Werewolf XXXVII: Middle-Earth - GAME ENDS. Who Won? Check it out!

[Alan T]

So it looks like we got lucky on day 1. Trying to understand what Anxiety posts, it looks like he was on Saruman's side or perhaps was Saruman himself.

Saruman for those who did not know came over as the greatest of the maia, he was the head of the white council (the leader of the wizards and in some ways Gandalf's greater). Saruman however was twisted to the dark side, his hunger for power and longing for it basically caused him to twist his desires for evil.

[Abe Sargent]

As an aside, I would never have allowed you to vote and spend a da voting for someone who may not have even signed up for the game. Scoobz responded to yesterday's pm and even asked me a question about his role. He was in this game.

-Anxiety

[Alan T]

Originally Posted by BrianD

Does that mean he was one of Saruman's?

From the description, the voice, his presence.. I think he was Saruman himself.

Saruman was most known for his commanding voice, and the power it held.

[DaddyTorgo]

"nothing to connect him to any dark lord" seems to me to indicate he was a good guy, although "fallen into shadow" ...maybe means just not a ranger or a "devout" but more of a "middleground" good-guy?

[BrianD]

Well, we walked away with a feeling of victory so he must have been a bad guy.

[ntndeacon]

I was thinking he was an independent bad guy with his own victory conditions.

[DaddyTorgo]

Originally Posted by Alan T

From the description, the voice, his presence.. I think he was Saruman himself.

Saruman was most known for his commanding voice, and the power it held.

but then you think we'd find SOMETHING indicating he was saruman.

although you're right...the voice...the smile as he dies, does remind me of Curumo.

[Alan T]

On Page 1, he was listed as Silvos the dark adept. Needless to say, that is a fake name too. So I am pretty convinced most people if not all have fake names in this game. THe description still leads me to think it was the Saruman type role, but guess only time will tell. Either way I think this was a huge kill for us today. Nice for luck to turn out on our side for once.

[Abe Sargent]

As much fun as it is to read your speculation, may I remind you that name, side, role title and faction are revealed upon death in the roster post.

[Alan T]

Originally Posted by DaddyTorgo

but then you think we'd find SOMETHING indicating he was saruman.

although you're right...the voice...the smile as he dies, does remind me of Curumo.

Curunir

[Alan T]

Originally Posted by Anxiety

As much fun as it is to read your speculation, may I remind you that name, side, role title and faction are revealed upon death in the roster post.

I was madly hitting F5!

[Abe Sargent]

I'm out to get some late dinner. Be back later.

[DaddyTorgo]

Originally Posted by Alan T

Curunir

Curumo...the name in High Quenya of the Maia who came to Middle Earth as Saruman....Curunir was in Sindarin

[SnDvls]

Originally Posted by Anxiety

5. Scoobz0202 - Lynched Day One. Silvos the Dark Adept, on the side of darkness.

for those that don't want to go to page #1

[Lorena]

I have seen a new level of geekdom

[DaddyTorgo]

Originally Posted by Dodgerchick

I have seen a new level of geekdom

at least i'm not my friend who can speak Quenya (although I am jealous of her...but she's also a linguist)

[Jonathan Ezarik]

But is she cunning? (Sorry, I couldn't resist)

[Alan T]

Originally Posted by DaddyTorgo

Curumo...the name in High Quenya of the Maia who came to Middle Earth as Saruman....Curunir was in Sindarin

Guess I am not familiar with the name Curumo then! I know Olorin was Gandalf's name in the far west, but I don't remember Curumo off the top of my head. I guess I need a refresher too

[DaddyTorgo]

Originally Posted by Alan T

Guess I am not familiar with the name Curumo then! I know Olorin was Gandalf's name in the far west, but I don't remember Curumo off the top of my head. I guess I need a refresher too

that's okay. not like High Quenya is really....used by any except the Ainur. I'm telling you though man...as far as reference...the Encyclopedia of Arda is AMAZING. So helpful, and quite cannonical.

[saldana]

Originally Posted by Alan T

Its like you only read half of my posts. The same half that Blade read. I also equated the disorder to similar to the characters Boromir, Frodo, Bilbo, Ilsidur all showed symptoms of it at time, all directly due to the ring's influences.

Its pretty interesting how you take one tiny part of the information and then try to distort it all and make a huge overblown deal out of it all. I've stated for the record that I don't even know if Gollum is in this game, or if a character similar to him is in this game. You however have chosen to ignore that. You also ignored the part where I said in the story timeline Gollum couldn't be in Bree at this time. You have however tried to take what I have said and try to make me sound like I am leading a lynch mob for Blade here.

It sounds and feels like a pretty wolfish thing to do in my opinion, and pretty unlike you for day 1.

actually alan, this is the other issue i had with what you were saying all day....the draw of the ring and the lure of power that affected isuldur, boromir and bilbo were hardly the same as the affect that it had on Gollum. The affect the one ring had on Smeagol when he killed Deagol is the same as everyone else, but no one else had a completely second personality develop as a result of possessing the ring. it was always my understanding that the second personality was a result of his isolation for 500 years, and had nothing to actually do with the ring.....again, this is kind of a dork semantic argument, but what set my radar off was that you were giving out information as fact that there is no proof of.

[KWhit]

Originally Posted by DaddyTorgo

"nothing to connect him to any dark lord" seems to me to indicate he was a good guy, although "fallen into shadow" ...maybe means just not a ranger or a "devout" but more of a "middleground" good-guy?

Kind of an evil middle-manager?

[LoneStarGirl]

Ok, I thought we didn't have to know any LOTR to play this game. I haven't seen any of the movies, or read any of the books and I am feeling so very lost.

[LoneStarGirl]

And this is the second time in as many games that we have killed a bad guy the first night. How lucky can you get? And if he messaged anxiety with a question about the game, i wonder why he never checked in?

[DaddyTorgo]

Originally Posted by LoneStarGirl

Ok, I thought we didn't have to know any LOTR to play this game. I haven't seen any of the movies, or read any of the books and I am feeling so very lost.

you don't need to LSG. we're just delving into geekdom. but at heart you can still play it like a WW game, evaluate people based on voting history and statements and who they finger.

[DaddyTorgo]

Originally Posted by KWhit

Kind of an evil middle-manager?

Yeah umm...I'm going to have to go ahead and ask you to come in on Saturday...

[Abe Sargent]

Originally Posted by LoneStarGirl

Ok, I thought we didn't have to know any LOTR to play this game. I haven't seen any of the movies, or read any of the books and I am feeling so very lost.

This is an important point and I wanted to address it officially. You don't. Some people are free to get their geek on as much as they want, but if I say you don't need to know ME through the books or movies, then I won't be bringing up obscure History of Middle Earth, Unfinished Tales and Silmarillion references in a game that takes place in Bree.

-Anxiety

[Alan T]

Originally Posted by saldana

actually alan, this is the other issue i had with what you were saying all day....the draw of the ring and the lure of power that affected isuldur, boromir and bilbo were hardly the same as the affect that it had on Gollum. The affect the one ring had on Smeagol when he killed Deagol is the same as everyone else, but no one else had a completely second personality develop as a result of possessing the ring. it was always my understanding that the second personality was a result of his isolation for 500 years, and had nothing to actually do with the ring.....again, this is kind of a dork semantic argument, but what set my radar off was that you were giving out information as fact that there is no proof of.

Most of it is due to Gollum actually posessing the ring for far longer than any of the rest of them, or at least being near it and craving it longer. His mind just couldn't handle it and it eventually corrupted him.

You only saw mild cases of Boromir and Ilsidur allowing the ring to influence their decisions, however Bilbo very clearly started to exhibit symptoms of it in his later years. If Bilbo had not had a retreat to escape to, it possibly would have driven him mad as well.

Gandalf and Galadriel both talk at times about the power of the ring as well. Both perhaps are two of the strongest willed people in the entire stories felt that they would try to do things for good, try to do things for the right reason, but the ring would change who they were and would affect them in the same way.

[Grammaticus]

Originally Posted by LoneStarGirl

And this is the second time in as many games that we have killed a bad guy the first night. How lucky can you get? And if he messaged anxiety with a question about the game, i wonder why he never checked in?

It could have been play style. It is surprising how many people get away from votes by not showing up early in the game.

[Glengoyne]

Originally Posted by Anxiety

Okay, here's a new rule. As of right now, I am banning people who are not playing from posting a vote. If you are not one of the 25 select, I don't want you posting bold votes for people. I've got 25 people to keep track of, and I don't want to accidentally include one of your votes and whatnot.


-Anxiety

Sorry 'bout that. I thought about undoing it, but then it wouldn't be funny . I should have thought again, and I'm sorry I didn't check back until now. I knew better..enough to apologize.

[Abe Sargent]

No prob Glengoyne

[Schmidty]

Originally Posted by BrianD

Well, we walked away with a feeling of victory so he must have been a bad guy.

That's the way I feel.

But feelings are fleeting.

[Fouts]

Nice result on scoobz. I think voting for quiet people makes sense as it forces people to get involved in the game.

[Grammaticus]

Here is a little treat from way back. Spock meets Bilbo Baggins, a little hobbit with a heart of gold.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XC73P...elated&search=

[Izulde]

If I remember correctly, Gandulf pointed out that the ring would corrupt even him, which is why he didn't take it himself.

[Tyrith]

Observations from today, as I was gone most of the day:

- (OOC) We really need to make sure that people that have "signed up" for games have ACTUALLY signed up for games. Maybe making everyone respond to their role PM to verify? This is getting a little silly; it takes any drama out of day 1 when we have to kill people that aren't here.

-This is the reason why I'm not an advocate of a day one lynch here...even though he was bad, what do you want to think that around vote six or so the bad guys started filtering in, seeing the writing on the wall? Someday someone is going to make something out of these votes and that is very dangerous -- they don't really mean anything since Day 1 has no context.

-I don't like the way Alan is going. I know he really, really loves LotR, but having him always directing traffic is out and out dangerous for us. Alan, I know you pulled the psycho scheme last game, and the fact that it worked means you might try to keep pulling it off so eventually you could hide a bad guy role in it. You're on notice.

[Tyrith]

With all the talking about LotR, let me just say this. It's fun. I love LotR a lot too, it's really cool to talk about. However, Anxiety says we don't need to know the stuff for the game, and I trust that we're not going to divine some great secret by talking about the canon. So while I appreciate the enthusiasm we might have, any future attempts to take the outside LotR canon into play, besides insanely obvious stuff, is going to be met by me with extreme suspicion.

[Chief Rum]

Originally Posted by Grammaticus

Here is a little treat from way back. Spock meets Bilbo Baggins, a little hobbit with a heart of gold.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XC73P...elated&search=

Umm...wow. I am speechless. And strangely enough, if I saw it correctly, he was the only one in that who didn't have pointy ears.

[Grammaticus]

Originally Posted by Chief Rum

Umm...wow. I am speechless. And strangely enough, if I saw it correctly, he was the only one in that who didn't have pointy ears.

Freakish

[Chief Rum]

So what is there to take from this?

You might suggest that anyone who didn't vote for scoobz must have been on his side, but I voted for spleen, and I am just a simple hobbit. So clearly we have plenty of baddies hiding in this runaway vote (which is why we try to get two candidates, of course, much the shame we didn't).

On today's little interplay between Alan and Blade and saldana. I think Blade was just being defensive. He is quick to leap to the persecuted act in these games when he feels he might be spotlighted, regardless of his allegiance. So I don't make much of him making a big deal of Alan's posts.

But the fact of the matter is that Alan's posts were essentially informational and provided a number of different perspectives and analyses to take from Blade's roleplay. I didn't get any sense of any bias or suggestion in them whatsoever.

So the over-the-top reactions of Blade and saldana are extremely suspicious to me. I can excuse Blade there (for now), but I can't excuse saldana. I think he went well beyond any reasonable level of post analysis to a level of paranoia I think was very likely fabricated. I think he may have reason to have pushed for this little controversy. To what end, I don't yet know, but it is very suspicious. Overreactions always make me suspicious in this game.

The one thing in saldana's favor is that I recall a similar argument between him and GoldenEagle early in the Tombstone game and they were both good there. So maybe it's just a little zealous over-analysis by saldana. But for lack of better candidates, he's on my short list right now.

[Grammaticus]

Originally Posted by Tyrith

Observations from today, as I was gone most of the day:

- (OOC) We really need to make sure that people that have "signed up" for games have ACTUALLY signed up for games. Maybe making everyone respond to their role PM to verify? This is getting a little silly; it takes any drama out of day 1 when we have to kill people that aren't here.

-This is the reason why I'm not an advocate of a day one lynch here...even though he was bad, what do you want to think that around vote six or so the bad guys started filtering in, seeing the writing on the wall? Someday someone is going to make something out of these votes and that is very dangerous -- they don't really mean anything since Day 1 has no context.

-I don't like the way Alan is going. I know he really, really loves LotR, but having him always directing traffic is out and out dangerous for us. Alan, I know you pulled the psycho scheme last game, and the fact that it worked means you might try to keep pulling it off so eventually you could hide a bad guy role in it. You're on notice.

I'm not sure you are quite caught up yet. As Anxiety posted, Scoobz did respond to his role PM and asked a question about his role. He was playing.

The pile on at vote 6 or whatever comment does not make sense. It took 13 votes to lynch yesterday. Scoobz did not have number 13 until 58 minutes to deadline. By not showing up he almost did escape a lynch. And we nailed a bad guy by lynching on day one. That would not have happened if we chose not to lynch. Yes it is a small chance to hit, but it is the only way we nail bad guys and the reason we have the numbers as the uninformed majority.

[Grammaticus]

Originally Posted by Chief Rum

So what is there to take from this?

You might suggest that anyone who didn't vote for scoobz must have been on his side, but I voted for spleen, and I am just a simple hobbit. So clearly we have plenty of baddies hiding in this runaway vote (which is why we try to get two candidates, of course, much the shame we didn't).

On today's little interplay between Alan and Blade and saldana. I think Blade was just being defensive. He is quick to leap to the persecuted act in these games when he feels he might be spotlighted, regardless of his allegiance. So I don't make much of him making a big deal of Alan's posts.

But the fact of the matter is that Alan's posts were essentially informational and provided a number of different perspectives and analyses to take from Blade's roleplay. I didn't get any sense of any bias or suggestion in them whatsoever.

So the over-the-top reactions of Blade and saldana are extremely suspicious to me. I can excuse Blade there (for now), but I can't excuse saldana. I think he went well beyond any reasonable level of post analysis to a level of paranoia I think was very likely fabricated. I think he may have reason to have pushed for this little controversy. To what end, I don't yet know, but it is very suspicious. Overreactions always make me suspicious in this game.

The one thing in saldana's favor is that I recall a similar argument between him and GoldenEagle early in the Tombstone game and they were both good there. So maybe it's just a little zealous over-analysis by saldana. But for lack of better candidates, he's on my short list right now.

Don't forget there are 2 bad factions. So Sauron's minions could have just as easily been moving to lynch Scoobz without truely "hiding" as they knew he was not one of them.

On the over reaction. Not sure, but it could be a fabricated altercation in order to defuse night action suspicion. Basically Saldana could have pushed back to make a scene so the dark side would have a motive to avoid him as a night kill target.

[Tyrith]

Originally Posted by Grammaticus

I'm not sure you are quite caught up yet. As Anxiety posted, Scoobz did respond to his role PM and asked a question about his role. He was playing.

The pile on at vote 6 or whatever comment does not make sense. It took 13 votes to lynch yesterday. Scoobz did not have number 13 until 58 minutes to deadline. By not showing up he almost did escape a lynch. And we nailed a bad guy by lynching on day one. That would not have happened if we chose not to lynch. Yes it is a small chance to hit, but it is the only way we nail bad guys and the reason we have the numbers as the uninformed majority.

And statistically we could have just as easily, if not more easily, got a good guy, beacuse they can shift votes in manners we can't detect -- by strategically not showing up, for instance. And yes, Ididn't read everything, I apologize, but the thought was brought up throughout the day. I can see the argument for lynchings on day one, and a lot of the time it's a good idea, but to think that we absolutely must be killing people every day even if we have no freaking clue what we're doing seems insane to me.

[Grammaticus]

Originally Posted by Tyrith

And statistically we could have just as easily, if not more easily, got a good guy, beacuse they can shift votes in manners we can't detect -- by strategically not showing up, for instance. And yes, Ididn't read everything, I apologize, but the thought was brought up throughout the day. I can see the argument for lynchings on day one, and a lot of the time it's a good idea, but to think that we absolutely must be killing people every day even if we have no freaking clue what we're doing seems insane to me.

But statistically the good guys have a better chance of winning the overall game by lynching on day one, etc. You are not trying to win the day, you are trying to win the game.

I know it is hard to make the call and things can go wrong. But one thing is for sure, the bad guys will not target one of their own for the night kill.

[Abe Sargent]

Dawn breaks, and with it comes the gloom of another fog filled day, as the mist from the Barrow Downs lingers over Bree. Your rise from the morning with a continued extra spring in your walk, as the events of yesterday still fill you with a sense of justice.

Morning continues like any morning. You have your breakfast, and head out to the center of the town where you are supposed to meet. Shops are open, innkeepers sweep away last night’s revelry, and you think you can sense the air lightening. Surely it can’t be long until the darkness is completely eradicated from your fair town.

Someone notices that the local herbalists, the Mortar and Pestle, is not open. Where is Imelda Francis, the herbalist? She always opens her store on time. She is not at the gathering either. Curious, you knock on her door, to no avail. Several of you have gathered, all wondering what has happened.

The door is not locked, and one of you dares entry. The door opens well enough, and you detect the shoeprints of wet shoes coming out of the store. Imelda must have walked out for the day, leaving early! You sigh a sigh of relief but wonder why she didn’t lock the door.

The group of you almost turns and walks away from the Mortar and Pestle, but one of you wonders out loud. “Why is the door not locked?” Another points out that these footprints are too big for Imelda’s.

With dread in your heart, you burst back into the shop and head for her personal room at the back, where her cot and room are. Upon opening the door, you smell the odor of death. Looking down, her body has been mercilessly stabbed over and over. One of you puts a blanket over her body.

You note that someone washed off the blood in the washbasin, and then walk out. Curiously, you look around but no one has wet hands. Imelda looks dead for several hours, so whoever was here would have had time to dry off.

The new day begins, and with it, shattered hearts as one of your own has died an ugly death.



Fouts has been found dead. Day Two begins and will end at 10:00 pm EST Tuesday.



-Anxiety

[Alan T]

Originally Posted by Tyrith

Observations from today, as I was gone most of the day:

- (OOC) We really need to make sure that people that have "signed up" for games have ACTUALLY signed up for games. Maybe making everyone respond to their role PM to verify? This is getting a little silly; it takes any drama out of day 1 when we have to kill people that aren't here.

-This is the reason why I'm not an advocate of a day one lynch here...even though he was bad, what do you want to think that around vote six or so the bad guys started filtering in, seeing the writing on the wall? Someday someone is going to make something out of these votes and that is very dangerous -- they don't really mean anything since Day 1 has no context.

-I don't like the way Alan is going. I know he really, really loves LotR, but having him always directing traffic is out and out dangerous for us. Alan, I know you pulled the psycho scheme last game, and the fact that it worked means you might try to keep pulling it off so eventually you could hide a bad guy role in it. You're on notice.

Tyrith, I'm not sure how you can say that I am on notice. The other game I tried a style where I came out non stop attacking and pushing people for a vote. I haven't even done that here. I was the one attacked, and simply defended myself. Good grief.

[Chief Rum]

I will be out all day (working both jobs), so I have to get my vote in here.

Nothing has really come forth from the night actions yet, other than poor Fouts' death, of course, so I don't have much to go on.

I will stick with my reasoning from last night and follow up on suspicions, for lack of a better candidate. I am sure someone will emerge today, but I unfortunately won't be around to change my vote. So hopefully my suspicions are correct.

VOTE SALDANA

[KWhit]

I tend to agree with you Chief. Saldana's and Blade's reaction to Alan's posts was over the top and suspicious. If lynch were right now, I'd vote for one of them. Hopefully, we'll learn more today.

[Lathum]

I'm not ready to vote anyone yet until we gain info from last night if any.

[Lathum]

dola-
FWIW Saldana's reaction is pretty much spot on with his personality in real life so I'm not ready to string him up yet.

This is by no means an endorsmant for him I just wasn't as surprised about his reaction as the rest of you, having been on the receiving end of it many times

[Alan T]

For whatever its worth, Blade never trusts me in games and I wouldn't be suprised if he thought I was up to some ploy with him. I don't find Blade's response to uncharacteristic for me at all in most games that I am in with him.

He was completely and utterly wrong about my intent, and when he attacked me, I had to defend myself, but reading back its not too uncharacteristic of him.

Saldana was a bit suprising for me, and I'm not quite sure what to make of it. There are definite disagreements in the "Tolkien geek community" about what is and isn't canon, and many people don't feel the things that I do are canon. My problem isn't as much with that as he seemed to jump and try to take pot shots at every little point and distort most every point possible with me yesterday, even when there was no basis to it. He either didn't read my points or ignored my points in many cases accusing me of things that were the exact opposite of what I said.

I guess the biggest reason I don't jump out on the Saldana bandwagon yet is I haven't figured out the motive. I'm trying to figure out what he was trying to accomplish with the attacks. Part of me thinks he is just really into Tolkien too and doesn't believe in Christopher TOlkien's publications the same way that I do (which is something very heatedly argued online even among Tolkien geeks).

The only frustrating thing is how people keep coming out accusing me of things that are actually the exact opposite of what I said. Like Tyrith this morning coming out and saying I'm playing my psycho game like I did in Resident Evil... where in fact its been the opposite and I've been on the defensive the entire time.