POTUS 2024 - Harris vs Trump - General Election Discussion

[GrantDawg]

Originally Posted by Thomkal

graham didn't have a problem with the calls for Mike pence to be hung on jan 6, but now he does?

Favorite line this week "They say they are eating lap dogs. Doesn't Lindsey Graham feel nervous?"

[Sweed]

Originally Posted by Atocep

Trump worked with Israel on a peace plan that would have effecitvely been an annexationof Gaza. He's also said Israel is being too cautious and taking too long. If theyre going to do this it needs to be quicker and they need to see it through to the end. Trump also has zero political pressure from his party for anything other than full support for Israel, while multiple dems have said they would support halting or putting conditions on further weapon shipments if the administration feels it's needed. Bibi also isnt pushing for Trump to win the election so that they can stop receiving weapons.




Misstating people's stance on something to frame them as pro genocide and telling them they see people as something less than human is going to get reactions.

Originally Posted by Atocep

He has such a strong desire to be right that he's creating enemies out of people that largely agree with him just so he can tell them they were wrong at some point in the future.

Originally Posted by Fidatelo

I think this quote really gets to the crux of the issue more than any other. RM's advocacy for ending the war is admirable, but there is definitely a strong whiff of schadenfreude that emanates from his posts.

Originally Posted by PilotMan

Agreed. He's a victim of his own passions, and like trumps followers they love to be miserable. Go back and read the 2020 election thread. He was the most miserable sob around, and never knows when to take a W or accept a L.

Agree with all of this.

[Thomkal]

Originally Posted by GrantDawg

Favorite line this week "They say they are eating lap dogs. Doesn't Lindsey Graham feel nervous?"

Ha! He should be very nervous then

[JPhillips]

Chris Rufo has a video of what he says are immigrants from Congo in Dayton grilling what may or may not be cats, so JD Vance wasn't lying.

[Lathum]

Originally Posted by JPhillips

Chris Rufo has a video of what he says are immigrants from Congo in Dayton grilling what may or may not be cats, so JD Vance wasn't lying.

It’s really something else. They choose to believe some shaky, grainy, video from a Twitter grifter over the mayor and governor. We truly are fucked.

[Atocep]

Whatever outlandish shit Trump says, MAGA has to run around trying to find evidence of it to prove he was right all along. If he said Mexicans were smuggling chupacabras over the border for Haitans to eat we'd have chupacabra footage by now.

[NobodyHere]

Are we sure that it isn't RFK Jr running around eating our pets? That sounds like it could be a true RFK Jr story.

[Atocep]

Originally Posted by NobodyHere

Are we sure that it isn't RFK Jr running around eating our pets?

Dude, he's white.

[NobodyHere]

Originally Posted by Atocep

Dude, he's white.

Maybe his brain worm is from Central America?

[Atocep]

Originally Posted by NobodyHere

Maybe his brain worm is from Central America?

A migrant worm coming in and stealing a hard working American worm's job.

[Lathum]

I’m taking it with a grain of salt because I don’t want to be guilty of the same thing the right does. I’m seeing on Twitter Loomer is now banned from trumps plane and anything campaign related. If this is true the backlash will be glorious.

[RainMaker]

I'm guessing Haitians are fair game again since Florida isn't a swing state anymore. There was a stretch where they cut that shit back because of Florida.

[RainMaker]

I thought the "Trump is having an affair with Loomer" was just a fun thing to joke about, but the fact he defended her and didn't just throw her under the bus like everyone else in his life makes me wonder.

[GrantDawg]

Springfield, Ohio's Haitian community wakes up to smashed widows and acid thrown on their cars. MSNBC

— Michael Grossman (@MichaelArt123) September 14, 2024

[Brian Swartz]

Originally Posted by Atocep

Trump worked with Israel on a peace plan that would have effecitvely been an annexationof Gaza. He's also said Israel is being too cautious and taking too long. If theyre going to do this it needs to be quicker and they need to see it through to the end. Trump also has zero political pressure from his party for anything other than full support for Israel, while multiple dems have said they would support halting or putting conditions on further weapon shipments if the administration feels it's needed. Bibi also isnt pushing for Trump to win the election so that they can stop receiving weapons.

I don't see the relevance of any of this. The point is that there's nothing about Harris that indicates she's going to cut off aid.

Originally Posted by Atocep

Misstating people's stance on something to frame them as pro genocide and telling them they see people as something less than human is going to get reactions.

Show me where he's misstating people's stance? I've seen a lot more of the forum mistating his stance than I've seen of that. Again, there's a pattern here. One that as someone who used to be targeted by it and still is on occasion if I wade into the 'wrong topics', I easily recognize, but ofc it's been aimed at more people than just me.

As a specific and relevant example:

Originally Posted by Rainmaker

There is no evidence she will do anything to stop the war crimes. She has nearly identical views to Biden on Israel and has stated such. And those views are identical to Trump's. They will give Israel whatever they want, no questions asked.

Which part of that is false?

[Atocep]

Originally Posted by RainMaker

I thought the "Trump is having an affair with Loomer" was just a fun thing to joke about, but the fact he defended her and didn't just throw her under the bus like everyone else in his life makes me wonder.

I was sold after seeing a compilation of the physical contact, the looks they give each other, and other stuff. They're 100% fucking. Milo is anything but reliable but he's tweeting that it's happening now too.

[NobodyHere]

Family Values!

[Thomkal]

Originally Posted by Atocep

I was sold after seeing a compilation of the physical contact, the looks they give each other, and other stuff. They're 100% fucking. Milo is anything but reliable but he's tweeting that it's happening now too.

I think the American public needs a full interview with Ms loomer-spare no details.

[Sweed]

Originally Posted by Brian Swartz

Show me where he's misstating people's stance? I've seen a lot more of the forum mistating his stance than I've seen of that. Again, there's a pattern here. One that as someone who used to be targeted by it and still is on occasion if I wade into the 'wrong topics', I easily recognize, but ofc it's been aimed at more people than just me.

Originally Posted by RainMaker

No one should compromise on genocide. And the plan is very coherent. Stop sending weapons to a far-right ethnostate that is committing a genocide. It's not that complicated.

Liberals don't understand the position because they don't really stand for anything and don't view Muslims as people. They don't understand that a large number of people find genocide to be repulsive.


Edit: Sorry, liberals care about Muslims when a Republican is in office. We'll be on the same side of this argument in a few months if Trump wins. So don't get too worked up about it.

Is it misstating if he puts a whole group on both sides depending on who's in office? That seems more offensive than just saying liberals don't view Muslims as people, or don't find genocide repulsive all of the time. One requires the liberal to take into account what party is in power before deciding Muslims aren't people. That's a pretty horrible thing to say, isn't it?

Not sure how anyone would take a liberal responding to this drivel as "picking on" RainMaker. If that's your opinion your entitled, I'll simply have to disagree.

[Brian Swartz]

Originally Posted by Sweed

Not sure how anyone would take a liberal responding to this drivel as "picking on" RainMaker. If that's your opinion your entitled, I'll simply have to disagree.

That depends on the nature of the response. I don't really know what you're referring to here; I didn't use the phrase 'picking on' and I'm unsure which of my statements, if any, that refers to.

Originally Posted by Sweed

Is it misstating if he puts a whole group on both sides depending on who's in office?

Not if that's actually the case. Whether it's a horrible thing to say is not an issue to me. Whether it's an accurate thing to say is. In general, I'd say something is more important to say if it is both accurate and horrible.

Take some examples that have come up on this forum; the rhetoric surrounding the border with Mexico under Trump, both what was said and who was saying it. Then, under similar actual circumstances, said rhetoric under Biden. To put the shoe on the other foot, the examples that have been rightfully cited of Republicans criticizing policies that were exactly what they were trying to do when in power. Immigration and health care being a couple of prominent examples but not the only ones.

Goes right back to what I talked about around here when Trump was president, and people said it was appropriate to criticize everything he did, including decisions they would approve of if done by someone else, because he's Trump and he's horrible and he's doing it for the wrong reasons and he must be defeated. At which point I said 'ok, just don't be surprised when people treat Biden the same way'.

I'd say there's a long history of this kind of thing, it's natural but still important to recognize when our responses are being skewed by the person/party doing something and not the actual facts/policies involved.
Certainly not limited to this forum but it does happen a lot around here, and there's nothing wrong or misstating about pointing it out.

[RainMaker]

Originally Posted by SirFozzie

Rain, I don't think I've said this to many folks, but you are hard core in a left-wing echo chamber when it comes to this issue (and I understand how personal this issue is, but I strenuously disagree with your viewpoint.)

What echo chamber? Most of you regurgitate everything the Democratic Party puts out. They can do no wrong. Even when their positions were the very same things you complained about Trump doing over four years ago. I didn't magically change my stance in January 2021 like some of you.

A lot of talk about Trump supporters being a cult, but Blue MAGA is one too. It's not a cult of personality, it's a cult against a personality. There is no line you can't cross as long as it's to stop Trump. And I think it's caused many of you to support horrific things and lose objectivenss. The fact the party is essentially 2003 Republicans I think should be a wakeup call.

I don't take it personally though. My beliefs are my beliefs and I'm not changing them to "help my team win". The Overton window has shifted enough. And I would hope many here don't actually believe the things they say. I hope people didn't actually think Joe Biden was perfectly fine a few months ago and snapped when people pointed out the obvious. I would hope that Pilotman doesn't actually believe that an innocent child in Gaza "deserves" to be killed as he insinuated a few pages ago. But at a time where politics are treated as a sport, it's tough to tell what people actually believe and what's just spin to protect their team.

[GrantDawg]

These people are insane.

This is what happens when the House GOP has a long weekend pic.twitter.com/YUFps0MGhn

— Jamie Dupree (@jamiedupree) September 15, 2024

[JPhillips]

FFS

Sen. JD Vance (R-OH) in responding to question from CNN this morning about dog and cat eating in Springfield, "..If I have to I create stories so that the American media actually pays attention to the suffering of the American people, then that's what I'm going to do..."

[Lathum]

So he's admitting it was all made up?

[Sweed]

Originally Posted by Brian Swartz

That depends on the nature of the response. I don't really know what you're referring to here; I didn't use the phrase 'picking on' and I'm unsure which of my statements, if any, that refers to.



Not if that's actually the case. Whether it's a horrible thing to say is not an issue to me. Whether it's an accurate thing to say is. In general, I'd say something is more important to say if it is both accurate and horrible.

Take some examples that have come up on this forum; the rhetoric surrounding the border with Mexico under Trump, both what was said and who was saying it. Then, under similar actual circumstances, said rhetoric under Biden. To put the shoe on the other foot, the examples that have been rightfully cited of Republicans criticizing policies that were exactly what they were trying to do when in power. Immigration and health care being a couple of prominent examples but not the only ones.

Goes right back to what I talked about around here when Trump was president, and people said it was appropriate to criticize everything he did, including decisions they would approve of if done by someone else, because he's Trump and he's horrible and he's doing it for the wrong reasons and he must be defeated. At which point I said 'ok, just don't be surprised when people treat Biden the same way'.

I'd say there's a long history of this kind of thing, it's natural but still important to recognize when our responses are being skewed by the person/party doing something and not the actual facts/policies involved.
Certainly not limited to this forum but it does happen a lot around here, and there's nothing wrong or misstating about pointing it out.

To me targeted, your phrase, or picked on, the one I used is just semantics. But feel free to replace "picked on" in my post with "targeting" if it makes you feel better. Arguing that point, to me, is a nonstarter.

If you want to go there feel free to replace "liberal" with "conservative" and I'll
say it's just as wrong. If Jon responded to that type of post I wouldn't accuse him of targeting the writer of that kind of drivel.

You asked and got a response, I'm not sure what else to say, his words in the post I quoted speak for themself.

[Ben E Lou]

This man has lost what's left of his mind. https://t.co/emqBoQ5Toh

— TheValuesVoter (Also on Threads and BlueSky) (@TheValuesVoter) September 15, 2024

[JPhillips]

The reason I'm done engaging with RM is because he can't see anyone as having a different opinion or that facts can be different than whet he accepts. Multiple times I've received a response like, You don't really believe that you just don't care about genocide. After enough of that, I have no interest in trying to discuss anything with him.

[RainMaker]

Originally Posted by Ben E Lou

This man has lost what's left of his mind. https://t.co/emqBoQ5Toh

— TheValuesVoter (Also on Threads and BlueSky) (@TheValuesVoter) September 15, 2024

I guess that's one way to get them to stop talking about your madeup cat eating story.

[Danny]

Originally Posted by JPhillips

The reason I'm done engaging with RM is because he can't see anyone as having a different opinion or that facts can be different than whet he accepts. Multiple times I've received a response like, You don't really believe that you just don't care about genocide. After enough of that, I have no interest in trying to discuss anything with him.

Yeah. Anytime someone brings up another issue and how Trump over Kamala will negatively (in some cases majorly) effect their lives, he brings up the genocide and that those issues dont matter. Its just as easy to say RainMaker doesnt see women,trans, black people, or non heterosexuals (among many other groups) as people.

[Ksyrup]

I assume that's Trump's desperate attempt to ruin her career since she endorsed Harris. I'm sure losing the 40-70 year old men demo is going to be devastating.

[molson]

Originally Posted by JPhillips

The reason I'm done engaging with RM is because he can't see anyone as having a different opinion or that facts can be different than whet he accepts. Multiple times I've received a response like, You don't really believe that you just don't care about genocide. After enough of that, I have no interest in trying to discuss anything with him.

I came to the same conclusion at some point. When I check back in here occasionally and think about the all of the conversations I've sat out on, it actually fills me with a sense of calm. Which then eventually led me to feeling good about moving away from those kinds of online discussions generally.

I don't know what people who continue to engage with him hope to accomplish, but it should be more than clear by now - he doesn't respect anyone's opinion, he has a deep resentment for everyone, he thinks he's the smartest person in the world on every single topic, he doesn't think anyone else's experience or perspective have any value to anything, and, while I can't speak to the sincerity of his views (like he can for everyone else), he is not actually doing anything productive to further them here. Instead FOFC is just the Rainmaker show now, we're all guests on his platform and soapbox he uses to berate and insult everyone and be just a general massive cock.

What a miserable fuck. Just a dark cloud of misery which continues to draw other people in. Which is morbidly fascinating in a way, for a while, wondering how someone became this way. Until he starts yelling at good people about supporting genocide or not seeing people as humans or whatever, and then it's just, fuck off dude, what is your fucking deal? What is the goal here? He does provide a perfect encapsulation of online toxicity which maybe should be studied somewhere.

There's too many other positive things in the world to spend energy on, and ways to help others. And you can do that AND engage with crazies online of course, but, christ almighty, the older I get, the more that energy comes at a premium, and the more important it is to rid yourself of harmful and unproductive things.

[NobodyHere]

[PilotMan]

Originally Posted by molson

What a miserable fuck.

I was typing something similar the other day, but deleted it like so many other comments. There's nothing positive in anything he posts. Just anger and misery. You nailed it.

[Ben E Lou]

Trump campaign is claiming shots fired at Trump International Golf Course where he is today.

[Ben E Lou]

{removed. may not be accurate}

[PilotMan]

Originally Posted by RainMaker

What echo chamber? Most of you regurgitate everything the Democratic Party puts out. They can do no wrong. Even when their positions were the very same things you complained about Trump doing over four years ago. I didn't magically change my stance in January 2021 like some of you.

A lot of talk about Trump supporters being a cult, but Blue MAGA is one too. It's not a cult of personality, it's a cult against a personality. There is no line you can't cross as long as it's to stop Trump. And I think it's caused many of you to support horrific things and lose objectivenss. The fact the party is essentially 2003 Republicans I think should be a wakeup call.

I don't take it personally though. My beliefs are my beliefs and I'm not changing them to "help my team win". The Overton window has shifted enough. And I would hope many here don't actually believe the things they say. I hope people didn't actually think Joe Biden was perfectly fine a few months ago and snapped when people pointed out the obvious. I would hope that Pilotman doesn't actually believe that an innocent child in Gaza "deserves" to be killed as he insinuated a few pages ago. But at a time where politics are treated as a sport, it's tough to tell what people actually believe and what's just spin to protect their team.

I believe that war is awful and that in this case, the 'side' I take is the one that is of the best benefit to the United States of America. The country I live in, and the country I want to be the best in the world. You can't save every baby in the world, you can't do everything for everyone. You can only play the cards you've got.



There's no 'save all the women and children in Gaza' card here. There's only the 'protect your allies' option because unfortunately that's the nature of the region. If you want to spend your final days pointing out all the injustices in the world, and you want to point out that your country perpetrates some of those, that's fine. But if you want the focus to only be on those, and you want to lose your fucking mind every time you think about it, don't be shocked when people get fed up with it.

The world you live in today has been molded and shaped by violence, injustice, and awful, terrible and too many arbitrary things. We do our best to be the change we want to see, but it's far from perfect, and bad shit happens all the time. I do love how Hamas, and decades upon decades of violence and terror against Israel is of no concern on what has happened there now. You can only kick a hornets nest so many times. The final chapter will ultimately be written by those who live to see it.

We are constantly fed that retribution is called for when you've been provoked too many times. We see it in movies, shows, documentaries, whatever. If your family is hurt, you want justice. I tend to believe that pov. Overwhelming, destructive violence as payback happens all the time. It's a deterrent on personal level all the way to the global stage. I tend to think that in this case, it's not beyond the pale, and I think the vast majority of people in the US feel that way too.

Blue MAGA? Get the fuck out dude. Seriously. No line that can't be crossed to stop trump? What does that mean? Is this cult out there plotting his death en masse? Support for Israel, in this case, means selling out convictions and morals? Not even close man. Nice try. Not even close. I think you need a wake up call, your perspective is off as usual.

[RainMaker]

Originally Posted by PilotMan

Blue MAGA? Get the fuck out dude. Seriously. No line that can't be crossed to stop trump? What does that mean? Is this cult out there plotting his death en masse? Support for Israel, in this case, means selling out convictions and morals? Not even close man. Nice try. Not even close. I think you need a wake up call, your perspective is off as usual.

Yeah, I think when you're at the point where you're saying kids "deserve" to be killed because you can't criticize your party you're either in a cult or just have no moral compass and a piece of shit. Take your pick.

Based on your post history, I have a pretty good idea which one it is and I'm happy I don't agree with you on this kind of stuff.

[Ben E Lou]

Originally Posted by Ben E Lou

{removed. may not be accurate}




[RainMaker]

Originally Posted by Ben E Lou




CNN reporting that Secret Service returned fire. So either it was shots at him, or someone chose the worst spot imaginable to fire their weapon.

[Ben E Lou]

Some indication that possibly it wasn't "returned" fire, but that the Secret Service fired first when they saw a weapon.

[GrantDawg]

The FBI just reported they are on the scene and are investigating this as an attempted assignation of Trump.

[PilotMan]

Originally Posted by RainMaker

Yeah, I think when you're at the point where you're saying kids "deserve" to be killed because you can't criticize your party you're either in a cult or just have no moral compass and a piece of shit. Take your pick.

Based on your post history, I have a pretty good idea which one it is and I'm happy I don't agree with you on this kind of stuff.

Not me brother. You're at the GWB "either your with us or against us" phase of your life. I didn't say kids deserve to be killed. You did. I said people get the leaders they deserve. But sure, tell us more how we're all genocide supporting degenerates with no moral compass. My point stands.

[GrantDawg]

Sounds like the guy was in an ambush postion pointing a rifle with a scope onto the course when the Secret Service spotted him and fired. He did get back to his car, but was arrested a short time later. They also said there was a GoPro on the gun.

[cuervo72]

When you don’t get enough polling juice from the first assassination attempt, order up another!

[RainMaker]

Originally Posted by PilotMan

Not me brother. You're at the GWB "either your with us or against us" phase of your life. I didn't say kids deserve to be killed. You did. I said people get the leaders they deserve. But sure, tell us more how we're all genocide supporting degenerates with no moral compass. My point stands.

I'm sure those kids had a huge say in their leadership elected 16 years ago. And yes, you described yourself perfectly.

[RainMaker]

Originally Posted by GrantDawg

Sounds like the guy was in an ambush postion pointing a rifle with a scope onto the course when the Secret Service spotted him and fired. He did get back to his car, but was arrested a short time later. They also said there was a GoPro on the gun.

Is there any word on if he got a shot off or if Trump was even in the vicinity? Described as a 60-year old.

[Danny]

Im far from an expert but Ive taken ai increased interest in political discussion but im done with that here now. This is the Rainmaker thread and its disruptive to any reasonable discussion. Back to sports only threads or nothing for me here.

[RainMaker]

You can just block people instead of having a temper tantrum whenever someone doesn't post a DNC approved position.

[Flasch186]

Ah I Remember all of this some time ago with another domineering poster taking over fofc


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[thesloppy]

Originally Posted by RainMaker

You can just block people instead of having a temper tantrum whenever someone doesn't post a DNC approved position.

Blocking people is useless. Replies/quotes still display blocked user's content.