Werewolf LXI - Ocean's Eleven (GAME OVER, SEE PAGE 19 FOR RESULT.)

[Lathum]

why cheaspeke?

[RendeR]

Originally Posted by Anxiety

Alright, this day was interesting and all, but I think we need to start looking at the UTR folks instead of getting all caught in a villager vs villager hissy fight.

This was why I went after Chesapeake. I know I'm good, and he came out after me as the first vote on me, so adding the UTR and voting for a good guy I felt he was a wolf. I was wrong.

Originally Posted by chesapeake

Dumped into the pool naked? What an ignominious end. Still, I had fun. Good luck, villagers!

Sorry dude, my instincts sucked this time. Come back soon!

Originally Posted by Barkeep49

I think that was might unsporting going after chesapeake. And FTR, I was at work and was not signed onto a computer immediately following my vote.

Unsporting? Wtf? I had a hunch based on game play and I played it.

Originally Posted by Lathum

why cheaspeke?

Thats why.

[SnDvls]

Originally Posted by Anxiety

Alright, this day was interesting and all, but I think we need to start looking at the UTR folks instead of getting all caught in a villager vs villager hissy fight.

When I am a wolf, if there are villager vs villager fights going on, I stay low and away. Let them kill each other, and I;m doign fine. Who's UTR?

CR but he normallis on Monday.
SnDvls is a bit, to be honest, compared to nomral
telle is a bit
jeheinz?
Pass?

sorry Abe that's just kinda my game...I try to add in where I can (shrugs) I think it's interesting how the vote really moved late again even with RendeR calling for the move...at least we have one person in our COT and one semi person still unconfirmed.

[Lathum]

well it's Renders power and he can use it how he likes but I think Anxiety or claphamsa would have been a choice that would have given us more answers.

[ntndeacon]

If anyone is gonna die best let it be the darned rogue.

[claphamsa]

wow i m alive

[Chief Rum]

You're all ungrateful swine! I would have dazzled with my skills, starting tonight. Unfortunately, I couldn't do anything interesting until tonight, and now I'm dead. Ugh. Oh well...another juicy role bites the dust. Go...vill...umm, go wol...well, screw y'all!

[Neon_Chaos]

Great day 1 read. Not enough drama though.

I WANT MY DRAMA!

and wicked last-minute reveals!

On with the show, then.

[jeheinz72]

Originally Posted by path12

I am an island.

Haha...

[jeheinz72]

Originally Posted by Anxiety

Who's UTR?

SnDvls is a bit, to be honest, compared to nomral
telle is a bit
jeheinz?
Pass?

Didn't think I was really being under the radar, just didn't have much to say. I wasn't about to throw myself in the lame (and pointless) argument BK and clap were having.

I'd be happy to talk more, but need to do some digging first. For the record, my short-list for votes would be Pass, SnDvls and Path. There's a wolf in them thar list.

[Passacaglia]

Originally Posted by jeheinz72

Didn't think I was really being under the radar, just didn't have much to say. I wasn't about to throw myself in the lame (and pointless) argument BK and clap were having.

I'd be happy to talk more, but need to do some digging first. For the record, my short-list for votes would be Pass, SnDvls and Path. There's a wolf in them thar list.

Why those three?

[jeheinz72]

Well first I'll admit, nothing very concrete here. My basic premise was that we were facing villager v. villager on Day One (we know Cronin was, and it's looking like Anxiety is). So the wolves decided to just steer clear (not that I think ALL THREE of your are wolves)

Pass - You aren't playing like I've normally witnessed you playing. Plus your votes have been basic nothings, NTN and Anxiety. It doesn't seem like you've taken a real stance on anything, possibly playing the UTR wolf card.

SnDvls - Strange vote for RendeR on Day One. Admittedly though, Day one votes are weak I know.

Path - Also seems to be playing differently from what I've picked up, though he did mention he was busy or in a foul mood (or both, I forget which). The odd thing to me was the late vote for Clap on Day Two. Just seemed like a strange place to put a vote at the time.

[Barkeep49]

I'll buy that path's vote late in the day for clap is odd. Good enough for me to vote for him to start things off.

Vote path

[path12]

Originally Posted by Barkeep49

I'll buy that path's vote late in the day for clap is odd. Good enough for me to vote for him to start things off.

What exactly is odd about my vote? There was a two vote margin between Render and Anxiety (I don't really have much of a read on either so didn't feel compelled to put my vote on one of them), and as I mentioned there was something about claphams reveal that just seemed off to me, so I voted for him.

Makes perfect sense to me.

[jeheinz72]

Originally Posted by path12

What exactly is odd about my vote? There was a two vote margin between Render and Anxiety (I don't really have much of a read on either so didn't feel compelled to put my vote on one of them), and as I mentioned there was something about claphams reveal that just seemed off to me, so I voted for him.

Makes perfect sense to me.

Meh, it just felt wasted to me (along the lines of the Day one scenario where the wolves may have just decided to avoid the V vs. V debate). I don't see how his reveal could be faked, no one really seemed to be leaning towards calling him on it, and if it's not fake then we're wasting a potentially valuable member of a future COT. It seemed to me to have these elements

- A wolf staying out of a Villager vs Villager fight
- A wolf possibly trying to re-up interest in voting a COT person
- A vote that *appears* as if it's meaningful but in reality isn't

Just my vibe off the whole deal.

[Barkeep49]

path: really? What seemed off? Basically by saying it's off you're accusing him of doing a fake reveal. What scenario did you have in mind that would justify the fake reveal? At that point in time clap was as about as close to a trusted player as we had, and basically is trusted by me at this point, and yet you voted for him, with a vote that was, by your own admission, meaningless. The meaningless late vote against an overhwelmingly likely good guy is off and strange. And thus worthy of my vote.

[Passacaglia]

Originally Posted by jeheinz72

Well first I'll admit, nothing very concrete here. My basic premise was that we were facing villager v. villager on Day One (we know Cronin was, and it's looking like Anxiety is). So the wolves decided to just steer clear (not that I think ALL THREE of your are wolves)

Pass - You aren't playing like I've normally witnessed you playing. Plus your votes have been basic nothings, NTN and Anxiety. It doesn't seem like you've taken a real stance on anything, possibly playing the UTR wolf card.

SnDvls - Strange vote for RendeR on Day One. Admittedly though, Day one votes are weak I know.

Path - Also seems to be playing differently from what I've picked up, though he did mention he was busy or in a foul mood (or both, I forget which). The odd thing to me was the late vote for Clap on Day Two. Just seemed like a strange place to put a vote at the time.

What was strange about SD's vote for RendeR? I don't remember it.

[Telle]

Loyal Wolf: You function as a regular wolf, but have the ability to change one lynching from the selected candidate to the person of your choosing. You will know this role from the beginning.

Just noticed.. the wolves could have a duke too. So there's a possibility that RendeR's not on our side. But in that case I'd think that the villager wolf would speak up.. assuming that we have one.

[Telle]

Originally Posted by Telle

Just noticed.. the wolves could have a duke too. So there's a possibility that RendeR's not on our side. But in that case I'd think that the villager wolf would speak up.. assuming that we have one.

Errr.. the "villager duke".

[path12]

Originally Posted by Barkeep49

path: really? What seemed off? Basically by saying it's off you're accusing him of doing a fake reveal. What scenario did you have in mind that would justify the fake reveal?

Here are some thoughts as to why this could be a fake reveal:

1) Because there are fewer players than normal, certain stated roles are not in the game. The wolves may be aware of which are in play (as happened last game or the one before, I forget which).
2) Twice yesterday as claphamsa was taking the vote lead a surge of votes came on Anxiety to tie it up.
3) claphamsa could be a brutal wolf.

I don't think those are out of line for a vote, and as I mentioned before, I didn't have a good feeling about either Render or Anxiety (I don't get any views this game).

I'd also point out that by waiting both days so far and making a late vote, I'm inviting more scrutiny on my votes than usual, which is really not the strategy I'd normally apply as a wolf, where I'd be far more happy to just kind of follow along with the consensus.

So if you want to vote me for that, feel free. I don't think I've done anything to warrant it though.

[Barkeep49]

Telle nice catch! Completely forgot about that possibility this game. I think it's less likely there is a both a villager and a wolf duke. So which one is Render? I don't know. I do know, however, that 50/50 is better than any other odds I'm getting today. I still don't trust path. But Render's the better play.

Unvote path
Vote Render

[claphamsa]

Originally Posted by Barkeep49

Telle nice catch! Completely forgot about that possibility this game. I think it's less likely there is a both a villager and a wolf duke. So which one is Render? I don't know. I do know, however, that 50/50 is better than any other odds I'm getting today. I still don't trust path. But Render's the better play.

Unvote path
Vote Render

Belive it or not Path has passed you on my wolf list

[X]- That just means I think your both guilty!

vote path

[PurdueBrad]

Here is the current vote tally:

Path12 (1)- Claphamsa (422)
RendeR (1)- Barkeep49 (421)

Not voted: Passacaglia, Telle, Path12, Anxiety, RendeR, SnDvls, ntndeacon, jeheinz72, Lathum

I won't be updating as much after 3 pm CST as the wife and I are doing a charity bowl this afternoon. I will be back in the evening and definitely by deadline.

[jeheinz72]

Originally Posted by Passacaglia

What was strange about SD's vote for RendeR? I don't remember it.

He was in and out of the thread for awhile and when it was clear there was a showdown he put his vote on someone new

[jeheinz72]

Originally Posted by Barkeep49

Telle nice catch! Completely forgot about that possibility this game. I think it's less likely there is a both a villager and a wolf duke. So which one is Render? I don't know. I do know, however, that 50/50 is better than any other odds I'm getting today. I still don't trust path. But Render's the better play.

Unvote path
Vote Render

Is he really though? It just seems like a lot of conjecture to get to where RendeR is a bad guy. The villager duke would have to not be countering his claim. While it could allegedly be 50/50, I don't think it really is. Since we have a lot to lose if we're wrong (namely someone who would be in our COT).

Frankly, this switch has me thinkin' about your loyalties here BK

[jeheinz72]

dola, I don't really think it's 50/50 either. 50/50 would be if we knew Render and PlayerX both had duke abilities and we were picking between one of them.

What we have here ix X% where that's the chance that both roles are in the game and RendeR holds the bad one. For all we know

A) The bad duke role isn't in the game
B) RendeR is the good duke role and the Wolvish Duke of course isn't coming forward

[jeheinz72]

Pass - What would be your counter/defense to my thought that you are playing differently. What are your thoughts at the moment?

[ntndeacon]

Originally Posted by Telle

Just noticed.. the wolves could have a duke too. So there's a possibility that RendeR's not on our side. But in that case I'd think that the villager wolf would speak up.. assuming that we have one.

I thought of this too. I don't think that Render should be voted for on this case though. I tend to believe he is the duke.

[Passacaglia]

Originally Posted by jeheinz72

Pass - What would be your counter/defense to my thought that you are playing differently. What are your thoughts at the moment?

Yeah, I've probably been more quiet than usual. I don't really play the UTR wolf, though -- when I'm a wolf, I'm in it to win it, not to just slide under the radar.

I disagree that my votes have been nothing votes. I put the first vote on Anxiety yesterday, with the intention of seeing if another effort would be made to save him. After two days, I think that it's most likely that he's not a wolf, but I'm still a littl cautious -- the wolves could have been biding their time.

I'm a bit skeptical of path, but I can see his side of things, so I want to see how things progress for as long as I can. I'm not sure Telle's argument necessarily gives me reason to vote for RendeR, so I still see him as neutral at this time.

Let me know if that doesn't clear everything up for you!

[Barkeep49]

If you believe there are two dukes in the game, then Render can be trusted. However, I don't believe there are two dukes in the game. That makes it 50/50 that he's a good guy or not.

[Abe Sargent]

jeheinz I'm pulling you off my utr list. In retrospect, I jus tthink we are playing at different times of the day, but you really aren't utr.

[Passacaglia]

Originally Posted by Barkeep49

If you believe there are two dukes in the game, then Render can be trusted. However, I don't believe there are two dukes in the game. That makes it 50/50 that he's a good guy or not.

How strong is your belief that there is only one duke? What is it based on?

[SnDvls]

Originally Posted by jeheinz72

He was in and out of the thread for awhile and when it was clear there was a showdown he put his vote on someone new

this isn't true...you need to reread my post and vote. I was out and gone after my vote and didn't get back on until way late.

[Barkeep49]

Based soley on the fact that there are 14 players in the game. Just seems like there are too many roles for 14 players and so some are ommitted.

[RendeR]

I am not a wolf or a wolf-duke. I am the persuader as told to me in my PM. I was also given an item which I have PM-d to have given to another player.

PB has that been dealt with yet?

[Passacaglia]

Originally Posted by Barkeep49

Based soley on the fact that there are 14 players in the game. Just seems like there are too many roles for 14 players and so some are ommitted.

I'd give you 20-40% certainty based on that, not the 100% you've based your decision-making on.

[PurdueBrad]

Originally Posted by Barkeep49

Based soley on the fact that there are 14 players in the game. Just seems like there are too many roles for 14 players and so some are ommitted.

I've purposely stayed out of several conversations where I might be able to give clarity. However, I will clarify this, all roles may not be in the game. I built it so that it would be flexible for between ten and twenty.

[jeheinz72]

Originally Posted by SnDvls

this isn't true...you need to reread my post and vote. I was out and gone after my vote and didn't get back on until way late.

Yeah but you were in it before your vote and clearly had to have seen the imminent showdown and you chose instead to vote for someone new. Sorry if I didn't word that correctly initially, you did indeed split after your vote, I saw that.

[PurdueBrad]

Originally Posted by RendeR

PB has that been dealt with yet?

Check your PM RendeR and verify.

[SnDvls]

Originally Posted by jeheinz72

He was in and out of the thread for awhile and when it was clear there was a showdown he put his vote on someone new

to add to this at the time of my vote there were 3 votes for St. C and 1 vote for all of the following people, including a single vote placed by you, Anxiety, Latham, NTN & Clap.

[jeheinz72]

Originally Posted by Barkeep49

If you believe there are two dukes in the game, then Render can be trusted. However, I don't believe there are two dukes in the game. That makes it 50/50 that he's a good guy or not.

So you're saying there is only 1 duke in the game. I can buy that to some extent. Why is it that only the bad duke would be it? Your statement conflicts itself, at least in the way I'm reading it.

[SnDvls]

Originally Posted by jeheinz72

Yeah but you were in it before your vote and clearly had to have seen the imminent showdown and you chose instead to vote for someone new. Sorry if I didn't word that correctly initially, you did indeed split after your vote, I saw that.

see my latest post this is incorrect there was no "showdown" as you are trying to come up with.

[jeheinz72]

Originally Posted by Anxiety

jeheinz I'm pulling you off my utr list. In retrospect, I jus tthink we are playing at different times of the day, but you really aren't utr.

Yeah I think that is it, though once I saw you call me UTR I was a little put back, but then I looked and at the time I only had 14 posts. I thought I had more because I read the thread all day long (from 6A-3P Pacific) but I guess I didn't actually contribute much.

Anyhow, enough of that, I'll start at least tossing my thoughts out more...

[claphamsa]

[quote=jeheinz72;1602380]Is he really though? It just seems like a lot of conjecture to get to where RendeR is a bad guy. The villager duke would have to not be countering his claim. While it could allegedly be 50/50, I don't think it really is. Since we have a lot to lose if we're wrong (namely someone who would be in our COT).

Frankly, this switch has me thinkin' about your loyalties here BK[/quote]

bout time

[SnDvls]

Originally Posted by SnDvls

Vote RendeR

no reason but to have a day one vote...I'll probally be out the rest of the day/night and don't want my vote to decide someone's fate without more info and it is day 1 and all

and here is my exact vote too

[RendeR]

Originally Posted by Barkeep49

Based soley on the fact that there are 14 players in the game. Just seems like there are too many roles for 14 players and so some are ommitted.

I guess mylogic is this: how many games have you ever seen where the wolves had a Duke and the good guys didn't?

now how many times have you seen a game where the good guys have a Duke ability possible and it wasn't actually there?

It makes no sense at all that the wolves would have a duke and the villagers NOT have one. Either they're both in or only the good one is.

I'm the persuader. If you think I'm the wolf-duke, then the real persuader needs to speak out and contradict me. They can't of course because I AM the persuader.

[jeheinz72]

Originally Posted by SnDvls

see my latest post this is incorrect there was no "showdown" as you are trying to come up with.

You're right. My mistake. When I looked this AM I saw the 3-2 (with no votes by either player in the showdown) tally.

[Abe Sargent]

Originally Posted by Barkeep49

If you believe there are two dukes in the game, then Render can be trusted. However, I don't believe there are two dukes in the game. That makes it 50/50 that he's a good guy or not.

Why do you beleive this?

[Abe Sargent]

Geez< i posted that twenty minutes ago, but mad lag made it just get posted. Been asked and answered so sorry BK

[claphamsa]

Originally Posted by Anxiety

Geez< i posted that twenty minutes ago, but mad lag made it just get posted. Been asked and answered so sorry BK

Yeah that lag was wierd, my post didnt go up for like 20 min! poorly formated as it was.