Mixed Martial Arts Thread (UFC and others)

[CrescentMoonie]

And you retire, and you retire, and you retire. Strange night in NY.

[PilotMan]

Man, the UFC has really flubbed the entire GSP return so far.

[molson]

Looks like McGregor/Mayweather is on for August 26.

(According to ESPN, Yahoo, and McGregor's instagram).

Edit: It will be an all-boxing card at either MGM or T-Mobile in Vegas.

It's hard to imagine Conor going back to MMA after making $100 million or whatever here. That kind of sucks. But it's amazing how successful he's been - less than 4 years ago he made $24k to beat Max Holloway on an UFC prelim.

First legit Vegas odds are Mayweather -1100.

[bhlloy]

The question is whether it will be competitive enough to allow for the 2 rematches they are clearly going to want to promote

[EagleFan]

Crap, it has to be the week we are on vacation.

I wish they signed a two fight crossover type of deal. One boxing match and mma a few months later.

[Suicane75]

If Floyd doesn't win in the first round it's because he's toying with him. If Floyd doesn't win by the second round it's because the fight is fixed.

[molson]

Floyd made $250 million for the Pacquiao fight and will probably make more here. So I'm not sure how either much it would take for him to take a dive and give up his undefeated record, who exactly would pay that, what the purpose would be, and how that could possibly be worth the money.

[stevew]

What odds would you need to even consider spending the first dollar on McGregor? 25:1? Unless Floyd is completely out of shape I can't imagine him losing.

[bhlloy]

Originally Posted by molson

Floyd made $250 million for the Pacquiao fight and will probably make more here. So I'm not sure how either much it would take for him to take a dive and give up his undefeated record, who exactly would pay that, what the purpose would be, and how that could possibly be worth the money.

He's not going to take a dive, but I think it's realistic to think it's in his interest to not completely outclass him like he should. If he goes and wins every round going away and makes Conor look stupid, there's no rematch on the table.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Maybe a meteor strikes & we all win.

[bhlloy]

Hey, maybe if the meteor has a sense of timing it can do it at the press conference and take a bunch of the talking heads from ESPN with them

[stevew]

I guess there really isn't a parallel here but I assume this would be like the world's greatest triathlete attempting to compete with Michael Phelps/Lance Armstrong/Random world champion Marathoner Kenyan

[BYU 14]

Originally Posted by stevew

I guess there really isn't a parallel here but I assume this would be like the world's greatest triathlete attempting to compete with Michael Phelps/Lance Armstrong/Random world champion Marathoner Kenyan

That's a pretty solid analogy actually.

[Suicane75]

Originally Posted by molson

Floyd made $250 million for the Pacquiao fight and will probably make more here. So I'm not sure how either much it would take for him to take a dive and give up his undefeated record, who exactly would pay that, what the purpose would be, and how that could possibly be worth the money.

I wasn't suggesting he'd take a dive as much as pointing out how silly the talent discrepancy is.

[Easy Mac]

"The Great White Hype (1996)" Theatrical Trailer - YouTube

[AlexB]

Watching the Bellator card from the weekend, I'm normally OK with injuries but had to watch the Chandler / Primus fight covering up the bottom half of the screen

Man, that was horrible, and to keep trying to bounce, run, strike... yeeesh.

[Suicane75]

Don't know what was worse, the ankle or the girl shitting herself on the UFC show.

[dubb93]

Originally Posted by Suicane75

Don't know what was worse, the ankle or the girl shitting herself on the UFC show.

The girl that shit herself was much worse than the ankle. The ankle will heal. Shitting yourself is forever.

[PilotMan]

And the UFC loses another main event just hours before it starts. Not good.

[Suicane75]

Eh the heavyweight fight was what 90% of the audience considered the real main event anyway. I doubt too many people are chucking their remotes at the screen over this.

[PilotMan]

Main Event is the main event. It's a big fight off the card. Whether or not it was a big draw or not isn't necessarily relevant as it's another card where the top billing is yanked for one reason or another.

[Suicane75]

Well it's very relevant in as much as how many purchases it will affect.

[bhlloy]

The greatest

[Toddzilla]

Wow, indeed.

and calling out Lesnar at the end was the perfect ending.

[PilotMan]

It's a page out of the McGregor playbook. It's great for those Benjamins, but it doesn't benefit the sport. Lesnar is good for the draw. He means nothing in the cage, especially at 41, he's over the hill. Rocky got paid for his fight against Thunderlips too. Sounds good, means nothing.

[bhlloy]

There's no way that wasn't a prerequisite for Dana letting Jones back into the cage. I give you another chance, you give me a super fight if you win.

[PilotMan]

Jones has owned 205. He's been hinting at a move to HW for a long while and we all knew he'd end up there eventually. Dana needs him to move up. He should have called out Miocic. HW is in need of that big name to stir the pot a little. Jones/Miocic could be massive.

[CrescentMoonie]

Nonsense. Jones vs Lesnar is the obvious match to make. It lets 2 of the top 5 PPV draws in UFC history face off while allowing Miocic to have one more defense before facing the winner. It will do a good 500k to 1m more buys than Jones/Miocic would do right now.

[BYU 14]

Lesnar belongs in the cage with Jones as much McGregor does in the ring with Mayweather. Let's turn all this shit into professional wrestling. How about just make the fight with Miocic and spare us the cash grab.

[CrescentMoonie]

Because that's so absurdly tone deaf to both what the crowd wants and what all sports have always been about.

[PilotMan]

Not really, the only thing about Lesnar is the draw. Ten years ago, with a healthy Lesnar, now you're talking something, but not now. He was irrelevant in the Hunt fight. I mean, the end result didn't impact the state of the HW division at all going forward. Lesnar came back for UFC 200 against a guy stylistically he could handle. Hunt was similar aged, highly ranked and a tough dude. That's a challenge, and it did put asses in seats, but it was never the main course, never sold to us as something more than it was. It was Lesnar coming back for one more appearance, because of who he was, against a guy he might beat, or he would get KO'd again.

The UFC got to where it is by putting good fights together and bypassing all the promoter bullshit. Guys fought who they fought on merit and the storylines progressed naturally. Sure Bellator can make money throwing out Sonnen/Silva, or Slice/Dada5000, but it kills the sport. Guys are making money with their mouths instead of in the cage. Conor is the perfect example, he's made way more money with his mouth than any other UFC fighter, ever. His only saving grace is that he's never shied away from a fight. This peck and choose method of booking then justifying it with because it's what the fans demand is stupid. Mike Tyson should be in the ring getting title shots left and right, because it's what the fans demand.

The UFC is taking a real hit from the actual fans of the sport by trying to launch GSP straight into a title fight at 185, a weight he said he'd never fight at, and frankly isn't suited to anymore. Hell, I'm pretty sure Tyron Woodley would kick his ass at 170. The UFC has put the cashflow above the athlete, like boxing before it. Lesnar has no business headlining a fight with Jones. It means nothing for Jones if he beats him. We know Jones, can probably handle 99% of guys at HW with no problem at all. He'll be much to quick for them, and his unorthodox style and great skills are a nightmare for anyone. Lesnar in the WWE isn't even the guy he used to be. Time catches us all, but damn, a fight like this is see through. Lesnar loses nothing with a loss, he's still irrelevant, and old at the fighting game. Jones gets a W against a guy who isn't even ranked and is still serving out drug ban. Then what a title fight? Why not call out Hafþór Júlíus Björnsson? People would pay for that fight too, but it doesn't mean anything in the Octogon.

[CrescentMoonie]

Jon Jones doesn't deserve a HW title fight.
Jon Jones doesn't deserve a HW top 10 fight.
Jon Jones lost the first two rounds to Cormier last night before winning with a spectacular KO.

Brock Lesnar doesn't deserve a HW title fight.
Brock Lesnar doesn't deserve a HW top 10 fight.

It's a perfect chance to let Lesnar have a full camp and see if he's still got it while also letting Jones get a look at how he feels fighting at a more natural weight without screwing other guys in the rankings who have earned their shot. It's also the right fight to make because it's the big money fight. Anyone who is in a short term career like a combat sport for a reason other than making as much money as possible is stupid.

Lesnar's WWE contract isn't up until WM. If WWE takes the title off of him at SS then I'm guessing we'll see him fight Jones around Christmas or New Year's. If not, I would think he would fight Jones next summer and JJ would fight Oezdemir for the LHW title later this year.

Anything that has Jones fighting Miocic right away, or even someone like Cain, JDS, or Werdum is the wrong thing to do. He hasn't earned it and it won't make the money that his HW debut should.

[CrescentMoonie]

Originally Posted by PilotMan

The UFC got to where it is by putting good fights together and bypassing all the promoter bullshit.

Tell that to guys like Jon Fitch while no talent hacks like Sonnen and the Diaz brothers talked their way into the biggest fights over and over. UFC took off when they realized what they were and started promoting it that way instead of focusing on the good fights that nearly went out of business.

[BYU 14]

Originally Posted by CrescentMoonie

Because that's so absurdly tone deaf to both what the crowd wants and what all sports have always been about.

Sports have always been about creating a circus? Did you only start watching sports 5 years ago? Go youtube Hagler/Hearns, Pryor/Arguello or the Ward/Gatti triology and get back to me on that.

[PilotMan]

Originally Posted by CrescentMoonie

Anything that has Jones fighting Miocic right away, or even someone like Cain, JDS, or Werdum is the wrong thing to do. He hasn't earned it and it won't make the money that his HW debut should.

A guy who has never been beaten in the octogon, beaten not DQ'd, in 9 years. A guy who has headlined his last 11 PPV's. You're literally smoking crack right now.

[PilotMan]

Originally Posted by CrescentMoonie

Tell that to guys like Jon Fitch while no talent hacks like Sonnen and the Diaz brothers talked their way into the biggest fights over and over. UFC took off when they realized what they were and started promoting it that way instead of focusing on the good fights that nearly went out of business.

Fitch has gone 6-3 since he was fired, and he was 1-2-1 in his last 4 UFC fights. In all of those wins, only 1 didn't end up in a decision. This is not the record of a guy making it.

You're complaining about the exact thing you're espousing. You're right, those guys fucking talk. At least the Diaz boys mix it up. Sonnen is a joke. That is part of the problem, that's exactly why Lesnar should be a non-starter in any conversation.

[Ryche]

Does Lesnar not face an 8 month ban before he can fight again?

[CrescentMoonie]

Originally Posted by Ryche

Does Lesnar not face an 8 month ban before he can fight again?

I believe his ban runs out in mid to late December.

[Suicane75]

Jones/Lesner should absolutely be the next fight for both men if they agree to it. To argue otherwise is missing the entire point of business. UFC needs to load both that card, and St. Pierre/Bisping with undercards that feature good, personal fighters cause their are going to be millions of eyeballs on those shows.

[booradley]

Originally Posted by CrescentMoonie

Tell that to guys like Jon Fitch while no talent hacks like Sonnen and the Diaz brothers talked their way into the biggest fights over and over. UFC took off when they realized what they were and started promoting it that way instead of focusing on the good fights that nearly went out of business.

John Fitch. Is he still kicking around? He was a good fighter but haven't seen him in a long time.

[booradley]

Originally Posted by booradley

John Fitch. Is he still kicking around? He was a good fighter but haven't seen him in a long time.

He is (I looked it up on my interwebs)! WSOF mostly. 4 wins on the trot, including a UD over Jake Shields.

[thesloppy]

Screw Jon Fitch. He's the human cure for insomnia, and he was popped for PEDs after being a vocal critic. He should go hump Ben Askren for the rest of his career, somewhere far away from my television.

[molson]

Originally Posted by CrescentMoonie

I believe his ban runs out in mid to late December.

There's been conflicting reports about whether Lesnar has re-entered the USADA testing pool. We do know from the USADA website that he hasn't been tested yet. Until he jumps back in, the suspension doesn't even move. And I'm not sure if Lesnar can keep his WWE physique at his age without the extra help, and he still has commitments to them through April. (though on the other hand, he doesn't necessarily have to be clean to get through another UFC payday, he just has to not get caught cheating until after the fight, like last time)

I think this was planting longer term seeds. Hopefully Jones still defends his title first. Gustafsson is a legit challenger. And Volkan Oezdemir seems to have ridiculous power and now there's nobody ahead of him in the light heavyweight division besides Jones, Gustafsson, and Cormier.

[CrescentMoonie]

Excellent card last night. 7 first round finishes to tie the record for Fight Night cards. The co-main and main event were both good fights as well.

[PilotMan]

Jon Jones has failed another drug test. He's going to be stripped..again.

hxxp://deadspin.com/reports-jon-jones-fails-yet-another-doping-test-1798329624

[JonInMiddleGA]

Jon Jones failed drug test at UFC 214, UFC president Dana White says

[Suicane75]

Good god, what a waste of a life.

[bhlloy]

This might be the thing that pushes me away from UFC for good to be honest, not to be too dramatic about it. Been far more of a casual fan over the last couple of years with all the great cards that end up crappy because of withdrawals and the sunsetting of a lot of the big names without many to replace them (and as entertaining as he is I don't count McGregor yet) but that last card got me back into it a little bit.

It was awesome to see Jones back and that knockout was up there with some of the great moments in the sport I've seen live, if it turns out he was doping for it... just ugh

[PilotMan]

I really, really hope they filmed DC's reaction to the news again. I can't imagine. If Jones wanted to spend his entire career to just troll DC, this is the absolute biggest way to do it.

[BYU 14]

Wow