009, 05:58 PM	#3575
hoopsguy General Manager Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Chicago	Least popular WW mechanic ever?

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